# Has the PCA ruled on ladies reading scripture in Sunday worship?



## earl40 (Aug 23, 2016)

I ask because it was announced last Sunday we are soon to start this, and if it has been ruled by the GA it is OK I shall not bring up this with my session.


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## Edward (Aug 23, 2016)

It is a not uncommon practice in the PCA. I expect the study commission to fully authorize, if not recommend it, in their report to the GA.


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## earl40 (Aug 23, 2016)

Edward said:


> It is a not uncommon practice in the PCA. I expect the study commission to fully authorize, if not recommend it, in their report to the GA.



So it is a current issue then?


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## StephenG (Aug 23, 2016)

earl40 said:


> Originally Posted by Edward
> It is a not uncommon practice in the PCA. I expect the study commission to fully authorize, if not recommend it, in their report to the GA.
> So it is a current issue then?


It's been going on in the PCA for quite a while I think (though not in every Presbytery). I believe the study commission Edward speaks of is one that will report to the GA concerning ordination of women.


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## Edward (Aug 23, 2016)

StephenG said:


> I believe the study commission Edward speaks of is one that will report to the GA concerning ordination of women.



While ordination of women generally, and ordination of women to the diaconate, are the issues that most of us have focused on, they certainly could, if they wished, delve into other issues such as the one which is the subject of this thread, under tha mandate of of studying the " issue of women serving in the ministry of the church".


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## Edward (Aug 23, 2016)

earl40 said:


> So it is a current issue then?



I would suggest it is not a denominational issue at all, except to the small minority of more confessional men in the denomination.


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## BGF (Aug 23, 2016)

Following are excerpts from three General Assemblies that deal with the question of prayer and scripture reading by women in a worship service.

From the minutes of the 25th GA (1997)

49 c. Be approved with exceptions of substance stated below:

Exception: April 16, 1996: The worship service for the purpose of organizing a church and installing its pastor included a lady who “led one congregation in the opening prayer” and another lady who “read passages of Scripture” prior to the sermon. (Commissioners Report M C - 6).


We see that the Committee on Review of Presbytery Records cited an exception of substance to the Southern Florida Presbytery for the actions of two women in a worship service; one leading in prayer and the other reading a passage of scripture.

The Presbytery responded with an inquiry concerning the grounds for the exception. The Committee recorded at the 26th GA (1998) the grounds for the exception (in bold below). Exception is defined as well (also in bold):

50 d. That the response to the 25th GA exceptions not be found satisfactory: [N.B. - Southern Florida Presbytery submitted an inquiry rather than a response, as required by RAO 14-10.b, however, such action was not contumacious] The 26th General Assembly refers Southern Florida Presbytery to 1 Corinthians 14:34; 1 Timothy 2:11-15; Westminster Larger Catechism Questions 155-159. Exception: April 16, 1996: The worship service for the purpose of organizing a church and installing its pastor included a lady who “led one congregation in the opening prayer” and another lady who “read passages of Scripture” prior to the sermon. (Commissioners Report MC-6). Response: The Presbytery of Southern Florida, at its Stated Meeting held on October 21, 1997, voted to request from the Committee the grounds for the exception. The Rules of Assembly Operations 14-6 c. 1 define an exception as follows: Apparent violations of the Scripture or serious irregularities from the Constitution of the Presbyterian Church in America, out of accord with the deliverance’s of the General Assembly, and matters of impropriety and important delinquencies. The Review of Presbytery Records Committee did not cite (sic) any authority for its opinion that our April 16, 1996 Minutes warranted an exception. When we receive your reply, Presbytery will make an appropriate response.


The committee recorded a response from the Presbytery in the minutes of the 28th GA (1999):

51 d. Response: Presbytery is sorry that exception occurred and will seek to prevent it from happening again

The PCA, through the GA is clear, (or was) in their response and the grounds (in both primary and secondary standards) for it. The Presbytery assented by way of apology. Unless a subsequent GA has ruled differently, the practice of women reading Scripture or leading prayer in the context of the worship service is not acceptable.


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## Beezer (Aug 23, 2016)

There is a large PCA church in central Virginia that my family visited for several months earlier this year that was very deliberate in making sure its Lord's Day worship services were led in part by women. Following the call to worship a lady would lead everything from the congregational prayer of confessing one's sins, the offertory prayer, and the scripture reading. This same church permitted laypersons, both men and women, to also distribute the Lord's Supper each week at multiple fixed "communion stations" set up in the large sanctuary. 

The issues above are only but a few that nearly drove my family to worship with a nearby Calvinistic SBC church. We instead are supporting a PCA church plant in our area.


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## StephenG (Aug 23, 2016)

BGF said:


> The PCA, through the GA is clear, (or was) in their response and the grounds (in both primary and secondary standards) for it. The Presbytery assented by way of apology. Unless a subsequent GA has ruled differently, the practice of women reading Scripture or leading prayer in the context of the worship service is not acceptable.





Beezer said:


> Following the call to worship a lady would lead everything from the congregational prayer of confessing one's sins, the offertory prayer, and the scripture reading. This same church permitted laypersons, both men and women, to also distribute the Lord's Supper each week at multiple fixed "communion stations" set up in the large sanctuary.


It seems that regardless of the GA's official position, many PCA congregations are determined to be 'inclusive' as far as leading in Worship.


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## NaphtaliPress (Aug 23, 2016)

At some point there is a time cut your losses and move along.


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## Romans922 (Aug 23, 2016)

Edward said:


> study commission


 study committee. And this was not in their tasks to cover this topic.


An official GA Action can be found below via the RPR recommendation and later GA approval that it was an exception of substance.

The WLC addresses this, *Q. 156. Is the Word of God to be read by all?*A. Although all are not to be permitted to read the Word publicly to the congregation, yet all sorts of people are bound to read it apart by themselves, and with their families: to which end, the holy scriptures are to be translated out of the original into vulgar languages.

The non-constitutional part of the PCA BCO states 50-1. The public reading of the Holy Scriptures is performed by the
minister as God’s servant.

And then it somewhat contradicts itself and adds more, 50-2. The reading of the Holy Scriptures in the congregation is a part of the public worship of God and should be done by the minister or some other
person.

If it be not the Pastor, who is the 'other person'? Well that is guided by the Constitution WLC (see above), that 'other person' cannot include all people. Given that 1 Timothy talks about women not teaching or having authority and remaining silent, it seems 'other people' can't be women. And I would assume also children would most likely be not those who ought to read the Scriptures publicly in worship. This leaves men, which seems in extreme cases to be allowed, but certainly it means ministers and perhaps includes elders and then maybe men - but in extreme cases.


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## Andres (Aug 24, 2016)

Beezer said:


> The issues above are only but a few that nearly drove my family to worship with a nearby Calvinistic SBC church. We instead are supporting a PCA church plant in our area.



Good for you.


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## Edward (Aug 24, 2016)

Romans922 said:


> study committee.



Thanks for the correction. 



Romans922 said:


> And this was not in their tasks to cover this topic.



While it wasn't in the conclusions that they were directed to draw, it would seem to fall within their broad mandate if they wish to address it. Although they may be so divorced from the confessional standards, they may not even see it as an issue. 

---

A question came to mind yesterday, and someone here may know the answer - are any of the members of the committee actually deacons?


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## Romans922 (Aug 24, 2016)

Edward said:


> are any of the members of the committee actually deacons?



No, but maybe some deaconesses lol


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## earl40 (Aug 24, 2016)

NaphtaliPress said:


> At some point there is a time cut your losses and move along.



I am thankful we are saved by faith which I am still blessed to hear on Sundays. I think how patient Our God was with the RC church before the reformation, and how patient He is with all the factions within Protestantism. That patience makes me persevere with all the horrible things going on in our particular denomination.


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## NaphtaliPress (Aug 24, 2016)

Even without issues of conscience per se, I'm just saying that at some point it is like the argument against using public school. The bad teaching and exampling is overwhelming; if you children are grown maybe its one thing but if you have 10, 20 years more for them under this, you need to be sure you are counter addressing all the error and bad examples effectively.


earl40 said:


> NaphtaliPress said:
> 
> 
> > At some point there is a time cut your losses and move along.
> ...


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## earl40 (Aug 24, 2016)

NaphtaliPress said:


> Even without issues of conscience per se, I'm just saying that at some point it is like the argument against using public school. The bad teaching and exampling is overwhelming; if you children are grown maybe its one thing but if you have 10, 20 years more for them under this, you need to be sure you are counter addressing all the error and bad examples effectively.
> 
> 
> earl40 said:
> ...



Yes my 3 sons are now over 20 and if they were younger (and me wiser) when we started attending I would have never joined knowing what I know now.


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