# Christian Military Experience Questions



## AThornquist (Jan 11, 2009)

I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:

1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?

2) Is the military an effective route to a) earn an income as a single man, b) earn college money for the future, and c) begin to build a strong resume?

3) Would it be worth starting college at my own cost in order to enter the service as an officer? 

4) If I enter the military at this point in time, is it pretty likely that the government will make me serve for more years than I sign up for?

5) If I am interested in the military for financial and personal benefits and not primarily for "defending the United States" (although I may end up fighting overseas anyway), would considering the military "be for the wrong reasons"?

There are more questions that will arise from this, surely, but I really need to figure out if the military is the right direction for me, and when, and how. I am 19. I want to be moving forward in life.


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## Zeno333 (Jan 11, 2009)

I feel that question number 1 is answered in the OT numerous times, and that answer would be a no.


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## InevitablyReformed (Jan 11, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:
> 
> 1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?
> 
> ...



1. NO
2. Friend, the military is for those who desire to selflessly serve their country (I realize that there are variations and differences on this point). Your A, B, and C options are all centered around yourself. Please KNOW that if your goal in joining the military is to earn money for college or build a resume, you should probably not join the infantry.
3. There are commissioning programs (I am in one) for enlisted Marines that help you pay for college. If you do plan on going to college on your own, you should seek out an ROTC scholarship.
4. NO
5. My comment on question #2 is not to opine on the validity or invalidity of Christians serving their countries. Motives count. Your effectiveness as a leader (and a follower) will be diminished/affected by your intentions. There is really no way around this. When men's lives are on the line, I, as an infantryman would not be thrilled to know that one of my subordinate leaders was more worried about their resume or college than the task at hand.

Please do not mistake any perceived firmness in this response as mean-spirited. That is not my intention. Please think about ALL aspects of the service and PRAY for wisdom if you are seriously considering the service. 

Hope this helps brother.


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## AThornquist (Jan 11, 2009)

Thank you for the input so far. I will check back on this sometime tomorrow since I have an obligation to attend to, but I will be praying fervently about this.


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## ColdSilverMoon (Jan 11, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:
> 
> 1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?
> 
> ...




Good questions.

1. No. 

2. This is a complex question. At first it is an effective source of income, especially as an officer. But for a given career field, you will find that your compensation in the military is quickly surpassed by your civilian counterparts. As a young, single officer, you will have housing free or nearly free, health insurance, and a reasonable income. It's not a bad route. I'm not sure I would use the military to earn money for college. I would go to a military academy or join the ROTC so they would pay for college and allow you to become an officer. I wouldn't enlist and then go to college - it's not an efficient way to do it. Other people may have a different opion on this, but that's my view.

3. If you plan on becoming an officer, it doesn't make sense to enter college at your own cost. Join the ROTC or go to a service academy (preferably ROTC, and I am an Air Force Academy grad). ROTC allows you a good university education and still gets you the scholarship and officer training. I'm an Academy grad, but I would avoid the Academies. The education is excellent in many ways, but there are many negative aspects of the experience. I can give you more detail in a PM. 

4. Unlikely, but theoretically possible.

5. In my view choosing to join the military is like any other decision you make in life: money may be a factor you consider, but you should obviously pray and ask God to give you wisdom in your decision. For most people, the military isn't the route to go if you want to make money in the long run. You need to be sure you want to join and have a special calling/aptitude for whatever sort of work you do in the military. If it's purely for money, you'll hate it, likely do a poor job at it, and therefore be a poor witness. So make sure you want to be a part of the military - doing it for the money just isn't wise. 

This may meet with some negative comments, but my personal opinion is that unless you want to be in the military specifically to do military stuff (fly planes, sail boats, drive tanks, etc, etc) I would look elsewhere. I wouldn't use the military as a "bridge" to something else. I don't think it's wrong to do that, but I don't think it's the best thing for anyone. The military isn't like a regular job you can just leave at the end of the day - it's a culture and a way of life very unique to anything else. 

Finally, and I know this will meet with some criticism, but I would join the Air Force first, Navy 2nd, Marines 3rd, Army 4th or not at all. It has nothing to do with the people in the service, but the location of bases, quality of facilities, and lifestlye. Unless you really want to join the Army, I would personally avoid it. I can go into detail or you can PM me for my rationale. The Marines are the best fighters, most loyal, toughest. I admire them, but they LOVE being Marines. You have to love being a Marine too or you'll hate it. The Navy and Air Force both have the best locations, nicest facilities, most cutting edge technology, etc. The negative part of the Navy is being on a boat for 6-9 months at a time. So I would go with the Air Force, my bias not withstanding. But again, if you feel God is leading you to one particular service, obviously that's the route you should go. 

So all that to say, joining the military is not a decision to take lightly. There are good and bad things about it, and you should research and pray before signing on the dotted line. As you have noticed, there are some really wonderful men of God on the board who have served or are serving in the military.


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## Pergamum (Jan 11, 2009)

I served 5 years as an army officer, so I can weigh in at least a little bit:


1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?

Depends. If you kill civilians on purpose you are a murderer. If you do not take precautions to preserve civilian populations you are guilty of manslaughter. If you kill enemy combatants in a just war then you are not sinning, unless you take pleasure in their death rather than merely taking pleasure in the good execution of a duty.





2) Is the military an effective route to a) earn an income as a single man, b) earn college money for the future, and c) begin to build a strong resume?


Do not serve your country UNLESS you want to serve your country. If you serve out of false motives you are not being a patriot, but are being a mercenary and I cannot condone those merely serving for money.

But, if you are primarily driven out of patriotic motives, then yes, the army can be a good avenue to get college education. My whole tuition was paid and I made pretty good money after I became a captain. For resumes, yes, the army is good if you are an officer. 

For being enlisted, don't go 11B infantry because killing people is not usually a civilian skill set.


Also, if you get killed in Iraq, this pretty much ruins your future plans for civilian life, and a lot of folks are losing limbs to IEDs, so don't join unless you feel patriotic stirrings, because I know several folks that have come out physically or psychologically scarred for life, and I had a cushy job.



3) Would it be worth starting college at my own cost in order to enter the service as an officer? 

YES, that is what I did. Sorry, but I would not have entered the army as an enlisted man. Find a college with ROTC, and try for an ROTC scholarship.




4) If I enter the military at this point in time, is it pretty likely that the government will make me serve for more years than I sign up for?


They cannot do this for long periods. The longest stop-losses (which I despise) that I have seen have been 18 months max.

NOTE: The army will offer to fund college for you sometimes and pay 100% for it, but this will obligate you to longer time. If you join through ROTC you will be obligated to 4 years active duty and 4 years reserve, and I know several of the IRR (inactive ready reserve) being called up for Iraq.



5) If I am interested in the military for financial and personal benefits and not primarily for "defending the United States" (although I may end up fighting overseas anyway), would considering the military "be for the wrong reasons"?



Yes, I would even call this sin because you are endangering your life for principles of monetary gain. Don't do it.



There are more questions that will arise from this, surely, but I really need to figure out if the military is the right direction for me, and when, and how. I am 19. I want to be moving forward in life.[/QUOTE]


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## matt01 (Jan 11, 2009)

> I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:
> I was an enlisted Marine, serving in an Infanty battalion for four wonderful years.
> 
> 1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?
> ...



The military can be a great way to serve your fellow man, while figuring out what you want to do with your life. It is not for everyone; make sure you pray/think through your decision. I would be glad to answer any specific questions that you might have.


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## PresbyDane (Jan 12, 2009)

I do not think you would be violating anything by joining the army Paul tells us to obey the government (or whatever the english bible says) and that it is for a reason that they carrie a sword.
I do not se why you could not be a soldier and as such you need your "sword" and that, to use it if nessesary.
my


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## JohnGill (Jan 12, 2009)

Join the Air Force. #1 generally would never arise, though from the OT the answer is no. In the AF you have all the benefits of the military with none of the drawbacks. In some instances they will even pay back your school bills. Or you could go enlisted, get your degree with them paying for it, and then go officer.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

I really appreciate your information, guys. I am comfortable with 1, 2, 4, and 5 at this point. I realize that I am asking a lot of financial questions, but that is because I am already firm on the fact that I won't join to serve unless it is for the right reasons anyway. 

With 3), concerning whether or not I should start college right now at my own cost to become an officer, I am stuck. The general feel I got was that entering as an officer is worthwhile, although simply working up through the ranks works as well. Plus, I hear that there are ROTC scholarships that can help me pay for much of my schooling, although I suppose it depends how much of a scholarship I get. (A quick look at AF ROTC shows that there are 3 levels of the scholarship, $15,000, $9,000, and $3,000, but I'll have to see for the other branches). Altogether: be an officer, somehow.

Here is something I need to know, though: if I get an ROTC scholarship and enter as an officer, does that effect my future available amount of college money?


______________________________________________________________


Now comes the issue of how I figure out what I want to do in the armed forces and what branch. I mean, how _do I know_ whether I should be in 11B Infantry or a cushy job (to borrow aforementioned options)? How can I know if I can kill enemies without scarring my mind unless I, well, do it? 

Today I am dedicating a large amount of time to researching my options, so please give me your take on the several branches of the military, their pros, cons, etc. I guess I could talk to a recruiter but, well, all they want to do is get me in. They will say what they need to say to do that...
As far as the Marines is concerned, I definitely see the "Marines LOVE being Marines" bit. I suppose I shouldn't consider that branch unless I am _really_ sure I am going to LOVE being a Marine. 

Anyway, thank you for the information so far.


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## Theognome (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:
> 
> 1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?
> 
> ...



1. No.

2. The income is fair, the college help is available (I never used it myself), and it can help build a resume in certain fields. Personally, I used the military to help develop discipline, which I desperately needed and continue to need.

3. Rich would be the guy to answer that one.

4. An enlistment can be involuntarily extended under the UCMJ only during wartime.

5. Ours is a volunteer military, and most folks I know wouldn't put patriotism on the top of their list as their reasons for enlisting. However, if the principle of overseas war is an offense to you, entering the military would not be advisable.


Theognome


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

If someone is a front-line soldier (say, 11B Infantry), how much opportunity is there to do college work back at the base? Any at all?

(My mom would HATE if I did that, but still... I'm interested)


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## jwithnell (Jan 12, 2009)

I've had some exposure to critical stress with my background in emergency response so I'll try to offer some insight in your question re:


> "How can I know if I can kill enemies without scarring my mind unless I, well, do it?"



Likely how you answer your first question -- the legitimacy of engaging in war -- will have a strong effect on how you weather the difficult things you may see or do. I would also hope that any ROTC program would administer some screening to see if you might be particularly susceptible. (I recall some kind of visit with a psychologist for my daughter as she entered an ROTC program, but I don't recall specifically what it was for.)

Beyond that, someone who is currently or formerly in the armed services can give you more specific info.


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## Semper Fidelis (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> I would like to ask a few questions of my brothers and sisters, especially those in the armed forces:
> 
> 1) If I was an Infantryman (for example), would it be a violation of the 6th commandment to kill an enemy soldier?


Depends on the order and the circumstances. In some cases, Yes.



> 2) Is the military an effective route to a) earn an income as a single man, b) earn college money for the future, and c) begin to build a strong resume?


a) Yes.
b) Yes. The new GI Bill is extremely generous.
c) Yes.



> 3) Would it be worth starting college at my own cost in order to enter the service as an officer?


Have you thought about an ROTC scholarship? I had 3 years of my college paid for. As for the Officer route, that is up to you. I had no desire to enlist.



> 4) If I enter the military at this point in time, is it pretty likely that the government will make me serve for more years than I sign up for?


It is less likely now than it was at the beginning of the current conflicts.



> 5) If I am interested in the military for financial and personal benefits and not primarily for "defending the United States" (although I may end up fighting overseas anyway), would considering the military "be for the wrong reasons"?


I think the number of people that have idealistic notions about why they are serving are few and far between. If you join the military, do so out of a sense of vocation.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

I am currently looking into ROTC Scholarships but because I don't really know if I want to straight up enlist I haven't enrolled into college yet, so applying for an ROTC Scholarship isn't yet possible (that I know of). 

What is the difference between an enlisted serviceman vs. an officer on a day to day basis? I read some of the benefits to being an officer (from an Air Force site), but they didn't talk about the difference in duties. Can officers still be front-line soldiers in the Marines, for example?


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## Semper Fidelis (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> I am currently looking into ROTC Scholarships but because I don't really know if I want to straight up enlist I haven't enrolled into college yet, so applying for an ROTC Scholarship isn't yet possible (that I know of).
> 
> What is the difference between an enlisted serviceman vs. an officer on a day to day basis? I read some of the benefits to being an officer (from an Air Force site), but they didn't talk about the difference in duties. Can officers still be front-line soldiers in the Marines, for example?



Officers are in the front lines but they are the leaders and supervisors. Responsibility, accountability, and command rest with them. Enlisted personnel tend to be more task oriented where the Officers plan overall direction.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

I see. Being an officer does sound more appealing to me. I will continue looking into ROTC scholarships and see what I can plan for. But I will ask this question again: do ROTC scholarships get pulled from one's GI Bill, or can I get an ROTC Scholarship and then use the full GI Bill at a later time?

Thank you for all of your input, everyone. It truly has helped me.


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## Whitefield (Jan 12, 2009)

But never forget ... it is the enlisted who "get r done".


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## matt01 (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> If someone is a front-line soldier (say, 11B Infantry), how much opportunity is there to do college work back at the base? Any at all?



It depends on the unit that you are assigned to, as well as the command's interest in promoting off-duty education. During 4 years as a 0311 (Marine Corps version on an 11B), I was able to complete less than 20 credits. Other Marines, in commands that looked more favorably on off-duty education, were able to nearly complete their AA/AS. There are opportunities, with schools having courses on many bases, but your access is what will be limited due to training/work schedule...

Why are you interested in that MOS? It is not all that glamorous, and depending on what your future goals are, the experience isn't all that great. If you want to be a cop, it would be pretty good experience. If you want to go into medicine, it is not so great of experience. Look at your end goal, and not just the glamorized idea of service.



Semper Fidelis said:


> I think the number of people that have idealistic notions about why they are serving are few and far between. If you join the military, do so out of a sense of vocation.



Few and far between, but still out there. I chose the service that offered the lowest entry rank, and zero financial bonus, based on idealist reasons. Still wonder what would have happened if I had taken one of the _better_ offers.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

sans nom said:


> Why are you interested in that MOS? It is not all that glamorous, and depending on what your future goals are, the experience isn't all that great. If you want to be a cop, it would be pretty good experience.



Hey, you nailed it  

And I don't know really, it just has always fascinated me. I am thinking long-term here. Either way, I'm thinking of getting a BA first and studying hard for the ASVAB. If I do decide to spend significant time in the military I want to do something difficult and intense. Delta Force, perhaps? Who knows, but our Father. I am single, so now is as good a time to do it as any.

When all is considered, I would love to be the Light of Christ in such a scary place; Lord knows that the soldiers need as much godly direction as possible (as do we all).


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## JohnGill (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> If someone is a front-line soldier (say, 11B Infantry), how much opportunity is there to do college work back at the base? Any at all?
> 
> (My mom would HATE if I did that, but still... I'm interested)



Slim to none. Don't go grunt, do something you can use on the outside. Also don't go FA, especially FiST. Unless your a masochist, in which case you'll fit right in.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

Really? Hmm.

Here was the general plan so far: 

Enlist in the Army, and aim for a combat oriented MOS. Do college work while on active duty whenever possible in hopes of getting a BA from an online college like Thomas Edison State College. Apply to become an officer as soon as the option is available. If I want to continue in the Army and continue in a combat oriented MOS, retake the ASVAB and work toward becoming a Special Forces operator (aka Green Beret) or Army Ranger. 

So, Chris, what is FA and FiST?


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## JohnGill (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Really? Hmm.
> 
> Here was the general plan so far:
> 
> ...



FA=Field Artillery; FiST = 13F; Fire Support Specialist my old MOS.

As to your idea to enlist in the Army in a combat MOS and go to college while on active duty: 

That really made me laugh. Your chances of doing ANY college while in a combat MOS is almost nil. If you really want a combat MOS then do 13F. It's above 11B and they're a better group.


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

Well heck, I would prefer a combat MOS but I would rather enter the services now and not go through college. _But_ I still want the degree and education in order to enter at a higher rank. Shoooot.....

Well, let me ask you this: if I wanted to eventually be an Army Ranger or in the Special Forces, does a BA have much of an impact on that? Also, would entering as a combative or non-combative MOS have any impact on that? Does being an officer or enlistee have any bearing on being a Ranger or Green Beret?


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## Theognome (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Well heck, I would prefer a combat MOS but I would rather enter the services now and not go through college. _But_ I still want the degree and education in order to enter at a higher rank. Shoooot.....
> 
> Well, let me ask you this: if I wanted to eventually be an Army Ranger or in the Special Forces, does a BA have much of an impact on that? Also, would entering as a combative or non-combative MOS have any impact on that? Does being an officer or enlistee have any bearing on being a Ranger or Green Beret?



I was offered to enter the Navy Seals program, and it was based on physical and mental ability, not education. Officers and enlisted must both endure rigorous training to enter into special forces (SF) programmes. If you go the ROTC route, you could still go SF after qualifying under the physical requirements.

Theognome


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

Based on "mental ability" -- would you define that for me, brother?


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## Theognome (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Based on "mental ability" -- would you define that for me, brother?



For me, it was based on my ASVAB score. It has nothing to do with stability, but rather you ability to learn new things.

Theognome


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## AThornquist (Jan 12, 2009)

Ah, the ASVAB. That is one reason I want to go to college; I need some good prep for it. Thank you for that info.


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## Theognome (Jan 12, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Ah, the ASVAB. That is one reason I want to go to college; I need some good prep for it. Thank you for that info.



Prep? I took the fool thing when I was 17, and got spam calls from every branch of the military... even some I'd never heard of. Personally, I think a pulse is all you need to take the ASVAB, though I'm sure others (Rich?) might disagree with good reason.

Theognome


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## matt01 (Jan 12, 2009)

Theognome said:


> AThornquist said:
> 
> 
> > Ah, the ASVAB. That is one reason I want to go to college; I need some good prep for it. Thank you for that info.
> ...



Don't worry about the ASVAB, your certainly don't need to go to college in order to do well on it. There are some study guides out there if needed, but mostly it is a walk in the park.


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## AThornquist (Jan 13, 2009)

Oh -_- Well, the only sections I really need a brush up on are the math sections. I was top in my class in math, but since I didn't really care or study I don't remember a lot of things. It's rather sad, really...lol. I need to stop getting stuff into just short term memory!


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## Theognome (Jan 13, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Oh -_- Well, the only sections I really need a brush up on are the math sections. I was top in my class in math, but since I didn't really care or study I don't remember a lot of things. It's rather sad, really...lol. I need to stop getting stuff into just short term memory!



Mr. Thornquist, you are 19. Since you are not Christ, you can expect to not know everything, be perfect, and walk on water before you make a decision. There will be advantages and disadvantages to whatever path you chose at this point, but you must understand that your fate is not cast in cold stone, but rather is held in the loving hand of our Creator who shall ensure that the best for you shall come from the path you choose. You are His- and regardless of your doubts, He shall make of you a vessel for His glory and a witness to the lost. Whatever career plan you decide at this point is the right one, for it is His plan long before it is yours.

Theognome


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## AThornquist (Jan 13, 2009)

You know...I needed that, sir. I have been so focused on "me" and how "I can plan my future" that I have been neglecting to recognize my Father as the One who controls all things--the waves of the ocean, the wind through the trees, and certainly whether or not I join the military (and what happens from there!). Thank you for redirecting my focus.

Though I am so unsure about where I will go or what I will do, in peace I will both lie down and sleep, for you alone, O Lord, make me dwell in safety.


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## Theognome (Jan 13, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> You know...I needed that, sir. I have been so focused on "me" and how "I can plan my future" that I have been neglecting to recognize my Father as the One who controls all things--the waves of the ocean, the wind through the trees, and certainly whether or not I join the military (and what happens from there!). Thank you for redirecting my focus.
> 
> Though I am so unsure about where I will go or what I will do, in peace I will both lie down and sleep, for you alone, O Lord, make me dwell in safety.



Yes, you has a karot.


Theognome


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## Archlute (Jan 13, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Really? Hmm.
> 
> Here was the general plan so far:
> 
> ...



Andrew, I served as a 13F with the 3rd Ranger Battalion. If you want to know more, please PM me. 

As far as study time, you may be able to get in a small amount as a single man, but that is a big "maybe". Deployments in the Batts (whether for training exercises or real world fare) are not long, but they are very frequent. If you gain a family while you are serving there I wouldn't consider outside study to be a viable option.


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## LawrenceU (Jan 13, 2009)

Go to college. Get a degree in math, science or some other degree programme. Take the AFOQT and get a commission in the USAF. If you want tough duty, or to serve as an officer in that vein, go into Combat Control Commando.


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## No Longer A Libertine (Jan 13, 2009)

I joined the army reserves and they are sending me to OCS later this year and putting me in Civil Affairs, Civil Affairs and Psyops are the most attractive aspects of the modern army to me.

You work intellectually alongside Special Forces to perform special op missions and really make a tangible difference in the lives of Afghans and Iraqis as you provide them with living necessities, protection and philanthropy as well as open their eyes to the fact that he Americans are not the enemy.

If I planned on going enlisted I would check out Psyops and Civil Affairs and put them at the top of my wishlist.


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## Archlute (Jan 13, 2009)

AThornquist said:


> Well heck, I would prefer a combat MOS but I would rather enter the services now and not go through college. _But_ I still want the degree and education in order to enter at a higher rank. Shoooot.....
> 
> Well, let me ask you this: if I wanted to eventually be an Army Ranger or in the Special Forces, does a BA have much of an impact on that? Also, would entering as a combative or non-combative MOS have any impact on that? Does being an officer or enlistee have any bearing on being a Ranger or Green Beret?



1. Any education that you can obtain will contribute to your ability to think through a situation's variables, make critical decisions, and improve your ability to improvise with the resources that are on hand. Serving within the special operations community entails not only performing feats of physical endurance and tactical prowess, but even more importantly it requires mental agility and the ability to make decisions using sound thought processes. You can develop this without having taken a formal education, but spending a few years in college will give you another leg up when you begin your career. 

2. Your choice of MOS may be limited by low ASVAB scores, which would obviously be improved through formal education. Also, you must have a minimum GT of 110 to obtain a Ranger/SF contract.

3. If you really want to make certain of serving in the special operations community you should go enlisted. You can secure either an option 40 (Ranger contract), or and 18x (unassigned Special Forces option) as an enlisted man that guarantees you a shot at either profession. Officers do not have that option, but are rather assigned a branch sometime during their training pipeline. It can be totally arbitrary. I know of a fellow who served successfully in the Ranger Regiment as an NCO who then pursued officer training, and was branched Chemical and sent to Korea. It all depends upon the "needs of the Army", and no matter how much your previous skills may have suited you to be a Ranger PL, if your class graduates when the Army needs 13 Ordnance officers and 0 Infantry officers, guess what you'll be doing.

However, you can be branched as anything and still attempt to become an 18A (SF officer) when your year comes up. It is sometime just before or after your promotion to O-3 (Captain),which in most cases is about 2-3 years following your commission. You should know that officers generally only serve a couple of years in a Ranger/SF unit before being reassigned to something else. They may come back later with a higher command, but all things being equal they only have about 2 years of "ground time" before moving on to serve in staff positions and such.

You might consider finishing college, coming in enlisted for a couple of years, and then going "green to gold" or whatever it is called to attend OCS for a commission. If you enlist with a BA you will come in as an E-4, which will give you a little better pay, and occasionally a little more responsibility (if they don't think that you're a knucklehead right out of the gate, in which case it will just bring you pain). However, you really don't pick up any leadership slots in Regiment until after you have completed Ranger school, and in SF, by the time you finish the training pipeline, you are generally an E-5/E-6 anyway.


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## SemperEruditio (Jan 13, 2009)

I agree with Adam. If I had to do it over I would get a degree and then enlist. Especially with all the Special Forces programs available to enlisted you have a much better chance. The degree gives you the flexibility to become an officer after a few years. Now we have gone way past the 25 meter mark, so I will say that your #1 focus needs to be to go to college and finds ways to pay for it that do not obligate you to anything.

BTW for clarity I was not a Special Forces officer. I was a Hospital Corpsman in the Navy for 10 years, 4 of which were spent with the Marines. I had a package in for BUDS as well as having taken the Force Recon indoc but got into a bit of trouble and gave up my chance to do either. By the time I could I had lost motivation...

At the very least look into an associates degree. Look into paramedic programs. Most are AA degrees. This will give you some funds after you finish and may increase your chances in the military. What some guys did was moonlight when in the States. Others continued on and became PAs or MDs.


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## AThornquist (Jan 14, 2009)

Some of the questions that I really needed help answering have been answered, great!
Thank you all so much. I especially am glad to hear the information about not entering as an officer--phew, that was good to find out before I make too many decisions in that direction. You all have been very helpful.

(This is why I bother to "look a fool" and ask too many questions; I want as much information as possible to make intelligent decisions. "Without counsel plans fail, but with many advisers they succeed." Prov. 15:22 )


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