# Who was present on the mountain to receive the Great Commission?



## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2015)

The 11 only? Others?

What theological significance does this have?


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2015)

Anybody?

It seems likely that it was more than the 11. Am I wrong?


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## Contra_Mundum (Jan 24, 2015)

Probably "...above 500 at once." 1Cor.15:6.

Still, I'd say Jesus' address is to _the Church_, and not to individuals in private capacity (baptizing and teaching should be done according to good order). He isn't addressing only officers, but he is addressing the Church, which has order from the start. I.e., it's false to say Christianity was just a "movement" to begin with, and only got organization and was made less "ideal" somehow later.


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## Nomad (Jan 24, 2015)

Pergamum said:


> The 11 only? Others?
> 
> What theological significance does this have?



I see no indication in the text of Matthew 28 that any other than the 11 were present at that particular time. As for 1 Corinthians 15, the text indicates that Jesus appeared at different times to various people. Notice the bold type in the Scripture quotation below. In any case, this isn't a hill I would die on, but I am curious. What theological significance do you see here? I'm thinking that you must have something in mind or you wouldn't have raised this issue. 

1Co 15:5 and that he appeared to Cephas, *then* to the twelve. 
1Co 15:6 *Then* he appeared to more than five hundred brothers at one time, most of whom are still alive, though some have fallen asleep. 
1Co 15:7 *Then* he appeared to James, then to all the apostles. 
1Co 15:8 *Last of all,* as to one untimely born, he appeared also to me.


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2015)

Contra_Mundum said:


> Probably "...above 500 at once." 1Cor.15:6.
> 
> Still, I'd say Jesus' address is to _the Church_, and not to individuals in private capacity (baptizing and teaching should be done according to good order). He isn't addressing only officers, but he is addressing the Church, which has order from the start. I.e., it's false to say Christianity was just a "movement" to begin with, and only got organization and was made less "ideal" somehow later.



I tentatively hold to that as well, that the 500 at once might be at the Great Commission. Any supporting proofs of this?


Does it matter if it was to the 11 or to 500 or so? We could still say it was to the Church as a whole whether the 11 foundation pillars or the 500 or so first disciples were present, right? Either way, the Great Commission was given to the Church as a whole, right, and not just the Apostles. That way it is still valid even after the death of those apostles.


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## Contra_Mundum (Jan 24, 2015)

Pergy,

In my opinion (For what it's worth), I think the text of Matthew 28 _does offer_ more than mild hints that there were present others than the Eleven. And, when we combine the gospel accounts for a fuller record of events during the 40 days, the result is supportive of such conclusions.

Matthew records only the appearance to the women on the Day of Resurrection, and none of the several other appearances that took place: such as with 10 of the Eleven, with those on the road to Emmaus, individuals like Peter, etc.

Who _exactly_ are the *brethren* Jesus orders the women to tell to "go to Galilee" to meet him? Are these "brethren" merely the Ten he's about to see and tell himself? Or, might it be more accurate to think of a much wider circle of followers, of "brethren," as many as they can tell in the following weeks? "Brethren" is an inclusive term, and it is fair to read it in broad terms here. Lk.24:9 says explicitly, "And returning from the tomb they told all these things to the eleven *and to all the rest*."

We have good reasons to think that after the second-Sunday appearance, when Thomas was present, Jn.20:26, the Eleven's "doubts" were significantly removed, see Act.1:3. But still, Matthew reports in v17 that "some doubted." The soon-to-be apostles had by the time of the Galilean Commission several encounters with Jesus resurrected, which meetings included his further opening their minds (Lk.24:45) to his teaching. I'm not persuaded there is still enough doubt in this small circle to mention it. I think it's fair to gloss those three Gk. words, "But there were doubters." "Some" is simply the definite article.

It isn't obvious to me that in Matthew's account, 28:16-17, that "some" (v17) are a subset (specifically) of the Eleven, who first are said to "worship"--quite the opposite of doubting. If we consider the possibility of a sizable crowd (perhaps even one meeting so noteworthy, Paul who wasn't there nevertheless heard of it), the two verbs do not have to be resolved inside the same tight group. Rather, we understand the Eleven are leading in worship, and the crowd contains some who had heard the news, but now are seeing and hearing the Risen Lord for the first time. And the response of these first-time encounters is similar to the Eleven's first reactions, see Lk.24:41.

Finally, reconsider the question: what sort of gathering is Paul most likely referring to in 1Cor.15:6? It is one that is quite memorable. The Galilee Commission is the meeting Jesus himself set up, apparently to be his big-event prior to his departure/ascension. The latter took place upon Olivet, only a few miles from Jerusalem, and it was not as "public," possibly for reason of proximity to the hostile authorities. If we compare Lk.24 and Act.1, the numbers seem smaller. And we're told the local congregation after 50 days is only about 120 souls, not all of whom may have attended.

So, Jesus is raised; he sends out word: "the meeting I promised you (Mt.26:32) is on!" which news takes three-or-four weeks to spread about everywhere in Judea and Galilee (at least); and a major crowd is gathered together, away from hostile authorities and closer to the homes of many Galileans who constituted the base of his following.


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2015)

Thanks so much! Great!


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## whirlingmerc (Jan 24, 2015)

Actually, Jesus appeared to give the great commision at least three times and places. At his ascention was one of those

Mt 18:18-20; Mk 16:15-18; Lk 24:46,47
so perhaps it was repeated those... and at other times...


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## Peairtach (Jan 25, 2015)

This 500 that the Apostle mentions shows that many of those who responded to Christ's preaching were not of the number who accompanied Him on His itineraries. 

They were converted, or at least professed faith in Him, and stayed where they were, in their various locales throughout judea, Samaria and Galilee.

Sent from my HTC Wildfire using Tapatalk 2


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