# PCA



## doulosChristou (Apr 25, 2005)

What year was the PCA born? What is the history behind it?


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## wsw201 (Apr 25, 2005)

The PCA was formed out of the PCUS (the old Southern Presbyterian Church) in 1973.


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## RamistThomist (Apr 25, 2005)

1978?
1977?


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## doulosChristou (Apr 25, 2005)

Did the OPC then split off from the PCA?


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## wsw201 (Apr 25, 2005)

The OPC split from the PCUSA back in the early 1930's when the PCUSA kicked Machen out.


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## doulosChristou (Apr 25, 2005)

Oh, so the OPC is older than the PCA? I did not know that. What was the issue over which Machen was kicked out of the PCUSA? What was the effect on Westminster Seminary?


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## fredtgreco (Apr 25, 2005)

Northern Mainline Church (UPCUS/PCUSA)---> OPC

Southern Mainline Church (PCUS) --> PCA

shortly after the PCA was formed, the Northern and Southern Mainline churches united to form the PCUSA.


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## fredtgreco (Apr 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by doulosChristou_
> Oh, so the OPC is older than the PCA? I did not know that. What was the issue over which Machen was kicked out of the PCUSA? What was the effect on Westminster Seminary?



Greg,

This is a long a convoluted issue. Westminster was formed briefly before the OPC - the takeover of Princeton by the liberals and founding of Westminster was one of the last battles in the mainline church.

The best resource I have found is Longfield's _The Presbyterian Controversy_


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## doulosChristou (Apr 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by fredtgreco_
> The best resource I have found is Longfield's _The Presbyterian Controversy_.



Thanks!


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## wsw201 (Apr 25, 2005)

Greg,

Here is a site that give an excerpt from Longfield about what was going on in the PCUSA and the split.

PCUSA History


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Apr 25, 2005)

Brief History of the PCA

Background of the OPC


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## jfschultz (Apr 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by fredtgreco_
> Northern Mainline Church (UPCUS/PCUSA)---> OPC
> 
> Southern Mainline Church (PCUS) --> PCA
> ...



Actually it was about a decade after the PCA was formed that the UPCUS and PCUS united. About the time that the PCA received the RPCES.

Ironically it was the PCUS desire to omit an escape clause that lead to the formation of the PCA. It was the inclusion of an escape clause that was only an option to the former PCUS churches that lead to the formation of the EPC by a number of UPCUS churches.


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## Presbyrino (Apr 25, 2005)

I apologize and I don't mean to hijack this post (If required, I will start a new post) , but why didn't the newly born PCA join the OPC? 

Were the differences, at the inception of the PCA, that distinctive from the OPC that it required starting a new denomination?


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## Myshkin (Apr 25, 2005)

I have been referred to these articles more than once for some contemporary history of the PCA:

http://www.pastoral-leadership.org/pdf/TKeller_CultureofthePCA-rev.pdf

http://www.epcnewark.org/recread/MakingSenseOfThePCA.htm

http://www2.pcanews.com/editorial_o...te/full_paper.taf?topic_ID=29&topic_paper_ID=

a response to this third article:

http://www2.pcanews.com/editorial_o...e/full_comment.taf?topic_ID=15&comment_ID=199

[Edited on 4-25-2005 by RAS]

[Edited on 5-3-2005 by RAS]


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## jfschultz (Apr 25, 2005)

> _Originally posted by sntijerina_
> I apologize and I don't mean to hijack this post (If required, I will start a new post) , but why didn't the newly born PCA join the OPC?
> 
> Were the differences, at the inception of the PCA, that distinctive from the OPC that it required starting a new denomination?



In fact having the OPC join the PCA was considered in the early 80's as the RPCES did. (As I recall the PCA vote to invite the OPC failed by one presbytery.)

speculation ON
The OPC might have been happier that the mass of departing PCUS churches did form the PCA just because of the numbers involved.
speculation OFF


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## Contra_Mundum (Apr 26, 2005)

The best chance for PCA/OPC unification was right at the beginning (mid '70s). If such an event had occurred, the resulting church would look different from the present PCA. (How much different????) The church's center might be a bit closer to the ideal envisioned by the PCA founders. Receiving only the RPCES joiners produced a "shift" that produced a new balance-point. Think of a see-saw upon which a weight is set on one side. The fulcrum must move toward the added weight in order to rebalance. Had the OPC come in at the same time, I think the "center" would not have moved as far.

A few years later the OPC entertained another invitationto join, but the OPC had different ideas this time--the condition they countered with was that the churches formally _merge,_ and not simply that the OPC join the PCA by adopting its Standards as in the first invitation (in particular the PCA BCO, the WCF and Catechisms already being the same). These conditions were not agreed to by the PCA, and those talks foundered.

I do not think the OPC and PCA will merge as the present bodies are constituted. I think it is more likely that the PCA will eventually merge with the EPC. If that happened, not every PCA church (or Presbytery) would agree to union, and new alignments would take place. This could (though far from certain) result in another sister-denomination to the OPC (which could split too, who knows? Over what? Who knows?). The OPC, being smaller, retains a greater semblance of internal unity--I don't see its break-up on the horizon (yet).

I regret that our unity is not broader. It seems like we can only agree when we are small. Thus we have tiny splinter-presbyteries who have ultra-narrow fellowship, besides the better know denominations. Far be it from me to suggest that we should have no standards, but modernism's lies and now post-modernism's polylogism have produced too many men who cannot agree on the _plain meaning of words!_

Speaking for myself alone, I would like to see a confessional successor church to both the OPC and the PCA, one that embraces the best of both, one that truly brings together the confessional stream split in 1861. But I don't see it coming for a few years yet, and a lot can happen in a short period of time. The OPC of today may be something different tomorrow that no confessional PCA church could merge with in good conscience (just as the Southern Presbyterians could not re-align with the northerners after the War because of the changes in the northern church in only five short years).


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## Reed (Apr 27, 2005)

Good book on the history of the PCA titled: I am Reminded by: Kennedy Smart

gives all the inside dope.
R


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## rmwilliamsjr (Apr 27, 2005)

_I regret that our unity is not broader. It seems like we can only agree when we are small. _

i really would like to understand what is going on when we see things like this.
I have to agree that things appear this way, but why? What is it that keeps theologically aware churches smaller, and allows country-club type of churches to get huge?

numbers aren't everything, i realize that, but they are important. 
something important is being captured in this statement, and i 'd like to understand what it is.


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## rmwilliamsjr (May 30, 2005)

i start teaching a Sunday School class on the History of American Presbyterianism at a PCA church this Sunday. I am rather nervous as i am not a teacher, nor a seminary graduate. the first class is at:
http://www.dakotacom.net/~rmwillia/hap1.html

i'd dearly love to get help on it while i can start incorporate the discussions into the notes. i'll printout this for the class Saturday june 4th afternoon.

the printout version of the lesson is:



> History of American Presbyterianism
> 
> 
> Introduction to the Class
> ...


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