# Who Can Preach in Your Pulpit



## JOwen (Jan 23, 2013)

Friends,

I'm most interested in the answer from NAPARC Churches but anyone can answer. 

Does a classical or presbyterial body grant permission for an ordained minister (or theological student) to preach in a local church pulpit on the Lord's Day, or is that decision left to the local consistory/kirk session? I am doing some comparisons between our practice in the FRCNA others around us. In my last denomination that privileged belonged to the kirk session, but in the FRCNA it belongs to an appointed committee of Synod made up of ministers and elders. Feedback would be appreciated.


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## JonathanHunt (Jan 23, 2013)

I do.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Jan 23, 2013)

Our church by-laws specifically make it the Session's call.


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## jfschultz (Jan 23, 2013)

Thinking back over the years that I have been at Riveroaks, it has always been a teaching elder. Even when there is a guest preacher, it is an ordained teaching elder of a Presbyterian denomination that holds to Westminster.


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## Guido's Brother (Jan 23, 2013)

Jerrold,

In the CanRC, it depends. Consistories in our federation are free to invite anyone to their pulpits, so long as the preacher is a minister in good standing of another CanRC or other sister church OR a seminary student who has been duly examined by a classis and declared fit for "speaking an edifying word" or a seminary graduate declared as a candidate for the ministry by a classis. Beyond that, we don't venture. This is not explicitly stipulated in our Church Order, but this is our practice/application of what we have agreed upon.


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## Jack K (Jan 23, 2013)

In my PCA church, for a one-time event it was any man the session approved. Typically, that would be an ordained minister in the same or a like-thinking denomination or an elder in our church. But there were rare occasions where the approval to preach was granted to someone else for reasons the session thought beneficial. Only PCA ministers would administer the sacraments, though, or preach on a regular basis. The presbytery would have gotten involved if those bounds were overstepped.


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## fredtgreco (Jan 23, 2013)

According to the Constitutional documents of the PCA (specifically, here, the Book of Church Order), the Session has approval over the pulpit, unless the person is a "regular" preacher. Regular preaching requires licensing by the Presbytery. Regular is not defined in the BCO, so each Presbytery has its own definition. (e.g. in my former Presbytery it was basically anyone who preached more than 12 times per year).
Not sure where that fits in your poll.


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## JOwen (Jan 23, 2013)

Thanks for your responses thus far. Just to clarify, I am speaking about ministers outside the denomination. For instance, if your kirk session or consistory wanted Spurgeon or Whitefield, or Lloyd-Jones to put in an appearance on the Lord's Day morning, who would grant that permission?


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## TylerRay (Jan 23, 2013)

As we're in the PCA, the decision lies with the Session. Usually when the pastor is away, we have a man who is a minister in the RPCGA preach. He also administers the Supper when we celebrate it in our pastor's absence.


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## Edward (Jan 23, 2013)

PCA, so the session approves.


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## Gforce9 (Jan 23, 2013)

JOwen said:


> Thanks for your responses thus far. Just to clarify, I am speaking about ministers outside the denomination. For instance, if your kirk session or consistory wanted Spurgeon or Whitefield, or Lloyd-Jones to put in an appearance on the Lord's Day morning, who would grant that permission?



Pastor Lewis,
If my session wanted and could deliver any of these dead men to the pulpit on the Lord's Day, I would run for the hills!  Feel free to resume normal operations............


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2013)

How do presbyterian churches treat visiting missionaries?


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## DeniseM (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> How do presbyterian churches treat visiting missionaries?


Usually with a pitch-in lunch. 

Seriously though, the only time we have had missionaries, that I can remember, the missionary gave a presentation of some sort, usually on a day other that Sunday. I can't think of any that came and preached on the Lord's Day, unless they were previously ministers in the denomination. 

I think that the session approves ministers outside of the denomination. We have had a few from Reformed Baptist churches that have preached on the Lord's day over the years, and it is very common to have other ministers from within the denomination, as well as a lay preacher that is a member of our church.


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## reaganmarsh (Jan 24, 2013)

I approve who speaks from our pulpit. If I ain't happy, he ain't preaching.


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## DMcFadden (Jan 24, 2013)

Gforce9 said:


> JOwen said:
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> > Thanks for your responses thus far. Just to clarify, I am speaking about ministers outside the denomination. For instance, if your kirk session or consistory wanted Spurgeon or Whitefield, or Lloyd-Jones to put in an appearance on the Lord's Day morning, who would grant that permission?
> ...



Necromancy, huh? I would've expected that kind of practice from one of the mainline denominations you all have withdrawn from to become confessional. How "free" is that Free Reformed Church you pastor? Perhaps you have issues greater than deciding protocol for inviting guest speakers?


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## Gforce9 (Jan 24, 2013)

DMcFadden said:


> Gforce9 said:
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Well, I thought I nearly derailed the train, then Dennis comes along with some dynamite and blows the train clean into the drink...................


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2013)

DeniseM said:


> Pergamum said:
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> > How do presbyterian churches treat visiting missionaries?
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Do you think this exclusion of missionaries from the local pulpit ministries of the churches that support them (and often send them) is one reason why we aren't sending out more missionaries? They have been deemed worthy to go out and endure hardship for the sake of the name but are not given adequate opportunities to influence local Stateside churches and are largely unknown to even the local congregations that support their work.

The more Reformed that a church is in ecclesiology often bears an inverse relationship to how visible missionary efforts are in that church.


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## Gforce9 (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> DeniseM said:
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Perg,
A few things come to mind:
In the OPC, there are three offices: Minister, Elder, Deacon. We believe the Minister has the calling and the office to preach. That high calling and office are not for the Deacon, for example. I think, and will stand corrected by the more knowledgeable, that our missionaries are Ministers and often have non office-bearing helpers in the field. Secondly, the local congregation does not send missionaries, the OPC sends missionaries. I think the differences between a Presbyterian government and an independent one are where the issue is.......I hope that is helpful.


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2013)

> Secondly, the local congregation does not send missionaries, the OPC sends missionaries.




How does this fit with the book of Acts where the Apostle Paul, directly called by God, is nonetheless, sent by the local congregation at Antioch?

I am sorry but it seems that independents are doing the bulk of the missions-sending and that many TR churches don't seem to be sending very well (though they do send better qualified people when they do, in fact, send). It seems that tighter versus looser ecclesiology is one major factor in this.


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## Marrow Man (Jan 24, 2013)

Session. If the minister is not just a guest minister, but preaching on a continuing basis (a supply pastor or student-supply who fills in regularly in the absence of a pastor), then that requires presbyterial approval (examined and approved by a committee, then by presbytery upon the committee's recommendation).


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## DeniseM (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> DeniseM said:
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I don't know that they are necessarily excluded from preaching on the Lord's day. The last missionary we had at our church was a young women, so she wouldn't be doing any preaching anyway. The time before that there were some missionaries visiting at the same time that many of the ministers were also visiting from other congregations within the denomination(it was the ministers' week of prayer), so I think that it just worked out that a different pastor preached. Our denomination at least does try to keep people up to date with missionary prayer requests and special needs.


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## Scott1 (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> DeniseM said:
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I don't want to distract from your specific back and forth but thought some comment and context would be helpful.

Preaching, as a defined ordinance of worship on the Lord's Day, is not the only means of missionaries connecting or sharing with or teaching the congregation.
There are many other practical ways that can (and is) done. For example, a 'minute for missions' during the service, a separate presentation by the missionary with a meal, e.g. Sunday evening. A Saturday night home presentation at the home of someone on the missions committee. A 'meet and greet' time before or after the service.

It might be appropriate to have the missionary teach, e.g. a former Pastor there who is now a missionary, someone ordained as a teaching elder. etc.

What's at stake is the centrality of _sola scriptura_ in corporate worship and the calling of elders. It's not easily set aside for people, not the corporate worship ordinance. For example, one church support 30 different missionaries or groups- imagine the disruption to the systematic teaching of Scripture if they all were presented for that.


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2013)

Scott1 said:


> Pergamum said:
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Thanks.


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## py3ak (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> Do you think this exclusion of missionaries from the local pulpit ministries of the churches that support them (and often send them) is one reason why we aren't sending out more missionaries?



I think in this case it's more that various people were ministers in local congregations or involved in home missions before/between being missionaries overseas.


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## Jack K (Jan 24, 2013)

Pergamum said:


> How do presbyterian churches treat visiting missionaries?



Perg, if you were an ordained minister serving as a missionary supported by my PCA church, the chances are very good you'd be invited to preach, especially if you asked for that opportunity. If you were not an ordained minister but preached regularly in the field you also might get invited to preach, especially if we knew you particularly well. If you weren't a regular preacher, it's more likely you'd be given time in the service to give a report and be prayed for, speak to a Sunday school class, get to know people over dinner or a special fellowship time and so on... but not preach.

At my Baptist church, where eccesiology is indeed looser, if you were accustomed to preaching in the field you could probably wrangle an invitation to preach, period.

By the way, my missionary pastor dad, who for most of his time in the field was not ordained but preached regularly, was always asked to preach when he visited a supporting church. Sometimes the elders in those churches put him through a few hoops or insisted on vetting his sermon content ahead of time, but he always preached. That was in the CRC of 30-50 years ago.


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## Pergamum (Jan 24, 2013)

Thanks Jack.


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## Kevin (Jan 25, 2013)

In the PCA it is the session. Who they may use seems to very from presbytery to presbytery and is more a matter of custom than law.

PCA and most Presbyterians that I know about (PCC, ARP, Free pres) will allow any man that has some evidence of a gift to preach. Students, men from an other denomination, and laymen.


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