# Yet another nugget of theological gold from Andy Stanley



## Bill The Baptist (Aug 27, 2016)

Sometimes all you can do is shake your head, and then weep when you realize this man is influencing millions. https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=4Gmw6nHfuts


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## arapahoepark (Aug 27, 2016)

Does he hate Scripture because he doesn't know it? Or because he doesn't known it he hates it?


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 27, 2016)

arapahoepark said:


> Does he hate Scripture because he doesn't know it? Or because he doesn't known it he hates it?



Probably a little of both. What makes statement so ridiculous is that the Bible is the source of virtually all that we know about the resurrection, and so if you take the spotlight off the Bible, you will also be taking it off the resurrection. His philosophy is self-defeating.


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## Gforce9 (Aug 27, 2016)

Inmates running the asylum in pop-evangelicalism


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## Rich Koster (Aug 27, 2016)

Jesus loves me, this I know
'Cause a televangelist told me so
If I die before I wake
I'll find out he was a fake


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## Pergamum (Aug 27, 2016)

I think this also shows the folly of the ERLC and Russell Moore at the helm. We are bound only to get more of this unless the ERLC is abolished or its leadership replaced: http://pulpitandpen.org/2016/08/26/sbc-conference-get-the-spotlight-off-the-bible-courtesy-of-russell-moore-andy-stanley/


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 27, 2016)

Pergamum said:


> I think this also shows the folly of the ERLC and Russell Moore at the helm. We are bound only to get more of this unless the ERLC is abolished or its leadership replaced: http://pulpitandpen.org/2016/08/26/sbc-conference-get-the-spotlight-off-the-bible-courtesy-of-russell-moore-andy-stanley/



Indeed. If I were the "evangelical pope" I would excommunicate these two.


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## Pergamum (Aug 27, 2016)

https://twitter.com/ERLC/status/769338712979300352

Not sure Moore sees the irony of his tweets sometimes.


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## StephenG (Aug 27, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> His philosophy is self-defeating.


Exactly.
Thank you, Pastor Stanley, for telling us to take the spotlight from one thing to another thing when what we know about the latter thing comes from the former thing. Makes perfect sense if you don't think about it.


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## DMcFadden (Aug 27, 2016)

Andy Stanley's view of the Bible must be catching. His co-founder of the North Point Community Church, Reggie Joiner, developed the Orange curriculum so popular in broad evangelical circles (at least two of my kids are in churches that use it on my gandkids). The big complaint with Orange is that you may learn "principles" that are biblical but you will never learn the Bible or its major narrative sweep.


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 27, 2016)

StephenG said:


> Bill The Baptist said:
> 
> 
> > His philosophy is self-defeating.
> ...



Apparently Stanley reasons this way about a number of things. A few years ago he said that he did not believe that Adam and Eve were real people because of Genesis, but because Jesus said they were real people. This once again makes absolutely no sense because we only know that Jesus felt this way because it's recorded in the Bible. I sometimes wonder if he ever realizes how disjointed his thinking is on the Bible and theology.


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## Tom Hart (Aug 27, 2016)

Gforce9 said:


> Inmates running the asylum in pop-evangelicalism



Well said.


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## reaganmarsh (Aug 27, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> Pergamum said:
> 
> 
> > I think this also shows the folly of the ERLC and Russell Moore at the helm. We are bound only to get more of this unless the ERLC is abolished or its leadership replaced: http://pulpitandpen.org/2016/08/26/sbc-conference-get-the-spotlight-off-the-bible-courtesy-of-russell-moore-andy-stanley/
> ...



I studied under Dr. Moore at SBTS. I'm stunned that he tolerated such comments. 

Andy Stanley is simply rehashing the same tired liberal arguments that were the bread and butter of the SBC "progressives" during the Convention's Egyptian wanderings years. The 1963 BFM epitomizes Stanley's comments in its statement, "The criterion by which the Bible is to be interpreted is Jesus Christ" (Article 1). In other words, my understanding of Jesus trumps Scripture's. That sentence is how so much liberalism crept into the SBC, because it sounds very spiritual and Christ-centered. They leveraged that sentence to justify denying or downgrading the Bible in the name of Christ. That's exactly the same heresy that had our seminaries and churches in the disorder which necessitated the Conservative Resurgence and the BFM 2000. God help us.


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 28, 2016)

reaganmarsh said:


> I studied under Dr. Moore at SBTS. I'm stunned that he tolerated such comments.



It is difficult to discern from the video precisely what Dr. Moore's opinion of Stanley's statement was, but it does seem clear that whatever the case he did not really challenge or rebuke him. It seems that many within broad evangelicalism are enthralled with Stanley because of his seeming success in attracting crowds, as if this was an indication of God's favor. This is what happens when we confuse church attendance with salvation. Stanley's statement and his entire demeanor smack of arrogance. All you small churches out there, you need to sell your buildings and fork over the money to him so he can plant more churches that pipe in his pop psychology fluff via live streaming video.


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## arapahoepark (Aug 29, 2016)

Seeing this I am not sure Stanley will remain a Christian much longer....
http://blog.goconnections.org/faith/who-needs-god-part-3-the-bible-told-me-so-a-sermon-by-andy-stanley/


> A tweetable recap of Andy Stanley’s sermon, Who Needs God, Part 3: The Bible Told Me So, in 140 characters or less.
> 
> The things we have in common are more plentiful than the things that divide us. #WhoNeedsGod [clicktotweet]
> Christianity does not exist because of the bible. Just as you don’t exist because of your birth certificate. #WhoNeedsGod [clicktotweet]
> ...


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## reaganmarsh (Aug 29, 2016)

arapahoepark said:


> Seeing this I am not sure Stanley will remain a Christian much longer....
> http://blog.goconnections.org/faith/who-needs-god-part-3-the-bible-told-me-so-a-sermon-by-andy-stanley/
> 
> 
> ...



What an absolutely despicable act of public speaking, masquerading as a Christian sermon.


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 29, 2016)

reaganmarsh said:


> arapahoepark said:
> 
> 
> > Seeing this I am not sure Stanley will remain a Christian much longer....
> ...



Galatians 6:7 comes to mind here.


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## reaganmarsh (Aug 29, 2016)

Bill,

Amen.


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## DMcFadden (Aug 29, 2016)

The sad part is that he has enormous influence on younger pastors of several traditions . . . all over the country. And, his philsophy gets inculcated in the Orange curriculum that is also ubiquitous among evangelicalism.


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## Bill The Baptist (Aug 30, 2016)

This is his full sermon from last week. As I watched it, my blood literally boiled. He has unequivocally declared himself to be a heretic. I suppose it is not really shocking that he would believe that the Bible is not the foundation of Christianity considering this entire sermon does not mention a single Bible verse. Watch this if your blood pressure can handle it. Someone smarter than me need to thoroughly refute this nonsense before he influences anymore people than he already has. http://northpoint.org/messages/who-needs-god/the-bible-told-me-so/


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## Taylor (Aug 30, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> It seems that many within broad evangelicalism are enthralled with Stanley because of his seeming success in attracting crowds, as if this was an indication of God's favor.



He himself believes this, no doubt, judging by his disdain for small churches.


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## Pilgrim (Aug 30, 2016)

DMcFadden said:


> Andy Stanley's view of the Bible must be catching. His co-founder of the North Point Community Church, Reggie Joiner, developed the Orange curriculum so popular in broad evangelical circles (at least two of my kids are in churches that use it on my gandkids). The big complaint with Orange is that you may learn "principles" that are biblical but you will never learn the Bible or its major narrative sweep.



I'm definitely out of touch as I have no idea what the Orange curriculum is. You say "You may learn "principles" that are biblical but you will never learn the Bible or its major narrative sweep." Is it similar in that sense to Veggie Tales and other similar moralistic teaching?


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## Natertot (Aug 30, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> This is his full sermon from last week. As I watched it, my blood literally boiled. He has unequivocally declared himself to be a heretic. I suppose it is not really shocking that he would believe that the Bible is not the foundation of Christianity considering this entire sermon does not mention a single Bible verse. Watch this if your blood pressure can handle it. Someone smarter than me need to thoroughly refute this nonsense before he influences anymore people than he already has. http://northpoint.org/messages/who-needs-god/the-bible-told-me-so/



He's no longer hiding his true colors.


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## DMcFadden (Aug 30, 2016)

Pilgrim said:


> DMcFadden said:
> 
> 
> > Andy Stanley's view of the Bible must be catching. His co-founder of the North Point Community Church, Reggie Joiner, developed the Orange curriculum so popular in broad evangelical circles (at least two of my kids are in churches that use it on my gandkids). The big complaint with Orange is that you may learn "principles" that are biblical but you will never learn the Bible or its major narrative sweep.
> ...



I am NO expert on Orange. Here are some comments by a person in children's ministry.



> DOES ORANGE EVEN TEACH THE BIBLE?
> 
> Orange is the latest, greatest thing in KidMin and family ministry. It is so popular that churches of all denominations are labeling themselves “Orange Churches.” It is well funded, well made, organized and nice to look at. It is always seeking to remain relevant by providing cutting edge music and resources. The creators and leaders of Orange bring decades of children’s ministry experience. I have KidMin friends who swear by Orange.
> 
> ...


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## DMcFadden (Sep 1, 2016)

Babylon Bee nails it again:


> ALPHARETTA, GA—While preparing for the next installment of his “Who Needs God” series, in which he has been attempting to make the case that the Bible is not a necessary pillar of the Christian faith, Andy Stanley, Senior Pastor of several hundred megachurches in the Atlanta area, was reportedly shocked upon being informed by an intern that the New Testament is actually part of the Bible.
> 
> “I don’t believe this,” Stanley exclaimed after verifying the statement on GotQuestions.org. “All this time I’ve been yelling about how people don’t need the Bible, they just need the Gospels and some other portions of the New Testament as the basis for their Christian faith. Why didn’t anyone tell me?”
> 
> ...



Indeed!


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## Pergamum (Sep 1, 2016)

Has there been any follow-up by Russell Moore about the interview? Did he voice any reservations or write about any unfortunate comments made by Stanley?


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## Gforce9 (Sep 1, 2016)

What Dr. Horton has said about Joel Osteen may very well apply to this fella:
Don't call yourself a pastor and don't call that gathering of people a church and the criticism would cease.......


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## Tom Hart (Sep 2, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> This is his full sermon from last week. As I watched it, my blood literally boiled. He has unequivocally declared himself to be a heretic. I suppose it is not really shocking that he would believe that the Bible is not the foundation of Christianity considering this entire sermon does not mention a single Bible verse. Watch this if your blood pressure can handle it. Someone smarter than me need to thoroughly refute this nonsense before he influences anymore people than he already has. http://northpoint.org/messages/who-needs-god/the-bible-told-me-so/



I watched the whole thing. The production is very professional, but that's the nicest thing I can say. I'd sooner call this a lecture than a sermon. The only time he refers to Scripture is to point out that Luke grounds his writings in history.

He says that the Bible is not a necessary piece of Christianity. The Bible exists because of Christianity, he says, not the other way round. All we need to believe is Jesus. Of course, there are huge problems with that! Namely, who is Jesus and how do we find out about Him?

Basically, Stanley is taking liberal scissors to his Bible (which he still says he 'loves' and reads every day). He mixes in what would be considered some more conservative points, such as the age if the NT documents. But in general his lecture was largely un-Christian and frankly anti-Bible.


Some chioce quotes (paraphrased):

You may be able to hang on to belief in the Bible (esp. OT miracles, the Flood) but your children and grandchildren won't.

The early Christians didn't have Bibles, and theirs was still a persecutable faith.

Thank goodness our faith doesn't have to hang on the fragile thread of trusting the Bible.

The early Christians did not believe the things about Jesus because they believed they were inspired, but because they believed those things were true.


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## Edward (Sep 2, 2016)

At some points he comes across as a hyper-dispensationalist; at other points, it is something worse. 

I'm predicting a crash and burn in a few years.


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## Bill The Baptist (Sep 2, 2016)

Edward said:


> At some points he comes across as a hyper-dispensationalist; at other points, it is something worse.
> 
> I'm predicting a crash and burn in a few years.



And also a heavy dose of liberalism, red letter Christianity, prosperity gospel, Catholicism (the Bible exists because of Christianity, not the other way around), and even a dash of preterism (the whole Bible was completed before AD 70). Quite an odd and dangerous mix indeed.


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## hammondjones (Sep 2, 2016)

Bill The Baptist said:


> Edward said:
> 
> 
> > At some points he comes across as a hyper-dispensationalist; at other points, it is something worse.
> ...



Worst. Cafeteria. Ever.


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## reaganmarsh (Sep 7, 2016)

A follow-up article in response to AS from the co-teacher of my preaching class (with Russ Moore), Dr. David Prince:

http://www.davidprince.com/2016/09/...bible-not-cutting-edge-theyre-old-liberalism/


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