# Favorite Historians



## SolaScriptura (May 3, 2004)

I really enjoy reading Mark Noll.
I also like Tom Nettles. But his niche is Baptist history.
I have enjoyed reading through Schaff's set. That has been a surprisingly enjoyable read.


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## Preach (May 3, 2004)

Last night (Sunday on cspan booknotes) they had an indepth interview (the first Sunday of each month are the in-depth interviews-I think 3 hours). The British historian's name is Niall Fergusson. Has anyone heard of him. He writes from a British perspective on the recurring theme as the United States as an empire. I think he jas written about five books on the subject. It seemed fascination, especially his advocacy of Americam imperialism (learning from the British mistakes-especially the strong analogy of Britian's post ww1 liberation attempts in Iraq, and the United States attempt today).


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## yeutter (May 3, 2004)

*Historian*

The secular historian that has been most helpful to me through the years is the Roman Catholic, Russell Kirk.

Two 20th Century Church Historians have done much to shape my thought; the Lutheran, John Warwick Montgomery, and a Presbyterian, John H. Gerstner.


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## lkjohnson (May 3, 2004)

On the secular side, Will Durant can't be beat.


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## fredtgreco (May 3, 2004)

For church matters, Iain Murray

For ancient history, J.B. Bury.

For ancients themselves, Thucydides, Livy and Tacitus.


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## Puritan Sailor (May 3, 2004)

Iain Murray
Merle d'Aubinge


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## RamistThomist (Jun 2, 2004)

For Contemporary American History with Religous overtones, I go with George Marsden and Mark Noll.

For Post Reformation: Ian Murray

For the Reformation: I have not yet read D'aubigne so I will have to go with Roland Bainton and Williston Walker

For General Reads: Bruce Shelley, Walker, and Justo Gonzalez.

Secular: Catholic Historian Paul Johnson


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## a mere housewife (Jun 2, 2004)

I have a question, if I can ask it in here:
How do you deal with the terrible things in history? I love history, but it's very difficult for me to read it because it isn't like fiction, where the awful things aren't real. And my foray into the ancients was even more unbearable: I had to stop reading Tacitus because I don't know how to deal with the almost glib accounts of suffering. I have never made it through Foxe's Book of Martyrs. I avoid the news for the same reason. How can I do better about this? It makes me wish the world had never come into existence, which I know is very wrong. I understand that we were created to glorify God-- that His eternal blessedness is the point, and not our misery: but I think I may not grasp as I ought to how misery that doesn't conform us to the image of Christ can glorify Him.
It also makes me feel guilty that I have Christ, and so much earthly ease, too, when so many masses of people have neither-- only nothing, and pain.


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## Me Died Blue (Jun 3, 2004)

I second the mention of Mark Noll. Josephus is obviously a good secular corroboration for the accurate history of the New Testament accounts. Another valuable Christian writer of historical fiction is Paul Maier, author of [i:5d6ec1252d]Pontius Pilate[/i:5d6ec1252d] which is a good fictional depiction of the biblical lands in the first century, and can be very educational.

[quote:5d6ec1252d][i:5d6ec1252d]Originally posted by a mere housewife[/i:5d6ec1252d]
I have a question, if I can ask it in here:
How do you deal with the terrible things in history? I love history, but it's very difficult for me to read it because it isn't like fiction, where the awful things aren't real. And my foray into the ancients was even more unbearable: I had to stop reading Tacitus because I don't know how to deal with the almost glib accounts of suffering. I have never made it through Foxe's Book of Martyrs. I avoid the news for the same reason. How can I do better about this? It makes me wish the world had never come into existence, which I know is very wrong. I understand that we were created to glorify God-- that His eternal blessedness is the point, and not our misery: but I think I may not grasp as I ought to how misery that doesn't conform us to the image of Christ can glorify Him.
It also makes me feel guilty that I have Christ, and so much earthly ease, too, when so many masses of people have neither-- only nothing, and pain. [/quote:5d6ec1252d]

I think that one way God uses the great extent of the turmoil and suffering for His glory and our good is that it forces us to have more real faith in Him - not based on any knowledge, but simply faith. Furthermore, without all the horrible tragedy and abomination that exists in the world, the new life we have in Christ would not be [i:5d6ec1252d]nearly[/i:5d6ec1252d] as precious.

Also, with regard to feeling guilty because of the grace we have been shown, I think we need to remember two things. [b:5d6ec1252d]First[/b:5d6ec1252d], we should always remind ourselves that we are clothed in Christ, and are thus spotless and pure no matter what our hearts say to us. &quot;There is therefore now no condemnation for those who are in Christ Jesus&quot; (Romans 8:1, ESV). &quot;For whenever our heart condemns us, God is greater than our heart, and he knows everything&quot; (1 John 3:20, ESV). [b:5d6ec1252d]Second[/b:5d6ec1252d], truly realizing in our hearts how unworthy we are of what we're been given, and how we are no more deserving of it than others - this should be viewed as an opportunity, an opportunity to gain greater humility, and thus appreciate all the more God's grace to save a wretch like us.

In Christ,

Chris


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## a mere housewife (Jun 3, 2004)

Chris, thank you for what you said. It is very helpful.


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## crhoades (Jun 3, 2004)

*Historians*

Edward Gibbons' 6 vol. Decline and Fall of Roman Empire is excellent
Michael Grant for a good read through Greek and Roman times.
Frederick Copelston's work on the History of Philosophy is incredible
Phillip Benedict has an outstanding book on the History of Calvinism - Christ's Churches Purely Reformed: A Social History of Calvinism
D.G. Hart for things Presbyterian...

Still thinking...

Chris Rhoades


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## RamistThomist (Jun 4, 2004)

Of course, for poetic prose on the reformation:
Roland Bainton's [i:b56f111ff5]Here I Stand[/i:b56f111ff5] is phenomenal. It has left such an impact on me that I can quote large chunks of it. 
I do not agree with certain aspects of Luther's theology, but he is by far the most quotable of men.


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## dado6 (Jun 5, 2004)

I agree with lkjohnson. No author has written more entertainingly readable histories than Will Durant. His analysis is conventional and very superficial at times so you will not be surprised by any revelation, but you will get a tremendous breadth of info presented in a style that demands you to turn the page. His treatment of early Christianity (Vol 3) in general is almost laughable in its rehashing of the enlightenment framework of religious history, but he does write in such a way as to make the apostles and fathers seem like real folks. And I will give him kudos for spending time destroying 'Higher Criticism' in this volume as well (chapter 26). His treatment of the Reformation is considerably better (Vol 6). I was particularly impressed with his fair handling of Calvin and Servetus (chapter 21 sections 5,6 &amp; 7).

Durants books remain my first stop for any era of History.

Gibbons history is the best for the analysis of the complex politics of Europe up until the fall of Constantinople.

Paul Johnson offers some unique revisionist viewpoints in his History of Christianity. He virtually ignores theology, but shows like no other the profound influence the church had on Western history (basically it is why we have western civilization in the first place.). His secular stuff is top drawer as well, The Birth of the Modern, History of the American People and Modern Times are all excellent. All speak of the the influence that Christian morality has had on Western thought in areas like property rights, human rights, slavery and even war.

Thanks,
Rob


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