# Gifts in 1 Cor 12:8-10



## Bethel (Nov 12, 2011)

_1 Cor 12: 8-10 For to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, and to another the word of knowledge according to the same Spirit; to another faith by the same Spirit, and *to another gifts of healing by the one Spirit*, and to another the effecting of miracles, and to another prophecy, and to another the distinguishing of spirits, *to another various kinds of tongues*, and to another the interpretation of tongues. [NASB]_​


As a cessationist, I believe that after the apostolic period, individuals do not have the gifts of prophecy, healing, or tongues. In a polite group discussion, a friend referenced the 1 Cor passage above and said that she needs Scriptural proof that the bolded gifts in the above quote are no longer valid. I really didn't know how to respond because I don't have Scriptural proof for healing and tongues, although I did cite Rev 22:18 for prophecy. That didn't seem to make any impression because the group in general defined revelation as any Spirit-inspired encouragement or guidance where I defined prophecy as direct revelation from God.

I don't think I did a very good job in my response, so I'd appreciate any insight or articles that would help me develop a better way to express what I believe. Does anyone have a Scripture reference that the gifts of healing and tongues are no longer valid?


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## rookie (Nov 12, 2011)

First off, we need context to define what the Corinthians were doing with the gifts. If you notice, Paul was basically taking them to the wood shed and giving them a whoopin in the previous 11 chapters. I don't think the context has changed from chapter 11 to chapter 12. They were infact not using the gifts in the church context as highlighted by Paul.

The gift of tongues could also be called the "gift of hearing" as well. In Acts, Peter and the apostles were preaching in their own tongue, but the audience was listening in their own tongue. That would have been incredible to hear. Someone speaking English, but I hear it in French.

So as far as actual scripture, the context is the key. If they throw away the context....I question their interpretation...

I have a friend that is a Branhamite, and getting through to him on the context is nil.

Hope this helps.


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## Bethel (Nov 12, 2011)

rookie said:


> I don't think the context has changed from chapter 11 to chapter 12. They were infact not using the gifts in the church context as highlighted by Paul.



Yes, I agree. But I think her point is that the early Christians were given gifts by the Holy Spirit (even if they weren't using them); therefore, the Holy Spirit can give those same gifts to modern day believers because there's no Scriptural reference that tells us otherwise.



rookie said:


> The gift of tongues could also be called the "gift of hearing" as well. In Acts, Peter and the apostles were preaching in their own tongue, but the audience was listening in their own tongue. That would have been incredible to hear. Someone speaking English, but I hear it in French.



For some reason this reminded me of the UN. Maybe the gift of tongues is still around... {said facetiously}

---------- Post added at 03:12 PM ---------- Previous post was at 02:47 PM ----------

Ray--Thank you for your response. I read back through my response, and it didn't come across as sincere as I would have liked. I feel very inadequate about this topic which is making me question whether or not my charismatic friends are correct. I feel very critical about the way I handled the discussion, and I'm sure that God was not glorified in the conversation as He should have been.


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## southkogs (Nov 12, 2011)

I don't think that early Christians were given any more gifts than Christians are today. If you need to define who was given the gift of tongues ('cause it only says some) and who was given the gift of healing (again, only some were given) then attribute it to the Apostles. They got those gifts, and if nobody else ever has them then the verse stands (at least by the language that "some" were given ...").

To be honest, I don't have a problem saying that these gifts may not have ceased completely. Why? Because the Bible doesn't specifically say they have, and God is Sovereign and He can grant them if it suits His purpose. The problem with most modern iterations of these "gifts" is this sort of Christian mysticism that breeds a completely fantastic manifestation. Then after the "rock-concert" like display of the "gifts" everyone goes home totally deflated. People speak in tongues with no translation (required in scripture) or requirement of substantiation (an OT prophet who gave a "word" would be held to a capital punishment if it didn't come to pass). Healers often beat people on the foreheads for hours, send them home "whole" and they are right back in their affliction 24 hours later ... that's not the healing we see in the Bible.

If however, I heard tell of a preacher in the Middle East or China who was up against a language barrier, but felt the call to preach anyway - and God broke through so that people could understand him and hear the Gospel; I would want it substantiated, but I'd have a lot easier time believing that is possible. If I heard tell of an African Evangelist or a missionary to the Appalachian poor who felt God's leading to pray for the miraculous healing of people in a small village over several months - and God granted a real healing ministry to him in that time - I could believe in it.

Stadium settings where droves of people crowd in to a slick suited professional healer and he "gospel-gun's" 'em one by one ... doesn't fit the Biblical mold. It screams the "sons of Sceva."


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## rbcbob (Nov 12, 2011)

I believe that 1 Corinthians 13 is helpful in understanding your reference as well as supporting cessationism. Previously on PB I had posted the following but could not locate the link.

1 Corinthians 13:8-12
The context of this passage is that concerning the ignorance of the Christians in the church at Corinth regarding the relationship between gifts and graces. Paul reminds them that they can have extraordinary, phenomenal gifts and yet be destitute of love and thus be lost in their sins (vss. 1-3).
“He who does not love does not know God, for God is love.” ( 1 John 4:8)

Paul states at the end of the chapter in verse 13 that “love is the greatest”. Why is love the greatest? Because love never fails. Love will accompany you all the way into the eternal state. Not so with all the flashy phenomenal gifts that they were desiring.

1 Corinthians 13: 8 Love never fails εκπιπτει. But whether there are prophecies, they will fail καταργηθησονται; whether there are tongues, they will cease παυσονται; whether there is knowledge, it will vanish away καταργηθησονται. 

Verse eight contains a triad __ prophecy, tongues, and knowledge __ which are contrasted with another triad in verse thirteen __ faith, hope, and love. The second triad consists of things that remain, whereas the first triad consists of things that cease, fail, or vanish away.
With what are faith, hope, and love contrasted? They are contrasted with prophecy, tongues, and knowledge. It should be apparent that if we make both of these triads continue throughout this present age until Christ returns then the apostle’s intended contrast is destroyed!
Paul says that love never fails [εκπιπτει ] the word means to fall down from or out of. So the meaning is that Love will never fall from its exalted position.
•	But prophecies (the extraordinary gift) shall be καταργεω “reduced to inactivity”.
•	Tongues shall παυω “stop, cease, leave off”. Compare the use of the word in Heb. 10:2 and in 1Pet 4:1.
•	Knowledge likewise shall be καταργεω “reduced to inactivity”. In this context just what knowledge is Paul talking about? Not spiritual and divine knowledge in general for surely there will be such knowledge hereafter in heaven as well as now on earth, and vastly more … knowledge of God, Christ, and spiritual things shall not vanish away but shall gloriously increase. By the phrase ‘knowledge shall pass away’ is meant a particular miraculous gift (see 1Cor 12:8) that was in operation in the Church of God in those days.
This knowledge was a Revelatory gift, i.e. it involved revealing directly to the possessor of the gift the mind and will of God. This is evidenced by its association with prophecy and tongues.

9 For we know in part and we prophesy in part. 

Paul says that we know, literally “we are presently knowing” εκ μερους “out of that which is partial” or “out of a portion of the whole.” Knowledge and prophecy were then coming forth in the period of Partial Revelation as contrasted with Completed Revelation as is seen in the following verses.
10 But when that which is perfect has come, then that which is in part will be done away. 

“But” says Paul by way of contrast “when comes that which is perfect …” . This phrase το τελειον that which is perfect is pivotal to the interpretation of the passage. The two Greek words are Neuter in gender and should be rendered the perfect thing. Whatever Paul had in mind when he wrote το τελειον it was, in its grammatical identity something neuter. If he had in mind Christ he would no doubt have written the masculine ο τελειος He who is perfect . If what he was referring to was Christ’s return he would have written the feminine η τελεια as in the feminine τη παρουσια “the coming of our Lord” (1Thess 5:23). Whatever Paul did have in mind he alludes to it with the neuter το τελειον that perfect thing.
So what is that perfect thing? The meaning of το τελειον is that which is brought to its end; finished; wanting nothing necessary to completeness; perfect.
Again the question comes: what is that perfect, that completed thing that the apostle was pointing to? It must be something apposite and juxtaposed to that which is partial mentioned in the previous verse. It is Revelatory, and since the category of the partial is Revelation then the category of the complete must be Revelation.
That Perfect Thing is the completed, inscripturated Revelation; the finished Word of God in both the Old and New Testaments.

11 When I was a child, I spoke as a child, I understood as a child, I thought as a child; but when I became a man, I put away childish things. 
Paul here, by way of illustration, administers a rebuke to the Corinthians. They have been behaving childishly in regard to the Extraordinary Gifts in general and Speaking in Tongues in particular. He illustrates this by saying that when he was a child he spoke, understood, and thought as a child, i.e. childlishly!
When however, “he became γεγονα [perfect tense] a man ” ανηρ that is, he completely entered manhood, he remained a man and did not return to childhood. He put away childish things. So too he is telling the Corinthians that the Church would one day reach Revelatory maturity and never return to childhood again.
It is a sign of spiritual childishness to want to go back to the time of the Church’s childishness. The time of the church’s childishness was the time of the extraordinary phenomenal gifts!
12 For now we see in a mirror, dimly, but then face to face. Now I know in part, but then I shall know just as I also am known. 

Paul gives explanation here saying “For” or “Because” “we see now, at this present time, by means of a mirror [εσοπτρον _ a piece of highly polished metal ] dimly { αινιγματι literally, in an enigma, indistinctly}…
Paul’s point is that in their day the Corinthians, along with all other believers, had an uncompleted Bible; a partially polished metal shield in which they could dimly behold themselves. James had already taken up the imagery of a mirror in reference to the Word of God saying in chapter One and verse Twenty-three of his epistle “For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror εσοπτρον.
Paul again takes up this same imagery, although he employs a synonym of εσοπτρον in his second epistle to this same Corinthian church saying:
14 But their minds were blinded. For until this day the same veil remains unlifted in the reading of the Old Testament, because the veil is taken away in Christ.
15 But even to this day, when Moses is read, a veil lies on their heart.
16 Nevertheless when one turns to the Lord, the veil is taken away.
17 Now the Lord is the Spirit; and where the Spirit of the Lord is, there is liberty.
18 But we all, with unveiled face, beholding as in a mirror [κατοπτριζω participle from κατοπτρον ] the glory of the Lord, are being transformed into the same image from glory to glory, just as by the Spirit of the Lord.

So here in (13:12) Paul is showing them that in this era of partially completed revelation they see things dimly; they know things out of a part of an as yet uncompleted whole. But he points this out in order to bring out the contrast. This partiality and dimness have continued up to their present time, but….
Contrast relative to Time
“but then …” τοτε When? When that perfect thing i.e. the completed Scriptures have come. The Corinthians were seeing in their Hebrew bibles dimly, but then τοτε face to face προσωπον προς προσωπον 
Contrast relative to Quality
“face to face” How? Clearly as contrasted with dimly.
This phrase “face to face” has been popularly interpreted to mean the beholding God by the saints in glory. But the phrase as used in Scripture never refers to that glorious event. Rather the biblical usage consistently refers to the clear propositional revelation of the Word of God as contrasted with the less clear revelation of visions and dreams.
Numbers 12:6 Then He said, "Hear now My words: If there is a prophet among you, I, the LORD, make Myself known to him in a vision; I speak to him in a dream. 7 Not so with My servant Moses; He is faithful in all My house. 8 I speak with him face to face, Even plainly, and not in dark sayings; And he sees the form of the LORD. Why then were you not afraid To speak against My servant Moses?"
See also __ Exodus 33:9-11, 18-23; Deuteronomy 5:1-4
Thus Paul tells the Corinthians that then, when that perfect, completed thing has come their knowing shall no longer be dim but shall possess the precision that comes from the clear propositional revelation of God’s Word inscripturated and preserved to the Church to the end of the age.

13 And now abide faith, hope, love, these three; but the greatest of these is love.

Even though the phenomenal gifts of prophecy (direct revelation from God), tongues (languages known without being learned), and knowledge (intelligence never acquired by study) would not continue to abide in the Church throughout this age, and at the end of the age faith becomes sight (2Cor 5:6-7) and hope becomes fulfillment (Rom 8:22-25), nevertheless Love continues throughout eternity.


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