# Killing Jesus alternatives



## arapahoepark (Aug 16, 2013)

Apparently O'Reilly has a book coming out called Killing Jesus where he seeks to understand why Jesus was killed and to work through the 'contradictions' in the Gospels. My mom wants the book but, I would rather have her read something else. Are there other alternatives that are also easy reads (as in popular level)?


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## CuriousNdenver (Aug 17, 2013)

arap said:


> Are there other alternatives that are also easy reads (as in popular level)?



Is your mom a believer? I would never recommend a non-believer read a book written by a secular author about Christ. I can see reading this as a believer, from an apologetics standpoint.

What is her interest in this book? That will help people suggest alternatives.

Maybe she would enjoy something by C. S. Lewis? Ligonier also has a wide selection of books, including some free eBooks that answer questions about the Christian faith. 

Reformed Theology from R.C. Sproul: Ligonier Ministries

This one looks interesting, though I've not read it. All God's Children and Blue Suede Shoes: Christians and Popular Culture: Ken Myers - Paperback, Book | Ligonier Ministries Store

It would be interesting to learn what O'Reilly comes up with. I bet it will have nothing to do with the true message of the gospel.


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## Matthew Willard Lankford (Aug 17, 2013)

I would suggest finding a good Harmony of the Gospels and letting her read God's word for herself; there are some Gospel Harmonies that include commentary or explanatory footnotes, which might be helpful. There are several popular ones available on Amazon. 

Not to get off the topic, but I would shy away from recommending C.S. Lewis. Lewis believed and promoted a number of errors. Lewis denied _penal substitutionary atonement_; he believed Christ paid a debt (which is true), but not as a punishment for our sakes. Lewis' golden lion, Aslan, in the fictional Narnia stories was sacrificed to the Witch, which was called "deeper magic." Did Aslan die for our sins? No. Lewis also promoted an inclusivism, in which we can supposedly be made righteous enough to stand before God through adhering to the "good" elements of a false religion. In the Narnia stories, Lewis also had Emeth, a worshiper of Tash, be accepted by Aslan for following him all along without knowing it. Lewis believed that our souls demand purgatory for purification before going to heaven, which detracts from the blood of Jesus which purifies us from all sins, 1 John 1:7. Lewis believed in theistic evolution, which undermines Biblical authority and implies death before sin, that death is natural, not the penalty for sin (what good did the death of Jesus Christ accomplish then?); Lewis also believed the the Genesis creation account to be "myth." Lewis said he had been having strange dreams about lions when he began writing the Narnia stories and also said that "Aslan is a divine figure." And Lewis even went so far as to say that when a child "thinks he is loving Aslan, he is really loving Jesus: and perhaps loving Him more than he ever did before." See page 438 of C.S. Lewis: A Complete Guide to His Life & Works By Walter Hooper. It is not okay to love and worship the Lord through any false image made to represent Him. Aslan is just another idol and a beastly one at that. Israel's idolatrous golden calf and Lewis' golden lion both serve the same purpose and function: images of four-footed beasts used by "God's people" to be images of the same Savior, Jesus. "Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus [KJV, NASB: the Lord, Greek: kurios], who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe." (Jude 1:5, ESV) cf. "He took the gold from their hands, fashioned it with an engraving tool, and made it into an image of a calf. Then they said, "Israel, this is your God, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!" When Aaron saw this, he built an altar before it; then he made an announcement: "There will be a festival to the LORD tomorrow."" (Exodus 32:4-5, cf. 28, 35, HCSB) & cf. Nehemiah 9:16-19; Psalm 106:19-22.

Let's turn from Lewis' false Christ to the Lord Jesus Christ as He is revealed in the Bible.


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## CuriousNdenver (Aug 17, 2013)

Matthew Willard Lankford said:


> Not to get off the topic, but I would shy away from recommending C.S. Lewis. Lewis believed and promoted a number of errors. Lewis denied penal substitutionary atonement; he believed Christ paid a debt (which is true), but not as a punishment for our sakes. Lewis' golden lion, Aslan, in the fictional Narnia stories was sacrificed to the Witch, which was called "deeper magic." Did Aslan die for our sins? No. Lewis also promoted an inclusivism, in which we can supposedly be made righteous enough to stand before God through adhering to the "good" elements of a false religion. In the Narnia stories, Lewis also had Emeth, a worshiper of Tash, be accepted by Aslan for following him all along without knowing it. Lewis believed that our souls demand purgatory for purification before going to heaven, which detracts from the blood of Jesus which purifies us from all sins, 1 John 1:7. Lewis believed in theistic evolution, which undermines Biblical authority and implies death before sin, that death is natural, not the penalty for sin (what good did the death of Jesus Christ accomplish then?); Lewis also believed the the Genesis creation account to be "myth." Lewis said he had been having strange dreams about lions when he began writing the Narnia stories and also said that "Aslan is a divine figure." And Lewis even went so far as to say that when a child "thinks he is loving Aslan, he is really loving Jesus: and perhaps loving Him more than he ever did before." See page 438 of C.S. Lewis: A Complete Guide to His Life & Works By Walter Hooper. It is not okay to love and worship the Lord through any false image made to represent Him. Aslan is just another idol and a beastly one at that. Israel's idolatrous golden calf and Lewis' golden lion both serve the same purpose and function: images of four-footed beasts used by "God's people" to be images of the same Savior, Jesus. "Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus [KJV, NASB: the Lord, Greek: kurios], who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe." (Jude 1:5, ESV) cf. "He took the gold from their hands, fashioned it with an engraving tool, and made it into an image of a calf. Then they said, "Israel, this is your God, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!" When Aaron saw this, he built an altar before it; then he made an announcement: "There will be a festival to the LORD tomorrow."" (Exodus 32:4-5, cf. 28, 35, HCSB) & cf. Nehemiah 9:16-19; Psalm 106:19-22.
> 
> Let's turn from Lewis' false Christ to the Lord Jesus Christ as He is revealed in the Bible.



I knew Lewis had some theological errors, but I was not aware they went this deeply. 

What are some specific books written for non-believers or new believers that would address Christianity in a non-technical, easy reading style? Some of the small eBooks I saw on the Ligonier page looked like they may be helpful if written for laymen, but I've not read them. http://www.ligonier.org/blog/rc-spr...rg&utm_medium=HomeFeature&utm_campaign=FreeCQ

It's hard for me to think of anything written in the popular style that is Biblically sound. When I think popular style, I think of the NYT Best Seller's List. The "Christian" books that made that list and come to my mind are the likes of, "The Shack," "Purpose Driven Life," "Blue like Jazz" and "90 Minutes in Heaven." I couldn't recommend any of them, but surely there must be something written from a theologically sound position that speaks to this potential audience?


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## arapahoepark (Aug 30, 2013)

Just bumping it up....


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## CuriousNdenver (Aug 30, 2013)

What about Lee Strobel's "A Case for Christ"? He's not reformed, that I am aware of, but I believe it is a solid book, aimed at a general audience and written in a straightforward manner.

I'm surprised that others have not suggested something written in an easy-reading style.


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## arapahoepark (Aug 30, 2013)

CuriousNdenver said:


> What about Lee Strobel's "A Case for Christ"? He's not reformed, that I am aware of, but I believe it is a solid book, aimed at a general audience and written in a straightforward manner.
> 
> I'm surprised that others have not suggested something written in an easy-reading style.


Thanks! I totally forgot about him!


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## CuriousNdenver (Aug 30, 2013)

arap said:


> Thanks! I totally forgot about him!



He lives in Castle Rock now. He is a former legal editor for The Chicago Tribune, and he came to Christ as a result of interviews he conducted ostensibly, to prove Christianity was false. I met him a few years ago at a conference.


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## SolaSaint (Aug 30, 2013)

Whatever you do stay away from recommending Bill O'Reilly 's book. I listen to his show a lot and he is no theologian plus he is lost.


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## arapahoepark (Aug 30, 2013)

SolaSaint said:


> Whatever you do stay away from recommending Bill O'Reilly 's book. I listen to his show a lot and he is no theologian plus he is lost.


I only watch for Watters world and Dennis Miller and some others he interviews not but I dont watch it for him; he can have good social commentary occassionally, but I do agree with you.


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## GloriousBoaz (Aug 31, 2013)

Matthew Willard Lankford said:


> Not to get off the topic, but I would shy away from recommending C.S. Lewis. Lewis believed and promoted a number of errors. Lewis denied penal substitutionary atonement; he believed Christ paid a debt (which is true), but not as a punishment for our sakes. Lewis' golden lion, Aslan, in the fictional Narnia stories was sacrificed to the Witch, which was called "deeper magic." Did Aslan die for our sins? No. Lewis also promoted an inclusivism, in which we can supposedly be made righteous enough to stand before God through adhering to the "good" elements of a false religion. In the Narnia stories, Lewis also had Emeth, a worshiper of Tash, be accepted by Aslan for following him all along without knowing it. Lewis believed that our souls demand purgatory for purification before going to heaven, which detracts from the blood of Jesus which purifies us from all sins, 1 John 1:7. Lewis believed in theistic evolution, which undermines Biblical authority and implies death before sin, that death is natural, not the penalty for sin (what good did the death of Jesus Christ accomplish then?); Lewis also believed the the Genesis creation account to be "myth." Lewis said he had been having strange dreams about lions when he began writing the Narnia stories and also said that "Aslan is a divine figure." And Lewis even went so far as to say that when a child "thinks he is loving Aslan, he is really loving Jesus: and perhaps loving Him more than he ever did before." See page 438 of C.S. Lewis: A Complete Guide to His Life & Works By Walter Hooper. It is not okay to love and worship the Lord through any false image made to represent Him. Aslan is just another idol and a beastly one at that. Israel's idolatrous golden calf and Lewis' golden lion both serve the same purpose and function: images of four-footed beasts used by "God's people" to be images of the same Savior, Jesus. "Now I want to remind you, although you once fully knew it, that Jesus [KJV, NASB: the Lord, Greek: kurios], who saved a people out of the land of Egypt, afterward destroyed those who did not believe." (Jude 1:5, ESV) cf. "He took the gold from their hands, fashioned it with an engraving tool, and made it into an image of a calf. Then they said, "Israel, this is your God, who brought you up from the land of Egypt!" When Aaron saw this, he built an altar before it; then he made an announcement: "There will be a festival to the LORD tomorrow."" (Exodus 32:4-5, cf. 28, 35, HCSB) & cf. Nehemiah 9:16-19; Psalm 106:19-22.



You forgot Lewis' reference to the witch being a descendant of Lilth, which historically Lilth is a reference from the Jewish mystical books the Zohar if i remember correctly to which Lilth was supposed to be Adam's first wife that wouldn't submit to his authority by wanting to have sexual relations in a manner other than missionary position so that she could be more dominating, to which she is banished and now still roams the earth causing sudden infant death syndrom and God then fashioned Eve for Adam. I never knew how or why Lewis would use that reference, but I have a friend how loves his space trilogy and he said it is like reading a theologian who has melded with a mythology fanatic so maybe that's all it was in Lewis' mind mythology and fiction.

I was going to recommend Gary Habermas on the "case for the resurrection of Jesus", or possibly Josh Mcdowell, perhaps his book "more than a carpenter' is very easy reading and really struck me right before I was regenerated by God.


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## CuriousNdenver (Aug 31, 2013)

Though C.S. Lewis had flawed theology, I don't think he intended his Narnia series to be taken as a literal metaphor for Christianity.

Many here on the board enjoy reading his works, but since some of them could be misconstrued by a new believer, it may not be the best recommendation in this case.

This thread opens my eyes to the relative scarcity of theologically sound books written in an easy-reading style for newer believers or even those who are not yet believers.


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## Matthew Willard Lankford (Aug 31, 2013)

> C.S. Lewis had flawed theology,



Yes. Lewis had a flawed, horrible, terrible, awful theology.



> I don't think he intended his Narnia series to be taken as a literal metaphor for Christianity. Many here on the board enjoy reading his works,



As we are to take heed what we hear (Mark 4:24 cf. Job 12:11; 34:3; 1 Thess. 5:21-22), so we should take heed what we read. In these days it is better not to read with the multitude. Lewis said that "Aslan is a divine figure" and he thought Christ "would become a Talking Beast" in the world of Narnia and he "pictured Him becoming a lion there." I don't know what would repulse you from Lewis' works if the selection below doesn't; it is the response Lewis gave to a mother, who had a child who became worried that he was committing idol-worship by loving Aslan more than Jesus.



> Laurence can't really love Aslan more than Jesus, even if he feels that' what he is doing. For the things he loves Aslan for doing or saying are simply the things Jesus really did and said. So that when Laurence thinks he is loving Aslan, he is really loving Jesus: and perhaps loving Him more than he ever did before. Of course there is one thing Aslan has that Jesus has not - I mean, the body of a lion. (But remember, if there are other worlds and they need to be saved and Christ were to save them - as He would - He may really have taken all sorts of bodies in them which we don't know about.) Now if Laurence is bothered because he find the lion-body seems nicer to him than the man-body, I don't think he need be bothered at all. God knows all about the way a little boy's imagination works (He made it, after all) and knows that at a certain age the idea of talking and friendly animals is very attractive. So I don't think He minds if Laurence likes the Lion-body. And anyway, Laurence will find as he grows older, that feeling (liking the lion-body better) will die away of itself, without his taking any trouble about it. So he needn't bother.



On the positive side, I think a Gospel Harmony with good commentary or explanatory footnotes, would be the way to go. However, these books might be worth investigating as alternatives to some of the garbage out there (I haven't read them yet, but some of the reviews are good):
_
FROM TORONTO TO EMMAUS: The Empty Tomb and the Journey from Skepticism to Faith_ by James R. White 
_
Reinventing Jesus - How Contemporary Skeptics Miss the Real Jesus and Mislead Popular Culture_ by J. Ed Komszewsi, M. James Sawyer, and Daniel B. Wallace

_Pierced for Our Transgressions: Rediscovering the Glory of Penal Substitution_ Paperback by Steve Jeffery, Michael Ovey, Andrew Sach


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## GloriousBoaz (Sep 1, 2013)

Great list of books Matthew!



> This thread opens my eyes to the relative scarcity of theologically sound books written in an easy-reading style for newer believers or even those who are not yet believers.


Fo Real! lol, seriously this is something I have been contemplating a lot. I think that is surely why Wayne Grudem's systematic theology is so popular right now because I've heard he has a real gift for making abstract concepts into your average Joe wording. Its like when we look at the archaeological evidence for the NT and for so many years people were like "why doesn't the NT Greek sound like the classical Greek (Homer, Aristotle etc)" then they found some bills and grocery lists, wills, stuff like that, in an ancient dump and it was the style of the NT Greek and so we call NT Greek Koine today, meaning "Common" or "Average". And that is the exact reason I despise the KJV only heresy.



> I don't know what would repulse you from Lewis' works if the selection below doesn't; it is the response Lewis gave to a mother, who had a child who became worried that he was committing idol-worship by loving Aslan more than Jesus.
> 
> Laurence can't really love Aslan more than Jesus, even if he feels that' what he is doing. For the things he loves Aslan for doing or saying are simply the things Jesus really did and said. So that when Laurence thinks he is loving Aslan, he is really loving Jesus: and perhaps loving Him more than he ever did before. Of course there is one thing Aslan has that Jesus has not - I mean, the body of a lion. (But remember, if there are other worlds and they need to be saved and Christ were to save them - as He would - He may really have taken all sorts of bodies in them which we don't know about.) Now if Laurence is bothered because he find the lion-body seems nicer to him than the man-body, I don't think he need be bothered at all. God knows all about the way a little boy's imagination works (He made it, after all) and knows that at a certain age the idea of talking and friendly animals is very attractive. So I don't think He minds if Laurence likes the Lion-body. And anyway, Laurence will find as he grows older, that feeling (liking the lion-body better) will die away of itself, without his taking any trouble about it. So he needn't bother.



Wow! That is disturbing. Its pretty much the same thing that makes me uneasy about consubstantiation and those in the Lutheran church who say that the worship bread and wine.


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