# Unequally Yoked



## Anton Bruckner (Jan 15, 2007)

Could the scriptures forbidding Christians from being unequally yoked be applied to our Arminian and Pentecostal Brethren?

Are we to marry not merely Christians, but Christians that are spiritually compatible?


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## LadyFlynt (Jan 15, 2007)

Yes, I do believe we should marry ppl that are compatible and share our faith. I know that there are times where a couple starts out of the same faith and then one converts to something else...that is something they simply have to work through...but you should not really set yourself up for that difficulty under normal circumstances.


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## ChristopherPaul (Jan 15, 2007)

Well they do worship a different god, so...


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## Herald (Jan 15, 2007)

[bible]2 Corinthians 6:14[/bible]

Contextually speaking this passage applies to a union between believers and unbelievers. It does not apply to a union between believers. I don't believe chapter and verse is needed in order to make wise decisions.



> Well they do worship a different god, so...



Be careful my friend. What we define as Arminianism today is not historical Arminianism. There are varying degrees of error. The pentecostal movement is all over the map theologically. Some, like the Oneness Pentecostals are modalists and would not be considered part of the body of Christ. Unless a denomination (like the Oneness movement) espouses heresy from top to bottom I would be careful about making a group judgment. Did you know that there are some (not many, but some) Plymouth Bretheren congregations that are Calvinists? They're Calvinist-Dispensationalists, but Calvinist nonetheless. Thus my warning against making group judgments.


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## Blueridge Believer (Jan 15, 2007)

http://teampyro.blogspot.com/

Wesley and Simeon: daggers at noon? 
by Dan Phillips

As the world prepares itself to hear Phil's haec dixit Philippus (watch—someone's going to be offended at that), some words from Charles Simeon seem to fit our current discussion well. In his talk on Simeon, John Piper says that Simeon

had little sympathy for uncharitable Calvinists. In a sermon on Romans 9:16, he said, "Many there are who cannot see these truths [the doctrines of God's sovereignty], who yet are in a state truly pleasing to God; yea many, at whose feet the best of us may be glad to be found in heaven. It is a great evil, when these doctrines are made a ground of separation one from another, and when the advocates of different systems anathematize each other. . . . In reference to truths which are involved in so much obscurity as those which relate to the sovereignty of God mutual kindness and concession are far better than vehement argumentation and uncharitable discussion" (Horae Homileticae, Vol. 15, p. 357).
Then Piper relates "how [Simeon] lived out this counsel is seen in the way he conversed with the elderly John Wesley. He tells the story himself:"
Sir, I understand that you are called an Arminian; and I have been sometimes called a Calvinist; and therefore I suppose we are to draw daggers. But before I consent to begin the combat, with your permission I will ask you a few questions. Pray, Sir, do you feel yourself a depraved creature, so depraved that you would never have thought of turning to God, if God had not first put it into your heart? 

Yes, I do indeed.

And do you utterly despair of recommending yourself to God by anything you can do; and look for salvation solely through the blood and righteousness of Christ?

Yes, solely through Christ.

But, Sir, supposing you were at first saved by Christ, are you not somehow or other to save yourself afterwards by your own works?

No, I must be saved by Christ from first to last.

Allowing, then, that you were first turned by the grace of God, are you not in some way or other to keep yourself by your own power?

No.

What then, are you to be upheld every hour and every moment by God, as much as an infant in its mother's arms?

Yes, altogether.

And is all your hope in the grace and mercy of God to preserve you unto His heavenly kingdom?

Yes, I have no hope but in Him.

Then, Sir, with your leave I will put up my dagger again; for this is all my Calvinism; this is my election, my justification by faith, my final perseverance: it is in substance all that I hold, and as I hold it; and therefore, if you please, instead of searching out terms and phrases to be a ground of contention between us, we will cordially unite in those things wherein we agree. (Moule, 79f)

To this, I add nothing.


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## Pergamum (Jan 15, 2007)

Jesus was a friend to sinners but I cannot hang out with a Pentecostal?


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## Davidius (Jan 15, 2007)

trevorjohnson said:


> Jesus was a friend to sinners but I cannot hang out with a Pentecostal?




If you would read the posts you would see that it is marriage that is being spoken of, not hanging out.


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## turmeric (Jan 15, 2007)

Of course there's the issue of spiritual headship to consider -ladies, if you don't want to go to a Pentecostal church the rest of your lives, you might want to think ahead! Of course, it could turn out like this.


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## LadyFlynt (Jan 15, 2007)

turmeric said:


> Of course there's the issue of spiritual headship to consider -ladies, if you don't want to go to a Pentecostal church the rest of your lives, you might want to think ahead! Of course, it could turn out like this.



Summary, please. Flu going around here and my focus can only handle so much.


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## Anton Bruckner (Jan 15, 2007)

trevorjohnson said:


> Jesus was a friend to sinners but I cannot hang out with a Pentecostal?



Why did you shave? You looked cool with the hair.

Anyway the substance of my question is, can someone who subscribes to the Doctrines of Grace can without sin knowingly court and marry someone who does not subscribe to the Doctrines of Grace.

ps. Can a follower of John Owen, Spurgeon etc knowingly marry a follower of Dave Hunt, Calvary Chapel and Benny Hinn.


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## Pergamum (Jan 15, 2007)

It's too hot over here to be too hairy.



Yes, I did not read the part focusing on marriage in the thread. 

Friend is one thing but "Life Friend" is quite another. Not only doctrinal compatibility but mood and goal compatibility are musts. 



I suppose a man could marry a wonderfully beautiful but not real bright girl who is obedient and raises the chillen's well. 

One does not need deep doctrinal agreement or even a wife that knows what a "Synod of Dort" is. 

If you get along, she complements your work instead of detracts from it and she runs the home well, then this is a rare find. 


This response is to you with the assumption that your are not one of them that denies that Arminians can be saved. If I get a response back that says, "But they worship a false God!" - my apologies in advance!


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## Davidius (Jan 15, 2007)

trevorjohnson said:


> Friend is one thing but "Life Friend" is quite another. Not only doctrinal compatibility but mood and goal compatibility are musts.
> 
> I suppose a man could marry a wonderfully beautiful but not real bright girl who is obedient and raises the chillen's well.
> 
> ...



 although I would have to qualify what _deep_ doctrinal agreement is. I just know I wouldn't marry an Arminian.


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## QueenEsther (Jan 15, 2007)

trevorjohnson said:


> It's too hot over here to be too hairy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...




Like what he said, but then he's speaking from a man's perspective. From the girl's perspective..I would find it hard to put myself under submission to someone I thought was in error most of the time. I think it can be done but I wouldn't recommend it. Of course this is coming from a girl who wont even look twice at a boy who isn't EP so all that other stuff is out of the question for me. You can also look at this thread for some more on what I concluded about this area for myself.


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## ReformedWretch (Jan 15, 2007)

Well, good luckik finding an Arminian girl (to the guys of course) that believe in the wife submitting to her husband. That alone would help you realize this was one NOT to marry.

PS- Trevor, I think you look better shaven, much YOUNGER looking. I didn't know who you were until I read the name!


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## turmeric (Jan 15, 2007)

Lady Flynt;
The upshot of the matter was that William (a credobaptist) married a nice Presbyterian girl. He permitted her to go to her church and he went to his. Eventually, after long talks with the Presbyterian minister, he became Presbyterian.


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## Pergamum (Jan 15, 2007)

Yep, I feel much younger too without a beard....though the top of my head (for some strange reason) is starting to get sunburned..and it never did this when I was younger for some reason.... The dangers of thinning hair for a fella living in the tropics!


Yes, I think you others are right. 

If the girl is Arminian, how COULD she submit and is she was a true Christian girl like Rose, she would be too smart to submit to any who was not orthodox to some degree (though - good men being as hard to find as they are - holding out for an EP husband might take you quite a few years Rose).


I have found that I have never had a fight with my wife over doctrine. Usually underwear on the floor or me forgetting some special date seems to be sources of friction more than minor theological points. And I think that personality compatibility might be just as important as these minor points when dealing with finding a mate. I, for one, always remind my wife that I am her tool of sanctification!


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## QueenEsther (Jan 15, 2007)

trevorjohnson said:


> If the girl is Arminian, how COULD she submit and is she was a true Christian girl like Rose, she would be too smart to submit to any who was not orthodox to some degree (though - good men being as hard to find as they are - holding out for an EP husband might take you quite a few years Rose).



hehe, thanks for the encouragement


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## Blue Tick (Jan 15, 2007)

Slippery said:


> Why did you shave? You looked cool with the hair.
> 
> Anyway the substance of my question is, can someone who subscribes to the Doctrines of Grace can without sin knowingly court and marry someone who does not subscribe to the Doctrines of Grace.
> 
> ps. Can a follower of John Owen, Spurgeon etc knowingly marry a follower of Dave Hunt, Calvary Chapel and Benny Hinn.




This would be a very strained relationship indeed. If someone is courting a person who does not subscribe to the DOG they are in dangerous water. Now if they are courting and they are open to listening to the DOG then this is a different story. But if someone is a church goer with the likes of Hinn,CC, and Hunt they are following a different god and being feed a different gospel. Hinn is a complete heretic, CC reads the Bible with the wrong conclusions, and Hunt is Pelagian monster.

I don't see how two people could even talk about the Lord(under the guise of fellowship) let alone consider a marriage relationship. When ever I get together with friends who don't subscribe to the DOG and we attempt to discuss spiritual things its always awkward. It's like two people talking in a room and ignoring the pink Calvinistic elephant in the corner. The two camps are on two different spectrums.

I would warn gently not to marry or court someone who does not believe the DOG. Anything else is a false gospel.


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## thegracefullady (Jan 15, 2007)

QueenEsther said:


> From the girl's perspective..I would find it hard to put myself under submission to someone I thought was in error most of the time. I think it can be done but I wouldn't recommend it.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Jan 16, 2007)

It's worth reading Daniel Defoe's _Religious Courtship_ which is essentially an application of this verse from Amos to marriage:

Amos 3.3 Can two walk together, except they be agreed?


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## Pergamum (Jan 16, 2007)

Rose;

Sorry to discourage you. 

Remember, we worship a sovereign God and He is powerful enough even to bring a meet mate to Cow Creek!

Trevor


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## QueenEsther (Jan 16, 2007)

Hehe, it's ok, I was just messing with you. Though I'm sure it would help if I wasn't going to a Baptist church, all I can say is that it's a good thing God is soveriegn


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## Pergamum (Jan 17, 2007)

Why don't we start a Reformed courting network here!? 


Put it in a special section. 


Surely out of all the members and lurkers on the PB one can find a meet mate to match for marriage! 



*E-Harmony watch out!! We've got PB Harmony!*


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## SRoper (Jan 17, 2007)

Well there already is Sovereign Grace Singles...


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## QueenEsther (Jan 17, 2007)




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## Anton Bruckner (Jan 18, 2007)

guys thanks for the responses, I figured that you would given the counsel that you all gave above. "Stupid me, why did I have to ask when I knew the answer".


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