# Whitefield Unregenerate?!?!



## Scot (Aug 31, 2005)

Anyone familiar with these guys? Wow, it looks like all the great Calvinists were unsaved!

http://www.outsidethecamp.org/letters44.htm


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## Bladestunner316 (Aug 31, 2005)




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## BobVigneault (Aug 31, 2005)

I regret that these fellows are from my native state. Let's just say this. In the days of the wilderness wanderings when someone was unclean or steeped in habitual sin they were sent 'outside the camp'. These nut-burgers are very appropriately named. This is a perfect example of how the internet can give a group of irrelavant hate-mongers a louder voice than they have earned or deserve. Their mean-spiritedness and small mindedness is surpassed only by their ignorance. Have nothing to do with them.


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

Don't worry--everybody is a heretic to these guys. Ha, they even accused John Robbins at one time of being compromising the doctrine!


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## Bryan (Aug 31, 2005)

I've gone through that site before, I think Phil Johnson has them in his "Really Bad Theology" section. Who c an take a site seriously that is so "calvinistic" that they put Calvin in the Heterodoxy Hall of Shame? 

Bryan
SDG

[Edited on 8-31-2005 by Bryan]


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## Scot (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by maxdetail_
> Have nothing to do with them.



Don't worry, I wasn't planning on it.


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## BobVigneault (Aug 31, 2005)

I know that Dan. I'm just saying, no one should even look at their website. No one should even repeat the name of the site. In fact, don't even say any of the words that make up their name. Don't say 'outside', don't say 'camp', don't even say 'out'. If you must say 'the' then go wash is the Jordan river 7 times after you do. And if you think someone is going to say the name it would be better to puncture your ear drums with an anthrax infected pencil than to hear the vile name repeated. That's all I'm saying Dan.


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## alwaysreforming (Aug 31, 2005)

Uh-oh! I "snuck a peek" at it earlier... and the Jordan is so far away! 

Is there any hope for one such as me?

Actually, when I see sites like theirs, it does affect me. It fills me with bitterness and anger towards them, which I know is not a good thing. Its just unfathomable how "nasty" people can be "in the name of Christ."


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## Puritanhead (Aug 31, 2005)

<<< my token emoticon protest


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## turmeric (Aug 31, 2005)

Bob,
For all the vegetarians in the world, please take back your remark calling these of whom we do not speak "nut-burgers". It's an insult to all vegetarian food!


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## PuritanCovenanter (Aug 31, 2005)

Nobody knows God and truth like this guy.  * NOT!*


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## Me Died Blue (Aug 31, 2005)

It is simply another one of the various scattered hyper-Calvinist groups out there.



> _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> Don't worry--everybody is a heretic to these guys. Ha, they even accused John Robbins at one time of being compromising the doctrine!



Now _that_ is funny.


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Me Died Blue_
> It is simply another one of the various scattered hyper-Calvinist groups out there.
> 
> 
> ...



See Paul's Someone Needs His Mouth Washed Out!
Marc Carpenter wrote:


> "Does this sound like the John Robbins you have read? It certainly didn't sound like the John Robbins I had read; I was floored. It sounded like Van Til!"





> Welcome Dr. Robbins, you Van Tilian you, you're finally a member of your own club!


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## Me Died Blue (Aug 31, 2005)

I read that when Paul wrote it. To keep on track here, it only makes sense that groups like Outside the Camp and individuals like Robbins, because of their shared tendency of labeling people heretics left and right, would sooner or later find some reason to label _each other_ that as well. In other words, when a heresy-hunting group of hyper-Calvinists find reason to label even one so close to their own patterns a heretic, then you _really_ know there's something wrong here.


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by maxdetail_
> I know that Dan. I'm just saying, no one should even look at their website. No one should even repeat the name of the site. In fact, don't even say any of the words that make up their name. Don't say 'outside', don't say 'camp', don't even say 'out'. If you must say 'the' then go wash is the Jordan river 7 times after you do. And if you think someone is going to say the name it would be better to puncture your ear drums with an anthrax infected pencil than to hear the vile name repeated. That's all I'm saying Dan.



So if my options are:

1)Drinking Miller High Life

OR

2) Visiting OTC

What do you say?


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## crhoades (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> So if my options are:
> 
> 1)Drinking Miller High Life
> ...



That's tough...maybe if I stall long enough, we'll be raptured out of here and I won't have to decide...


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by crhoades_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> ...



Okay, this needs to stop! Miller High Life is not that bad a beer! In a bottle, it is quite good.


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## Craig (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by crhoades_
> ...


Don't worry. I'm laughed at and mocked for my love of this brew. It's cheap and good...not great, but it beats paying a lot for something else.

Miller High Life is truly, "The champagne of beers".


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## Scot (Aug 31, 2005)

> I know that Dan. I'm just saying, no one should even look at their website. No one should even repeat the name of the site. In fact, don't even say any of the words that make up their name. Don't say 'outside', don't say 'camp', don't even say 'out'. If you must say 'the' then go wash is the Jordan river 7 times after you do. And if you think someone is going to say the name it would be better to puncture your ear drums with an anthrax infected pencil than to hear the vile name repeated. That's all I'm saying Dan.



Oh, o.k., I understand. I'm headin' for the jordan.


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## Arch2k (Aug 31, 2005)

I understand that there are many on this board who do not care for Robbins, and in fact are very Van-Tillian (anti-Robbins), but let's be fair. Lumping Robbins and OTC together is hasty In my humble opinion.

OTC is:
1)not part of a respectable denomination
2)not ordained
3)to my knowledge not educated

Robbins is:
1)until recently a member and part of a respectable denomination
2)ordained and licensed to preach by the PCA
3)has a doctorate in Philosophy and Political Theory, served as an aid to a memeber of Congress and has taught at Harvard University, the University of Colorado, the University of Texas, Biola University, Sangre de Cristo Seminary, College of the Southwest, Westminster Seminary, Western Reformed Seminary, and Chesapeake Seminary.

You may not agree with everything that Robbins teaches (I don't either), and that is ok, but these two are miles apart. I also understand that Carpenter wrote a couple of articles for Trinity, but people do change. I think that Robbins would most likely endorse the judgment of OTC made by people on this board.

I don't wish this to be a Robbins/Van-Til bash, but let's give credit where credit is due. We can read Calvin, Knox, Owen and Luther where they are harsh as can be, and be just fine with it, but when somebody contemporary is the same, everyone's a critic.

P.S. I am NOT lumping Robbins in with Calvin, Knox etc. etc. and I also think that OTC has gone off the deep end.

That's my


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## turmeric (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Craig_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> ...



That's where the "higher life"gets you! If you would all come outot Oregon you'd find out what the higher life - and beer- are *really* about!

[Edited on 9-1-2005 by turmeric]


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## PuritanCovenanter (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Jeff_Bartel_
> I understand that there are many on this board who do not care for Robbins, and in fact are very Van-Tillian (anti-Robbins), but let's be fair. Lumping Robbins and OTC together is hasty In my humble opinion.
> 
> OTC is:
> ...



Jeff,
I enjoyed reading John Robbins Trinity Review years ago.... I also like reading Herman Hoeksema. I pick a little from everybody.


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Jeff_Bartel_
> I understand that there are many on this board who do not care for Robbins, and in fact are very Van-Tillian (anti-Robbins), but let's be fair. Lumping Robbins and OTC together is hasty In my humble opinion.
> 
> OTC is:
> ...



I wasn't lumping Robbins in with OTC. If anything, I was highlighting the differences between Robbins and Carpenter. I won't engage in character-assassinations as he...well...never mind.


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## RamistThomist (Aug 31, 2005)

I was showing that they had even got that old heresy hunter himself with the heresy hatchet. I was not suggesting they were in cahoots. Quite the opposite.


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## Me Died Blue (Aug 31, 2005)




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## BobVigneault (Sep 1, 2005)

Jacob, I sense I touched a tender spot when I dissed your beloved Miller. You have stuck to your guns even when I tried to shame you with hyperbole. Good for you, I would expect nothing less from someone so single-minded, sensible and resolute.

I respect any company that brews beer, even Miller and Bud. But in this brave new world of micro-brews and crafters that are out to capture the TRUE european traditions and flavors - in a world where real trappist ales can be bought in the tiniest burgs of America - where some brewers are innovating in ways that are creating flavors unsurpassed in all of earths history - then drinking Miller is like going into a warehouse filled with all the great puritan writings and walking out with a six-pack of Max Lucado.

We stand in the midst of a new and glorious golden age of malt and hops and God is sending forth new wine.... which is really..... beer. Drink deep of this blessing, oh rapture, oh joy, oh rats, I'm out of beer.


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## Arch2k (Sep 1, 2005)

Jacob and Chris,

I am not trying to accuse, just to clarify.


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## Pilgrim (Sep 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by maxdetail_
> Jacob, I sense I touched a tender spot when I dissed your beloved Miller. You have stuck to your guns even when I tried to shame you with hyperbole. Good for you, I would expect nothing less from someone so single-minded, sensible and resolute.
> 
> I respect any company that brews beer, even Miller and Bud. But in this brave new world of micro-brews and crafters that are out to capture the TRUE european traditions and flavors - in a world where real trappist ales can be bought in the tiniest burgs of America - where some brewers are innovating in ways that are creating flavors unsurpassed in all of earths history - then drinking Miller is like going into a warehouse filled with all the great puritan writings and walking out with a six-pack of Max Lucado.
> ...


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## Pilgrim (Sep 26, 2005)

> So if my options are:
> 
> 1)Drinking Miller High Life
> 
> ...





Better to be.......A High Life Man


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## turmeric (Sep 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by maxdetail_
> Jacob, I sense I touched a tender spot when I dissed your beloved Miller. You have stuck to your guns even when I tried to shame you with hyperbole. Good for you, I would expect nothing less from someone so single-minded, sensible and resolute.
> 
> I respect any company that brews beer, even Miller and Bud. But in this brave new world of micro-brews and crafters that are out to capture the TRUE european traditions and flavors - in a world where real trappist ales can be bought in the tiniest burgs of America - where some brewers are innovating in ways that are creating flavors unsurpassed in all of earths history - then drinking Miller is like going into a warehouse filled with all the great puritan writings and walking out with a six-pack of Max Lucado.
> ...



When it comes to beer - I'm a Postmillenialist!


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## CalsFarmer (Sep 27, 2005)

Marc Carpenter sent me a personal email accusing me of being a heretic. I reported him to his internet provider for harassment. 

From what I know Mr. Robbins does not hold Marc Carpenter in good esteem. 

These people are as bad as the 'anti' church of Christ'ers. They spew the same thing, the same way. They are the only ones going to heaven yeah yeah what-ev-er......everyone else is going to hell.....Its all about fear and control over their little group of crazies. 

Thats my


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## Puritanhead (Sep 27, 2005)

I know I have a big mouth, but this is one worn-out thread that has really really strayed from the original subject matter. We should have it closed.


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