# What is true godliness?



## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

We often hear the term "godly" or "godliness" when speaking of others, but I find these terms can be quite broad at times and often applied to outward behavior and/or appearance. So my question is, what is true godliness? And what does a godly person "look like" practically-speaking?


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## awretchsavedbygrace (Aug 19, 2009)

A godly person is a christian who seeks to be conformed to the image of Christ, and the means of this is by mortifying their sin.


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## Rich Koster (Aug 19, 2009)

A godly person would be one that increasingly displays the character of Christ in all of their doings.


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

Joshua said:


> Like trees planted by rivers of water?



I see you referenced Psalm 1:3, so would you say that godliness is demonstrated by the fruit that we bear?


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

Great answers so far! 

So I'm wondering then, would it be appropriate to say then that "all" the elect are godly? (Given that they _WILL_ be conformed more and more to the likeness of Christ and _WILL_ persevere to the end).


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## OPC'n (Aug 19, 2009)

True godliness is a love for God above all else. If we loved Him more than ourselves (for really we do love ourselves more than anything else even our children....if we truly loved our children more than ourselves we would turn from much of the sin we do so as to be a faithful demonstration of a godly child of God), we would deny ourselves the "pleasures" of sin and obey His commandments which include not only the Ten but also the two greatest ones, to spread the Gospel, to use the tools of grace etc. I don't have much fruit of the Spirit bc I choose what I want more than I choose Christ. Of course, He is faithful and will bring trials to root out self love.


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

Okay, next question  So, is godliness then fostered by our level of personal sanctification? (Btw, I'm not looking for a particular answer, I'm sincerely trying to get at the root of what godliness is.)


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## Rich Koster (Aug 19, 2009)

We get more Christlike, but the old nature still rears it's ugly head from time to time. We can asymptotically approach Christlikeness, but not reach it this side of the second coming or our death.


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## TeachingTulip (Aug 19, 2009)

In His Grip said:


> Okay, next question  So, is godliness then fostered by our level of personal sanctification? (Btw, I'm not looking for a particular answer, I'm sincerely trying to get at the root of what godliness is.)



Hi Yvonne,

"Personal sanctification" can be subjective. I tend to evaluate "godliness" more objectively.

In other words,'s, is there genuine evidence of the Holy Spirit indwelling the one who professes faith and godliness?

Jesus said to judge according to one's fruits, but I believe it matters that those must be fruits of the Holy Spirit. (Galatians 5:22-25)

*"Abide in Me, and I in you. As the branch cannot bear fruit of itself, unless it abides in the vine, neither can you, unless you abide in Me. I am the vine, you are the branches. He who abides in Me, and I in him, bears much fruit; for without Me you can do nothing." John 15:4-5*


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

Great insight!

Okay, so then would we characterize true godliness by the outward display of the fruit of the Spirit? 

"But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law." - Gal 5:22-23


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

Okay, so my next question is a bit tricky...

There are many unbelievers that I know that outwardly demonstrate the "fruit of the Spirit" in their lives, and there are many believers that I know that grew up being taught these outward behaviors. So, there must be more than simply to display these characteristics in our lives. Some people have already touched on being rooted in the Truth....what are some other ways in which we can qualify godliness?


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## JBaldwin (Aug 19, 2009)

In His Grip said:


> Great insight!
> 
> Okay, so then would we characterize true godliness by the outward display of the fruit of the Spirit?
> 
> "But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23gentleness and self-control. Against such things there is no law." - Gal 5:22-23



I think that has a lot to do with it. When we were studying Galatians a couple of years ago, my pastor encouraged as to sit down and read the entire book in one sitting. As I was going through chapter 5, it suddenly hit me that one of the ways we can look at godliness (walking in the Spirit) is by seeing what it is not, and that is why Paul put the works of the flesh list right next to the fruit of the Spirit. 

_



16 But I say, walk by the Spirit, and you will not gratify the desires of the
flesh. 17 For the desires of the flesh are against the Spirit, and the desires of the Spirit are against the flesh, for these are opposed to each other, to keep you from doing the things you want to do. 18 But if you are led by the Spirit, you are not under the law. 19 Now the works of the flesh are evident: sexual immorality, impurity, sensuality, 20 idolatry, sorcery, enmity, strife, jealousy, fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, 21 envy, [4] drunkenness, orgies, and things like these. I warn you, as I warned you before, that those who do such things will not inherit the kingdom of God. 22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control; against such things there is no law. 24 And those who belong to Christ Jesus have crucified the flesh with its passions and desires.

25 If we live by the Spirit, let us also walk by the Spirit. 26 Let us not become conceited, provoking one another, envying one another.

Click to expand...

_
What hit me the hardest was the "fits of anger, rivalries, dissensions, divisions, envy". As I took a long look at myself and the churches where I had been, I saw a lot of people (including myself) who often appeared to be godly and to have some of the fruit of the Spirit on the surface (patience, kindness, faithfulness, self-control), but who lacked the love, joy, peace and gentleness. In it's place? Anger, rivalries, dissensions, back-biting, envy, jealousy, conceit, provoking one another. If person is characterized by those things, even if they are not involved in open idolatry or sexual sins, they are not godly. 

Godliness comes when a person is walking by the Spirit. How we love and treat one another is another evidence of godliness or lack of godliness.


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## Rich Koster (Aug 19, 2009)

In His Grip said:


> Okay, so my next question is a bit tricky...
> 
> There are many unbelievers that I know that outwardly demonstrate the "fruit of the Spirit" in their lives, and there are many believers that I know that grew up being taught these outward behaviors. So, there must be more than simply to display these characteristics in our lives. Some people have already touched on being rooted in the Truth....what are some other ways in which we can qualify godliness?



May I suggest consistency. We can all put on a face from time to time, but what about all of the time??????????????


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## dbroyles (Aug 19, 2009)

*Calvin on Piety*

You may want to Get Dr. Joel Beeke's perspective on this important subject. He gave Calvin's perspectives on biblical godliness and the fear of God at the 73rd Annual Synod of the Bible Presbyterian Church in Bristol, VA about two weeks ago. I believe he has a series of articles available on the Internet. Just Google "Calvin on Piety" and "Beeke". And see what you get.


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## JBaldwin (Aug 19, 2009)

dbroyles said:


> You may want to Get Dr. Joel Beeke's perspective on this important subject. He gave Calvin's perspectives on biblical godliness and the fear of God at the 73rd Annual Synod of the Bible Presbyterian Church in Bristol, VA about two weeks ago. I believe he has a series of articles available on the Internet. Just Google "Calvin on Piety" and "Beeke". And see what you get.



David, just as aside. Which PCA are you attending in Anderson?


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## Idelette (Aug 19, 2009)

dbroyles said:


> You may want to Get Dr. Joel Beeke's perspective on this important subject. He gave Calvin's perspectives on biblical godliness and the fear of God at the 73rd Annual Synod of the Bible Presbyterian Church in Bristol, VA about two weeks ago. I believe he has a series of articles available on the Internet. Just Google "Calvin on Piety" and "Beeke". And see what you get.



Thanks so much! This is exactly what I was looking for! I found a book that includes Beeke's "Calvin on Piety", and it is excellent! He does a wonderful job of expounding on this topic! There are some pages missing because it is a book preview.....but nevertheless an excellent read!

If anyone else is interested: The Cambridge companion to John Calvin - Google Books


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## dbroyles (Aug 20, 2009)

JBaldwin said:


> dbroyles said:
> 
> 
> > You may want to Get Dr. Joel Beeke's perspective on this important subject. He gave Calvin's perspectives on biblical godliness and the fear of God at the 73rd Annual Synod of the Bible Presbyterian Church in Bristol, VA about two weeks ago. I believe he has a series of articles available on the Internet. Just Google "Calvin on Piety" and "Beeke". And see what you get.
> ...



Our current membership is at New Covenant Church.


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## JBaldwin (Aug 20, 2009)

dbroyles said:


> JBaldwin said:
> 
> 
> > dbroyles said:
> ...



We've been over there a few times. It's nice church.


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