# Greek Translation of 2 Peter 3:9



## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

Greek scholars, here is the text for 2 Peter 3:9, followed by some translation observations.

ου βραδυνει κυριος της επαγγελιας ως τινες βραδυτητα ηγουνται αλλα μακροθυμει εις υμας μη βουλομενος τινας απολεσθαι αλλα παντας εις μετανοιαν χωρησαι

The NAS (which is what I preach from) renders the verse: "The Lord is not slow about His promise, as some count slowness, but is patient toward you, not wishing for any to perish but for all to come to repentance."

Notice that the same pronoun (translated "some" and "any") is used in both halves of the verse.

"Wishing" carries with it the connotation of desiring something after having planned its outcome.

"Slowness" has the connotation of "being negligent."

My translation: The Lord is not slow about the promise, as some regard slowness, but is patient to you [or concerning you], not intending for these to perish but for all [all of them] to come to repentance.

Feel free to critique/add/correct my translation/observations. I will be preaching on vv. 8-9 this Lord's Day, D.V.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Apr 22, 2011)

No to get off-topic on you but it is interesting the TR has "ου βραδυνει ο κυριος της επαγγελιας ως τινες βραδυτητα ηγουνται αλλα μακροθυμει εις ημας μη βουλομενος τινας απολεσθαι αλλα παντας εις μετανοιαν χωρησαι" as the Greek here.


This would change "...but is patient toward you" to "...but is longsuffering/patient toward us".


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## fredtgreco (Apr 22, 2011)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> No to get off-topic on you but it is interesting the TR has "ου βραδυνει ο κυριος της επαγγελιας ως τινες βραδυτητα ηγουνται αλλα μακροθυμει εις ημας μη βουλομενος τινας απολεσθαι αλλα παντας εις μετανοιαν χωρησαι" as the Greek here.
> 
> 
> This would change "...but is patient toward you" to "...but is longsuffering/patient toward us".


 
The "you" and "we" difference occurs many times in the NT manuscripts, especially in Peter's letters. It is easy to see why, because the difference is a single letter of the alphabet. The meaning is also nearly the same - depending on whether Peter is speaking to his audience as a pastor/preacher (you) or a fellow congregant (we).


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## Osage Bluestem (Apr 22, 2011)

2Pe 3:9 KJV TheG3588 LordG2962 is not slackG1019 G3756 concerning his promise,G1860 asG5613 some menG5100 countG2233 slackness;G1022 butG235 is longsufferingG3114 toG1519 us-ward,G2248 notG3361 willingG1014 that anyG5100 should perish,G622 butG235 that allG3956 should comeG5562 toG1519 repentance.G3341 

G1014
βούλομαι
boulomai
boo'-lom-ahee
Middle voice of a primary verb; to “will”, that is, (reflexively) be willing: - be disposed, minded, intend, list (be, of own) will (-ing). Compare G2309.

G5100
τίς
tis
tis
An enclitic indefinite pronoun; some or any person or object: - a (kind of), any (man, thing, thing at all), certain (thing), divers, he (every) man, one (X thing), ought, + partly, some (man, -body, -thing, -what), (+ that no-) thing, what (-soever), X wherewith, whom [-soever], whose ([-soever]).

G3956
πᾶς
pas
pas
Including all the forms of declension; apparently a primary word; all, any, every, the whole: - all (manner of, means) alway (-s), any (one), X daily, + ever, every (one, way), as many as, + no (-thing), X throughly, whatsoever, whole, whosoever.


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## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

Thanks for the input. Two things to note (and I want to focus on these): the rarer word for "will/wish" that is used, and the interplay between the pronouns at the end of the verse (some/any/all).


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## fredtgreco (Apr 22, 2011)

Tim,

Here is the entry in _Mounce's Complete Expository Dictionary of Old and New Testament Word_s on will/want (which I happened to have written a few years ago for the book):

*WANT
New Testament*
Verb: βούλομαι (boulomai) GK 1089 (S 1014), 37x. boulomai describes the desire or intention of a person to do something, to have something, or to obtain a result. This includes choice, purpose, or intention and desire or longing. This verb occurs in the NT regarding both the actions of God and of people.
(1) When used of people, boulomai refers to their action to bring about either godly or sinful desires. Examples of people who take action because of godly desires include: Joseph, who did not divorce Mary publicly because he did not “want to expose her to public disgrace” (Mt 1:19); Apollos, who went to Achaia because he “wanted” to go (Acts 18:27); the centurion who prevented the soldiers from killing all the prisoners in the shipwreck because he “wanted to spare Paul’s life” (Acts 27:43); and John’s intention to visit with his addressees face to face (2 Jn. 12). Ungodly desires can cause people to act as well: Pilate releases Barnabas because he “wants to satisfy the crowd” (Mk 15:15; cf. Jn 18:39); the Sanhedrin is furious with Peter and John and “want to put them to death” (Acts 5:33); and those who “want to get rich” take actions that cause them to fall into temptation (1 Tim. 6:9).
In addition to describing what a person wants, boulomai can also refer to the actual act of planning something. Paul writes to the Corinthians that he “planned to visit you first so that you might benefit twice,” (2 Cor. 1:15; cf. also 1:17; Peter and John are accused of intending to bring guilt on the Sanhedrin (Acts 5:28). This type of intention can bring about actual results—either practical (e.g., Jas 3:4), or moral and spiritual (e.g., 4:4). But the key to boulomai is the intention, not the result; what one purposes or wills may not come to pass (cf. Acts 12:4 in the context of the story).
(2) boulomai also applies to God. The author of Hebrews speaks of God’s “wanting” to make clear his purpose to the heirs of the promise, and then fulfilling that intention by confirming the promise with an oath (Heb 6:17). Intentional acts of the will are also applied the Son (Mt 11:27; Lk 10:22) and the Spirit (1 Cor. 12:11). With respect to God, boulomai expresses God’s intention and purpose as well as his ability to fulfill his intention, especially with respect to salvation. It is Jesus Christ who “chooses to reveal him” (Mt 11:27; Lk 10:22), it is God who “chooses” to give new birth to sinners by the power of his word (Jas 1:18), it is God who “desires” salvation for his people (2 Pet. 3:9), and it is God who “wills” the atoning work of Christ (Lk 22:42). See NIDNTT-A, 97–98.
Verb: θέλω (thelō), GK 2527 (S 2309), 208x. thelō means “to will, want, desire,” sometimes with human beings as the subject, sometimes with God as subject. See will.

*WILL
New Testament
*Verb: βούλομαι (boulomai) GK 1089 (S 1014), 37x. boulomai describes the desire or intention of a person to do something, to have something, or to obtain a result. See want.
Verb: θέλω (thelō), GK 2527 (S 2309), 208x. thelō means “to will, want, desire.” It can be broken down into two main categories: the act of willing or desiring as performed by a person, and the act performed by God. This distinction is blurred when it is used in the context of Jesus.
(1) The following examples are all with human subjects. “Rachel did not want to be comforted” (Mt 2:18). “If someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well” (5:40). “Herodias … wanted to kill [John]” (Mk 6:19). “[Peter] became hungry and wanted something to eat” (Acts 10:10). “I [Paul] do not want you to be unaware, brothers” (Rom 1:13). “I have much to write you, but I do not want to do so with pen and ink” (3 Jn. 13). In such cases the meaning is simply to want or desire something.
But thelō can be also used with human subjects in the context of deeper theological issues. Possibly the best-known example is Paul’s discussion of his own desires in Rom. 7:15ff., in which he uses thelō six times. The opening line is, “What I do, I do not understand. For what I do not desire, this I do.” Human willing sometimes expresses faith; e.g., in Lk 18:41 a blind man says that he “wants” Jesus to heal him, to which Jesus replies, “Receive your sight, your faith has healed you.” Other such uses are Jesus’ statement that Jerusalem is “not willing” to be cared for by him (13:34) and his censure of the Jewish leaders, “You do not want to come to me so that you might have life” (Jn 5:40).
(2) thelō also signifies the desire of God or Jesus, which almost always has a theological nuance. God “desires all people to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth” (1 Tim. 2:4). Our prayers should be conditioned with, “If the Lord wills, we will live and do this or that” (Jas 4:15).
An important topic to mention when thinking about “the will of God and of human beings” is the way in which they intersect. This has been one of the great areas of debate and dissension in the history of the church. Jesus said, “If anyone chooses to do God’s will” (Jn 7:17). This reflects the reality that human will is not entirely consumed by God’s will or action. At some level, people choose whether or not to do God’s will. This point is also reflected in the “Lord’s Prayer” (“Your will be done on earth as it is in heaven,” Mt 6:10; this vs. uses the noun thelēma), and in Jesus’ prayer in the garden of Gethsemane, in which he asks to be delivered from the cross, but says “not my will but yours be done” (Mt 26:39). In both cases the implication is that humans do not automatically do God’s will.
However, there are also passages such as Rom 9 that clearly articulate the sovereign will of God. Paul writes, “Therefore God has mercy on whom he wants to have mercy and hardens whom he wants to harden” (Rom 9:18). Similar acknowledgment of God’s sovereign will is seen in Paul’s statement, “I will come to you very soon if the Lord is willing” (1 Cor. 4:19; also 1 Cor. 12:18; 1 Cor. 15:38). A passage that connects divine and human will is Phil 2:13, in which Paul writes, “It is God who works in you to will and to act according to his good purpose.” In summary, God is sovereign and his will is accomplished, but in some sense each of us chooses to follow him or to rebel against him. See NIDNTT-A, 241–42.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Apr 22, 2011)

Good stuff Rev. Greco.


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## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

Fred, how would you relate boulomai to texts Acts 2:23 and 4:28, where God's sovereign purpose is stated?

If I am correct in my musings, it would be grammatically impossible for the text to mean what certain Arminians (and some Reformed folks too) state that it means, it terms of a universal desire on the part of God. That would not fit with the context of 2 Peter. The "wanting" seems to be a purposeful wanting, tied to God's sovereign purpose (so it would be tied to His degree). And the pronouns, as is often pointed out, seem to be limited in scope, focusing on the "you", i.e., the readers of 2 Peter (whom he also calls "beloved" in the prior verse).


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## CharlieJ (Apr 22, 2011)

Tim, I wouldn't translate τινας as "these." After all, it's an indefinite pronoun. It means "anyone", or here in the plural, "any [people]." Contextually, you could make it "any [of you (or us)]."


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## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

Charlie, would you make a distinction, then, between τινες and τινας in the translation?

Also, if "any" is correct, that would refer to "any" of the "some," correct?


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## CharlieJ (Apr 22, 2011)

Well, it's an indefinite pronoun, so it naturally resists being restricted to a well-defined group. I don't think there's a necessary connection between the "some" who are questioning the timing of the Lord's return and the "any" who are the object of his desire not to perish. 

The indefinite pronoun can communicate a subgroup of a previously mentioned entity. So, I think τινας is a subgroup of υμας. "The Lord ... is patient toward you, not wishing for any [of you] to perish, but for all [of you] to come to repentance."

In short, I think the τινας goes back to the υμας, not the τινες.


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## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

CharlieJ said:


> The indefinite pronoun can communicate a subgroup of a previously mentioned entity. So, I think τινας is a subgroup of υμας. "The Lord ... is patient toward you, not wishing for any [of you] to perish, but for all [of you] to come to repentance."



Thanks, this is a very good and helpful point. In the context of 2 Peter 3, then, would it make more sense for the τινες to be referring the scoffers (i.e., false teachers), though who deny the Lord's coming, since it is the "some" who count the Lord as being slow. Or would it make better sense for this to simply be an indefinite hypothetical group?


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## CharlieJ (Apr 22, 2011)

I think it's reasonable to see a reference to the scoffers, since it's all in the same context.


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## MW (Apr 22, 2011)

Verse 8, "But, beloved..." This sets the readership apart from the scoffers so that what follows is distinctive of the readership in particular. However one understand the textual variant, it imposes a limiting context on the indefinite pronoun.


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## Marrow Man (Apr 22, 2011)

armourbearer said:


> Verse 8, "But, beloved..." This sets the readership apart from the scoffers so that what follows is distinctive of the readership in particular. However one understand the textual variant, it imposes a limiting context on the indefinite pronoun.



Very good point, Rev. Winzer. In fact, Peter does this consistently throughout the letter. The first chapter is directed at his readers, the elect, and he utilizes the pronoun "you" throughout. But chapter 2 contains the condemnations of the false teachers, using the pronoun "they" as a reference. So the text has already set us up to distinguish between the "they" and "you" of chapter 3, if we allow the Holy Spirit to speak through His word in a consistent manner and humbly submit to His teachings in these things.


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## Wayne (Apr 22, 2011)

Now that you've done your own spade work, have you looked at the commentary by Thomas Adams?


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## Marrow Man (Apr 23, 2011)

Wayne said:


> Now that you've done your own spade work, have you looked at the commentary by Thomas Adams?



I purchased the reprint from Solid Ground Books recently. I will be diving into it tomorrow morning.


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## Wayne (Apr 23, 2011)

Great stuff.


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