# Positive Discipline



## tdowns (May 5, 2006)

Has anybody heard of this program, or series. I think it's wide spread for schools, parenting etc. 

Ever heard of it Adam? If so, what do you think of it?

I'd be interested in anybodies thoughts on it, seems pyschobabble to me, but like all things, some good strategies can be found in it. I've only seen a bit on it.

Thanks


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## ReformedWretch (May 5, 2006)

I don't know anything specifically about it. Can you provide a link? Here is my last blog entry on discipline. Does it sound anything like this program?

What Is Discipline? 
Is discipline punishment? If your answer is yes you are amongst the throngs of people who´ve gotten it wrong. Discipline is not punishment and it´s sad that so many house parents believe that it is. Punishment is an aspect of discipline, but only that it is not and should never be seen as one in the same. In fact, punishment is not even the most important element of discipline! Before punishment is ever given, we should have tried everything else from a positive approach, when we have exhausted all of those, then we can begin to "œpunish".

Why are so many children growing up to be angry adults? It is my contention that this is because too many parents (or house parents) make life seem like a battle. Life is two enemies facing off for ultimate power within the home. House parents who monitor children waiting for them to "œmess up" so they can go in with punishment. This is reactive parenting at it´s worst, and it turns out angry young adults who see all of life in this manner and act as such.

So what is the most important aspect of "œdiscipline"? It´s making your children feel loved. When you accomplish this you can move forward to the second most important approach and that´s training your children in thought and deed so that they may grow into solid, well adjusted, clear thinking young adults. Discipline is training children by setting a good example, talking to them often, writing down things for them if need be in order for them to better understand, and looking for teachable moments in every aspect of life. I believe when a teachable moment arises, you stop everything and point out what the lesson is. I don´t care what´s going on, politely interrupt it and point out what can be learned at that moment. If you notice, everything I´ve mentioned here is positive. There is nothing negative about any of these approaches. That´s very important. This style of discipline approaches children as individual human beings that are able to learn and grow rather than robots programmed to obey commands given through behavior modification techniques.

Since this industry is so fond of formula´s here´s one for you.

Loving + Training = Strong, well balanced children.

Children whose emotional needs are met will more easily identify with the adults meeting these needs. They will be more ready to learn, to be shaped by the adult meeting their needs. Children who have emotional needs that are not being fulfilled never connect with the staff in charge of them, they never identify with them in any way, shape, or form. These children are resentful and have a negative orientation. They are never ready to learn, but always ready to rebel.

Take a look at what the word of God says.

Eph 6:4Fathers, do not provoke your children to anger, but bring them up in the discipline and instruction of the Lord.

Col 3:21 Fathers, do not provoke your children, lest they become discouraged.

Can you not see here that Paul is telling two different church bodies that they should treat their children in such a way as to not make them angry, resentful, or discouraged? Please take a look at your style and honestly determine if what you are doing is causing children in your care to feel badly, angry, defeated, discouraged, etc. If it is, realize that it´s time to change your style so not to do this. If you won´t listen to me it is my hope and prayer that you will heed the word of God.

So let´s take a look at what I am talking about here.

A child in your care has acted up/misbehaved. What now? Here´s what a good house parent will do.

1) Ask themselves "œdoes this child have an emotional need"?

Maybe you haven´t paid much attention to this child today? Maybe they are fighting with their boyfriend, best friend, mom, dad, brother? It could be many things.

2) Ask themselves "œis there a physical problem"?

Are they sick, in pain, hungry etc? If the answer to any of these is yes, it´s an easy fix!

If neither of these applies there are five ways you can respond. Two are positive, two are negative, and one is neutral. Here are the five ways you can respond.

1) Requests (Positive)

Everyone one of us likes to be asked rather than told to do something right? This approach shows respect and places responsibility upon the person being asked. It is my experience that children respond so much better with requests than they do with ..

2) Commands (Negative)

The reason these don´t work nearly as well is because you are reminding the child that they have no power in your home. Commands can lead to the abuse of power. What happens when power is abused? It stirs up rebellion. A good thing to remember is "œpleasant but firm". The word of God tells us that we reap what we sow. I recommend sowing love and respect, you will surely reap such in return.

3) Gentle Physical Manipulation (Positive)

Yes, as childcare workers we must be very careful here and I realize that some of you may even work for places that have a strict hands off policy. However, if at all possible use this on occasion. When a child is not responding to your call, walk up and tap them lightly on the shoulder, place your hand on that shoulder and ask them to come with you.
Something to replace this step with is assisting with the request. In this you actually go to the child and help them do what you have asked them to do, or remove them from a situation by asking them to do something else with you. If a child seems reluctant to scrub the floor, get down there and help. Show him how to do it and how it´s not below you to do this. If a child is being disruptive or loud, ask them to come shoot baskets with you, or on a walk, or a ride with you. This always beats barking orders or giving commands.

4) Punishment (Negative)

Not only is punishment negative, it is the most difficult part of discipline. There are several reasons for that.

-Punishment must fit the crime. Children know when we are being fair and when we are not.

-Punishment must be age appropriate.

-Punishment has different outcomes with different children.

-Adults are not consistent because we punish based on the mood we are in at the moment.

Punishment is reserved for the defiant child. You only know that your child is being defiant when you have determined that all the other issues we discussed earlier are not the reason for the behavior. You determine to punish when all other approaches have failed.

The biggest mistake house parents make with punishment is over doing it. Many of us tend to go in hard and heavy in order to teach a lesson. The problem later is that when more serious offenses come from this child, or another you have used up your serious punishments of smaller matter and you now have to get extreme or back pedal exposing your foolishness in the past. It is not weakness for you to show your kids that you desire to be as lenient as possible before going into punishment mode.

Look, children we care for know that we have power. They know that we are in control. We don´t have to "œshow them that!" That´s foolishness. We show them something when we don´t hold our power over their heads. We teach them what meekness is, what love is, what respect is, when we refrain from using our power over them. When the children in our care see us restrain ourselves and use gentleness and self-control our authority over them is actually increased!

5) Behavior Modification (Neutral)

The biggest problem with this approach is that the message "œDo what we say and then we will care about/for you" cannot be avoided. For years this industry has been turning our people who are not concerned about morality or ethics, but instead reward or consequences. Their motivation is the "œpayoff". As such I believe that "œB-mod" should be used as little as possible. I have used it and will use again in my career but only in specific instances most of which involve a child he has little to no remorse, and show little to no ability to gain remorse.

Remorse is something you must pay attention to and praise when you see it. Yes, some kids will apologize in an attempt to get away with poor behavior but a moron can spot that when it happens. When you have a child who id honestly sorry sometimes the best lesson is simply to forgive that child. Again, the word of God tells us this

2 Cor 2: 5 Now if anyone has caused pain, he has caused it not to me, but in some measure--not to put it too severely--to all of you. 6For such a one, this punishment by the majority is enough, 7so you should rather turn to forgive and comfort him, or he may be overwhelmed by excessive sorrow. 8So I beg you to reaffirm your love for him.

When someone is truly sorry, forgive them. Don´t ignore the bad behavior, but on occasion it is ok to simply just forgive them "œas Christ Jesus forgave us".

Discipline the right way, and DON´T LIE TO KIDS.


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## ReformedWretch (May 6, 2006)

Ok, I looked this up and so far it seems VERY interesting to me. It seems to be saying what I have been saying for a long, long time!


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## ReformedWretch (May 6, 2006)

Yep, impressed!

Check out this article.

http://www.positivediscipline.com/articles/teenmotivation.html

Then check out the article archive.

http://www.positivediscipline.com/articles/index.html


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## tdowns (May 6, 2006)

*Thanks Adam*

Adam, I thought you would be interested in it, and I'm happy you are researching it like I should be. I'm looking forward to your analysis of it.

My concerns based on the little I've heard are:

*Little if no mention of sin, seems to be they want us to be so positive, that the fact that a child might feel guilt is a bad thing...well, if we don't feel guilt, then why would we need a savior to remove that guilt....just something I've been thinking about.

*seemingly an over emphasis on a democratic relationship with kids. If the child does something wrong, we give them choices, etc, "How could you do this differently, instead of saying, "That is wrong behavior."

*And the seemingly absolute rejection of spanking, which from what I've seen, is biblical.

Just a few things that pop out too me. But like you, I see the positive attributes of Positive Discipline, and great blog post by you by the way.

[Edited on 5-6-2006 by tdowns007]


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## ReformedWretch (May 6, 2006)

Thanks Trevor.

The thing with me and my opinion is that while I "parent" many children I can't do it 100% as I would if these children were my own. Where I work now comes as close as you can get to that, but it's still not the same. 



> *Little if no mention of sin, seems to be they want us to be so positive, that the fact that a child might feel guilt is a bad thing...well, if we don't feel guilt, then why would we need a savior to remove that guilt....just something I've been thinking about.



We look for remorse more than guilt (even though you could classify them as the same thing). As for teaching them about the Savior, we have to do that through example and then words when the child asky "how do you live as you do?" That used to frustrate me, but kids will ask more often than not! Especially if you live what you preach.



> *seemingly an over emphasis on a democratic relationship with kids. If the child does something wrong, we give them choices, etc, "How could you do this differently, instead of saying, "That is wrong behavior."



Well, in my situation too many staff just bark orders at kids and don't explain why something is wrong. We have to force ourselves to look for teachable moments or our kids grow in anger and resentfullness. Also, remember that I work with girls ages 13-20.



> *And the seemingly absolute rejection of spanking, which from what I've seen, is biblical.



Again, in my line of work it's hands off (at least regarding punishment) so we have to find other means. The problem I see with spanking isn't that it's not biblical, but that far too many parents do it out of frustration and anger and in my opinion that teaches nothing besides "don't tick me off".


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## tdowns (May 6, 2006)

*Great points...*

Yeah, I know what you mean, as a teacher, there are certain things I just can not do, but, the opportunities to share God's truth often comes up wich is awesome.

Keep it up, I appreciate your voice on the issues.


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## ReformedWretch (May 6, 2006)

Thanks, I appreciate the encouragement!


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