# Martyn Llyod Jones



## 5 Solas (Jul 7, 2004)

I have a friend that wanted to know what Martyn Lloyd Jones view was concerning baptism with the Holy Spirit. 
If you have any links to any articles concerning his view on this subject it will be helpful.


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## fredtgreco (Jul 8, 2004)

[quote:d93b3d7650][i:d93b3d7650]Originally posted by Heidelberg[/i:d93b3d7650]
I have a friend that wanted to know what Martyn Lloyd Jones view was concerning baptism with the Holy Spirit. 
If you have any links to any articles concerning his view on this subject it will be helpful. [/quote:d93b3d7650]

Lloyd Jones was unorthodox in his view.

The best short book that deals with this subject if Donald MacLeod's [i:d93b3d7650]The Spirit of Promise[/i:d93b3d7650].


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## py3ak (Jul 8, 2004)

Here is a short something about it. Probably your best bet is to read Lloyd-Jones himself, or to read Iain Murray's 2 volume biography of him. The bolded section is particularly relevant. Iain Murray has observed that a lot of the objections to what Lloyd-Jones asserted come out of a misconception that he was supporting charismatic tendencies. Whereas the books that are controversial in this regard consist of sermons actually preached before there was such a thing as a charismatic in England.



> While Dr. Lloyd-Jones did not believe that sign gifts had necessarily ceased(1), he in no way believed them to be necessary. At the Welsh Minister's Conference in June 1977 these were his words:
> "The trouble with the charismatic movement is that there is virtually no talk at all of the Spirit 'coming down'. It is more something they do or receive: they talk now about 'renewal' not revival. The tendency of the modern movement is to lead people to seek experiences. True revivals humble men before God and emphasize the person of Christ. If all the talk is about experiences and gifts it does not conform to the classic instances of revival."(2)


Iain Murray also quotes a conversation he had with Dr. Lloyd-Jones:
"I was against Pentecostalism and still am. *My doctrine of the baptism of the Spirit is that it gives full assurance.* I have never been satisfied with any speaking in tongues that I have heard. (...) It is very unfair to put the label Pentecostal on me."(3)
Dr. Lloyd-Jones did not believe in continuing revelation or the continuance of apostles and prophets in our time; see, for instance, pp. 355ff of God's Way of Reconciliation (4).
His own words with regard to becoming personally revived are: "Seek not an experience, but seek Him, seek to know Him, seek to realize His presence, seek to love Him."(5)
________________________________________________

1. _The Fight of Faith_ Banner of Truth Trust, 1990
1. _Prove All Things_, p.146 Cited in Iain Murray. _The Fight of Faith_, p.487
2. Ibid., p.693
3. Ibid., p.695
4. _God's Way of Reconciliation_. Grand Rapids, MI: Baker Books, 1998
5. Lloyd-Jones, D. Martyn. _God the Holy Spirit_. Wheaton, IL: Crossway Books, 1997 p.253

Here are some websites where more research can be done. Although I have not read most of the controversial material by or about Lloyd-Jones, I must say that I have never read an attack on him that had any degree of cogency.

Audio sermons on the Holy Spirit
http://www.the-highway.com/HSauthority_Lloyd-Jones.html

Lectures on the Authority of the Holy Spirit
http://www.the-highway.com/HSauthority_Lloyd-Jones.html

John Piper's interpretation of Lloyd-Jones
http://www.desiringgod.org/library/biographies/91lloyd_jones.html

And for a good corrective to Piper's article, Iain Murray's review of what happened at Westminster Chapel (Lloyd-Jones' church in London) when a man practiced what Piper _claims_ Lloyd-Jones inconsistently did not (no doubts that Lloyd-Jones didn't do those things; just not convinced that it was inconsistent). This article is one very likely to make you sad, angry or both.
http://www.banneroftruth.org/pages/articles/article_detail.php?576

Ultimately you would have to go to _Joy Unspeakabl_e and _The Sovereign Spirit_ to get the whole scoop. I have not read them, but what I have read and listened to of Lloyd-Jones makes me suspicious of the criticisms levelled against him.

Reactions: Like 1


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## Irishcat922 (Jul 8, 2004)

Check these articles out. http://www.graceonlinelibrary.org/charismatics/


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