# How do I know if i am mourning right?



## Matthew1344 (May 11, 2016)

“Blessed are those who mourn, for they shall be comforted." (Matthew 5:4 ESV)

What does it look like to morn over your sin and at the same time have in mind Romans 8:1?

My friends at starbucks were talking about how we should always walk in victory as Christians, and live in Romans 8. They said we should never go back to Romans 6 "Wretched man that I am", and walk there. 

They were older than me and have been Christian for (20+)-(60+) years, so i didn't challenge them too much on this. I wanted to just think over it for a bit and go back to them. Didn't want to talk to quick and look silly haha. 

Im just not sure if you are not supposed to go through times of being hit by the truck called "Romans 6:Wretched Man that I Am". I think God even puts you right in the middle of the road so to be sure that you get smashed for your good and his glory. 

After you get hit with this, then the Lord brings you to morn over your sin that you have sinned against him. As Christians there is only one place to go at this point and that is to Christ on the cross. We know that in him we are forgiven and that he has already put away that sin. Now, and only after reflection on Christ, can you get up with even more assurance of the victory in Christ than you had before, and know that there is now no condemnation in Christ, even for people like us "the wretched sinners".

So I say that to ask, how do we know in our time of morning it is a good morning like the one Jesus advocates for in Matt 5 and not a morning that when done is attesting that Christ's sacrifice isn't enough for us and that we must go into a deep "work depression" to make ourselves acceptable to God?

Let me know if this doesn't make since. It is 12:48 am here and I'm a little tired ha


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## Jack K (May 11, 2016)

Matt:

I think you've actually brought up most of the elements that pertain to your question. Maybe a framework for putting them together is all that's missing.

Keep in mind that Mat. 5:4 says those who mourn are blessed and will be comforted. Jesus is not speaking of a hopeless sort of mourning, nor of morbid "beating yourself up." He is most likely speaking of the sorrow for sin that accompanies true repentance. This is a godly sorrow that brings life, not a worldly sorrow that leads to death (2 Cor. 7:10). Within that godly sorrow there is joy and comfort because those who repent surely are forgiven and no longer condemned by God. So Mat. 5:4 is not an instruction to be filled with gloom. It is an encouragement that sorrow for sin leads to life.

Of course, "no condemnation" is only part of the story when it comes to our sin problem. Having been eternally forgiven and declared righteous, we still are eager to grow in holiness. So a godly man will still feel sorrow for sin daily. Again, this is a sorrow that leads to joy and life. It shows we truly are God's children. And it is never without hope. The sorrow itself testifies that God is at work in us. He is perfecting us in his good time, and glory awaits. So be filled with joy, even amid the sorrow for sin.

I don't believe the concern over how much to mourn versus how much to feel victorious is quite the best way to think. Provided the mourning is a godly sorrow, mourning and a sense of victory actually advance together in a believer's life. As we grow as believers, we increase our awareness of sin and our sorrow over sin and at the same time also increase our joy in the victory we have in Christ. They happen together, says Mat. 5:4. And of the two, victory always has the last word, because it is our final destiny. Mourning will cease one day and our joy will be complete.

Is that helpful and does it make sense (I'm writing while sleep-deprived and on medication tonight)? Do you understand the difference between godly sorrow and worldly sorrow? That difference is critical and I could go further into that after getting some rest.


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## Matthew1344 (May 11, 2016)

Thanks so much for your time and response! 


Jack K said:


> I don't believe the concern over how much to mourn versus how much to feel victorious is quite the best way to think. Provided the mourning is a godly sorrow, mourning and a sense of victory actually advance together in a believer's life. As we grow as believers, we increase our awareness of sin and our sorrow over sin and at the same time also increase our joy in the victory we have in Christ. They happen together, says Mat. 5:4. And of the two, victory always has the last word, because it is our final destiny. Mourning will cease one day and our joy will be complete.


I really enjoyed this paragraph. 

And if it is not too much, i would really appreciate more on what worldly sorrow is. Now that i think about it, I'm not too sure that i have that understood.


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## Contra_Mundum (May 11, 2016)

2Cor.7:10 "For godly sorrow worketh repentance to salvation not to be repented of: but the *sorrow of the world* worketh death."

Calvin, _loc.cit._10. _Sorrow according to God._ In the first place, in order to understand what is meant by this clause "according to God," we must observe the contrast, for the sorrow that is according to God he contrasts with the sorrow of the world. Let us now take, also, the contrast between two kinds of joy. The joy of the world is, when men foolishly, and without the fear of the Lord, exult in vanity, that is, in the world, and, intoxicated with a transient felicity, look no higher than the earth. The joy that is according to God is, when men place all their happiness in God, and take satisfaction in His grace, and show this by contempt of the world, using earthly prosperity as if they used it not, and joyful in the midst of adversity.

Accordingly, the sorrow of the world is, when men despond in consequence of earthly afflictions, and are overwhelmed with grief; while sorrow according to God is that which has an eye to God, while they reckon it the one misery—to have lost the favor of God; when, impressed with fear of His judgment, they mourn over their sins. This sorrow Paul makes the cause and origin of repentance. This is carefully to be observed, for unless the sinner be dissatisfied with himself, detest his manner of life, and be thoroughly grieved from an apprehension of sin, he will never betake himself to the Lord. On the other hand, it is impossible for a man to experience a sorrow of this kind, without its giving birth to a new heart. Hence repentance takes its rise in grief, for the reason that I have mentioned—because no one can return to the right way, but the man who hates sin; but where hatred of sin is, there is self-dissatisfaction and grief.

There is, however, a beautiful allusion here to the term repentance, when he says—"not to be repented of;" for however unpleasant the thing is at first taste, it renders itself desirable by its usefulness. The epithet, it is true, might apply to the term salvation, equally as to that of repentance; but it appears to me to suit better with the term repentance “We are taught by the result itself, that grief ought not to be painful to us, or distressing. In like manner, although repentance contains in it some degree of bitterness, if, is spoken of as 'not to be repented of' on account of the precious and pleasant fruit which it produces.”

_To salvation._ Paul seems to make repentance the ground of salvation. Were it so, it would follow, that we are justified by works. I answer, that we must observe what Paul here treats of, for he is not inquiring as to the ground of salvation, but simply commending repentance from the fruit which it produces, he says that it is like a way by which we arrive at salvation. Nor is it without good reason; for Christ calls us by way of free favor, but it is to repentance. (Mt.9:13.) God by way of free favor pardons our sins, but only when we renounce them. Nay more, God accomplishes in us at one and the same time two things: being renewed by repentance, we are delivered from the bondage of our sins; and, being justified by faith, we are delivered also from the curse of our sins.

They are, therefore, inseparable fruits of grace, and, in consequence of their invariable connection, repentance may with fitness and propriety be represented as an introduction to salvation, but in this way of speaking of it, it is represented as an effect rather than as a cause. These are not refinements for the purpose of evasion, but a true and simple solution, for, while Scripture teaches us that we never obtain forgiveness of sins without repentance, it represents at the same time, in a variety of passages, the mercy of God alone as the ground of our obtaining it.​


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## Miss Marple (May 11, 2016)

I always thought the mourning referred to was not for sin necessarily but for all the stuff that makes us sad. I guess not?


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## Jack K (May 11, 2016)

Calvin is good, isn't he?

Godly sorrow is marked by repentance and faith. It is part of turning to Christ. This is why it leads to life. Worldly sorrow has none of this and leads only to death. It ends in despair.

It's good to grieve over our sin. But sometimes we can grieve over sin and our grieving is still just worldly sorrow. An example of this is Judas after he betrayed Jesus. Judas felt horrible about what he had done. He realized his sin, admitted it, and even tried to return the guilt-inducing payment he'd received. But none of that self-loathing led to life. Rather it led, quite literally, to death.

Despite all the pain he felt, Judas never turned to Christ in true repentance and faith. He was sorry for the consequences of his sin. He was sorry about how guilty it made him feel. He was disgusted at how he, who thought himself superior, was proven a moral failure. But he never repented of the superior attitude he'd had toward Jesus, nor did he humble himself and seek forgiveness. His sorrow was a worldly sorrow. No good came out of it.

But imagine what his story might have been had he turned to Christ. He would still have had deep, deep sorrow over the horrible sin he committed. But he also would have had unspeakable, surprising joy. What improbable victory! What stunning mercy, that the Lord he betrayed would forgive even him! And what eternal confidence, to see that even his cold heart was growing warm! This is where godly sorrow leads.


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