# Mathew 24 and the Destruction of the Temple



## Eoghan (Mar 12, 2011)

The prediction of the Temple being destroyed is clear and yet it seems to be mixed in with predictions of the Second Coming. Anyone got a clear idea about which verses deal with what?

I think the clue is that there are essentially two questions asked by the disciples even if they thought it was only one.


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## Notthemama1984 (Mar 12, 2011)

Eoghan said:


> Anyone got a clear idea about which verses deal with what?



I am sure Jesus does.


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## Skyler (Mar 12, 2011)

Chaplainintraining said:


> Eoghan said:
> 
> 
> > Anyone got a clear idea about which verses deal with what?
> ...


 
I'm betting Matthew does.


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## Notthemama1984 (Mar 12, 2011)

Skyler said:


> Chaplainintraining said:
> 
> 
> > Eoghan said:
> ...


 
Probably Luke and Mark as well.


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## Rev. Todd Ruddell (Mar 13, 2011)

Read the other gospel accounts--they indicate less of a "dividing of the question". J. Marcellus Kik has a good exegetical work on this topic, "An Eschatology of Victory". He is post-mil in the older sense of that term, I believe.


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## Jerusalem Blade (Mar 13, 2011)

Eoghan, 

Here are a couple of amil views on aspects of Matthew 24, for your edification:

Kim Riddlebarger on “Prophetic Perspective and the Abomination of Desolation”, in his book, _The Man of Sin_. 

And a number of amil authors on the word "generations" in Matthew 24:34.

Hope this is helpful.


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## JennyG (Mar 13, 2011)

thank you for posting those very illuminating links, Steve. I must have missed seeing them the first time.


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## Covenant Joel (Mar 13, 2011)

It seems that there is a separation from verses 1-35 and then verses 36 and following. The former refer to "those days," and given the "this generation" guideline of verse 34, they seem to me to refer to the destruction of Jerusalem. Verses 36 begins by mentioning "that day," seemingly indicating something outside of the 1st-century destruction of Jerusalem.


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## KMK (Mar 13, 2011)

I don't believe that a clear distinction is intended.


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## KMK (Mar 14, 2011)

JennyG said:


> thank you for posting those very illuminating links, Steve. I must have missed seeing them the first time.


 
 Steve! Thanks.


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## Peairtach (Mar 14, 2011)

> I don't believe that a clear distinction is intended.



There is this prophetic perspective of seeing and describing two events at the same time. But what profit will there be in, e.g., those in Judea running to the mountains on the Last Day? (Matthew 24:16)

There are two Comings with the Clouds, as Richard Pratt has pointed out:

(a) One in which Christ ascends to Heaven and receives a Kingdom from His Father, which was confirmed by the destruction of the Temple and the end of the theocratic typological Kingdom and the beginning of a kingdom which spanned the globe:

*E.g.*


> I saw in the night visions, and, behold, one like the Son of man came with the clouds of heaven, and came to the Ancient of days, and they brought him near before him. And there was given him dominion, and glory, and a kingdom, that all people, nations, and languages, should serve him: his dominion is an everlasting dominion, which shall not pass away, and his kingdom that which shall not be destroyed. (Dan 7:13-14)





> And Jesus came and spake unto them, saying, All power is given unto me in heaven and in earth.(Matt 28:18)



(b) One in which Christ returns to this earth to raise the dead and judge the world:

*E.g.*


> And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight. And while they looked stedfastly toward heaven as he went up, behold, two men stood by them in white apparel; Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven. (Acts 1:11)



The two advents - one to Heaven, and one to Earth - are brought together in the saying of the angels here.


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## Prufrock (Mar 14, 2011)

Of course, the argument can be made that neither is specifically in view (as I have seen done here on the PB, and from which brief statements I received much initial direction in my own understanding of the passage). I'm not entirely unconvinced that Paul's teaching in 1 Thess. 2:15-16 should apply here (which was, of course, written before either the destruction of the temple or the second coming). The wrath of God was already come upon that nation "to the uttermost" long before the temple was destroyed when they both "killed the Lord Jesus" and "persecuted us." Do we need to find specific historical fulfillment of Paul's charge in specific events? I don't think we even could point to an "event" that Paul was referring to in Thessalonians; nevertheless this does not undermine the validity of his charge. Rather, the wrath referred to there refers to his rejection of them and their being cast away because of their rejection of him. Such ideas are often pictured in prophetic oracles by use of cataclysmic language. Perhaps if we apply a consistent hermeneutic to this passage such as we apply to Old Testament prophecy (and is Christ not the prophet _par excellence_ of the Covenant?), there will still be difficulties in interpreting this passage, but within the context of asking different questions.


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## KMK (Mar 15, 2011)

Prufrock said:


> I'm *not* entirely *unconvinced* that Paul's teaching in 1 Thess. 2:15-16 should apply here



Just for clarification, are you saying that there is a possibility that 1 Thess applies to Matt 24? Interesting point.

I side with Calvin in this: even if some of the events described came upon the Jews in 70 AD, that doesn't mean they don't also come upon others at other times, including the end of the world. Obviously, people continue, in the face of great calamity, to be deceived by false Messiahs, and to be terrified, and to premeditate their own defense, etc. In addition, signs in the sun, moon and stars could be associated with other catastrophes as well. Obviously, all calamity is God's vengeance upon sinfulness whether in Jerusalem or anywhere else. 

Isa 45:7 I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.


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## Prufrock (Mar 15, 2011)

KMK said:


> Just for clarification, are you saying that there is a possibility that 1 Thess applies to Matt 24? Interesting point.



Rev. Klein, yes, I was obliquely intending the fact I think such a passage could shed light on Christ's judgment discourse. I think we might see passages which involve similar ideas throughout the New Testament even if we don't always realize it. One passage (though spoken with different intent and in a different context) which informs to an extent how I read Matt. 24 is Acts 2:19-24. I would note the potential parallel between 19ab and 22; between 19c-20b and 23; and between 20c and 24. If that parallelism is accepted, we see Israel's rejection and crucifying of Christ (along with their continuing to do so at the present stage of the narrative), and the consequences of this expressed in the language of the Sun being turned to blackness and the moon to blood, etc., which language has its parallels in Matt. 24.


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## MW (Mar 15, 2011)

Prufrock said:


> Rev. Klein, yes, I was obliquely intending the fact I think such a passage could shed light on Christ's judgment discourse. I think we might see passages which involve similar ideas throughout the New Testament even if we don't always realize it. One passage (though spoken with different intent and in a different context) which informs to an extent how I read Matt. 24 is Acts 2:19-24. I would note the potential parallel between 19ab and 22; between 19c-20b and 23; and between 20c and 24. If that parallelism is accepted, we see Israel's rejection and crucifying of Christ (along with their continuing to do so at the present stage of the narrative), and the consequences of this expressed in the language of the Sun being turned to blackness and the moon to blood, etc., which language has its parallels in Matt. 24.


 
Excellent points, Paul.

Within Matthew's gospel there is an overarching theme in which Jesus is presented as true Israel Who sums up the history of Israel in Himself. E.g., book of the generations; out of Egypt I called my firstborn son; washings; wilderness wanderings; law republished; conquest of land; denunciation of apostasy and promise of rest; establishment of kingdom; building the temple; schism in the tribes; reformation of the temple; Isaianic land judgements; and Jeremiah-like denunciations. In this scheme chapter 24 depicts the destruction of the temple. Chapters 26 and 27 naturally describe the exile and its conditions, whereas chapter 28 teaches restoration. This cursory account of the theme shows it is impossible to divorce the judgment oracle of chapter 24 from the life of Christ Himself.


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