# Merry Christmas!!!



## kevin.carroll (Dec 22, 2005)

I hope everyone has a blessed Christmas. And for all the ultra-RPW types on the Board, have a blessed-non-specific-wintertime-related-observance-that-has-nothing-whatsoever-to-do-with-the-Incarnation. 

Ok...I admit, I'm agitating. :bigsmile: But Merry Christmas, anyhow!


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## LadyFlynt (Dec 22, 2005)

:LOL:


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## crhoades (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> I hope everyone has a blessed Christmas. And for all the ultra-RPW types on the Board, have a blessed-non-specific-wintertime-related-observance-that-has-nothing-whatsoever-to-do-with-the-Incarnation.
> 
> Ok...I admit, I'm agitating. :bigsmile: But Merry Christmas, anyhow!



Or you could always say, "Happy December 25th".


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 22, 2005)

Happy Festivus for the rest of us! (December 23)


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## blhowes (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> I hope everyone has a blessed Christmas. And for all the ultra-RPW types on the Board, have a blessed-non-specific-wintertime-related-observance-that-has-nothing-whatsoever-to-do-with-the-Incarnation.


Same to you, brother. Have a blessed Christmas...or a blessed-non-specific-wintertime-related-observance-that-has-nothing-whatsoever-to-do-with-the-Incarnation...whichever you choose.

[Edited on 12-22-2005 by blhowes]


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot_
> Happy Festivus for the rest of us! (December 23)



Isn't that from Seinfeld?


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## Arch2k (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot_
> Happy Festivus for the rest of us! (December 23)





I'm just really looking forward to some time off work!


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by blhowes_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> ...



Thanks for not binding my conscience.


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## cupotea (Dec 22, 2005)

Wow, that link is really funny. I had no idea Festivus had so much history!


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## historyb (Dec 22, 2005)

MERRY CHIRSTMAS ALL!


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## kceaster (Dec 22, 2005)

Happy Grace Day! (January 1st). Yeah, I know I'm probably the only one who calls it that, but maybe if y'all jump on board, we can start something.

I celebrate the advent season just like all the other seasons of the church calendar. But we stopped doing traditional Christmas on December 25th. We are contemplative of the Lord's birth on that day, but we do not set it aside as a holy day, nor do we give gifts.

We didn't, however, stop giving gifts altogether. We just wait 'til Jan. 1st. We've named it grace day because we thank the Lord for His gifts of the previous year and look forward to the blessings of the new one.

In any case, I wish all of you and your families a blessed time in remembering the grace of our Lord and Savior, Jesus Christ.

KC


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## ReformedWretch (Dec 22, 2005)




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## tcalbrecht (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> I hope everyone has a blessed Christmas. And for all the ultra-RPW types on the Board, have a blessed-non-specific-wintertime-related-observance-that-has-nothing-whatsoever-to-do-with-the-Incarnation.
> 
> Ok...I admit, I'm agitating. :bigsmile: But Merry Christmas, anyhow!



"Good sabbath, Reb Kevin."


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## PuritanCovenanter (Dec 22, 2005)

I aint telling my sons about this festivus stuff. Did you read the last of the wiki thing. 


> The Feats of Strength are performed. Traditionally, Festivus is not over until the head of the household is wrestled to the floor and "pinned."



My 14 year old is now six foot one inch. I didn't make it above 5'4".


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## Peter (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> ...





Hopefully even the non-hyper-fanatical RPW types will turn their foot from doing their own pleasure on the only true Holy Day and save Hoho Santa present time for another day.

[Edited on 12-23-2005 by Peter]


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## PuritanCovenanter (Dec 22, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Peter_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> ...



I give gifts on Sabbaths. It is a good thing to be gracious on the Sabbath. Jesus expounded upon this. Be careful of the leaven of the pharisee. Just to be clear I don't do Ho Ho Santa Present time. I don't believe anyone should. But I am for giving gifts.


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## Peter (Dec 22, 2005)

I'd agree it'd be good to give food or clothing to the poor on the Sabbath. Indeed, God prefers mercy before sacrafice. But anything not of that nature, such as normal Xmas festivities, would not be consecrating all thoughts, words, and deeds to the Lord (besides so much time that is seperated for works of necessity).


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## historyb (Dec 22, 2005)

Wow I heard about people that didn't like Chrstmas, never met them til I came here. 

[Edited on 12-23-2005 by historyb]


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## Peter (Dec 22, 2005)

bah humbug


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 23, 2005)

Two of the prominent OPC ministers, G. I. Williamson (retired), and the late Professor John Murray, both opposed holy day observance, and [^defended; that's a big typo!] strict observance of the Lord's day. See Williamson's 1962 article on holy days here.



> _Originally posted by historyb_
> Wow I heard about people that didn't like Chrstmas, never met them til I came here.
> 
> [Edited on 12-23-2005 by historyb]



[Edited on 7-29-2006 by NaphtaliPress]


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## tcalbrecht (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by historyb_
> Wow I heard about people that didn't like Chrstmas, never met them til I came here.
> 
> [Edited on 12-23-2005 by historyb]



I think that says more about the state of our reformed denominations than it does about this group.


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## ChristopherPaul (Dec 23, 2005)

Merry Christmas!


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## bond-servant (Dec 23, 2005)

Merry Christmas!!!


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## LadyFlynt (Dec 23, 2005)

Merry Christmas, all...(now hopefully these kids will get over the stomach flu so we can go be with family!)


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> ...



Hey, I'm midwestern by birth...


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Peter_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> ...



My foot doesn't turn more than about 30 degrees.  And let us not forget this gives me an opportunity to gorge on Christmas cookies. :bigsmile:


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by historyb_
> ...



Touche. Interestingly, RTS dismisses classes for Good Friday.

One thing I would say is that we ought not throw out the liturgical baby with the Roman bathwater. The modern Protestant observances of Christmas, Good Friday, and Easter bear (for the most part) no resemblance to the Catholic ones. No one's conscience is being bound. Indeed, Christmas, Good Friday, and Easter are times when the vast majority of believers (and some non-believers) are thinking about the three most important events in redemptive history: the Incarnation, the Passion, and the Resurrection. To say that we can reflect on or preach on such subjects any time of the year EXCEPT Christmas, Good Friday, and Easter is nonsense, pure and simple. But I respect your position nonetheless.


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## fredtgreco (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> ...



There is a difference bewteen observing a holy day, and using an opportunity to preach on a doctrine such as the incarnation or resurrection.

Samuel Davies thought so.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 23, 2005)

Just to clarify, G.I. Williamson and John Murray, the founder of my denomination, the Presbyterian Reformed Church, do and did oppose the celebration of man-made holy days, but were not "opposed" to "strict observance of the Lord's Day" but rather by precept and example supported strict observance of the Lord's Day. 



> _Originally posted by historyb_
> Wow I heard about people that didn't like Chrstmas, never met them til I came here.
> 
> [Edited on 12-23-2005 by historyb]



The Puritans in general were strongly opposed to Christmass observance and this is the Puritan Board.

Westminster Directory of Publick Worship (which is binding in my church):



> AN APPENDIX,
> Touching Days and Places for Publick Worship.
> THERE is no day commanded in scripture to be kept holy under the gospel but the Lord's day, which is the Christian Sabbath.
> 
> Festival days, vulgarly called Holy-days, having no warrant in the word of God, are not to be continued.



[Edited on 12-23-2005 by VirginiaHuguenot]


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by fredtgreco_
> There is a difference bewteen observing a holy day, and using an opportunity to preach on a doctrine such as the incarnation or resurrection.
> 
> Samuel Davies thought so.



My point exactly. But aren't you preaching from Exodus on Sunday? :bigsmile:


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 23, 2005)

My pastor is preaching in the AM "Faith That Is Not Ashamed" RoM 10:11-13 and in the PM from Obadiah 7: "œGod´s Lex Talionis" continuing in his Romans and Obadiah series, no break; though if he thought it needful he would have no quams of doing so. He likes Samuel Davies xmas sermon.


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## Peter (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> My foot doesn't turn more than about 30 degrees.  And let us not forget this gives me an opportunity to gorge on Christmas cookies. :bigsmile:



Gluttony is a sin any day of the week Rev Kevin :bigsmile:

[Edited on 12-24-2005 by Peter]


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## Saiph (Dec 23, 2005)

*Gloria in Excelsis Deo !* 

That is my choice of holiday greeting.


The benefits:

1. The angels themselves said it, so it must be acceptable.

2. It will not offend the RPW advocates because it can be said anytime, and anywhere, regardless of the season.

3. You can say it in Target and Wal-Mart because no one knows latin anymore. They just smile and nod, or stare at you like a zombie.

4. It is non-denominational.

5. If someone does ask what it means, the opportunity is there to share your faith.

6. It sounds better because it is in latin.

[Edited on 12-23-2005 by Saiph]


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## historyb (Dec 23, 2005)

As an aside and if you want I will start a new thread. What is RPW??


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## tcalbrecht (Dec 23, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Saiph_
> *Gloria in Excelsis Deo !*
> 
> 
> 4. It is non-denominational.



I thought it was Romish.


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Saiph_
> *Gloria in Excelsis Deo !*
> 
> That is my choice of holiday greeting.
> ...



AND it is another example of biblical non-exclusive psalmnody! :bigsmile:


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Peter_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> ...



Interesting picture, btw. I know that all of us have argued this subject _ad nauseum_ but I think those opposed to Christmas observance today are using the Puritans anachronistically. No Protestant (to my knowledge) views Christmas as a "holy day." I challenge anyone to demonstrate *from the Bible* how the observance of a holiday (spelling is key) is sinful. Even Jesus observed Hannukah...


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by historyb_
> As an aside and if you want I will start a new thread. What is RPW??



It stands for the Regulative Principle of Worship, something we all subscribe to. The differences lie with those of us who see more regulation and those of us who see more principle.


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## Herald (Dec 24, 2005)

Merry Christmas to all!

[size=-1]This is a "Merry" Christmas zone. Happy Holidays or Seasons Greetings are not welcome. If you are British you may substitute "Happy" for "Merry" since the convey the same meaning. "Joyous" may also be used if so desired. Merry or Happy "Xmas" day shall not be used. A full list of Merry, Happy or Joyous Christmas greetings are available free of charge from most bible teaching fellowships. You may also pick up a free copy at any home of a person of goodwill. Any likeness, resemblance to persons living or dead are a coincidence. This caveat is used by expressed written permission of Major League Baseball. If this had been a real emergency, this message would have been followed by specific instructions. Warning: this message is hot and may burn. Do not employ this message while using heavy machinery. Avoid exposure to direct sunlight. These Christmas greetings are practiced by professionals, do not try them at home without adult supervision. All returns must be accompanied by a receipt within 30 days of the holiday. Returns are good for greetings to another holiday, no refunds will be provided.[/size]

[Edited on 12-24-2005 by BaptistInCrisis]


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## gwine (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by BaptistInCrisis_
> Merry Christmas to all!
> 
> [size=-1]This is a "Merry" Christmas zone. Happy Holidays or Seasons Greetings are not welcome. If you are British you may substitute "Happy" for "Merry" since the convey the same meaning. "Joyous" may also be used if so desired. Merry or Happy "Xmas" day shall not be used. A full list of Merry, Happy or Joyous Christmas greetings are available free of charge from most bible teaching fellowships. You may also pick up a free copy at any home of a person of goodwill. Any likeness, resemblance to persons living or dead are a coincidence. This caveat is used by expressed written permission of Major League Baseball. If this had been a real emergency, this message would have been followed by specific instructions. Warning: this message is hot and may burn. Do not employ this message while using heavy machinery. Avoid exposure to direct sunlight. These Christmas greetings are practiced by professionals, do not try them at home without adult supervision. All returns must be accompanied by a receipt within 30 days of the holiday. Returns are good for greetings to another holiday, no refunds will be provided.[/size]
> ...





Use only as directed. Not to be taken internally.


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## tcalbrecht (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> Even Jesus observed Hannukah...



While I have heard this offhand comment made many times, I have never seen anyone actually defend it from the Bible.


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## Greg (Dec 24, 2005)

Merry Christmas everyone!!


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## PuritanCovenanter (Dec 24, 2005)

Merry Christmas.


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## Laura (Dec 24, 2005)

Merry Christmas--I already know it's going to be a good one, 'cause I just unwrapped _Worldly Saints_ by Leland Ryken and a biography of Katharina von Bora!


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## matt01 (Dec 24, 2005)

Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays to any who want such things. I will be glad when it is over. I don't have anything against the holidays per se, but get tired of the nonsense that comes along. I went to Wally World to pick up a prescription this morning and thought the world was ending. There were so many people there, one might think that they were giving stuff away for free.


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## Shane (Dec 24, 2005)

From a not so active member on the board, Merry Christmas to all of you.


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## Scott Bushey (Dec 24, 2005)

Well, everyone just left; we had a large party. Why do I feel better now that everyone is gone?

For what it's worth, I did enjoy watching The How the Grinch Stole Christmas.........


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## matt01 (Dec 24, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Scott Bushey_
> I did enjoy watching The How the Grinch Stole Christmas.........



I have never been much of a Jim Carey fan, but that is a pretty good movie. I love the hairdos.


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## Saiph (Dec 25, 2005)

Holiday Food For Thought



> The Festivals of Christ and the Saints. Moreover, if in Christian Liberty the churches religiously celebrate the memory of the Lord's nativity, circumcision, passion, resurrection, and of his ascension into heaven, and the sending of the Holy Spirit upon his disciples, we approve of it highly.
> 
> --The 2nd Helvetic Confession (1566)


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## historyb (Dec 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by historyb_
> ...



Thanks, not sure if I ascribe to it yet. Although I may and not know it as I'm a newbie to all this.


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## just_grace (Dec 25, 2005)

*Bon Noel...*

Oui, je souhaite Ã  chacun un temps heureux de NoÃ«l et toute la bÃ©nÃ©diction de Dieu.


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## LawrenceU (Dec 25, 2005)

Nollaig chridheil agus Bliadhna mhath ur!

And to my brother-in-law who lurks:

Sretan Bozic!


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## Laura (Dec 25, 2005)

Oh yes, don't we have some Welshmen on the boards? Nadolig Llawen!


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## Herald (Dec 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by just_grace_
> Oui, je souhaite Ã  chacun un temps heureux de NoÃ«l et toute la bÃ©nÃ©diction de Dieu.



Pouvoir le Seigneur vous bÃ©nit richement. Pouvoir ce jour glorifie Christ dans toutes choses.


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## puritangirl (Dec 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Laura_
> Merry Christmas--I already know it's going to be a good one, 'cause I just unwrapped _Worldly Saints_ by Leland Ryken and a biography of Katharina von Bora!



What's this biography of Katherina Von Bora called? I would love to read it!


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## Laura (Dec 25, 2005)

Just _Katharina von Bora: A Reformation Life_, by the Markwalds.


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## Augusta (Dec 25, 2005)

Erie PA folks celebrated "Festivus."

http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,179705,00.html


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> ...



Well, how about this, then: the Feast of Dedication, recorded in John 10:1-39 IS Hannukah. While, granted, we do not know the extent to which Jesus participated, yet he does go up to Jerusalem during the observance and does use imagery from the feast to guide his discourses.

My remark wasn't offhand at all...


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 26, 2005)

*Voluntary Jewish Feasts*

David Lachman comments on this argument in his criticism of R. J. Gore´s use of it in his doctoral dissertation, in: Frank J. Smith, Ph.D. D.D. and David C. Lachman, Ph.D, "Reframing Presbyterian Worship: A Critical Survey of the Worship Views of John M. Frame and R. J. Gore," _The Confessional Presbyterian_ (2005) 138-139. Available at http://www.cpjournal.com


> _
> [align=center]The Voluntary Jewish Feasts[/align]_
> 
> Gore passes on to a discussion of Jesus´s observance of the Voluntary Jewish Feasts, proving to his satisfaction from the witness of a variety of modern commentators that when Jesus was in Jerusalem at the time of the Feast of the Dedication (John 10:22) it implies that he was there in order to participate in its observation. He interprets John 5:1 ("œAfter these things there was a feast of the Jews, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem") in similar fashion. But he does not bother to consider that the presence of Jesus in Jerusalem at such times might have been timed in order to enable him to speak to the much larger numbers of people then present there. Certainly there is nothing inherent in either passage which implies his participation in either feast. That it is quite possible to interpret these passages as merely alluding to the time of year Jesus was in Jerusalem does not come under Gore´s consideration. This is a serious flaw in that if he had bothered to look into Puritan commentaries on the passages in question he would have found that this is what they argued is the correct interpretation. It is particularly reprehensible that he does not even refer to George Gillespie´s discussion of the subject in his English Popish Ceremonies (EPC, 3.6.8-11, 264-270): admittedly this is not an easy work to read, but granted the subject matter of Gore´s dissertation it should not be too much to expect a familiarity with the whole of the work and an interaction with it when it impinges on the points he is trying to make. Generally, a responsible scholarly discussion of the matter would at least take into account Puritan exegesis of the passages in question. Lacking even the rudiments of this, Gore´s treatment of the matter is wholly without merit.32
> ...


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## tcalbrecht (Dec 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by tcalbrecht_
> ...



When someone says "Jesus observed Hannukah" it's obviously a statement that cannot stand alone. It is loaded with all sorts of modern baggage for language and tradition.

My point was that we know nothing about Jesus supposed "observance" of Hannukah other than what we find in John 10, which isn't much. It could amount to nothing more than a chronological indicator of the time when Jesus was found in the temple, which was His custom at many other times. Jesus did nothing more or less John 10 than what He did at other times while in the temple. How is that an "observance" of Hannukah?

To use this verse to "prove" that "Jesus observed Hannukah" is highly suspect. The way it was put was quote offhand.


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## Peter (Dec 26, 2005)

Paul went to Jerusalem for Pentecost and Passover too (Act 18, 20) does that mean he observed these Jewish beggerly elements; days, months, times and years (Gal 4:10) or that he was there to preach to the multitude that would be there.


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## Peter (Dec 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by Peter_
> ...



The picture,






I took from this website: http://mysite.verizon.net/vze27g73/holidays.html

and croped it to fit PB guidelines for avatars

My motive was to agitate too


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## Peter (Dec 26, 2005)

Merry Yule-Tide Popery 

http://freeinternetpress.com/modules.php?name=News&file=article&sid=5296


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## historyb (Dec 26, 2005)

Yikes, looks like he's ready to go get puritans. :bigsmile:


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## Peter (Dec 26, 2005)

thirsty for the blood of the martyrs


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## kevin.carroll (Dec 27, 2005)

> _Originally posted by NaphtaliPress_
> David Lachman comments on this argument in his criticism of R. J. Gore´s use of it in his doctoral dissertation, in: Frank J. Smith, Ph.D. D.D. and David C. Lachman, Ph.D, "Reframing Presbyterian Worship: A Critical Survey of the Worship Views of John M. Frame and R. J. Gore," _The Confessional Presbyterian_ (2005) 138-139. Available at http://www.cpjournal.com
> 
> 
> ...


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 27, 2005)

Pastor Carroll,
The context of Dr. Lachman's criticism is not any paper on worship but a doctoral dissertation criticising and attempting to overturn the _Puritan_ view. In _that_ context I think the strong criticism is certainly valid if pointed. I may be mistaken but I believe Dr. Lachman has at one time or another served as a reader for Ph.D dissertations. David is a careful scholar and doesn't brook sloppy work, particularly if someone is attempting to overturn a long established doctrine!


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## fredtgreco (Dec 27, 2005)

> _Originally posted by NaphtaliPress_
> Pastor Carroll,
> The context of Dr. Lachman's criticism is not any paper on worship but a doctoral dissertation criticising and attempting to overturn the _Puritan_ view. In _that_ context I think the strong criticism is certainly valid if pointed. I may be mistaken but I believe Dr. Lachman has at one time or another served as a reader for Ph.D dissertations. David is a careful scholar and doesn't brook sloppy work, particularly if someone is attempting to overturn a long established doctrine!



I agree with Chris, that is vital in this context.

But I would say that Gore's book deserves treatments and responses. Even though I disagree with it, it is leagues above Frame's piece of garbage _Worship in Spirit and Truth_. Gore at least is intellectually honest.


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 27, 2005)

I should add that I don't find any objection to your qualification as long as it is not "cover" for retaining or not addressing real worship abuses. See this thread.
http://www.puritanboard.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=15205#pid212685


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## Peter (Dec 27, 2005)

I read that article in CPJ. What I remember is that Gore was lauded for at least being open and honest about his rejection of the RPW, more than can be said about most neo-Presbyterians (viz. contemporary and liturgical worshippers) such as Frame.


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 27, 2005)

> _Originally posted by fredtgreco_
> I agree with Chris, that is vital in this context.
> 
> But I would say that Gore's book deserves treatments and responses. Even though I disagree with it, it is leagues above Frame's piece of garbage _Worship in Spirit and Truth_. Gore at least is intellectually honest.


I agree we should give credit where credit is due and Dean Gore at least does not try to say he holds to something he doesn't by creating moving definitions that have had set historical meanings. That said, it takes a lot to "move" David Lachman to "enter the field." I think it is fair to say, while he was do doubt doing his friend Frank Smith a personal favor, that the shockingly poor quality of scholarship paired with the seeming accolades and "cover" this was giving those opposed to the RPW, induced him to write.


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## tcalbrecht (Dec 27, 2005)

> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> When I said "observed" I chose my words poorly. We know Christ was in Jerusalem during Hannukah and that he used imagery from the feast in his discourses of John 10. *I do not see how that is any different from me taking opportunities to guide the reflections of the congregation at times when they are predisposed to thinking about certain things.*
> 
> The quote you posted is interesting. He seems to argue that if you don't interact with the Puritans, you aren't scholarly (or right). That's an interesting, if misguided, perspective.



One obvious distinction is that Jesus was not fashioning a worship observance to match the calendar put together by men. "Christmas services" and other activities are admittled oriented primarily toward the flock. Jesus does not appear to be doing anything out of the ordinary from His many other sojourns in the temple area.

I fail to see how this narrative supports the non-reformed view of seasons in the congregation, with "mediations" replacing sermons, "caroling", special choirs, and auditorium decorations so prominent in many reformed congregations this time of year.

I would like to ask ministers who make all sorts fo special arrangements around Dec. 25th or at "Eastertime", why they do not do these things every sabbath day of the year.



> _Originally posted by kevin.carroll_
> 
> that he used imagery from the feast in his discourses of John 10.



What specifically in John 10:22-39 did Jesus say that would indicate He had the Feast of Dedication in mind? You make it sound like He preached a Hannakuh sermon.


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