# Theistic evolution



## Scott (Jul 8, 2005)

Does anyone know of any resources on how theistic evolutionists of conservative churches address issues like these:

[1] Were Adam and Eve literal people?
[2] If [1] is yes, then at what point were they "created" - when they were born from some lower life form with mutations distinguishing them from the life form?
[3] Could Adam have been cro-magnon or neanderthal?

Thanks


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## rmwilliamsjr (Jul 8, 2005)

check out:
http://www.ualberta.ca/~dlamoure/3EvoCr.htm
http://www.reality.org.nz/articles/28/28-broom.html
and of course terry gray at:
http://www.asa3.org/gray/evolution_trial/

1-yes
2-either God created them with a pattern in mind that had evolved or fashioned from pre-adamite. google "old earth, young adam" for more
3-no neanderthals are a parallel branch to homo sapiens not an ancestor, cro-magnon man had burials, art, and religious artifacts., so possibly


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## biblelighthouse (Jul 8, 2005)

Scientists have determined that Neanderthals are NOT human . . . their DNA was markedly different from ours.

(That probably doesn't have anything to do with this discussion in one way or the other . . . but it is still a kind of interesting piece of info.)


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## Larry Hughes (Jul 8, 2005)

[3] Could Adam have been cro-magnon or neanderthal?

No, that would make Adam an idiot with intelligence on the level of an animal. Adam's mind pre-fall would have been considered super geneous as sin had not damaged it - compared to the likes of even our best like Einstein and so forth. Furthermore, God's Word is clear: Adam was set over the animals in superiority to rule them, he did not evolve or issue forth from that which he was set over. The flow is from God sovereign over all, man, animals not animals, man then God. Evolution fundamentally usurps and reverses the order of sovereignty. All that to say man was made in God's image and not the animal kingdoms.

[2] God created them "as is". Systematic evolution has zero backing, that's why they went to superstitions like "chance" theory and "spontaneous generation" (same thing) theory. Just "poof" for no reason.

[Edited on 7-9-2005 by Larry Hughes]


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## just_grace (Jul 8, 2005)

*After the fall...*

When God expelled Adam and his partner from the 'Garden' they were clothed with animal skins! 3 things come to mind, a sacrifice provided from God, hence the skins, they left Paradise ( Garden ) also a curse was laid on them. I think nature, tooth and claw lay outside of Eden.

[Edited on 7-9-2005 by just_grace]


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## ChristianTrader (Jul 8, 2005)

> _Originally posted by biblelighthouse_
> Scientists have determined that Neanderthals are NOT human . . . their DNA was markedly different from ours.
> 
> (That probably doesn't have anything to do with this discussion in one way or the other . . . but it is still a kind of interesting piece of info.)



I do not think anything of the sort has been determined or proven. It might have been claimed but proof is a whole different ball of wax.

The biggest issue is how much difference in DNA should be expected before one assumes that one is dealing with another species.

CT

[Edited on 7-9-2005 by ChristianTrader]


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## Robin (Jul 8, 2005)

At this day, the earth sustains on her bosom many monster minds, minds which are not afraid to employ the seed of Deity deposited in human nature as a means of suppressing the name of God. Can anything be more detestable than this madness in man, who, finding God a hundred times both in his body and his soul, makes his excellence in this respect a pretext for denying that there is a God? He will not say that chance has made him different from the brutes; but, substituting Nature as the architect of the universe, he suppresses the name of God.- John Calvin



Robin


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## Larry Hughes (Jul 9, 2005)

Robin,

As a Christian & geologist - That is a great quote & point. I've used a similar Calvin quote before.

Ldh


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## just_grace (Jul 26, 2005)

*Beginnings...*

When Adam and Eve were expelled from Eden they had animal skins for clothing which for me brings back thoughts from school such as cavemen etc but for me I cannot imagine Adam and Eve being ugly, hairy, violent raw meat eating and basically very stupid communicating with the words 'ugg' and oogga googa.

And yet they would have had to fend for themselves seeing they were no longer in the 'Garden'

I have said before that I believe nature tooth and claw lay outside of the Garden.

I have no problem with the dinosaur issue either, they are still with us, look at the crocodile and other reptiles, dinosaurs if ever I saw one


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## Puritanhead (Jul 26, 2005)

"œI BELIEVE that God wants me to be president." -Dubya


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## LarryCook (Jul 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Robin_
> At this day, the earth sustains on her bosom many monster minds, minds which are not afraid to employ the seed of Deity deposited in human nature as a means of suppressing the name of God. Can anything be more detestable than this madness in man, who, finding God a hundred times both in his body and his soul, makes his excellence in this respect a pretext for denying that there is a God? He will not say that chance has made him different from the brutes; but, substituting Nature as the architect of the universe, he suppresses the name of God.- John Calvin
> 
> 
> ...



I'm reading this thinking that these are Robin's words...wow, I think to myself, she's gettin real serious here, not to mention eloquent. Honestly, I thought she was making a good point until I got to the end and saw John Calvin's name. Of course, it's still a good point.

Larry


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## Robin (Jul 26, 2005)

> _Originally posted by just_grace_
> When Adam and Eve were expelled from Eden they had animal skins for clothing which for me brings back thoughts from school such as cavemen etc but for me I cannot imagine Adam and Eve being ugly, hairy, violent raw meat eating and basically very stupid communicating with the words 'ugg' and oogga googa.
> 
> And yet they would have had to fend for themselves seeing they were no longer in the 'Garden'
> ...



 And.....


I wonder if the animal skins that God used to clothe His people remind us of not only the OT system of slain animals in Temple sacrifice as their blood covered (in type-only) the sins of the people; but the NT (reality) of Christ's slain blood to cover sinners?

Covenant activity???

Also...perhaps it's no small matter that God endowed Adam as a "king" in the sense that he was given dominion over God's dwelling place (the Garden?) Maybe this is why Christ is the Second Adam? The "Adam" that would finally succeed in obeying the commission of royal vassal and obtain the original blessing held-out to the failed-Adam: eternal life.

 

Robin

[Edited on 7-26-2005 by Robin]


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