# Nature is my Church!



## Sonoftheday (Nov 23, 2007)

(This is not my belief however I am going to represent a belief that has been presented to me by at least 2 individuals to see how you would respond.)There are many sundays whenever the weather is nice that I dont go to church because my family goes on camping trips. But I worship God while I'm in the forest by looking at the beautiful nature that God created. Whenever I see nature like this I know there has to be a creator and I praise him for it.


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## Megaloo (Nov 23, 2007)

Stinkin' tree huggers!


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## Richard King (Nov 23, 2007)

I get this on a certain level.
I also love being outdoors. 
And any agrarian type probably is aware of God more regularly than people in their
little pink houses and cubicles 
BUT I would really REALLY caution people who take this approach that the danger is you could end up 
worshipping the creation rather than the Creator. 

There is something to be said for completely setting your self and what feels exhilarating aside 
and out of duty, and reverence, 
and true piety just worshipping God without distraction.

Then there is scripture about NOT forsaking the gathering together of the fellow believers. 
AND somebody at that gathering may need you more than the rocks and trees and stars do.


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## Dieter Schneider (Nov 24, 2007)

Sonoftheday said:


> (This is not my belief however I am going to represent a belief that has been presented to me by at least 2 individuals to see how you would respond.)There are many sundays whenever the weather is nice that I dont go to church because my family goes on camping trips. But I worship God while I'm in the forest by looking at the beautiful nature that God created. Whenever I see nature like this I know there has to be a creator and I praise him for it.



Well - why did the Holy Spirit fail to mention it? Christians 'want' to go to Church - it's a joyful duty, mixed with gratitude and a desire to hear God speak to us through His Word. 
Why would one wish to spend eternity with God in heaven if one is not prepared to spend an hour with Him on earth? 
If all had the same attitude we would all end up being hermits.Or fair-weather Christians. How one's theology is to be shaped by the weather is surely disturbing. 
Why a Christian would wish to give the impression that the attendance on the means of grace is an intolerable burden I fail to understand.


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## thisistim (Dec 20, 2007)

did they actually say that "nature is my church?"

because i think there would be a big difference between them saying that and going on an occasional camping trip with the family and appreciating creation.


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## Davidius (Dec 20, 2007)

thisistim said:


> did they actually say that "nature is my church?"
> 
> because i think there would be a big difference between them saying that and going on an occasional camping trip with the family.



This is what they said: 


> There are many sundays whenever the weather is nice that I dont go to church because my family goes on camping trips.



Many Sundays...
Whenever the weather is nice...

I appreciate you wanting to give them the benefit of the doubt but it doesn't sound like "occasional camping trips" is what he's talking about.


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## panta dokimazete (Dec 20, 2007)

well - first off, there is a fundamental error to their rationale:

the "church" is the fellowship, not the building...

Hebrews 10:25 

25Let us not give up meeting together, as some are in the habit of doing, but let us encourage one another—and all the more as you see the Day approaching.

so, to truly worship in spirit and truth in the "church", you must be *with* the church!


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## thisistim (Dec 20, 2007)

true. 'many sundays' conveys that he meant...well, many sundays. 

when you participation in Christ body is repeatedly trumped by your vacation plans...there's quite a problem.

i'm reminded of a family i know...one of them is a music minister and the rest is the band. they have a house at the beach...and during the summer/early fall you can count on it that they'll be out 2 sundays out of every month. the best part is when they call on saturday evening to say that they won't be there. talk about dedication!


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## Sonoftheday (Dec 20, 2007)

By many Sundays they mean pretty much anytime the weather is good, well one of the people who has said this to me said that if the weather is good for fishing he wont be on a pew worshipping God but in his bass boat worshipping God.

"Nature is my Church" was just the catchy title I thought would catch peoples attention and have them to comment. I do not think that these people, or at least not all of the many people who have said such comments to me, would actually say that nature takes the place of church completly, however they seem to be presenting this idea that which takes place in the congregational worship service is no different than what happens everywhere else.

I'm searching my brain right now because I just heard a clip that is so relevant to this discussion yesterday. I cant remember if it was Micheal Horton of the White Horse Inn, or Gene Cook of the Narrow Mind. But addressing this comment they said something like "You can look at the Grand Canyon and see God, but all youre going to see is the God's wrath upon you, to see the mercy and grace you need you have to look to the gospel." The gospel is preached every week in a good church, and as christians we need to hear the gospel constantly and have our focus shifted towards it. The gospel is not only the means used by the Holy spirit to regenerate us, but also the means used to fuel us for his good works.


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## Davidius (Dec 20, 2007)

Sonoftheday said:


> I'm searching my brain right now because I just heard a clip that is so relevant to this discussion yesterday. I cant remember if it was Micheal Horton of the White Horse Inn, or Gene Cook of the Narrow Mind. But addressing this comment they said something like "You can look at the Grand Canyon and see God, but all youre going to see is the God's wrath upon you, to see the mercy and grace you need you have to look to the gospel." The gospel is preached every week in a good church, and as christians we need to hear the gospel constantly and have our focus shifted towards it. The gospel is not only the means used by the Holy spirit to regenerate us, but also the means used to fuel us for his good works.



I remember that discussion. It's from the White Horse Inn...I think from one of the late November episodes or early December.


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## a mere housewife (Dec 20, 2007)

There is not only the danger of worshipping the creature more than the Creator but of mistaking the Creator. Your friend assumes that nature is an adequate revelation of God, and that we are capable of comprehending that revelation and responding to it appropriately on our own terms. Both things are false: nature shares in the curse of man's sin and cannot adequately reveal God, and we make no proper responses to Him naturally. Even many of the pagans knew that there was one Creator god, and worshiped him as such. But because they were worshipping an inadequate revelation with inadequate responses, their worship was idolatrous. God has revealed Himself to fallen man in His infallible Word, in Christ; and He has revealed the only adequate response from fallen man to that: He has revealed the worship that is acceptable to Him and it is centered around Christ, the Word. We cannot approach the Creator except by the Redeemer, and except by the appointed means of God's grace to us in the covenant of grace. If we choose to make a different response than the one He has outlined thinking it won't really matter to Him and that we'll be more in tune with Him in our own way, we're only proving that we are natural idolaters, and what we've learned about Him from nature is totally inadequate.

I understand the feelings very, very well, though. Nature is stupendous: I would even disagree that the beauty of God's benevolence is not also displayed there. But the revelation of God in Christ is even more stupendous; the means of grace are designed to help us to see Christ. It sounds like your friend may be more easily excited about the revelation of God as Creator than of God as Redeemer right now. It's easy to do because nature immediately appeals to us in a fully sensible way (we have all the feelings we think we should have in worshipping God, but again if this is not according to His own revelation of Who He is and what He accepts, it's quite worthless: the pagans had grand feelings and thoughts about god also): but sometimes we aren't taught properly what to look for in the means of grace, we aren't taught to be looking for Christ. That can indeed be very dull.


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## Pergamum (Dec 20, 2007)

I loved to use this phrase as a teenager. 


But, it's not much of a church when animals eat their babies and creatures show their fallenness and hunt and kill one another. Nature is red in tooth and claw.


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## Iconoclast (Dec 21, 2007)

> By many Sundays they mean pretty much anytime the weather is good, well one of the people who has said this to me said that if the weather is good for fishing he wont be on a pew worshipping God but in his bass boat worshipping God.


Iam not sure if the image will post but it reminds me of this-

Was this the god he was speaking about

Search for pictures of the Dagon or Enki priests and you'll find they wore fish costumes with fish head hats similar to today's miter. The fish symbol Christians use today is literally one of the many marks of the beast Dagon. 
Here we see carvings and diagrams of Dagon priests and their fish head hats along side the Pope with his similar fish head hat holding the crooked cross of Mithra. The carving on the left shows the Dagon priests sprinkling holy water.


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## Zenas (Dec 21, 2007)

To not forsake the Sabbath day, to keep it Holy, is to keep it set apart. It is to forego what you wish to do, and submit and worship God in the manner in which He has commanded.

While it may be pleasing to us to worship God in a way that we see fit, the Sovereign is not so amused, as He has revealed in Scripture. Did He not slay those two who offered up profane fire? Surely they wished to worship in the manner that they saw fit, but this is not what God delighted in. They knew the rules, but thought that they knew a better way. They were disciplined or punished, depending on their status before Him.

This self-centered worship is open rebellion; it is claiming that God's ways are not the only ways, that we have a better way than His. Such an idea should be abhorrent to the believer who delights in the ways of God. Surmising that on can "go to church" on their own terms is a dangerous way of thinking, as it holds not God's edict in reverent esteem, but rather places it on the par, or even in subjection to our own whims and desires.


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