# Pope Francis allegedly declares that "there is no hell" in interview



## Haeralis (Mar 29, 2018)

http://www.newsweek.com/does-hell-e...interview-could-change-catholic-church-866010

The Vatican predictably jumps into defense mode and denies that the interview ever happened. Even if he did not utter these remarks in an interview format, it doubtless represents the Pope's universalist leanings. 

Consider:
https://www.opc.org/nh.html?article_id=722

https://timothyjhammons.com/2016/04/17/the-pope-embraces-universalism/

https://www.americamagazine.org/fai...-must-unite-against-intolerance-prejudice-and


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 29, 2018)

Good 'ol Francis.... selling off the family farm.....

Reactions: Funny 4


----------



## Bill The Baptist (Mar 29, 2018)

Haeralis said:


> http://www.newsweek.com/does-hell-e...interview-could-change-catholic-church-866010
> 
> The Vatican predictably jumps into defense mode and denies that the interview ever happened. Even if he did not utter these remarks in an interview format, it doubtless represents the Pope's universalist leanings.
> 
> ...



Technically, what he was espousing was annihilationism and not universalism.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## jw (Mar 29, 2018)

Well, when you presume to stand in Christ's stead, no lie would ever seem off limits.

Reactions: Like 4


----------



## Tom Hart (Mar 30, 2018)

Whom do we believe? The Vatican says the journalist was lying, but to be honest the alleged comments do not seem too far off of Francis's theology.

Reactions: Like 2


----------



## Pergamum (Mar 30, 2018)

It seems that the old rhetorical question of, "Is the Pope Catholic?!" is now a legit question.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 3


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 30, 2018)

The following video is very pertinent to the discussion. In the Ligonier video, this guy spells out the radical shift in emphasis at Vatican II and that Francis is the embodiment of that council. It is worth the 20-25 minutes, for sure. The speaker is a Protestant with a pastorate and para-church in Rome.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Rangerus (Mar 30, 2018)

funny thing is this is the fifth interview he has conducted with La Repubblica founder Eugenio Scalfar and each time the Vatican refutes the interview. will they ever learn?

Reactions: Funny 1


----------



## TylerRay (Mar 30, 2018)

I'm almost embarrassed by Francis on behalf of the Papists. They really put a loose canon on the throne.

Reactions: Funny 2


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 30, 2018)

TylerRay said:


> I'm almost embarrassed by Francis on behalf of the Papists. They really put a loose canon on the throne.



No doubt, Tyler. My extended family is hard-core R.C. and they are embarrassed about Francis.....


----------



## hammondjones (Mar 30, 2018)

Wasn't ex cathedra, so it doesn't count.


----------



## Tom Hart (Mar 30, 2018)

hammondjones said:


> Wasn't ex cathedra, so it doesn't count.



Right. If it's true, then the defence would be that it's not one of those infallible statements. The pope is not said to be infallible in all circumstances, so some of the headlines are misleading.


----------



## RBachman (Mar 30, 2018)

_______________________________________

WCF 25 VI. There is no other head of the Church but the Lord Jesus Christ: nor can the Pope of Rome in any sense be head thereof; but is that Antichrist, that man of sin and son of perdition, that exalteth himself in the Church against Christ, and all that is called God.

I do wonder: can a pope be impeached? I'm not sure I really care, but it is an interesting question.

Or better yet, what if God is using the current Pope to rescue His elect from that false church?

Ro9:22, 23 (ESV) _What if God, desiring to show his wrath and to make known his power, has endured with much patience vessels of wrath prepared for destruction, in order to make known the riches of his glory for vessels of mercy, which he has prepared beforehand for glory—_


----------



## Dachaser (Mar 30, 2018)

TylerRay said:


> I'm almost embarrassed by Francis on behalf of the Papists. They really put a loose canon on the throne.


Per Catholic theology though, when he speaks on theology and practices for the Church of Rome, is he not speaking on behalf of God, as the Vicar of Christ?


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 30, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> Per Catholic theology though, when he speaks on theology and practices for the Church of Rome, is he not speaking on behalf of God, as the Vicar of Christ?



He is not speaking authoritatively or, as you say, "for God" all the time, regardless of the topic, but only when it is deemed "ex cathedra". This gives Catholics a back door when someone like Francis speaks foolishly.


----------



## Dachaser (Mar 30, 2018)

Gforce9 said:


> He is not speaking authoritatively or, as you say, "for God" all the time, regardless of the topic, all the time, but only when it is deemed "ex cathedra". This gives Catholics a back door when someone like Francis speaks foolishly.


Thanks, as I did not know that the Pope is not considered to be infallible unless under certain situations.


----------



## Romans922 (Mar 30, 2018)

He is the antichrist, what do you expect?

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## greenbaggins (Mar 30, 2018)

Gforce9 said:


> The following video is very pertinent to the discussion. In the Ligonier video, this guy spells out the radical shift in emphasis at Vatican II and that Francis is the embodiment of that council. It is worth the 20-25 minutes, for sure. The speaker is a Protestant with a pastorate and para-church in Rome.



This guy is one of the two very best commentators on Roman Catholicism alive today, the other being Gregg Allison.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Haeralis (Mar 30, 2018)

greenbaggins said:


> This guy is one of the two very best commentators on Roman Catholicism alive today, the other being Gregg Allison.



I'd include Dr. James White in that list, but yeah, I agree that all of those men know their stuff. Leonardo De Chirico has a great online resource named VaticanFiles.

I just a few minutes ago had a depressing discussion with an Arminian "Protestant" who believed that Roman Catholicism and Eastern Orthodoxy were different "flavors" of Christianity but are equally true and not substantively different from classical Protestantism. Why did he think this? Because in his view the "Gospel" is just an ethical code of moral living. It seems like once you abandon monergism for any kind of synergism, Arminian or otherwise, you really lose the ground to oppose the Church of Rome. This person's theology was more similar to Erasmus than to any of the Reformers. Hopefully he has a personal relationship with Christ and just doesn't really understand what that means doctrinally speaking.


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 30, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> Thanks, as I did not know that the Pope is not considered to be infallible unless under certain situations.



When he waves his magic wand and sits in the Lazy Boy, he's official!

Reactions: Funny 2


----------



## Edward (Mar 30, 2018)

Gforce9 said:


> In the Ligonier video, this guy spells out the radical shift in emphasis at Vatican II and that Francis is the embodiment of that council.



It's my recollection that Benedict, not Francis, was a key player at Vatican II, and that Francis is betraying Benedict's work, not embodying it. Francis would have been about 26 when VII kicked off. 

I'd identify Francis more with Liberation Theology rather than Vatican II theology, although he invokes VII to justify his actions.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Gforce9 (Mar 30, 2018)

Edward said:


> It's my recollection that Benedict, not Francis, was a key player at Vatican II, and that Francis is betraying Benedict's work, not embodying it. Francis would have been about 26 when VII kicked off.
> 
> I'd identify Francis more with Liberation Theology rather than Vatican II theology, although he invokes VII to justify his actions.



Check out the video. Leonardo di Chirico makes the case that V II included both.....


----------



## dtaylor3 (Apr 1, 2018)

Haeralis said:


> http://www.newsweek.com/does-hell-e...interview-could-change-catholic-church-866010
> 
> The Vatican predictably jumps into defense mode and denies that the interview ever happened. Even if he did not utter these remarks in an interview format, it doubtless represents the Pope's universalist leanings.
> 
> ...


This is no surprise considering what we have seen from this pope in his time in office.

This is precisely why the church was never setup biblically to follow one man, but rather sola Scriptura!


----------



## Gforce9 (Apr 1, 2018)

hammondjones said:


> Wasn't ex cathedra, so it doesn't count.



The famous answer when it's time to back-pedal and cause a diversion after a public foot-in-mouth event.


----------



## hammondjones (Apr 2, 2018)

Gforce9 said:


> The famous answer when it's time to back-pedal and cause a diversion after a public foot-in-mouth event.



Next time I play golf, I'm not taking a mulligan, I'm taking a francis.

Reactions: Like 2 | Funny 1


----------



## Ask Mr. Religion (Apr 3, 2018)

The finger of God pointing:

https://www.christianpost.com/news/...laims-pope-saying-hell-does-not-exist-222316/


----------



## Tom Hart (Apr 10, 2018)

The Pope of Rome has at long last issued an answer.

https://mobile.reuters.com/article/amp/idUSKBN1HG2GY


----------



## Dachaser (Apr 10, 2018)

The Pope affirmed that Satan exists, but where is his take on hell here?


----------



## Tom Hart (Apr 10, 2018)

Dachaser said:


> The Pope affirmed that Satan exists, but where is his take on hell here?



I found that to be curiously absent also, going by the news article alone. I didn't read through the actual document.

Reactions: Like 1


----------



## Ask Mr. Religion (Apr 18, 2018)

Child claims atheist father was a good man and asks about his final destination:

The Pope answers:
https://aleteia.org/2018/04/16/crying-little-boy-asks-pope-if-his-atheist-dad-could-be-in-heaven/


----------



## Tom Hart (Apr 18, 2018)

Ask Mr. Religion said:


> Child claims atheist father was a good man and asks about his final destination:
> 
> The Pope answers:
> https://aleteia.org/2018/04/16/crying-little-boy-asks-pope-if-his-atheist-dad-could-be-in-heaven/



Saw this. He advocates some kind of good works universalism. And this time the Vatican can't deny it happened!

Reactions: Like 3


----------

