# Where To Get a Th.M?



## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 8, 2008)

I am in the market after graduating from a non-confessional seminary to working on an academic degree to counterbalance my education, for personal and professional reasons. I am somewhat limited by geography so keep that in mind. 

Any ideas?


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## Blue Tick (May 8, 2008)

What's your goal? Would you like to pastor a church? Teach at a seminary? Personal enrichment?

It really depends on your long term goals.


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## ReformedSinner (May 8, 2008)

*Th.M. is a "unique" degree*

Th.M. is a unique degree nowadays. It's supposed to be a "researched graduate theological degree", but then institutions like Dallas Seminary kind of blow that theory away (Dallas, instead of issuing M.Div., gives Th.M.) Even different institutions have different levels of requirements for Th.M. At Westminster Seminary in Philly their Th.M. is pratically "half a Ph.D." which prompted many students to go ahead and get a Ph.D.

Anyway, if you're in Pittsburg, and geography is an issue, then I guess Westminster Seminary in Philly would be your best bet... but stick with the ST department degrees as their BT department are having some... ahem... house cleaning...


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## jawyman (May 8, 2008)

Again, Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary (my seminary) offers a Th.M. program and it is a rather good program. PRTS should be added to your list of options. Grand Rapids is not that big of a stretch and you would study under Dr. Joel Beeke.

Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 8, 2008)

Well I am on the way to Ordination and have no real interest in "teaching" academically as of now. 

My main purpose, I guess, would be "personal enrichment" in the sense of gaining a deeper and more focused education. I would like to eventually work on a Ph.D.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 8, 2008)

Thanks jawyman. I did not think PRTS had a Th.M. Thanks!!!

Can a Mod/Admin add PRTS to the Poll?


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## Blue Tick (May 8, 2008)

Are you open to distance ed? If so, there are plenty of programs to choose from.


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## dannyhyde (May 8, 2008)

WesCal, my alma mater, does not offer a ThM . . . hence I am doing my ThM at Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary with Joel Beeke. So far I have had classes with Robert Oliver, Robert Kolb, and Carl Trueman. Next Spring Sinclair Ferguson is teaching on the Westminster Assembly, so I'd say it's a good education to say the least!


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## jawyman (May 8, 2008)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> Thanks jawyman. I did not think PRTS had a Th.M. Thanks!!!
> 
> Can a Mod/Admin add PRTS to the Poll?



We sure do. I pray that after I finish my M.Div., the following Monday I am going to enrol in the Th.M. program.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 8, 2008)

dannyhyde said:


> WesCal, my alma mater, does not offer a ThM . . . hence I am doing my ThM at Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary with Joel Beeke. So far I have had classes with Robert Oliver, Robert Kolb, and Carl Trueman. Next Spring Sinclair Ferguson is teaching on the Westminster Assembly, so I'd say it's a good education to say the least!



I assume then PRTS does "intensive" courses for the Th.M? That would work perfect.


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## ReformedSinner (May 8, 2008)

If you are using Th.M. as "personal enrichment" and would eventually work on a Ph.D. I would then definitely recommend WTS-Philly. Like I said you are practically sitting in Ph.D. courses and expected to turn in Ph.D. level work, but at half the load of Ph.D. instead of the full load. Needless to say the programs are very "enrichment" and will prepare you for your Ph.D. journey (anywhere after that.)

If you are thinking of Apologetics I can't think of anywhere else better (at least for the Van Tilian Reformed Apologetics), if you are thinking of Church History again I can't think of anyone else better to study under in Carl Trueman and his trusted collegue Jeff Jue. As for ST Lane Tipton is relatively young and less known in the academic circle but having taken a few courses with him I don't think I'm exaggerating when I say he has the potential to be a big player in the theological circles given a few years. And yes WTS ST department will attract major theologians to teach in Sinclair Ferguson, Daryl Hart, and others.


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## AV1611 (May 9, 2008)

Dangers for Pastor-Scholars « Thomas Goodwin


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

Westminster-PA sounds very attractive but I am more than likely going to end up in NC or SC for my first Pastorate so a place like PRTS that offers "modules" as part of their program is very intriguing.


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## Contra_Mundum (May 9, 2008)

Check out GPTS too, being in SC. And Erskine, which is longer established, and did attract H.O.Old to their faculty here at the end of his long career. I don't think you would be getting as strict a Confessional perspective there as at GPTS. However, I believe they do have at least one PCA fellow that taught (adjunct) some at GPTS during my time there (at the time, he was employed full time at Southern Wesleyan). RTS Charlotte sort of completes a triumvirate of specifically Reformed seminaries in that region. Doug Kelley might be "the main attraction" at RTS-C.


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## ADKing (May 9, 2008)

Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary gets my vote.


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## JOwen (May 9, 2008)

jawyman said:


> Again, Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary (my seminary) offers a Th.M. program and it is a rather good program. PRTS should be added to your list of options. Grand Rapids is not that big of a stretch and you would study under Dr. Joel Beeke.
> 
> Puritan Reformed Theological Seminary



Doing it now!


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

How have you found the program Rev. Lewis? 

By the way RTS-Charlotte as of right now does not offer a Th.M.


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## JOwen (May 9, 2008)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> How have you found the program Rev. Lewis?
> 
> By the way RTS-Charlotte as of right now does not offer a Th.M.



The program is wonderful. Its emphasis is in the Puritan tradition and offers courses by some of the best teachers today. The program is also flexible for those in the ministry. I have taken one course in house at PRTS but I am doing much of it here in my study. I do plan on going again DV to take more in house. Dr. G.Bilkes is my advisor, and he is a tremendous asset to Puritan.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

Thank you very much. This discussion has opened up an avenue I was not previously ware of, thanks to all.


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## dannyhyde (May 9, 2008)

JOwen said:


> Backwoods Presbyterian said:
> 
> 
> > How have you found the program Rev. Lewis?
> ...



I'd concur with Jerrold!

Besides the cost of $150/unit, the added benefit of doing 1-week intensive courses in Grand Rapids allows pastors to get away, but also be back to their sheep in a timely manner. This benefits both pastor and parish.

I am doing the Historical Theology track. My advisor is Dr. Joel Beeke. So far I have taken one course by directed study on english Non-Conformity with Robert Oliver and two courses in Grand Rapids on Lutheran Orthodoxy with Robert Kolb and Forerunners of the Reformation with Carl Trueman. Next Spring, both Robert Godfrey (History of Dutch Reformation) and Sinclair Ferguson will be teaching (Westminster Assembly).

I submit that no other seminary can offer that lineup of instructors, at least for Historical Theology.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

Historical Theology is the avenue I wish to take Rev. Hyde so you are doing a great job of selling me on PRTS. (especially the cost).

Anyone know what the cost is per credit for GPTS? They do not have Th.M prices listed on their website, I know they are quite competitive in the M.Div.


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## dannyhyde (May 9, 2008)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> Historical Theology is the avenue I wish to take Rev. Hyde so you are doing a great job of selling me on PRTS. (especially the cost).
> 
> Anyone know what the cost is per credit for GPTS? They do not have Th.M prices listed on their website, I know they are quite competitive in the M.Div.



Hi Benjamin,

I believe GPTS is the same, $150/unit. Although, their ThM program is now by-invite-only. A friend, Rev. Wes White, just finished his ThM there, but they've re-worked the program to make it more conducive to those who want to do it quickly, etc.

It was attractive at first because it, too, allowed for module-type courses, but the instructors at PRTS are head-and-shoulders above. PRTS' goal is to get the top scholars in to teach every class, hence, I've not had 1 class with Dr. Beeke, although we work closely on my directed study courses and research.

I'd call PRTS and talk with Henk Kleyn, the registrar, and then set up a phone appointment with Dr. Beeke.

As a die hard Westminster California guy, I cannot recommend PRTS any higher than I am.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

I am finished at PTS/RPTS in the Winter Term of '09 (Feb. 09, as both schools are on a quarter-system) so I would not start till probably Fall '09. I saw in the catalog that the application date for fall of '09 is May of next year. 

But I will certainly contact Henk Kleyn and get some more information on PRTS. You have been a great help Rev. Hyde.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 9, 2008)

One more thing, do you fly into Grand Rapids or Detroit (or somewhere else?)...


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## Kevin (May 11, 2008)

If you are in the ARP then there are a lot of good reasons to go to Erskine, like low tuition if you are "under care". ATS accreditation, etc...

If you do intend to get a PhD, then some of the schools on the list might make that harder.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 31, 2008)

Thanks for that Kevin. That is a serious issue for me. However I have spoken to some mentors at PTS and RPTS and they told me that as long as I write a quality Thesis and do good work post-Th.M that it will not pose a fatal threat to a Ph.D but like you said it will make it a little more difficult.

Also I received in the mail yesterday the information from PRTS and wow. That place is great and is definitely top of my list and will receive an application from me.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (May 31, 2008)

By the way the DVD they send with the packet features fellow Puritan Board member nleshelman.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Aug 8, 2008)

I sent in my application to Erskine and PRTS to start next fall...


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