# I've left the Assemblies of God and heading in a Baptist direction.



## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

Heh folks, just a wee update. 

A few weeks ago my family and I made the decision to leave our AoG church. There were several reasons for this. 

For me, one of the key issues was ecclesiology and the conviction regarding a future call to ministry. 

We are attending a baptist church but it will take several months before we can apply for membership. 

I'm just wondering how this works with the puritan board membership rules. Should I change my signature to say 'attending a Baptist church with the intention of requesting membership?'


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## Scott1 (Feb 19, 2009)

As you move toward reformed theology, it will be:

Doctrines of grace ("five points") + covenant theology + confession

You may find "What is Reformed Theology"? by RC Sproul helpful where you are now.

Blessings.


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## ManleyBeasley (Feb 19, 2009)

Jon 316 said:


> Heh folks, just a wee update.
> 
> A few weeks ago my family and I made the decision to leave our AoG church. There were several reasons for this.
> 
> ...



That sounds right.


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

> As you move toward reformed theology, it will be:
> 
> Doctrines of grace ("five points") + covenant theology + confession
> 
> ...



Hey, not really sure what you mean but thanks for the book tip!  

I'm not sure I can sign up 100% to the confession. Dont get me wrong, most of it (baptist) is great. But there are a few areas I cannot allign myself with at this point.


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## Scott1 (Feb 19, 2009)

> Jon 316
> I'm not sure I can sign up 100% to the confession. Dont get me wrong, most of it (baptist) is great. But there are a few areas I cannot allign myself with at this point.



That's why this is a great place to learn reformed theology, what it is, and what it is not, and to grow in grace toward one another!


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## Hamalas (Feb 19, 2009)

Thanks for the update! Keep us posted.


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## Jimmy the Greek (Feb 19, 2009)

Yes. I would adjust your signature as _you_ suggested. 

Next identify those areas of the 1689 LBCF with which you have potential problems. They will be great starting points for some discussion threads.


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

cheers Jim


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## SemperEruditio (Feb 19, 2009)

Why not just skip all the back & forth your about to do and join a Presbyterian church? We all know that is where this is headed....why fight it?!  

AoG--->Calvinist--->"Reformed"  Baptist ---> Presbyterian

Skip all the middle ground and just meets us at the end game. 


In all seriousness, glad to hear you are headed in the right direction.


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

> Why not just skip all the back & forth your about to do and join a Presbyterian church? We all know that is where this is headed....why fight it?!
> 
> AoG--->Calvinist--->"Reformed" Baptist ---> Presbyterian
> 
> ...





I'm laughing so much at that... A few weeks ago I was reading up on the puritans and for a brief moment arrived at that place! I even visited my local Cof S (but soon realised the error of my ways  )I was despairing over the schism and thought to myself. Back to the source thats the answer, and then I realised that would mean heading back to Rome!


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## SemperEruditio (Feb 19, 2009)

Rome was just a fork on the road back to the source.


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## PresbyDane (Feb 19, 2009)

Is a congratulations in order ?


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

> Is a congratulations in order ?



why do u say that?


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## Glenn Ferrell (Feb 19, 2009)

Jon 316 said:


> A few weeks ago I was reading up on the puritans and for a brief moment arrived at that place! I even visited my local Cof S (but soon realised the error of my ways  )



That was an error; CoS is the wrong place to look. Many of them no longer believe or teach the confessional standards, though there are genuine Reformed Evangelicals among them. Get to know some FCoS-C, FCoS or FPCoS folk. They actually believe what they confess. Even if you end up elsewhere, you may learn something from them.


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

Thanks Glen... I did visit a free church when I was 'up north' on holiday. I really enjoyed it. Great preaching. I think the minister nearly had a cardiac when he found out I normally go to an AoG... I think he was confused because I was a pentecostal and I liked the service! lol

I think they have good preachers but culturally they are too far removed for me.


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## PresbyDane (Feb 19, 2009)

Jon 316 said:


> > Is a congratulations in order ?
> 
> 
> 
> why do u say that?



You have gone from pentacostal to baptist


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

Martin Marsh said:


> Jon 316 said:
> 
> 
> > > Is a congratulations in order ?
> ...



sorry, was being a bit slow...


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## Herald (Feb 19, 2009)

John, what part(s) of the 1689 London Baptist Confession don't you agree with?


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## Jon 316 (Feb 19, 2009)

Herald said:


> John, what part(s) of the 1689 London Baptist Confession don't you agree with?



its been a few weeks since I have read it... the one part that comes to mind (there may have been a few other parts) is the 'minister of word and sacriment' part. 

In otherwords, I find the scriptures used to justify the idea that it is the minister's role to distribute the sacriments somewhat lacking in weight. The stewardship is clearly the mystery of the gospel and not the sacriments. 

My disagreement with this would also be on a theological basis. The priesthood of all believers is not just about individual access into God's courts but also the 'ministry' of all believers. The eraly church broke bread in each others homes over a meal. It was much more communal occassion than it has become today. The simplicity is somewhat lost. Perhaps I still have some brethren influence, but I see it being more scriptural that the church has the sacriments entrusted to her and she can adminsiter them as led by the Holy Spirit.


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## LawrenceU (Feb 19, 2009)

John, having pastored an AoG church I am thrilled for you. I will also be praying fervently for you.


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## Herald (Feb 19, 2009)

> Chapter 28: Of Baptism and the Lord's Supper
> 
> 1. Baptism and the Lord's Supper are ordinances of positive and sovereign institution, appointed by the Lord Jesus, the only lawgiver, to be continued in his church to the end of the world.
> ( Matthew 28:19, 20; 1 Corinthians 11:26 )





> 2. These holy appointments are to be administered by those only who are qualified and thereunto called, according to the commission of Christ.
> ( Matthew 28:19; 1 Corinthians 4:1 )




The ordinances administered in paragraph two can be more aptly described as presiding over. There is a pastoral charge that accompanies the Lord's Supper. That charge includes prohibition of those who are living in unrepentant sin and those who are unsaved. That this ordinance is presided over by a pastor or elder displays the serious and solemn nature of the ordinance. Pastors and elders function as a spiritual gatekeeper for the flock, protecting it from wolves. The elements need not be passed out by a pastor or elder, but the ritual itself is performed according to scriptural authority and pastoral oversight.


Similarly, baptism is no less serious or solemn. As keepers of the flock, pastors and elders identify with the person being baptized upon their profession of faith. Baptism is a visible sign that a person has believed in the gospel message by faith, and is now part of the New Covenant. 


You write:




> The stewardship is clearly the mystery of the gospel and not the sacriments.


Actually, the two cannot be separated. The Lord's Supper is a celebration of the gospel. Baptism is the sign of the gospel as seen in the promise of the New Covenant. Since the gospel is an integral part of both ordinances they are to be observed with the same care and attention that is given to the Word of God being preached. The body does rejoice together during the Supper and when a sinner is redeemed and professes their faith in baptism. In that sense all participate.


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## Glenn Ferrell (Feb 19, 2009)

Jon 316 said:


> Thanks Glen... I did visit a free church when I was 'up north' on holiday. I really enjoyed it. Great preaching. I think the minister nearly had a cardiac when he found out I normally go to an AoG... I think he was confused because I was a pentecostal and I liked the service! lol
> 
> I think they have good preachers but culturally they are too far removed for me.



Weed through the culture and ask what is essentially warranted by God and what is a circumstance. I agree the Wee Free's are impacted by culture like all of us; but they hold to a "regulative principle" of doctrine, worship and discipline, which is biblical. Sort out what is what, considering chapter I, paragraph 6 of either WCF or LBC-1689.

Visit one of the Glasgow or Edinburgh congregations and find opportunity for discussions with their ministers. As my wife was a member of a Free Church Continuing congregation during her residence in Glasgow, I’ve had opportunity to know many of them, and have a special fondness for their faith and piety, Highlander culture and all. I found them gracious even when I disagreed.


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## Iconoclast (Feb 19, 2009)

Hello John
Keep serving the Lord as you continue to feed on His word.
Learn each of the confessions and see which one best lines up with the word of God. Get comfortable with the main threads that run through the bible.
Do you know about Sermonaudio.com. Thousands of sermons which you may download. There is a wealth of good study guides and helps right here in the Archives. It is an encouragement to many when the Lord opens truth to fellow believer's


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## Glenn Ferrell (Feb 20, 2009)

Iconoclast said:


> Do you know about Sermonaudio.com. Thousands of sermons which you may download.



Check out British Baptist Malcolm Watts:

SermonAudio.com - Sermons by Rev Malcolm Watts


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## turmeric (Feb 20, 2009)

Okay, folks, let him get his "sea legs"! Let's don't overwhelm with all the split-P's!


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