# Jesus Hates Religion



## JS116 (Jan 11, 2012)

Take a minute to check out this short 4 minute video that was taken yesterday of a spoken word poet speaking about religion and Jesus,it's the buzz on the social networks.

***Watch BEFORE you comment***

Why I Hate Religion, But Love Jesus || Spoken Word - YouTube

I believe the guy has alot of good points but needs to be corrected on a couple things,but I'll wait to you guys watch and then i'll respond...


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## Andres (Jan 12, 2012)

I guess we’d have to define “religion” first.


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## Beoga (Jan 12, 2012)

My comment, after watching, via the social networks:

"Religion says do, Jesus says done. Except Jesus said do:
"If you keep my commandments, you will abide in my love," John 15:10
"If you love me, you will obey my commands." John 14:15"

That being said, the video wasn't as bad as I was anticipating, though I don't know what that says.


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## Pilgrim's Progeny (Jan 12, 2012)

Andres said:


> I guess we’d have to define “religion” first.



This man seems to define "religion" as a cover up to conceal the true character of those who live this "religion"

"Religion" as I see it defined in this video is synonymous with hypocrisy.

So, Yes, Jesus hates "religion". 

True religion =


> Pure and undefiled religion in the sight of _our_ God and Father is this: to visit orphans and widows in their distress, _and_ to keep oneself unstained by the world.
> James 1:27 (NASB)



With this right understanding, Jesus loves "religion".

True religion as I understand it is not me commending myself to God and man, but my reasonable act of service to God and man in the sight of a God who is pleased with me because I am the fruit of the travail of His son.

The problem with "religion" is that is so often misunderstood, it is just too ambiguous I think and therefore I believe the speaker may be doing faithful adherents to "true religion" more harm than good.


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## PuritanCovenanter (Jan 12, 2012)

Jesus came to abolish religion? This poor soul needs to square up his terminology on a few different levels. To start with he needs to know what religion is and what it isn't. I suspect he might have many other issues also. This young man seems to not understand that there is true religion in comparison to false religion. Only a novice would say that Christianity isn't a religion. There are many religious beliefs and religions. This pompous kid wants to start his own epistemological reference point. He is the definer of what is and isn't. Wow, that must be pretty cool. I guess he is on the level of God in giving words their meaning now. Jesus came to save and seek. That is true. He didn't come to abolish religion. He came to establish His Kingdom and reconcile us to God so that we could perform our duty to God and be righteous. 

(Jas 1:26) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.


(Jas 1:27) Pure religion and undefiled before God and the Father is this, To visit the fatherless and widows in their affliction, and to keep himself unspotted from the world.

It is fine if this young man wants to confront hypocrisy. I have no problem with that. The book of James does this also. 

By the way this young man talks, we should probably relegate the word faith to obscurity also. There is true faith and false faith. Christianity is a religion of faith in Christ. If you were to tell an atheist that Christianity wasn't a world religion you would be laughed at. The word religion is not a bad word as this person is making it out to be. This kind of stuff just makes me sick and makes Christians look mindless. I use to hear this tripe from people who mostly despised authority but wanted to claim Christ. Jesus and me stuff. He says that he loves the Church. But which Church does he love? What does he mean by Church? What is his reference point for defining that? Maybe I should rely upon him for a definition of Faith and Church also? 

Am I getting my point across?


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## Pilgrim's Progeny (Jan 12, 2012)

PuritanCovenanter said:


> Jesus came to abolish religion? This poor soul needs to square up his terminology on a few different levels. To start with he needs to know what religion is and what it isn't. I suspect he might have many other issues also. This young man seems to not understand that there is true religion in comparison to false religion. Only a novice would say that Christianity isn't a religion. There are many religious beliefs and religions. This pompous kid wants to start his own epistemological reference point. He is the definer of what is and isn't. Wow, that must be pretty cool. I guess he is on the level of God in giving words their meaning now.



I had a burst of anger that raised up in my breast as I watched the video as well.

The sad thing is that you this "pompous" rhetoric is all too common.

It sort of reminds me me of the following parable


> And he spake this parable unto certain which trusted in themselves that they were righteous, and despised others: *10* Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican. *11* The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men _are_, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican. *12* I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess. *13* And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as _his_ eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner. *14* I tell you, this man went down to his house justified _rather_ than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted. Luke 18:9-14 (KJV)




You know, a possible third man at the temple saying, "Thank you, I am not like the Pharisees . . ."


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## steadfast7 (Jan 12, 2012)

The institutional church is by no means perfect. Lots of terrible things happening and lots of people getting hurt - what else do you expect from an organization made up of sinners? However, once this guy condemns and separates himself from institutional religion, I'd be curious to know where he plans on going.

"He does not call God his Father, who does not call the Church his mother." - St. Cyprian.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2012)

It's unfortunate that this trendy, non-traditional definition of 'religion' detracts from what is ultimately being meant. He is a talented brother who made this video with good intentions, but the truth he means to convey suffers from inaccuracies.


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## steadfast7 (Jan 12, 2012)

On a positive note, though, I was alerted to this video from a coworker, who is an unbeliever. The video went viral on her facebook feeds, so it's a good opener to religious conversation. Praise God.


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## kvanlaan (Jan 12, 2012)

This is a very popular concept these days:

» Home THE END OF RELIGION: ENCOUNTERING THE SUBVERSIVE SPIRITUALITY OF Jesus


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## Semper Fidelis (Jan 12, 2012)

_False_ religion is the invention of idolatrous mind and, in his condemnation of some forms of idolatry, he has created his own. He makes statements throughout about how men ought to be treating neighbor and worshipping Christ and so makes statements about what is proper religion.

He seems like a nice young man who is earnestly seeking the Truth but he needs some better mentors. Part of denying self is dealing with the realities of any group when sinners saved by grace start congregating. It's tempting to say that _their_ problem is X but selflessness demands a religion that is not schismatic.


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## Rufus (Jan 12, 2012)

Didn't the revivalists of the 1910's-20's speak of getting back to "Old Time Religion"? Also didn't "having religion" mean something particularly years ago? (Both rhetorical questions)


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Jan 12, 2012)

PuritanCovenanter said:


> By the way this young man talks, we should probably relegate the word faith to obscurity also. There is true faith and false faith. Christianity is a religion of faith in Christ. If you were to tell an atheist that Christianity wasn't a world religion you would be laughed at. The word religion is not a bad word as this person is making it out to be. This kind of stuff just makes me sick and makes Christians look mindless. I use to hear this tripe from people who mostly despised authority but wanted to claim Christ. Jesus and me stuff. He says that he loves the Church. But which Church does he love? What does he mean by Church? What is his reference point for defining that? Maybe I should rely upon him for a definition of Faith and Church also?


Stop beating around the bush and tell us what you really feel, brother. 

I agree with you. I frequently run into the "Jesus hates religion" bit when encountering vitriolic open theists and anti-Calvinists who are quick to conclude anything but what they believe is "man made" or "philosophical". It is a well-worn canard that needs to be denounced.

AMR


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## Christusregnat (Jan 12, 2012)

> Nor can that practice be right and saving which is not directed by knowledge (Jn. 17:3). Hence Lactantius says, 'Religion should not be received without wisdom, nor is wisdom without religion to be approved' (Lactantius, Divine Institutes 1.1 [FC 49:20; PL 6.119]; and 'all the wisdom of man is in this one thing, that he may know and worship God' (ibid., 3.30* [FC 49:243; PL 6.444]); and 'religion cannot be separated from wisdom nor wisdom from religion because it is the same God who ought both to be known (which is wisdom) and to be worshipped (which is religion); but wisdom precedes and religion follows because we must first know God in order to worship him. So in the two words there is the same force, although they may seem to be different; for the one is placed in the sense, the other in acts, yet they are like two streams flowing from one fountain' (ibid., 4.4 [FC 49:251-52; PL 6.456-57]). (5) The end is the happiness of man which consists partly in the vision and partly in the fruition of God, from each of which arises assimilation to him (Jn. 13:17).



Francis Turretin, Institutes, 1:21.


I think Turretin and Lactantius are on the right track here.


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## JimmyH (Jan 12, 2012)

Since all true believers are, whether they know it or not, part of the body of Christ, it seems to me that if he really is of the elect, he is misguided. OTOH, I wonder if his passive/aggressive video isn't just self promotion. He begins with some very controversial statements which would make the viewer think he is an atheist and then goes on to proclaim his faith in Jesus Christ. His alleged faith is belied by his lumping all of the body of Christ into "religion" rather than specifying exactly which spoke of the wheel he is referring to. Just my take on it.


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## Philip (Jan 12, 2012)

Can I get someone to define "religion" here, in the old sense?


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## Christusregnat (Jan 12, 2012)

Turretin's citation of Lactantius seems to be on point for defining religion.


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## gordo (Jan 12, 2012)

PuritanCovenanter said:


> Jesus came to abolish religion? This poor soul needs to square up his terminology on a few different levels. To start with he needs to know what religion is and what it isn't. I suspect he might have many other issues also. This young man seems to not understand that there is true religion in comparison to false religion. Only a novice would say that Christianity isn't a religion. There are many religious beliefs and religions. This pompous kid wants to start his own epistemological reference point. He is the definer of what is and isn't. Wow, that must be pretty cool. I guess he is on the level of God in giving words their meaning now. Jesus came to save and seek. That is true. He didn't come to abolish religion. He came to establish His Kingdom and reconcile us to God so that we could perform our duty to God and be righteous.
> 
> (Jas 1:26) If any man among you seem to be religious, and bridleth not his tongue, but deceiveth his own heart, this man's religion is vain.
> 
> ...



Great post!


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## JS116 (Jan 12, 2012)

I think Louis Berkhof summarized religion in the best way here in the Introductory chapter of his book A Summery of Christian Doctrine





> 1. The Nature of Religion
> 
> The Bible informs us that man was created in the image of God. When he fell in sin, he did not entirely cease to be the image-bearer of the Most High. The seed of religion is still present in all men, though their sinful nature constantly reacts against it. Missionaries testify to the presence of religion in some form or other among all the nations and tribes of the earth. It is one of the greatest blessings of mankind, though many denounce it as a curse. Not only does it touch the deepest springs of man's life, but it also controls his thoughts and feelings and desires.
> 
> ...


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## PuritanCovenanter (Jan 12, 2012)

Pilgrim's Progeny said:


> I had a burst of anger that raised up in my breast as I watched the video as well.
> 
> The sad thing is that you this "pompous" rhetoric is all too common.
> 
> ...



Paul, I am not mad at the kid. I have to admit that I find his confusion is rather distasteful and reeks of ignorance. This young man's rhetoric is bombastic and uneducated. Thus the reference to him being pompous. He is standing over the Church proclaiming anathema's but the very foundation he is starting from is so incorrect. He is acting as an authority on the issues he is discussing but his foundation and zealous reaction reminds me of the passage that "he has a zeal for God, but not according to knowledge." He is actually making Christianity look unintelligent. That along with his semi rap attitude and delivery just seems to be a bit overboard. So if you want to accuse me of being the third man in the room saying I am not like this pharisee, I would humbly appreciate you showing me what that really means. As you know I am not above being wrong and I believe you have corrected me before. I am open to correction and repentance when I am wrong.


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## Jack K (Jan 12, 2012)

"Religion" in the new sense (the sense understood by most non-PB folks in Western societies today) means doing your best to follow a set of principles that will win points with God or bring you some spiritual enlightenment. Understood that way—the way _most_ people we know use the word most often today—Jesus is indeed against "religion." And it can be of great help to say this when explaining your faith to people.

When we've had discussions about this here in the past, there've always been many who resist giving in to this definition of "religion." They want to preserve a better one. I can see their point. There've also been some who object to the idea that "Christianity is not religion" on the grounds that it smells antinomian or probably reflects shallow thinking of some sort. No doubt it does for some who use the line.

But the importance of speaking to others about Christ in _their_ language, the way they use it and understand it, should not be undervalued. Likewise, the importance of showing that faith in Christ must never be about winning points with God—that, in fact, it is the very opposite of this—cannot be overstressed. So I'm generally okay with the language that Jesus brought Good News, not "religion." I've used such lines myself (always explaining further what I mean).

That said, the particular example in the link is probably not as well thought out or expressed as it should be.


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## Philip (Jan 12, 2012)

Jack, I think you've hit on the central confusion, which is that "religion" here doesn't necessarily mean what the Bible means when it uses the word. The ordinary use of the word has become exactly that which Christianity stands opposed to: works done to win points with God.


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## JS116 (Jan 12, 2012)

I really wasnt too upset about this video until this morning,then I saw the reaction from the people on all the networking sites.This guy really does not see what a mess he has gotten himself and others into...

I praise God for the reformation and it the true reformed churches we have today for being faithful to God and his word standing against postmodernism.

Nonetheless Jack you are right..it's just that this causing the wrong kind of uprising between christians and non christians ,all because he was careless with his words.

---------- Post added at 01:11 PM ---------- Previous post was at 12:52 PM ----------

I feel alot better now..I think he goes to Mark Driscolls church,that explains alot.


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## Pilgrim's Progeny (Jan 12, 2012)

PuritanCovenanter said:


> Pilgrim's Progeny said:
> 
> 
> > I had a burst of anger that raised up in my breast as I watched the video as well.
> ...



Randy,

I should be corrected by you here!(as I have in times past) I regret that I wrote in such a way as to make you think I was correcting you.

Actually, I was comparing the speaker to a possible third man at the temple. 

I think you were pretty "spot on" in your comment.


I hope that clears it up. And, thank you for giving me a chance to make this right, brother.


Now, the anger I spoke of:



PuritanCovenanter said:


> a burst of anger that raised up in my breast as I watched the video



This has more to do with my own experience, I can literally taste this rhetoric, as I have used similar. This way of speaking alienates so much of the body of Christ, and does more harm than good. Sadly, I know first hand.


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## J. Dean (Jan 12, 2012)

I watched the video and commented directly on the site, echoing what most of you said: I like the thrust of the video, and the emphasis on grace in particular, but the author needs to be clear about what he means by "religion." If he means hypocrisy or external works righteousness, bravo and kudos to him. If he means churches that don't use services with rock music, emotionalism, or hyped up altar calls, then he's wrong and judgmental.


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## athanatos (Jan 12, 2012)

I was going to post about this myself! Well, he's my video response
[video=youtube;TZpxnT706pc]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TZpxnT706pc[/video]


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## JS116 (Jan 13, 2012)

The guy who made the video I guess is hearing the good and bad effects of his video.Here is what he wrote on Facebook today..




> If you are using my video to bash "the church" be careful. I was in no way intending to do that. My heart came from trying to highlight and expose legalism and hypocrisy. The Church is Jesus' bride so be careful how you speak of His wife. If a normal dude has right to get pissed when you bash His wife, it makes me tremble to think how great the weight is when we do it to Jesus' wife. The church is His vehicle to reach a lost word. A hospital for sinners. Saying you love Jesus but hate the Church, is like a fiancé saying he loves his future bride, but hates her kids. We are all under grace. Look to Him.



I must admit,I was going back and forth for a while on how I should respond.Part of me said "He's totally wrong and ignorant about what true and false religion is and is misrepresenting Christianity!" another part or me was saying "I was once there,zealous for Jesus but no self-control with use of my tongue speaking on matters I knew little about about,he's wrong on some points but I can tell he does love God and he is a brother"..God has to work on me just as he has to work on this brother,maybe me even more.


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## Philip (Jan 13, 2012)

My hangup is not with his theology (which is actually very good) but his terminology. Calling the stuff he condemns "religion" is the problem. "Churchianity," "_Sola Bootstrapsa_," hypocrisy, all of these would be wonderful terms. My objection is not substantive but semantic.


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## GulfCoast Presbyterian (Jan 13, 2012)

Sola Bootstrapa! That's awesome. I am borrowing that one.


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## RobertPGH1981 (Jan 13, 2012)

Jack K said:


> "Religion" in the new sense (the sense understood by most non-PB folks in Western societies today) means doing your best to follow a set of principles that will win points with God or bring you some spiritual enlightenment. Understood that way—the way most people we know use the word most often today—Jesus is indeed against "religion." And it can be of great help to say this when explaining your faith to people.





I think this is what he had his mind on. Plus if you talk to non-christians that is probably how they would define religion. That is how all other "religions" outside of Christianity claim you can be accepted by God. I would say anything posted on YouTube would be for a secular audience. So when you do not define words and phrases you have to use how the world would define it.


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## PuritanCovenanter (Jan 13, 2012)

Most of the people that I have encountered through the years equate religion with the organized church (religion as they put it). They don't have a problem with Jesus. They have a problem with organized religion. What that mostly entails is a sloppy understanding of the Church as an organism and a hatred for authority. I had a friend post to me on facebook that, "I am my own religion." This person claims Christ. YUK!


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## J. Dean (Jan 13, 2012)

Here's a blog that dealt with it. Interesting take. Why I Love (True) Religion Because I Love Jesus « Roads from Emmaus

Edit: the blogger critiquing the video seems to be Arminian, so watch out for the "cooperating grace" stuff in his response. But he does nail a lot of it on the head.


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## JStone (Jan 13, 2012)

To be fair, he uses the term "false religion" in his own description of the video. But yeah, lots of problems here.


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## seajayrice (Jan 13, 2012)

Did this fellow mention he loves God's people? The poem seems to typify that individualistic evangelism one find so common in the church.


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## J. Dean (Jan 13, 2012)

seajayrice said:


> Did this fellow mention he loves God's people? The poem seems to typify that individualistic evangelism one find so common in the church.


I think that, if I remember correctly, he does proclaim that he loves the church.


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## Zach (Jan 13, 2012)

Kevin DeYoung also wrote a very good response.

Does Jesus Hate Religion? Kinda, Sorta, Not Really.


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## JohnGill (Jan 13, 2012)

I think it demonstrates the need in modern Christendom for catechistic teaching.


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## Philip (Jan 13, 2012)

J. Dean said:


> Here's a blog that dealt with it. Interesting take. Why I Love (True) Religion Because I Love Jesus « Roads from Emmaus



This response was from an Eastern Orthodox priest, and I felt that much of it, as a result, failed to appreciate the context into which Mr. Bethke is speaking (presumably conservative evangelical Protestant Churchianity). Rev. DeYoung's article is a more relevant one for this reason.


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## Jack K (Jan 13, 2012)

Zach said:


> Kevin DeYoung also wrote a very good response.
> 
> Does Jesus Hate Religion? Kinda, Sorta, Not Really.



Yes, a good response. Well worth reading if this video interests you.


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## Zach (Jan 13, 2012)

P. F. Pugh said:


> J. Dean said:
> 
> 
> > Here's a blog that dealt with it. Interesting take. Why I Love (True) Religion Because I Love Jesus « Roads from Emmaus
> ...





Jack K said:


> Zach said:
> 
> 
> > Kevin DeYoung also wrote a very good response.
> ...



The more I read from Kevin DeYoung the more I appreciate his wisdom and presentation of Gospel truth. The way he handled this video is exactly how it should be handled.


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## Weston Stoler (Jan 14, 2012)

[Link removed by Moderator - due to Second Commandment violations.]

a word from the Lutheran. I actually enjoyed this


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## JohnGill (Jan 14, 2012)

JS116 said:


> I really wasnt too upset about this video until this morning,then I saw the reaction from the people on all the networking sites.This guy really does not see what a mess he has gotten himself and others into...
> 
> I praise God for the reformation and it the true reformed churches we have today for being faithful to God and his word standing against postmodernism.
> 
> ...



I was told by a friend today, who regrettably attends Driscoll's church, that Bethke does attend there as well. I made the mistake of posting James 1:26,27 as a response to my friend's posting of the video. The response was saddening, "I side with Jesus." I keep praying that my friend will attend a different church. The more I read about Driscoll's teaching the more worried I become for my friend.


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## Weston Stoler (Jan 14, 2012)

JohnGill said:


> JS116 said:
> 
> 
> > I really wasnt too upset about this video until this morning,then I saw the reaction from the people on all the networking sites.This guy really does not see what a mess he has gotten himself and others into...
> ...



I wouldn't worry so much, yeah driscoll is non-orthodox in a lot of issues however for the most part he preaches truth. I attended his church this summer while in Seattle while a counselor at a camp (out of 3 choices it was the closest to Calvinism I could get) and I was fed.


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## JohnGill (Jan 14, 2012)

Weston Stoler said:


> JohnGill said:
> 
> 
> > JS116 said:
> ...



Next time your there let me know, a friend of mine's dad is a Reformed pastor. 

The videos I've seen of Driscoll are what worry me. God's word should not be so trivialized.


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## Weston Stoler (Jan 14, 2012)

JohnGill said:


> Weston Stoler said:
> 
> 
> > JohnGill said:
> ...



The problem is I have to go where the other people go. Or else I would need a ride.
I will probably be there this summer
Anyways, I don't believe he misuses the word on purpose. Piper should call him out on some of these things since he tends to respect him.


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## JM (Jan 14, 2012)

My favourite Lutheran minister has done a freestyle of his own. The video is jerky and he will sometimes throw images of Christ into them so what with this in mind.

Jesus = Religion

[Link removed by Moderator for Second Commandment violations.]


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## AThornquist (Jan 14, 2012)

Following Up on the Jesus/Religion Video – Kevin DeYoung


Here is a follow-up blog post from Kevin DeYoung that highlights the young man's humility in accepting correction. He's apparently not as arrogant as some people make him out to be.


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## GulfCoast Presbyterian (Jan 14, 2012)

Very gracious on both their parts.


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## Unoriginalname (Jan 14, 2012)

AThornquist said:


> Following Up on the Jesus/Religion Video – Kevin DeYoung
> 
> 
> Here is a follow-up blog post from Kevin DeYoung that highlights the young man's humility in accepting correction. He's apparently not as arrogant as some people make him out to be.



That's awesome thanks for posting that.


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## Zach (Jan 14, 2012)

It's great to see two brothers in Christ interacting with each other with grace and love. In an age where it's so easy to sit behind a computer screen and call people out and try to win arguments it is very refreshing.


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## athanatos (Jan 14, 2012)

I am impressed with Bethke's timely, humble response; not surprised by DeYoung's critique (calm, appropriate, Biblical, pursuasive), even though DeYoung sees his tone and approach as a high-point not a typical point.


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## JM (Jan 14, 2012)

For a Lutheran response see Revfiskj video on YouTube.


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## PuritanCovenanter (Jan 14, 2012)

I really am grateful for the wonderful interaction and spirit Mr. Bethke expressed in corresponding with Kevin DeYoung. May we all be as teachable. Thanks for posting the follow up Andrew.


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## dudley (Jan 16, 2012)

*I say Amen to our brother Jack K. in all he said in his post on this thread and I add*



Jack K said:


> "Religion" in the new sense (the sense understood by most non-PB folks in Western societies today) means doing your best to follow a set of principles that will win points with God or bring you some spiritual enlightenment. Understood that way—the way _most_ people we know use the word most often today—Jesus is indeed against "religion." And it can be of great help to say this when explaining your faith to people.
> 
> When we've had discussions about this here in the past, there've always been many who resist giving in to this definition of "religion." They want to preserve a better one. I can see their point. There've also been some who object to the idea that "Christianity is not religion" on the grounds that it smells antinomian or probably reflects shallow thinking of some sort. No doubt it does for some who use the line.
> 
> ...



I say Amen to our brother Jack K. in all he said in his post on this thread. I especially agree when he said “ So I'm generally okay with the language that Jesus brought Good News, not "religion." I've used such lines myself (always explaining further what I mean).

The New Testament Gospels, Letters and Books demonstrate in every way that Jesus saw the old laws and its rules as not the essential message God wished to convey in sending His son to be the messiah. The new Testament is not about organized institutional religion and all the laws of the many books of the Old Testament. Instead Jesus in all the Gospels tells us that God wishes us to be like His son and Love the Lord your God with your whole heart and soul and Love your neighbor as thyself.

Love everyone, forgive everyone, and only do good.

Luke 6:27-28 “But I tell you who hear me: Love your enemies, do good to those who hate you, bless those who curse you, pray for those who mistreat you.” that is a substantial message of the New Testament. 

With the coming of Christ, God has established a new covenant with mankind. Jesus and His apostles gave us a radically new understanding of the true intent of the Old Testament Law; they brought a new era of the rule of love for all people and spiritual truth instead of rule by law Luke 10:25-28, John 13:34-35

Luke 10:25-28 (New International Version)
The Parable of the Good Samaritan
25 On one occasion an expert in the law stood up to test Jesus. “Teacher,” he asked, “what must I do to inherit eternal life?” 
26 “What is written in the Law?” he replied. “How do you read it?” 
27 He answered, “‘Love the Lord your God with all your heart and with all your soul and with all your strength and with all your mind’[a]; and, ‘Love your neighbor as yourself.’*” 
28 “You have answered correctly,” Jesus replied. “Do this and you will live.” 

Jesus wanted us to be His disciples and spread the Good news , not be as the old testament of laws and organized religion. I will note I left the roman catholic church and become a reformed protestant because the RC church in my experience is like the old churches of organized= religion , following many laws but not living as the disciples of the Lord which I believe is what the Reformed faith is all about; not an organized religion as the Jews knew it; but living the teachings of Jesus about Love and the spirit of the law.

John 13:34-35 (New International Version)
34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” 
Ephesians 2:14-18 (New International Version)
14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two groups one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by setting aside in his flesh the law with its commands and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new humanity out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit. 

John 13:34-35 (New International Version)
34 “A new command I give you: Love one another. As I have loved you, so you must love one another. 35 By this everyone will know that you are my disciples, if you love one another.” 

The teachings of Jesus, the Council of Jerusalem, and other New Testament teachings make it clear that Christians are not required to follow the Old Testament rules about crimes and punishments, warfare, slavery, diet, circumcision, sacrifice, feast days, Sabbath observance, ritual cleanness, etc.

Christians still look to the Old Testament scripture for moral and spiritual guidance. (2 Timothy 3:16-17). But when there seems to be a conflict between Old Testament laws and New Testament principles, we must follow the New Testament because it represents the most recent and most perfect revelation from God (Hebrews 8:13, 2 Corinthians 3:1-18, Galatians 2:15-20).

2 Timothy 3:16-17 (New International Version)
16 All Scripture is God-breathed and is useful for teaching, rebuking, correcting and training in righteousness, 17 so that the servant of God[a] may be thoroughly equipped for every good work. 
Footnotes: 
2 Timothy 3:17 Or that you, a man of God, 

Hebrews 8:13 (New International Version)
13 By calling this covenant “new,” he has made the first one obsolete; and what is obsolete and outdated will soon disappear. 

However, freedom from the Old Testament Law is not a license for Christians to relax their moral standards. The moral and ethical teachings of Jesus and His apostles call for even greater self-discipline than those of the Old Testament. The organized church as Jesus intended is there for moral guidance. 

Corinthians 3:1-18 (New International Version)
2 Corinthians 3
1 Are we beginning to commend ourselves again? Or do we need, like some people, letters of recommendation to you or from you? 2 You yourselves are our letter, written on our hearts, known and read by everyone. 3 You show that you are a letter from Christ, the result of our ministry, written not with ink but with the Spirit of the living God, not on tablets of stone but on tablets of human hearts. 
4 Such confidence we have through Christ before God. 5 Not that we are competent in ourselves to claim anything for ourselves, but our competence comes from God. 6 He has made us competent as ministers of a new covenant—not of the letter but of the Spirit; for the letter kills, but the Spirit gives life. 
The Greater Glory of the New Covenant
7 Now if the ministry that brought death, which was engraved in letters on stone, came with glory, so that the Israelites could not look steadily at the face of Moses because of its glory, transitory though it was, 8 will not the ministry of the Spirit be even more glorious? 9 If the ministry that brought condemnation was glorious, how much more glorious is the ministry that brings righteousness! 10 For what was glorious has no glory now in comparison with the surpassing glory. 11 And if what was transitory came with glory, how much greater is the glory of that which lasts! 
12 Therefore, since we have such a hope, we are very bold. 13 We are not like Moses, who would put a veil over his face to prevent the Israelites from seeing the end of what was passing away. 14 But their minds were made dull, for to this day the same veil remains when the old covenant is read. It has not been removed, because only in Christ is it taken away. 15 Even to this day when Moses is read, a veil covers their hearts. 16 But whenever anyone turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away. 17 Now the Lord is the Spirit, and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is freedom. 18 And we all, who with unveiled faces contemplate[a] the Lord’s glory, are being transformed into his image with ever-increasing glory, which comes from the Lord, who is the Spirit. 
Footnotes: 
2 Corinthians 3:18 Or reflect 
New International Version (NIV)

Galatians 2:15-20 (New International Version)
15 “We who are Jews by birth and not sinful Gentiles 16 know that a person is not justified by the works of the law, but by faith in Jesus Christ. So we, too, have put our faith in Christ Jesus that we may be justified by faith in[a] Christ and not by the works of the law, because by the works of the law no one will be justified. 
17 “But if, in seeking to be justified in Christ, we Jews find ourselves also among the sinners, doesn’t that mean that Christ promotes sin? Absolutely not! 18 If I rebuild what I destroyed, then I really would be a lawbreaker. 
19 “For through the law I died to the law so that I might live for God. 20 I have been crucified with Christ and I no longer live, but Christ lives in me. The life I now live in the body, I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me. 
Footnotes: 
Galatians 2:16 Or but through the faithfulness of … justified on the basis of the faithfulness of 

I end by again reiterating what Jesus said through the new testament. “I live by faith in the Son of God, who loved me and gave himself for me“.*


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## PuritanCovenanter (Jan 16, 2012)

dudley said:


> With the coming of Christ, God has established a new covenant with mankind. Jesus and His apostles gave us a radically new understanding of the true intent of the Old Testament Law; they brought a new era of the rule of love for all people and spiritual truth instead of rule by law Luke 10:25-28, John 13:34-35



Please read the following link brother. I am not so sure Jesus gave us a radically new understanding as much as he corrected the corrupted understanding that had developed. 
_Eschatological Fulfilment and the Confirmation of Mosaic Law_ (2002)
A Response to D. A. Carsonl

A young man and friend wrote this. 



> http://davidpulliam.blogspot.com/2012/01/is-Jesus-against-religion.html
> 
> Jesus, the God-man, was a religious man. He followed the Old Testament laws perfectly. This is why he is a perfect sacrifice for us sinners, He fulfilled the law. Bethke takes Old Testament Judaism and frames it in the context of modern Christianity. Using this picture, he bashes and tears modern Christianity down using Jesus' words.
> 
> ...


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## Jack K (Jan 16, 2012)

dudley said:


> Jack K said:
> 
> 
> > "Religion" in the new sense (the sense understood by most non-PB folks in Western societies today) means doing your best to follow a set of principles that will win points with God or bring you some spiritual enlightenment. Understood that way—the way _most_ people we know use the word most often today—Jesus is indeed against "religion." And it can be of great help to say this when explaining your faith to people.
> ...



Thank you, Dudley, for your kind words. I always appreciate your desire to encourage the rest of us and your zeal for the gospel.

I do think we need to be careful, though, NOT to suggest that by proclaiming "good news" Jesus was introducing something totally unforeseen or declaring that the law revealed in the Old Testament did not reflect the true heart of God. I would say the Old Testament law, when properly understood and followed, never was "religion" in the bad sense we've been discussing here. God has never wanted his people to relate to him by winning points for following his rules. Not in Old Testament times, and not today.

I guess this is a good example of why it's always good to clarify and explain when using the word "religion" these days.


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## ooguyx (Jan 16, 2012)

I think that views such as this "I'm for Jesus, not religion" is the natural logical conclusion to the non-demoninational movement. It's a movement away from true religion into fractured Jesus-ists. The guy in this video simply has his terms mixed up, but it won't be long before the terms will just be redefined and then used in just this way to promote a move away from the church in an effort to be more Christ-like. Much like Driscoll's "Jesus is the head pastor" routine.


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