# Boring church service?



## arapahoepark (Jul 23, 2017)

How would you respond to those who say that your church services are boring and that 'they don't feel God?'
I have had people say that before and our church is more MacArthur-esque, Grace church type. I am not looking for witty comments but, deep insightful thoughts on how to have an intelligent conversation who seems to like the Pentecostal, stereotypical 'black church' emotionalism.​


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## Edward (Jul 23, 2017)

arapahoepark said:


> I am not looking for witty comments but, deep insightful thoughts



How are you going to have a deep, insightful discussion with someone that is that shallow in their faith.

Reactions: Like 1 | Funny 1


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Jul 23, 2017)

I expect the worship services to be conducted with due reverence towards God. I don't attend church with the idea of being fed, entertained, etc. Instead I believe are called to church to worship a most holy God. Sadly, for some churches "_worship_" means putting on a show. This view eliminates among my choices of church those that engage in _happy-clappy_ style services that seem so prevalent in many around my home. One wonders if these churches ever understood "_let's have a show!_" lesson of 1 Kings 18 or why Nadab and Abihu were consumed (Leviticus 10). 

Again, for me, _worship _is the key, as some churches do not appear to come together for worship of God. I don’t go to church to (1)evangelize, (2)to provide a comfortable “_consumer-friendly_” setting for the un-churched, (3)to primarily fellowship with other Christians, or (4)for lectures and devotionals—I go to church to worship God (Deuteronomy 12:29-32) in a way that is God-centered, Biblical, spiritual, weighty, and reverent. As the author of Hebrews urged us, worship of God must be conducted with reverence and awe (Hebrews 12:28-29).

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## TheThirdandReformedAdam (Jul 23, 2017)

Coming out of a Pentecostal background (and still attending a church that is dominantly Pentecostal), I believe one of the biggest issues you will have with trying to engage those people in conversation is that they deeply lack an appreciation for the holiness of God and justification by grace through faith in Christ alone. The 'happy-clappy' worship mentality seems to directly flow out of the idea that God is a laid-back, good-time-seeking deity, and that we ought to show up to Church ready to join in His celestial party. There is little understanding of His wrath against sin and His desire for worship in spirit _and truth_. Unless the people you want to engage are willing to engage in discussions about the holiness of God, then you will never be able to talk to them.

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## OPC'n (Jul 23, 2017)

I think people who like those types of churches are emotionally driven. If they don't feel something then it's not real. This is a sign of their lack of knowledge of God and his character. You would have to start by giving them a good book on God's holiness and a book on the reason for corporate worship. They go to churches like these bc they feel they are adding to worship to make it better (they feel it's better bc they feel emotional and they attribute their emotions to the work of Holy Spirit) by the way they worship instead of going to church to worship God according to his command on how to worship him

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## KeithW (Jul 23, 2017)

Personal note: I first believed on Jesus Christ in a Oneness Pentecostal Church, but did not spend much time in that church. Several years later I came to understand and believe the doctrines of Grace and the 5 points of Calvinism.

Phrases like "boring" and "don't _feel_ God" during "church services" must be investigated further. What do they mean? Is a specific part of the service being referred to? The song choices? Singing style? The sermon? Too much or not enough liturgical elements? A different cultural vibe? The charisma of the pastor? Whether or not the pastor is even following the text of Scripture?

Does the pastor do a really good job of following a text of Scripture and explaining it, and this is called boring? On the other hand do the songs never have direct words of praise to Jesus and the words are all about me, me, me, I, I, I? What aspect of church service are they speaking about?

You also need to consider the "age" of the person making the claim, and by age I mean spiritual maturity. A spiritually immature person will probably have less understanding of what is really important. They might even have a sense of what is important or what is missing but not have enough understanding to correctly identify it.

For example, I go to a Lutheran Bible study. (They let me.) A lady who used to go there clearly has a strong hunger and desire for God and His Word. Because of this she recently left the Lutheran Church for an independent church which teaches through the Bible. I talked with her privately and fully supported her in this because this particular Lutheran church, while it is the only conservative one in the area, is not good at teaching much of the Bible to grow the people. There is way too much reliance on liturgical elements being followed is enough.

We talked after she had been to her new church a few times and she urged me to visit. She talked about the grandeur of the building's foyer, that the pastor and his family all play musical instruments and are so talented musically that they have recorded several albums. She didn't mention once the content of the sermons. I had investigated this church previously as I have struggled to find a local church which follows the Bible. And while the pastor does go through the Bible he has a tendency to add commentary which doesn't follow the text and at times outright contradicts major themes of text. I am not going to criticize the lady for missing that aspect because even though we are the same age she seems to have not yet learned the importance of following and submitting to Scripture, while I have. But I remember starting out where she is now. The important thing in this case is she finally escaped what has been hindering her growth.

So this story was nothing more than one example of needing to investigate what they mean by "feeling God" in one church and not another. On one hand they may be referring to something that is correct but they don't know how to accurately articulate it, and on the other they may be completely misguided about what is important. This is where care needs to be taken.


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## John P (Jul 23, 2017)

arapahoepark said:


> How would you respond to those who say that your church services are boring and that 'they don't feel God?'
> I have had people say that before and our church is more MacArthur-esque, Grace church type. I am not looking for witty comments but, deep insightful thoughts on how to have an intelligent conversation who seems to like the Pentecostal, stereotypical 'black church' emotionalism.​



Well, first of all, not all pentecostalism is emotionalism. There is such a thing as worshipping in Spirit as well as in Truth. When King David was dancing in the street, was that emotionalism? Maybe the person does not feel an active worship going on. A worship that he thinks is oppressive and with the mind only and not with the Spirit. Worship is not just thinking rightly about God, it is praising Him.

Now, as to whether your church is a "mind only during worship" church, I obviously cannot say. I just know that there is plenty more to worship that many presbyterians incorrectly label "emotionalism" that is NOT emotionalism. When God moves you, He moves you inwardly and you want to dance for joy. The elders in heaven are falling on their knees in worship of God. When the Holy Spirit fell on the believers on Pentecost, the believers were mistaken as drunk. That should tell us that being touched by the Spirit can be much more than a "mind only, stay in your rigid standing positions, please" thing.

Anyways, maybe you could reply by asking the person why he feels that way. It is impossible to determine whether a person is chasing a feeling or looking for the Holy Spirit during worship without knowing why he specifically feels the way he does. If he says he does not feel the Holy Spirit, then ask him what feeling the Holy Spirit entails. If he references things that sound like emotionalism, or chasing a feeling, then you know he is looking for emotionalism. However, if he answers that he wants to worship freely and does not feel the Holy Spirit is present during worship, then that could be cause for concern. If someone is trying to draw near to God and is worshipping with their mind and they feel that God did not answer them, and multiple other people have voiced the same concern, then maybe it is time to take a look at whether worship in your church simply is not worship, or whether these people are in need of a pastor to teach them about God and how to have a relationship with Him.

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## Herald (Jul 23, 2017)

I agree with what Patrick said a few posts back:



Ask Mr. Religion said:


> I go to church to worship God (Deuteronomy 12:29-32) in a way that is God-centered, Biblical, spiritual, weighty, and reverent. As the author of Hebrews urged us, worship of God must be conducted with reverence and awe (Hebrews 12:28-29).


If the worship of God fills us with joy, amen! But there may also be times when worship fills us with godly sorrow over our sin. Worship draws us neigh unto God, along with our other brothers and sisters who worship along side us. We live in a fast food world that caters to our appetite. It is that way in the worship experience of many Christians.

If someone told me that our worship experience was boring, and that they do not "feel God", I would ask them why they think worship is boring, and what they would do to correct it. Their answer will say a lot. If they are a member of your church, I would use their answer to help instruct them on what worship is about. If they are a visitor I would still use it as a teaching moment, but I would not get drawn into a protracted argument that cannot be won. The person is either teachable or not. If they are not, then it is, "Thank you for coming, and for sharing your opinion."

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## jomawh (Jul 26, 2017)

When I hear of complaints about services being "too boring" I cannot help but question an individual's motivation for coming into the assembly. Over and against the world's noise you're finally entering into a place where God's word, just as tangible and real as the words with which He spoke untold numbers of stars and planets into existence, the full-glory of the universe, is presented to you to nourish, encourage, and convict of sin. How could that not shake you?

Or as the Belgic Confession beautifully puts it, "He testifies to us that as certainly as we take and hold the sacrament in our hands and eat and drink it with our mouths, by which our physical life is then sustained, so certainly do we receive by faith, as the hand and mouth of our soul, the true body and true blood of Christ, our only Saviour, in our souls for our spiritual life-" How could one stand in the congregation and know that, by faith, you do certainly receive the true body and blood of Christ, and not feel full and complete awe?

Either one's motivation is wrong or they simply don't understand why they're here.

Reactions: Like 2 | Amen 1


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## JTB.SDG (Jul 26, 2017)

I agree with many things here, but also would take due note of what JohnP said. Probably the person who said this was off based and immature. But any time someone says something like this, we need to take it seriously and do some honest searching. If we search before the Lord and find nothing, then we've done our part and we can dismiss it as not helpful or accurate.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ben Zartman (Jul 27, 2017)

If the worship is according to the RPW, we know that the Holy Spirit is there not because we can "feel" something, but because we believe His promises. He has promised to be with His gathered people. How they feel doesn't enter into it at all! Instead of looking inward and judging a service by how it makes one feel, we should engage fully in the means of grace believing that we are doing God's will.


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## earl40 (Jul 27, 2017)

What is interesting is that the parts found boring for many are my highlights. The Word preached is one of the few parts in my local congregation, along with pastoral prayer and the benediction, that falls within the RPW. Now that I have that principle most of what I see now practiced is simply appalling.
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## Joseph Noah Gagliardi (Jul 29, 2017)

I believe that this condition is common to the believer; the emptiness, and subsequent guilt at not feeling anything when in the presence of the Almighty God. We should desire to feel; to feel sorrow and guilt for our sins, for sinning against our LORD and Savior, as well as our Father. We as children seek to avoid His fatherly displeasure; there is that status as son or daughter. We should feel at times, assurance of forgiveness when we have confessed our sins and repented of them, and have pursued new obedience. When we have been delivered from some grievous sin or broken estate, we should feel the utter emptiness of our own effort, and even bewilderment when we see that we have blasphemed, and smitten with the fist of wickedness. Or like the prodigal son, when having rejected our Father, who from youth has provided for, and protected us, only to forsake our Father, yet, lo, He forgives us and utterly wipes away all memory of this, casting it behind His back, no more to be remembered. We should feel this emptiness. And joy. The joy of the Lord is a real part of the Christian's life. But truly, often the most present feeling is longing, longing _to_ feel something. Longing to feel joy. It doesn't seem right that we shouldn't feel. But that is the life of the sinner saved. We have indwelling us the Holy Spirit, we possess new life in Christ. Yet we still inhabit these bodies of dust, and there still remains much corruption in all believers, so often shrouding the glory of Christ, casting up mud to obscure our vision. I think a question worth asking of those who give this assessment of worship: Are you here _to_ feel, or because you feel the sense of your own unworthiness? Feeling without Christ is death, and so is the Regulative Principle of Worship death without Christ. Maybe put forth the help that they pray for God to give them this sense of their own unworthiness, that they may give all glory to God, for His deliverance. And pray for them as well. Going through the motions of worship, without the work of the Holy Spirit is the most agonizing and painful thing. One should never say worship is boring; please consider asking them what is boring about the worship service, and why they believe they don't feel God. I believe many who think this, do feel God, but they feel His wrath for their sins, and need Christ. Or they have their sins cast up by Satan to discourage them, or they see their remaining sin, and are brought low. Past life experiences of believers who may have sinned egregiously do not disappear at regeneration: we reap what we sow. But we are saved as by fire, and as the fire of the Word and Spirit burn up our dross, it is painful, and one may feel undone. This is different from simply "not feeling God". Also, in Reformed circles, we tend to become legalistic, where as Charismatic folk tend to become antinomian. They might have a true complaint. I would beg you address them in all humility, seeking how they might be built up in Christ, not debased for not conforming to Reformed standards. Above all pray for them. If you find evidence for unbelief, tell them of Christ, and the true nature of the Christian walk: our pilgrimage is not often easy. Tell them they may not feel now, but in Christ, _there is_ rest, and that eternal, which is far more glorious than "feeling". Peace be unto you.

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## BG (Jul 31, 2017)

Here is the answer put in your earbuds and enjoy.

https://s3-us-west-2.amazonaws.com/...remacyofGodinRedemptivePreachingIsa52_1-7.mp3


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## Stope (Jul 31, 2017)

Ask Mr. Religion said:


> I expect the worship services to be conducted with due reverence towards God. I don't attend church with the idea of being fed, entertained, etc. Instead I believe are called to church to worship a most holy God. Sadly, for some churches "_worship_" means putting on a show. This view eliminates among my choices of church those that engage in _happy-clappy_ style services that seem so prevalent in many around my home. One wonders if these churches ever understood "_let's have a show!_" lesson of 1 Kings 18 or why Nadab and Abihu were consumed (Leviticus 10).
> 
> Again, for me, _worship _is the key, as some churches do not appear to come together for worship of God. I don’t go to church to (1)evangelize, (2)to provide a comfortable “_consumer-friendly_” setting for the un-churched, (3)to primarily fellowship with other Christians, or (4)for lectures and devotionals—I go to church to worship God (Deuteronomy 12:29-32) in a way that is God-centered, Biblical, spiritual, weighty, and reverent. As the author of Hebrews urged us, worship of God must be conducted with reverence and awe (Hebrews 12:28-29).


Well said! Very helpful indeed


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## John P (Jul 31, 2017)

JTB.SDG said:


> I agree with many things here, but also would take due note of what JohnP said. Probably the person who said this was off based and immature. But any time someone says something like this, we need to take it seriously and do some honest searching. If we search before the Lord and find nothing, then we've done our part and we can dismiss it as not helpful or accurate.



Truth.


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