# Gisbertus Voetius on wether children are a part of the visible Church



## Seeking_Thy_Kingdom (Sep 18, 2019)

Question: Whether the children of those who belong to the covenant are members of the visible church and co-assemble it?

Answer: They are called members of the church by the Dutch Liturgy and by the ministry in the form of baptism, and this is supported by 1 Cor. 7:14, Acts 2:39 and by other places that tend to be brought up against the Anabaptists for child baptism. However, this should not be construed as limiting, as Amesius says very well about this: _The children, however, are not fully members of the church to the extent that they could practice the activities of the community, or were allowed to to be part of all its special rights, unless it appears in advance of the growth in the faith; however, of those things that relate to the commencement of faith and the entry into the church, they may not be excluded._ They are therefore incomplete members, having a certain similarity with those who are full members of the church, because they have the spirit and grace of being born again, and thus something similar to faith, the calling and actual conversion (through which one is a member of the invisible church), but not having faith and actual conversion itself, have something similar to the actual and explicit confession of faith, and with the promise and commitment (by which adults are incorporated into the people of God and the visible church), namely the actual and explicit confession and commitment of the parents. 

_Gijsbertus Voetius, Verhandeling over De Zichtbare en Georganiseerde Kerk_

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## Reformed Covenanter (Sep 18, 2019)

We need to see more of Voetius in English. Thanks very much for your labours, brother. Keep up the good work.

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## Seeking_Thy_Kingdom (Sep 18, 2019)

Reformed Covenanter said:


> We need to see more of Voetius in English. Thanks very much for your labours, brother. Keep up the good work.


Thank you sir, sadly most of his works are in Latin, but I happened to find a Dutch translation. As for labor, this is all fun and practice. Thankfully this is in modern Dutch and not in the gothic script, that makes this quite easy to translate. 

I agree there should be more of his works published, and I have a sneaking suspicion that we will be hearing more about him in the near future.

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## Seeking_Thy_Kingdom (Sep 18, 2019)

_Question_: Whether ecclesiastical care and government should extend in all parts to adults who were baptized in their childhood and whether they themselves should be admitted or encouraged to the community in all sacred acts alongside the other members, without giving from their side a free, actual and explicit consent and confession when they have come to the years of accountability, so that the unspoken and potential commitment and confession that resulted from baptism in childhood would be sufficient?

_Answer_: Certainly the Popes want that, assuming that all those who were baptized in their youth, even though they have never embraced the Roman faith and shared in the Roman community, to the ecclesiastical power, and consequently being guilty of heresy or of any other crime, with ecclesiastical and civil punishments, of which the pagans, Jews, Mohammedans, Greeks and other Eastern schismatics are free. Among the Reformed in the Netherlands there was someone who for several years in a Latin Treatise on ecclesiastical Discipline written by him (which was also translated into our language and, but wrongly, for a time was attributed to Jac. Arminius) that ecclesiastical discipline had to be extended even to all adults, however strange they may be to the confession of the faith and the community of the church, as well as to the members of the church, and this on the basis that they were baptized in their youth. That Dutch theologian, who is the author of the aforementioned treatise, has not succeeded in getting this and other ideas accepted by his colleagues and the Dutch churches, and thus to make them opposed to it, and the existing practice no longer followed or defended. As a result, this discourse has been unable to make progress and is seen and read by few in private circles. We assert that our churches have a well-founded reason for taking up members (which I have suggested above in Chapter 1) and expanding and practicing discipline (which the Dutch Liturgy and Ecclesiastical Ordinances have) and not to hold to the extent that the unconfirmed confession and commitment contained in baptism are sufficient to partake of the Lord's supper and the entire ecclesial community. The reasons we have for this are these:

1st Because thus the distinction would be abolished between perfect and imperfect members of the church and between being born again and actual conversion. Now this would be foolishness. After all, it could happen that a person born and baptized in his youth was brought up in the teachings of the Mohammedans or Manichaeans, or openly served the flesh and the world up to the hour of his salvation, or the third, or the sixth, or the eleventh hour, while the seed of being born in him was hidden beneath it all the time as in the earth. But who would call such a member of the Church, or admit him as a member of the Church to her communion and the sacrament or encourage him to participate, if there is not a free and express confession and promise on their part?

2nd Because the Apostle makes a consequential confession to the Church a preliminary requirement for those who go to the Lord's Supper, 1 Cor. 11:28. If they do not give a confession, then they must not belong to the community and be banned from the table, as our Catechism correctly states in Questions 74 and 80. Thus, an unconscious, potential and improper acceptance and confession of the covenant is not sufficient, although this is sufficient for children to receive baptism. And on the basis of this distinction alone, taken from 1 Cor. 11:28, it is clear to us that children should be refused to participate in the sacrament, as opposed to the errors of Augustine, Innocentius and several others from ancient times. But more about this later.

3rd Because it fights against the state and condition of the people of God, that it incorporates persons in its number and rank, without having made a voluntary and clear confession of their actual conversion and belief. See Ps. 110 v3, Isa. 49 v. 18, v. 5 and 60 v. 4. How will the other believers rejoice about the spiritual knowledge found with them, their streams of living water, their love of truth and their receiving from the covenant of grace, which things are so magnificently promised in Isa. 11, 44, 60 and 62 and in Joel, if a silent and unconscious confession and commitment (which still dates from childhood and which is later witnessed by words as by actions) would be sufficient?

4th Because such an impulse and force to the ecclesiastical community (which some may want, and that will take place with all those who were baptized in their childhood) against the state of the spiritual kingdom of Christ and against the freedom of conscience, and the church is filled with low hypocrites and makes it conform to a worldly empire, from which it is distinguished as sharply as possible in this respect.

5th Because of their unconscious commitment and confession contained in baptism, it would follow that children have more rights, and should be admitted to the sacrament and the full communion of the church, no matter how much out of order they are, as to make a conscious profession of faith and to make a commitment on their part. In that they would be more suitable than those who have not yet confessed bondages, and who are already adults, that they would not do anything through lack of knowledge or even by hostile ignorance, moreover by carelessness and unity that would be contrary to the demands of the holy covenant and the church community.

_Gisbertus Voetius, Verhandeling over de Onzichtbare en Georganiseerde Kerk _


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## Seeking_Thy_Kingdom (Sep 19, 2019)

Question: The church will therefore refrain from all acts of spiritual care and community concerning children implanted by the baptism of the visible church, unless they themselves, when they have reached adulthood, desire church care and community. 

Answer:By no means. For it is precisely for that reason that the Church makes sure that the names of the baptized children are recorded in a special book, so that they may give them to other inhabitants of that place, who are unbelievers and alien to religion, as children of God and of the church, and as they increase in age to participate in catechisms, attending religious exercises and, as soon as they can meet the conditions, to encourage the confession of faith and participation in the sacrament and open the way to them. This is what we see happening with diligent shepherds and well-assembled church councils; also on this matter, if I remember correctly, there have been decisions at synods.

_Gisbertus Voetius, Verhandeling over de Zichtbare en Georganiseerde Kerk_


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