# Eye condition. Baptists beware!



## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Its been a while since I've been to the eye doctor, and I'd noticed that my eyes have gotten worse since the last visit, so I went in for a visit yesterday after work. He went through all the tests (including the one where they blow air into your eyes - I hate that test) and mentioned that my eyes have definitely gotten worse since my last visit. He was quiet for a while, concerned, I asked him how much worse they are.

He told me to put on my glasses and told me to 'read the bottom line' - I was tempted to ask, "What bottom line", but didn't. He then put some other lenses in front of the glasses and I was able to see the line pretty clearly. It was obvious my eyes had gotten a good bit worse. 

I don't think I was properly prepared to know about my condition, but he told me anyway. He said I had a condition called "Presbyopia". *Presbyterian*opia? I didn't even have to ask him where I got that disease. I don't know of any Presbyterians at work - there was only one place where I'd come into contact with Presbyterians - it had to be on the Puritanboard. Sure, there were times when a point was made about infant baptism or the like and I'd scream "WHAT???" with my eyes practically bulging out of their sockets, but I never would have guessed it'd be a permanent condition, one that couldn't be corrected, one that I'd have to live with the rest of my life.

I appreciate all you Baptists who stay on the board day after day trying to show the Presbyterians the right way, but please be aware (and beware) that the longer you stay in contact with them, the greater the chance you'll also get Presbyopia. And don't think you're too old to catch it, either. I'm at mid-life now and I caught it.

You've been warned.


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

I got it at 40 Bob and I was not a Presbyterian nor did I know any Presbyterian's at the time. It was long before the PB started sucking my sight away.

It is weird isn't? If one has presbyopia then one NEEDS a lot of light in order to see. It may be a condition caused by going so long stumbling in the dark. Presbyopia may not be a loss of sight but an appreciation of and a hindering by the encroaching darkness around us.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> I got it at 40 Bob and I was not a Presbyterian nor did I know any Presbyterian's at the time. It was long before the PB started sucking my sight away.


You didn't even know any Presbyterians at the time? Interesting. Obviously close contact isn't the only way to catch it then.


BobVigneault said:


> It is weird isn't? If one has presbyopia then one NEEDS a lot of light in order to see. It may be a condition caused by going so long stumbling in the dark. Presbyopia may not be a loss of sight but an appreciation of and a hindering by the encroaching darkness around us.


I appreciate your insights and thanks for sharing your experience, Bawb. Its all so new to me - kind of a shock. I may have questions for you about the condition after its all sunk in, if you don't mind.


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## reformedman (Sep 7, 2007)

I'm seriously sorry to hear about your condition but think about the symptoms though. Although you got that from some careless Presbyterian here on the board, the condition does have it's benefits. Some of the symptoms have to do with 
a blessed conversation,
a slightly different perspective of worship toward God,
a fortified strength by the added friendships

So although those Presbyterians do have their negatives, there are some good side-effects.


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

Thanks for the warning dear brother. From here on out I'm practising "safe" fellowship.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

reformedman said:


> I'm seriously sorry to hear about your condition but think about the symptoms though. Although you got that from some careless Presbyterian here on the board, the condition does have it's benefits. Some of the symptoms have to do with
> a blessed conversation,
> a slightly different perspective of worship toward God,
> a fortified strength by the added friendships
> ...


Yes, thanks for the reminder. Its best not to dwell on the negatives. And I hope nobody thinks I'm trying to blame anybody in particular - something like this, you really can't point your finger at any one person and say that they're to blame.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Thanks for the warning dear brother. From here on out I'm practising "safe" fellowship.


I'm glad you're heeding my warning. Better safe than sorry.


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## JohnV (Sep 7, 2007)

When the eye doctor would ask me in former days to say the last line he would have to go right up to it to see if I was right. I gave him the line that's usually in the bottom right hand corner, telling who put the chart out. I could actually do that at one time. 

Not now anymore. The doctor gives me hints by saying different words that begin with the letter that comes next. And that's the second line! 

But now, thanks to Bob, I know what it is. What did the doctor prescibe, Bob? Confessional glasses?


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

JohnV said:


> But now, thanks to Bob, I know what it is. What did the doctor prescibe, Bob? Confessional glasses?


Maybe. He wrote it down in his notes, but I the print was too small for me to read.


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## JohnV (Sep 7, 2007)

Then don't believe him. Get a second opinion. Sounds like he's Episcopalian.


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

There is just as much evidence represented here that perhaps presbyopia has to do with being named "Bob". It's something to ponder Robert.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> There is just as much evidence represented here that perhaps presbyopia has to do with being named "Bob". It's something to ponder Robert.


Hindsight's 20-20, but I wish I had known of this theory sooner - could've asked the doctor when I met with him. Oh well.


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

Now I'm really scared. My eyes have been geting a little fuzzy since I had lunch with Southern Presbyterian(the former Wythe County Calvinist) the other day. I also did lunch with the pastor of an ARP church recently. It may be too late for me.


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## JohnV (Sep 7, 2007)

Is your middle name Bob, James? You know, it plainly myoptic that we didn't see that connection before.


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## Reformed Baptist (Sep 7, 2007)

Is the Puritan Board a presbyterian board? I am confused.


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## turmeric (Sep 7, 2007)

Doctor, my eyes
Tell me what is wrong,
Was I unwise
To sttay on Puritanboard too long?

I think Jackson Brown had a Baptist background


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Now I'm really scared. My eyes have been geting a little fuzzy since I had lunch with Southern Presbyterian(the former Wythe County Calvinist) the other day. I also did lunch with the pastor of an ARP church recently. It may be too late for me.


This is what I'd feared would happen if I started the thread - mass hysteria and a panic situation. Sorry.

You know, though, if it makes you feel any better, yesterday the doctor didn't say one word that even hinted at the idea that you have more chance of catching presbyopia if you come in direct contact, vs online exposure.


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## turmeric (Sep 7, 2007)

You know, it just hadn't occurred to us Presbyterians the effect that too much light can have on the eyes of people who have been in a situation of limited light most of their lives. So Baptists, please be careful! Don't try to get the whole infant baptism thing in view all at once. One step at a time, please, for your own safety!


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

turmeric said:


> You know, it just hadn't occurred to us Presbyterians the effect that too much light can have on the eyes of people who have been in a situation of limited light most of their lives. So Baptists, please be careful! Don't try to get the whole infant baptism thing in view all at once. One step at a time, please, for your own safety!




Would it be wise to use a welding shield when looking at it?


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

Reformed Baptist said:


> Is the Puritan Board a presbyterian board? I am confused.



There are two schools of thought on that - the presbyterian view and the minority view.


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## turmeric (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> turmeric said:
> 
> 
> > You know, it just hadn't occurred to us Presbyterians the effect that too much light can have on the eyes of people who have been in a situation of limited light most of their lives. So Baptists, please be careful! Don't try to get the whole infant baptism thing in view all at once. One step at a time, please, for your own safety!
> ...



Your doctor would probably know best.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

turmeric said:


> You know, it just hadn't occurred to us Presbyterians the effect that too much light can have on the eyes of people who have been in a situation of limited light most of their lives. So Baptists, please be careful! Don't try to get the whole infant baptism thing in view all at once. One step at a time, please, for your own safety!


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Would it be wise to use a welding shield when looking at it?


Figures! I had to go the cheap route and just order whatever glasses were covered by my insurance. I should have paid a few extra bucks and got the tinted!


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Now I'm really scared. My eyes have been geting a little fuzzy since I had lunch with Southern Presbyterian(the former Wythe County Calvinist) the other day. I also did lunch with the pastor of an ARP church recently. It may be too late for me.



 You men are too much. 

But you know, I used to have trouble seeing things when I was a Baptist too. But things are much clearer here in the light.


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

Southern Presbyterian said:


> Blueridge Baptist said:
> 
> 
> > Now I'm really scared. My eyes have been geting a little fuzzy since I had lunch with Southern Presbyterian(the former Wythe County Calvinist) the other day. I also did lunch with the pastor of an ARP church recently. It may be too late for me.
> ...




Did you get laser surgery?


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Southern Presbyterian said:


> But you know, I used to have trouble seeing things when I was a Baptist too. But things are much clearer here in the light.


Thank-you for the 'glimmer' of hope.


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Southern Presbyterian said:
> 
> 
> > Blueridge Baptist said:
> ...




Nope. I still have to wear my glasses to read (or when fellowshipping with Baptists - but I think that is for your potection ). Didn't you notice that I had them on at lunch?


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

Here we see young Bob Howes searching for long hours trying to find the scriptural references for infant baptism.


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

Southern Presbyterian said:


> Blueridge Baptist said:
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> 
> > Southern Presbyterian said:
> ...



I didn't notice brother. I'm a baptist. I can't see.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> Here we see young Bob Howes searching for long hours trying to find the scriptural references for infant baptism.



 Hilarious! The man is hilarious!


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> Here we see young Bob Howes searching for long hours trying to find the scriptural references for infant baptism.


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> I'm a baptist. I can't see.



Well, they do say that "admitting the problem is the first step toward the cure."  It worked for me.


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## Reformed Baptist (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> Reformed Baptist said:
> 
> 
> > Is the Puritan Board a presbyterian board? I am confused.
> ...



What is this supposed to mean?


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

Southern Presbyterian said:


> Blueridge Baptist said:
> 
> 
> > I'm a baptist. I can't see.
> ...



Is paedobaptism a 12 step program?


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

Reformed Baptist said:


> BobVigneault said:
> 
> 
> > Reformed Baptist said:
> ...



Nothing! I'm just lobbing tomatoes and then running, hiding and waiting to see what happens.


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## Reformed Baptist (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> Reformed Baptist said:
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> 
> > BobVigneault said:
> ...



lol. I am confused again.


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Southern Presbyterian said:
> 
> 
> > Blueridge Baptist said:
> ...



Don't know about steps, but it took me a little over 3 years to get there once I finally started seriously wrestling with the issue. So take heart and be encouraged, God is not finished with any of us yet.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Reformed Baptist said:


> BobVigneault said:
> 
> 
> > Reformed Baptist said:
> ...


If you read the posts, its pretty clear. By any chance do you wear (or are you supposed to be wearing) glasses? 

Presbyopially yours,


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## Calvibaptist (Sep 7, 2007)

But my vision is 20-10. Should I start looking for the closest Presbyterian church to become a member? Or is it ok to remain a Baptist?


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## Reformed Baptist (Sep 7, 2007)

blhowes said:


> Reformed Baptist said:
> 
> 
> > BobVigneault said:
> ...



On my natural eyes I do. lol There are many presbyterians who have held with great conviction and love to Christ the doctrine of infant baptism. Many of those men who have gone to be with the Lord are personal heroes and the works on their lives and theology occupies my shelves and reading. I expect to be give great thanks to God for those men, and expect to see them honored by our God. 

Without shame I disagree with the practice of infant baptism and know what I believe and why. What I never want to do, God help me if I do, is give the impression to my pedo brothers and sisters that somehow they are second-class citizens in the kingdom of God, and be possessed of a party-spirit (Baptist) than of God's Spirit in the communion I share with my presbyterian brethren. 

I do not want in my zeal for truth to make my brother feel less. If I consider him to be less enlightened than me, and so weaker in the faith, then I ought to betow upon him more abundant honor so that there will be no schism in the body. 

I am not by saying these things accusing any PB member of such actions or intentions. Granted, I did get the feeling of it, but that is in me and not necessarily in my presbyterian brethren. 

May the Lord be merciful and gracious this day to all His elect. 

RB


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

Geoff, the question is not 'Who is right?' but will we all go blind trying to figure it out. I will go further, we will all be in glory when the baptism debate is finally ended, our vision will be perfect.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Reformed Baptist said:


> On my natural eyes I do. lol There are many presbyterians who have held with great conviction and love to Christ the doctrine of infant baptism. Many of those men who have gone to be with the Lord are personal heroes and the works on their lives and theology occupies my shelves and reading. I expect to be give great thanks to God for those men, and expect to see them honored by our God.


My personal library is probably smaller than most, but I'd definitely have to say those books I have that I treasure most (other than some by Spurgeon) were written by Presbyterians. 


Reformed Baptist said:


> Without shame I disagree with the practice of infant baptism and know what I believe and why. What I never want to do, God help me if I do, is give the impression to my pedo brothers and sisters that somehow they are second-class citizens in the kingdom of God, and be possessed of a party-spirit (Baptist) than of God's Spirit in the communion I share with my presbyterian brethren.


I hope I didn't give the impression that I considered them second-class citizens (3rd or 4th maybe, but... (jk)). For me, though it'd be cool to figure out where I stand on the issue, the mode and/or timing of baptism isn't what's most important to me. However and whenever you were baptized, how are you living right now for our Lord? Do you pray, read your scriptures, seek the Lord, have family devotions, etc. In many/most of these areas I'm a second-class citizen compared to many of my Presbyterian brethren.


Reformed Baptist said:


> I do not want in my zeal for truth to make my brother feel less. If I consider him to be less enlightened than me, and so weaker in the faith, then I ought to betow upon him more abundant honor so that there will be no schism in the body.
> 
> I am not by saying these things accusing any PB member of such actions or intentions. Granted, I did get the feeling of it, but that is in me and not necessarily in my presbyterian brethren.


I think its common knowledge that quite often I'm not to be taken seriously. I kid around a lot, I don't think most take me seriously when I'm in one of those moods. I think if the doctor had told me I had baptistopia, I'd have still started this thread, perhaps from a different angle.



Reformed Baptist said:


> May the Lord be merciful and gracious this day to all His elect.


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## Calvibaptist (Sep 7, 2007)

blhowes said:


> I think its common knowledge that quite often I'm not to be taken seriously. I kid around a lot, I don't think most take me seriously when I'm in one of those moods. I think if the doctor had told me I had baptistopia, I'd have still started this thread, perhaps from a different angle.



I think it is actually called Bapdysteria.


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## blhowes (Sep 7, 2007)

Calvibaptist said:


> I think it is actually called Bapdysteria.


Oops, my ignorance is showing. Thanks for the correction.


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## Reformed Baptist (Sep 7, 2007)

> I think if the doctor had told me I had baptistopia, I'd have still started this thread, perhaps from a different angle.



It would have started with announcements and prayer requests. 

Thanks for your gracious spirit brother.


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## Blueridge Believer (Sep 7, 2007)

RABBI OUTING A 'CLOSET' PRESBYTERIAN.


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## Calvibaptist (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> RABBI OUTING A 'CLOSET' PRESBYTERIAN.



Here's where being a Presbyterian is a benefit. It he were a Baptist, the rabbi would have to push him in the pool or something.


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

Good one James. He's pretty fly... for a rabbi!


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

Calvibaptist said:


> ...is it ok to remain a Baptist?



I don't know if its "OK" , but it certainly is permissable. 

In all seriousness though, folks (be they Baptist, Presbyterian, or whatever) who argue for and stand upon the doctrines of grace the way people on this board do will be held in the highest regard by me.


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## PuritanCovenanter (Sep 7, 2007)

Because of the Presbyterian's I see more clearly the implications of right Covenant Theology. My eyesight hasn't been clearer in years. I went from being semi Presbyterian to full blown Covenantal, Confessional, and to a Pluralistic congregational Reformed Baptist. I can see clearly now the rain is gone and the Sun of Righteousness has lighted my way.


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## MrMerlin777 (Sep 7, 2007)

Blueridge Baptist said:


> Now I'm really scared. My eyes have been geting a little fuzzy since I had lunch with Southern Presbyterian(the former Wythe County Calvinist) the other day. I also did lunch with the pastor of an ARP church recently. It may be too late for me.




Don't forget your phone conversations with me Brother James. Face it, you're DOOMED!!


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## JohnV (Sep 7, 2007)

An eye doctor visit report turns into a baptism debate. Yup, it's the Puritan Board alright. For a while I was scared because I haven't been finding the regular stuff here. Now I feel at home again.


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## BobVigneault (Sep 7, 2007)

I was thinking of that John. We could come up with a rating system, the Baptismal Meltdown Potential (BMP). Basically it would be a number on a scale of 1 to 100 that represented a threads potential to turn into a baptism debate. For example, the original post might be "How many magi went to the childhood home of Jesus?" This would have a BMP of 6. On the other hand because this thread began with a play on the word 'presbyterian' it had a BMP of 78. It looked innocuous enough but the high BMP would have been sufficient warning to avoid it.


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 7, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> I was thinking of that John. We could come up with a rating system, the Baptismal Meltdown Potential (BMP). Basically it would be a number on a scale of 1 to 100 that represented a threads potential to turn into a baptism debate. For example, the original post might be "How many magi went to the childhood home of Jesus?" This would have a BMP of 6. On the other hand because this thread began with a play on the word 'presbyterian' it had a BMP of 78. It looked innocuous enough but the high BMP would have been sufficient warning to avoid it.





Who would asign the BMP numbers?


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## JohnV (Sep 7, 2007)

Sounds good, Bob. But I'm afraid that just the term " Baptismal Meltdown" could have a negative or pejorative connotation to it: it could be construed as a Presbyterian mandate.


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## PuritanCovenanter (Sep 7, 2007)

JohnV said:


> An eye doctor visit report turns into a baptism debate. Yup, it's the Puritan Board alright. For a while I was scared because I haven't been finding the regular stuff here. Now I feel at home again.



It hasn't even come close to a debate yet. Boy have we gotten sensitive through the years. But yeah we have taken a break. And I appreciate that very much. Just like you guys do.


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## turmeric (Sep 8, 2007)

When did this thread stop being funny? Bring back the humor even if it's aqueous!


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## blhowes (Sep 8, 2007)

turmeric said:


> When did this thread stop being funny? Bring back the humor even if it's aqueous!


Funny?? Humor?? So THAT'S what this thread's all about? Frankly, I'm a little shocked/disappointed/saddened !! 

"Ok, everybody, let's have a big laugh at the Baptist's expense! He's got an incurable disease... "

Well, I hope you all had a good laugh. I know I'm too old to get teary eyed...but...<sniff, sniff>...I'm ok, don't worry about me. You guys/gals go ahead and have your laugh...I'm sure someday I'll be able to take a chance again and bear my burdens to others, but...


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## BobVigneault (Sep 8, 2007)

Come on out and visit me Bob. We will laugh AND cry over the fact that we see as through a glass dimly.

Meg, humor -----> aqueous, now THAT's comedy. Well done sister.


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## blhowes (Sep 8, 2007)

BobVigneault said:


> Come on out and visit me Bob. We will laugh AND cry over the fact that we see as through a glass dimly.


Thank-you, brother Bob, for your compassion.


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## CalvinandHodges (Sep 8, 2007)

Greetings:

What is that saying as we become sanctified:

*The things of the world grow strangely dim...*

Presbyopia may be indicative of the sanctification process. 

Blessings,

-CH


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## Southern Presbyterian (Sep 8, 2007)

CalvinandHodges said:


> Greetings:
> 
> What is that saying as we become sanctified:
> 
> ...



I was thinking it... just hadn't said it yet.


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