# Any current RTS Jackson students out there?



## Awenwonder (Nov 17, 2009)

I am starting the MDIV program at RTS jackson this summer, 2010. Any current or new RTS Jackson students out there?

Tom Von Stroh


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## Bookmeister (Nov 17, 2009)

I think I am the only one on the PB. Patrick Severson and Andrew Barnes are recent grads.


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## kevin.carroll (Nov 17, 2009)

I am also a recent grad. You are in Mecca, my friend. Enjoy it.


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## Bookmeister (Nov 17, 2009)

Sorry Kevin, I did not realize you attended here, I will add you to my list.


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## fredtgreco (Nov 17, 2009)

I graduated in 2006. I have fond memories of my time there. It is an excellent school.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Bookmeister said:


> I think I am the only one on the PB. Patrick Severson and Andrew Barnes are recent grads.



Alan-What year are you right now?

-----Added 11/18/2009 at 11:59:37 EST-----



fredtgreco said:


> I graduated in 2006. I have fond memories of my time there. It is an excellent school.



Glad to hear, Fred! I have seen some of your posts regarding RTS Jackson on the board and that you have a very positive opinion. Care to elaborate? Any advice for an incoming student? I am going to be taking the Biblical Exegesis emphasis with Miles and the Counseling emphasis. Looking forward to learning from Miles, Guy, Derek, Ligon, etc. Thanks!


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## Bookmeister (Nov 18, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Bookmeister said:
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> > I think I am the only one on the PB. Patrick Severson and Andrew Barnes are recent grads.
> ...


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Bookmeister said:


> Von Stroh said:
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> > Bookmeister said:
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## Bookmeister (Nov 18, 2009)

Miles pedagogical approach is outstanding, he is very entertaining while at the same time making the material understandable. Hebrew is a very intimidating language even after taking Greek and Miles made it just a joy. Dan Timmer began teaching here this semester and I imagine he will pick up the slack the semester Miles is gone. Don't tell anyone but I am planning on taking Homiletics and NT classes exclusively next fall.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Alan- Good to hear, Miles told me about Dan Timmer, said he was a good addition tot he falculty, of course he would say that being Academic Dean! Seriously, I heard from a few that Timmer was good. I was wondering how his sabbatical will impact things, makes sense to adjust, I thought about doing that myself, even told Miles that and he laughed and promised me that he would find a top notch replacement. I won't say anything about your schedule change! I am still hoping he will be teaching summer greek when I start this summer, he said there was a 50% chance he still would, otherwise Guy will which will still be good. What other faculty, classes have impressed you or you feel were particularly instructive?


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

kevin.carroll said:


> I am also a recent grad. You are in Mecca, my friend. Enjoy it.



Kevin-Thanks, I believe I will enjoy the experience. When did you graduate? What do you appreciate the most from your years at RTS Jackson? Any advice?


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## Bookmeister (Nov 18, 2009)

Tom,
I really have nothing bad to say about any faculty here. I have only had Dan Timmer for two classes, thats two days, he is doing the last half of Biblical Theology the Miles started in september. Bruce Baugus is another new prof that is just fascinating to listen to. Dr. Medieros is great, you will never fall asleep in his class, you will see what I mean the first time you sit in his class. Guy Waters is soooo knowledgeable about Greek it isn't funny. Ligon Duncan, what more needs saying. I have been fortunate to have had Dr. Duncan for two classes since Derek Thomas is on sabbatical this semester Ligon is teaching Systematics I. Have not had Dr. Thomas or Dr. Ireland yet so nothing to report there, although I will have the honor of taking classes with both next semester. Let's see, oh yeah, Dr. Hoffecker, I have him for History I right now and he is a great lecturer with just a wealth of knowledge on Church History. 

Do you know where you are going to live yet? I live on campus in the apartments. Are you married? Any children?


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Bookmeister said:


> Tom,
> I really have nothing bad to say about any faculty here. I have only had Dan Timmer for two classes, thats two days, he is doing the last half of Biblical Theology the Miles started in september. Bruce Baugus is another new prof that is just fascinating to listen to. Dr. Medieros is great, you will never fall asleep in his class, you will see what I mean the first time you sit in his class. Guy Waters is soooo knowledgeable about Greek it isn't funny. Ligon Duncan, what more needs saying. I have been fortunate to have had Dr. Duncan for two classes since Derek Thomas is on sabbatical this semester Ligon is teaching Systematics I. Have not had Dr. Thomas or Dr. Ireland yet so nothing to report there, although I will have the honor of taking classes with both next semester. Let's see, oh yeah, Dr. Hoffecker, I have him for History I right now and he is a great lecturer with just a wealth of knowledge on Church History.
> 
> Do you know where you are going to live yet? I live on campus in the apartments. Are you married? Any children?



Thanks for the info, Alan. We are reserved for a 3 BR townhome off campus, I am married 14 years, 4 children, leaving a career in accounting/auditing. How about you?


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## Puritan Sailor (Nov 18, 2009)

I loved it there. I graduated in 2008. It was a time of great testing but also great rewards. I made some good friends there (i.e. Fred, Andrew, Kevin, Alan) both in the seminary/church community and without. If you live in the townhomes you should get acclimated rather quickly. I lived a couple blocks away from there. Feel free to email or PM me if you have any questions.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Thanks, Patrick! I'll respond more later but it is good to know there are a few grads out there to get advice from.


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## Bookmeister (Nov 18, 2009)

I am married and we have a 13 yr. old son, how old is your oldest?


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## Awenwonder (Nov 18, 2009)

Bookmeister said:


> I am married and we have a 13 yr. old son, how old is your oldest?



My oldest is 5, then 3, 1, 6mo. 3 boys and a baby girl!


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## kevin.carroll (Nov 21, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Bookmeister said:
> 
> 
> > I think I am the only one on the PB. Patrick Severson and Andrew Barnes are recent grads.
> ...



Hank out in Miles office. Take him donuts. Pretend to be a Framekwork guy.

Guy: just hang in there. Lots of good knowledge.

Derek/Ligon: get as much as you can from them.


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## fredtgreco (Nov 21, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> fredtgreco said:
> 
> 
> > I graduated in 2006. I have fond memories of my time there. It is an excellent school.
> ...



Tom,

The faculty at Jackson is very good, and not just the "big names." Dennis Ireland is an excellent NT and Greek scholar. Andrew Hoffecker is first rate. So are many others.

I would spend an inordinate amount of time on the languages when you first arrive. You can always catch up on other reading, but once you fall behind on the language, you may never catch up.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 21, 2009)

Thanks, Fred! I appreciate your opinion. Miles gave me the same exact advice. Prioritize the language study and it makes everything else easier. Can I contact you privately for further questions?

-----Added 11/21/2009 at 08:08:07 EST-----

Kevin-
So Miles likes donuts.....What is a "framework guy"?, pardon my ignorence!


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## JoyFullMom (Nov 21, 2009)

Tom, 

I may have a very experienced babysitter headed your way Fall 2010.  My eldest (of six children), and my right hand, is possibly headed to Belhaven College.  The Lord sure appears to be paving the way...


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## fredtgreco (Nov 21, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Thanks, Fred! I appreciate your opinion. Miles gave me the same exact advice. Prioritize the language study and it makes everything else easier. Can I contact you privately for further questions?
> 
> -----Added 11/21/2009 at 08:08:07 EST-----
> 
> ...



Tom, absolutely!

I'll be in my office on Monday and Tuesday if you want to call me. 281.392.0002


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## Romans922 (Nov 21, 2009)

Framework is a view of creation which does not hold to a literal 24hr/6day creation. His Biblical Theology can be a little 'over the top' if you ask me.


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## Bookmeister (Nov 21, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Thanks, Fred! I appreciate your opinion. Miles gave me the same exact advice. Prioritize the language study and it makes everything else easier. Can I contact you privately for further questions?
> 
> -----Added 11/21/2009 at 08:08:07 EST-----
> 
> ...



Framework view of the days of creation, not a literal twenty-four hour day.

-----Added 11/21/2009 at 08:44:13 EST-----



Romans922 said:


> Framework is a view of creation which does not hold to a literal 24hr/6day creation. His Biblical Theology can be a little 'over the top' if you ask me.



His biblical theology is fantastic and right on target!!


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## Romans922 (Nov 21, 2009)

Don't make me pull out my notes...


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## Bookmeister (Nov 21, 2009)

Just curious, which part do you have a problem with, the theme of the Kingdom of God or the centrality of Jesus Christ?


P.S. Mod's-Andrew and I are just kidding, we are in a FF league and he always gives me trouble.


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## Romans922 (Nov 21, 2009)

The interpretation and exegesis of Scripture because of His TOO high of Biblical Theological view.

His layout/chart of how to look at Scripture has flaws too.


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## Puritan Sailor (Nov 22, 2009)

I share Andrew's reservations. Miles has some great insights and I thoroughly enjoyed his teaching. He was awesome in Greek and Hebrew. But I think he does over-emphasize the biblical theology. And his views on the structure of the Canon, though interesting and often helpful, need further peer review and study before I jump on the bandwagon completely.


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## kevin.carroll (Nov 23, 2009)

Puritan Sailor said:


> I share Andrew's reservations. Miles has some great insights and I thoroughly enjoyed his teaching. He was awesome in Greek and Hebrew. But I think he does over-emphasize the biblical theology. And his views on the structure of the Canon, though interesting and often helpful, need further peer review and study before I jump on the bandwagon completely.



Don't miles started on sex as Sacrament.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 23, 2009)

JoyFullMom said:


> Tom,
> 
> I may have a very experienced babysitter headed your way Fall 2010.  My eldest (of six children), and my right hand, is possibly headed to Belhaven College.  The Lord sure appears to be paving the way...



Polly,

That would be an answer to prayer! An experienced, mature, Godly babysitter is simply just a gift from Heaven! We do not take it lightly. I would love to stay in touch if that would materialize! When are you finalizing the decision? Our associate pastor almost sent his oldest to Belhaven but he went to Patrick Henry instead. They have absolutely nothing bad to say about Belhaven. Excellent school. You might have already talked with him on this board. His name is Rick Franks, his board name is rrfranks. His son who is at Patrick Henry is lamalas on the board. Feel free to contact them if you havent already but I suspect you already have!

-----Added 11/23/2009 at 01:13:03 EST-----

Okay, let me get this straight....Alan, you support the non-literal "framework" view? Andrew, you support the literal 6 day 24 hours view? I agree with Dr. Currid's view of creation which is a literal 6 day /24 hour view. RTS Jackson recommends that every incoming MDIV student listent to Currid's lectures on creation which explains and supports the literal 6 day view. I know Ligon supports the literal view as well but the PCA put out a statement a few years back that added contraversy to the issue. I have not read it yet, care to summarize for me? How common is the framework view in the PCA? I know the OPC has taken a courageous stand on the literal view. Good for them!

-----Added 11/23/2009 at 01:14:33 EST-----



kevin.carroll said:


> Puritan Sailor said:
> 
> 
> > I share Andrew's reservations. Miles has some great insights and I thoroughly enjoyed his teaching. He was awesome in Greek and Hebrew. But I think he does over-emphasize the biblical theology. And his views on the structure of the Canon, though interesting and often helpful, need further peer review and study before I jump on the bandwagon completely.
> ...



HaHaHa, that sounds like Miles! I heard he has a good sense of humor.


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## Puritan Sailor (Nov 23, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> I know the OPC has taken a courageous stand on the literal view. Good for them!



That's not correct. The OPC allows other views too, very similar to the PCA.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 23, 2009)

Puritan Sailor said:


> Von Stroh said:
> 
> 
> > I know the OPC has taken a courageous stand on the literal view. Good for them!
> ...



I stand corrected, Patrick! I apologize for that.

-----Added 11/23/2009 at 01:41:05 EST-----

Patrick- Does that mean you are a supporter of the framework view?


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## Puritan Sailor (Nov 23, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Puritan Sailor said:
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> > Von Stroh said:
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Absolutely not. I think it's rubbish. I was just clarifying that the OPC doesn't have a uniform view on the matter.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 23, 2009)

Relieved to hear, Patrick! I was worried for a moment. How common is the framework view in the OPC?


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## Bookmeister (Nov 23, 2009)

Alan, you support the non-literal "framework" view?

No, I support the literal framework view.


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## Simply_Nikki (Nov 23, 2009)

Josh Walker and Thomas Graves are current students at RTS Jackson. They are members here but do not post.  But look them up, I'm sure you can make fast friends with them.

-----Added 11/23/2009 at 02:27:08 EST-----

Oh, I forgot to add Thomas's and Josh's screen name on here.

Here's Thomas: thomasjg
Here's Josh: johnny_redeemed


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## Puritan Sailor (Nov 23, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Relieved to hear, Patrick! I was worried for a moment. How common is the framework view in the OPC?



I don't know if anyone has taken an official poll. But there have been several OPC voices behind all the major views in the Reformed world. Kline was OPC. EJ Young was OPC, but he argued for the analogical day view. Machen allegedly was a day-age guy. And there have been traditional guys too.


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## Awenwonder (Nov 23, 2009)

Simply_Nikki said:


> Josh Walker and Thomas Graves are current students at RTS Jackson. They are members here but do not post.  But look them up, I'm sure you can make fast friends with them.
> 
> -----Added 11/23/2009 at 02:27:08 EST-----
> 
> ...



Thanks, Nikki!
How do you know them if they do not post?

-----Added 11/23/2009 at 02:49:41 EST-----



Bookmeister said:


> Alan, you support the non-literal "framework" view?
> 
> No, I support the literal framework view.



Alan-I sincerely apologize for the misunderstanding! I guess you were referring to Miles' biblical theology and/or canon perspectives then?

How does a leading Hebrew professor not take a literal view of creation? I do not see how that comes about. Wouldn't his knowledge of Hebrew confirm the literal view? That is how John Currid explains his literal view of creation, from hebrew linguistic knowledge. Any explanation?


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## Simply_Nikki (Nov 23, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Simply_Nikki said:
> 
> 
> > Josh Walker and Thomas Graves are current students at RTS Jackson. They are members here but do not post.  But look them up, I'm sure you can make fast friends with them.
> ...



Met them both in a Christian chat room ages ago . However Josh is from Arizona and he connected me with RUF here in Tucson.  I know Thomas a little bit better since we both set up a chatroom for reformed folk some time ago. He is a deacon at his local PCA church and is probably one of the most awesome people ever!


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## Awenwonder (Nov 23, 2009)

Thats good to know, Nikki! Thanks.


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## Romans922 (Nov 23, 2009)

I hold to literal 24/6 day creation, and gladly took my Gen-Dt and as many OT classes from Dr. Currid while he was still there.

How does a Hebrew professor hold to framework or non-literal 6 day view? An over emphasis on Biblical Theology and being heavily influenced by Kline.


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## kevin.carroll (Nov 24, 2009)

Von Stroh said:


> Thanks, Fred! I appreciate your opinion. Miles gave me the same exact advice. Prioritize the language study and it makes everything else easier. Can I contact you privately for further questions?
> 
> -----Added 11/21/2009 at 08:08:07 EST-----
> 
> ...



Sorry for the late reply. Who does not like donuts? heheheh

Miles is a very personable guy. You will like him very much. He is a formidable language scholar, but somehow makes the drudgery of memorizing and parsing enjoyable.

He's also a big Meredith Kline fan. Kline made the Framework theory popular, and Miles bought into it while sitting at Kline's feet. It is essentially a non-literal view of Genesis 1-2 that sees the accounts as being "semi-poetic," whatever that means, and therefore open to more interpretive license as to the lenght of the days of Creation.

I used to sit in his office and blow holes in the theory while chatting with him. But hey, I was getting A's.


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