# Anyone know anything about the URCNA?



## shackleton (Jul 23, 2007)

There is a URCNA church in the area and my wife and I are thinking of trying it out. I met someone from there that I liked and I found out that Michael Horton is a member of that group.


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## dannyhyde (Jul 23, 2007)

shackleton said:


> There is a URCNA church in the area and my wife and I are thinking of trying it out. I met someone from there that I liked and I found out that Michael Horton is a member of that group.



You can e-mail me at home and I can try to answer your questions (dandkjhyde-at-cox-dot-net)


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## Davidius (Jul 23, 2007)

I have nothing but the highest respect for some of the URCNA theologians whom I read on a regular basis (Drs. Horton and Clark from Westminster California). You should definitely look into that congregation if you are seeking a home church!


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## Answerman (Jul 23, 2007)

Erick, are you talking about Covenant Reformed Church? 

You might already know this, but you can find out more information on their website as well as download their sermons:

http://www.covenantreformed.org

I attended there a few years ago and haven't been there since they got their new pastor, Bill DeJong. I heard their advertisement on a Christian radio station in the KC area a while back and really liked what I heard. The advertisement took a stab at contemporary worship at the sacrifice of truth.

I know most of the families that attend there and would commend their hospitality and their dedication to a Christ centered worship service.


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## wraezor (Jul 23, 2007)

As you probably know, their somewhat unofficial denominational website is http://www.covenant-urc.org/urchrchs.html

They are definitely conservative, although the local congregation here defines the RPW to include hymns, instruments, and holy days.

Seems like a healthy Dutch presbyterian body though. I'd be interested to hear more of the reasons they're separate from other groups such as the Free Reformed.


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## x.spasitel (Jul 25, 2007)

wraezor said:


> I'd be interested to hear more of the reasons they're separate from other groups such as the Free Reformed.



Because Presbyterian bodies take any excuse to be separate from one another. [/facetiousness]


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## Guido's Brother (Jul 25, 2007)

wraezor said:


> I'd be interested to hear more of the reasons they're separate from other groups such as the Free Reformed.



Historically, it's the same reason why the Canadian Reformed are separate from the Free Reformed. In the Netherlands in 1892, two church federations which had previously left the Dutch State Church (in the 1830s and 1880s) united to form the Gereformeerde Kerken in Nederland (the Reformed Churches of the Netherlands). However, for a number of reasons (mostly having to do with Abraham Kuyper), a number of the churches which had seceded in the 1830s decided not to join the union. These became known as the Christelijke Gereformeerde Kerken (Christian Reformed Churches) and their people in North America are known as the Free Reformed. Ecclesiastically speaking, the URC and CanRC are both descended from the GKN. 

I hope that helps.


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## wraezor (Jul 26, 2007)

It does, thanks. Sounds very similar to the Scottish Presbyterian story.

It's also interesting that the CRC and URCNA are discussing union. It would definitely be a step in the right direction (provided they don't throw away the good stuff).


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## shackleton (Jul 26, 2007)

Am I right in assuming that the Dutch Reformed churches are more friendly between fellow churches? They assume themsleves to be all a part of the same body rather than in competition with each other?


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## Guido's Brother (Jul 26, 2007)

shackleton said:


> Am I right in assuming that the Dutch Reformed churches are more friendly between fellow churches? They assume themsleves to be all a part of the same body rather than in competition with each other?



It depends. What do you mean by "Dutch Reformed churches"?


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## jfschultz (Jul 26, 2007)

wraezor said:


> It's also interesting that the CRC and URCNA are discussing union. It would definitely be a step in the right direction (provided they don't throw away the good stuff).



Now that is interesting! As I recall the URCNA split from the CRC when the CRC started to ordain women. (Which is why the CRC was removed from NAPARC.)


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## ADKing (Jul 26, 2007)

jfschultz said:


> Now that is interesting! As I recall the URCNA split from the CRC when the CRC started to ordain women. (Which is why the CRC was removed from NAPARC.)



I did a double-take and then a triple-take at that statement myself. I think, however, given the context that what was meant was the current talks between the *Can*adian *R*eformed *C*hurches not the *C*hristian *R*eformed *C*hurch.


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## shackleton (Jul 26, 2007)

Guido's Brother said:


> It depends. What do you mean by "Dutch Reformed churches"?



I am specifically referring to non-Presbyterian, but reformed chruches. I was under the impression that if you were not Presbyterian, you were Dutch, maybe I was wrong.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Jul 26, 2007)

ADKing said:


> I did a double-take and then a triple-take at that statement myself. I think, however, given the context that what was meant was the current talks between the *Can*adian *R*eformed *C*hurches not the *C*hristian *R*eformed *C*hurch.



More ammo for the AAA (Alliance for the Abolition of Acronyms).


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## Guido's Brother (Jul 26, 2007)

shackleton said:


> I am specifically referring to non-Presbyterian, but reformed chruches. I was under the impression that if you were not Presbyterian, you were Dutch, maybe I was wrong.



The problem is that there are a wide variety of Reformed churches that come from a Dutch background, some of them confessional in a meaningful way (CanRC, URC, FRC and others), and others less so or not at all (most RCA, many CRC). 

The confessional Reformed churches do generally recognize one another to varying degrees and meet together in organizations like the International Conference of Reformed Churches and NAPARC. The only exception would be the Protestant Reformed Churches.

And yes, the common abbreviation for Canadian Reformed is CanRC, to distinguish from CRC which is usually understood to be Christian Reformed.


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## Coram Deo (Jul 26, 2007)

If the Dutch Reformed are not presbyterian what Ecclesia are they?

What other differences theologically between presbyterian and dutch reformed?


I think I need to do my homework more on dutch reformed, they fascinate me but know so little about them accept the 3 forms of unity confession....


Michael




shackleton said:


> I am specifically referring to non-Presbyterian, but reformed chruches. I was under the impression that if you were not Presbyterian, you were Dutch, maybe I was wrong.


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## Guido's Brother (Jul 26, 2007)

thunaer said:


> If the Dutch Reformed are not presbyterian what Ecclesia are they?
> 
> What other differences theologically between presbyterian and dutch reformed?



I think it would be helpful to distinguish between "Presbyterian" in church polity and "Presbyterian" in theology. When used in the latter sense, "Presbyterian" is essentially synonymous with "Reformed."


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## Ruben100 (Jul 26, 2007)

Michael Daniels 
Here is a good book to inform you more on dutch reformed.

Dutch Calvinism in Modern America A History of a Conservative Subculture.
By James D. Bratt


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## JDKetterman (Jul 26, 2007)

URCNA is actually planting a church around the Washington D.C. area. I've been to almost every study, and I think their theology is pretty solid. One thing I do notice is that everyone who goes to the groups was either URC or listens to White Horse Inn. It was kind of like having our own WHI when we gathered together. Brian Lee, who is planting the church, is good friends with Michael Horton and Kim Riddlebarger. 

One thing I find very refreshing is how they emphasize the Law/Gospel distinction and how they are redemptive historical in their approach to preaching. The way they worship is also something I like a lot also. Over the past couple of months, we have been going over _A Better Way_ by Micheal Horton.


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