# World Mission Society Church of God



## timfost (Jun 16, 2018)

Hi all,

I was at a Maryland zoo today and a gentleman and teenage boy approached me and asked if he could ask me a question. The teenager asked if I have heard about the "feminine image of God" or something along those lines. I said no so he started to explain it to me. He explained that for Adam and Eve to be made in God's image, there must be a mother deity or else we wouldn't have gotten Eve. He took me to Genesis 1 to show me that the plural is used when man was made in God's image ("let us make man in Our image..." v. 26). 

I challenged the idea that a natural body cannot be made in the image of a Spiritual body in terms of physical appearance, since God is invisible. Rather, what is in view is being made like God in righteousness and holiness.

In speaking a little about the Trinity, it became clear that they are modalists. I said as much to them (the adult stepped in at this point) and disagreed that they were modalists. I asked if he knew what modalism was and he answered "no." 

Anyway, I looked up their website (http://www.wmscog.com/). They have some weird beliefs. Their portion about "God the Mother" is borderline insanity (http://www.wmscog.com/heavenly-mother/god-the-mother/). 

Has anyone heard of this group?


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## Gforce9 (Jun 16, 2018)

I have not heard of these folks, Tim, but I heard that Benny Hinn stated that the Trinity each had a trinity, so there are nine members. All that to say, I'm wholly not surprised. Good job on challenging their dung......

Reactions: Like 1


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## Tom Hart (Jun 17, 2018)

This is a Korean cult. Their name in Korean is 하나님의 교회 (Ha-na-nim-ay Kyo-hay, "God's Church"). You'll see some of their nice, new, blockhouse-like buildings in most cities in Korea.

The cult is, I have read, one of the fastest-growing South Korean cults internationally. (In South Korea itself, it seems that there's too much competition between cults to really make them stand out.) It is expanding in Asia, Africa, Europe, as well as Canada and the USA.

I have encountered them here in Korea. Very weird stuff. I asked them to prove from the Scriptures this "Mother God". The man said, reading from his ordinary Bible, that Galatians 4 shows that "we all need a mother." He also pointed me to a single verse in Revelation, although I can't remember which one. That's all he had.

I asked if they affirmed the Trinity, and the man said yes. Obviously, his definition of the Trinity is rather different from an orthodox believer's.

The creeps were making me late for work and I eventually just told them they were heretics. With my limited Korean, I've found that an effective way to get cultists off my back.

The Mother God cult (as I call them) brand themselves as a "feminist church" and, of course, they claim to be the only true church.

As I've heard it explained, following the death of the cult's original founder, they needed to amend their teachings to include a "Mother God" (who happens to be the founder's wife, still living in Seoul).

Reactions: Informative 5


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## Username4000 (Jun 17, 2018)

They had some ministry in Seattle at one point. Found an American one on a bus one time, and a couple Korean girls confronted me while working in a library on the University of Washington campus.

They are definitely primed with their bag of verses; get them off those, and I expect you’ll be met with little response.

I wish I was more prepared when I met them (it was several years ago).


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## yeutter (Jun 20, 2018)

They have a large congregation in Lalitpur area of Kathmandu. The men from this cult, always wear a white shirt. Superficially they appear to be reasonable and intellectual. They do much mischief among the poorly catechized; carrying many away in Nepal, with their fables.


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## Dachaser (Jun 20, 2018)

timfost said:


> Hi all,
> 
> I was at a Maryland zoo today and a gentleman and teenage boy approached me and asked if he could ask me a question. The teenager asked if I have heard about the "feminine image of God" or something along those lines. I said no so he started to explain it to me. He explained that for Adam and Eve to be made in God's image, there must be a mother deity or else we wouldn't have gotten Eve. He took me to Genesis 1 to show me that the plural is used when man was made in God's image ("let us make man in Our image..." v. 26).
> 
> ...


I am still searching the Bible to see when and where Jesus addressed God as His father/Mother.


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## timfost (Jun 20, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> I am still searching the Bible to see when and where Jesus addressed God as His father/Mother.



Yeah, it's pretty weird stuff. I've actually been conversing with this gentleman who wanted to talk. He's making some bizarre statements, but I am slowly walking him through what the Bible teaches in context. One of his arguments is that Elohim is plural. I challenged his application of the plural in that context (Hebrew usage, accompanying verbs, LXX usage and Christ's translations Elihim) to which he replied that he disagreed. I'm going to further press this point.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Jun 20, 2018)

timfost said:


> One of his arguments is that Elohim is plural.


You might look over PB member Rev. Dilday's fine efforts translating De Moor, or contact him for more information.

For example:
https://www.fromreformationtoreformation.com/blog/de-moor-iv-5-hebrew-names-for-god-א-לו-ה-eloah

https://www.fromreformationtoreformation.com/blog/de-moor-iv-5-hebrew-names-for-god-א-ל-el


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## Dachaser (Jun 20, 2018)

timfost said:


> Yeah, it's pretty weird stuff. I've actually been conversing with this gentleman who wanted to talk. He's making some bizarre statements, but I am slowly walking him through what the Bible teaches in context. One of his arguments is that Elohim is plural. I challenged his application of the plural in that context (Hebrew usage, accompanying verbs, LXX usage and Christ's translations Elihim) to which he replied that he disagreed. I'm going to further press this point.


Elohim being plural would be speaking to God as a Trinity Being, or else to the Heavenly Hosts God was adressing in heaven, but still looking to any time Jesus referred to Him having a heavenly Mother.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Jun 20, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> Elohim being plural would be speaking to God as a Trinity Being,...


Not exactly if we want to let the texts speak for themselves.

Please see aforementioned:

https://www.fromreformationtoreformation.com/blog/de-moor-iv-5-hebrew-names-for-god-א-לו-ה-eloah

Specific to the page, see the discussion at the note *α* preceding the numbered footnotes.


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## timfost (Jun 20, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> Elohim being plural would be speaking to God as a Trinity Being, or else to the Heavenly Hosts God was adressing in heaven, but still looking to any time Jesus referred to Him having a heavenly Mother.



Perhaps this might help. It's from my correspondence with the gentleman.
__________

The Hebrew uses plurality for the purpose of a) literal plurality and b) magnitude and majesty. If the first, you may establish the grounds for multiple deity. If the second, you introduce other gods that we are to worship and break the first and second commandments. Either way, one of us is in serious error. So let's consider the following:

1. I'm sure we can both agree that Dagon (1 Sam. 5:7), Chemosh (1 Kings 11:33), Baal (1 Kings 18:24) and Ashtoreth (1 Kings 11:5) are idols. They are false _singular_ gods. However, they are all referred to as _elohim_ in the Hebrew (see the verses listed). The people worshiped these individual gods, though they referred to them individually in the plural (_elohim_). This at least proves that the plural can refer to magnitude and not only plurality. Having established this,

2. in Genesis 1, although God is referred to as _Elohim_, the accompanying verb throughout the whole chapter is singular, not plural. This is significant, since if Genesis 1 was establishing a plurality of deity, the Hebrew writer of Genesis broke the Hebrew rules of grammar. This further proves that _Elohim_, when referring to the God of the Bible, refers to magnitude and majesty, not plurality.

3. When the Hebrew Bible was translated into Greek, _Elohim_ is always translated as God (singular). "Gods" is a foreign word to the New Testament unless referring to idols. This translation, called the Septuagint, was used by Jesus and the Apostles as well as much of the New Testament church. 

4. Finally, Jesus quotes Old Testament passages that use the name _Elohim_. In teaching against idolatry, Jesus says: "For it is written, 'you shall worship the Lord your God, and Him only you shall serve'" (Matt. 4:10). This passage is signficant for our discussion, because in translating from the Hebrew of Deuteronomy 6:13 which uses _Elohim_, Jesus translates the plural _Elohim_ as a singular _Theos _(God in Greek). Jesus settles this discussion and makes it completely clear how _Elohim _is to be understood (God singular).

Unless Genesis 1 uses bad Hebrew grammar, the Greeks improperly translated the object of worship in a document used by Christ, the Apostles and the New Testament church, and Jesus mistranslates His own word, the use of _Elohim_ in the Old Testament is speaking about a _singular_ God! You said that no one searches the Scriptures like you all. I would like to gently challenge you to compare Scripture with Scripture and see how your multiple "Gods" is unbiblical. A "Mother God" is idolatry.


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## Dachaser (Jun 21, 2018)

timfost said:


> Perhaps this might help. It's from my correspondence with the gentleman.
> __________
> 
> The Hebrew uses plurality for the purpose of a) literal plurality and b) magnitude and majesty. If the first, you may establish the grounds for multiple deity. If the second, you introduce other gods that we are to worship and break the first and second commandments. Either way, one of us is in serious error. So let's consider the following:
> ...


Excellent! I do see the Elohim and other Pssages in the OT tidbits God placed in there to pave the way for the full blown Trinity that would be known in the NT. Some examples would be the Spirit of God we see right there in the beginning, and also the Angel of the Lord, who seemed to be the preincarnate Christ. Elohim would be speaking to those Persons in God, but never had a Mother mentioned in the OT as poart of God, and the NT makes it really clear that Jesus only refers to God as His Father, never as also His Mother. This worshipping of the feminine nature ascribed to God almost seems like the catholic view on Mary really exaggerated.


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## timfost (Jun 21, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> Excellent! I do see the Elohim and other Pssages in the OT tidbits God placed in there to pave the way for the full blown Trinity that would be known in the NT. Some examples would be the Spirit of God we see right there in the beginning, and also the Angel of the Lord, who seemed to be the preincarnate Christ. Elohim would be speaking to those Persons in God, but never had a Mother mentioned in the OT as poart of God, and the NT makes it really clear that Jesus only refers to God as His Father, never as also His Mother. This worshipping of the feminine nature ascribed to God almost seems like the catholic view on Mary really exaggerated.



I agree that the Persons of the Godhead are all present in creation. Gen. 1 makes clear God and Spirit, John 1, Col. 1, etc. make clear Christ was also involved.

I think using the word Elohim to speak of the Trinity is a classic case of right doctrine, wrong passage. Considering the Hebrew usage, all it seems to communicate is the magnitude of God or the concept that He is God of gods.


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