# How can God stop hating me?



## InSlaveryToChrist (May 14, 2011)

I have discovered a place in my heart that does not approve of the fact that God's wrath against sinners was ceased because of someone else taking the wrath on himself. And this is because I don't understand God's justice. It does not seem right to me. In all my attemps to accept God's justice, I cannot help ending up with the notion that God is just keeping his promise in not pouring his wrath on me, but that otherwise he would surely attack me. So, I'm scared and cannot delight in a God like that. God's justice in the Atonement is just too good to be true! It's unbelievable! How could God stop hating me, although I keep living in sin? How could God delight in me, because of someone else taking my guilt on himself? It drives me crazy!

Any recommendations on this specific topic? Your prayers are most appreciated!


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## Rufus (May 14, 2011)

I'm not an expert in theology but Jesus Christ the perfect sinless lamb and only begotten Son of God was put in your place as far as wrath is concerned, while you deserve punishment He did not. 



InSlaveryToChrist said:


> I cannot help ending up with the notion that God is just keeping his promise in not pouring his wrath on m



Gods wrath was satisfied, and God is both loving and patient towards you, in the same sense God also doesn't outright punish others in the world who are unsaved, its his patience.


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## Peairtach (May 14, 2011)

God loved you and sent Christ to die for you because He "already" loved you as a sinner "before" He gave Christ for you. 

E.g. A simple illustration from Scripture. God loved the Israelites first, therefore He provided the Passover Lamb.

Not only did the Father love you but the Son and the Spirit did, too.

*Ergo* they provided Christ.

It wasn't that they hated you from eternity and provided Christ to remove that hatred or to shield you from that hatred.

It was that they loved you from eternity although you are a sinner and therefore provided Christ to make it possible for that love to be expressed, communicated and completed.

God loves sinners. God's grace isn't equal to our sin but greater than it. 

He deals with it in reverse order to how it originally affected Man by 
(a) Removing its penalty in justification.
(b) Breaking its power over us in sanctification - a life long process.
(c) Removing its presence in perfection and glorification at death.


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## InSlaveryToChrist (May 14, 2011)

I made this thread in hope of finding a satisfactory perception of God's justice, but I think that was too much asked for... I think the Dutch lady, Corrie Ten Boom, was right, when she said,

"Faith sees the invicible,
believes *the unbelievable*,
and receives *the impossible*."

As mere creatures we are unable to comprehend the love of God and His justice. They both seem utterly unbelievable and impossible to us, yet they are true.

---------- Post added at 03:32 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:27 PM ----------

Thank you all for your passioned responses! I think I slipped over to my own understanding, instead of leaning to God's wisdom. Still, I would greatly appreciate your prayers! I've been feeling very empty and powerless lately.


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## Christopher88 (May 14, 2011)

Read chapter six of the Holiness of God by RC Sproul.

Justice is God's nature but so is mercy and grace. 

Also read Psalm 18. For it goes something like this: I have mercy on whom I have mercy, I have justice with those whom I have justice, I purify those who I purified. 

Your right, in questioning God's wrath , but your wrong when you accept Satan's lies on making God your enemy. Samuel, you are a son of the most High, and you will reign in His new Earth as heirs of Christ. (Spelling possibly wrong) 

Yes God's wrath is real, and His mercy should not be taken with a grain of salt, but we are made righteous by the blood shed that was on Calvary. God have given you grace, no you don't deserve it, in fact you deserve hell as do I, but God has elected us to save us from eternity apart from Him. So accept what you don't understand but know our God is both just and merciful.


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## InSlaveryToChrist (May 14, 2011)

Maybe I should have clarified that my problem was, not that God could love me sacrificially (although that's unbelievable, too), but that God could delight in me. I know it has nothing to do with MY merit and virtue. But the hard thing to believe is just the fact that I can clothe myself with Christ's righteousness and thus be the object of God's delight, although I'm a hell-deserving sinner.

---------- Post added at 03:51 PM ---------- Previous post was at 03:48 PM ----------




Sonny said:


> Read chapter six of the Holiness of God by RC Sproul.


 
Wow! I think I'm seeing God's providence here. I had stopped reading RC Sproul's book just at the end of the fifth chapter! Now I'm greatly encouraged to move on! =)


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## Christopher88 (May 14, 2011)

And to not embrace that truth of Christ redemption in your life, to not embrace God's delight in you as His child is a lie the evil one has placed in your heart. My brother in Christ, you are His and I pray against the spirit that has darkned your mind and heart to embrace the gospel. 
Yes its a hard concept to know in the battle, and I too struggle with it. But we must take those thoughts captive and have joy in the Salvation that was given to us. 

I lift you up in prayer right now.


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## InSlaveryToChrist (May 14, 2011)

Sonny said:


> And to not embrace that truth of Christ redemption in your life, to not embrace God's delight in you as His child is a lie the evil one has placed in your heart. My brother in Christ, you are His and I pray against the spirit that has darkned your mind and heart to embrace the gospel.
> Yes its a hard concept to know in the battle, and I too struggle with it. But we must take those thoughts captive and have joy in the Salvation that was given to us.
> 
> I lift you up in prayer right now.


 
Thank you, Brother. I'm very glad to hear it is just a lie from the Devil.


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## Christopher88 (May 14, 2011)

Galatians 4:7 So you are no longer a slave, but a son; and since you are a son, God has made you also an heir.
Romans 8:17 Now if we are children, then we are heirs--heirs of God and co-heirs with Christ, if indeed we share in his sufferings in order that we may also share in his glory.
Titus 3:7 so that, having been justified by his grace, we might become heirs having the hope of eternal life.

I'm glad the truth was spoken to you and to my self. May God's spirit always remind us when the evil one wishes to take hold of our thoughts. For by God's spirit we can captive the thoughts of the evil one by the truth of God which is our sword and shield.


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## deleteduser99 (May 14, 2011)

The reason is that to believe on the forgiveness of sin is an evangelical grace, like anything else. It is not something that the flesh likes to hear, because even the message of pure grace is repugnant to the flesh.

If you look in the Garden of Eden, after Adam and Eve had eaten the fruit, the first thing they did was run for God. You notice they made no applications for mercy, no appeals for forgiveness, because naturally the concept was lost on them. It was lost on Cain when he said, "The punishment is more than I can bear!" It was lost on Judas when he repented, returned the money, but then went and hung himself. That is, these men prove a point: that naturally, in the flesh, it is impossible to believe in the forgiveness of sin. Our flesh knows the law, it's written on our hearts (Romans 1:18-19), but there is nothing of the writing of grace on our hearts, and is something that comes completely from the outside.

All that to say, if you trace it down to its bottom, you will find that it comes down to unbelief. Even the believer has this Pharisee residing in his heart.

I have to fight my own unbelief from day to day and continually cast myself on Christ for forgiveness, and remind myself repeatedly that He is true to His Word.

Paul makes two great statements in Galatians: I Galatians 1:8-9, he emphatically says, "But even if we or an angel out of heaven should preach to you a Gospel other than the one we preached to you, let him be anathema!" Then he says in Galatians 2:20, after discoursing on justification by faith through Christ, he talks about Christ, "Who loved me and gave Himself on my behalf." That "loved me and gave Himself on my behalf" is an element of the very Gospel that Paul said there could never be another, nor could an angel from heaven come down and tell you otherwise.

A book that was supremely helpful to me was John Owen's Exposition of Psalm 130. Most of the book is based on 130:4, "But there is forgiveness with thee, that thou mayest be feared." He deals with the burden of sin on the conscience, the law written on the heart of man, why the flesh resists forgiveness, evidences of forgiveness (three or four chapters), hindrances to belief in forgiveness, and direction for (by the Spirit) knocking down hindrances to believing on forgiveness. For me, it was a book that I went a bit slowly through, but Owen writes it so well because he himself was in a condition for five years of a very bad struggle believing on forgiveness. I myself will probably pick it up again and review key parts of it. He does bring out the sweetness and pleasantly of the Gospel in this book too.

A helpful exercise for me was to take John 6, starting where the crowds went looking for Christ, and just slowly digest every verse. I think His words in John 6 are strongly encouraging for the one hungering and thirsting after God's righteousness. What it did for me, at least, was increase my belief in the solidity of His promise, and persuaded me of its infallible terms, and that there really is a perfect security in this covenant. Not only that, but you cannot help but see the love of God in the promises made in this discourse. He is the bread of life... I don't know why that imagery strikes me like nothing else. You eat and are revitalized; we feed on Christ, and are eternally revitalized!

Not only this, but Romans 7:1-6 was a productive meditation. It really is amazing grace to think that the Christian can be separated from the law, and that will actually free him up to be a Christian. At least for me, it helped reduce the terror of the law in my mind.

Corrie ten Boom was right; believing on forgiveness is impossible, impossibe for the flesh. Like everything else, it's something that we bring before the Father and seek the power of His Spirit. But by the Spirit, if we persist in battle, it _will_ lie dead and powerless at our feet.

I'm working through Luther's commentary on Galatians. It's not so much a commentary as it is a discourse on Galatians in its relation to the law-stricken and wounded conscience. I've finished his comments on the first chapter, gives me a lot of hope. In Luther's day, from what I read, he was hounded continuously with images of Christ as an angry law-giver, a second Moses, something he was happy that his own pupils did not have to endure; but that is not the Christ of the Bible, but an image by the hands of Satan. Christ truly is gracious beyond what we can conceive, and sympathizes with our weakness.

I hope this helps you. May God bless the things in this thread to you.


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## InSlaveryToChrist (May 14, 2011)

Harley said:


> The reason is that to believe on the forgiveness of sin is an evangelical grace, like anything else. It is not something that the flesh likes to hear, because even the message of pure grace is repugnant to the flesh.
> 
> If you look in the Garden of Eden, after Adam and Eve had eaten the fruit, the first thing they did was run for God. You notice they made no applications for mercy, no appeals for forgiveness, because naturally the concept was lost on them. It was lost on Cain when he said, "The punishment is more than I can bear!" It was lost on Judas when he repented, returned the money, but then went and hung himself. That is, these men prove a point: that naturally, in the flesh, it is impossible to believe in the forgiveness of sin. Our flesh knows the law, it's written on our hearts (Romans 1:18-19), but there is nothing of the writing of grace on our hearts, and is something that comes completely from the outside.
> 
> ...


 
This was mind-opening and encouraging! Thank you so much!


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## seajayrice (May 14, 2011)

Richard Tallach said:


> God loved you and sent Christ to die for you because He "already" loved you as a sinner "before" He gave Christ for you.
> 
> E.g. A simple illustration from Scripture. God loved the Israelites first, therefore He provided the Passover Lamb.
> 
> ...


 
 Rest assured, you have nothing to worry about.


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## deleteduser99 (May 16, 2011)

InSlaveryToChrist said:


> This was mind-opening and encouraging! Thank you so much!



Glad it was helpful to you. On that basis I only more recommend the works mentioned. Owen treats this subject of belief on forgiveness very well.

Remember that Christ is not another law-giver, but is the giver of life.


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## Peairtach (May 16, 2011)

As someone who suffered greatly from lack of assurance of faith in the past, I believe that much of it is due to a lack of appreciating and understanding what our Apostle says in Romans 6, that if we are in Christ we are no longer under law but under grace.

See e.g. Sinclair Ferguson's or John Piper's online sermons on Romans 6.


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