# Difference Between Calvinist Predestination and Islam?



## Quatchu (Apr 23, 2013)

What is the difference between the Calvinist understanding of predestination and the Islamic predestination?


----------



## Alan D. Strange (Apr 23, 2013)

Islam does not have a doctrine of predestination as such. 

It has a fatalastic doctrine of a God who is radically one, who has no essence, and who thus reduces to will: everything is the expression of the will of this impersonal being (personhood existing only in relationship and Allah has no divine counterpart(s)). Everything so reduces to Allah's will, in fact, that we cannot properly be said to have wills. Only Allah does. This is not the predestination of a Trinitarian covenantal God who has promised never to leave or forsake us. Allah is bound by nothing (and binds himself by nothing). He could throw everyone out of paradise at any moment. There are no promises of any kind that he is bound to keep. So this is not predestination as Christians know it, but simply the manifestation and exercise of a raw, arbitary will.

Peace,
Alan


----------



## earl40 (Apr 23, 2013)

I have found that one will be falsely charge as being a Muslim when discussing Romans 9 with many Christians today. In other words, it is His will not ours that decides who will enter heaven. Of course we have wills and choose Who we will follow, and it is The Lord Who is the molder of this will to His glory. Now many will think this is no different than the muslim god but of course as Pastor Strange has pointed out, the personal aspect of Our God makes all the difference in the world.


----------



## MichaelNZ (Apr 24, 2013)

From Sahih Al-Bukhari (collection of Ahadith)

Narrated 'Abdullah: Allah's Apostle, the truthful and truly-inspired, said, "Each one of you collected in the womb of his mother for forty days, and then turns into a clot for an equal period (of forty days) and turns into a piece of flesh for a similar period (of forty days) and then Allah sends an angel and orders him to write four things, i.e., his provision, his age, and *whether he will be of the wretched or the blessed (in the Hereafter)*. Then the soul is breathed into him. And by Allah, a person among you (or a man) may do deeds of the people of the Fire till there is only a cubit or an arm-breadth distance between him and the Fire, but then that writing (which Allah has ordered the angel to write) precedes, and he does the deeds of the people of Paradise and enters it; and a man may do the deeds of the people of Paradise till there is only a cubit or two between him and Paradise, and then that writing precedes and he does the deeds of the people of the Fire and enters it." (Sahih Al-Bukhari, 77: Divine Will, 593, emphasis mine)


----------



## Contra_Mundum (Apr 24, 2013)

Christian predestination is fundamentally different from Islamic fatalism. Islam, just like Arminianism et al, puts a premium on free-will in the creature. Humans are not *inherently sinful* in Islam, but good (or a blank-slate to begin with), with corruption coming from without. However, very differently from Arminianism and various other Christian declensions, the god of Islam is capricious rather than benevolent.

Fatalism teaches that a person cannot escape his destiny, even though he may seek to thwart it (because he's a free-will creature). Christian predestination teaches that God employs human will and action as secondary causation, to the accomplishment of his purposes. Calvinism teaches that humans have free-will, but that the nature of the will constrains it. Proper Christian theology puts premium on the will of God, which is holy and righteous by definition (nature). And what that looks like (the character of God) is known by revelation, by _*covenant*_.

In Christian theology, there is no creaturely will to "thwart fate," unless it is the universal sinful impulse to evade the eternal consequences of sin. In which case the evasion is unto damnation, just as much as indifference would be. A will to please God is a gift of grace, and such gifts are without repentance from God. He is not capricious. So, the Islamic hadith (above) and similar stories teach a very different doctrine from the Christian doctrine, provided that it is a robust doctrine and not an Arminian or other declension.


----------



## MarieP (Apr 24, 2013)

Quatchu said:


> What is the difference between the Calvinist understanding of predestination and the Islamic predestination?



One is through the eternal counsel of the Holy Trinity and to the glory of Christ Jesus. The other isn't. At least, that's the starting point of difference...

If I remember correctly, Michael Reeves mentions this in his book Delighting in the Trinity. He argues that we can't start our definition of God with Creator because it leads to the pluralism that's rampant today. They have "Allah the All Creating" but we have "Father, Son, and Holy Spirit!"


----------



## Scottish Lass (Apr 24, 2013)

Muslims have also told us they have no assurance of faith.


----------



## Covenant Joel (Apr 24, 2013)

There was a debate during the Middle Ages between Muslim scholars (the Ash'arite school and the Mut'azilite school) regarding free will, predestination, causality, etc. The Mut'azilite school essentially (to simplify quite a lot) argued for a more free will approach to such issues, whereas the Ash'arites argued more strongly for an essentially fatalistic position.

The Ash'arites won out (al-Ghazali being a famous representative of their position). Some of them went so far as to deny all secondary causes. That is, some went so far as to say that e.g., with a match, when you strike it, it isn't the friction and chemical reaction that causes the fire, but instead God that directly causes it. Any connection between them is purely apparent.

Given that this view is the dominant view among scholars today (though certainly among the masses they may have little awareness of the debate itself), we can say that at least one major difference is the Reformed affirmation of the reality of secondary causes.


----------



## Stephen L Smith (Apr 24, 2013)

I have just been reading one of Spurgeon's sermons on this very issue. Spurgeon addressed the argument that the Doctrines of Grace are similar to the Islam view of Fatalism. Spurgeon made the very insightful comment that the important difference is the doctrine of Providence. Islam does not have Providence


----------



## MichaelNZ (Apr 26, 2013)

Scottish Lass said:


> Muslims have also told us they have no assurance of faith.



I think what you meant to say is that they have no assurance of salvation. That is true - they cannot know whether their good deeds exceed their sins. I remember a Muslim telling me once that if a Muslim (who believes there is no god but God and Muhammad is the messenger of God) goes to hell, he will eventually get out because of his belief in Islam. I don't know enough Qur'an or Hadith to confirm or refute that, though.


----------

