# Dangerous to find an all-encompassing theme in the Bible?



## RamistThomist (Mar 11, 2005)

I was reading an old thread, Meta-Story, and was wondering if it is proper (or dangerous) to find a "central doctrine" in the Bible, like Luther and Justification. Steve Wilkins (and I am not debating this, just using it as an example) spoke of the Covenant as the central theme of the Bible.

Is it okay to find a key doctrine in the Bible that can be used as "hermenuetical keys"? I know a lot of people are cautious about doing this because it lends itself to imbalance (think, Karl Barth and the "Word" of God, modern day "covenantal-nomism," etc.). In the above mentioned thread, Webmaster suggested the glory of God from Edwards's book (which I have read and profited, btw). However, that response was geared to a meta-narrative question. 

In other contexts here are some answers that have been given to this question (I got the idea from Millard Erickson's systematic theology. Some of the ideas below will be taken from him):

1) Justification by Faith alone, obviously--Luther.

2) Proclamation that Christ is presently Lord and King--N.T. Wright and others

3) Covenant--Federal Vision

4) Christ as the "Word of God"--Karl Barth

5) The Greatness of God--Millard Erickson

Any thoughts


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## RamistThomist (Mar 11, 2005)

I thought about editing my title for clarity. I do not mean to suggest that it is wrong to find an hermeneutical key for Scripture, quite the opposite actually.


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## SolaScriptura (Mar 11, 2005)

When I took OT Theology with Dr. Daniel Block he had us read "God's Design" by Elmer Martens. (I highly recommend this book. Even if one disagrees with his starting point, his book is nonetheless a very profitable read.)

Anyway, he argues that Ex. 5:22-6:8 provides us with the first complete statement of God's design. This design of God is broken into four components:1) Deliverance, 2) Community, 3) Knowledge of God, 4) Abundant Life.
I think that these categories easily transfer to the NT.


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## Puritanhead (Mar 11, 2005)

6) God's contempt of man-centered religion/doctrine (i.e. Phariseeism, Catholicism, Arminianism, legalism, etc.)


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## heartoflesh (Mar 11, 2005)

7) _Purpose-Driven Eschatology_


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## RamistThomist (Mar 11, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Rick Larson_
> 7) _Purpose-Driven Eschatology_



That might not be a bad idea when we realize that one's idea of eschatology has consequences. If we view that God will fulfill all his Covenant Promises to his people, then that shapes the way we view the Bible. 

However, I don't know if eschatology should be THE hermenuetical key, however important it may be.


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## heartoflesh (Mar 12, 2005)

> That might not be a bad idea when we realize that one's idea of eschatology has consequences. If we view that God will fulfill all his Covenant Promises to his people, then that shapes the way we view the Bible.




Yeah, and when you think that all _eshatology_ really is is the story of the Bible-- it could make sense. And it's better than a ridiculous, insane, (...I didn't say dispensational did I?.....) eschatology. But it's probably better as a joke than a serious contender-- unless Rick Warren reads this and get's any ideas.


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## Robin (Mar 12, 2005)

We just had a class on the theme of the Bible - "The Kingdom." Wow....it really helped a lot....like having the picture-box-top for a huge 5,000 piece puzzle.

Lee Irons taught it - based on the Meredith Kline book "The Structure of Biblical Authority." The MP3's of this class are free to download:

http://www.upper-register.com/mp3.html

The theme of "the Kingdom" unfolds the meaning of Covenant - especially how it relates to ancient Middle Eastern suzerainty treaties. Fascinating... and yes...this includes the eschatalogical nature of the whole of Scripture...so avoiding eschatology is impossible...because it is in the Text throughout - and helps clarify all those weird apocalyptic references to "smoke; the moon turning to blood; spewing out of mouths; eating scrolls; dragons, etc."

Eschatology drives theology...so this is why if we don't nail the eschatology of Scripture (how it is IN the Text) the theology goes off in the ditch.

Sorry to ramble...another by-product of this class was learning about Adam's covenantal "viceroyship" as a "lesser-king" and how his obligation to the "Greater-Suzerain-Creator, King" worked. Believe it or not...this tightened my understanding of justification immensely.

If anyone cares...I can demonstrate how the Kingdom is the theme....and it does comport with the whole of Scripture - especially Christ's teaching and goal.

It's pretty beefy...

R.


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## RamistThomist (Mar 12, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Robin_
> We just had a class on the theme of the Bible - "The Kingdom." Wow....it really helped a lot....like having the picture-box-top for a huge 5,000 piece puzzle.
> 
> Lee Irons taught it - based on the Meredith Kline book "The Structure of Biblical Authority." The MP3's of this class are free to download:
> ...



I would love to see that. Start another thread or email me if you would like. Thanks


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## nonconformist (Apr 29, 2005)

> Eschatology drives theology...so this is why if we don't nail the eschatology of Scripture (how it is IN the Text) the theology goes off in the ditch.


 that is so true.that would be a cool thread to start


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## LawrenceU (Apr 30, 2005)

Not to be trite, but how about:

GOD


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## nonconformist (Apr 30, 2005)

> Not to be trite, but how about: GOD


 good answer,now i feel foolish


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## Puritan Sailor (Apr 30, 2005)

Perhaps, because our God is so big, you will find numerous themes throughout the Bible, both for His own glory, and for our own understanding of Him. I don't think it's wrong to identify a theme. I do think it may be wrong to create your own theme and impose it, or to wrongly carry over a theme into a text which may not apply. But themes themselves help us to put together alot of peices. I personally love the themes of covenant theology and it's historical development and self-interpretation in Scripture, along with the Adam/Christ parallel.


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## nonconformist (Apr 30, 2005)

> Perhaps, because our God is so big, you will find numerous themes throughout the Bible


 good point.talk about unsearchable.he is awsome


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## JohnStevenson (May 28, 2005)

> _Originally posted by LawrenceU_
> Not to be trite, but how about:
> 
> GOD


To break that down a bit, I would say that the big idea in the OT is that Yahweh is Lord.
And the big idea in the NT is that Jesus is Lord.


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## Robin (May 29, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> I was reading an old thread, Meta-Story, and was wondering if it is proper (or dangerous) to find a "central doctrine" in the Bible, like Luther and Justification. Steve Wilkins (and I am not debating this, just using it as an example) spoke of the Covenant as the central theme of the Bible.
> 
> Is it okay to find a key doctrine in the Bible that can be used as "hermenuetical keys"? I know a lot of people are cautious about doing this because it lends itself to imbalance (think, Karl Barth and the "Word" of God, modern day "covenantal-nomism," etc.). In the above mentioned thread, Webmaster suggested the glory of God from Edwards's book (which I have read and profited, btw). However, that response was geared to a meta-narrative question.
> ...



The Kingdom - Geerhardos Vos, Meredith Kline

Robin


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## Arch2k (May 29, 2005)

WSC
Question 3. What do the Scriptures principally teach?
Answer. The Scriptures principally teach what man is to believe concerning God, and what duty God requires of man.


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## RamistThomist (May 29, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Jeff_Bartel_
> WSC
> Question 3. What do the Scriptures principally teach?
> Answer. The Scriptures principally teach what man is to believe concerning God, and what duty God requires of man.



I agree fully. How would we unify these into one theme?


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## Arch2k (May 29, 2005)

> _Originally posted by Draught Horse_
> 
> 
> > _Originally posted by Jeff_Bartel_
> ...



Personally, if one is to generalize the scriptures into one theme, then the theme will have to be just as general. The only thing that can come to mind is the glory of God. Everything exists to glorify him. That is the ultimate purpose of EVERYTHING, and the ultimate theme of the scriptures. 

Rom 11:36 For from him and through him and to him are all things. To him be glory forever. Amen.


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## BobVigneault (May 29, 2005)

How to be filthy rich! - Creflo Dollar


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## Arch2k (May 29, 2005)




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## RamistThomist (May 29, 2005)

> Personally, if one is to generalize the scriptures into one theme, then the theme will have to be just as general.



Correct. But I was thinking "unify," not generalize. But I am just on a thinking spree at the moment. I might write a book trying to answer my question.


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## JohnV (May 29, 2005)

Jacob:

I don't think it is wrong to get as much as one can get out of a theme. It is wrong, I would think, to limit Scripture to that, though. There are many such themes that need to be explored by the searching mind. And there is more to them than has been written about. Who can plumb the depths of truth, even narrowed down to one subject or topic? It seems to me the problem with some theme-followers is that they cut themselves off from Scripture in other areas. They need a whole-Scripture base that they may not veer from. 

That's what divides the good from the bad. When one theoretic starts to overshadow the whole Bible, then that is reason it no longer is Biblical. We have to read the Word, but not judge it by our own standards. The Bible is like a many-faceted gemstone, and is infallible in all the glory and beauty that can be observed. But its shape remains the same, and has not changed in all the history of the Church.


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## RamistThomist (May 29, 2005)

> _Originally posted by JohnV_
> Jacob:
> 
> I don't think it is wrong to get as much as one can get out of a theme. It is wrong, I would think, to limit Scripture to that, though. There are many such themes that need to be explored by the searching mind. And there is more to them than has been written about. Who can plumb the depths of truth, even narrowed down to one subject or topic? It seems to me the problem with some theme-followers is that they cut themselves off from Scripture in other areas. They need a whole-Scripture base that they may not veer from.
> ...



I agree. I guess it boils down to the problem of the one and the many. I know the dangers inherent in such a scheme, but I do believe some good can be gleaned in a limited study. oh well


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## Robin (May 30, 2005)

Jacob,

I heartily agree with John's post....and yet, I also think it meaningful to realize that the Bible is a story....the whole book means something particular - overall. God is revealing His Story in it. As John reminds, the revelation has never changed. We must discover what is already there.

An example: to focus upon Matthew's account first, is to "walk in on the middle of the movie", so to speak. The beginning of The Story is in Genesis and travels through to the end: Revelation. Matthew would be the middle.

One hint that might help - and is certainly fascinating....start from Genesis and begin to find all the phrases "I will be your/their God and you/they shall be my people." A recurring theme - sometimes worded differently - this is connected to my former hint that (at least, I agree with) the Scriptures are telling of God's Kingdom coming - creation restored by the Return of the King.



Robin

[Edited on 5-31-2005 by Robin]


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