# Scottish Maths Curriculum and Saxon Maths



## Eoghan (Jan 12, 2012)

I was looking for some good books on maths for my daughter (First Year) and I was wondering if anyone has experience of using John Saxon in the UK?

Problem is getting a fit for the Scottish level!


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## Pergamum (Jan 12, 2012)

Have I missed something? In my day I learned "math"....

When did math ever become plural?


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## Eoghan (Jan 14, 2012)

Bless you cousin, math is an abbreviation of mathematics. This side of the pond I think the plural abbreviation prevails. I would assume that it is because it can be subdivided into calculus, geometry, algebra and arithmetic etc... but that is just my speculation.


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## Afterthought (Jan 14, 2012)

I don't know about the UK, but if this is the same Saxon I'm thinking of, I almost used him once in the US for Algebra and so forth. However, I ended up choosing an alternative curriculum because I thought the alternative explained math better (and in retrospect, I'm glad I did so; because one thing leads to another, I ended up learning how to do math proofs well and ended up ahead of my peers in understanding math). I suppose it depends on what the student wants to and needs to learn from a math book. I briefly googled around concerning Saxon, and it seems his curriculum is more fit for the UK way of learning math than the US method (i.e., it appears [though I may be wrong due to the briefness of my search] his math isn't as compartmentalized). If I had a refresher on what math is required for which year, I might be able to help more, but if you're just looking for an opinion on a textbook/it's suitability for Scotland, I think you might be better off making an account here and asking your question there.

Edit: Of course, as I'm sure everyone knows, one thing to watch out for is to make sure that whatever is done, the student is taught how to do math--not just the few concepts or problems that the text gives. Or as the old saying goes, "I want them to solve problems, not just _these_ problems."


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## jwithnell (Jan 14, 2012)

If you have the scope and sequence for the math curricula that students are expected to master, you could mix and match lessons from Saxon. The primary concern would be to look ahead so the student gets a preliminary taste for the math that will be introduced in the near-term future, and to also make certain previous concepts are repeated in whatever daily assignments are given to replicate the spiraling approach used by Saxon.


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## Pergamum (Jan 15, 2012)

Eoghan said:


> Bless you cousin, math is an abbreviation of mathematics. This side of the pond I think the plural abbreviation prevails. I would assume that it is because it can be subdivided into calculus, geometry, algebra and arithmetic etc... but that is just my speculation.



Yes, I guess I get weirded out by "maths" but I think nothing of pluralizing "phonics" (more than one phonic). Ha. Words are weird (eg., they call them fingers, but I've never seen them fing).


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## Eoghan (Jan 15, 2012)

My concern is that the current approach seems to be haphazard and the problems are simply "stories". I have looked in vain for a Scottish textbook that clearly lays out the theory first before giving examples. It appears the current motto could be "see one, do one, teach one" (In my humble opinion). In my day we had a textbook that tried to explain things


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## jwithnell (Jan 15, 2012)

I think it is reasonable to ask the school for their "scope and sequence." This should detail what is expected to be covered in a particular time frame (school years for us) and the order in which topics will be covered. It's also possible this could be found if you have standards that have to be met at different grade levels. Yes, Saxon can make a decent "teaching" textbook, but if you are looking at the high school level, be aware that geometry is spread between the Algebra 1 and 2 textbooks -- an approach not supported by any math professional that I know.


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## lynnie (Jan 15, 2012)

My daughter started with saxon math- grade 1 book- in grade 5!!, age 11, when she began tutoring with a woman who took a course in college on how to teach math to kids who can't do math, and who subsequently taught fifth grade for a while. In retrospect, my daughter wasted the first four years of school trying to parrot math lessons without truly understanding concepts.

This tutor swears by Saxon, and the spiraling approach. You review and review and review until it is firm. You also have to grasp concepts, not just do things by rote. (Now at age 15 she is on the 6/7 book, which is good considering the academic struggles). 

For myself, I realize how complicated teaching math is ( I aced doing it in school). For example, I foolishly thought of minus as takeaway. Well, if you have a problem like "I have three cookies and I have two more than you, how many do you have" that uses the words "more than", so kids add and say five. Or " I have five candies now and you took away two of my candies earlier, so how many did I start with", instead of seven, a kid will take away and say three. With saxon my daughter had to draw everything out. Minus can be take away, subgroups, comparison. That is just one example. They try to really get concepts across- negatives, fractions, etc.

This is just one opinion, but I figure if it is the opinion of a teacher who trained in how to teach math to problem students, and works with problem kids, it is worth considering.


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## interalia (Jan 15, 2012)

I had Saxon math in high school. After coming from a beka, I found it to be a miserable curriculum.


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## JBaldwin (Jan 16, 2012)

My only experience with Saxon Math was when I switched my child from a 1980s version of Modern Curriculum Press's math book to Saxon Math. It was a nightmare for both me and my daughter. She is very gifted in Math and found it confusing. We switched to Singapore after that, and she sailed through it. I really like Singapore Math though it doesn't have good explanations. A student really needs someone to help them along. 

My daughter and I both regret not staying with Singapore through high school.


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## jwithnell (Jan 16, 2012)

]The early elementary years of Saxon are poor and were not developed by the same men who did the later books -- many start with another math, then make the switch to the Saxon books for the middle years where it is strongest. For late high school, the Saxon calculus and physics books are quite handy because home school curricula frequently don't go this far. My husband (a math teacher) used these books as a kind of backbone for our oldest daughter and pulled in information from his college textbooks. Our daughter ended up finishing all the calculus she needed for a math major before starting college, but then our family is weird.

Earlier, I mentioned the weakness of having geometry integrated into algebra. The Algebra 2 book does incorporate math from chemistry which I thought was clever since many people take chemistry about this time in school or soon after.


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## Miss Marple (Jan 16, 2012)

Interesting (to JBaldwin), we went from Modern Curriculum Press to Saxon, just like you - with each child and it went very well.

It all goes to show one of the strengths of homeschooling - one curriculum does not fit all and we teachers need to be aware of each student's aptitude and development, and be willing to change methods if they are not working.


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