# Philip Melanchthon on God’s care for the church in the face of the Islamic threat



## Reformed Covenanter (Jul 31, 2022)

... In the past, Germany excelled both in the greatness of minds and in the truth, honesty and faith of its counsels. Nowadays people contend with ruses, righteous intentions are made sport of, and the ancient desire for military glory and courage are extinct. Therefore you can see that there is no help in such public danger, not only in Germany, but also in the rest of Europe.

When I think about this, I am distressed in my mind for the Church and for our studies, both of which are particularly threatened with devastation and ruin by the savagery of the Turks [Islam]. Although dangerous hardship is imminent, as there are many signs not only in the stars, but also in the morals of men, I nevertheless sustain myself by the hope that God will care for the Church, and that the Son of God will defend our assemblies, as Daniel foretold. ...

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Philip Melanchthon on God’s care for the church in the face of the Islamic threat


There is an old story about an oracle of the sibyl concerning Athens – that two banes would be its ruin, namely deceit and the stupidity of its leaders. However, if we consider the everyday life of…




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## Phil D. (Jul 31, 2022)

The Islamic conquests of large parts of Europe has always been a fascinating part of history to me. Their ultimate defeat in those endeavors indeed has providential hallmarks. The Moorish advance far into central France was improbably repelled (infantry vs. heavy cavalry) by Charles Martel at the battle of Tours (732). In Luther and Melanchthon's day the Turks held the entire Balkan Peninsula and were at the very gates of Vienna - a mere few hundred miles from Wittenberg. It was only at the Battle of Vienna (1683) that a badly outnumbered Christian alliance was able to repel and force the gradual retreat of the Ottomans back into Asia Minor. In terms of how one envisions the vicarious Muslim conquest currently occurring in Europe as ultimately turning out, I suppose that will be governed by one's eschatological presuppositions.

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## Pergamum (Jul 31, 2022)

We should thank the Catholics for their work in defeating the Turk. The Protestants didn't do very much at all until later when we colonized their lands.

We all speak of the Catholic as "Anti-Christ" and then suddenly POOF they are Christian once they are fighting off the Muslims.


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## Charles Johnson (Jul 31, 2022)

Pergamum said:


> We should thank the Catholics for their work in defeating the Turk. The Protestants didn't do very much at all until later when we colonized their lands.
> 
> We all speak of the Catholic as "Anti-Christ" and then suddenly POOF they are Christian once they are fighting off the Muslims.


In all fairness, Catholics killed protestants and Muslims merely enslaved and oppressed them, given the chance.


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## Pergamum (Jul 31, 2022)

Charles Johnson said:


> In all fairness, Catholics killed protestants and Muslims merely enslaved and oppressed them, given the chance.


So Muslims never killed Protestants? That is false, but if it were true it was because millions of Catholics were a barrier between them and fought a fight that Protestants did not (enemies on both sides, Muslims to the South and Protestants to the north). 

"Merely enslaved and oppressed them"....oh, ok... ha ha....

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## Phil D. (Jul 31, 2022)

Pergamum said:


> We should thank the Catholics for their work in defeating the Turk. ... We all speak of the Catholic as "Anti-Christ"



Yes, I'm certainly willing to "thank" them for (or, more precisely, I am grateful for) their role in defeating the Turks, while at the same time I'll persist in pointing out their blatantly anti-Christ characteristics. Both attitudes may be held concurrently without contradiction. Apples and artichokes.



Pergamum said:


> The Protestants didn't do very much at all until later when we colonized their lands.



This was largely due to the Turks occupying lands that adjoined Catholic countries. Of course prior to the Battle of Vienna the Catholic and Protestant factions of much of Christian Europe (I use that term primarily in a geopolitical sense, ala Christendom) had just finished beating each other to smithereens in the Thirty Years' War... Still, there were a few Protestant states that pitched in to drive back the Ottomans, like Saxony (Lutheran), along with various countries that had divided religious loyalties, like Poland-Lithuania (Catholic and Lutheran) and Hungary (Catholic and Reformed).

Of course a critical difference between previous Islamic attempts to subjugate Europe and the current situation is that before they were seen as invaders and actively opposed by religious and governmental powers alike, whereas now they have essentially had the welcome mat rolled out for them...


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## Charles Johnson (Jul 31, 2022)

Pergamum said:


> So Muslims never killed Protestants? That is false, but if it were true it was because millions of Catholics were a barrier between them and fought a fight that Protestants did not (enemies on both sides, Muslims to the South and Protestants to the north).
> 
> "Merely enslaved and oppressed them"....oh, ok... ha ha....


I didn't say never.


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## Claes Jacob Heijndericksz (Aug 1, 2022)

Pergamum said:


> We should thank the Catholics for their work in defeating the Turk. The Protestants didn't do very much at all until later when we colonized their lands.
> 
> We all speak of the Catholic as "Anti-Christ" and then suddenly POOF they are Christian once they are fighting off the Muslims.


We should thank God He send the Turks into Europe. They kept the empire of the Antichrist occupied while the real church was able to flourish in all the places where the gospel was preached.

You would most likely not be able to read books of Calvin, Brakel or Spurgeon if the house of Habsburg would have been able to direct all its attention to the Reformation. With all their forced there would not have been a Dutch Republic and not have been a Glorious Revolution in England. All of Europe and America would probably have been fallen into the hands of the Antichrist of Rome.

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## Pergamum (Aug 1, 2022)

Claes Jacob Heijndericksz said:


> We should thank God He send the Turks into Europe. They kept the empire of the Antichrist occupied while the real church was able to flourish in all the places where the gospel was preached.
> 
> You would most likely not be able to read books of Calvin, Brakel or Spurgeon if the house of Habsburg would have been able to direct all its attention to the Reformation. With all their forced there would not have been a Dutch Republic and not have been a Glorious Revolution in England. All of Europe and America would probably have been fallen into the hands of the Antichrist of Rome.


That is one perspective. But Islam is further from the truth than the ancient Catholic creeds, which we still use today. Plus, Western civilization deserves to be defended.

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