# Challenging the Pastor



## sevenzedek (Mar 5, 2012)

I think it is wrong for a pastor to not be open to discussing their beliefs—to not allow their convictions to be tested by those wishing to learn. How much should a pastor be willing to discuss their beliefs? Is it wrong for a pastor to say that their convictions are not open for discussion?


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## rbcbob (Mar 5, 2012)

sevenzedek said:


> Challenging the Pastor



Jon when you refer to "challenging the Pastor" do you mean by "challenging" and is this to be done publicly or in private conversation?


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## sevenzedek (Mar 5, 2012)

I mean privately so as not to harm his reputation.


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## AThornquist (Mar 5, 2012)

If it's done privately and respectfully, I think the qualifications for an elder give a portrait of an approachable man who is willing to lovingly explain why he holds to what he does. I would be seriously worried about a pastor who refused to be open to such discussion.


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## Pergamum (Mar 5, 2012)

*touch not the lord's annointed!*

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## sevenzedek (Mar 5, 2012)

Pergamum said:


> *touch not the lord's annointed!*
> 
> ---------- Post added at 02:50 AM ---------- Previous post was at 02:49 AM ----------



If I have done something wrong, would you make it more plain? Perhaps you meant to give me a word of caution. I'm not entirely sure about your intentions.


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## Pergamum (Mar 5, 2012)

Jon, 

Very sorry, I am not sure you did anything wrong and my comment was not to rebuke you. I was trying for sarcasm (which I normally despise..which should be reason enough for me, myself, to avoid sarcasm - if I were smarter)....

..I quoted this phrase because I once heard a black pastor state this phrase as a means of deflecting criticism.

I believe that there should be no problem with discussions about your pastor's beliefs.


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## MarieP (Mar 5, 2012)

Jon, that was a joke. That is sadly the response many charismatic false teachers give.


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## Pergamum (Mar 5, 2012)

Sorry for my sarcasm, Jon. It is a very good question.


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## jandrusk (Mar 5, 2012)

Are we talking a Presbyterian or non-Presbyterian pastor?


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## sevenzedek (Mar 5, 2012)

I just had a flashback from my young-Christian days in the Church of God denomination. I didn't think TBN was so bad at that time.

The reason I am asking this question is because I am trying to understand my role as one being mentored by my pastor for teaching responsibilities at my church.

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Independent Reformed Baptist

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Independent Reformed Baptist

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Thanks for the apology, Pergamum.


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## Andres (Mar 6, 2012)

My answer to your question would depend a lot on what you mean by "challenging". Honestly, upon first reading, I don't care for that wording because it sounds like a challenge of defiance. Of course, this is only my inference and I doubt you mean it that way. If you simply want your pastor to help you understand why he believes the way he does, then no, I don't see a problem with that and yes, I would think a minister should be happy to oblige this request, especially to one he is mentoring. The most imporant thing would be to be respectful in your questioning of the pastor. (Seems obvious, I know) This would include your reasoning for questioning him. Do you have an agenda or is it a sincere desire to grow in your knowledge of the bible and theology?


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## Miss Marple (Mar 6, 2012)

Don't apologize too much, Pergamum, it made me laugh out loud.

I think I may use it on my children.


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## jwright82 (Mar 6, 2012)

Back when I was a member of the church that Andres goes to, I was being mentored in general by his same pastor (a wonderful and brilliant man BTW). I can't say that I ever outright questioned him but I could come to him in private and talk about all kinds of questions I had. Back than I started to cut my teeth on theology and I was interested in guys like Barth, Brunner, Bultmann, etc. He would allow me to ask anykind of question I wanted. He never said no don't read those guys there bad. He showed why they were wrong and because of it I came out of that church with a far deeper understanding of reformed theology than I had before. I miss those talks.


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## J. Dean (Mar 6, 2012)

For some reason, I have a Star Wars lightsaber duel coming to mind when I read this thread....


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## jwithnell (Mar 6, 2012)

I can envision two different kinds challenging: 

The first would be if you think the pastor is some how in error. In that case, I'd ask a bunch of questions to make sure I truly understand his position. If you remain concerned, your followup would be based upon the level of "problem." A difference with the confession (you cite LBC) would require consultation with other leaders in your church. 

The second would be if you are trying to understand an issue for yourself. In that case, I'd make sure he understands you are challenging to understand all sides of an issue and to be careful you are not doing so in a time or fashion that would interfere with his overall work.


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## sevenzedek (Mar 6, 2012)

I have approached my pastor, in the past, with the intention of challenging his statements. This is what I meant when I mentioned testing the convictions of my pastor. I think I was perceived as being contentious, although that was not how I wanted to be perceived. As long as I am not brow-beating my pastor and not trying to hurt him, is it wrong to push against his convictions? We do this with our friends on this board and in person. We test the thoughts of others in light of the Bible. If we don't do it with our mouths, our thoughts certainly do it. I tend to be transparent with what is on my mind. Perhaps others may see this as being insensitive, even though I appreciate this behavior from others and invite the same in return.


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## J. Dean (Mar 6, 2012)

sevenzedek said:


> I have approached my pastor, in the past, with the intention of challenging his statements. This is what I meant when I mentioned testing the convictions of my pastor. I think I was perceived as being contentious, although that was not how I wanted to be perceived. As long as I am not brow-beating my pastor and not trying to hurt him, is it wrong to push against his convictions? We do this with our friends on this board and in person. We test the thoughts of others in light of the Bible. If we don't do it with our mouths, our thoughts certainly do it. I tend to be transparent with what is on my mind. Perhaps others may see this as being insensitive, even though I appreciate this behavior from others and invite the same in return.


Jon, if you HONESTLY believe that this guy is in violation of Scriptural doctrines, then you ought to speak to him about it. Do it based on Scripture, not on a whim or a feeling. Look up verses, and ask him how he would understand them. Approach him in love, in charity, and give the benefit of the doubt to the extent that such benefit is warranted. Make it clear that you are trying to understand where he is coming from.


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