# Augustine on Predestination -- ideas wanted



## SolaScriptura (Sep 30, 2005)

I'm currently taking a class on the Theology of Augustine. I've been given the general topic of "Augustine and predestination" on which I am to write my research paper. 

I was tempted to simply write: "Augustine on Predestation: He believed in it." However, I don't think that would go over too well.

So, I'm interested in hearing ideas for where I should take it.


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## Puritanhead (Sep 30, 2005)

Stand up for sovereign grace! Don't let your hands get tied behind your back.
:bigsmile:


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## SolaScriptura (Sep 30, 2005)

> _Originally posted by PastorSean_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by SolaScriptura_
> ...



That might be doable. I found it interesting that though (like you mention) he is often credited with "inventing" predestination, he actually credits the teaching of Cyprian with correcting his early views (which diminished sovereign grace). Additionally, he often cites Ambrose as well...


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## DTK (Sep 30, 2005)

There are some who contend that Augustine held to what they call "predestination to grace" rather than "predestination to glory." In other words, they come to the point where they can't deny that he held to a "form" of predestination, but they explain that what he meant by predestination was that the elect are predestined only to be in a state of grace, from which they may or may not fall away before death. Such a subject would seem to fall within the parameters of Augustine and predestination.

Blessings,
DTK


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## biblelighthouse (Sep 30, 2005)

> _Originally posted by SolaScriptura_
> I found it interesting that though (like you mention) he is often credited with "inventing" predestination, he actually credits the teaching of Cyprian with correcting his early views (which diminished sovereign grace). Additionally, he often cites Ambrose as well...



Fascinating, and wonderful! What are some of these quotes? Where can I find them . . . somewhere in my set of Ante-Nicene Fathers? 

I would very much appreciate any guidance here . . . I have a cousin to whom I would *love* to show some pre-Augustinian predestination quotes.


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## LadyCalvinist (Oct 1, 2005)

Hello I'm new. There is a book by B.B. Warfield entitled Calvin and Augustine. It was published by P&R. I hope that helps you.


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## SRoper (Oct 1, 2005)

Welcome to the board, Diane.


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## SolaScriptura (Oct 1, 2005)

> _Originally posted by biblelighthouse_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by SolaScriptura_
> ...



Well, Augustine's writings are laced with references to Cyprian and Ambrose. However, two very potent passages are:
In Ch 7 of A Treatise on the Predestination of the Saints, Augustine explains how he was corrected by Cyprian and led to affirm God's sovereign grace because of him.

Perhaps the most poignant passage I've come across is chapter 49 of A TREATISE ON THE GIFT OF PERSEVERANCE. He cites Cyprian, Ambrose & Gregory!


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## SolaScriptura (Oct 1, 2005)

> _Originally posted by DTK_
> There are some who contend that Augustine held to what they call "predestination to grace" rather than "predestination to glory." In other words, they come to the point where they can't deny that he held to a "form" of predestination, but they explain that what he meant by predestination was that the elect are predestined only to be in a state of grace, from which they may or may not fall away before death. Such a subject would seem to fall within the parameters of Augustine and predestination.
> 
> Blessings,
> DTK



The next time you hear someone say that, have them check out his A TREATISE ON THE GIFT OF PERSEVERANCE. He directly, clearly, and thoroughly repudiates that notion.


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## DTK (Oct 1, 2005)

> The next time you hear someone say that, have them check out his A TREATISE ON THE GIFT OF PERSEVERANCE. He directly, clearly, and thoroughly repudiates that notion.


Well, I know that, but you were asking for ideas...

Blessings to you on your forth-coming paper,
DTK


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