# Campus Crusade?



## jaybird0827 (Jul 20, 2006)

I was wondering what kind of experiences people on this forum have had with Campus Crusade for Christ or their staff.

I was a member of their staff for a period of roughly 3 years back in the mid-70's. My background at the time was mainline Presbyterian and I was also very much a Dispensational.

There were a lot of things that eventually drove me out of there, but the clincher was this. My team had to take a course within what they call Institute of Biblical Studies (IBS). The course was in Basic Bible Study Methods. The "sample book" to be studied happened to be Paul's epistle to the Romans.

I was not long into the study when I became aware that I was uncomfortable with their stock methods such as "The Four Spiritual Laws", "The Van Dusen Letter", "The Spirit-filled Life", "Carnal Christians", et al. I suspected that their idea of "carnality" was in error as the study progressed through Romans 7. 

By the time we got to Romans 9 I couldn't handle it anymore. What they taught about "successful witnessing" and their methods being "proven effective" was not squaring with Scripture. The workarounds no longer made sense. They were just as expert at explaining Scripture away as the mainline liberals had been previously.

Note, right after I left they started working on "The Jesus Video". 

It would be another 4 years before I found out what path I had begun as a result of having gone through that study. That is another long story.

Thoughts? Stories?


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Jul 20, 2006)

Jay,

I can very much relate. I will not forget that when I was an unbeliever, a Baha'i, friends in Campus Crusade were kind to me and expressed their desire for me to know the Lord Jesus. But the Four Spiritual Laws is not the gospel. The pressure that was put on us after we confessed Christ to immediately go out and start witnessing to everyone around us with that tract or others like it, to invest all of our time and energy in building up the parachurch, to seek out a 'second baptism of the Spirit,' and many other things weighed heavily on me. The doctrine of 'carnal Christian' was for me a particular snare. Which is why when by the mercy of God my heart was opened to the doctrines of grace and the Reformed Faith, and I left Campus Crusade and Inter-Varsity Christian Fellowship behind, it was for me like my eyes were opened to the truth for the very first time.


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## yeutter (Jul 20, 2006)

> _Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot_
> Which is why when by the mercy of God my heart was opened to the doctrines of grace and the Reformed Faith, and I left Campus Crusade and Inter-Varsity Christian Fellowship behind, it was for me like my eyes were opened to the truth for the very first time.



Andrew;

ParaChurch organizations like Campus Crusade, Inter-Varcity, and Young Life are irregular because they are not subject to proper ecclesiastical oversight. Was it your experience that Inter-Varcity was hostile to the doctrines of grace like Campus Crusade?


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Jul 20, 2006)

> _Originally posted by yeutter_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot_
> ...



Not as overtly in my experience, but I was never taught anything about the doctrines of graces in IVCF. I was taught Arminianism only albeit the word itself was never uttered in my hearing. The main message I got out of IVCF was that true worship and godly living consists in this: learn how to play a guitar, participate in singing praise choruses, have your quiet time daily, avoid the sin of denominationalism (Roman Catholics are Christians too), and above all, witness, witness, witness for Jesus -- witness as if your salvation depends upon it.

[Edited on 7-21-2006 by VirginiaHuguenot]


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## Puddleglum (Jul 20, 2006)

I was part of Campus Crusade while at community college . . . it was an interesting year and a half (the first half year I was at Highline my schedule wouldn't let me go).

The first year there was a guy leading it, who was pretty conservative and seemed sympathetic - or at least not antagonistic - to more reformed thinking (he goes to Mars Hill). 

The next year, there were a couple co-leaders, and they were all pretty charismatic Evangelicals. So at the beginning of the year we had to all say what we wanted / thought God was going to do in our lives the next year - because if you say something, it will happen. And we burned incense because of those verses in the New Testament about being a "sweet smelling aroma" (despite my protests about Nadab & Abihu - and then about allergies, when that didn't work!). And we talked about casting out demons, and demons sitting on your shoulder. And almost every week the one leader would say or pray something related to speaking in tongues. The greatest sin - it seemed - was "being devisive". 

And then there were some of the people who came . . . like the one guy who argued that you can't say that anyone is saved, because salvation is conditional on your enduring to the end. And the gal who said that Christians never sin - herself included. 

I argued those points . . . and thankfully, one of the leaders (crazy theology aside) decided to bring up the doctrine of election (!) in support of what I was saying in response to the first one . . . and our faculty advisor (who is a great Christian guy faithfully representing Christ in a pretty difficult situation) supported me on the "Christians do sin" argument.

It was difficult. I learned a lot about picking my battles - there are a lot of things that I didn't argue (demons, speaking in tongues), and some things that I did argue that I wish I hadn't (incense). 

The person that really frustrated me was the regional guy who was actually on staff (none of us at Highline were on staff), who'd come down every so often and play the same stupid movie clip from Les Miseralbes and tell us that if someone wasn't converted after we were done sharing the 4 Spiritual Laws with them, the problem was with us. There were days when I'd leave profoundly discouraged (ok, depressed). 

But - I'd do it again. Cause it wasn't all discouragingly bad theology. The second year, we had a lot less involvement from the regional directors than in the past. This really frustrated some people - because it meant that there was a lot we weren't able to do - but I thought it was a really good thing. There was one quarter when basically all we'd do was meet once a week to talk and pray for an hour. And thankfully, we were blessed in that these meetings didn't turn into an hour-long gossip-and-whine fest. Those prayer times were a definite blessing. 

And beyond that . . . there were a few saner Christians that also went, and those friendships (and ok, the friendships of some of the crazier people too!) were a huge source of support, especially during that last year which was a rather difficult year for me. 

And there were times when I got the opportunity to talk about doctrine in a sane way - because of the craziness. One girl came up to me and asked me what I thought of the 4 Spiritual Laws, and we got into a good discussion about it . . . things like that. And there were times when some of the "saner" people would come up to me and say that they agreed with / appreciated what I'd said when I'd decided to speak up against some of the weird stuff.

The last couple months I ended up being a leader - somehow, I ended up getting put on the list, even though I'd been trying to avoid it. Dusty (our faculty advisor) said that I'd volunteered one too many times . . . I don't think I could have handled leadership if I'd been at it for any longer, with that group of co-leaders. (I was late enough that I didn't have to "preach" like all of the other leades did). 

But I definately think that it was worth it . . . though I am VERY grateful for RUF. While there may be things that I disagree with, at least no-one is trying to make me speak in tongues!


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## blhowes (Jul 22, 2006)

Inspite of all the things that may be negative about Campus Crusade, their methods and their message, still I'm thankful for the limited contact I had with them when I was in college. Sitting out there on the campus drill field, at enmity with God and battling God in my mind, two folks from Campus Crusade came by and asked me if I wanted to know how to get saved. I told them I wasn't quite ready yet, so they left me the 4 Spiritual Laws tract for me to read. I continued to battle God in my mind for the rest of the day. Around 5:30 in the evening, I went into the campus chapel and used the 4 Spiritual Laws tract as an aid when I got saved. 

The things in there about experiencing the abundant life and experiencing God's plan for my life, etc., didn't have much impact as I read through the tract. But God sure did use those scriptures in there powerfully to convict me of my sin and show me my need for Jesus and what He did for me on the cross. 

I'm so glad those two 'happened' to come by when they did. I'm sure God would/could have used different messengers with a more theologically accurate message, but for me, an athiest who knew nothing about God, those scriptures in that tract, surrounded and almost hidden by many of man's ideas, were very helpful.

[Edited on 7-22-2006 by blhowes]


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## jaybird0827 (Jul 22, 2006)

> _Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot_
> ... I was never taught anything about the doctrines of graces in IVCF. I was taught Arminianism only albeit the word itself was never uttered in my hearing. The main message I got out of IVCF was that true worship and godly living consists in this: learn how to play a guitar, participate in singing praise choruses, have your quiet time daily, avoid the sin of denominationalism (Roman Catholics are Christians too), and above all, witness, witness, witness for Jesus -- witness as if your salvation depends upon it.



This very closely describes my experience with CCC.


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## jaybird0827 (Jul 22, 2006)

Jessica H.

I noted your mention of "speaking in tongues". This tells me that CCC has changed its position on this particular issue. When I joined staff in 1974, CCC acknowledged that people had this "gift" but asked them to set it aside and apply the "temperance" aspect of the fruit of the Holy Spirit (Galatians 5:23, NASB in use by CCC at the time translated this "self-control") if they joined staff.

_Jay_


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## Puddleglum (Jul 22, 2006)

Jay,

As far as I'm aware, that's still Crusade's official position. I remember talking to other Crusaders about that sitution, and they were very surprised . . . I think that a lot of the situation at Highline was due to the fact that we were pretty much left to ourselves, without any official Campus Crusade input 95% of the time (including the fact that none of our leaders received any official training where they might have been told something like that).


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## jaybird0827 (Jul 22, 2006)

Jessica,

Good - that's a little more reassuring. Albeit the type of thing that you found was quite common then, too.

_Jay_


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## jaybird0827 (Jul 22, 2006)

> _Originally posted by blhowes_
> Inspite of all the things that may be negative about Campus Crusade, their methods and their message, still I'm thankful for the limited contact I had with them when I was in college. Sitting out there on the campus drill field, at enmity with God and battling God in my mind, two folks from Campus Crusade came by and asked me if I wanted to know how to get saved. I told them I wasn't quite ready yet, so they left me the 4 Spiritual Laws tract for me to read. I continued to battle God in my mind for the rest of the day. Around 5:30 in the evening, I went into the campus chapel and used the 4 Spiritual Laws tract as an aid when I got saved.
> 
> The things in there about experiencing the abundant life and experiencing God's plan for my life, etc., didn't have much impact as I read through the tract. But God sure did use those scriptures in there powerfully to convict me of my sin and show me my need for Jesus and what He did for me on the cross.
> ...



Bob, 

What a testimony to God's grace that he converted you speaking through those scriptures, and that the fact that he did so is so clear to you.

_Jay_


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## blhowes (Jul 22, 2006)

> _Originally posted by jaybird0827_
> What a testimony to God's grace that he converted you speaking through those scriptures, and that the fact that he did so is so clear to you.


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