# Church or World or Both?



## chatwithstumac (Jul 10, 2015)

Is the parable of the tares (Matt. 13:24-30) about the world or the church or both?

Apparently, Augustine said it was solely about the church. I lean towards world because I believe this a parable saying, "all will be judged."

Let me know your thoughts.

Thank you.

In Christ,
Stu


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## Andrew P.C. (Jul 10, 2015)

Scripture is to be understood in light of covenants and covenantal language. We know that God works "by way of covenant" (WCF, 7:1) and thus there is a covenant keeper/breaker distinction. I believe one of the more clearer passages in the NT for this idea is seen in Hebrews 10:



> 29 How much severer punishment do you think he will deserve who has trampled under foot the Son of God, and has regarded as unclean the blood of the covenant by which he was sanctified, and has insulted the Spirit of grace? 30 For we know Him who said, “Vengeance is Mine, I will repay.” And again, “The Lord will judge His people.” 31 It is a terrifying thing to fall into the hands of the living God.



In this passage we see that God judges "HIS people". How would you understand this passage in light of your assumption that the "world" will be judged rather then those within the Church?


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## Pilgrim (Jul 10, 2015)

I would imagine that, although not explicitly stated, the question in the OP arises from v. 38* "The field is the world."*


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## johnny (Jul 10, 2015)

I have always equated this parable to mean the Church so I was surprised to read this.

<<QUOTE>> Pillar New Testament Commentary 

Carson makes an important point when he draws attention to the large number of commentators who interpret this parable of the church. But we should be clear that Matthew nowhere equates the kingdom with the church, and he explicitly says that this parable concerns the kingdom. Carson says, “The parable does not address the church situation at all but explains how the kingdom can be present in the world while not yet wiping out all opposition. That must await the harvest. The parable deals with eschatological expectation, not ecclesiological deterioration.” If we so choose, we may reflect that the situation described in the parable is much like what we see in our church, but we should not take this as Jesus’ meaning. He is talking about the kingdom


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## Peairtach (Jul 11, 2015)

> But we should be clear that Matthew nowhere equates the kingdom with the church, and he explicitly says that this parable concerns the kingdom.



Well this would tie in with Christ's mandate given to the Church to exercise church discipline and sanctions. If the parable was speaking about the Church you would that the impression that there is no such thing as church sanctions, wheras it is clear from other parts of the Gospels that there is.

Of course, the parable may also remind us - by the way - not to exercise over zealous and unwise church discipline, and that just as the world and the kingdom of God are sown with tares, the Church is never completely free of them even after the most biblical and careful church discipline and sanctions.

Christians on the other hand are to be careful about using the state as an agency of conversion/"conversion". People are saved by grace alone through faith alone in Christ alone, not by having a sword held to their throats or a gun held to their heads.


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## Ken (Jul 22, 2015)

Stu,

This is a very interesting question; given, there is a growing consistence that there have only ever been two belief systems, those who believe there are many paths to god; including, themselves, and the other being that Jesus is the only way, that God created all and is not a created being.

Paul touched on this in the book of Romans:
Romans 1:25: "_25 who changed the truth of God into a lie, and worshipped and served the creature more than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen._"

Basically, you have those who believe a lie worshipping the creation and those that have the truth of God.

Could this be the difference between the wheat and the tares?

God bless you and keep you,
Ken


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