# The christian and martial arts ?



## Mayflower (Jan 29, 2009)

I have a daughter whwhom is almost 5 years old, and i know that she likes to do you a sport. Myself when i was young i did judo, jui-jitsu and teakwondo all martial arts.I was wondering what your thoughts are ? Can i send my daughter for martial arts or not not ? Iam struggeling with that, bcause i don't have a clear view about, so iam sorry for my igonorance ? Any help and thoughts are welcome.


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## sotzo (Jan 29, 2009)

Mayflower said:


> I have a daughter whwhom is almost 5 years old, and i know that she likes to do you a sport. Myself when i was young i did judo, jui-jitsu and teakwondo all martial arts.I was wondering what your thoughts are ? Can i send my daughter for martial arts or not not ? Iam struggeling with that, bcause i don't have a clear view about, so iam sorry for my igonorance ? Any help and thoughts are welcome.



The Bible is silent on this matter and I can see no Biblical principle that could be applied to this by "good and necessary consequence"....in light of that you are free to decide either way on this.


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## Kevin (Jan 29, 2009)

As long as you do not join a school that combines pagan ritual, with physical training. 

Some (few) martial arts schools do have a bit of pagan mumbo-jumbo, but in this day they are rare.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 29, 2009)

Like Kevin said, as long as there is no spiritual ceremony stuff. I actually teach the martial arts of Jeet Kune Do and Filipino Martial Arts(Kali), JKD and Kali schools practice no rituals, we just train for sport, self defence, excercise and fun.


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## matt01 (Jan 29, 2009)

Mayflower said:


> Can i send my daughter for martial arts or not not ?



Yes, you can enroll your daughter for martial arts. It could be a great way to increase physical conditioning, while giving instruction in discipline...We hope to enroll our eldest daughter when she is three years old.


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## OPC'n (Jan 29, 2009)

I too would like to hear more about this because I've heard some pretty gnarly stuff about doing it. I wanted to learn it but what I heard about it wasn't good. They said that even the moves were pagan-worship inspired....same with yoga.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 29, 2009)

Sarah there is a great school(I used to attend before I began to teach) kinda close to you, the web adress is theblastma.com There is no crazy pagan things there.


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## OPC'n (Jan 29, 2009)

charliejunfan said:


> Sarah there is a great school(I used to attend before I began to teach) kinda close to you, the web adress is theblastma.com There is no crazy pagan things there.



Cool! Now I can really cause damage!


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## larryjf (Jan 29, 2009)

I use the Bible to defend myself...of course, you have to get the metal ones for that...


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

Can you teach her? I'm sure there are fine places you could go but what better way to learn than from dear, old dad?


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## larryjf (Jan 29, 2009)

If you want to combine the martial arts with the metal Bible you can always get a little creative


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## Poimen (Jan 29, 2009)

larryjf said:


> If you want to combine the martial arts with the metal Bible you can always get a little creative



A new meaning to the term 'Bible thumper'.

You now have permission to groan.


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## LawrenceU (Jan 29, 2009)

Maybe you can find a Sambo or Krav Maga instructor. No religion required and very effective.


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

KrapMaga is not for kids and I would not recommend it for adults either.


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## Mayflower (Jan 29, 2009)

SemperEruditio said:


> KrapMaga is not for kids and I would not recommend it for adults either.



Why ?


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## PresbyDane (Jan 29, 2009)

larryjf said:


> If you want to combine the martial arts with the metal Bible you can always get a little creative



Cool I have to get a pair of those


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

Mayflower said:


> SemperEruditio said:
> 
> 
> > KrapMaga is not for kids and I would not recommend it for adults either.
> ...



The garbage they advocate is dangerous. The gun disarms are unrealistic and fall apart when practiced with someone who does not know how they are "supposed" to move. It's also a "by the numbers" kinda system but nothing in a real life altercation happens by the numbers.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 29, 2009)

Stick with Jeet Kune Do(bruce lee, bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), Filipino Kali(The Hunted, Bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), and Brazilian JuJitsu(UFC, MMA) mixed with Kino Mutai(art of breaking fingers, biting, and eye gouging)


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

charliejunfan said:


> Stick with Jeet Kune Do(bruce lee, bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), Filipino Kali(The Hunted, Bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), and Brazilian JuJitsu(UFC, MMA) mixed with Kino Mutai(art of breaking fingers, biting, and eye gouging)



His daughter is ALMOST five....


Now there's a martial art to teach people how to break fingers, bite, and eye gouge. I bet dollars to doughnuts you do not need to teach a five year old how to do these things. If anything we unlearn these skills of our naturally depraved nature but need a system in how is ridiculous. Again she is almost five and I am pretty certain he's not looking to make her into the next Bruce Lee Bourne fighting in the UFC gouging out some guys skull.....she's ALMOST five.


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## AThornquist (Jan 29, 2009)

"You stole my Pokemon card!" **breaks fingers**


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> "You stole my Pokemon card!" **breaks fingers**





...bites it off, then pokes & gouges out the kids eye with his own finger...


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## matthew11v25 (Jan 29, 2009)

I hear Aikido is good. Advocating skill similar to judo/jujitsu but with the intent to disarm the opponent without hurting them if possible. Supposedly law enforcement uses it frequently.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 29, 2009)

Yo Frank! I was not talking directly to the person who has a five year old! That is precisely the point of JKD, Kali, Kino Mutai, is to use what is natural to the human body, that way one does not have to stop and think of which art to use at certain times, it just flows because JKD, Kali, Kino Mutai are just "signs and seals" if you will, like Bruce Lee said, "Jeet Kune Do is just a boat(a framework made up of absorb what is useful, reject what is useless) to take across the river of knowledge(Martial Arts techniques and training methods needed to give one a well rounded base in the five ranges=Kicking, punching, trapping(clinch/infighting/limb immobilization), groundfighting, and weapons) once you are across the river (once you have a well rounded understanding of combat) the boat is no longer needed, so you discard it." In other words, if it were me, I would go from being just natural Charlie to Trained Charlie to natrual Charlie - Before I studied martial arts a kick was a kick and a punch a punch, once I studied martial arts a kick was more than a kick and a punch more than a punch, once I understood the martial arts a kick was just a kick and a punch just a punch. JKD, Kali, and BJJKM are the best simply because their concepts are that it is not technique that matters but attribute, I could learn all the Martial Arts techniques in the world but if I didn't have the necessary attributes behind them then they would be useless. We who teach JKD and the like try and utilize the most natural movements of the body, actually our core JKD system has only 8 moves(this system is used by over 50government agencies including the famous Navy Seal Team 6) So instead of starting people with how to punch properly we teach them to take that eye poke(eye jab, what have you) and develope the attributes behind it such as speed, quickness, nontelographicness, and so on. Any martial art can be used functionally if you spend enough time practicing, but only certain martial arts can be used functionally in hours rather than years. I was certified by Progressive Fighting Systems by Sifu Paul Vunak(2nd generation bruce lee student), in fact my name Charlie Barribeau is at the top of his instructors under him list at ---- fighting.net I used to have my website attached but I scrapped that one to make a better one, I will have it up soon.

Anyways, we have different body structures so everyone has to adapt any art to themselves in areas while also adapting themselves to the art, for instance, if someone had no left arm but they were doing ground fighting then they would have learn to use their legs and so on alot better. With a blind person, we would teach them to use sensativity to fight, NOT sight. We take from any martial art out there and try and mold it to our body types and certain of us favor this technique while the guy next to us discards it, it may sound "spiritual" but it is not it IS "philosophical". There was a more realistic and deep thinking Bruce Lee that people did not witness in his movies. 

It is a hacking away process, you clump on more clay only to strip it away revealing truth in combat or excercise or whatever. Sculpting away only to refine, reveal and perfect, its like sanctification lol.

SO FRANK!!! STOP BEING SO ONRY OR I'LL SHOW HOW EYE GOUGING IS DONE!!! JK brother lol !!!!!!!!?!!!!!!!!


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 29, 2009)

You lost quite a bit of credibility with the introduction of SEAL Team 6. Every system has been brought in by the Research & Development Team to see what it has to offer. That alone is grounds for the ambiguous statement that "our system has been used by Seal Team 6."

I thought Lee said to be like water...now JKD is a boat? When did this happen? 

I learned Contemporary Fighting Arts from Sammy Franco. He and Vunak know each other. I find it interesting how lineage is not only important in theology but also in martial arts. 

BTW you can't eye gouge me because I am wearing my motorcycle helmet.  Saw the PFS videotape 12 years ago.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 29, 2009)

WOW you're a real instegater aren't you, I only used the seals for the benefit of those who are not familiar with these things, since most respect the seals(I personally think they are nothing but brute force and weaponry). Yes Bruce said be like water, which simply meant, adapt to the opponent, use their own force against them, Bruce said that water can flow or drip or beat down violently, it can also take the form of whatever you put it in, it is one of the softest things in the world and yet it can penetrate rock.
This is an example from my favorite anime Cowboy Bebop [video=youtube;cc0Dkp0vJl8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cc0Dkp0vJl8[/video]

Using Cowboy Bebop again, this is how a JKD practioner wants to fight, Like water:
[video=youtube;_0WKeRcQdFg]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0WKeRcQdFg&feature=related[/video]

and one more with Dan Inosanto, Bruce's best student:
[video=youtube;13Ymvv-DE5I]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13Ymvv-DE5I[/video] (comedy-ish)


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## OPC'n (Jan 29, 2009)

How do you say uncle in Japanese?


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## AThornquist (Jan 29, 2009)

I don't think I can support a fighting style that trains using small Japanese people as punching bags. Hyper-calvinist punching bags, _maybe._


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## SpokenFor (Jan 30, 2009)

I must say I'm shocked at the answers on this subject from this particular messageboard.

Martial arts are steeped in Eastern Religions. You can't really take that out any more than you can take it out of yoga.

I think gotanswers.org sums up my feelings on the subject best:
Is it right for a Christian to be involved in martial arts?

(SpokenFor dons flame-proof suit)


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## LawrenceU (Jan 30, 2009)

SemperEruditio said:


> KrapMaga is not for kids and I would not recommend it for adults either.



I was focusing on the non-religious aspect of the arts and forgot that she was talking about a child. You are right Krav Maga is not for kids. A good bit of what is taught here is not the real deal. Krav Maga as the IDF teaches is quite effective and is not a numbers system at all. It is very fluid to the situation. But, then everyone has their beefs with every other person's system of fighting. Sambo is very effective in many situations, much more so than BJJ in the real world but it is almost unheard of in the US while BJJ seems to be all the rage.


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## Honor (Jan 30, 2009)

I vote to teach her MMA... but that's just me and I am the mother of two little boys and have no idea what I would do with a little girl. but that's my 2 cents


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## Kevin (Jan 30, 2009)

charliejunfan said:


> Stick with Jeet Kune Do(bruce lee, bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), Filipino Kali(The Hunted, Bourne Identity-Supremacy-Ultimatum), and Brazilian JuJitsu(UFC, MMA) mixed with Kino Mutai(art of breaking fingers, biting, and eye gouging)



JKD is Wing Chun in gym pants.

in my opinion Bruce Lee's main innovation was making westerners think that Yip Man only had one student!

-----Added 1/30/2009 at 02:45:09 EST-----



SpokenFor said:


> I must say I'm shocked at the answers on this subject from this particular messageboard.
> 
> Martial arts are steeped in Eastern Religions. You can't really take that out any more than you can take it out of yoga.
> 
> ...



That is silly. 

I read the article. He cites one (!) "of the founders of martial arts" (sic) as making a general observation about-- superiority in anything improves you spiritualy-- or some such. I think I read Martin Luther (that famed orientalist) say something very similar about doing everything to the glory of God.

Martial Arts are stylised, systemised methods of working out & training for fighting. In some VERY FEW cases people try to use it as a gateway into an expanded intrest in all things eastern, including religion.

However that is as likely to happen at a Chineese or Indian cooking class or a Japanese language school. T

here is no causative link between eastern methods of fighting and eastern religions.


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## TimV (Jan 30, 2009)

Time for some humor. Last week, two sons, a worker and a guy from church went to a MMA tournament at a local school owned by two of our OPC members. The guys did well, with 12 wins and one loss.

BUT, my 15 year old son had to fight a girl! Fortunately is was just wrestling and choking submissions, but still. We played back the video, and everyone was laughing because David kept looking around with a questioning expression on his face. What am I permitted to do? It was really hysterical. After he won (as gently as possible) he kept saying "I didn't know what parts I could touch".



> I must say I'm shocked at the answers on this subject from this particular messageboard.
> 
> Martial arts are steeped in Eastern Religions. You can't really take that out any more than you can take it out of yoga.



Hey, Tina. I've got to disagree on this one. All cultures have martial arts, just like all cultures have farming. Believe me, I've seen some pretty pagan farming practices in Africa, and in PNG. But you can easily separate the paganism from the agriculture. Well, actually you can't, if water dowsing is wrong, and we'd better not go into planting by the stages of the moon...

But still I trust you can see my point. Just because the heathen had a bunch of rituals around raising our food, and defending our homes, doesn't mean there's anything intrinsically wrong with raising food and defending our homes.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 30, 2009)

"JKD is Wing Chun in gym pants.

in my opinion Bruce Lee's main innovation was making westerners think that Yip Man only had one student! "-----Kevin

Yes, JKD is alot of Wing Chun with US boxing, Savate, Muay Thai, Fencing, Northern/Southern Shaolin, Escrima, Silat, Jujitsu, Judo, and on and on

JKD is just flowing from one arts technique to the next until the fight is ended

Bruce Lee is just Yip Man's popular student, Bruce's modyfied Wing Chun kept evolving and turned into Jeet Kune Do(Way of the Intercepting Fist). Bruce Lee's methods were much more effective because he no longer was bound by tradition, Bruce was more like a UFC fighter of his day than a Wing Chun man although he loved his Wing Chun later in life he used Wing Chun less and less. He always had that Wing Chun flow though.

I love Wing Chun, but it is dangerous if one thinks they can defend themselves with just classical Wing Chun. Gung Fu is art whereas MMA or JKD/Kali are practical

Bruce Lee was the godfather of MMA


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## Kevin (Jan 30, 2009)

^^^ I was just pulling your leg.


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## charliejunfan (Jan 30, 2009)

oh..... hahaha


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