# French vs. German



## Notthemama1984 (Dec 23, 2008)

In purely theological terms which language would be better to learn French or German?


----------



## PresbyDane (Dec 23, 2008)

German, that is my opinion anyway


----------



## DMcFadden (Dec 23, 2008)

German


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 23, 2008)

I'm going to say French. I've studied both and I definitely use my French a lot more than my German. 

Calvin wrote in French, so did de Bres and a lot of other early Reformed writers. Though there are lots of translations, Calvin never wrote in German.


----------



## Davidius (Dec 23, 2008)

German, without a doubt. After the decline of Latin, it was the language of the humanities before English took over. You'll find much more primary and secondary literature of value in it.


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 23, 2008)

Davidius said:


> German, without a doubt. There is much more primary and secondary literature in German.



I think that depends where your interests lie, i.e. time period and location.

If your interests are in the early period of the Reformed churches in Western Europe, I would say that French is the better choice. Beyond that, I could agree that German would be better.

Of course, all of this is predicated on the assumption that the original questioner has an interest in historical theology! For modern theological study, German would definitely be more useful. Dutch is helpful too.


----------



## Davidius (Dec 23, 2008)

Guido's Brother said:


> Davidius said:
> 
> 
> > German, without a doubt. There is much more primary and secondary literature in German.
> ...



The early period of the Reformed churches in non-German-speaking Western Europe seems to be a much more narrow research interest than the one expressed in the OP. 

There was a considerable Reformed contingent in Germany, not to mention Zwingli in Switzerland, and Luther and Melancthon up north (not "Reformed" in the definition you seem to be using, but still...the OP says "purely theological terms."). 

In academia it's an accepted fact that German is the most important research language in the humanities. French would be next. German carries one all the way to the present and covers the most important thinkers.


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 23, 2008)

Davidius said:


> German carries one all the way to the present and covers the most important thinkers.



Not to belabour this, but doesn't Calvin count as one of the "most important thinkers"?

I concede the point, however, that German is the most important for modern theological study.


----------



## larryjf (Dec 23, 2008)

Theological reasons - German

Ministerial reasons - French since the French are in desperate need of Christ


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 23, 2008)

larryjf said:


> Ministerial reasons - French since the French are in desperate need of Christ



And the Quebecois! But also the Germans...


----------



## Whitefield (Dec 23, 2008)

For Reformation studies I would suggest Latin first and then German.


----------



## tellville (Dec 23, 2008)

German without a doubt if you plan on doing biblical scholarship in today's world. Of course, both would be preferred, but if you don't know German you're pretty handicapped.


----------



## Notthemama1984 (Dec 24, 2008)

Whitefield said:


> For Reformation studies I would suggest Latin first and then German.




Without a doubt on the Latin. I am seeing several schools require French and German, but I can substitute another language and I plan on substituting Latin for one of them.


----------



## Whitefield (Dec 24, 2008)

Chaplainintraining said:


> Whitefield said:
> 
> 
> > For Reformation studies I would suggest Latin first and then German.
> ...



With German you can tap into Zwingli and Luther. I have not run across very much in French in my Reformation studies. There is some Calvin in French but much of that was originally written in Latin.


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 24, 2008)

Whitefield said:


> There is some Calvin in French but much of that was originally written in Latin.



_Some_ Calvin in French? Almost all of his sermons are in French. Many of his liturgical writings are in French and a lot more. See W. De Greef's The Writings of John Calvin and you'll see that it's not just _some_ Calvin in French. 

Moreover, a lot of the important secondary literature on Calvin is in French, i.e. Doumergue, Bieler, and Wendel (some of whose works have been translated). I think if you're doing to do serious Calvin studies you need to know both French and Latin.


----------



## Davidius (Dec 24, 2008)

Guido's Brother said:


> Davidius said:
> 
> 
> > German carries one all the way to the present and covers the most important thinkers.
> ...



Sorry, I don't want to sound like I'm belittling Calvin's importance. You're definitely right. I'm just speaking more broadly about covering the most amount of time and the most amount of literature.


----------



## Whitefield (Dec 24, 2008)

Guido's Brother said:


> Whitefield said:
> 
> 
> > There is some Calvin in French but much of that was originally written in Latin.
> ...



Yes, there is much by Calvin in French, however, most of it was originally written in Latin and later translated into French, e.g., the Institutes. I'm in no way saying, "Don't learn French, it is useless." In fact, I encourage the learning of any and all languages in service to God. Given the "either/or" tenor of the OP, I chose German. My guess is that in academia theological German is used more than theological French.


----------



## Guido's Brother (Dec 24, 2008)

Whitefield said:


> Yes, there is much by Calvin in French, however, most of it was originally written in Latin and later translated into French, e.g., the Institutes. I'm in no way saying, "Don't learn French, it is useless." In fact, I encourage the learning of any and all languages in service to God. Given the "either/or" tenor of the OP, I chose German. My guess is that in academia theological German is used more than theological French.



I'm in a bit of a contrary mood today....  Must be the season.

Not disagreeing with you about modern academia and the use of German. 

But I'm still taking issue with you about Calvin. Many of Calvin's works were originally written in French (e.g. his sermons, probably which make up the vast bulk of the Calvin corpus). Of the original Latin works that were translated into French, many were published nearly simultaneously in both languages. With those French translations that were published later, Calvin often did the translating himself and in so doing sometimes corrected the Latin. This was the case for instance with his commentary on Exodus through Deuteronomy.

So, to reiterate (and to mix the languages): French is a sine qua non for Calvin studies.


----------



## Whitefield (Dec 24, 2008)

Based on what has been said .. here are my  
1. if you want to be scholar on Calvin: Latin + French
2. if you want to be scholar on the German Reformation: Latin + German
3. if you want the languages which will be used most in a Ph.D. or a Th.D program in a theological graduate school: German + Latin

I would suggest learning all three, but with time/energy constraints, I can see why one of the modern languages would be left until later.


----------



## JohnGill (Dec 24, 2008)

German is more useful for reading the works of higher critics and text critics.

I'd say learn Latin so you can read John Owen in the original!


----------



## jawyman (Dec 24, 2008)

Take this for what it is worth. I speak both German and French, but I would recommend German for theological study. Everything Calvin has written in French has been translated into English and German. You would be limiting yourself greatly studying French for theological reasons. A solid foundation in Latin will aid you in your study of German, but again, German would be the more logical choice.


----------

