# Best way to introduce Calvinism



## MichaelGao (Aug 7, 2010)

I'm preparing to introduce doctrines of election and sovereign grace to my youth group. The difficulty is that I only got one session - roughly one hour.
With such a large topic, where do we start? 
There was an earlier post about resources to introduce Doctrine of grace, I'm asking for ideas for a presentation.

And most of them know nothing of calvinism or arminianism, most probably don't even know the words "predestination", "election"..I just hope to achieve the purpose of getting them interested and engaged in this so they will want to learn more (because lets be honest, one hour is not enough to sever all the pelagian roots inbuilt into our corruption), as they aren't very theologically orientated.

i was thinking of just going through Rom 9 with them. Mainly because I feel like this passage gives a high view of God. 
Would you recommend this approach? Any other suggestions? 

Personally, I didn't want to turn it into something TOO intellectual/technical where I point out the arminian view and the reformed view, and use reasoning and scripture to show reformed view is correct. 

Any suggestions is much appreciated.

P.S. I have gone through the total depravity with them very thoroughly. So dont need to start there.


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## LawrenceU (Aug 7, 2010)

Michael, a survey of Ephesians chapters one and two would most likely be much easier to understand and more easily received. It also has a high view of God and clearly points out the impossibility of man's work in salvation.

For what it is worth I would not present 'Calvinism' to them. I wouldn't even use the word. Neither would I use the word 'Reformed'. Just teach the truth of Scriptures. If one of them asks something like, 'Hey, isn't that X?' Then you could affirm it simply and move on.


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## Steve Curtis (Aug 7, 2010)

I agree that Ephesians would be a better place to start. And if you have already gone through total depravity "very thoroughly" the rest should fall into place pretty naturally! In fact, they should then be asking, "Who then can be saved?" And there's your opening...


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## Jack K (Aug 7, 2010)

I agree that if they know nothing of the Calvinist/Arminian debate, you don't want to go there. Doing that would turn it into a controversial "issue" rather than just plain Bible teaching. Teach about the truth, not about the debate.

You're in the best possible situation. They should be open to just being taught the truth. Don't let the fact that _you_ have been caught up in the controversy turn it into some kind of big deal issue study when it doesn't need to be.

Ephesians sounds like a good suggestion. You might also consider Jesus' discussion with Nicodemus in John 3. That's my favorite with young people because there's something of a story going on, featuring two personalities, even though they're largely just talking doctrine. I've found kids able to see that Nicodemus comes to Jesus claiming to be a believer in his own power, and Jesus tells him he can't be. It's all the Spirit's power, and you have no control over what the Spirit chooses to do. Kids I've taught often find the teaching radical, but eye-opening, and the conversation fascinating. Which it is.


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## Puritan Sailor (Aug 7, 2010)

I agree with what's been said before. I wouldn't use the big terms either. But you only get one hour? Use Eph 1 to explain union with Christ, and how we are given EVERY spiritual blessing in Him. Salvation is a package deal. You don't get one blessing without the gaurantee of all the others. And (if you have the time), use Eph 2 to explain the radical effects of sin and then the radical work of grace, i.e. total transformation from child of wrath to child of God (including the gift of faith). The difference between Arminianism and Calvinism ultimately comes down to how we define the effects of sin and grace. Let Ephesians give them the biblical definitions of the whole redemption purchased by Christ and the effects of grace. That will inoculate them from Arminianism when they finally come across it more formally.


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## Jesus is my friend (Aug 7, 2010)

Is using a book like A.W Pink's Sovereignty of God a possibility to use during or to supplement your teaching?,This was the one book that first made sense to me and that was in an non-reformed

I am excited to hear how it plays out keep us posted


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## MichaelGao (Aug 7, 2010)

Okie. Sounds like we have a consensus. 
I'll have a look if its John 3 or Eph 1-2 that I know better haha. 
I was thinking about Eph 1, but because of its such a dense, full-on passage, I thought I might not make it through to the other end in time.
But since you all think its a good place to start, I'll see what I can do.
What about John 6? I myself was brought to see the triumphant grace there.

Thanks for the advice, I will definitely keep the theology debate out the door.


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## jwithnell (Aug 7, 2010)

Both the Romans and the Ephesians passages came to my mind, but in a much more limited sense. You could lead a discussion on just "God chose us in Him before the foundation of the world ..."or "How can the pot tell the potter make me thus" and be prepared to interpret scripture with scripture. (I.e., have the scriptures noted for the different directions the kids might take this.) This covers several things: first, kid's like to be engaged and not talked "at." Secondly, it demonstrates that election and predestination are taught in the scriptures. It encourages them to be grounded in the scripture, not just how they feel or what they think.



> Teach about the truth, not about the debate.


Right on!


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## MichaelGao (Aug 7, 2010)

Oh they aren't exactly kids haha, they are university students. 
Though I guess you could call that as kids. Still true that at this age no one likes being lectured.
It just sounds funny to me, cause I'm their age, so Im a technically kid too. FUN.


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## jwithnell (Aug 7, 2010)

Blush! Actually I started considering myself old when I started thinking of college students as kids ...


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## Semper Fidelis (Aug 7, 2010)

I've been listening to Piper's seminar on TULIP: TULIP, Part 1 :: Desiring God Christian Resource Library

I think it is the most winsome discussion of the topic I've ever listened to. I got the MP3's from a friend but just found them online. Better yet, these have notes!


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## Iconoclast (Aug 8, 2010)

Michael,
Introduce the God of the bible to these students,the doctrine will flow from it. Teach the truth of scripture first,not all the historical baggage,terms,and isms.
1] Did God save you, or did you save yourself? ans . God saved me
2] Did God save you on purpose,or was it an accident or mistake? ans . on purpose
3] that is election...God saving His people on purpose.

Keep it as simple as the scripture does. If you do not mind me saying this to you,[as i do not know you that well}
you seem to be over anxious to tell them what you know,and have learned,instead of walking them into the truth.
It is a long distance race not a sprint. Do not overlook the very fine confessions of faith as they speak very clearly on this
.Those godly men used great care to help give us scriptural and doctrinal guidelines


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## MichaelGao (Aug 9, 2010)

Iconoclast said:


> Michael,
> Introduce the God of the bible to these students,the doctrine will flow from it. Teach the truth of scripture first,not all the historical baggage,terms,and isms.
> 1] Did God save you, or did you save yourself? ans . God saved me
> 2] Did God save you on purpose,or was it an accident or mistake? ans . on purpose
> ...


 
Thanks for the advice Anthony, I have actually asked myself if I am leading them through this just for the sake of knowledge or even showing off my knowledge. And to be honest, I still can't be sure that my motives are entirely pure and out of love (same applies to everything I've "claimed" to have done for God). But my reasoning for wanting to teach this: it has occurred quite a few times that while we were doing bible study during fellowship, people brought up the question of if God chooses people to be saved. Every time that question came up, I dodged it by saying: "its too big of a topic, we might have a look at it someday, but the short answer is yes." I think generally people are ready to get to know the "family secret" (I think J.I. Packer once used this phrase). I feel like this is a view of God that will free us all from self-sufficiency and self-dependence for the journey ahead. 

The plan of attack so far is to start with the question: How did you come to believe? And answer that question through Jn 3 and Jn 6..etc Then ask the question Can you fall away from faith if God chose you? Answer using Jn 10 and Heb 3-4. Thus establishing the concepts of unconditional election, irresistible grace and perseverance of the saints...without unnecessary terms like you all have advised.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Aug 9, 2010)

You could build the entire discussion around the Scriptures suggested and this talking point outline, or some variation of the same:

*T* = The Problem (_Total Depravity_) – Grace Needed

*U* = The Remedy (_Unconditional Election_) – Grace Conceived

*L* = The Means (_Limited Atonement_) – Grace Merited

*I* = The Application (_Irresistible Grace_) – Grace Applied

*P* = The Result (_Perseverance of the Saints_) – Grace Preserved

AMR


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## Iconoclast (Aug 9, 2010)

Michael,
I am glad you have been considering and praying about looking into these things with this group of persons.
Here is a section of the 1689 confession of faith,that gives some fine verses to consider, but also speaks of being cautious in point number 7


> Chapter 3: Of God's Decree
> 1._____ God hath decreed in himself, from all eternity, by the most wise and holy counsel of his own will, freely and unchangeably, all things, whatsoever comes to pass; yet so as thereby is God neither the author of sin nor hath fellowship with any therein; nor is violence offered to the will of the creature, nor yet is the liberty or contingency of second causes taken away, but rather established; in which appears his wisdom in disposing all things, and power and faithfulness in accomplishing his decree.
> ( Isaiah 46:10; Ephesians 1:11; Hebrews 6:17; Romans 9:15, 18; James 1:13; 1 John 1:5; Acts 4:27, 28; John 19:11; Numbers 23:19; Ephesians 1:3-5 )
> 2._____ Although God knoweth whatsoever may or can come to pass, upon all supposed conditions, yet hath he not decreed anything, because he foresaw it as future, or as that which would come to pass upon such conditions.
> ...


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## KMK (Aug 9, 2010)

LawrenceU said:


> Michael, a survey of Ephesians chapters one and two would most likely be much easier to understand and more easily received. It also has a high view of God and clearly points out the impossibility of man's work in salvation.
> 
> For what it is worth I would not present 'Calvinism' to them. I wouldn't even use the word. Neither would I use the word 'Reformed'. Just teach the truth of Scriptures. If one of them asks something like, 'Hey, isn't that X?' Then you could affirm it simply and move on.


 
I couldn't agree more.


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## nicnap (Aug 9, 2010)

"Everyone, this is Calvinism. Calvinism, this is everyone." How was that difficult?


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## SemperEruditio (Aug 9, 2010)

Sometimes we presume people believe the Bible simply because they attend a youth group. Give a topical study on God's word and the sufficiency of it.


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## BlackCalvinist (Aug 9, 2010)

Go through Ephesians 1 and Ephesians 2. You'll have covered 4 of the 5 points there alone.


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