# Sabbath Day Questions...



## Mindaboo (Apr 11, 2010)

Brad and I are getting into a routine and getting our preparations under control as far as preparing for the Sabbath. It has been a lot of work, a lot of thought and effort that I do hope is honoring and pleasing our Lord. 

My questions would primarily be for people with children. Do you allow your children to play or do they study? My youngest is nine and all of them are capable of studying the scriptures. My understanding of the WCF is that they should forsake all play and normal activities on Sunday. My children constantly get invited to other Christian's homes to play, but we are convicted that maybe shouldn't be happening. Those other families allow their children to do things we don't think are permissable. What do you do in those situations? Do you allow them to go play? We have not. They have six other days to have play dates. My other question pertains to our Sunday night activities at church. We only meet one Sunday a month for evening activities. The teens group seems to be focused on playing games rather than a Bible study. They have a group that goes out and does acts of mercy within the community and some times they are planning those things. Wednesday nights they do a Bible study that is very good. If they were doing that I wouldn't have a problem with it. Would you allow your children to participate? Why or why not? I have always thought that churches are dumbing down our children by making everything about having fun. My children can grasp things at times that are difficult for me, so I think we don't set the standard high enough.

Please don't get the wrong impression about my church. I love my church deeply and my pastor is one of the most godly men I have ever met. I do however know that our view is the minority, meaning we are the only family I know of that even attempts to observe the Sabbath. I am not looking to change my church, just simply to follow what I think the scriptures teach. 

Any suggestions or advice would be greatly appreciated. Am I being legalistic in my approach to the Sabbath? Please don't turn this into a debate about whether or not we should observe the Sabbath or not. I am convinced that we should. I just want to understand if I am approaching this correctly or not.


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## bouletheou (Apr 11, 2010)

Mindy,

I think you should try and "change your church." I don't think there's anything wrong with that if it's done in the right spirit.

My kids are very young yet (3 and 4) and we try to tailor our Sabbath activities to their capacities. They are allowed to play quietly for part of the day. We let them have one hour of TV (some kind of Christian DVD.) When they get older we will wean them off of that and onto the Bible and Christian books. First reading them to them, then allowing them to read for themselves. We always try to emphasize to them what a blessing and a joy the Sabbath Day is, and try to mirror that in our own countenances.

Your kids are old enough to begin making use of the Day, and I would press them towards that goal. I would not allow play dates on a Sunday.

As regards your church, perhaps you can
1. Ask your pastor to begin a Sunday evening worship service or at least a Bible study. If he's unwilling, maybe an elder can lead it.
2. Ask that the wonderful Wednesday bible study be held on Sunday evening instead, and the games and goofing be held on Wednesday night.
3. Volunteer to do whatever needs to be done to remove obstacles to Sunday Evening worship being instituted in your church
4. If that fails, gather your family for your own Sunday evening worship. Better to keep the Sabbath in your own home than to break it in the church.
5. Pray lots that the Lord would change hearts regarding the blessed Day and its inestimable value.

Blessings,


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## Montanablue (Apr 11, 2010)

Two Things:

1. If your church is holding a Bible study on Wed nights already, it doesn't seem like it would be really inconvenient for them to change the night to Sunday night instead. That seems like a request you could make respectfully to the elders that wouldn't require lots of extra work on their part. 

2. Obviously, this could not happen every week, but possibly, your children could occasionally ask their friends to your house and they could engage in an activity that would meet with your approval? Something like a mercy activity, perhaps a hike where you could focus on God's creation etc. I had friends when I was young whose parents had similar scruples about the Sabbath and they did this. My parents did not have similar scruples against recreation (and neither do I), but I certainly didn't mind going to friends' houses and doing these things - I often enjoyed it.


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## newcreature (Apr 11, 2010)

Our children play. In fact, we have a small playground at church were the kids all go out for a while after service. We have no Sunday evening service, instead we have fellowship lunch and then dismiss. Sometimes one of the families in the church will offer a cook-out at their home and invite everyone. But usually we go home to our families. 

We view the Sabbath as a day of worship and rest. We rest from non-essential work, and enjoy the day that the Lord has made. My husband and I often take our children to a park after we leave church, just to get out and enjoy creation. We often watch TV and take naps as well. It has never occurred to me that children would not play on the Sabbath.


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## lynnie (Apr 11, 2010)

We homeschool, and the weekdays are pretty full. Six other days for play dates? I don't see how. We also drive almost half an hour to church, so the nicest way for my daughter to play with church friends is to invite various ones back Sunday. Sometimes the parents have come for dinner, but usually we drive them home later and give the other parents a break.

I like it when the church feels like extended family. I want my kids to hang out with kids from church. My son is hanging out now at another home with older kids. I love having kids over on Sunday and them feeling like part of a big family.

If you do school all week and bible every day, I don't see the problem with playing Sunday afternoon. Creativity is a good thing. The girls here made a big fire and roasted hotdogs and played outside in the sunshine. I would see more forced bookwork all day as breaking the sabbath. School all week and more on Sunday? That's work.

Obviously there is no clear rigid set of rules on the sabbath, but I thank God my girl feels like part of the church family, and having kids over sunday facilitates that.


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## Scott1 (Apr 11, 2010)

Generally, if your church is doing something not quite right, perhaps allowing or encouraging recreation and entertainment on the Lord's Day, I would likely:

1) seek the counsel of some mature believers in the church
2) let your concern be known, in the form of a request for counsel and input from at least two elders
3) if the activity is a "primary" kind of violation, I would probably quietly abstain from the activity
4) if the activity was more "incidental," I would probably overlook it, but also look for opportunities in the ordinary course of things to engage it with people.


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## Andres (Apr 12, 2010)

Mindy, I don't have any children, but I hope it's okay that I am still commenting. 
First, no I do not deem it acceptable for children to go "play" at their friends house on the Lord's day. I will not let my children do that and they will understand from an early age why they will not do so and why they won't play group sports, scouting, or any other activities along those lines on Sundays. It is not because we are prohibiting those activities in a witholding sense, but rather we are setting those activities aside for the privilege of giving the day over to the Lord. 

With that being said, I do not think one has to completely outlaw children's activities of every kind. We must remember that the key issue is a heart issue. God wants our hearts completely given over to Him on the sabbath. Due to the nature of children, especially young ones, they simply cannot read/do bible studies for 10 hours straight all day. But this doesn't mean that they cannot worship God and keep their heart and mind focused on Him for the day. For example, perhaps they could play with their legos/blocks and make bible scenes out of them. Or they could play games that are bible games. You could go for a walk with them and practice memory verses/catechism. The point is that the focus remains on the Lord throughout the day. This is the huge difference is how you spend Sunday and how you spend the rest of the week. I would fear that if young children were made to sit still and listen to reading all the first half of the day, then the second half of the sabbath would be worthless in that they would be far too restless to pay any attention to anything else. Restless, grumpy children would also make it difficult for you and Brad to enjoy your worship/study time too.

As for the second question regarding the teens, no I would not want mine to spend Sunday evening playing games, even if it is at church. I would not be divisive about it , but I would lovingly explain to the pastor/elders ahead of time that on the Sunday evenings when the teen group chooses to play games instead of study God's Word or do the mercy ministry, your teens will not participate. I would have them join you in whatever you and Brad are choosing to do for that Sunday evening instead. Again, as long as you are not being divisive or causing a big stink about it (and it in no way sounds like you are) then I see no reason why your pastor would have a problem with you and Brad obeying your consciences and leading your family in the way you deem best.

BTW, I love how you are genuinely concerned in properly honoring the Lord's Day and I love how you desire for your children to also. I look forward with great anticipation for the day my wife and I get to spend Sundays with our children.


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## Tim (Apr 12, 2010)

My pastor at my home church in Canada has special Noah's ark toys that are set aside for his children for the Sabbath.


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## TexanRose (Apr 12, 2010)

Mindy, I agree with your interpretation of the WCF. 

I do know of a family that does not allow their three-year-old to play on the Sabbath. She doesn't seem to have a hard time with it--just takes it as a matter of course. With two church services, two family worship times, meals, a nap, and being read to (Bible stories) by her big brothers, she stays occupied. She does have her "baby" (doll) that she keeps with her all day, and she is allowed to "take notes" in church.

Personally, I don't take it quite that far; my three-year-old may play with his Legos or blocks on the Sabbath, though he has to play quietly so as not to disturb the peace and restfulness of others' Sabbath. At some point in the day, I read him Bible stories; and he often takes a nap on the Sabbath (not usually on other days). 

My five-year-old is not forbidden to play on the Sabbath, but I am gradually steering him away from the toys and towards good books and other more appropriate Sabbath activities. He knows which are the Sabbath books and which are not (Sabbath books include Bible stories, moral children's stories, biographies of missionaries, etc.) He also spends part of the day reviewing his memory work, and lately I have discovered that he really likes to play teacher and quiz ME on MY memory work. He's a very active/energetic kid so I find it helpful to take him for a walk before the evening service to burn off some energy (this also helps wake me out of the quiet-afternoon drowsiness that I sometimes experience).

I know a number of kids who are similar ages to yours, Mindy, and their parents do expect them to keep the Sabbath according to the WCF. They do gather in groups and visit after church, but there isn't any running around or "playing." Afternoons are spent quietly reading good books and preparing for Sabbath school (which is held before the evening service). It can be done, and it isn't a burden. 

This is probably semantics, but I wouldn't call what our young people do "studying." If you call it studying, it does sound more ominous.  I would just call it reading. Nothing wrong with asking kids to spend the day reading quietly or resting. Perhaps journaling would be another appropriate activity.

Of course, it's more challenging when others at church don't share your convictions. Been there, done that, so you have my sympathy.

I agree wholeheartedly about churches dumbing things down for the kids. I have often thought that most churches these days underestimate their children. Children are capable of sitting and listening and even understanding in church; of learning and understanding the Bible and quite a bit of doctrine; and even of memorizing large chunks of Scripture and the Shorter Catechism. (I know a few teens who completed the Shorter Catechism long ago and are now memorizing the Larger Catechism.) Having seen what kids can do, I've been disappointed to find that even some of the better churches have Sunday school classes that consist mostly of cutting and pasting.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 12, 2010)

> 1. Ask your pastor to begin a Sunday evening worship service or at least a Bible study. If he's unwilling, maybe an elder can lead it.



Right now we have an interim pastor and a hurting congregation. I would not want to do anything else right now to inflict more injury to my congregation. I can however go to my interim pastor and ask for direction on this. 



> 2. Ask that the wonderful Wednesday bible study be held on Sunday evening instead, and the games and goofing be held on Wednesday night.



Another problem our church is facing is that we have no building. And I found out last night we actually won't be having any Sunday night activities through the summer. That gives me time to pray, meet with my session, and study more.



> 3. Volunteer to do whatever needs to be done to remove obstacles to Sunday Evening worship being instituted in your church
> 4. If that fails, gather your family for your own Sunday evening worship. Better to keep the Sabbath in your own home than to break it in the church.
> 5. Pray lots that the Lord would change hearts regarding the blessed Day and its inestimable value.


Thank you! That is very helpful advice!


> We homeschool, and the weekdays are pretty full. Six other days for play dates? I don't see how. We also drive a
> lmost half an hour to church, so the nicest way for my daughter to play with church friends is to invite various ones back Sunday. Sometimes the parents have come for dinner, but usually we drive them home later and give the other parents a break.


I homeschool as well and maybe the difference is that I live within a ten minute range of most of the kids in my church. That makes it easier for me to have kids over any time. I understand your situation is different than mine. My kids are not lacking Christian fellowship. We are part of a small group where the kids play and we often have other kids at our home. There is rarely a day in our week that goes by that we don't have extra as a family, listen to Christian music or hymns, we work on memkids here. 

My kids range of age is . I do catechism with them, we read Narnia ory verses and a variety of other things. I don't feel like I am mak16-9. I don't make them, nor do I plan to make them study the scriptures for hours a daying the day a "work" day. I am s to give Him one day out of seven. Our family is enjoying the Sabbath greatly. My main problem is that we are offending other parents when they invite our children to play and we say no. I want to make sure my attitudes are correct.

---------- Post added at 10:29 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:19 AM ----------

My cursor won't let me post beyond a paragraph without going goofy. So, if my last post doesn't make sense in the end that is why. 
What I was trying to say is that my kids age range is 16-9. I do catechims, read Narnia, work on memory verses and a variety of other things. I don't feel like I am making this a day of work. I don't expect them to study for hours. They are allowed to read missionary biographies and other books. Our family is enjoying the Sabbath greatly. My main problem is becoming the other parents who are offended when they invite our children over to play and we say no. I want to make sure my attitudes are correct.


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## Montanablue (Apr 12, 2010)

Mindy, maybe when families invite your children over, you can tell them that you appreciate the invite, but you're trying to make Sunday a special day for your family, you have these Sunday activities that you do together, and so you're trying to cut down on visiting with others. I _can_ see why some ppl might be offended if they're interpreting your not allowing your children to visit as some kind of comment on their household being unsuitable. (I know that's not what you're saying, but I can see why someone might take it there). In the end though, if you're polite and kind in your refusals, I don't think anyone should take offense.


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## larryjf (Apr 12, 2010)

On the Lord's Day my children play, but we try to center the playing around Christ. Playing can be a wonderful learning mechanism for children.

So when my little girl plays with dolls on Sunday, she might have them be part of a church service....or be missionaries to other dolls who don't know the Lord.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 12, 2010)

> Mindy, maybe when families invite your children over, you can tell them that you appreciate the invite, but you're trying to make Sunday a special day for your family, you have these Sunday activities that you do together, and so you're trying to cut down on visiting with others. I can see why some ppl might be offended if they're interpreting your not allowing your children to visit as some kind of comment on their household being unsuitable. (I know that's not what you're saying, but I can see why someone might take it there). In the end though, if you're polite and kind in your refusals, I don't think anyone should take offense.



We have repeatedly explained it isn't personal. Our children play with these kids throughout the week, so I think it is pretty obvious that it isn't personal. We let our children spend the night at their house, have those children here, and try to let them have time to play. Thank you for your advice. I am praying about this.


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## Montanablue (Apr 12, 2010)

Mindaboo said:


> > Mindy, maybe when families invite your children over, you can tell them that you appreciate the invite, but you're trying to make Sunday a special day for your family, you have these Sunday activities that you do together, and so you're trying to cut down on visiting with others. I can see why some ppl might be offended if they're interpreting your not allowing your children to visit as some kind of comment on their household being unsuitable. (I know that's not what you're saying, but I can see why someone might take it there). In the end though, if you're polite and kind in your refusals, I don't think anyone should take offense.
> 
> 
> 
> We have repeatedly explained it isn't personal. Our children play with these kids throughout the week, so I think it is pretty obvious that it isn't personal. We let our children spend the night at their house, have those children here, and try to let them have time to play. Thank you for your advice. I am praying about this.


 
Well, in that case, I can't think of why they would be offended! I'm sorry Mindy.


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## py3ak (Apr 12, 2010)

I know some kids (my warrant for commenting) who were required to spend their Sundays reading biographies, Foxe's Book of Martyr's, commentaries, etc. They considered Sunday the _worst_ day of the week, rather than the best. Depending on a child's age, at times it seems that honoring the Sabbath, for them, involves mostly not preventing other people from honoring it. Hence a variety of quiet/companionable/active things to do may be of most assistance to them, and most in keeping with Mark 2:23-28; it might be possible to present things to other parents in that light?


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## matt01 (Apr 12, 2010)

Mindaboo said:


> My questions would primarily be for people with children. Do you allow your children to play or do they study? What do you do in those situations? Do you allow them to go play?



Our children are still young, so maybe it is not as applicable. We like to take them to the park in the afternoon, normally while dinner is being prepared. I took them to the park for 30 minutes yesterday, which proved to be a fine time. The kids were able to enjoy some time in the sun, and my wife was able to finish dinner preparations. We went to the evening service shortly after dinner.

In the past, when family has been in town, we have gone to a cook-out on Sunday afternoon. It isn't optimal, but we often only see family once a year, and it is normally on Sunday.

We should avoid cookie cutter definitions of what can be done on the Lord’s Day.



py3ak said:


> Depending on a child's age, at times it seems that honoring the Sabbath, for them, involves mostly not preventing other people from honoring it.



We might not have the same meaning, but this is what we aim for. We make an effort to focus our activities on the Lord, even while playing on the swings (thanking the Lord for the sun...). We do avoid activities that require others to work, such as eating out, though we will do so if we happen to be travelling, and not have family to spend the day with.


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## TexanRose (Apr 12, 2010)

py3ak said:


> I know some kids (my warrant for commenting) who were required to spend their Sundays reading biographies, Foxe's Book of Martyr's, commentaries, etc. They considered Sunday the _worst_ day of the week, rather than the best.



Children who do not yet know the Lord will probably find the Sabbath a burden (as will unregenerate adults). This does not mean that they should not be expected to keep it.


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## py3ak (Apr 13, 2010)

Indeed, the Sabbath laws bind all, saved or unsaved. But why do you assume the children were unregenerate?


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## Tripel (Apr 13, 2010)

TexanRose said:


> py3ak said:
> 
> 
> > I know some kids (my warrant for commenting) who were required to spend their Sundays reading biographies, Foxe's Book of Martyr's, commentaries, etc. They considered Sunday the _worst_ day of the week, rather than the best.
> ...


 
I have been regenerated as long as I can remember, but as a young boy, I would have grown to despise the Sabbath had I been forbidden to play and forced to read the Bible and commentaries all day.


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## TexanRose (Apr 13, 2010)

py3ak said:


> Indeed, the Sabbath laws bind all, saved or unsaved. But why do you assume the children were unregenerate?


 
Well, I'm just thinking of my own son, who grumbles about family worship, church, and Sabbaths. As far as I know, he does not yet know the Lord. Also, I remember my own youth pre-conversion. I would think that a child who does know the Lord could find delight in a Sabbath kept according to God's will. 

The fourth commandment is addressed not only to adults, but to sons and daughters. As Matthew Henry says on this commandment, "In this...it is expected that masters of families should take care, not only to serve the Lord themselves, but that their houses also should serve him, at least that it may not be through their neglect if they do not." 

I don't know why expecting children to keep the Sabbath is considered "forcing." I would call it "training up a child in the way he should go." 

It's not like I expect my son to sit stock still on a couch with his hands folded on his lap, reading Calvin's Commentaries. He reads interesting books written for children, and he is allowed to stand on his head while doing so if he wishes (he does like to read while upside down). Once he gets over his grumbling about not being allowed to jump on the couch, wrestle with his brother, etc. he does enjoy his reading. I haven't yet raised a child who didn't like to read (and I don't intend to  ) so I can't picture this being such a burden as some of y'all are making it out to be.


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## Montanablue (Apr 13, 2010)

I'm not a parent, so I should butt out of this thread. But just one last thing - not every child (or adult) enjoys reading. Its a real struggle for some. I would hesitate to say that one needs to spend the Sabbath reading to keep the Sabbath- its simply not restful for many people. (I'm thinking of one of my siblings in particular)


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## py3ak (Apr 13, 2010)

TexanRose said:


> Well, I'm just thinking of my own son, who grumbles about family worship, church, and Sabbaths. As far as I know, he does not yet know the Lord. Also, I remember my own youth pre-conversion. I would think that a child who does know the Lord could find delight in a Sabbath kept according to God's will.
> 
> The fourth commandment is addressed not only to adults, but to sons and daughters. As Matthew Henry says on this commandment, "In this...it is expected that masters of families should take care, not only to serve the Lord themselves, but that their houses also should serve him, at least that it may not be through their neglect if they do not."
> 
> ...



Part of the childish condition is that you have fewer resources with which to control the demands of nature - hence, diapers! Since eating when you're hungry is a Sabbath activity defended by Christ, in the text I cited previously, the Sabbath laws ought to be understood in such a way that they don't oppress nature (though they will oppress sin, as you can see in Nehemiah). Therefore in training your children to keep the Sabbath (which is very laudable) wisdom must be exercised so that an adult standard of control over nature is not imposed on children (e.g., you don't require a newborn to stay awake the whole day because the LC condemns laziness). I think that was the mistake of the parents of the children I mentioned, and it seems like an easy mistake to make. Part of the responsibility of parents honoring the Sabbath is not to make it miserable for others. Of course, the fact that others have made that mistake doesn't mean anyone here will; but it can hardly hurt to be aware of the possibility.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 13, 2010)

> I'm not a parent, so I should butt out of this thread. But just one last thing - not every child (or adult) enjoys reading. Its a real struggle for some. I would hesitate to say that one needs to spend the Sabbath reading to keep the Sabbath- its simply not restful for many people. (I'm thinking of one of my siblings in particular)



Kathleen, please don't butt out. I personally enjoy reading your post. 

I will just say this, all four of my children are proffessing faith and even if they weren't I am still called to raise them in the nurture and admonition of the Lord. I have not made this a burden for them in anyway. We have read exciting books about missionairies. They are allowed to have their neighborhood friends over. They teach those kids hymns and they sit and listen to me read Narnia. We allow the neighborhood kids, because they are unsaved kids from broken homes who are suffering and hurting. Those kids come and quietly sit with us, sing, listen to the sermon or whatever we are doing. If they don't they are asked to leave.

My children enjoy the Sabbath. I am just asking as I try to work out in my own mind what is honoring the Lord.


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## Montanablue (Apr 13, 2010)

I don't think I made it clear, but my point was that you don't necessarily have to read to honor the Sabbath You could listen to hymns, sermons, have a conversation about the sermon etc. Reading is certainly a good way to spend the day, but for those who struggle with it there are other options - and we shouldn't forget that.

Edit: Mindy, its nice to know I'm not being a pest!


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## TexanRose (Apr 13, 2010)

Montanablue said:


> I'm not a parent, so I should butt out of this thread. But just one last thing - not every child (or adult) enjoys reading. Its a real struggle for some. I would hesitate to say that one needs to spend the Sabbath reading to keep the Sabbath- its simply not restful for many people. (I'm thinking of one of my siblings in particular)


 
Oh, absolutely. In our house, we are all of the bookish sort, so reading is an obvious choice for our Sabbath afternoons. But conversations, singing, going for a walk, sermons or books on tape--all would also be excellent ways to spend the day (and we do those things also).


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## jogri17 (Apr 17, 2010)

No such thing as a perfect local church. How to obey the sabbath (or as I prefer to call it the Lord's day for theological reasons though sabbath is acceptable language properly understood) is largely a matter of personal Christian conscience. I would encourage to walk in humility with your fellow brothers and sisters in Christ and obey according to your conscience and do not judge other families who do not share your convictions and through humility and demonstrating what you believe to be true win them over. That was how I came to become a reformed Sabbatharian.


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## Scott1 (Apr 17, 2010)

jogri17 said:


> No such thing as a perfect local church. How to obey the sabbath (or as I prefer to call it the Lord's day for theological reasons though sabbath is acceptable language properly understood) is largely a matter of personal Christian conscience. I would encourage to walk in humility with your fellow brothers and sisters in Christ and obey according to your conscience and do not judge other families who do not share your convictions and through humility and demonstrating what you believe to be true win them over. That was how I came to become a reformed Sabbatharian.


 
The problem with that is we do not go by "conscience" really.

We go by what God has commanded His creatures to do.

(And He has a lot to say about one day in seven).


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## jandrusk (Apr 17, 2010)

As far as getting the church to change it's position on the observance of the Sabbath you may have a problem if they do not subscribe to a confession that calls for adherence to it. Not to say that you should not, just saying it will be very difficult to get support. If your church does not confessionally subscribe to the Sabbath you may want to get some of the men in the church involved in getting it added to either an existing confession if one exists or to have the constitution of your church amended to include it.


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## calgal (Apr 17, 2010)

Asking the session and pastor what their view of the Lord's Day might be helpful. And realizing that many families define day of rest differently might help. One thing you could encourage is starting a monthly or biweekly church lunch (potluck) at church after the morning service.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 18, 2010)

> Asking the session and pastor what their view of the Lord's Day might be helpful. And realizing that many families define day of rest differently might help. One thing you could encourage is starting a monthly or biweekly church lunch (potluck) at church after the morning service.



I am pretty sure I already know where each stands, but intend on asking them if they have taken any exceptions just so I do know. I am getting into a deeper study of the WCF and would like to know what they have taken exceptions to. I am not looking to change anyone's mind. I don't talk to people about it unless they ask. 

We do have a monthly luncheon and it is a nice time of fellowship. Our church doesn't have a building so our fellowship times are determined by the school we meet in. 

I am just learning these things myself and understand that not everyone will agree with me. I am okay with being in the minority. I want to walk in obedience and do what the Lord commands. 

In the end my main concern is glorifying the Lord with our day. I just started reading The Lord's Day by Joey Pipa and am studying that along with his study guide on the WCF. I know the Lord will guide and direct me in His way.


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## Scott1 (Apr 18, 2010)

As you are in a PCA church, all officers (deacons and elders) must declare any differences they have requested to take from the Westminster Standards. These are usually stated when the congregation votes on officers, so the congregation knows what they are voting on.

So, for example, if 2 deacon and 2 elder candidates are standing for election, and have gone through officer examination (e.g. exemplary life and sound doctrine), the congregation is able to know any exceptions before they vote on their officer candidates.

A teaching elder, e.g. Senior Pastor also requests exceptions, if any, before his presbytery. When the church calls him, there is a vote, and any exceptions, if any, are made known at that time in some format.

Last time I stood for office, I was the only one who did not request any exceptions to our standards- every other candidate requested and was granted exception to the sabbath recreation clause of Westminster Chapter XXI. That was the only exception requested.

All these men believe in the priority of Lord's Day worship, and that work, ordinarily is to be abstained from. Among those who request the recreation exception, it is interesting, many are open to improving on this. One told me he draws a "light" verses "heavy" recreation exception- no recreation that causes one to sweat.

It seems most also believe it is a violation to ordinarily eat out on the sabbath because it causes others to have to work. I only came to firm conviction about this recently (and am so blessed because of it), so one can only be patient as others are working through this.

What an incredible witness it has been to invite people over for a quiet meal after church at home- sometimes that happens as an alternative to a request to go out to eat at a restaurant after church. It is a good way to encourage and welcome new people, visitors, those going through difficulties, etc. Single people are good meal guests also.

It's important to witness with your words and life with the fourth commandment. After all, the Westminster Larger Catechism even acknowledges there is less light in nature for it.

What a lifetime pattern of blessing it is... and it helps us keep all the other commands better. While no one can promise, the restlessness and crisis that often breaks out in people's lives is lessened when a regular "ceasing" is, by God's grace observed one day in seven. It is really freeing to know you don't have to work, or even worry about it... and instead you can prioritize focus on God, His Word, and His Ways, all day.

[emphasis added]



> Question 121: Why is the word Remember set in the beginning of the fourth commandment?
> 
> Answer: The word Remember is set in the beginning of the fourth commandment, partly, because of the great benefit of remembering it, we being thereby helped in our preparation to keep it, and, *in keeping it, better to keep all the rest of the commandments*, and to continue a thankful remembrance of the two great benefits of creation and redemption, which contain a short abridgment of religion; and partly, *because we are very ready to forget it,* *for that there is less light of nature for it*, and yet it restrains our natural liberty in things at other times lawful; that it comes but once in seven days, and many worldly businesses come between, and too often take off our minds from thinking of it, either to prepare for it, or to sanctify it;and *that Satan with his instruments much labor to blot out the glory, and even the memory of it,* to bring in all irreligion and impiety.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 19, 2010)

Scott,

We are in a PCA church, but have only been in this church for about a year. Only one man has stood for elder and two for deacon since our return. No one mentioned any exceptions to the WCF. If they did it was not mentioned when we voted. 

We are still trying to sort out what is appropriate and what isn't at this point. I have only met two other families who have even attempted to rest on the Sabbath. Both have differing views than I do. They basically don't eat out and shop on Sunday. My conviction is that it goes deeper than that. We are to delight in the Lord by resting physically, refraining from works or business, and turning our feet from doing our good pleasure. I am finding great joy in focusing on Him instead of my self. 

People see it whether we talk about it or not. Like I said we are the only ones I am aware of that hold this view. If they ask me about it I do talk about it. I don't know how you would bring it up without coming across as judgemental. 

At some point I will go to my pastor and ask him about his take on it. He is our interim pastor and I am not sure just what his role is in the church. I don't think he comes in to reform the church since he won't be the pastor we call. He is a very sweet godly man. I know he isn't sabbatarian in his view and I would like to know why not. It would be interesting to hear his thoughts.


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## Scott1 (Apr 19, 2010)

Mindaboo said:


> Scott,
> 
> We are in a PCA church, but have only been in this church for about a year. Only one man has stood for elder and two for deacon since our return. No one mentioned any exceptions to the WCF. If they did it was not mentioned when we voted.
> 
> ...


.


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## Mindaboo (Apr 19, 2010)

> First, if you are new members (you mentioned you have been there less than one year), seek out a couple mature believers who have been there a long time and ask them about the local practice historically.



We are actually returning after being away for six years. I should probably just go to the session and ask them. We have a great relationship with a couple of our elders.




> A few ways this can be done (declaring exceptions):
> 
> 1)Have them announced when a congregational meeting is held
> 2)Have them written by the candidates name on the congregational ballot
> ...



We have been in two PCA churches and never seen any of this done. An officer's testimony would be very helpful, especially if it were a written one! I should ask if that is something they have ever considered. We or I should say Brad has always gone privately to ask them their stand on the WCF, but I never have. I don't remember ever hearing that they did take an exception. I wonder if it is because they aren't as familiar with it as they like to think. I would also be interested in finding out what their thoughts are on the second commandment. It would be good information to have. It certainly does help me to know how and why the church moves in certain directions. Thank you for all of your advice!


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## Andres (Apr 19, 2010)

Mindy, it sounds like you and Brad might be in a situation sort of similar to my wife and I. In our fairly small church (approx 25 people), we are the only ones who hold to a confessional view of the Sabbath. This includes our pastor who goes out to eat with his family on Sundays and whose wife watches football on Sundays. This is in NO WAY a post in condemnation of my pastor or any of our brothers and sisters in our local body, but I am hoping to comfort you in knowing that we too are in the minority group at our church. It is not always easy, but we stick to our convictions as best we can, all the while being respectful to others whom the Lord has not revealed the truths regarding the Lord’s Day. This means that we turn down lots of offers to go out to eat with families after service. Yesterday some of the teens were trying to plan a “game night” and suggested having it next Sunday evening. I simply remarked that I would prefer we do it on another night and suggested Friday instead. I have much, much respect for my pastor and elders, so I have never made it an issue. However, it was important for me to let them know where we stood, so when my wife and I met with them before joining our church as members, I told them that I held to the confessional view of the Sabbath. My pastor actually said that was great and he had no problem with it. He actually told me that even though I would be the minority in our local church, in the OPC he was the one who was the minority for taking exception to the confession’s teaching on the Sabbath. Also Scott, you are correct in that my pastor explained he declared this exception when transferring his ordination from the PCA to OPC and our presbytery okayed it.


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## Scott1 (Apr 19, 2010)

One other thing, and this comports with experience in several churches in the denomination-

Confirming officers (deacons and elders) is quite a process. It involves qualification by Scripture, testing and confirmation by the congregation. Ordination is, as I understand it, an ordinance of public worship because it involves taking of vows, laying on of hands, etc.

Remember, Presbyterian doctrine is that ordination is a lifetime call, not something to casually set aside. That's doctrine. This tends to promote stability.

The congregation, in the PCA, is very involved in the process of selecting officers. It's a process that involves nomination, training and examination by senior leadership, ordination, and confirmation by and greeting by the congregation. Ordinarily, a suitable sermon is directed toward ordination and installation of officers and God's plan in that. It is a basic part of the life of the congregation in Presbyterianism.

On a practical side, it really helps draw the covenant community together, encourage men broadly to lead, and make a more stable structure for growth and nurture and admonition in the Lord.


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