# Sharing Reformed Theology in love



## Weston Stoler (Jun 28, 2011)

When the topic comes up, any ideas how to argue for God's sovereignty in love?


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## Joseph Scibbe (Jun 29, 2011)

Examine your motives. I noticed in my "cage (or is it rage) stage" I wanted to bring the topic up just to beat people with my proof texts and win arguments. If your motives are to bring them to a more beautiful knowledge of God and to help them grow in Him then you are doing it in love. Also, understand that there are more important things in life than making everyone a Calvinist.


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## Jack K (Jun 29, 2011)

Weston Stoler said:


> any ideas how to argue for God's sovereignty in love?



Yup. Don't argue.

A heart-level belief in God's sovereignty will always produce (1) humility with regard to oneself and (2) confidence with regard to God. Being argumentative is usually evidence that both are absent.

Instead, just explain (and sincerely feel the truth of it) that you know your own sin is such that you would never, ever come to God except that he drew you despite yourself. And leave it at that. If the other person can't relate to that, they aren't spiritually ready to accept God's sovereignty no matter how watertight an argument you give.


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## Reformation Monk (Jun 29, 2011)

Weston Stoler said:


> When the topic comes up, any ideas how to argue for God's sovereignty in love?



Hey Weston,

It's very interesting that you brought this up. I've been personally struggling over something for that past few days. I have a friend in the PCUSA ( basically someone who doesn't really understand the Bible or the Gospel ) who I'm pretty good friends with and whom I was hanging out with. 

Anyway, he told me a few days ago that he was struggling with his faith because his brother died not to long ago. I was there the night his brother died and he did take it very hard, they were really close. They grew up Jehovah's Witness, so he's a little messed up with his Christianity. 

Well, his comment to me was; "I'm mad at God for taking my brother away. So I don't know if my wife and I are going to stay in Church anymore." The thing is is that he's an ordained deacon in the PCUSA and his wife's an ordained elder. Now I knew that they were limited in their understanding of the Bible but I thought that they at least had a pretty strong faith to be ordained leaders in the Church. 

Anyway, so at that point I struggled with how I should witness to him. I wound up not saying anything to him and just comforted him because I knew that if I started to preach the Gospel to him, that at that time, I really don't think he would have been very open to it. But at some point I do mean to sit him down and go over the truth with him and his wife. 

So I guess through this recently personal experience of mine, I would have to say that I believe that God gives us the discernment to know when the right time is. 

Here is my other strong recommendation. Here is how I was discipled. A good friend of mine who brought me to the reformed faith, did it in a way that took a long period of time. Over several months. His method was just to ask questions and then encouraged me to answer them on my own using my Bible. This is a very non confrontational way to get someone to read the Scriptures for themselves and to be honest with the truth.

Hope this helps.


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## au5t1n (Jun 29, 2011)

Jack K said:


> Weston Stoler said:
> 
> 
> > any ideas how to argue for God's sovereignty in love?
> ...



That's deep.


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