# Knowing Calvin yet missing Christ



## Reformingstudent (Feb 6, 2005)

Is it possible for a person to have a great understanding of Reformed theology and know a lot concerning the bible and what it says and yet at the same time not know Christ at all?
Now I have asked this in another group I was in and the response I received was not all too pleasant. Some took offense at my question as if I was pointing a finger in their direction that was never my intention. I have seen people who have or seem to have a great zeal for spiritual things and yet at the same time show no true love toward other believers, act petty toward those whom they disagree with and want to burn at the stake anyone who may make the mistake of offending them even in the smallest way. I have seen one such person who has a forum devoted to Calvin and his works and yet act so un Christ like that one would wonder if they even knew Christ at all let alone been Born Again. Has anyone else had a similar experience like this before?
I keep hearing over again and a again that we are not to judge and that if you do your not being a good Christian. But if you don't judge, how else are you to know if someone is a
brother or sister in the faith or not? Do you just take people at their word if what they show does not go with what they claim to believe? 

John 7:24 Do not judge by appearances, but judge with right judgment."


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## LadyFlynt (Feb 6, 2005)

Of, course...just as anyone could know all the ins and out of Chritianity, it's history, it's divisions, it's terminology, even agreeing about everything that God is and does...and still not be a Christian.

I've known ppl like this and then they say "but I want none of it" or "I LIKE my own way even though I'll burn"....sad, tisn't it?


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## Me Died Blue (Feb 6, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Keylife_fan_
> Is it possible for a person to have a great understanding of Reformed theology and know a lot concerning the bible and what it says and yet at the same time not know Christ at all?



Knowledge by itself puffs up. And just as there is rampant "heart-centered" Christianity today with a shunning of intellect and theology, it is likewise equally possible to make the opposite error. Furthermore, Satan himself knows the Scriptures well, and yet his heart and being could hardly be further from Christ. So in one sense I would say absolutely.

In another sense, however, part of _knowing_ the Scriptures and Reformed theology is the application itself. For instance, the mortification of sin in the heart is just as "doctrinal" as the concept of what sin is. So if someone appears to know so much of the truth, and yet lacks it in their heart and lives, that means that they are also in fact missing a big part of the truth itself. So in that sense, I would say no to the question.


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## Scott Bushey (Feb 6, 2005)

Jam 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.


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## satz (Feb 6, 2005)

> Not only possible, but widespread. As Chris noted, Knowledge puffs up. Many are in this field for the intellectual stimulation it brings. Think about it. Calvinists are in the minority, but they're indeed the most Academic in the field of Biblical and Systematic theology. What better way than th pad your ego by debating Arminian strawmen and inconsistencies?



aye...this is one area i find i have to keep watching myself to make sure my motives are right. 



> keep hearing over again and a again that we are not to judge and that if you do your not being a good Christian. But if you don't judge, how else are you to know if someone is a
> brother or sister in the faith or not? Do you just take people at their word if what they show does not go with what they claim to believe?



I really think this thing about not judging has been taken completely out of context by many who use it in this way. There is nothing wrong, and in fact it is right to examine how credible someone's profession of faith is, and if his walk matches his talk. It is good, both for us and indeed for the other person if we can identify spiritual problems that others may have. Off course we need to be careful to avoid self-righteousness, but that is far from meaning we cannot judge...


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## Reformingstudent (Feb 6, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Scott Bushey_
> Jam 2:19 Thou believest that there is one God; thou doest well: the devils also believe, and tremble.



Have to give the devil credit though, at least he has sense enough to tremble. Most people don't even have that much sense to fear God.


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## Abd_Yesua_alMasih (Feb 6, 2005)

The Unconverted Religious Zealot by Dr. C. Mathew McMahon


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## Reformingstudent (Feb 6, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Abd_Yesua_alMasih_
> The Unconverted Religious Zealot by Dr. C. Mathew McMahon



Yes, excelent! Thanks for posting this.


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## VirginiaHuguenot (Feb 6, 2005)

May the Lord keep us all from hypocrisy and Pharisaism! To be a true Calvinist or a Christian or Reformed Presbyterian is to live for Christ and not for yourself. 

For to me to live is Christ, and to die is gain. (Philippians 1.21)


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## street preacher (Feb 19, 2005)

Great question my brother! Reformed theology is the doctrine of the Bible no doubt about it. The whole of it and its details are Jesus Christ and His work. May our hearts rejoice in the very focus of it and not in its intellecual aspects of it.


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## Richard King (Feb 19, 2005)

Funny you should ask this. Just this Thursday I just heard a minister named Jon Randles who has a huge impact on the students at Texas Tech University say that he is fed up with intellectual students so unbelievably well read in Arminian authors or Calvinist authors but unable to quote Jesus nearly as well. He intends to tell them every time you quote Calvin or John Piper or Erasmus or even Pat Robertson or even Max Lucado you must give me 5 quotes that Jesus Christ said.


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