# FV Resources?



## Zenas (May 14, 2011)

I know there are some present who have dealt extensively with FV theology. Those who have, will you recommend some online resources, whether drafted by you or others, to help me understand what the FV proponents are advancing and why they are incorrect. As my wife put it, "I'd rather not trust wikipedia."


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## Notthemama1984 (May 14, 2011)

I would recommend Heidelblog, but.........


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## torstar (May 14, 2011)

Must be a few threads on the matter going back through the years of this board....


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## DMcFadden (May 14, 2011)

Google Guy Waters and Alan Strange.

You find almost 30 of the best Internet resources on it (including Clark) at 
http://www.monergism.com/directory/...phrase=federal+vision&B1.x=0&B1.y=0&B1=Search

The ones posted on Heidelblog are, obviously, broken links. But others work fine.


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## eqdj (May 15, 2011)

Scott Clark was not just a blogger, but also a Seminary Professor. 

He has resources on his Faculty Page 
Westminster Seminary California
On the right click on "FV and NPP"


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## brianeschen (May 15, 2011)

There is a great "Reply to the Joint Federal Vision" written by a PCA pastor here . . . Johannes Weslianus


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## Semper Fidelis (May 16, 2011)

PCA Historical Center: Index to the Position Papers of the Presbyterian Church in America (look for the Federal Vision report of the Ad Interim committee)
http://www.opc.org/GA/justification.pdf (OPC Report)

I made these posts sticky as they are very helpful to get to some of the core issues:
http://www.puritanboard.com/f77/con...es-fv-differ-historical-reformed-usage-18377/
http://www.puritanboard.com/f77/wilkins-presbytery-exam-examined-rick-phillips-18274/


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## Semper Fidelis (May 16, 2011)

Reply to the Joint FV Profession
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 2
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 3
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 4
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 5
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 6
Reply to the Joint FV Profession, Part 7


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## Nate (May 16, 2011)

I found the URCNA FV report to be very helpful: URCNA FV Report
Also this lecture: Engelsma on the FV


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## threehappypenguins (Jun 10, 2011)

You could try looking at some of the literature of the Federal Vision proponents themselves. To be honest, I don't know enough about Federal Vision, but I did read a book by Douglas Wilson (FV proponent) called "Standing on the Promises" which was written before the "FV" movement began. I think you'll find some foundational stuff in there.

It was the idea of Covenant Succession that introduced me to the idea of FV. I'd actually never heard of it before today. I was convinced of Covenant Succession from listening to a baptism sermon preached by my pastor, John Shearouse (click here to listen, click here for the sermon notes).

I am unsure of the paedocommunion though. Our church doesn't practice it, and scripture says that we need to examine ourselves before taking communion. There seems to be some really good arguments on the paedocommunion side too... so I dunno!

I guess those are the two main things that I know about Federal Vision; and if you haven't read Wilson's book "Standing on the Promises," give it a read! It is extremely encouraging to my husband and I in bringing up our son.


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## Edward (Jun 10, 2011)

threehappypenguins said:


> I guess those are the two main things that I know about Federal Vision; and if you haven't read Wilson's book "Standing on the Promises," give it a read! It is extremely encouraging to my husband and I in bringing up our son.



You are aware that FV has been found to be out of bounds by the Presbyterian bodies that have studied it? 

Link to PCA here: PCA Historical Center: Index to the Position Papers of the Presbyterian Church in America

OPC: http://www.opc.org/GA/justification.pdf

RPCNA resolution reprinted here: RP Declaration on Justification « De Regno Christi

And see the RCUS report here: http://basketoffigs.org/NewPerspectives/Final_Federal.Vision.Report[1].pdf


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## Pilgrim (Jun 10, 2011)

Lane Keister's (greenbaggins) blog is an excellent resource as well.


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## MichaelLofton (Jun 22, 2011)

Zenas said:


> I know there are some present who have dealt extensively with FV theology. Those who have, will you recommend some online resources, whether drafted by you or others, to help me understand what the FV proponents are advancing and why they are incorrect. As my wife put it, "I'd rather not trust wikipedia."



Check out the 2003 Auburn Avenue Pastor's Conference available here: Covenant Media Foundation - The Federal Vision Examined -- AAPC 2003

The conference had lectures by four FV proponents and four non-FV guys. I think this is a good resource to understand what exactly the Federal Vision is about. In my understanding of the issues, it seems that the FV all boils down to the objectivity of the covenant of grace. FV proponents believe that everyone in the covenant community objectively has all of the benefits that come from Christ (the forgiveness of sins, justification, adoption as sons, indwelling of the Holy Spirit). According to FV guys, some in the covenant community have been predestined to persevere in this state and others have not been predestined to persevere in Christ (John 15 is usually used by FV guys to demonstrate that one can be in Christ and later on broken off from union with Christ). 

One of the things I have yet to hear the FV guys reconcile is how Christ could have propitiated the wrath of God for everyone in the covenant community, thereby giving everyone in the covenant forgiveness of sins, yet some fall away and end up in hell where the wrath of God is placed on them once again, even though Christ already propitiated the wrath they deserve. I also have not come across any exegetical articles on the golden chain of redemption written from an FV perspective. It would be interesting to see how they would exegete that passage. 

The whole controversy really boils down to one question: can the FV view of the objectivity of the covenant of grace be reconciled with the five points of Calvinism?


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