# Merry Turkeymas day



## BG (Nov 23, 2017)

Just wondering how many of you celebrate National Turkey and Footbaal day, and why?

Is it okay for Christians to celebrate Turkey day (or any other day for that matter)? 

**I hate Turkymas day it ruins my work week and causes a lot of problems for me as a small business man.**

What is our justification for this practice?

How is this different from Christmas\Nativity or Halloween?

What Holidays are legitimate? (52 Sundays)

How does the book of Esther figure into how we think about Holidays?

Is it Okay for a Church to decide to celebrate a good providence or celebrate anything (the death,life, birthof Christ)?

Can a Church call for a day of fasting or feasting?

Can we really separate religion\or Christian faith from anything (no neutrality)?

Is the consistent position no Holidays at all (birthdays, anniversary, Veterans Day, MLK day, Valentine’s Day)?

What is the consistent Biblical position on this topic?

Do any of you who don’t celebrate Christmas give your Christmas bonus back to your employer, do any of you refuse to take the day off, Do you refuse to be paid for the day?


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## NaphtaliPress (Nov 23, 2017)

That was a bit manic. I would split the topics out to related but separate threads.

Reactions: Like 3 | Funny 1


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## Edm (Nov 23, 2017)

I am eating Turkey today. I see no problem with Thanksgiving. The only relationship I see between Christmas and Thanksgiving is that people eat a lot and get together with family. Totally different besides that.


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## Edward (Nov 23, 2017)

BG said:


> Just wondering how many of you celebrate National Turkey and Footbaal day, and why?



Two different questions. The turkey's in the oven, but the boycott of the National Felons League continues.

Edit: corrected spelling error.

Reactions: Like 5


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## BG (Nov 23, 2017)

I’m probably bipolar.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Edm (Nov 23, 2017)

Edward said:


> Two different questions. The turkey's in the oven, but the boycott of the National Felons League continues.
> 
> Edit: corrected spelling error.



I honestly forgot about that part..have stopped watching all NFL. Egg bowl is on for today however...


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## Edward (Nov 23, 2017)

Edm said:


> Egg bowl is on for today however.



I probably should watch that. I went to an Egg Bowl back in the 80s when they played in Jackson.


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## Romans922 (Nov 23, 2017)

BG said:


> Turkymas



I don't celebrate mass. I put my papist ways behind me when I became a Christian.

Reactions: Like 1


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## jw (Nov 23, 2017)

It’s not a holy day. It’s not a religious _day_. Giving of thanks is a religious _act_, as it should be. The last I checked, we are free privately to pray, read scripture, sing psalms, and give thanks anytime of the week (whilst keeping in mind our 5th and 8th commandment duties, particularly). In fact, we’re _commanded_ to do so. We even do these things -GASP- on December 25th, divorced from all the papist pomp and idolatry, and unrelated to anything of that abused day.

When our magistrate proclaims a day of thanksgiving, and many are free to take the day off to reflect, give thanks, and spend time with family, I don’t understand the problem. Is it required for folks to do so? No. Does it have ties to ecclesiastical monuments of past idolatry? No. Is it supplanting, competing with, or distracting (inherently) from the Lord’s Day? No. Is it by nature tied to the occult or doctrines of devils? No. Are businesses _required_ to close down on this day? No. Are churches requiring members to observe it as a holy day? Not to my knowledge. Is the sabbath day the only holy day? Yes.

Are we willing/able/forward to think through things and make distinctions, even though it might be a little more difficult than simply generalizing and lumping in together all/any days not used exactly as every other 6 days on a week-to-week basis that do not possess the aforementioned disqualifiers?

I’m not sure it’s very common.

Reactions: Like 13


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## Dachaser (Nov 23, 2017)

Edm said:


> I am eating Turkey today. I see no problem with Thanksgiving. The only relationship I see between Christmas and Thanksgiving is that people eat a lot and get together with family. Totally different besides that.


And also go Lions.


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## BG (Nov 23, 2017)

Great post Josh. 

Just because the RC Church did something in the past does that mean it is out of bounds for the rest of us?


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## malcolmmaxwell60 (Nov 23, 2017)

All throughout the Bible we are to give thanks unto the Lord, for he is good, for his mercy endureth forever. Psalm 136. In the Westminister confession of faith and the larger and shorter catechisms, and in our directory of Public Worship, we are to have a Thanksgiving day service, remembering God in a special way thanking him for his general Providence in our lives, and singing psalms acapella praising him, and thanking God throughout the day. 

Sent from my SM-G530T using Tapatalk


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## VictorBravo (Nov 23, 2017)

My wife and I are spending part of this day in the county jail--right next to the elected prosecutor.

We are serving a feast to the forgotten on this magistrate-declared day of thanksgiving. 

After that, we will buy groceries and I'll take the time given to me to pound some fence posts in our orchard.

As with most every day (when I'm not self-absorbed and forgetful), we thank God for his continuing grace and blessings.

Reactions: Like 1


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## OPC'n (Nov 23, 2017)

I say no more pumpkn pie for you! LOL. I think all the holidays are fine to celebrate. I don't do anything for Easter. I hate football and wish it was outlawed lol. Happy thanksgiving!


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## bookslover (Nov 23, 2017)

My son and I will go to Black Angus and have ourselves a nice Thanksgiving Day turkey dinner with all the fixin's.

Not a football fan, so that's not a problem.

Will probably come home after that and do some more reading about Augustine.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Edward (Nov 23, 2017)

Since this is the Puritan Board, let's all remember to blame the Puritans for Thanksgiving

Reactions: Funny 4


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## NaphtaliPress (Nov 23, 2017)

Brownist separatists , so one of the extremes if we must include them under the puritan name. And apparently we can thank Lincoln for the national observance as we have it now. 


Edward said:


> Since this is the Puritan Board, let's all remember to blame the Puritans for Thanksgiving

Reactions: Like 1


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## Stephen L Smith (Nov 23, 2017)

Edward said:


> Since this is the Puritan Board, let's all remember to blame the Puritans for Thanksgiving


No thanksgiving here in New Zealand. So don't need to ascribe any blame to the Puritans


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## Gforce9 (Nov 23, 2017)

A national/secular day to enjoy food and family with some rest from work. Sports would only ruin it. It's about time for some good bourbon......

Reactions: Like 2 | Amen 1


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## Edward (Nov 23, 2017)

NaphtaliPress said:


> And apparently we can thank Lincoln for the national observance as we have it now.



FDR was the one who moved the date to jump start retail sales.


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## NaphtaliPress (Nov 23, 2017)

I know it is wiki but according to it, it was always the fourth Thursday and FDR tried to change it to the third; it reverted back by act of congress from 1942 forward. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thanksgiving_(United_States)#1942_to_present


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 23, 2017)

We have liberty to set aside a weekday for giving thanks if we so wish; what we do NOT have liberty to do is alter the regular Lord's Day worship because the world has decided to have a holiday. It grieves me no end when the second service gets cancelled for the sake of having a "Thanksgiving Service," which is not part of regulated worship. So, I hate the holiday because many churches allow it to bleed into their practice to the destruction of decency.
And I loathe turkey.

Reactions: Like 1


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## timfost (Nov 23, 2017)

Still digesting...

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 2


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## Ryan&Amber2013 (Nov 23, 2017)

I was thankful to have 4 feasts this week.


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## JimmyH (Nov 23, 2017)

I had been a 'humbug' of the thanksgiving holiday in past years, but now, at 69 years old, with most of my family passed on, I enjoy the fellowship with friends and look forward to the get together every year.

Reactions: Like 2


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Nov 23, 2017)

My input is more of a commentary on the day.

I'm full.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## bookslover (Nov 24, 2017)

Turns out my son and I did not go out to Black Angus. He felt slightly ill, so we stayed home.

My Thanksgiving dinner was a bowl of Campbell's chicken noodle soup and a peanut butter and jelly sandwich.

Still thankful, though.

Reactions: Like 2


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## earl40 (Nov 24, 2017)

I was blessed to have to work all day yesterday. When I say I was blessed I really meant it, in that is better to be in the house of mourning than mirth. After work I had to work to go to my SIL house for the turkey thing, and really did not want to do such because I was beat. Of course I enjoyed the house of mirth (I really did) and left early to retire to my bed. No sooner that I laid my head to rest I got called back to my job to enjoy the blessing of the miseries of our world. All the while myself and my immediate blood brothers and sisters are in the mist of dealing with a serious mental breakdown of my sister Caroline so back to the house of mourning again and again and again (prayers very much appreciated for her).

So far as Thanksgiving not being a religious holyday holiday that should be perpetual....poppycock. Though I will say I am grateful for the obligation to attend many years with this one being an exception.

Reactions: Like 1


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## OPC'n (Nov 24, 2017)

Ben Zartman said:


> We have liberty to set aside a weekday for giving thanks if we so wish; what we do NOT have liberty to do is alter the regular Lord's Day worship because the world has decided to have a holiday. It grieves me no end when the second service gets cancelled for the sake of having a "Thanksgiving Service," which is not part of regulated worship. So, I hate the holiday because many churches allow it to bleed into their practice to the destruction of decency.
> And I loathe turkey.



Your church does know that Thanksgiving is on Thursday not Sunday, right? lol


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 24, 2017)

OPC'n said:


> Your church does know that Thanksgiving is on Thursday not Sunday, right? lol


Sarah, they don't seem to. Or else they want to double-dip, which perhaps is worse since mid-week prayer was cancelled "Because of the holiday", and now Sabbath afternoon prayer will be supplanted by a "Thanksgiving Service." Which is an unregulated invention of men--a golden calf of conformity to the nation around us. Bleh.


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## Edward (Nov 24, 2017)

Ben Zartman said:


> a "Thanksgiving Service." Which is an unregulated invention of men



So I take it that you reject the London Baptist Confession?

"with fastings, and thanksgivings, upon special occasions"


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 24, 2017)

Edward said:


> So I take it that you reject the London Baptist Confession?
> 
> "with fastings, and thanksgivings, upon special occasions"


Those are to mean occasions of special deliverance from extraordinary difficulties, not occasions hallowed by the unbelieveing world around. To use it as a justification for following the world after their groves and high places is to wrest the meaning of the confession out of shape. Gillespie deals with this issue ably, though I don't have his quote ready to hand.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Edward (Nov 24, 2017)

Ben Zartman said:


> Those are to mean occasions of special deliverance from extraordinary difficulties, not occasions hallowed by the unbelieveing world around.



So they are OK if you say they are OK, but not OK if your Elders call for them?


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 25, 2017)

Edward said:


> So they are OK if you say they are OK, but not OK if your Elders call for them?


Two things would make them OK:
1) If the reason they were being called was legitimate. To do something because the world is doing something flies in the face of Deut. 12:30. This is the same reason we must guard carefully the style of music we select for singing. But that's aside.
2) If the actions done were legitimate. What is a religious service? Prayer, singing, preaching, etc. But that every person should stand up and say what they're thankful for just then is not part of regulated worship. Is this a wrong thing to do? Not in itself, but on the Lord's day, when an actual service is cancelled for the sake of this, it becomes abominable.
The LBCF states that God is not to be worshiped according to the inventions of men. If Thanksgiving Day is not an invention of men, I don't know what is.
"What meaneth this lowing of cattle in my ears?...."


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## Edward (Nov 25, 2017)

Ben Zartman said:


> What is a religious service? Prayer, singing, preaching, etc. But that every person should stand up and say what they're thankful for just then is not part of regulated worship.



Compare that to the Baptist Confession:

" Prayer, with thanksgiving, being one part of natural worship, is by God required of all men."

and 

" moreover, solemn humiliation, with fastings, and thanksgivings, upon special occasions, ought to be used in an holy and religious manner."


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## OPC'n (Nov 25, 2017)

Edward said:


> Compare that to the Baptist Confession:
> 
> " Prayer, with thanksgiving, being one part of natural worship, is by God required of all men."
> 
> ...



I've never read the Baptist Confession, but do you really believe that it's talking about America's Thanksgiving day? Seem very odd and strange for them to be referring to our Thanksgiving day instead of referring to the church being thankful to God in all things.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 25, 2017)

Edward said:


> Compare that to the Baptist Confession:
> 
> " Prayer, with thanksgiving, being one part of natural worship, is by God required of all men."
> 
> ...


Again, the limitations are special occasions and in a holy and religious manner. Deut. 12:30 means that it is impossible to put a holiday of the world to a holy and religious use.
If the church had an experience of sin like Corinth, and was to seek repentance in solemn humiliation with fasting, there would then be warrant to have a special occasion of thanksgiving. That's what the LBCF is allowing.

As to the first quoted portion, I say that if we are neglecting the proper amount of thanksgiving in our weekly services, (which I don't think we are: prayer with thanksgiving is part of our regular worship), then following the world's example of being thankful one day a year won't make up the deficit. If we are expressing a decent amount of thanks throughout the year, what business have we calling an occasion we are not enjoined to by Scripture? And if we were to have special Lord's Days of extra thanksgiving, why ever would we do it just because the world has been pleased to? The church must not allow the world to regulate her habits and practice--this is the burden of Deut. 12:30


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## BG (Nov 25, 2017)

In the book of Esther the civil magistrate ordered the people to recognize a Holiday, what are your thoughts on that? Anyone...


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 25, 2017)

We also may by all means celebrate civil holidays, and if the government were to require their keeping, it would be our duty to do so, as long as they did not cause the breaking of God's law. But no government can lawfully enjoin a holiday that would make folk break the Sabbath, and I'm willing to bet that the weekly Sabbath in the OT trumped Purim.

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## Herald (Nov 25, 2017)

I'll take the day and say "thank you very much" for the opportunity to feast. Josh was spot on. It's not a commanded day, but nor is giving thanks prohibited. Would it be that we would give public thanks to our God more often. As for the football and shopping, any good thing can be abused.

Reactions: Like 3


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## Edward (Nov 25, 2017)

OPC'n said:


> I've never read the Baptist Confession



When discussing with Baptists, I refer to the LBC.

When discussing with RCs, I refer, when possible, to the Catholic Confession and cite Douay-Rheims when the the translation is adequate. I've even been known to quote the Catholic Confession here a time or two. 

It can be helpful to familiarize oneself with both (and the strengths and weaknesses of each).


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## Edward (Nov 25, 2017)

Ben Zartman said:


> If we are expressing a decent amount of thanks throughout the year, what business have we calling an occasion we are not enjoined to by Scripture? And if we were to have special Lord's Days of extra thanksgiving, why ever would we do it just because the world has been pleased to?



Well, please provide me with a list of the dates upon which scripture proscribes giving thanks.


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## Ben Zartman (Nov 26, 2017)

Edward said:


> Well, please provide me with a list of the dates upon which scripture proscribes giving thanks.


I think you're misunderstanding. You may have all the extraordinary days of giving thanks that you wish to. But what you may not do is alter the regular worship of God simply because the world has been pleased to call a day.
By all means celebrate the Thanksgiving holiday on Thursday if you like. But to change the Sunday activities of the church for no other reason than that the world "gave thanks" last Thursday is wrong.
The church may not lay on any man's conscience a duty that God has not enjoined. Yet to do on the Lord's Day, as an assembly of the church, a thing that God has NOT required is to violate the RPW. If everyone spouting what they're thankful for in turn is regulated worship, then why does it only happen this time of year? Once? There are 51 other Lord's Days--if this is right, then surely it is right more often. If it is not part of regulated worship, then it is always wrong.
I think, Edward, you don't understand the RPW, and you're purposely misunderstanding the LBCF.
EVERY Lord's day is to include the giving of thanks, among other things--but that giving of thanks must be done according to the RPW.

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