# What term do you prefer to use for the first day of the week?



## Sonoftheday (Dec 14, 2007)

What term do you prefer to use for the first day of the week?

Sunday

Lord's Day

Sabbath


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## Davidius (Dec 14, 2007)

I normally say Sunday.


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

Lord's day first, or sometimes Sabbath, or if necessary I'll use Sunday. But Lord's day mostly.


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

I have actually heard men in my church say - from the pulpit - that it is a sin to use the word "Sunday" instead of Sabbath or Lord's Day.

in my opinion this is nonsense, as the Sabbath takes place on a Sunday, so what is the big problem with using the word Sunday?


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## Sonoftheday (Dec 14, 2007)

I wouldnt think it sin to call it banana day as long as you gave it to the Lord.

I prefer the term Lord's Day over sunday because it reminds of who the day is for. but among many of my non-reformed brethren I often have to say sunday or they dont know what Im talking about. (sad but true)


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

Daniel Ritchie said:


> I have actually heard men in my church say - from the pulpit - that it is a sin to use the word "Sunday" instead of Sabbath or Lord's Day.
> 
> in my opinion this is nonsense, as the Sabbath takes place on a Sunday, so what is the big problem with using the word Sunday?


It was a position of the Quakers that it was wrong to use the old (and forgotten) pagan names for the days of the week. Robert Baillie has an interesting comment somewhere about that, in regards to the Brownists I think. Not sure; in his Dissuasive somewhere maybe.


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

We should prefer Lord's day, at least in worship or ecclesiastical context, I think as that is what Scripture calls it.


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
> 
> 
> > I have actually heard men in my church say - from the pulpit - that it is a sin to use the word "Sunday" instead of Sabbath or Lord's Day.
> ...



Did not Cargill and Renwick have a similar problem with the Gibbites?


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> We should prefer Lord's day, at least in worship or ecclesiastical context, I think as that is what Scripture calls it.



Interesting point, when we gather for corporate worship on the Sabbath, we are worshipping the risen Christ on the day of His resurrection - so maybe it is most appropriate to use "Lord's Day" in that context.

Or, here is another idea, what about Al Martin's term "Lord's Day Sabbath"?


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## Richard King (Dec 14, 2007)

Daniel Ritchie said:


> I have actually heard men in my church say - from the pulpit - that it is a sin to use the word "Sunday" instead of Sabbath or Lord's Day.
> 
> in my opinion this is nonsense, as the Sabbath takes place on a Sunday, so what is the big problem with using the word Sunday?



I think that comes from the fact that the names come from a background of worshipers of stars, moon and sun or greek gods like Monday is Moon day, Thursday is Thors day, Saturday celebrates Saturn, Sunday in honor of the Sun.
Or so I am told.


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## toddpedlar (Dec 14, 2007)

Sonoftheday said:


> What term do you prefer to use for the first day of the week?
> 
> Sunday
> 
> ...



Are you asking about a term used all the time with the world around us, or within the church? 
The answer differs....


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

Daniel Ritchie said:


> NaphtaliPress said:
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Dunno.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 14, 2007)

Richard King said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
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> > I have actually heard men in my church say - from the pulpit - that it is a sin to use the word "Sunday" instead of Sabbath or Lord's Day.
> ...



Thomas Melville Slater (Reformed Presbyterian), _Nicknaming the Sabbath: A Protest against using other than the Scriptural names for the Lord’s Day_


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
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I think Maurice Grant's biography of Donald Cargill _No King But Christ_ (published by Evangelical Press) goes into this a bit.


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

VirginiaHuguenot said:


> Richard King said:
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Covenanters eh; what would you do with them


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## etexas (Dec 14, 2007)

Usually I say Sunday, in writing i usually use Lord's Day. Not sure why....I guess that like most people I can be little more formal in writing.


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## Southern Presbyterian (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> We should prefer Lord's day, at least in worship or ecclesiastical context, I think as that is what Scripture calls it.



Great point.


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## Davidius (Dec 14, 2007)

Just out of curiosity, how many times is the phrase "Lord's Day" used in the NT?


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## historyb (Dec 14, 2007)

I have always said Sunday and suspect I always will. All days belong to the Lord.


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## Coram Deo (Dec 14, 2007)

I call it the Sabbath and normally say to people "Good Sabbath"...


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 14, 2007)

CarolinaCalvinist said:


> Just out of curiosity, how many times is the phrase "Lord's Day" used in the NT?



I think it is only used by John in Revelation 1


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## Southern Presbyterian (Dec 14, 2007)

Daniel Ritchie said:


> CarolinaCalvinist said:
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> 
> > Just out of curiosity, how many times is the phrase "Lord's Day" used in the NT?
> ...



Correct; [esv]Revelation 1:20[/esv]


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## DMcFadden (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> We should prefer Lord's day, at least in worship or ecclesiastical context, I think as that is what Scripture calls it.


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## Sonoftheday (Dec 14, 2007)

I am not one who cares about the pagan meaning things had many yrs ago, however I do like the term Lord's Day over sunday because the meaning the word sunday has now. Sunday is the day off work, the day to spend with the family, the day to watch football and nascar, the day to barbeque. The Lord's Day is the day to worship the Lord.


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## Davidius (Dec 14, 2007)

Just change the -u- to -o- and you've got a Christianized name for the day as well as all kinds of cheesy merchandise.

Sonday!


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## Coram Deo (Dec 14, 2007)

Does anybody know if there is a printed calendar to buy that has replaced "SUNday" with "SABBATH DAY"

That is one that I would like to buy....


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 14, 2007)

thunaer said:


> Does anybody know if there is a printed calendar to buy that has replaced "SUNday" with "SABBATH DAY"
> 
> That is one that I would like to buy....



Not sure about that, but the Trinitarian Bible Society makes calendars that use the term "Lord's Day."


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## etexas (Dec 14, 2007)

VirginiaHuguenot said:


> thunaer said:
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> > Does anybody know if there is a printed calendar to buy that has replaced "SUNday" with "SABBATH DAY"
> ...


Gotta love TBS


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## SRoper (Dec 14, 2007)

I say Sunday, but I'd like to get into the habit of saying Lord's Day to remind myself and others whose day it is.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 14, 2007)

Daniel Ritchie said:


> I think Maurice Grant's biography of Donald Cargill _No King But Christ_ (published by Evangelical Press) goes into this a bit.



Yes, Grant notes that John Gibb opposed any usage of days of the week or months based on their pagan nature; his objection was not confined to the Lord's Day/Sabbath v. Sunday. Grant has a lengthy footnote on the subject.


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## jaybird0827 (Dec 14, 2007)

NaphtaliPress said:


> Lord's day first, or sometimes Sabbath, or if necessary I'll use Sunday. But Lord's day mostly.


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## Coram Deo (Dec 14, 2007)

I would love to read it, could you post a link...

I have thought about the same thing on and off the past year.......



VirginiaHuguenot said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
> 
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> > I think Maurice Grant's biography of Donald Cargill _No King But Christ_ (published by Evangelical Press) goes into this a bit.
> ...


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## MW (Dec 14, 2007)

VirginiaHuguenot said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
> 
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> > I think Maurice Grant's biography of Donald Cargill _No King But Christ_ (published by Evangelical Press) goes into this a bit.
> ...



Jeremiah Burroughs on Hosea also has an interesting discussion on this idea.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 14, 2007)

thunaer said:


> I would love to read it, could you post a link...
> 
> I have thought about the same thing on and off the past year.......
> 
> ...



Maurice Grant, _No King But Christ: The Story of Donald Cargill_, pp. 160, 261-262:



> Events soon proved the truth of Cargill's prediction. At the beginning of May Gibb and his followers were all seized by the soldiers and carried to Edinburgh. The mere were imprisoned in the Canongate Tolbooth; the women were consigned to the 'correction house', the usual repository for the loose and immoral in the city. After some weeks in prison Gibb drew up a paper setting out his principles, which he presented to the Council. It was a wild, unbalanced document, aptly demonstrating the mind of its author and scarcely deserving to be treated seriously. It denounced the use of chapters and verses in Scripture, the metrical Psalms, the translation of the Bible out of the original languages, the Confession of Faith and the Catechisms, the Covenants and the Form of Church Government, the Queensferry paper, the Sanquhar Declaration and even the names of months and days of the week.1
> 
> 1. The view that the common names of the days and months, being derived from pagan deities, were not worthy to be used by Christians, was not confined to Gibb and his followers. As contemporary records show, it was one of the chief points of difference between James Russel and the United Societies in the years following Cargill's death. Russel's friend and associate, Patrick Grant, maintained that his and Russel's views on the subject had been shared by William Cuthill, who died along with Cargill, and that Cuthill had asserted them in the portion of his last testimony which was supressed by the editors of the _Cloud of Witnesses_ (1714 ed., p. 118). Grant also claimed that in his letter to Gibb's followers in the Correction House Cargill himself had expressed approval of these views, but there is nothing in Cargill's letter to lend support to this. Nevertheless it is clear that some who attended on Cargill's ministry and held him in the highest respect adopted the practice at about this time. A manuscript copy of Cargill's sermon at Dovan Common on 26 June, obviously recorded by a friendly hand, is dated 'the 26th day of the sixth month'. A letter from Patrick Forman, who with four others was put to death at the Gallowlee in Edinburgh in October 1681, is dated 'the 16th of this ninth month' and his testimony 'the 8th day of the tenth month'. The practice did not, however, become general, and was not adopted by James Renwick nor the other members of the United Societies.


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## Coram Deo (Dec 14, 2007)

Could you elaborate on what Burrough said on Hosea with regard to this?

I love his works....



armourbearer said:


> VirginiaHuguenot said:
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## VirginiaHuguenot (Dec 14, 2007)

armourbearer said:


> VirginiaHuguenot said:
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Jeremiah Burroughs, _An Exposition of the Prophecy of Hosea_, p. 147 (on Hosea 2.16-17):



> It were good therefore, seeing God hates and loathes it so much, that we should hate and loath it also, and therefore cast out even the name and memory of it; it were a happy thing if the names of popish, as well as heathenish, idols could be banished from the church; but I know not how it happens that we Christians still retain the use of them; the very days of the week among us are called by the names of planets, or heathen gods: not that I think it a sin, when it is the ordinary language of the world, to speak so as may be understood, for the apostle mentions the name of Castor and Pollux; but if there could be an alteration by general consent, (as our brethren in New England have), it were desirable; and still more so, that our children might not be educated in the use of heathen poems, whereby the names of heathen idols are kept up fresh amongst us: the papists themselves acknowledge so much in the Rhemish Testament, in their notes on Rev. i.10: "The name Sunday is heathenish, as all other of the week-days, some imposed by the Romans after the name of planets, some from certain idols which the Saxons worshipped, and to which they dedicated their days before they were Christians. These names the church rejecting, has appointed to call the first day _Dominic_, (the Lord's) the others by the name of _Feries_, successivly to the last day of the week, which she calls by the old name of sabbath, because that was of God, and not by imposition of the heathen." And in their Annotations upon Luke xxiv.1, "The first day of the sabbath; that is, the first after the Sabbath, which is our Lord's day. And from the apostle, 1 Cor. xvi.2, commanding a collection to be made on the first day of the sabbath, we learn," (say they) "both the keeping that day as the sabbath, and the church's naming the days of the week the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th of the sabbath, and so on, to be apostolical, and the calling of the days of the week, the second, the third, the fourth, &c., to be likewise apostolical, which St. Sylvester afterward named the 2nd, 3rd, and 4th _Feriam_." Thus you have the papists acknowledging the Lord's day to be apostolical, and the calling of the days of the week the second, the third, the fourth, &c., to be likewise apostolical. The heathenish Roman names of the days were taken from the seven planets: 1. _Sol_, thence _Dies solis_, Sunday dedicated to the sun. 2. _Luna_, Monday, dedicated to the moon. 3. _Mars_, Tuesday, dedicated to Mars. Our Tuesday is a Saxon name, from Tuisco, who they say was, since the Tower of Babel, chief leader and ruler of the German nation, who, in honour of him, called this day Tuesday, Tuisco's day. 4. _Mercurius_, to whom Wednesday is dedicated, and we call it so, is from the Saxon's Woden, who was a great prince among them, and whose image they adored after his death. 5. _Jupiter_, to whom Thursday is dedicated; so called by us from the Saxon Thor, the name of an idol which they anciently worshipped. 6. _Venus_, to whom our Friday, which name is given it from Friga, an idol of the Germans. This idol was an hermaphrodite, and reputed to be the giver of plenty, and the causer of amity; the same perhaps which the Romans called Venus. 7. _Saturnus_, dedicated to Saturn, whence our Saturday; or, as others think, from Seater, an idol of the Germans. Exod. xxiii.13, we have this charge, "In all things that I have said unto you, be circumspect: and make no mention of the names of other gods, neither let it be heard out of thy mouth." And Psal. xvi.4, David professes he will not take the names of idols into his lips.


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## ADKing (Dec 14, 2007)

I make it a point to consistently use the term Sabbath or Lord's Day (though Sabbath is my preference). I find there are several reasons--some of which have already been stated:
1). I prefer using the Scriptural name God has given the day
2). It is a reminder of the morality of sanctifying the day--especially when you cannot miss the connection with the day and the 4th commandment.
3). I don't have any reservations about using the term Sabbath with unbelievers. Normally they are very clear on what is meant. If they inquire I have a chance to explain it to them. I have never been mistaken for a Seventh Day Adventist by an unbeliever--sadly the only times that question has been raised is by professing evangelicals. I think it is good and necessary to insist on the claims of the Sabbath day in society and not just as a term restricted to church. 
4). I have found that the more consistent I am as a pastor in my use of the terms it does (slowly!) have an affect on the thinking and use of the members of the congregation as well.


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## Coram Deo (Dec 14, 2007)

Ok, Maybe I am just tired tonight and too medicated up.. But what is a "Feriam" and "Feries"?

Mike



VirginiaHuguenot said:


> armourbearer said:
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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

I found where Robert Baillie mentions the subject of the names of the days of the week; here also is the place George Gillespie mentions it:

Gillespie.
In arguing for the proposition that in "communicating with idolaters in their rites and ceremonies, we ourselves become guilty of idolatry" Gillespie notes that the papists themselves contend "that it is generally forbidden to communicate with infidels and heretics, but especially in any act of religion." He then goes on to say:
"Yea, they [the papists] think that Christian men are bound to abhor the very phrases and words of heretics, which they use. Yea, they condemn the very heathenish names of the days of the week imposed after the names of the planets, Sunday, Monday, etc." EPC, 3.3.9.190-191 (NP, 1993). Note, Gillespie says "they think". 

Baillie.
Robert Baillie, who uses the names of the days of the week throughout his Letters and Journals, tags the rejection of the names for the days of the week as a Brownist doctrine:

"Their hatred of idolatry is so great, that they professe it unlawful, so much as to mention in any civil way, the names of places or times that carry any footstep of any ancient Idoll, Saint _Andrew,_ Saint _John, Peter_ or _Pauls _Church: _Munday, Tuesday, Wednesday, Sunday; January, February, March_; those and the like words to them are profane and unlawful: The very year of God displeaseth them; they will have it called, _The yeare of the Saints last patience_."


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## NaphtaliPress (Dec 14, 2007)

Along this topic of names for the days of the week, we do have the physician Luke in Scripture using the common place name though named after a false god, in Acts 17:22.
Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.


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## bookslover (Dec 15, 2007)

joshua said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
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> 
> > Or, here is another idea, what about Al Martin's term "Lord's Day Sabbath"?
> ...



Or, we could just call it "Fred."


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## JBaldwin (Dec 15, 2007)

I tend to use Sunday, though I often use Lord's Day as well. I have never referred to the day as the Sabbath, because in my mind, the Sabbath is a Jewish word and they still insist it's on Saturday. We also have a lot of Seventh Day Adventists around here who would completely misunderstand what you are talking about if you referred to Sunday as the Sabbath. 

Incidentally (and I am going to start another thread on this), I tend to lean toward the idea that "Sabbath" in the New Testament refers to a Sabbath rest which is all the time. I still believe we need to set aside Sunday as the Lord's Day.


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## KMK (Dec 15, 2007)

I use the word 'Son-day'!


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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 15, 2007)

VirginiaHuguenot said:


> Daniel Ritchie said:
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> > I think Maurice Grant's biography of Donald Cargill _No King But Christ_ (published by Evangelical Press) goes into this a bit.
> ...



I really do not know where you would stop if you took the Gibbites to their logical conclusion.


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## Coram Deo (Dec 15, 2007)

A NonPagan Based, Christian Based Society? Maybe? 



Daniel Ritchie said:


> VirginiaHuguenot said:
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## Reformed Covenanter (Dec 15, 2007)

thunaer said:


> A NonPagan Based, Christian Based Society? Maybe?
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Dunno about that, I think the Gibbites were more pagan than Cargill, Renwick etc. Pagans sometimes do things which, outwardly at least are right. Pagans wear shoes, does that mean we should not wear shoes. Pagans eat food, does that mean we should not eat food? Pagans (I think) invented cars etc, does that mean we should never use these things.

Indeed the apostle Paul quoted from Pagan writings to substantiate his point both at Mars Hill and in his letter to Titus.


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