# Valentine's Day and The Westminster Confession of Faith



## Wanderer (Feb 12, 2010)

On Valentines Day Sunday, I'm sure there will be many church's preaching on a husband is to love his wife as Christ loves the church. And many of a lady out their will appreciated these words from their pastor. 

But I ask you, how are we to love? For God's word tells us we are to Love God and our Neighbor, and that these two commandments hang all the law and of he prophets.
_
Matthew 22:36-40 (King James Version)
Master, which is the great commandment in the law? 
Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. 
This is the first and great commandment. 
And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbor as thyself. 
On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets._


With this said, are we to define the love we are to show towards God and others as we see fit, or as God sees fit? I've come across many well meaning Christians who speak of love, but know nothing of what God's word commands. I submit, that the two of the greatest commandments is a summarization of mans duty, and that the Ten Commandments expands this summarization further, and that the whole of scripture expands the Ten Commandments. 

For example, in the Ten Commandments we are instructed how we are to love God in that we are to have no other god before him, we are not to take his name in vain, we are not to worship idols, and so forth. The rest of scripture gives us lesson on these commands. Therefor we are taught how to love God, and what is not loving God, along with the natural consequences of not loving God properly.

Additionally, we are taught how to love our neighbors by not stealing from them, not committing adultery, not murdering them, not bearing false witnesses against them, and so forth. And likewise the rest of scripture expands upon these themes, and again we are taught how to love and how to not love our neighbors, and the natural consequences if we fail to keep these commands.

Is this not the love that we should be speaking of on Valentine's Day?

However, the sad fact is that many will focus their attention on romantic love this Sunday. Mean while the will ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce. And members of these reformed churches are divorcing one another and in sometimes being told that divorcing their spouse even though no adultery nor desertion of their spouse has occurred is not sin. And other's in the church look on and think that a divorce for any and every reason is not sin, especially if it is because the two people argue. 

I say this that these Reformed Church that allow members to divorce for reason other than adultery or desertion have departed from the reformation an God's word. And those churches that have the Westminster Confession of Faith as their church confession and believe that divorce for reasons other than adultery or desertion is permissible show that they have abandoned their church's confession and and only preaching and teaching what is right in their own eyes. 

For the Westminster Confession of Faith states the following:

_WCF 24.6. Although the corruption of man be such as is apt to study arguments unduly to put asunder those whom God hath joined together in marriage: yet, nothing but adultery, or such willful desertion as can no way be remedied by the Church, or civil magistrate, is cause sufficient of dissolving the bond of marriage: wherein, a public and orderly course of proceeding is to be observed; and the persons concerned in it not left to their own wills and discretion in their own case._


And for those church's that also hold to the Westminster Larger Catechism and make statements that members can leave their spouces for reason other than willful desertion or adultery, and fail to hold those members accountable, now preach and teach that adultery is no longer a sin, and by their failure to act are endorsing members to violate the 7th Commandment.

_Q. 139. What are the sins forbidden in the seventh commandment?
A. The sins forbidden in the seventh commandment, besides the neglect of the duties required, are, adultery, fornication, rape, incest, sodomy, and all unnatural lusts; all unclean imaginations, thoughts, purposes, and affections; all corrupt or filthy communications, or listening thereunto; wanton looks, impudent or light behavior, immodest apparel; prohibiting of lawful, and dispensing with unlawful marriages; allowing, tolerating, keeping of stews, and resorting to them; entangling vows of single life, undue delay of marriage; having more wives or husbands than one at the same time; unjust divorce, or desertion; idleness, gluttony, drunkenness, unchaste company; lascivious songs, books, pictures, dancings, stage plays; and all other provocations to, or acts of uncleanness, either in ourselves or others._


With this said, this Sunday, take these issues up before your church leaders. Ask them, how are we loving one another when divorce is so ramped within the church? Has not our church's become a church of Corinth? Should we not do as Paul instructs the Corinthian Church and repent of our sins, and do that which is right? Ask your leadership, what are we doing to ensure that our Gospel Message is clear on this issue.

I also wondering how many churches that have the Westminster Confession of Faith as their statement of faith actually teach to it. Or is it one of those things that they just list on their web page.

For those of us that what to uphold the Westminster Confession of Faith as our own confession, by wearing parts of it, I have designed a T-Shirt that can be found at www.shirtmagic.com/shop/spepchurch . Other things people can do is also post parts of the confession up on their web pages, or encourage their leaders to have it as part of their church Sunday Morning Readings.

The shirt is pretty straight forward. It has WCF 24.6 on the back of it, and Matthew 19:6 on the back. Will you buy the shirt or make one up like it to show your support for the words of the Westminster Confession of Faith and Christ's own words in this age when people are getting divorce for any and every reason? I think in this age of ramped divorce, if you do not make such statements like this, you and your church's are simply giving consent to unjust divorces, and are equally guilty of breaking the 7th Commandment, and how is that loving your neighbor on Valentine's Day. Give the gift of love, and speak lovingly and truthfully.


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## lynnie (Feb 12, 2010)

_Mean while the will ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce. And members of these reformed churches are divorcing one another and in sometimes being told that divorcing their spouse even though no adultery nor desertion of their spouse has occurred is not sin. And other's in the church look on and think that a divorce for any and every reason is not sin, especially if it is because the two people argue. 

I say this that these Reformed Church that allow members to divorce for reason other than adultery or desertion have departed from the reformation an God's word._

Is it really that bad out there? I am limited mostly to East Coast PCA exposure and this is not the case. I will say that I am aware of non biblical divorces in more typical evangelical churches....(he spiritually deserted me and didn't meet my emotional needs sort of thing), and definitely a cavalier attitude towards the subject with charismatics who are "led by the spirit" and "mercy triumphs over judgment", so they excuse a lot of things that are NT unbiblical, not just divorce. But is it this bad in Reformed denominations? I'd like to think not. Am I naive?

A lot of this needs to be premarital counseling I think, and ongoing, not just pulpit. Even with good counseling on most subjects, I never got one word from anybody on how I would feel when I had little kids with a vomiting virus throwing up all night. I have a wonderful helpful caring husband, but sickness and stress can make you feel like you'd trade family in for a week of sleep. I wish I had had an older woman in my life to talk to back in the early days, and some accountability when I didn't agree about our (very tight) finances and argued with him. The bible exhorts older women to be helping younger ones to love their husbands, and I rarely had that. I try to be that now for others, but the point is, don't lay the burden of all this on Sunday preaching. God's means of grace for marriage is a lot more.


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## Edward (Feb 12, 2010)

> ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce.



I'll challenge your statistic. I don't think you are going to be able to back that up. 

indeed, there is a dearth of good data. The CDC statistics, for example, exclude several states, including California and Georgia. See, for example, http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr57/nvsr57_19.pdf

Good places to start might be here: http://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/series/sr_23/sr23_022.pdf

You can look at secondary and tertiary sources:

3. PROJECTION/PREDICTION. This is the Census Bureau's often-cited "50%" rate, the proportion of marriages taking place right now that will eventually divorce, which has since been revised downward to roughly 43% by the National Center for Health Statistics but was moved back up to around 50% by the Census Bureau in 2002, with even more ifs ands and buts than usual. Most recently, according to the New York Times, it has been revised downward to just over 40%.
Divorce Rates - Divorce Statistics Collection

Or breakdowns such as this:
Divorce Statistics : Divorce Rate Statistics


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## SemperEruditio (Feb 12, 2010)

The thread should be titled

_Valentine's Day and Divorce in the WCF_

I fail to see the connection between a focus on romantic love during Valentine's Day and then the WCF's stance on divorce. Is your claim that the focus on romantic love during Valentine's Day leads to or does not retard divorce in the US? 

Now you ask how are we to love but then cut to another part of scripture. In Ephesians it tells us husbands that we are to love our wives as Christ loves the Church. Christ died for His bride as must those of us who are husbands. I see nothing wrong with the message on Valentine's Day on the eternal and extreme love that Christ has for His bride preached and men encouraged to follow suit. This love is more than just a romantic love but the love a man has for his wife is not the same love a man has for his neighbor. We do an injustice to equate the love we have as husbands for our wives as the same love we have for our neighbor.

I see nothing wrong with romantic love. I would dare say that if men loved their wives romantically in word and deed that would do far more to squelch the divorce statistics. I have never heard a wife tell her husband _I think you love me more than you love (your friends, TV, sports, your ministry...)_ it is always the other way around. Men have to learn and have it preached into them that the great love Christ has for His bride is the same love we men need to have for ours and that it not be a:

_Huh....yeah baby...I love you too....can I finish watching the game?_

or for us Reformed

_Huh....yeah baby...I love you too....can I finish reading this chapter of Bavinck?_


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## Curt (Feb 12, 2010)

I'm preaching from Hebrews 12:14-17, the "Community of Holiness." It's unlikely that Valentine will be mentioned, but what greater love is there than that which we are taught in Scripture regarding Christ's love for us and our living out that love within the "salvation community," as I sometime call the church?


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## Wanderer (Feb 12, 2010)

Edward said:


> > ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Sorry, got my number switched up there. Your right, about 50% of marriages in divorce. The 65% is the number of women initiated divorces. However, I find it interesting that church's now have these recovery ministries associated with divorce, and from what I can see the ones being ministered are not new comers to the church, but are members who recently have gone through or going through a divorce. At least that is what I see in my church.

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SemperEruditio said:


> The thread should be titled
> 
> _Valentine's Day and Divorce in the WCF_
> 
> ...


 
All love has to have a starting point. The starting point is to love each other as neighbors first. If you can't get that far then you might as well bag the rest. 

In a marriage men are to love their wives as Christ loves the church, the love talked about here in the scriptures is not a romantic love. It is a love that puts another needs before his desires. We as Christians are also to consider the needs of others, other than our own families. But with that said, our own families and especially our wives are to be given priority. This is a balancing act that every man has to do for himself. There is no prescribed formula that I can think of.

Does not Christ do this also. I think of William Tyndale who Christ indeed loved, ended up suffering and dying for the Word of God so that Christ body may be edified. Again, no prescribed formula here. Many would have counted Tyndale for being not favored by God, since God chose not to save him from the flames, but I believe that many of us would now count Tyndale as being most favored by God.

A man's responsibility to love his wife as Christ loves the Church has more to do with his leadership role and sacrificial roles for his wife. To understand this better, one needs to look at all the various was the Christ loves the church. Think on how he makes provision for the church, how he teaches the church, how he chastises the church, and how he sacrificed himself for the church. This is all part of his love.

But now as to the divorce issue. If couples believe that they can divorce for what ever reason may come their way, how are they emulating Christ love in a marriage, or how are they being neighbors to one another. I believe the two greatest commandment includes a man love towards his wife, and a wives love towards her husband. 

How is it love if he or she files for divorce? And how is it love to allow situation where children are being denied at least one parent?

This is something that church's as a whole are accepting. This breakdown of commitments is part of the core of our societal problems with out a doubt.


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## SolaScriptura (Feb 12, 2010)

1. 65% of marriages don't end in divorce. That is way too high. Every stat I've ever seen has the divorce rate hovering between 45-50% (which is still too high... but not nearly as high as 65%).

2. Is there really a way to track the number of divorces that occur from within Reformed demoninations? I've never seen the breakdown get that specific. I would LOVE to see how the NAPARC type churches compare with "evangelicals" and "mainliners" in terms of things like adultery and divorce.


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## Andres (Feb 12, 2010)

I would probably lean more towards John MacArthur's belief on the divorce in the church issue. Here is an excerpt from an article entitled, "Divorcing Fact from Fiction": 



> Some reporter called me a few months ago and said,
> Reporter: There is a new study, a new survey that indicates that divorce among Christians is the same as divorce among non-Christians. This survey has been done, this poll has been taken and it has been determined that Christians are divorced at the same rate that non-Christians are divorced in America. What do you think of that?
> John MacArthur: I don't believe it--I do not believe that.
> Reporter: But this is what the survey says!
> ...



You can read the whole article here and there is also a part 2 here.


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## Wanderer (Feb 12, 2010)

lynnie said:


> _Mean while the will ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce. And members of these reformed churches are divorcing one another and in sometimes being told that divorcing their spouse even though no adultery nor desertion of their spouse has occurred is not sin. And other's in the church look on and think that a divorce for any and every reason is not sin, especially if it is because the two people argue.
> 
> I say this that these Reformed Church that allow members to divorce for reason other than adultery or desertion have departed from the reformation an God's word._
> 
> ...


 
Egalitarianism has gained a strong foot hold in the church. Along with it are teachings where a man's headship is only symbolic, and soon after that comes the teachings of divorce for any and every reason. 

I unfortunately live in one of the most liberal states in the union, and in one of the most liberal counties in that state, so from my perspective it is ramped. And as far as the WCF is concerned, in my own church it only gets a mention in membership class. I've never heard mention of it from the pulpit, which is pretty sad. It's a wonderful document, and our pastors are to use it as part of their standards. 

Unfortunately, the messages I have seen are much like you would get in a non Reformed Church, with just a sprinkling of reformed doctrine to give the appearance of being reformed. I would venture that if I wore my new T-Shirt to a church activity that many members of my church would not recognize the words of the WCF, and that there might indeed be many that disagree with the words. So the situation may be different in own particular church, but you shouldn't assume that all the churches that referred to themselves as being reformed actually apply their own confessional standards.


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## Andres (Feb 12, 2010)

Wanderer said:


> lynnie said:
> 
> 
> > _Mean while the will ignore the fact that 65% of all marriage which include many marriages in reformed churches end in divorce. And members of these reformed churches are divorcing one another and in sometimes being told that divorcing their spouse even though no adultery nor desertion of their spouse has occurred is not sin. And other's in the church look on and think that a divorce for any and every reason is not sin, especially if it is because the two people argue.
> ...



Then your issue seems to be more with your church than with anything else.


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## Wanderer (Feb 12, 2010)

Andres said:


> I would probably lean more towards John MacArthur's belief on the divorce in the church issue. Here is an excerpt from an article entitled, "Divorcing Fact from Fiction":
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Actually, I too would lean more on John MacArthur's belief also to some degree.

Yes, many people claim to be Christians but are indeed are not part of the elect. And these same people attend or do not attend churches. So since we do not know who is part of the invisible church for sure, the numbers of the pole will be off. However, I think that many of these pollsters also ask the question if they person attends church or is a member of a church. BTW, I know for a fact that Chesapeake Presbytery has permitted a divorce and neither party was discipline for the matter. And there is at least one other case out there where the Presbytery has refused to act. On both cases, all members of Presbytery were will informed, and many complaints were filed for both. These divorces have not happen in a quite secretly manner where the Session and Presbertyies can say they knew nothing of it, but are happening with the full knowledge of the elders, and these same members are being still held in good standing by the church. And not only that, but in one case, the church is actually assisting in the divorce itself.

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SolaScriptura said:


> 1. 65% of marriages don't end in divorce. That is way too high. Every stat I've ever seen has the divorce rate hovering between 45-50% (which is still too high... but not nearly as high as 65%).
> 
> 2. Is there really a way to track the number of divorces that occur from within Reformed demoninations? I've never seen the breakdown get that specific. I would LOVE to see how the NAPARC type churches compare with "evangelicals" and "mainliners" in terms of things like adultery and divorce.


 

I think this is something that should be brought to the GA. We record church attendances, deaths, births, and why not divorces. Having a statistic which records divorce statistics with the following questions would be a good litmus test to see if the preaching and teaching is being affective in people lives. 

Here's are some questions that could be asked:

1. Was the grounds for divorce for actual physical adultery?
2. Was the grounds for divorce for willful desertion?
3. Was the grounds for divorce for physical abuse?
4. Was the grounds for divorce for mutual desertion?
5. How long has each spouse been a professing Christian?
6. How long has each spouse been a member of the local church?
7. How long has each spouse been a member of the denomination?
8. In the case of abuse, did the local Session follow the PCA position papers to assist the victim and help the marriage to survive?
9. Was there a death of a child?
10. In the case of desertion or adultery what did the local Session do to keep the marriage intact?

As you can see, there's a wealth of information that can be asked gathered and analyzed that can be very meaningful to determine if church leadership and ministries are effective. But this would have to start more than likely at the GA level, and then at the NAPARC level in order to be effective. 

Unfortunately, these number could be a double edge sword. First, they could prove to be an effective witness of the power of Christ words, or they could prove to be an effective witness of church's departing from God's word. To me, both could serve to glorify God. For if we know we are well, then we can say we are good in this area. However, if we have a festering cancer, then we need to act so we can become well again.


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