# Trouble Verses



## Backwoods Presbyterian (Aug 16, 2008)

I know there is for me (which is the purpose of this thread) verses that I have a very hard time not only wrapping my head around but verses that keep me up at night. One such verse is Romans 5:18 which says:



> So then as through one transgression there resulted condemnation to all men, even so through one act of righteousness there resulted justification of life to all men.



Someone please explain this to me??!?!?!?!?!


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## Dearly Bought (Aug 16, 2008)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> I know there is for me (which is the purpose of this thread) verses that I have a very hard time not only wrapping my head around but verses that keep me up at night. One such verse is Romans 5:18 which says:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Adam, representing mankind in the Covenant of Works, breaks the covenant and thus all mankind is condemned.

Christ, representing His elect people through the Covenant of Redemption, fulfills the conditions of the covenant and thus all the elect are justified.


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Aug 16, 2008)

> III. The parallel that the apostle runs between the communication of sin and death by the first Adam and of righteousness and life by the second Adam (v. 12, to the end), which not only illustrates the truth he is discoursing of, but tends very much to the commending of the love of God and the comforting of the hearts of true believers, in showing a correspondence between our fall and our recovery, and not only a like, but a much greater power in the second Adam to make us happy, than there was in the first to make us miserable. Now, for the opening of this, observe,
> 
> 1. A general truth laid down as the foundation of his discourse-that Adam was a type of Christ (v. 14): Who is the figure of him that was to come. Christ is therefore called the last Adam, 1 Co. 15:45. Compare v. 22. In this Adam was a type of Christ, that in the covenant-transactions that were between God and him, and in the consequent events of those transactions, Adam was a public person. God dealt with Adam and Adam acted as such a one, as a common father and factor, root and representative, of and for all his posterity; so that what he did in that station, as agent for us, we may be said to have done in him, and what was done to him may be said to have been done to us in him. Thus Jesus Christ, the Mediator, acted as a public person, the head of all the elect, dealt with God for them, as their father, factor, root, and representative-died for them, rose for them, entered within the veil for them, did all for them. When Adam failed, we failed with him; when Christ performed, he performed for us. Thus was Adam typos tou mellontos—the figure of him that was to come, to come to repair that breach which Adam had made.
> 
> ...



Matthew Henry on text.
from: here


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Aug 16, 2008)

*John Gill on Romans 5:17-19*



> Verse 17. For if by one man's offence death reigned by one,.... It may be rendered, "by one offence death reigned by one"; for it was the single sin of Adam, the first sin that was committed by him, which gave death its reigning power over the sons of men: "Adam, say {f} the Jewish doctors, transgressed, atyyrwad dx adwqp le, one commandment of the law," and was the cause of death to himself, and to all the world. These words are a repetition, with a further explanation, of Romans 5:15; there it is said, "through the offence of one many be dead"; here "by one man's offence," or "by one offence, death reigned by one"; in which death is represented as a mighty monarch, a powerful king; and designs not only corporeal death, which has mounted the throne by sin, and is supported in its dominion by an ordinance of heaven; but also a moral or spiritual death, which has seized on all mankind, and reigns in every power and faculty of the soul of man; and likewise an eternal one, which will have power over all those, who have no part in the first resurrection: in Romans 5:15, "the grace of God, and the gift by grace," are said to "abound unto many"; here they are said to
> 
> receive abundance of grace, and of the gift of righteousness: by abundance of grace is designed, either something distinct from the justifying righteousness of Christ; such as the abundant grace and mercy of God, in regeneration and conversion; the various graces of the Spirit then implanted; the many things then wrought in the heart; the large discoveries! of pardoning grace, and the abundance of the love of God shed abroad in the soul by the Spirit: or rather the same with "the gift of righteousness," because of the large display of the grace of God in it; by which "righteousness" is meant, not righteousness or holiness infused into us; but the righteousness of Christ, which is a free grace gift, and is enjoyed in a way of receiving; which denotes the act of faith, and supposes giving; and hence there is no room for boasting, but great reason for thankfulness: now such persons who have received this abundant grace and free gift,
> 
> ...



From: here


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Aug 16, 2008)

*Jamieson, Faussett, and Brown*



> 17. For if by--"the"
> one man's offence death reigned by one--"through the one."
> much more shall they which receive--"the"
> abundance of grace and of the gift of--justifying
> ...



from: Here


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## Dearly Bought (Aug 16, 2008)

If you have the time, this sermon would be greatly edifying to you:
Through the Obedience of the One Man, Romans 5:12-21 (Dr. Kim Riddlebarger, Christ Reformed Church). Unfortunately, the sermon pdf appears to be lost in Internet limbo, but you can still read it if you google the title and then click on the cached HTML version.


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## toddpedlar (Aug 16, 2008)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> I know there is for me (which is the purpose of this thread) verses that I have a very hard time not only wrapping my head around but verses that keep me up at night. One such verse is Romans 5:18 which says:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



What are you asking for explanation about? If you're asking about the "all men", this is a classic case of the "all men" usage not meaning "each and every human being". Here is a cause-effect statement being made - all who are condemned trace their condemnation to Adam; all who are justified trace their justification to Christ. The fact that in the first case it is truly each and every human being, whereas in the second case, only the elect are justified, can be confusing on the face of it. However, one must read this verse in context of Romans 5, where the representative headship of Adam and of the Second Adam, Christ, are spoken of - and the limited nature of that representation made more clear - and also in the broader context of the New Testament, where also the limited nature of the identification of Christ with His people is made more clear. The emphasis here is on the fact that Christ is the only means of justification for any and all - justification comes to all men through Christ; not that all men are justified, but that He is the only way for any man.


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## Jimmy the Greek (Aug 16, 2008)

Paul is explaining the concept of imputation in relation to the representative headships of Adam and Christ.

My question is in the headship of Adam. Is it Federal or Seminal or both?

(Sorry, I haven't read the lengthy quotes if it's buried in there)


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Aug 16, 2008)

Gomarus said:


> Paul is explaining the concept of imputation in relation to the representative headships of Adam and Christ.
> 
> My question is in the headship of Adam. Is it Federal or Seminal or both?
> 
> (Sorry, I haven't read the lengthy quotes if it's buried in there)



Both with respect to Original Sin.
_________________________

Original Sin 

Question: How is Original Sin passed down to succeeding generations? 

Original sin is passed down by our parents in birth. Therefore we are all born in sin. 
-Ps. 51:5; Job 14:4; 15:14; John 3:6. 

Question: What is the difference between Adam's Seminal and Federal Headship of humanity? 

Seminal headship is related to physical birth. We are in Adam because we are all physical descendents from him. 
-PS. 51:5 

Federal headship is related to Adam's representative leadership of humanity. 
-Rom. 5:12-20 


from HERE


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## Jimmy the Greek (Aug 16, 2008)

Presbyterian Deacon said:


> Question: What is the difference between Adam's Seminal and Federal Headship of humanity?
> 
> Seminal headship is related to physical birth. We are in Adam because we are all physical descendents from him.
> -PS. 51:5
> ...



May we then look at Christ's headship as being both federal and seminal? Can regeneration be seen as the seminal aspect?


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## Presbyterian Deacon (Aug 16, 2008)

Gomarus said:


> Presbyterian Deacon said:
> 
> 
> > Question: What is the difference between Adam's Seminal and Federal Headship of humanity?
> ...




I would say no. Seminal headship is related to physical birth. Our regeneration is not by physical birth. 



> John 1:12-13
> But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name: [13] Which were born, not of blood, nor of the will of the flesh, nor of the will of man, but of God.



Regeneration is of God. Though original sin and Adam's headship is both federal and seminal, I see only a Federal aspect to Christ's headship with respect to our salvation.


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## Iconoclast (Aug 16, 2008)

22For as in Adam all die, even so in Christ shall all be made alive


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