# Pastors as theologians



## lynnie (Jan 7, 2011)

I never heard of this guy before, and yeah he has a quote from Barth, but I thought some of you might enjoy it. I'm not sure church history is the right PB forum for it, but his appeal to history is well thought out and worth considering. I picked a few quotes, but best to read it all. 

The Pastor as Wider Theologian, or What&rsquo;s Wrong With Theology Today | First Things

The Pastor as Wider Theologian, or What’s Wrong With Theology Today 
Jan 3, 2011 
Gerald Hiestand 
_Pastors, not professors, should be setting the theological agenda of the church. This is, of course, a loaded statement, and one that requires more nuance than I’ll be able to give it here. But I stand by it nonetheless. As a pastor who cares deeply about theology, I’ve become convinced that the present bifurcation between theological scholarship and pastoral ministry accounts for much of the theological anemia facing the church today. _

.......
_
Historically, the church’s most influential theologians were churchmen—pastors, priests, and bishops. Clerics such as Athanasius, Augustine (indeed, nearly all the church Fathers), Anselm, Luther, Calvin, Zwingli, Edwards, and Wesley functioned as the wider theologians of their day—shaping not only the theological vision of their own parishes, but that of the wider church. In their day, the pastoral community represented the most influential, most insightful, and most articulate body of theologians. 

But since the nineteenth-century (in North America, at least) the center of theological reflection has shifted from the parish to the university. The pastoral community is no longer called upon—as a matter of vocation—to construct theology for those beyond their congregations. Instead, our present context views the academy as the proper home for those with theological gifts. Those with shepherding gifts are directed toward the pastorate. And those who are gifted in both areas? Well, they’ll have to choose. But can this be right? Do we really mean to suggest that the proper home of a theologian is in the academy, disconnected from the pastoral vocation? _
......

_The ecclesial renewal of Christian theology will not take place apart from a concerted effort to reestablish the pastoral community as the church’s most significant body of theologians. The pastoral community must once again become serious about the duties of the theological task—study, prayer, writing, and theological dialog. The pastoral community as a whole must once again don the mantle of theological responsibility for the wider church. _
......


_Ecclesially sensitive academic theologians have much to offer the church; I count them among my most valuable dialog partners. But we pastors must stop outsourcing the entire theological enterprise to the academy. Maintaining the theological integrity of the people of God is a task that has been assigned to the pastors of the church. _
....

_We must stop insisting that pastorally sensitive theologians and theologically sensitive pastors choose between theological scholarship and the church. Theologians not only belong to the church, they also—in the main—belong in the church._


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## KMK (Jan 7, 2011)

lynnie said:


> But since the nineteenth-century (in North America, at least) the center of theological reflection has shifted from the parish to the university.



Who says?


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## Jack K (Jan 7, 2011)

I'd agree this probably has been true to some extent in the past century. But advances in communications and travel are now blurring that distinction between local pastor and theological scholar/guru. It's more possible than it used to be for a guy to pastor a particular church and also help set the theological agenda for the wider church. And several academics are among today's top tier of conference speakers. In effect, these seminary guys are preachers and in a way (granted, an incomplete way) even pastors with large numbers of followers.

I wonder if the line between academic theologian and pastor will begin to blur even more. What do the rest of you think?


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## jwithnell (Jan 8, 2011)

From my pew dwelling perspective, you have to be a pastor to be a theologian, and to be a theologian, you have to be a pastor. You must care, and care deeply, about how your work edifies the church whether you are in the pulpit or in the classroom. I think you see this in practice by those like Sinclair Ferguson who have moved between the two settings. A person's talents will guide where he spends the most time.


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## Reformed Elder (Jan 8, 2011)

lynnie said:


> Pastors, not professors, should be setting the theological agenda of the church.



Might we be free to exchange the word "professors" for "professionals" in this sense? As a Pastor I have seen this work its way true in the music realm (I know this isn't about music but it does deal with theology). I listen to mainstream "Contemporary Christian" lyrics (which I am not against entirely, the Contemporary Christian genre I mean) and often find myself running to the bathroom to puke the mucus of diluted theological soundness many songs leave in the pit of my stomach. I am not against the idea of "professors" but only wish to see the "professors" and "pastors" as one and the same. Where are the true "professionals/professors" like Luther, Newton, and yes...even Wesley today? Currently in our church, our Elder of Music and myself are working on writing hymns for our local assembly. Theology is kept sound as it is tested, fought for, and promoted by her keepers...the pastors, at least as Apostle Paul seemed to explain it.


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## StrictBaptist (Jan 8, 2011)

jwithnell said:


> From my pew dwelling perspective, you have to be a pastor to be a theologian, and to be a theologian, you have to be a pastor. You must care, and care deeply, about how your work edifies the church whether you are in the pulpit or in the classroom. I think you see this in practice by those like Sinclair Ferguson who have moved between the two settings. A person's talents will guide where he spends the most time.



I have to disagree here, I do not believe you have to be a pastor to be a theologian, however if you are a pastor, then you need to be one. There are many great theologians that are not pastors.


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## Wannabee (Jan 8, 2011)

The problem with a theologian, in the academic sense, who is not a pastor is that he studies about God, even studies God, and is seen as a spiritual guide because of this. This necessitates a pastoral role simply in teaching about God to his students. Furthermore, many of these men are training pastors at this level. If such men are not pastors themselves then they are unqualified to train pastors. It's done. But it's done to the detriment of the church, creating academicians to preach to congregations rather than pastors to shepherd their souls. It is also clear that the majority of the errant theological novelties come from institutional theologians. However, a pastor who is not a theologian is a contradiction.


> I believe the remark is too well grounded that if you attend to a lecturer on astronomy or geology, during a short course you will obtain a tolerably clear view of his system; but if you listen, not only for twelve months, but for twelve years, to the common run of preachers, you will not arrive at anything like an idea of their system of theology. If it be so, it; is a grievous fault, which cannot be too much deplored. Alas! the indistinct utterances of many concerning the grandest of eternal realities, and the dimness of thought in others with regard to fundamental truths, have given too much occasion for the criticism! *Brethren, if you are not theologians you are in your pastorates just nothing at all.* You may be fine rhetoricians, and be rich in polished sentences; but without knowledge of the gospel, and aptness to teach it, you are but a sounding brass and a tinkling cymbal.
> Verbiage is too often the fig-leaf which does duty as a covering for theological ignorance. Sounding periods are offered instead of sound doctrine, and rhetorical flourishes in the place of robust thought. Such things ought not to be. The abounding of empty declamation, and the absence of food for the soul, will turn a pulpit into a box of bombast, and inspire contempt instead of reverence. Unless we are instructive preachers, and really feed the people, we may be great quoters of elegant poetry, and mighty retailers of second-hand windbags, but we shall be like Nero of old, fiddling while Rome was burning, and sending vessels to Alexandria to fetch sand for the arena while the populace starved for want of corn.
> 
> CHS
> _Lectures_, V 1, 82


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## Grimmson (Jan 8, 2011)

I can understand strongly why someone would say that pastors and not professors should be establishing what is theologically taught and a given agenda in the church; particularly considering the liberalism that was taught in well known schools such as Union seminary in the late 19th century and later in many more schools in the 20th century here in the U.S. There is a real concern of taking away the teaching and training responsibility of a pastor and switching it to an institution that is outside of the domination, local church, and the pastor who would one day will be held accountable to the ones that were entrusted by God to him. The teaching in an academic setting is done in a mechanicalistic process whereby only fractions of knowledge is imparted, instead of a more holistic mentoring/discipleship setting; so that one could move on in their educational training without a firm foundation being set in regards to scripture and systematic theology. The lack of grasping is not fully the fault of the student due to the sheer volume of information that must be consumed (through reading a large number of books and taking notes on lectures), and not given time to digest by evaluating properly the data, the argument, and application theologically there of. Professors instead of having a pastoral focus, typically have more of an academic research focus. This is important because then the research or project takes priority over helping the individual students that may need help. If a student does need serious help the professor may push the student aside because the professor does not have the time because of other responsibilities or interests. Of course the result of such behavior could result in a depressional psychological state for the students involved and could hurt practically even a desire to work harder to study the material, showing thus a lack of pastoral concern. If a student is sick or is spending to much time in trying to get everything on his plate, instead of the professors allowing the student a break to study, continue to push the student even if the result forces the student to see a doctor because of neglect of his own health. In other words there no real concern for the student wellbeing physically or spiritually. If academics are to train pastors then part of that training must include a love for one another and communicated concern. For without this there really is no reason for a Christian to engage in theology. Love cannot and must not be separated out by the theology of the theologian for the people of God and God himself. For once pastoral care is separated out from theology, then that theology is not really a living theology for the people and all theology is practical for the people of God. The theologian must never separate himself from the people or church for the sake of academics, nor should the theologian hide behind his academics as a defense for teaching something against what a established church or domination believes. Instead, as I have seen at times, making light of what the church believes they need to confront it and not be afraid of church discipline. 

I have known of good students that have struggled, barely passing, their licensing and ordination exams because of some of what they said they believe based on what they were taught in seminary. Why should some with an MDiv from a Reformed or Presbyterian seminary be struggling to pass these exams? There is a disconnect with the seminary and the denominations, and such should be addressed; especially if students are getting in debt for the Gospel (which personally angers me). 

I don’t think a theologian must be a pastor, but he should never be disconnected from the church and must have pastoral care in mind when he does his work. Theologians should not be considered minister of ministers if no ministry care is taking place. Being a theologian and a pastor helps to create a practical balance in your theology; whereby there is a recognition of means that God employs, how the theology works out practically in everyday living (instead of it in a theoretical setting), and many more things as well. You want a man with a balanced theology, for if you move a little to the right or left much harm can come to the people of God; therefore wisdom must be applied to one’s theology.


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## jwithnell (Jan 8, 2011)

Wannabee hits this one pretty squarely! Thanks.



> There are many great theologians that are not pastors.



It's more the heart that's the issue here. Cornelius Van Til might be an example; he spent most of his career in academia and maintained a great love for God and His church. He greatly advanced the kingdom through his teaching of so many pastors and encouraged an educated laity.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Jan 8, 2011)

Wannabee said:


> a pastor who is not a theologian is a contradiction


As are Christians, no?

We should probably use the term with a big T, Theologian, to represent those that make a living at the formal study of God or perhaps consider their "day jobs" as hobbies to support their theological endeavors.

Such big T, _Theologians_ attempt to teach us from the Scriptures how to think, and how not to think, about God, and thusly how to talk about Him. What we should say, and what we should not say. Such theologians do not control what we may say; they simply (!!!) indicate the rules of intelligible speech. 

AMR


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