# Do You Need Seminary To Teach Theology?



## Mikey (Jul 19, 2019)

At first glance, this question may come across as a no brainier, but I think its still worth asking. Do you need to have undertaken 5 to 7+ years of theological higher education to begin a career as a lecturer at seminary/university? With the rising costs of theological education, and with there being few jobs out there for theological graduates, it can often feel like the costs of such education far out-weigh the benefits (especially with the use of online resources and online bookstores, where one can effectively self-teach himself much of what is taught at seminary). I know many men who would testify that very little of that which they were taught at seminary couldn't be self-taught and learned within the context of the local church. As far as my own education goes, much of what I learned at university could've been self-taught at a much more effective speed at home; in fact, most of what I know about my own personal study areas came outside the university campus (besides Classical Greek). I have a passion to teach Theology at a high level, but must I incur so much debt (or give up so much of my income/savings) to even just have a small chance of landing a lecturing/teaching role? 

Long question put short: are there other routes to becoming a Theology lecturer apart from the financially burdensome route of half a decade's worth of seminary? Do you know anyone who has taken an alternative route?

Thanks in advance for your replies!

Additional Information: I have recently enrolled in two courses at seminary, to begin next week. I recently graduated with a Bachelor of Arts (Economics, Philosophy). I have little to no interest in unaccredited education (I think it has a place, but I struggle to think it does so in academia). Also, I do not struggle with self-discipline (if such struggle did exist, the benefit of seminary would be greater).


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## Pergamum (Jul 19, 2019)

"According to The Center for the Study of Global Christianity, there are “5 million pastors/priests in all Christian traditions worldwide (Catholics, Orthodox, Protestants, and Independents, including bi-vocational).” They further estimate that “5% (250,000) are likely to have formal theological training (undergraduate Bible degrees or Master's degrees)”. This means that of the estimated 2.2 million evangelical, pastoral leaders globally (some estimates put this figure as high as 3.4 million), only 5% have received formal training (i.e., a Bachelor’s or Master’s degree).”

A Masters degree or lengthy experience in the ministry is fine for teaching overseas in many locations. Most church workers around the world are not formally trained. And those that train them don't need to have doctorates. If you want to get into the bubble of academia, you might need a higher degree, but for on-the-ground training of pastors, there are hundreds of pastors in many locales overseas who are begging for men to teach them, but few teachers will come long-term to these locations to put in the necessary work.

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## alexandermsmith (Jul 19, 2019)

If we're talking specifically about teaching in a seminary, at least in Western countries, you probably would need qualifications from accredited institutions. Academia tends to only recognise academia. In terms of training to be a minister I don't think there's any necessity for _seminary_ education, but good quality education is required but this can done in-house through an apprenticeship approach.

And I could imagine a situation where a minister, through his experience and exemplary pastoral and theological work over the years, could teach at a seminary even if he himself had not achieved degrees from such institutions himself all the way back during his original training. But I think the normal situation would be that certain qualifications would be looked for.

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## earl40 (Jul 19, 2019)

Personally I would rather have an MD who had a degree along with a Pastor who also had one. Interesting it is required to have a degree to practice medicine but not Pastoring.

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## Pergamum (Jul 19, 2019)

earl40 said:


> Personally I would rather have an MD who had a degree along with a Pastor who also had one. Interesting it is required to have a degree to practice medicine but not Pastoring.



There was one called the Great Physician who had no degree.

I've heard the analogy of a pastor being a doctor (or a surgeon by R Scott Clark), but I really think it is sort of a stupid analogy. A pastor is not a brain surgeon. 

It is more like a musician having a music degree or not. Many times a music degree helps, but the proof is in the music and not in the degree.

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## Alan D. Strange (Jul 19, 2019)

Mikey said:


> I have a passion to teach Theology at a high level



I understand men who argue that they shouldn't have to go to seminary to be pastors. I think that they are wrong (what is needed is most commonly garnered there), but I understand the reasons that they argue such, including the economic ones.

But your arguments are new for me, Mikey. You want to "teach theology at a high level," presumably in seminary, while at the same time arguing against the need for such sort of education. So you want to teach subject matter in a place that you think people shouldn't need to go to study the subject matter you want to teach? 

Am I missing something here or is your question/argument as bizarre as it sounds?

Peace,
Alan

Reactions: Like 11 | Funny 1


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## alexandermsmith (Jul 19, 2019)

It is necessary for ministers to have a solid, thorough theological training. I don't know that it's necessary it is acquired at a particular institution called a seminary.

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## earl40 (Jul 19, 2019)

Pergamum said:


> There was one called the Great Physician who had no degree.



The lady with the issue of blood first went to a Dr.  Also I strongly suspect Jesus was educated beyond the regular lay person of today, and back then.


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## arapahoepark (Jul 19, 2019)

Of course, I would think. If I want to get my masters I am eligible to teach at a community college level and even be an adjunct at some universities. How much more is it necessary for graduate level education?


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## Pergamum (Jul 19, 2019)

P.s. I know 2 bible schools in New Guinea and Papua, Indonesia who desire bible teachers asap to train pastors. Masters degree is desired.

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## Contra_Mundum (Jul 19, 2019)

The problem with pointing to Jesus, and suggesting that: _since he didn't have a credential from men _(ala *Jn.2:25*)_, none other needs it--_is that it really is a claim that _there aren't any extraordinary people._ And, of course Jesus was even more than just one of those. The end of Jn.2:25 witnesses the extraordinary gift (by whatever interpretation placed on the words) of the Lord's knowledge.

For every Spurgeon, there are dozens (maybe hundreds) who ran ahead of all preparation that might have made them genuinely effective. Spurgeon created a preacher's college. Read his _Lectures to My Students, _in which he frankly discusses the cases of would-be preachers who were manifestly unqualified.

Jesus, as we know, set up his own school of sorts, a "three-year seminary course" if you will, completed by many of his disciples (more than the Twelve alone, including Matthias and Justus, Act.1:23; also Paul as I argue from Gal.1:17-18 cf. 2Cor.12:2-4). Paul set up a pastoral school in Ephesus, Act.19:9-10, resulting in a tremendous evangelistic output. We should also mention the school (sons) of the prophets, first mentioned 1Ki.20:35, of which there are early signs even in Samuel's day, 1Sam.10:5.

Regardless of whether one thinks of such training ground in the way of a college or a mentorship, the Bible certainly offers much more by way of example regarding training of pastors and teachers for the church than it supposes either "everyone's a teacher," or sudden involuntary Spirit-endowment is a mature norm for the church.

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## Chad Hutson (Jul 19, 2019)

I would think that in order to teach at seminary level one would need some credentials.
But let me speak to a greater issue that has been alluded to in at least a couple of recent threads: the need to train ministers of the gospel for pastoral ministry.
While many churches have uncredentialled preachers, I think it would serve them to receive formal education/training to cut back on much of the heresy or near-heresy that is prevalent in many American churches. While these men have a zeal for God, many do not have a firm foundation in sound doctrine that keeps them from straying from orthodoxy. I pray that someday soon in my area of the country there would be available a minister's academy/training program that would be affordable for these bi-vocational ministers as well as accommodating for work schedules. I am kicking around the idea with our elders now, however, it would require great effort, resources, and cooperation among churches.
Brothers and sisters, if you could only hear what passes for gospel preaching in North Central WV you would be shocked and grieved in your spirit! For example, I recently had a conversation with an area minister who told me he doesn't like to cling to the plain meaning of Scripture because the meaning changes according to how he feels and what is happening in his life at the time, thus influencing his messages. I informed him that the plain meaning of Scripture *is* the message! Probably won't be getting a Christmas card from him this year.
Pray for us, for we are so small and weak.

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## Pergamum (Jul 19, 2019)

It is always a mistake to over-emphasize or under-emphasize the place of seminary in the preparation of a man of God.

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## Alan D. Strange (Jul 19, 2019)

Pergamum said:


> It is always a mistake to over-emphasize or under-emphasize the place of seminary in the preparation of a man of God.



I agree entirely! We (in the seminary) don't give a man a single gift (only God does). Nor do we qualify and call a man (God does internally and the church does externally, working in submission to her Lord). 

Well put, Trevor!

Peace,
Alan

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## Pergamum (Jul 19, 2019)

Alan D. Strange said:


> I agree entirely! We (in the seminary) don't give a man a single gift (only God does). Nor do we qualify and call a man (God does internally and the church does externally, working in submission to her Lord).
> 
> Well put, Trevor!
> 
> ...


Thanks. I was afraid I under-emphasized the place of training in my previous post.


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## bookslover (Jul 19, 2019)

What I really want to know, Mikey (Mike) - is that really you in your avatar photo?

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Mikey (Jul 19, 2019)

Alan D. Strange said:


> But your arguments are new for me, Mikey. You want to "teach theology at a high level," presumably in seminary, while at the same time arguing against the need for such sort of education. So you want to teach subject matter in a place that you think people shouldn't need to go to study the subject matter you want to teach?
> 
> Am I missing something here or is your question/argument as bizarre as it sounds?



You are right, it is bizarre. I thought about what you're saying before I started the discussion. I feel like I have two seemingly desires within me: 1) For me to teach the next generation of Christian thinkers at (the financial burdensome) seminary and 2) For such theological education to not be so burdensome upon those who have been called by God to be educated. I feel like we need men to go through the system one last time, and then change the system for the next generation, where theological education does not have to be such a big financial question. I certainly see your point though, Dr Strange.


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## Mikey (Jul 19, 2019)

bookslover said:


> What I really want to know, Mikey (Mike) - is that really you in your avatar photo?



Haha, no its not, the picture is a bit outdated... I've recently grown a beard.


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## Polanus1561 (Jul 19, 2019)

I am thankful my seminary has men with both credentials and pastoral experience.


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 19, 2019)

Mikey said:


> Haha, no its not, the picture is a bit outdated... I've recently grown a beard.


Outdated? Let me help. I think the avatar would look pretty cool with an All Blacks jersey. Agreed?

Reactions: Funny 1


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## ArminianOnceWas (Jul 19, 2019)

Mikey said:


> I feel like I have two seemingly desires within me: 1) For me to teach the next generation of Christian thinkers at (the financial burdensome) seminary and 2) For such theological education to not be so burdensome upon those who have been called by God to be educated. I feel like we need men to go through the system one last time, and then change the system for the next generation, where theological education does not have to be such a big financial question.



One idea I have for you is this. Earn your legit Ph.D. and then offer to teach at a seminary for 1/2 salary of other professors, or perhaps even volunteer to teach a full-time course load. If you can set an example for others to follow perhaps tuition costs may decrease.

In all seriousness brother, I believe I can sense your sincerity in this thread and I do wish seminary education was more affordable.

However, there is a fine line of discernment here. Do I want my seminary professor full time, actively engaged in continuing education such as attending academic conferences and presenting papers? Well yes, because hopefully, he is maintaining a high level of interest in his profession and not growing lazy. Alternatively, do I want my seminary professor to work 40 hours a week selling used cars then coming in to teach a class he has hardly prepared for in order to save me tuition cost? Well, no to that extreme.

I think you see my point. To earn the credentials to be able to teach at seminary often means you will be in debt and required to earn a living for your family which implies the seminary must pay a competitive salary which comes from tuition. It is a vicious cycle, isn't it? However, I do want my professors to be able to give themselves wholly to the profession in the same way I wish to give myself wholly to my pastoral vocation.

One answer could be the accreditation issue. Do our seminaries need ATS or other accreditation? Well yes and no I suppose. First to receive funds for student loans and to be competitive, then yes.

I'm strongly supportive of endeavors such as LAMP Seminary among PCA churches that utilize local church facilities and pastors usually with D.Min degrees to offer a high level of education. However, my local LAMP site is talking about closing because of funding. Tuition is about $50 per credit and I'm not sure they are paying the guest lecturers much at all. I don't know why they can't survive except that 10 students paying $150 per class for 8 weeks does not cut it.

I don't know what the answer is or how to fix it because I don't want my pastor going to a diploma mill either to "earn" an education.

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## Alan D. Strange (Jul 19, 2019)

Not wanting to appear unduly partisan or parochial, but students at our seminary, typically, between support of their own churches (at local and other levels), scholarships, and student aid leave here with no additional debt. We tend to be quiet about that, but in a discussion like this I think it warrants saying.

Perhaps other institutions are the same, but if you are sent here by your church, which is required for M.Div. study, and admitted to our program, we are committed to not adding to your burden(s) in this way. 

If one is fit for seminary study, which is an ecclesiastical judgment as well as an institutional one, it ought to be affordable. 

Peace,
Alan

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## AlexanderPetzinger (Jul 20, 2019)

Pergamum said:


> It is always a mistake to over-emphasize or under-emphasize the place of seminary in the preparation of a man of God.


Totally agree! I am also piggy-backing on the comments of Professor Strange regarding one's calling to a church office and was thinking, "for what specific purpose will the seminary training be?" in other words, will it be for equipping a pastor for guiding a flock, or for an evangelist who is called to evangelize the lost (and exhorting other believers to evangelize)? I wonder if the Church has too often conflated the two offices. 

"Now as they observed the confidence of Peter and John and understood that they were uneducated and untrained men, they were amazed, and began to recognize them as having been with Jesus." (Acts 4:13)


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## RJ Spencer (Jul 20, 2019)

I've always held that Seminary is unnecessary to be a minister. Often times I feel ostracized because of my lack of formal education, even though I've studied theology on my own for about 15 years. I understand where the OP is coming from and I encourage him to follow the call of God regardless of whether he has the approval of men or not.


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## ArminianOnceWas (Jul 20, 2019)

RJ Spencer said:


> I've always held that Seminary is unnecessary to be a minister. I understand where the OP is coming from and I encourage him to follow the call of God regardless of whether he has the approval of men or not.



Do you believe a minister has any kind of accountability to the fellow church and leaders?


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## Taylor (Jul 20, 2019)

RJ Spencer said:


> I've always held that Seminary is unnecessary to be a minister.



Perhaps not a formal education at an institution called a "seminary," but a solid theological, biblical, and historical training is most certainly necessary. Of course, the easiest place to get such a thorough education, at least here in the US, is your local seminary.


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## Alan D. Strange (Jul 20, 2019)

RJ Spencer said:


> I've always held that Seminary is unnecessary to be a minister. Often times I feel ostracized because of my lack of formal education,



As to the first point, RJ, the church of which you are a part, the PCA (together with other Presbyterian and Reformed churches), requires a seminary education ordinarily of its Teaching Elders. This then seems a bit of an odd conviction on your part. Are you not thankful for the theological training that your pastor has? You don't resent or regret him having such, do you?

As to the second point, I regret that you've ever felt ostracized for lacking a formal education. I know that people, even in the church, can act wrongly in this regard. Such might be akin to the favoritism that we too easily show to the rich, the powerful, etc. James 2 condemns such class-bias and would condemn ostracizing for these sorts of reasons. Paul said in I Cor 1 (26-31), in fact, that not many who are worldly-wise, mighty, or noble are called, but those that this world despises as weak and foolish. 

Many jobs don't require college or graduate education. They require other sorts of technical skills that on the job or other vocational training furnishes. Paul commends working with one's hands (I Cor. 4:12; cf. II Thes. 3: 6-12) and, in all cases, doing what one does to serve the Lord (Eph. 6:5-9). 

No one should ostracize anyone for being formally educated or not, rich or poor, etc. We should treat one another as we would be treated and receive each other as Christ receives us--just as we are (though thankfully making us anew at the same time). 

Peace,
Alan

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## bookslover (Jul 20, 2019)

Mikey said:


> Haha, no its not, the picture is a bit outdated... I've recently grown a beard.



LOL


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## Jo_Was (Jul 21, 2019)

One of the qualifications of all elders is their ability to teach. I think becoming an elder in a local church is one of the best places to exercise those gifts of teaching if you are a layman. It is not just teaching elders who teach, but ruling elders also must be ready to fulfill certain duties of Christian education and service in the church. From what I understand, it even seemed a historic practice to first become an elder, and then the congregation would support an elder for the ministry more formally. I think that can be a good model for someone who sees that they have gifts in teaching and Christian education, but perhaps does not foresee being a full-on pastor (that obviously entails more gifts and duties outside of just being able to teach).

But also, how about being an actual teacher?  It may still require some formal training, but may take less time and rigor. There are many private schools and educational contexts in which to teach Bible and theology topics. It can be just as rewarding. Don't underestimate the high level conversations that can be had at the secondary level!

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## Semper Fidelis (Jul 21, 2019)

Providentially, I preached this morning as our Pastor is out for a few weeks. I am licensed to preach in our Presbytery.

Today, I preached Matt 13:44-52. Matthew 13:52 concludes this pericope from our Lord:

*52 *And he said to them, “Therefore every scribe who has been trained for the kingdom of heaven is like a master of a house, who brings out of his treasure what is new and what is old.” 

I have been a student of the Word and of theology for many years now. By the time I started attending Seminary in 2009 (sort of a log cabin extension), I had been studying for well over 13 years. In part, my knowledge was intimidating to some of my instructors but I also learned so much from them.

Self-study can tend to be a bit lopsided at times and you may never study some topics at depth and really appreciate them. It took many years of sacrifice and money to complete a Masters of Christian Ministry but every second and dollar spent was worth it.

Given the gifting, calling, and proper motivation, a good seminary education is a great blessing to the Church at large.

Christ calls teachers "scribes of the Kingdom" for a reason. They are not like the scribes of His day who could only tell you what great Rabbis thought but are those who are able to accurately understand an apply that which has been handed down and is in the Word which is timeless to new situations.

The Puritans called their ministers Physicians of the Soul because, as a physician understands the anatomy of the body, the minister understands the human predicament and is able to administer true and wise words in the appropriate context.

Sadly, I see many ministers today who have received good training and are like physicians who have not kept up with their craft and so they don't one and continually develop their skills. They are examined once and are offended at the notion that they have to continually prove their worth and whether their preaching is truly healing or heals the sins of God's people lightly.

So, I don't want to be arrogant and claim that no man can be an approved worker of God without formal training. We have an embarrassment of riches that we not only hoard but neglect.

But, if a man aspires to ministry, then it means he pursues all that will make him useful. He is willing to sacrifice time and riches for that which is more worthy of both. He should be careful from whom he learns but no sacrifice is too great for the Bride of Christ. Given the judgment that awaits any who claim to be teachers and who harm little ones, we should be sober about what kind of preparation we take and be surrounded by wise men who have been in the fight for years to have them evaluate whether we are approved.

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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 21, 2019)

Alan D. Strange said:


> Not wanting to appear unduly partisan or parochial, but students at our seminary, typically, between support of their own churches (at local and other levels), scholarships, and student aid leave here with no additional debt. We tend to be quiet about that, but in a discussion like this I think it warrants saying.


I am sure, Alan, I speak for many in the Reformed Churches of New Zealand when I say people trained at Mid-America have been a real blessing in this denomination. A good friend of mine is beginning his language studies and will relocate to the USA in 2020 DV, and I was also recently blessed by the preaching of another graduate from Mid-America who is now doing his 1 year ministerial interim training with the RCNZ now.

It is a big commitment to send people to the USA to train but the arrangement between the RCNZ and Mid-America helps a lot here.


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## Alan D. Strange (Jul 21, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> I am sure, Alan, I speak for many in the Reformed Churches of New Zealand when I say people trained at Mid-America have been a real blessing in this denomination.



Some Americans trained here have gone there and we are happy to share these good brothers with you.

But you have sent us some of your own men for training, and, I must say, it has been an enormous blessing to have them here. We love the kiwis who come here! Great guys!

What a beautiful land, in so many ways, you have there and I look forward to visiting someday. 

Peace,
Alan


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## ZackF (Jul 21, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> A good friend of mine is beginning his language studies and will relocate to the USA in 2020 DV,



Don’t they speak English in NZ?

Reactions: Funny 3


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 22, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Don’t they speak English in NZ?


Yes, her majesty the Queens English


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 22, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Don’t they speak English in NZ?


Sorry I misread your joke  If I clarified and said *Biblical *language studies does that get me off the hook?

Reactions: Informative 1


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## TylerRay (Jul 22, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Don’t they speak English in NZ?


Barely.

Reactions: Funny 1


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## TylerRay (Jul 22, 2019)

Mikey said:


> At first glance, this question may come across as a no brainier, but I think its still worth asking. Do you need to have undertaken 5 to 7+ years of theological higher education to begin a career as a lecturer at seminary/university? With the rising costs of theological education, and with there being few jobs out there for theological graduates, it can often feel like the costs of such education far out-weigh the benefits (especially with the use of online resources and online bookstores, where one can effectively self-teach himself much of what is taught at seminary). I know many men who would testify that very little of that which they were taught at seminary couldn't be self-taught and learned within the context of the local church. As far as my own education goes, much of what I learned at university could've been self-taught at a much more effective speed at home; in fact, most of what I know about my own personal study areas came outside the university campus (besides Classical Greek). I have a passion to teach Theology at a high level, but must I incur so much debt (or give up so much of my income/savings) to even just have a small chance of landing a lecturing/teaching role?
> 
> Long question put short: are there other routes to becoming a Theology lecturer apart from the financially burdensome route of half a decade's worth of seminary? Do you know anyone who has taken an alternative route?
> 
> ...


I studied theology privately for nearly a decade before entering seminary. I know certain aspects of theology very well. However, I quickly learned upon starting seminary (I just finished my first year) that there was much that I had neglected. I pursued my own interests. A course of study in a seminary will give you a well-rounded education in all the disciplines of divinity--and if you don't have a well-rounded base in all these disciplines, you have no business teaching systematic theology, which requires one to be a masterful exegete and historical theologian.

Remember, if you think you're the exception to the rule, you're probably wrong. Have any theologians told you that you have the requisite knowledge to begin teaching prospective theologians?

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## Dachaser (Jul 22, 2019)

Mikey said:


> At first glance, this question may come across as a no brainier, but I think its still worth asking. Do you need to have undertaken 5 to 7+ years of theological higher education to begin a career as a lecturer at seminary/university? With the rising costs of theological education, and with there being few jobs out there for theological graduates, it can often feel like the costs of such education far out-weigh the benefits (especially with the use of online resources and online bookstores, where one can effectively self-teach himself much of what is taught at seminary). I know many men who would testify that very little of that which they were taught at seminary couldn't be self-taught and learned within the context of the local church. As far as my own education goes, much of what I learned at university could've been self-taught at a much more effective speed at home; in fact, most of what I know about my own personal study areas came outside the university campus (besides Classical Greek). I have a passion to teach Theology at a high level, but must I incur so much debt (or give up so much of my income/savings) to even just have a small chance of landing a lecturing/teaching role?
> 
> Long question put short: are there other routes to becoming a Theology lecturer apart from the financially burdensome route of half a decade's worth of seminary? Do you know anyone who has taken an alternative route?
> 
> ...


The bigger question is can one be a profitable bible teacher without high amount of formal education?

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## Susan777 (Jul 22, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Don’t they speak English in NZ?


No, who can understand them? They speak Kiwese.


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 23, 2019)

Alan D. Strange said:


> Some Americans trained here have gone there and we are happy to share these good brothers with you.


Some of the American pastors who have ministered here have struggled because the Reformed witness/fellowship here is significantly less than the USA. Part of this is population difference, part of this is because New Zealand is a more secular nation.

If you want a modern helpful resource on ministering in modern day New Zealand an esteemed minister of the Reformed Churches of New Zealand has written a very helpful book. It is free online https://www.rbc.org.nz/library/FeedMySheep.pdf

Your American students who desire to minister here would find it particularly helpful.



Alan D. Strange said:


> What a beautiful land, in so many ways, you have there and I look forward to visiting someday.


I am very blessed to have lived here and I do love the scenery of my native South Island  But I bemoan how ungodly this nation is. If you are able to visit sometime I would love to meet you.


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## Mikey (Jul 23, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> Outdated? Let me help. I think the avatar would look pretty cool with an All Blacks jersey. Agreed?



Hahaha... I don't think so!

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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 24, 2019)

TylerRay said:


> Barely


After observing the diverse range of accents in the United Kingdom, I have come to the conclusion if you blend all these accents into one perfect accent, you have NZ English

Reactions: Funny 2


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 24, 2019)

Susan777 said:


> No, who can understand them? They speak Kiwese.


New Zealand is sometimes called 'Middle Earth'. We speak Elvish, a highly developed language

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## Tom Hart (Jul 24, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> New Zealand is sometimes called 'Middle Earth'. We speak Elvish, a highly developed language


Sindarin or Quenya?


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## ZackF (Jul 24, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> New Zealand is sometimes called 'Middle Earth'. We speak Elvish, a highly developed language



So how many case endings are there? Decline the noun Kiwi for us please?


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 25, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Decline the noun Kiwi for us please?


Did you mean decline or define? 

As for your question, "a picture is worth a thousand words"


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## Stephen L Smith (Jul 25, 2019)

Tom Hart said:


> Sindarin or Quenya?


New Zealanders like to have a "bob each way". So we take the best of each

Reactions: Informative 1


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## TylerRay (Jul 25, 2019)

Stephen L Smith said:


> Did you mean decline or define?
> 
> As for your question, "a picture is worth a thousand words" View attachment 6193


Here's what they look like with the head and limbs removed, and feathers plucked:

Reactions: Funny 6


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