# Who do you say is the Whore Of Babylon and why?



## dudley (Aug 22, 2011)

Martin Luther, John Calvin and John Knox used the phrase "Whore of Babylon" to refer to the Roman Catholic Church. 

Some traditionalist Catholics who hold the position of Sedevacantism believe that a counterfeit bride – a Counter-Catholic Church – will arise in the end times in order to deceive faithful Catholics; they teach that this counterfeit Church is the Roman Catholic Church after the Second Vatican Council.

One Roman Catholic teaching is that the Whore of Babylon is an apostate Jerusalem, allied to the Beast that is the Roman Empire. 

Who do you say is the Whore Of Babylon and why?


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## baron (Aug 22, 2011)

I think it represents Rome and the Roman Empire of John's day. I think Revelation was written before 70 AD.


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## dudley (Aug 22, 2011)

baron said:


> I think it represents Rome and the Roman Empire of John's day. I think Revelation was written before 70 AD.



I agree John but I am wondering and I tend to believe more and more she has continued to be the whore trough 2000 years of Christian History. I see her as a false church.

Here in chapter 17 of Revelations the woman is described as a "great whore that sitteth upon many waters". Alternatively she may be described a great idolater controlling many people, and nations, which is a good description of the Roman Catholic Church all through 2000 years of Christian history.


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## FCC (Aug 23, 2011)

I will agree with you Dudley. The whore of Revelation is the Roman Catholic Church. The descriptions are very clear! 

VI. There is no other head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the Pope of Rome in any sense be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God. WCF XXV, Sec. VI


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## 3dawgnight (Aug 23, 2011)

Could it be that John was referring to any church that teaches a false gospel (justification by works; implicitly or explicitly)?


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## Peairtach (Aug 24, 2011)

The best treatment of this is in Patrick Fairbairn's "The Interpretation of Prophecy" (BoT)

There are numerous instances in the OT to spiritual unfaithfulness by the OT Church/Israel being compared to sexual infidelity and prostitution.

Christ (often?) called Israel "aduterous" by which He meant spiritually unfaithful.

Such behaviour - spiritual unfaithfulness to Christ - is undoubtedly wider than Rome, but is at least covered by the fact that Babylon is called "the Mother of Harlots" i.e. she is not the only harlot, but the chief.

She is found in the desert/wilderness, where John leaves the Woman i.e. the early New Testament Church.

She is seen sitting on the Beast. By the Middle Ages the Church was in the driving seat. The Papal doctrine of the relation of Church to State is Papalism, that the Church should rule over the state. The Papacy, ideally, claims kingly power over the nations and their leaders aswell as spiritual and ecclesiastical power.

But the political power of Rome over the nations has declined since the Middle Ages, as the kings have demanded more unrestricted secular power. 


> And the ten horns that you saw, they and the beast will hate the prostitute. They will make her desolate and naked, and devour her flesh and burn her up with fire, (Rev 17:16)



Thus raw secular and pagan civil power has grown at the expense of the power of apostate Christianity.

The echo of the light and voice of Christ and His true Church were once heard in her


> and the light of a lamp will shine in you no more, and the voice of bridegroom and bride will be heard in you no more,(Rev 18:23)



But when Rome and the big liberal apostate denominations, also are characterised by paedophilia and homosexuality, it is long past the time to leave:



> And he called out with a mighty voice, "Fallen, fallen is Babylon the great! She has become a dwelling place for demons, a haunt for every unclean spirit, a haunt for every unclean bird, a haunt for every unclean and detestable beast.(Rev 18:2)





> Then I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of her, my people, lest you take part in her sins, lest you share in her plagues (Rev 18:4)



The problem being a true Christian and being in the Church of Rome or a mixed Protestant denomination is that of accomodation and compromise.

Like the cleansed Church, the apostate Church is both a woman and a city:



> And on her forehead was written a name of mystery: "Babylon the great, mother of prostitutes and of earth's abominations." (Rev 17:5)





> Let us rejoice and exult and give him the glory, for the marriage of the Lamb has come, and his Bride has made herself ready;it was granted her to clothe herself with fine linen, bright and pure"-- for the fine linen is the righteous deeds of the saints. (Rev 19:7-8)





> And I saw the holy city, new Jerusalem, coming down out of heaven from God, prepared as a bride adorned for her husband. (Rev 21:2)





> Husbands, love your wives, as Christ loved the church and gave himself up for her,that he might sanctify her, having cleansed her by the washing of water with the word, so that he might present the church to himself in splendor, without spot or wrinkle or any such thing, that she might be holy and without blemish.(Eph 5:25-27)



The Book of Revelation is the story of the Church "in broad brush strokes" from the death throes of the OT Church in Jerusalem, and the destruction of the Temple and City, to its resurrection out of that in the Christian Church ("the Woman"), the early Church, the apostate Church ("the Whore"), the end of the apostate Christianity (in history) and the glorified Church ("the Bride"). "The Dragon", "the Beast" and "the False Prophet" put pressure on the Woman until she becomes the Whore. But God will always have His true people on Earth


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## dudley (Aug 25, 2011)

*Amen David!*



FCC said:


> I will agree with you Dudley. The whore of Revelation is the Roman Catholic Church. The descriptions are very clear!
> 
> VI. There is no other head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the Pope of Rome in any sense be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God. WCF XXV, Sec. VI



Amen David! We must renounce the Romanist church and her antichrist pope as did the Protestant Reformers.She is not only the Whore of Revelations she is truly a Harlot of Satan .


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## baron (Aug 25, 2011)

I was reading The Man of Sin by Kim Riddlebarger on page 107 he says: Preterists often identify this woman as apostate Jerusalem, while historicists see this as a refrence to the Roman Catholic Church. Dispensationalists most often believe this is a prophecy of an alliance between an apostate church with revived Roman political power during the seven-year tribulation period, although prophecy pundit Dave Hunt also sees this as a reference to the Roman Catholic Church. None of these identifications, however, fit the data given us in the vision.

So it seems on the camp you are in as to how you see this. 

Has anyone read Roman Catholicism by John Armstrong? I have not but plan to. On the cover it also says What Divides And Unites Us. I could be wrong but if there are things that unite us than we should be carefull who we call the anti-Christ or the whore of Babylon. 

Amazon.com: Roman Catholicism (9780802471697): John Armstrong: Books


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