# J. R. W. Sloan on the connection between theology and philosophy



## Reformed Covenanter (Mar 14, 2020)

... In this age, when old errors are appearing in so many and varied forms—old, dead, and long-since buried philosophies raised from the grave, their bones scraped, re-washed, and presented anew to the world, —acquaintance with the great systems of speculative thought, both of belief and unbelief, appears an essential element of ministerial qualification.

He who knows little or nothing of Spinoza, Des Cartes, Locke, Hume, Kant, Hamilton, Comte, Fichte, Hickok, &c., may be a very good practical preacher, perhaps—whatever that may mean; but can scarcely be esteemed a competent defender of the faith. ...

For more, see J. R. W. Sloan on the connection between theology and philosophy.


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## jwright82 (Mar 18, 2020)

Reformed Covenanter said:


> ... In this age, when old errors are appearing in so many and varied forms—old, dead, and long-since buried philosophies raised from the grave, their bones scraped, re-washed, and presented anew to the world, —acquaintance with the great systems of speculative thought, both of belief and unbelief, appears an essential element of ministerial qualification.
> 
> He who knows little or nothing of Spinoza, Des Cartes, Locke, Hume, Kant, Hamilton, Comte, Fichte, Hickok, &c., may be a very good practical preacher, perhaps—whatever that may mean; but can scarcely be esteemed a competent defender of the faith. ...
> 
> For more, see J. R. W. Sloan on the connection between theology and philosophy.


Good post, I think at the end of the day it comes down to do I need a pastor that can go into the inns and outs of the latest philosophical craze or someone who can preach that old good gospel message. There are those of us who need to be up to date on what's going on philosophicaly but a good old-fashioned gospel message is always in vogue.

Reactions: Like 1


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## RamistThomist (Mar 20, 2020)

A thousand times amen. I had a guy last year rebuke me for "vain philosophy" when in actuality I was defending the reality of the kingdom of God. Those who are most ignorant of philosophy are usually the most enslaved to it.

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## RamistThomist (Mar 20, 2020)

And if you think philosophy is "vain philosophy," please explain what "essence" means in the phrase God has one essence. 

Sorry. Ranting.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## jwright82 (Mar 20, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> A thousand times amen. I had a guy last year rebuke me for "vain philosophy" when in actuality I was defending the reality of the kingdom of God. Those who are most ignorant of philosophy are usually the most enslaved to it.


I'll give you a million dollars if they can do anything (theology, whatever it is) without philosophy. I've heard that "vain philosophy" thing for years and you're right.

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## Reformed Covenanter (Mar 20, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> A thousand times amen. I had a guy last year rebuke me for "vain philosophy" when in actuality I was defending the reality of the kingdom of God. Those who are most ignorant of philosophy are usually the most enslaved to it.



A thousand times amen, yet you did not even press the above "Amen" button even once.

Reactions: Amen 3


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## RamistThomist (Mar 21, 2020)

jwright82 said:


> I'll give you a million dollars if they can do anything (theology, whatever it is) without philosophy. I've heard that "vain philosophy" thing for years and you're right.



ANd even though you and I have gone back and forth on "substance" metaphysics, we both realize that substance has a huge philosophical legacy, and if you are going to claim God is one in substance, then you better at least know the philosophical issues involved (and of course, you do).

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## jwright82 (Mar 21, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> ANd even though you and I have gone back and forth on "substance" metaphysics, we both realize that substance has a huge philosophical legacy, and if you are going to claim God is one in substance, then you better at least know the philosophical issues involved (and of course, you do).


Exactly, I get so annoyed at wave off philosophy and can't even define it.

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## Nate (Mar 21, 2020)

Daniel, Jamey, and Jacob: In the past I know that each of you have helped point many here in the right direction with respect to resources for the philosophically uninitiated. Could you again suggest what you consider to be essential works for the neophyte?


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## RamistThomist (Mar 21, 2020)

Nate said:


> Daniel, Jamey, and Jacob: In the past I know that each of you have helped point many here in the right direction with respect to resources for the philosophically uninitiated. Could you again suggest what you consider to be essential works for the neophyte?


https://www.amazon.com/Terms-Philosophy-Their-Importance-Theology/dp/0664225241
https://www.amazon.com/Approaching-...thony+thiselton&qid=1584823774&s=books&sr=1-3

That's an overview. You probably should pick up Plato's major dialogues, not because he is right, but because a) it is the foundation of secular Western civilization and b) he is so much fun to read.
https://www.amazon.com/Great-Dialog...oks&sprefix=plato+dialo,stripbooks,225&sr=1-5

Reactions: Like 1 | Amen 1


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## Nate (Mar 21, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> https://www.amazon.com/Terms-Philosophy-Their-Importance-Theology/dp/0664225241
> https://www.amazon.com/Approaching-...thony+thiselton&qid=1584823774&s=books&sr=1-3
> 
> That's an overview. You probably should pick up Plato's major dialogues, not because he is right, but because a) it is the foundation of secular Western civilization and b) he is so much fun to read.
> https://www.amazon.com/Great-Dialogues-Plato/dp/0451471709/ref=sr_1_5?crid=N17H39FRY353&dchild=1&keywords=plato+dialogues&qid=1584823836&s=books&sprefix=plato+dialo,stripbooks,225&sr=1-5


Thank you, brother. It seems I've some extra time on my hands for the next few weeks. This will help.

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## jwright82 (Mar 21, 2020)

Nate said:


> Daniel, Jamey, and Jacob: In the past I know that each of you have helped point many here in the right direction with respect to resources for the philosophically uninitiated. Could you again suggest what you consider to be essential works for the neophyte?


"The Passion of The Western Mind: understanding the ideas that have shaped our world view" by Richard Tarnas. 
Totem books has an "Intrducing ..." series that are short comic like, not as in funny but in style. They do ones on philosophers, scientists, politicians, artists, etc. They are geared towards beginners.
I agree with Jacob that Plato is a fun read. The introducing series can be helpful next to a primacy source from the philosophers. Also stay away from R. C. Sproul's "The Consequences of Ideas", not a good resource. Hope that helps.

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## jwright82 (Mar 21, 2020)

Also good reader on philosophy would be nice, they usually introduce the thinker or subject and gives primary sources on him/her or subject, I can't find mine to give you names but you can probably look it up. "Social and Political Philosophy" edited by John Sommerville and Ronald E. Santoni is one of those.

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## jwright82 (Mar 21, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> ANd even though you and I have gone back and forth on "substance" metaphysics, we both realize that substance has a huge philosophical legacy, and if you are going to claim God is one in substance, then you better at least know the philosophical issues involved (and of course, you do).


I always enjoy our conversations, they always make me go back and check myself. You know your stuff better than I do. Loving your book reviews as well. It's nice to have conversations with someone smarter than me.

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## jwright82 (Mar 22, 2020)

Fredrick Coppleston, S.J. has a whole series of historical books on philosophy that I believe, and correct me if I'm wrong here Jacob, is a standard on the subject. I have volum 13 on modern philosophy (Empiricism, Idealism, and Pragmatism In Britain and America). He starts with Utilitarianism and ends with the later Wittgenstein. Can be heavy but meant for students.


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## jwright82 (Mar 22, 2020)

"The Philosopher's Handbook: Essential Readings From Plato to Kant" edited by Stanley Rosen, it actually goes beyond Kant to more recent thinkers.

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## RamistThomist (Mar 22, 2020)

I'm going to make a cheat sheet on how to start reading philosophy based on my own experience (i.e., mistakes).

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## Nate (Mar 22, 2020)

BayouHuguenot said:


> I'm going to make a cheat sheet on how to start reading philosophy based on my own experience (i.e., mistakes).


That would be much appreciated.


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## RamistThomist (Mar 24, 2020)

Nate said:


> That would be much appreciated.


https://puritanboard.com/threads/on-beginning-to-read-philosophy-sources.101844/


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