# Repentance



## Infralap (Dec 8, 2004)

When you repent... Do you tell God, "I wont do it again"?

Is this a biblical repentance?


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## ReformedWretch (Dec 8, 2004)

I have a quote in my e-mails that I love. I think it's a good answer to this quesation.



> Repentance means that you realize that you are a guilty, vile sinner in the presence of God, that you deserve the wrath and punishment of God, that you are Hell bound. It means that you begin to realize that thing called sin is in you, that you long to get rid of it, and that you turn your back on it in every way, shape, and form. You renounce the world, whatever the cost, the world in its mind and outlook as well as its practice, and you deny yourself, take up your cross, and go after Christ. Your nearest and dearest, and the whole world, may call you a fool, or say you have religious mania. You may have to suffer financially, but it makes no difference. That is repentance.
> 
> -D. Martyn Lloyd-Jones


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## ReformedWretch (Dec 8, 2004)

I used that quote in my company e-mail until my boss asked me if I could use something "tamer" as this one was offending many people.


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## Infralap (Dec 8, 2004)

> _Originally posted by houseparent_
> I have a quote in my e-mails that I love. I think it's a good answer to this quesation.
> 
> 
> ...



This is a wonderfull quote worth quoting again, but my ordeal relates to the "what do you do" without taking away from the power of the Gospel...

Can we theologycally say, " I will no longer walk that path" or "promise to do better and get rid of the sin that I partake" without making a WORK issue and robbing God of the glory in our life.


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## turmeric (Dec 8, 2004)

I tell God I'm sorry (hopefully w/Godly sorrow) and ask Him to change me so that I don't continue to commit this sin. I really try to understand what underlying lack of faith or rebellion caused me to commit the sin in order to correct the problem as close to the root of it as possible.


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## Me Died Blue (Dec 8, 2004)

Just like in salvation, we are making a decision and action, even though it is fully rooted in God's work. I also thank God for atoning for the specific sin of which I am repenting.


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## alwaysreforming (Dec 8, 2004)

I think there's a certain amount of "I won't do that again" that needs to be there.

Now in our frailty, our statement of purpose to avoid that sin is often a broken promise, but not a vain one. If we continue to struggle with a sin, and as we're repenting of it we're planning our next appointment with it, then true repentance wasn't had.

Here's where we need to be careful in how we view that affecting our salvation. Our salvation is laid in Christ. Our lack of "true, genuine, Biblical repentance" is not what we should look for for our correct standing before God. There's a certain amount of "Lord, help me truly repent" that we can rely on when we don't feel 100% genuinely sorrowful over our sin, and don't feel very confident that we shall do better next time. Its so easy to turn repentance into a work that saves, and I think we need to be wary of that; and of holding others (and ourselves) to an impossible standard.


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## openairboy (Dec 8, 2004)

> _Originally posted by Infralap_
> This is a wonderfull quote worth quoting again, but my ordeal relates to the "what do you do" without taking away from the power of the Gospel...
> 
> Can we theologycally say, " I will no longer walk that path" or "promise to do better and get rid of the sin that I partake" without making a WORK issue and robbing God of the glory in our life.



There is clear admonition in Scripture to work out our salvation, so we shouldn't fear the word work or works. I think James and Paul equally admonish us, as well as considering the fact that all Scripture is God breathed that the man of God may be thoroughly equipped for every good work, to good works.

If a word sets us off theologically, especially with one that is so Biblically rooted, then we need to adjust our hermeneutic.

I hope that we have plenty of good works that others may glorify our Father in heaven.

openairboy


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## Me Died Blue (Dec 8, 2004)

and


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Dec 8, 2004)

Repentance is:

Sight of sin
Sorrow for sin
Confession for Sin
Shame for sin
Hatred of sin
Turning From sin

Usually we do #1 and #3 and think we are done.
If its not all there, its not really repentance, even from the basic Greek meaning to the NT word.


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## Average Joey (Dec 9, 2004)

The biggest misconception of repentance today is the sinner`s prayer.Believe it or not sometimes I like most of what Adrian Rodgers says.However,when at the end of his radio sermon a man says pray this prayer(sinner`s prayer).The problem with that is how the person who is praying truely sees themselves.Do they REALLY believe they are deserving God`s wrath?Are they just going through the motions?I like to test people who profess Christ.One way I do it is by using the example of David Berkowitz.I mention that he is a Christian now.Two responses I get."That`s great." and "No,he couldn`t be a Christian.He killed all those people."That weeds out some of the "Christians".I go further with saying that probably some of or all of his victims were lost.That may sound mean but I meant it to show that all who are not in Christ are lost.No matter how they are killed,and that the killer is saved today.That roughs up some feathers with people.My point is,how can anybody repent and turn to Christ if they truely donnot see themselves as the most wicked and vile sinner?Or,you can also use this approach.If somebody held up a picture of you and Adolf Hitler.Who would you choose as the biggest sinner?

[Edited on 12-9-2004 by Average Joey]


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## Average Joey (Dec 9, 2004)

> _Originally posted by webmaster_
> Repentance is:
> 
> Sight of sin
> ...



AMEN to that!I had a friend who told me I should not let sin bother me at all now since I am saved.I felt conviction for what he said and could not believe it.I was very confused but now I am happy to find I am not the only one who sorrows over sin.


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## alwaysreforming (Dec 9, 2004)

Openairboy wrote:
"we shouldn't fear the word work or works. ...
If a word sets us off theologically, especially with one that is so Biblically rooted, then we need to adjust our hermeneutic."


I think that was so wonderfully put. There has been SUCH an emphasis on "not by good works" that we have almost come to loathe the word "work," as if its something bad in and of itself.

When you mention "work" to the average contemporary evangelical, you'll probably get stopped in your tracks and told more or less, "Ahh, works are meaningless!" 

I like the way you've redirected that word to its proper place, OpenAirBoy.


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## Infralap (Dec 15, 2004)

> _Originally posted by Me Died Blue_
> Just like in salvation, we are making a decision and action, even though it is fully rooted in God's work. I also thank God for atoning for the specific sin of which I am repenting.



If it is us who do it...(salvation/repentance) then is not the power of Christ or the Gospel. Thus we rob away from God


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## Infralap (Dec 15, 2004)

> _Originally posted by alwaysreforming_
> I think there's a certain amount of "I won't do that again" that needs to be there.



But this takes away from the power of the gospel for then is not God but us


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Dec 15, 2004)

This should help:

Their ability to do good works is not at all of themselves, but wholly from the Spirit of Christ.[12] And that they may be enabled thereunto, beside the graces they have already received, there is required an actual influence of the same Holy Spirit, to work in them to will, and to do, of his good pleasure:[13] yet are they not hereupon to grow negligent, as if they were not bound to perform any duty unless upon a special motion of the Spirit; but they ought to be diligent in stirring up the grace of God that is in them.[14]

12. John 15:4-6; Rom. 8:4-14; Ezek. 36:26-27
13. Phil. 2:13; 4:13; II Cor. 3:5; Eph. 3:16
14. Phil. 2:12; Heb. 6:11-12; II Peter 1:3, 5, 10-11; Isa. 64:7; II Tim. 1:6; Acts 26:6-7; Jude 1:20-21


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## Infralap (Dec 15, 2004)

> _Originally posted by webmaster_
> Repentance is:
> 
> Sight of sin
> ...



 and Amen to this, however we neglect that the turning from sin is not done in our power but by the power of the gospel. I cannot turn from sin, but as I humble myself I plead with God. He (God) gives me the strength, power, will to turn. Thus God is glorified in the Sanctification process and is not "I did it on my own"


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## Infralap (Dec 15, 2004)

> _Originally posted by webmaster_
> This should help:
> 
> Their ability to do good works is not at all of themselves, but wholly from the Spirit of Christ.[12] And that they may be enabled thereunto, beside the graces they have already received, there is required an actual influence of the same Holy Spirit, to work in them to will, and to do, of his good pleasure:[13] yet are they not hereupon to grow negligent, as if they were not bound to perform any duty unless upon a special motion of the Spirit; but they ought to be diligent in stirring up the grace of God that is in them.[14]
> ...



 The problem as you mention earlier is that the christian (we) think that repentance is confession and promise to do better. But is God who enable us internally to do his will as we are sanctified from Glory to glory. What I gather is the much of christianity has a perception of repentance through works of promises. And what are these promises... nothing else than lies and the father of lies is the devil. We do not glorify God by this empty promises for we act as orphans and not as Son's of God (Sonship Theology).


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Dec 15, 2004)

Just as a note: Sonship theology as dicated in some of the Presbyterian denonminations is nonsense. It blurs the lines between justificationa nd adoption. 

All those that are justified, God vouchsafeth, in and for his only Son Jesus Christ, to make partakers of the grace of adoption,[1] by which they are taken into the number, and enjoy the liberties and privileges of the children of God,[2] have his name put upon them,[3] receive the Spirit of adoption,[4] have access to the throne of grace with boldness,[5] are enabled to cry, Abba, Father,[6] are pitied,[7] protected,[8] provided for,[9] and chastened by him, as by a father:]j] yet never cast off,[11] but sealed to the day of redemption;[12] and inherit the promises,[13] as heirs of everlasting salvation.[14]

1. Eph. 1:5; Gal. 4:4-5
2. Rom. 8:17; John 1:12
3. Num. 6:24-26; Jer. 14:9; Amos 9:12; Acts 15:17; II Cor. 6:18; Rev. 3:12

4. Rom. 8:15
5. Eph. 3:12; Heb. 4:16
6. Rom. 8:15-16; Gal. 4:6
7. Psa. 103:13
8. Prov. 14:26
9. Matt. 6:30, 32; I Peter 5:7
10. Heb. 12:6
11. Lam. 3:31-32; Psa. 89:30-35
12. Eph. 4:30
13. Heb. 6:12
14. I Peter 1:3-4; Heb. 1:14

Reactions: Amen 1


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## Irishcat922 (Dec 16, 2004)

I found this helpful by Calvin.

True repentance.

There are two main teachings in the gospel: repentance and remission of sins. Both are given by Christ and obtained through faith. We will consider repentance first.

Repentance follows faith and is also a result of faith. A man cannot repent until he has accepted the grace of the gospel. He can only do this if he has faith. When he has accepted the gospel, he will necessarily leave his sinful ways -- i.e. he will repent. Repentance and faith are very closely connected but they are not the same thing. Paul writes of them separately: "Repentance toward God and faith toward our Lord Jesus Christ".

The Hebrew word for repentance means turning around or converting, while the Greek word means a change of mind and plan. Both meanings should be included in our definition: Repentance is a true conversion of our life to God, as a result of sincere fear of God. It includes both the putting to death of the flesh and the renewal of the spirit of the mind. There are three points to be considered in this definition.

1. Conversion to God must mean more than a change in external actions. The heart itself must be changed. This is why Ezekiel, when encouraging the people to repent, spoke of repentance as a matter of the heart: "Cast away from you all the transgressions which you have committed against me, and get yourselves a new heart and a new spirit" (Ezekiel 18:31). Repentance is not true repentance unless the wickedness is removed from the heart.

2. Repentance is a result of a sincere fear of God. A sinner will not even think about the need to repent until he knows that God is going to judge him. But when he knows that God will judge him, his conscience will make him worried and urge him to turn around in his way of life, and thus repent. True conversion begins with a tear and hatred of sin. "You were grieved into repenting ... for godly grief produces a repentance that leads to salvation" (II Corinthians 7:9, I0).

3. The first part of repentance is the putting to death of the flesh. This is clearly seen in such verses as: "Depart from evil and do good; seek peace, and pursue it" (Psalm 34:14). "Wash yourselves; make yourselves clean; remove the evil of your doings from before my eyes; cease to do evil, learn to do good; seek justice" (Isaiah 1:16,17). It is necessary to do this because "to set the mind on the flesh is death, but to set the mind on the Spirit is life and peace" (Romans 8:6).

The second part of repentance, renewal of the spirit of the mind, is shown in the fruit that springs from the life of the converted person (see Galatians 5:22,23; Philippians 4:8). These things all come to us by union with Christ. If we truly share in his death, our old nature is crucified and we take part in his resurrection, and so we are woken up to a new life. Such repentance is not the matter of a moment or a day or a year. It lasts a life-time. New birth means that a Christian is no longer controlled by sin, though he will still have to fight with his sinful nature. The Christian does not lose his old nature, and this is what makes him still want evil things. He cannot be completely freed from these evil desires until he dies. When God removes sin, he takes away the guilt and penalty of sin. He does not take away the presence of sin. But he does something which will bring us to greater victory -- he supplies to Christians the power of the Spirit to conquer sin. We should always remember our own weakness and the need to rely on the Holy Spirit. In Romans 7 Paul is speaking of his experience after he became a Christian and shows us clearly that sin remains in us after we are converted. Paul still felt a dislike for the law of God (verse 23). He knows that nothing good lives in his flesh (verse 18) and that there is the wretchedness of continual conflict because of the sin within him (verse 24). Some people have taught that the children of God are reborn in salvation to a state of innocence and thus, however much they sin, they will be innocent in God's sight. Because, they say, it is the Holy Spirit who lives now in them, so there is no longer any need for them to curb their lusts. Whatever they do now cannot be sin. Being done by the Spirit!-- What kind of a Spirit is this'? But we can be sure that the Holy Spirit does not encourage murder, immorality, pride, greed or deceit. The Holy Spirit is the source of love, virtue, modesty, peace and truth. The Holy Spirit is given to lead us into the righteousness of God.

In II Corinthians 7:11, Paul speaks of seven signs that show that a man has repented: earnestness, so that he watches to guard against temptation to sin; eagerness to clear himself, an endeavour to give practical proof of his sincerity and reverence for God; indignation, which is anger against himself when he sees his own sinfulness and ungratefulness to God; alarm is the fear he feels when he thinks about the punishment he deserved from such a righteous God; longing, which is probably his great longing to obey God; zeal is also the effect of knowing his own tendency to sin which makes him the more keen to obey God; punishment is the inward shame he feels when he thinks of God's divine judgment on his sin and the punishment he should have received. In summary, we can say that the results of repentance in a life are obedience to God; love to man; and a life which is holy and pure.

The gospel is made up of these two things: repentanceand remission of sins. John the Baptist's cry was: "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand" (Matthew 3:2); and the teaching of Christ was similar: "Repent and believe the gospel" (Mark 1:15). The Bible teaches that repentance is the gift of God and not something we can produce in ourselves. In Acts 11:18 repentance is spoken of as something that God had given: "Then to the Gentiles also God has granted repentance unto life". The same is seen in II Timothy 2:25: "God may perhaps grant that they will repent and come to know the truth". God exhorts all men to repent, but these exhortations are effective only where the Holy Spirit brings a man to new life by the new birth.

Repentance is not, strictly speaking, the cause of salvation, but the two are so closely linked as to be inseparable. The Bible does tell us of some who were greatly enlightened and who saw so much of the light of God's truth that they could not plead ignorance. When such people deliberately hardened their hearts and contemptuously rejected God's grace, they were in effect despising the blood of Christ and crucifying the Son of God afresh (Hebrews 6:6). Such apostates could not repent and therefore could not be saved. This sin is called the unforgiveable sin or the sin against the Holy Ghost.

[Edited on 16-12-2004 by Irishcat922]

Reactions: Rejoicing 1


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## fredtgreco (Dec 16, 2004)

> _Originally posted by webmaster_
> Just as a note: Sonship theology as dicated in some of the Presbyterian denonminations is nonsense. It blurs the lines between justification and adoption.



I'm not sure I would say that it is "nonsense." I would be more comfortable describing it as over-emphasis that distorts the whole picture - kind of like the body builder that only lifts weights with one hand all the time.


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Dec 16, 2004)

Fred, your just so..........nice.


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## covrin (Dec 21, 2004)

I think I am realizing that repentance is like breathing - if I stop doing it for too long, I turn blue. Each moment pulls at me - each breath worships someone or Someone. 

What was Noah's message? Peter says he was a "preacher of righteousness" to a world that was not righteous. He offered an escape from the waters - I might assume the condition the people heard from Noah was a return to God, a return to righteousness -repentance .
Moses? He physically lead the people in in their return to the Lord
Jonah? He hated the idea but he offered a message, a plan, of repentance to the Ninevites.
Major prophets? Minor prophets? One message through and through - repent.
After some years of silence, John comes on the scene and the first words from his mouth? "œRepent, for the kingdom of heaven is near."
Jesus begins his earthly ministry - From that time on Jesus began to preach, "œRepent, for the kingdom of heaven is near."

"we all have gone astray, each of us has turned to his own way"
"all the people did what was right in their own eyes."

Why do I not repent? Suspected or feared discomfort - suffering and pain. Or I live with an assinign assumption that I know better and I, of course, assume the better is my own good.

"œIf anyone would come after me, he must deny himself and take up his cross daily and follow me. For whoever wants to save his life will lose it, but whoever loses his life for me will save it. "

...deny himself... not turning to his own way - turning to God - to God's way - repentance
...take up cross... choose actions which may have negative consequences to self but fulfill God's revealed will (Nevertheless, not my will but Thine)
...follow Me... foxes have holes but... - skirt hitched and staff in hand (Passover requirements) - where are we going?


Let us fix our eyes on Jesus, the author and perfecter of our faith, who for the joy set before him endured the cross, scorning its shame, and sat down at the right hand of the throne of God. Consider him who endured such opposition from sinful men, so that you will not grow weary and lose heart.

Reactions: Rejoicing 1


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## alwaysreforming (Dec 28, 2004)

*Quote from \"Keep in Step w/the Spirit\"*

I was reading this today, and I thought I'd post this quote here. Packer says,

"We need to realize that while God's acceptance of each Christian believer is perfect from the start, our repentance always needs to be extended further as long as we are in this world. Repentance means turning from as much as you know of your sin to give as much as you know of yourself to as much as you know of your God, and as our knowledge grows at these three points so our practice of repentance has to be enlarged."

I thought that was a great way of putting it.


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## Infralap (Dec 31, 2004)

> _Originally posted by webmaster_
> Just as a note: Sonship theology as dicated in some of the Presbyterian denonminations is nonsense. It blurs the lines between justificationa nd adoption.



By the way, thank you for the note Fred, is not a matter of being nice but being Christ servant. 

In response to your reply, at first I hope you meant to say dictated and not dicated. If you were correct in your first spelling"¦ would you please explain what is dicated? (I apologize in advance, just in case, I am ever learning and wanted to make sure I understand you correctly) 

Also, I have posted a forum regarding Sonship Theology and I think that this might be better suited there. However, being that you mention it here I will like to say. I do not fully support this position as to die for it for only the bible has me captive; however there are some truths about it (Sonship Theology) we cannot escape. Including the part where you beautifully put its truths in a systematic way with scripture reference. 

In regards to the justified/adoption"¦I do see that those who are Justified (done at the cross) are Adopted (given the spirit, John 3, the Spirit gives birth to spirit). There is not blurring or over-emphasis that distorts the whole picture. The key is do we act as Son´s or do we act as orphan. Are we free in Christ? Do we have the power of the gospel present in our life? Do we understand that "œyes" we are as sinful as we could be, but if we are in Christ there is more than hope, there is salvation, etc. 

In theology, there are areas that, as they developed (understood better) there will not be perfect for perfection is still to come. However, we hold a key that opens the truths that will set us free. And that is, first understanding the core of the truths and applying it to our religious experiences/practices. This might be better understood by the word discernment! which is done in love!


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Dec 31, 2004)

> Just as a note: Sonship theology as dictated in some of the Presbyterian denonminations is nonsense. It blurs the lines between justification and adoption.



Corrected.

Fred, if I saw a weightlifter who only worked out with one arm, he'd look crazy. I'd say to myself - "What is the guy a nut?" I would not say "Well, he's just a bit lopsided...." 

We would send him to counseling, unless of course, he only HAD one arm. 



[Edited on 12-31-2004 by webmaster]


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## larryjf (Jan 1, 2005)

> When you repent... Do you tell God, "I wont do it again"?
> 
> Is this a biblical repentance?



The Westminster Catechism puts it this way...

Repentance unto life is when the sinner, out of a true sense of his sin and aprehension of the mercy of God in Christ, does with grief and hatred of his sin turn from it unto God, with full purpose of and endeavor after new obedience.

I think the "new obedience" clearly speaks to us trying not to do it again. I don't think it's necessary to tell God "I won't do it again", but it must be what is in your heart. If you are not willing to stop the sin, you are not truly repentant.


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