# Why ECOP instead of PCA, OPC or ARP, etc.?



## Pergamum (Jan 30, 2012)

A New Presbyterian Denomination Is Formed – Justin Taylor





> This past weekend, a new Presbyterian denomination was formed. From January 18-20 approximately 2,100 Presbyterians gathered at the Fellowship of Presbyterians Covenanting Conference. Over 500 Presbyterian Church (U.S.A.) congregations were represented (of the 10,600 congregations in that denomination). Most of those in the room covenanted to form a “new reformed body” and join the new denomination called The Evangelical Covenant Order of Presbyterians (ECO for short).




Why form a new denomination instead of just going into one of the already-existing more conservative Presbyterian denominations?


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## Zenas (Jan 30, 2012)

Don't know. The more liberal (relatively speaking) churches who want to leave typically would fit within the boundaries of the EPC.


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## fredtgreco (Jan 30, 2012)

It's called women elders and Arminianism.


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## Andres (Jan 30, 2012)

fredtgreco said:


> It's called women elders and Arminianism.



I call it


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Jan 30, 2012)

fredtgreco said:


> It's called women elders and Arminianism.





Nothing more really needs said.


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## Edward (Jan 30, 2012)

Pergamum said:


> Why form a new denomination instead of just going into one of the already-existing more conservative Presbyterian denominations?



Because the already existing denominations are too conservative. Even the EPC.


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## Pergamum (Jan 30, 2012)

So they broke away..but just barely.....(i.e., didn't run very far)...


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## Wayne (Jan 30, 2012)

This new group plans to hold to the Books of Confessions, which includes the Confession of 1967.
They will also hold to the ordination of women.

In short, they don't fit in the EPC, so thus they saw fit to form a new entity.

You said it well, Pergy: They ran, but didn't run far.


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## PointyHaired Calvinist (Jan 30, 2012)

The EPC permits egalitarians and complementarians, from what I've seen the ECO is "egalitarian only".

The Book of Confessions was also mentioned - their version even has the questionable Barmen Declaration and the abominable Confession of 67. Apparently they want to go back to what the UPUSA/PCUS were in the 60s, "but no further."


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## Edward (Jan 30, 2012)

Pergamum said:


> So they broke away..but just barely.....(i.e., didn't run very far)



It's not even clear if it is a break - some were talking about dual affiliation. But, yes, they seem to want to turn back the clock about 1 year, not 20 or 40 years.


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## Zach (Jan 30, 2012)

It all seems like pure silliness to me. They want to turn the clock just a little bit back...where do they think they will end up in 15-20 years? Do they think history will play out differently and the slow decline into greater liberalism and apostasy plateau to just the level they want? They are accomplishing absolutely nothing with this decision.


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## SolaGratia (Jan 31, 2012)

fredtgreco said:


> It's called women elders and Arminianism.



Then why didn't the PCA join the OPC?

The OPC does not have "women elders and Arminianism".


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## fredtgreco (Jan 31, 2012)

SolaGratia said:


> fredtgreco said:
> 
> 
> > It's called women elders and Arminianism.
> ...


The PCA did not join the OPC for very different reasons that the current group is going independent. One could just as easily ask the opposite - why didn't the OPC join the PCA? There are cultural differences to account for that, and different emphases beyond the Confession. That does not make it right, but it is a far different kettle of fish.


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## SolaGratia (Jan 31, 2012)

Rev. Greco,

I really appreciate your respond!

Praying for Unity in the Church:

"And I am no longer in the world, but they are in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, keep them in your name, which you have given me, that they may be one, even as we are one" (John 17:11).


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## Pergamum (Jan 31, 2012)

Thanks for the fine answers. I thought this news was good news when I first heard it, but I am less than impressed now.... now we just seem to have two crummy denominations instead of one crummy larger denomination...


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## Scott1 (Jan 31, 2012)

Charitably,
we need to pray that these brothers and sisters will find their way back to biblical, reformed Presbyterianism.

In the couple of generations lost to departure from Scripture, many have been left contending for the most basic parts of Christianity against patently false religion. Lost along the way has been much reformed doctrine and the distinctives of Presbyterianism. That includes following the pattern of Creation set forth and the explicit command of Scripture establishing men to the offices of the church.

The contrast now is suddenly so stark for them.

Any effort not to base faith and practice on Scripture is doomed to confusion, division and failure.

It is true that a full spectrum of Presbyterianism from apostasy to thoroughgoing biblical reformed is already available.

Pray that these dear people will quickly find their way home, for His Honor and His Glory.


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## Edward (Jan 31, 2012)

SolaGratia said:


> Then why didn't the PCA join the OPC?



Several formal efforts were made in the early years. The PCA got cold feet once, the OPC once (during the 'joining and receiving). I'd recommend that you read up for the details but the barriers included merger versus joining and receiving, denominational agencies and staff, philosophy as to church growth and expansion, and perhaps even personalities. 

At the onset, both were essentially regional bodies with little overlap geographically and quite different cultures.

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Pergamum said:


> I thought this news was good news when I first heard it, but I am less than impressed now



I have only spoken briefly to a man who was there. He indicated that there was a lack of clear direction as to where they want to head.


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## GulfCoast Presbyterian (Jan 31, 2012)

We had folks at both meetings, and are pursuing an "established option" instead. When the (former) FoP elected to keep the Book of Confessions (PCUSA) with Barmen and the horrible 1967, and a half dozen others, rather than simply embracing the WCF/WSC/WLC, it indicated to me a misplaced desire to keep the failed "big tent" mentality, without the proper set of poles to hold up the tent. All things to all folks is what you are trying to leave, not re-create. From my perspective of having a dog in the fight, I do not see this option having much of a shelf life.


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