# Masters and maybe PHD in Philosophy



## T.A.G. (Nov 22, 2009)

Secular or Seminary?
Which schools do you suggest?


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## Oecolampadius (Nov 22, 2009)

Why a Ph.D. in Philosophy? Are you planning to teach philosophy at a college in the future?


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## GD (Nov 22, 2009)

I’m an early church history guy, so I can only offer a second-hand recommendation. A good friend recently finished his MA and after careful research and input from his favorite professors applied to sixteen PhD programs. Looking at his list, I think it is a good selection of really high-quality programs that aren’t so selective as to make applying the equivalent of buying a lottery ticket.

They are: 
Notre Dame
UVA
UNC
Purdue
St. Louis
Cincinnati 
Ohio State
Baylor
South Carolina
Georgia
Vanderbilt
Florida State
Florida
Memphis
Tennessee
Duke


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## Ivan (Nov 22, 2009)

My understanding that a degree from a secular university will serve you well in finding a job. I don't know if Marquette is one of the tough programs to get into, but I thought it had a good program too. It's located in Milwaukee.


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## Philip (Nov 22, 2009)

I'm looking into this myself for after college. The way it goes is that you go for your PhD and the masters is sort of a consolation prize if you end up dropping out.

I'm not aware of any seminaries offering Philosophy programs.


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## T.A.G. (Nov 22, 2009)

Chippy said:


> Why a Ph.D. in Philosophy? Are you planning to teach philosophy at a college in the future?



I am praying about my future so this is an option

-----Added 11/22/2009 at 08:49:36 EST-----



P. F. Pugh said:


> I'm looking into this myself for after college. The way it goes is that you go for your PhD and the masters is sort of a consolation prize if you end up dropping out.
> 
> I'm not aware of any seminaries offering Philosophy programs.



Yeah thats also what I was confused on, thats interesting...


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## GD (Nov 22, 2009)

P. F. Pugh said:


> The way it goes is that you go for your PhD and the masters is sort of a consolation prize if you end up dropping out.



At different schools the Masters degree is awarded...
-when coursework is done and comprehensive exams are passed (the_ MA in Passing_)
-when the Ph.D. is awarded (the _Bonus MA_)
-if your dissertation is rejected with no opportunity for revision (the dreaded _Consolation MA_)

The harsh reality is that although many schools take BA applicants, one may experience a really hard time competing for admission without an MA. Not to sound cynical, but this situation also allows schools to take people as (unsubsidized) MA students for a year or two before allowing them into (subsidized) PhD slots.



P. F. Pugh said:


> I'm not aware of any seminaries offering Philosophy programs.



True. For those looking for a seminary for an MA in philosophy, Trinity, Talbot, and (surprisingly) Liberty* have sent many students on to PhD programs elsewhere. 



*I did my MDiv-Bib Studies at Liberty and was so impressed by their unique presentation of their distinctive theology that I became Reformed instead. Their MA in Philosophy of Religion has different (and largely non-dispensational) faculty, and a better reputation.


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## T.A.G. (Nov 22, 2009)

David G said:


> P. F. Pugh said:
> 
> 
> > The way it goes is that you go for your PhD and the masters is sort of a consolation prize if you end up dropping out.
> ...



What would you suggest that one should do if they wanted to pursue a Master or PHD in Philosophy?

I am trying to work all my options


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## DMcFadden (Nov 22, 2009)

Biola has one of the most impressive faculties in philosophy for the M.A. They were also written up in _Christianity Today _a while back for having an enviable record of placing their grads in top PhD programs.

My recommendation would be to get your M.A. at a solidly evangelical institution before getting your PhD at a top university (personally I would recommend Biola M.A., Notre Dame PhD).


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## cih1355 (Nov 22, 2009)

P. F. Pugh said:


> I'm looking into this myself for after college. The way it goes is that you go for your PhD and the masters is sort of a consolation prize if you end up dropping out.
> 
> I'm not aware of any seminaries offering Philosophy programs.



Denver Seminary offers an M.A. in Philosophy of Religion.


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## Ivan (Nov 22, 2009)

P. F. Pugh said:


> I'm not aware of any seminaries offering Philosophy programs.



SBTS – The School of Theology – Doctor of Philosophy


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## cbryant (Nov 22, 2009)

If you are going to do Philosophy, make sure you get into a program that offers full funding to you (Free tuition plus stipen (spl)). This will probably rule out seminaries in general (though there are some that do offer full funding, but usually they are not evangelical).


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## T.A.G. (Nov 22, 2009)

DMcFadden said:


> Biola has one of the most impressive faculties in philosophy for the M.A. They were also written up in _Christianity Today _a while back for having an enviable record of placing their grads in top PhD programs.
> 
> My recommendation would be to get your M.A. at a solidly evangelical institution before getting your PhD at a top university (personally I would recommend Biola M.A., Notre Dame PhD).



wow thanks very much!


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## DMcFadden (Nov 22, 2009)

Ivan, if he wants to do any teaching, SBTS would not be his best bet. A terminal degree from a large university would be his best "green card." Sometime listen to R.S. Clark opine on what he thinks of a PhD from a seminary! If one is seeking a teaching job in almost any university or in many seminaries, a university PhD would be a better ticket into the academy.


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## T.A.G. (Nov 22, 2009)

DMcFadden said:


> Ivan, if he wants to do any teaching, SBTS would not be his best bet. A terminal degree from a large university would be his best "green card." Sometime listen to R.S. Clark opine on what he thinks of a PhD from a seminary! If one is seeking a teaching job in almost any university or in many seminaries, a university PhD would be a better ticket into the academy.



Do you know anything about University of Texas's PHD program for Philosophy? Is it well respected?


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## cbryant (Nov 22, 2009)

The UT program is well respected but highly selective. A good resource is Philosophical Gourmet but if you are wanting to study continental philosophy rather than analytical then the philosophical gourmet won't be much help. Another school to check out is Institute for Christian Studies. They offer a Masters program validated by ICS and a Ph.D in cooperation with the Free University of Amsterdam. My advice is the same as before, before you start a program, be sure they are willing to fund you.


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## nate895 (Nov 25, 2009)

Sorry if this is hijacking the thread, but I thought it would be kind of pointless to start a whole new thread about undergrad schooling in the same subject.

I was looking to get an undergrad degree in philosophy, and then move on to Theological studies and either go on to get a Ph.D. in Philosophy* and primarily do Apologetics, or go into Theology. In any event, I would also be interested in knowing about the different programs for philosophy undergrads as well. I read that, when you are doing undergrad work at least, the college doesn't really matter and it is the graduate schooling that counts. Considering that, I was just planning on going to Portland State and surviving the secular onslaught for another two years (I'll have my AA when I graduate HS). Think that would be a decent plan?

*Is it "Ph.D. in Philosophy" or just "Ph.D." considering "Ph.D." stands for Doctor of Philosophy?


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## Theogenes (Nov 25, 2009)

nate895 said:


> Sorry if this is hijacking the thread, but I thought it would be kind of pointless to start a whole new thread about undergrad schooling in the same subject.
> 
> I was looking to get an undergrad degree in philosophy, and then move on to Theological studies and either go on to get a Ph.D. in Philosophy* and primarily do Apologetics, or go into Theology. In any event, I would also be interested in knowing about the different programs for philosophy undergrads as well. I read that, when you are doing undergrad work at least, the college doesn't really matter and it is the graduate schooling that counts. Considering that, I was just planning on going to Portland State and surviving the secular onslaught for another two years (I'll have my AA when I graduate HS). Think that would be a decent plan?
> 
> *Is it "Ph.D. in Philosophy" or just "Ph.D." considering "Ph.D." stands for Doctor of Philosophy?



I thought Ph.D. stood for "Piled higher and Deeper", at least that's what one of my professors told me...


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## nate895 (Nov 25, 2009)

Theogenes said:


> nate895 said:
> 
> 
> > Sorry if this is hijacking the thread, but I thought it would be kind of pointless to start a whole new thread about undergrad schooling in the same subject.
> ...



Considering the amount of debt most have probably accumulated by that point in your schooling, that is probably the truth. LOL


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## cih1355 (Nov 25, 2009)

Just out of curiosity, what can someone do with a philosophy degree besides teach?


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## nate895 (Nov 25, 2009)

cih1355 said:


> Just out of curiosity, what can someone do with a philosophy degree besides teach?



I am sure some government job will take you.


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## Andres (Nov 25, 2009)

okay, I am just going to throw in my own  (which doesn't mean much) 
I am in no way saying this is the case with the OP and nate895, but I have found that many men want to earn philosophy degrees and PhD's simply for the sake of earning them; in other words, it becomes an issue of pride. As others have already stated, unless you are going to teach at the college level, I am not sure why someone might pursue a PhD. You can still be well respected and considered intelligent without a PhD. (I hope)


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## nate895 (Nov 25, 2009)

Andres said:


> okay, I am just going to throw in my own  (which doesn't mean much)
> I am in no way saying this is the case with the OP and nate895, but I have found that many men want to earn philosophy degrees and PhD's simply for the sake of earning them; in other words, it becomes an issue of pride. As others have already stated, unless you are going to teach at the college level, I am not sure why someone might pursue a PhD. You can still be well respected and considered intelligent without a PhD. (I hope)



That's an important thing to consider when you are getting any high level academic degree, I'd think. The reason I wanted to get the degree was to be considered an "expert" if I went into Apologetics, and so I could teach either Apologetics or philosophy. For the most part, I think the vast majority of degrees are entirely worthless as far as an indication of the level of intelligence, but it is always nice to be able to say you're an expert on something when you go around writing, speaking, debating, and teaching a subject as I want to do.


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## Reformed Thomist (Nov 27, 2009)

cih1355 said:


> Just out of curiosity, what can someone do with a philosophy degree besides teach?



Would you like fries with that?

Seriously, though, your question should be asked about degrees in history, Classics, English, or political science. There is nothing that degrees in those subjects will get you that a degree in philosophy won't.


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