# Did God command the making of idols?



## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

Help me rationalize this:

exodus 20:4 "œYou shall not make for yourself an idol j in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below.

exodus 25:18 And make two cherubim e out of hammered gold at the ends of the cover. 19 Make one cherub on one end and the second cherub on the other; make the cherubim of one piece with the cover, at the two ends. 20 The cherubim f are to have their wings spread upward, overshadowing g the cover with them. The cherubim are to face each other, looking toward the cover. 21 Place the cover on top of the ark h and put in the ark the Testimony, i which I will give you. 22 There, above the cover between the two cherubim j that are over the ark of the Testimony, I will meet k with you and give you all my commands for the Israelites.


Cherub "“ 1. A winged celestial being. With the seraphim they are said to be in the very presence of God 2. an angel of the second order whose gift is knowledge; usually portrayed as a winged child

Did God not command the making of idols?



[Edited on 5-5-2006 by fivepointcalvinist]


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by joshua_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by fivepointcalvinist_
> ...



sorry, i didnt mean to imply God commanded people to worship the statues. the 2nd commandment says not to make idols. isnt that why most of you guys dont have pictures of Jesus in your house?

[Edited on 5-5-2006 by fivepointcalvinist]


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

let me rephrase:

did God command the making of idols?


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## Arch2k (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by fivepointcalvinist_
> let me rephrase:
> 
> did God command the making of idols?



One can make anything an idol. What makes pics of Christ an idol is the attributing of God's name/characteristics to a man-made object. A pic of a long-haired man is a-ok, but attributing God's name etc. to it is sinful. If one did the same with the statues, THEN they would be come idols.


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by joshua_
> No. Why do you think that the cheribum were idols? They were not representing God. They were not for the purpose of worship.



"œYou shall not make for yourself an idol j in the form of anything in heaven above or on the earth beneath or in the waters below"

are the cherubim not "something" in heaven?


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## Peter (May 4, 2006)

"Something" yes. But are they an "idol"?

Thou shalt not make for yourself an _idol_

[Edited on 5-5-2006 by Peter]


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## Arch2k (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by fivepointcalvinist_
> 
> are the cherubim not "something" in heaven?



Yes, but they are not an idol. "An idol in the form of..."


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by joshua_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by fivepointcalvinist_
> ...



i agree the worship is wrong, but without something to worship, idolatry cannot occur. this is why God commanded men not to make images of anything. the cherubim represent a heavenly being, capable of being worshipped. if men can worship a calf, which is an idol, why are they incapable of worshipping a cherubim? what makes the cherubim not an idol?


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## Arch2k (May 4, 2006)

> _Originally posted by fivepointcalvinist_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by joshua_
> ...



The sin of the Israelites in the making the golden calf was that they attributed the name Jehovah to it....they attributed the work of God to it. This is the essence of idolotry...a statue of a golden calf in and of itself is not evil.

Exo 32:1 The Gold Calf
Now when the people saw that Moses delayed coming down from the mountain, the people gathered together to Aaron, and said to him, "œCome, make us gods that shall go before us; for as for this Moses, the man who brought us up out of the land of Egypt, we do not know what has become of him."

Exo 32:4 And he received the gold from their hand, and he fashioned it with an engraving tool, and made a molded calf. 
Then they said, "œThis is your god, O Israel, that brought you out of the land of Egypt!"
Exo 32:5 So when Aaron saw it, he built an altar before it. And Aaron made a proclamation and said, "œTomorrow is a feast to the LORD."


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

okay so graven images in themselves are not bad, it is the worship of them only. the cherubim itself could have been an idol, but since no one worshipped it, it remains simply a graven image?


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## fivepointcalvinist (May 4, 2006)

thanks for the clarification guys!

i guess i was interpreting that passage too literal....


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## BobVigneault (May 5, 2006)

It's so wonderful to see a thread end in violent agreement. Good question Matthew, great discussion fellows.


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## Scott Shahan (May 5, 2006)

I didn't know that it was wrong to have pictures of Jesus in your house.


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## Scott Shahan (May 5, 2006)

cool..


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