# Versus Mormonistic "KJV Only"ism



## steven-nemes (Feb 8, 2009)

I was visited by Mormon missionairies on Friday and I invited them to lunch and discussion at a restaurant this coming Friday. I hope to just ask a few questions, maybe emphasize the inconsitency between the Christian Bible and their book (for example, I read a passage they pointed me to in 3 Nephi (which I am not sure I fully understand who exactly these "Nephites" are, but I am guessing they are Gentiles) which states that the Jesus appeared to these people post-resurrection, and they were able to identify him based on the prophecies of the past of their people; but Romans teaches that the oracles of God were given to the Jews, and because they are not Jews, arguing from the Christian Bible, they could not have received prophecy from God (--if my argument is invalid or needs some work, please do tell me!)). They told me that the Mormons only accept the King James version of the Bible, however--is there any particular line of reasoning in this? I don't ask that you give me counter-arguments, I'd prefer to think them up myself, but if you'd like, go ahead!

Thank you, and pray that I might give a good case against Mormonism and for true Christianity!


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## Grymir (Feb 8, 2009)

They use the KJV as it is 'correctly translated' in their eyes. When something doesn't agree with what their doctrine teaches, that part was not translated correctly.


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## InevitablyReformed (Feb 8, 2009)

steven-nemes said:


> I was visited by Mormon missionairies on Friday and I invited them to lunch and discussion at a restaurant this coming Friday. I hope to just ask a few questions, maybe emphasize the inconsitency between the Christian Bible and their book (for example, I read a passage they pointed me to in 3 Nephi (which I am not sure I fully understand who exactly these "Nephites" are, but I am guessing they are Gentiles) which states that the Jesus appeared to these people post-resurrection, and they were able to identify him based on the prophecies of the past of their people; but Romans teaches that the oracles of God were given to the Jews, and because they are not Jews, arguing from the Christian Bible, they could not have received prophecy from God (--if my argument is invalid or needs some work, please do tell me!)). They told me that the Mormons only accept the King James version of the Bible, however--is there any particular line of reasoning in this? I don't ask that you give me counter-arguments, I'd prefer to think them up myself, but if you'd like, go ahead!
> 
> Thank you, and pray that I might give a good case against Mormonism and for true Christianity!



I believe they will try to tell you that the Nephites ARE Jews; they are the Jews that came to the Americas thousands of years ago. Before you talk to them you should visit carm.org and get some basics down on what they believe. I will be praying for you.


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## toddpedlar (Feb 8, 2009)

InevitablyReformed said:


> steven-nemes said:
> 
> 
> > I was visited by Mormon missionairies on Friday and I invited them to lunch and discussion at a restaurant this coming Friday. I hope to just ask a few questions, maybe emphasize the inconsitency between the Christian Bible and their book (for example, I read a passage they pointed me to in 3 Nephi (which I am not sure I fully understand who exactly these "Nephites" are, but I am guessing they are Gentiles) which states that the Jesus appeared to these people post-resurrection, and they were able to identify him based on the prophecies of the past of their people; but Romans teaches that the oracles of God were given to the Jews, and because they are not Jews, arguing from the Christian Bible, they could not have received prophecy from God (--if my argument is invalid or needs some work, please do tell me!)). They told me that the Mormons only accept the King James version of the Bible, however--is there any particular line of reasoning in this? I don't ask that you give me counter-arguments, I'd prefer to think them up myself, but if you'd like, go ahead!
> ...



That's exactly what they will say. According to their story, the Nephites are Jews who left Jerusalem immediately prior to the Babylonian exile, and settled in North America in 589 BC.


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## kvanlaan (Feb 8, 2009)

Yep, they're an interesting bunch to tangle with, and the deeper you get, the more you think "are you serious? do you honestly believe this?" It seems fairly innocuous at first blush, but once you've been sucked in, the underlying theology is truly bizzarre.

The Book of Mormon is the product of Joseph Smith staring at a stone in the bottom of his hat, and the "Inspired" version of the KJV is not much better. Again, whatever could not be shoehorned into their theology was translated "incorrectly" and changed. Add to that almost 4,000 changes to the Book of Mormon since it was written, and you've got a 'living' document of a whole other sort. It was only in the 70's that the leadership got a 'revelation' that blacks were now able to become Mormons; they had previously been unsuitable as members, as their black skin showed a judgment against their sin. :cuckoo:

The best sites to investigate are those written by ex-Mormons. They are far and away the most damning.


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## john_Mark (Feb 8, 2009)

There are some free videos you can watch online such as "The Bible vs. The Book of Mormon." You can watch here. This might help give you more insight.

Also, check out Mormon Research Ministries and James White has some good information too.

I grew up RLDS which is not quite LDS, but close. I've witnessed to certain members of my family and they are tough to even reason with on simple things.


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## he beholds (Feb 8, 2009)

Just wondering, are you planning on debating whether KJV is the only proper Bible? I'd personally bring my KJV along and save that debate for the PB.


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## steven-nemes (Feb 9, 2009)

he beholds said:


> Just wondering, are you planning on debating whether KJV is the only proper Bible? I'd personally bring my KJV along and save that debate for the PB.



No I don't plan on debating KJV. I hate reading the KJV, though, so I figure I could just end that matter quickly and move on to arguing from my ESV, but I guess it wont' be so easy...


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## matthew11v25 (Feb 9, 2009)

Whether or not you use the KJV (I do not), I would strongly recommend using one when speaking with Mormons. You can even explain that you are doing this to level the playing field eventhough you use a different translation. You can have fun arguing translation issues with mormons but you are not going to get anywhere fast. I believe that Reformed Christians are at an advantage of getting to/and arguing core issues with Mormons (i.e. salvation and scripture authority). 

The only time I have seen Mormons break down and cry was when my mentor proved their faith was built on works...so make it personal! 

I have taken Anthropology classes on Latin America, etc, and the issue of Mormonism was always a burden for my EXTREMELY liberal professors. My professors complained how whenever artifacts were found, Mormon anthropologist/archaelogists would rush to the scene to interpret the evidence then publish it out of context. I have read some of their stuff...it is true!

I would also avoid going deep into the Nephite issue unless you are confident in arguing it...it truly is ridiculous and you will get bogged down. It is fascinating to read (like Lord of the Rings) though when you have the time...they really try hard (too hard) to make the history work.


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## Quickened (Feb 9, 2009)

praying for you brother!


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## calgal (Feb 9, 2009)

The minute you disagree with them, you may see a difference in how they behave towards you. The LDS tend to work off a script and anything that deviates confuses the heck out of them. Don't bother with the KJV: there is so much more that is wrong with their American Gnostic beliefs that you can pin them down on.  Their "testimonies" are built on emotion, guilt and manipulation. So says this exmo.


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## nicnap (Feb 9, 2009)

steven-nemes said:


> I was visited by Mormon missionairies on Friday and I invited them to lunch and discussion at a restaurant this coming Friday. I hope to just ask a few questions, maybe emphasize the inconsitency between the Christian Bible and their book (for example, I read a passage they pointed me to in 3 Nephi (which I am not sure I fully understand who exactly these "Nephites" are, but I am guessing they are Gentiles) which states that the Jesus appeared to these people post-resurrection, and they were able to identify him based on the prophecies of the past of their people; but Romans teaches that the oracles of God were given to the Jews, and because they are not Jews, arguing from the Christian Bible, they could not have received prophecy from God (--if my argument is invalid or needs some work, please do tell me!)). They told me that the Mormons only accept the King James version of the Bible, however--is there any particular line of reasoning in this? I don't ask that you give me counter-arguments, I'd prefer to think them up myself, but if you'd like, go ahead!
> 
> Thank you, and pray that I might give a good case against Mormonism and for true Christianity!



I would have them turn to Genesis 3. Ask them what it means. Then ask them, "If it was a sin for Adam and Eve to want to be god, why in your estimation is it acceptable now?" 

(I usually ask that to stir the pot.)


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## KMK (Feb 9, 2009)

If they try to get 'cozy' with you, remember 2 John 1:10 "If there come any unto you, and bring not this doctrine, receive him not into [your] house, neither bid him God speed:"



> We should have nothing to do with those who defend perverse doctrine. Geneva Bible Notes


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## Pilgrim (Feb 10, 2009)

john_Mark said:


> There are some free videos you can watch online such as "The Bible vs. The Book of Mormon." You can watch here. This might help give you more insight.
> 
> Also, check out Mormon Research Ministries and James White has some good information too.
> 
> I grew up RLDS which is not quite LDS, but close. I've witnessed to certain members of my family and they are tough to even reason with on simple things.



The Utah Lighthouse Ministry is another site you may find helpful. 
http://www.utlm.org/


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## steven-nemes (Feb 10, 2009)

What is the preferred or proper "battle plan", then? Should I press them to try and defend some Mormon ideas, or should I just work on establishing that Christianity and Mormonism are at odds with each other and that I won't consider dropping Christianity until I hear some reasons, or what?


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