# Origen and the Life of the Stars



## RamistThomist (Sep 10, 2018)

Given the recent discussion on Heiser's works concerning the beney ha elohim, and the worldview of ancient man in general, and that Heiser references this work, I thought a review would be apropos.

Alan Scott, _Origen and the Life of the Stars: The History of An Idea_ (Oxford Early Christian Studies; Oxford University Press, 1994.

Alan Scott sheds light on key problems in Hellenism by focusing on Origen’s view of the stars’ souls. Ancient Greece certainly discussed the possibility that the stars are alive (and we will use the phrase” alive,” “intelligence,” and “souls” interchangeably in this review) but there was no consensus.

*Plato*

The presence of intelligence is the presence of a soul (Scott 9, cf. _Soph_. 249a4) and a mind must exist in the soul. The universe, accordingly, must be ensouled since “mind was present in it.” aether: the body in which the soul operates. The astral soul and aether co-operate.

A problem for later Platonists: if the “divine” is incorporeal, and if stars are divine, how can we see them in the heavens? Jewish and Christian thinkers exploited this weak point. The only way to respond to this criticism was to weaken the “divine claim” and see them rather as intermediate beings.

*Origen*

Scott argues against reading too much of any single school into Origen’s thought. While he is close to Middle Platonism, for example, he was also very familiar with Jewish Apocalypticism and Gnosticism (54).

*Philo*

Philo’s sometimes wooden borrowing of philosophy allows us a “snapshot” of the Hellenistic classroom (63-64).


Earth is centre of cosmos
Yet Philo rejects the somewhat Stoic claim that the mind is material. The mind is neither pneuma nor matter. 
Stars are definitely living beings.
Ontologically superior to angels.
Not surprisingly, Philo was tolerant of those who worshipped heaven (something no biblical writer could say!), but elsewhere says it is wrong to do so (74).

“Philo is too good a Jew and too good a Platonist to take these arguments to their logical conclusions” (74). Origen advances beyond Philo in seeing the possibility of evil in heaven. 

*Heavenly Powers*

Problem: how does the soul enter into the generative powers of the world? Phaedrus said because of evil, whereas Timeaus said because of a good demiurge. “The belief began to slowly evolve that the soul was joined to the body through the medium of an ‘astral body’” (77). This became a major theme in Platonism after Iamblichus (79).

At this time Oriental sources entered Hellenistic thought, notably Mithraism, which taught that a gate corresponded to a planet (82).

However, once the idea of fate was firmly attached to the stars, and given that people have “bad luck,” many began to question whether the stars were truly benign. This meant, among other things, that the neutral “daimons” in the heavenly realms could now be seen as demons in the traditional understanding (90-93).

_Toll Houses (!)_

A common theme in later Platonic and Gnostic thought is the soul’s traveling through planets after death. The _Apocalypse of Paul_ (Nag Hammadi Library) has Paul passing through toll collectors (98). Granted, there are huge differences between this and the later Russian Orthodox teaching of toll houses.

*Clement*

Clement believes there are angels who oversee the souls’ ascent (106). Clement holds that stars are governed by their appointed angels (55.1; cf. p. 108).

*Origen and the Stars*

Origen divides the soul with a highest sense–mind (nous). This is fallen and capable of sin. There is an unfallen portion called “spirit” (pneuma). Origen is aware that many of his views are speculative, and he is not setting them forth as doctrine (122). He is “thinking out loud” in the face of very difficult problems. And compared to the current Alexandrian cosmology, Origen’s is quite restrained (124).

_Are the stars alive?_

Origen tentatively answered “maybe.” But before we judge him, we must see that his answers are based on terminology that both Christians and pagans accepted. For example, only rational agents are self-moving. This would appear that the stars are in some sense rational agents. But Origen was also aware of Jewish Apocalyptic and he would have been on better ground had he said that “angels move the stars.”

This really isn’t that problematic. Scientifically wrong, to be sure, but that’s all. The problem came when Origen had to account for why some stars are greater than others. And is answer, of course, was of some pre-temporal fall. And that is problematic.

*The Stars and the resurrection body*

Origen is actually very careful on this point. He affirms the resurrection body, but he knows, as does Paul in 1 Cor. 15, that it isn’t the same type of body we have today. But perhaps he gets in trouble with his discussions of the “astral body.” All Christians have to believe in the post-mortem existence of the soul. This is a mode of existence that isn’t bodily yet which the soul is in one place at one time. 

Given both Scriptural teachings, logic, and the experiences of wise saints, we posit that the soul has an existence after death. But how does it exist? Does it recognize other souls? Surely it does. Is it omnipresent in the spiritual world? Certainly not, for not even angels (who are bodiless) are omnipresent. Therefore, there must be some sort of identifiable mode of existing that is bodiless. Origen called this an “astral body.” 

*Conclusion*

Does Scott fully vindicate Origen? Not quite, but he does alleviate a lot of problems. Origen was very reticent about using philosophy. He didn’t innovate but rather held to established, conservative opinions in the intellectual world (even if they were wrong in hindsight).

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## Pergamum (Sep 10, 2018)

Fascinating. Thanks.

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## Regi Addictissimus (Sep 10, 2018)

Have you read Edward Reynolds "Treatise on the Soul?" It is volume six in his works. Also, thanks as always for the informative review.


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## RamistThomist (Sep 10, 2018)

Reformed Bookworm said:


> Have you read Edward Reynolds "Treatise on the Soul?" It is volume six in his works. Also, thanks as always for the informative review.



I have not. A relative of mine might have it. I will check. I am a strong defender of substance dualism and this popped on my radar when some Kuyperians were denying it this week on Facebook.


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## Pergamum (Sep 10, 2018)

Question:

In Jude 1:13 false teachers are referred to as "wandering stars." One commentator spoke of this being a nautical allusion (mariners had to follow the fixed stars to head in the right path), but I had always thought Jude meant real stars that fall out of orbit like the fallen angels, since elsewhere false teachers are likened to angels who fell and stars that fell are likened to rebellious angels in Jewish apocrypha and ancient myth.

For instance, other non-canonical sources speak of the stars as alive (spirit beings) and the angels who fell as being stars (I Enoch), 1 Enoch 21..."And there I saw seven stars of the heaven bound together in it, like great mountains and burning with fire. 4. Then I said: ‘For what sin are they bound, and on what account have they been cast in hither?’ 5. Then said Uriel, one of the holy angels, who was with me, and was chief over them, and said: ‘Enoch, why dost thou ask, and why art thou eager for the truth? 6. These are of the number of the stars of heaven, which have transgressed the commandment of the Lord, and are bound here till ten thousand years, the time entailed by their sins, are consummated.’ 7. And from thence I went to another place, which was still more horrible than the former, and I saw a horrible thing: a great fire there which burnt and blazed, and the place was cleft as far as the abyss, being full of great descending columns of fire: neither its extent or magnitude could I see, nor could I conjecture. 8. Then I said: ‘How fearful is the place and how terrible to look upon!’ 9. Then Uriel answered me, one of the holy angels who was with me, and said unto me: ‘Enoch, why hast thou such fear and affright?’ And I answered: ‘Because of this fearful place, and because of the spectacle of the pain.’ 10. And he said unto me: ‘This place is the prison of the angels, and here they will be imprisoned for ever.’

It seemed to be the belief of many in the ancient world that the stars were not dead rock but living creatures or lesser gods or spirits and any deviation from their set path was rebellion.


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## RamistThomist (Sep 11, 2018)

Pergamum said:


> It seemed to be the belief of many in the ancient world that the stars were not dead rock but living creatures or lesser gods or spirits and any deviation from their set path was rebellion.



Yeah, that's more or less the ancient view. Some thought stars were angels. I think there is more to it than that, but I my thoughts aren't settled on it right now.


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## Pergamum (Sep 11, 2018)

It amazes me how much the ancients new about the "Great Year" and the movement of the earth against the backdrop of the constellations. Ancient cultures did not slowly develop from "primitive tribal" to advanced urban dwellers, but sprang fully formed and advanced. My tribe in 2018 is less advanced than the ancient Sumerians, for instance. 

Because of this I believe they were, in fact, coached and given knowledge by the fallen angels, just as their own histories and the Jewish sources say.

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## SRoper (Sep 12, 2018)

Pergamum said:


> In Jude 1:13 false teachers are referred to as "wandering stars." One commentator spoke of this being a nautical allusion (mariners had to follow the fixed stars to head in the right path), but I had always thought Jude meant real stars that fall out of orbit like the fallen angels, since elsewhere false teachers are likened to angels who fell and stars that fell are likened to rebellious angels in Jewish apocrypha and ancient myth.



Usually the wandering stars are planets, but your suggestion is interesting.


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## Pergamum (Sep 13, 2018)

Compare Jude 1:13 and the Book of Enoch, which Jude quotes:

"Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever."

Now Enoch, which Jude utilized:

18:12 And beyond that abyss I saw a place which had no firmament of the heaven above, and no firmly founded earth beneath it: there was no water upon it, and no birds, but it was a waste and horrible place. 13. I saw there seven stars like great burning mountains, and to me, when I inquired regarding them, 14. The angel said: 'This place is the end of heaven and earth: this has become a prison for the stars and the host of heaven.



Many of the ancients believed the stars and planets were Gods. One easy example is the Sun God myths of the God traveling daily across the sky in his chariot, etc., like Apollo. Fallen angels would thus be compared to stars which fell and angels as stars sometimes:

Isaiah 14:13
You said in your heart: "I will ascend to the heavens; I will raise my throne above the stars of God. I will sit on the mount of assembly, in the far reaches of the north.

Rev 12:
4His tail swept a third of the stars from the sky, tossing them to the earth. And the dragon stood before the woman as she was about to give birth, ready to devour her child as soon as He was born.

Revelation 9:1
Then the fifth angel sounded his trumpet, and I saw a star that had fallen from heaven to earth, and it was given the key to the pit of the Abyss.




Look up the word "Astrolatry" - the worship of the stars, and you'll see the ancients did not merely name the constellations after Gods but many thought they were, in fact, gods. In Egypt, the pharaoh died and became a star. So did the Mayans (who also had pyramids...I believe in the unpopular notion of cultural diffusion and that all the megalithic cultures were related and traveled and that pyramids did not spring up in different places by coincidence but that they all had a distant relationship and this knowledge was spread to the ends of the earth by them even in ancient times).

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