# Great Calvin quote on "Free Will"



## Hamalas (Sep 27, 2009)

Hey, I read this last Lord's Day and just had to share it with y'all:



> Were any one to ask them, Is not God necessarily good, is not the devil necessarily wicked, what answer would they give? The goodness of God is so connected with his Godhead, that it is not more necessary to be God than to be good; whereas the devil, by his fall, was so estranged from goodness, that he can do nothing but evil. Should any one give utterance to the profane jeer that little praise is due to God for a goodness to which he is forced, is it not obvious to every man to reply, It is owing not to violent impulse, but to his boundless goodness, that he cannot do evil? Therefore, if the free will of God in doing good is not impeded, because he necessarily must do good; if the devil, who can do nothing but evil, nevertheless sins voluntarily; can it be said that man sins less voluntarily because he is under a necessity of sinning?



Calvin Book 2, Ch. 3, Paragraph 5.


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Sep 27, 2009)

Also from Institutes I:18.1



> They babble and talk absurdly who, in the place of God's providence, substitute bare permission -- as if God sat in a watchtower awaiting chance events , and his judgments thus depended upon human will.


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## Hamalas (Sep 27, 2009)

Presbyterian Deacon said:


> Also from Institutes I:18.1
> 
> 
> 
> > They babble and talk absurdly who, in the place of God's providence, substitute bare permission -- as if God sat in a watchtower awaiting chance events , and his judgments thus depended upon human will.



That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today:



> We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.


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## Amazing Grace (Sep 27, 2009)

Hamalas said:


> Presbyterian Deacon said:
> 
> 
> > Also from Institutes I:18.1
> ...



Does not Calvin criticize Chrysostom for this quote? I may be mistaken, but I think he did.


NR


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## Rich Koster (Sep 27, 2009)

I'm really starting to like this Calvin fellow


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## Hamalas (Sep 27, 2009)

Amazing Grace said:


> Hamalas said:
> 
> 
> > Presbyterian Deacon said:
> ...



No, you are correct. He does criticize Chrysostom in this quote. That's why he says we must repudiate Chrysostom's statement. He's trying to show how ridiculous it is.


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## Amazing Grace (Sep 27, 2009)

Rich Koster said:


> I'm really starting to like this Calvin fellow



I just finished reading a book titled "The Genius of Geneva" It is a tremendous book time lining his life. Opened my eyes to what a wonderful man he actually was and what he suffered for the Gospel.


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## akennethjr (Sep 27, 2009)

Was Calvin a fruit bearing christian?


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## Amazing Grace (Sep 27, 2009)

akennethjr said:


> Was Calvin a fruit bearing christian?



In what sense do you mean? I believe he was. His devotion and Love for the Lord is unbelievable. His care for people is unbelievable.


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## Philip (Sep 27, 2009)

Hamalas said:


> That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today:
> 
> 
> 
> > We must, therefore, repudiate the oft-repeated sentiment of Chrysostom, "Whom he draws, he draws willingly"; insinuating that the Lord only stretches out his hand, and waits to see whether we will be pleased to take his aid.



In a sense, though, Chrysostom is right: God draws a person, He makes them willing.


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## Hamalas (Sep 27, 2009)

P. F. Pugh said:


> Hamalas said:
> 
> 
> > That reminds me of another Calvin quote I read today:
> ...



I'm no expert on the church fathers but I don't think that was what Chrysostom meant. Perhaps someone with more familiarity with Chrysostom could comment?


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