# Kiss the girl: Prior Marriage



## Christopher88 (Apr 25, 2012)

Christians,
In a courtship what is the Christian perspective on kissing prior to marriage? 


*Background story. *

I am in a serious relationship with a wonderful Christian lady, I have not kissed her and our physical contact is limited to holding hands and hugs. Recently I read a book called Holding Hands, Holding Hearts by Richard Philips. (Great book, conservative, not Mark Driscoll language) He affirms about the same position I do. 

That forms of sexual touch/intimacy are meant for marriage. My take on this is to refrain kissing until the altar. I see kissing (in today's culture) as sexual intimacy. To kiss has no purpose but to share passion, correct? Yes its a form of love, but love with passion. 

I have every intent on marrying this wonderful lady, but if God does not bless that road why would I want to take a passionate form of love away from her?
*
End of background story *

What are your thoughts? 

I have asked people in person and get the answer "kiss the girl" .


----------



## greenbaggins (Apr 25, 2012)

I do not believe it is a sin per se to kiss before marriage. The Bible certainly does not say so. Jacob kisses Rachel before marriage (Genesis 29:11). Now, one does have to be careful there, in that biblical examples are not always normative (especially when there is a recorded sin!). However, in this case, there does not seem to be any reproach sent Jacob's way for so doing. There is a slippery slope, of course, and one must set very clear boundaries for that sort of thing. My guess is that people's consciences will be in different places on this. If you believe that this would be sin, or would lead to sin, then it would be sin for you to do so. For others, that might not be the case.


----------



## raekwon (Apr 25, 2012)

I'm w/ Lane. It's a matter of individual conscience. (But be sure she knows your conviction, lest she think you're just being standoffish! )


----------



## Romans922 (Apr 25, 2012)

Sonny said:


> Christians,
> In a courtship what is the Christian perspective on kissing prior to marriage?
> 
> 
> ...



It sounds like you already have an answer. 

Also, I'd refrain from calling it an altar unless you plant to sacrifice something on it.  Such language probably comes from Roman Catholics who get married where they have the sacrifice of the mass.


----------



## rookie (Apr 25, 2012)

I would go more along the lines of what Paul was saying in the book of Corinthians. It is better to not touch a woman before marrying her. For those of us that are married, I can say that for myself, a kiss usually leads to more. Or at least the temptation of more. I would say you are on a wise council. Especially if she is of the same accord.

Don't put yourself in a place of temptation, as you may not be able to fight it.....


----------



## Tim (Apr 25, 2012)

I think you are right, Chris. Save the kiss and all that goes along with it until marriage. But make sure the courtship "gets to the point" of whether you should marry. Don't dilly dally. If you decide you will marry, keep the engagement short.

Most people don't even consider this in the way that you have, so don't put too much stock in what they say (I am not referring to the above posts).


----------



## Romans922 (Apr 25, 2012)

I was going to ask, "What does her dad with the gun say?" or Your dad since you have yet to leave your father and mother, and she has not either.


----------



## Constantlyreforming (Apr 25, 2012)

my half cent:

what of "greet one another with a holy kiss"? surely this holy kiss was note meant to be sexual, but rather full of love and concern for the believer
can one greet their bride to be with a kiss that is meant to be this same holy kiss....something that is full of consideration for the person, yet not something that is sexual in nature?

pretty much anything these days can be sexual in nature...it's all what you make of it.


----------



## raekwon (Apr 25, 2012)

You're lookin' awfully kissy-faced in that avatar, Ethan.


----------



## Constantlyreforming (Apr 25, 2012)

my point exactly. and I think I am capable of delivering a holy kiss. I think we all are if scripture commands it.


----------



## Rufus (Apr 25, 2012)

Constantlyreforming said:


> my half cent:
> 
> what of "greet one another with a holy kiss"? surely this holy kiss was note meant to be sexual, but rather full of love and concern for the believer
> can one greet their bride to be with a kiss that is meant to be this same holy kiss....something that is full of consideration for the person, yet not something that is sexual in nature?
> ...



Men kissing men, women kissing women. Hopefully on the cheek for that matter, but there was a different cultural atmosphere in the 1st century.


----------



## Constantlyreforming (Apr 25, 2012)

Rufus said:


> Constantlyreforming said:
> 
> 
> > my half cent:
> ...




so what of the new cultural atmosphere now in the 21st century? Do we take that into consideration with kissing? Do we state "well, since they do it now, we all should"?


----------



## O'GodHowGreatThouArt (Apr 25, 2012)

Is it sin? Not necessarily. However, given the rampant sexual sin that has completely obliterated the social status of our American culture, I would strongly exhort you to refrain from doing so until such a time as you are married.

Israel was forbidden to obtain any sort of tattoos, not because it was necessarily sinful, but because they were called to be completely separate from the pagan Egyptian culture that they came out of. We should stride to be completely separate from our culture. Most would not bat an eye of having relations before exchanging wedding rings (much less having kids).

Considering all the mud we are exposed to, taking it up to kissing before marriage would open doors to sin that are best left to be padlocked. Plus it's your duty to protect her from situations where lines could be crossed. 

In short, let me give one piece of advice. if you're questioning if it should be done, don't do it. At the very least, you will protect your integrity as well as your own.


----------



## AThornquist (Apr 25, 2012)

Courtship is _not_ engagement, right? So you are not yet committed to one another for marriage. Why risk becoming more physically intimate if you two are not bound for marriage and may break up? Are you willing to let her bring memories of such intimacy into a different relationship if your courtship doesn't work out? Are you willing to risk your and her purity by becoming more physically intimate at this early stage of your relationship? Ask yourself, HONESTLY, _why_ do I want to kiss her? Is it because it would be pleasing to the flesh?

My view is that, though it may not automatically be a sin to smooch your unmarried lady friend, it isn't necessarily wise either. If you two marry, you will not regret abstaining from kissing at this point in time; however, on that day you may sincerely regret having gone one kiss too far before its proper time. Be careful how you may justify your actions. After all, while there no command, "Don't kiss the girl you're courting," there is also no command, "Don't kiss the girl you work with." Tread carefully, brother. May our great God and Savior protect and lead you in this matter.


----------



## Rufus (Apr 25, 2012)

Constantlyreforming said:


> Rufus said:
> 
> 
> > Constantlyreforming said:
> ...



Yes we do take it into consideration. I was trying to say that the holy kiss on the lips was in a time when that didn't necessarily mean anything sexual.


----------



## PointyHaired Calvinist (Apr 25, 2012)

My wife and I refrained until we married. Kissing can certainly make it harder to keep from going further.

I think a good rule of thumb when wondering what is "acceptable" when you are courting is that, if you don't marry, this is another man's future wife. Don't go further physically with her than you would want another man to do once you _are_ married.

Keep it up, brother, and you will be blessed.


----------



## moral necessity (Apr 25, 2012)

I followed a similar approach with my wife before I was married, and after I became a Christian. My logic ran as follows back then:

1. All women in the world either fit into the category of "not my wife" or "my wife".

2. If this action I am about to do is allowable for someone who is in the "not my wife" category now, then it is allowable for someone who is in the "not my wife" category later when I'm married.

3. Am I allowed to do this action with other women after I am married?

4. And, this action also becomes equally allowable for other men to do with women in the "not my wife" category for them...which includes my own wife someday.


Basically, my rule was: I have the right to treat every woman the way I would want every other man to treat my wife, and nothing more. This basically cut to the chase in knowing where to draw the line in my mind with grey areas back then.

My verses included, "It is good for a man not to touch a woman, nevertheless, to avoid fornication, let each man have his own wife" - I Cor. 7:1,2; and "I urge you all to treat older men as fathers, older women as mothers, younger women as sisters,...in all purity" - I Tim. 5 (?).

Not saying that all should agree with my approach; and I haven't thought it through again in the past 15 years, so I'm not sure how I stand with it now either. But, that was my thinking back then. I must say, it turned off most women in college who knew about it, and it certainly made me the strange one in the Intervarsity group. I do think it was honorable, and most ended up having a lot of respect for it.

Blessings!


----------



## Constantlyreforming (Apr 26, 2012)

Great thoughts, Charles. Thanks!


----------



## Christopher88 (Apr 26, 2012)

Men, thanks for your input. 

I was bold and expressed this concern to my lady friend on the phone last night. Not wishing to go into detail respect was mutual.


----------



## hermanchauw (Apr 26, 2012)

I have not kissed my girlfriend. I don't intend to. Neither have i held hands or hug her. Maybe after engagement i would hold hands, but not more than that. This is to safeguard both of us, to keep us from temptation. I would keep the physical intimacy to after marriage. I don't see the need to be physically intimate before marriage. After marriage we can have all the physical intimacy we like and it will be God honouring. If it is worth waiting, it is worth waiting.

Jeremiah 17:9


> The heart is deceitful above all things, and desperately wicked: who can know it?



My worldly friends (including Catholics who do not have a credible profession of faith) urged me to have sex with her before starting a relationship. "Test the goods before you buy". The more they tell me to do it, the more i shun their advice. They think i am crazy. I know it is not God honouring to do that. If i honour God, i must honour her and her family and her church by keeping ourselves pure. At the same time also i honour my God, my family, my church. Otherwise it is taking the name of the Lord our God in vain.

Ephesians 5:25-27


> Husbands, love your wives, even as Christ also loved the church, and gave himself for it; That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word, That he might present it to himself a glorious church, not having spot, or wrinkle, or any such thing; but that it should be holy and without blemish.



Before marriage our duty as the man we must keep our wife-to-be from sinning by avoiding temptations. Even if she is tempted we must take the lead to say no.

As i am writing this, i continually pray asking God to keep us pure in our relationship because i know i am weak and rely only upon His strength.


----------



## Jackie Kaulitz (Apr 26, 2012)

As a young single Christian woman, I applaud you, Chris! Thank you for being one of the rare men who are looking out for not only your purity but the purity of your girl. 

I also believe in saving my first kiss for my future husband (if God gives me one). My ex-courter/bf wanted to kiss me and I explained my view and would not allow him to kiss me. Well, this is when his true colors came out. He couldn't get over this "rejection" and stopped hiding his true self and immediately became super controlling, suicidal, and made out with another woman within one week of us splitting. Finally, he admitted he had been through a number of painful relationships and had been putting on a front with me. If a man won't wait, I must ask myself "why" and what does this say about his character and motivations? With my ex, he was more interested in getting what he wanted than remaining pure, helping me to stay pure, and glorifying God. I will wait and save my first kiss for my one and only.

I believe a man who waits and wants to wait is truly respectable. I hope to marry someone like this someday. And if I have a son or daughter, I hope he/she will also hold to this belief.


----------



## John Bunyan (Apr 26, 2012)

The not hugging part seems excessive to me - everyone seems to hug everyone, although some kinds of hugs are certainly not seem as appropriate by people in general. It must be a northern thing (and by northern I mean the northern hemisphere), or maybe differences in heritage (mainly anglo-saxon/eastern vs iberian/indinegous).

The rest seems to make sense, although I've never given that topic enough attention - in both personal and academic levels.

One question: what was considered appropriate to married-to-be or maybe married-to-be couples to do before people started going wild - say, before the 40's, or in Victorian England, for example.


----------



## SolaScriptura (Apr 26, 2012)

Don't just not kiss. You would be wise to not even hold hands - physical contact is itself a POWERFUL communicator of affection and desire. No hugs either. For the same reason.


----------



## Philip (Apr 26, 2012)

John Bunyan said:


> The not hugging part seems excessive to me - everyone seems to hug everyone



Same here. Maybe it's a southern thing, but hugging is a sign of friendship in my circles.


----------



## Stargazer65 (Apr 27, 2012)

Our personal family rules are that we would save kissing on the lips for marriage. Otherwise it takes away from the statement, "You may now kiss the bride". Hand holding for engagement. Hugs are trickier, they can be passionate or friendly, we would observe about a 2 ssecond rule to keep them friendly during a courtship through engagement.


----------



## cajunhillbilly53 (Apr 27, 2012)

I kiss my girlfriend on the cheek. She is not comfortable with a lip kiss, so I respect her wishes.


----------

