# Children of KJV-preferring parents



## nwink (Sep 21, 2011)

For those of you parents who prefer the KJV and use it as your primary Bible, what Bible do you use in family worship and what Bible do you buy for your children to use? Some people will say that the KJV language could be a little hard for the children to understand, so maybe they would start out with a more modern version (NKJV, etc) and then maybe be led up to using the KJV as they grow older. On the other hand, some parents would say that if the child regularly hears KJV their whole lives, they should be able to just pick up on it and learn it that way. Thoughts? I'd also love to hear actual experiences you've had with your children!


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## TimV (Sep 21, 2011)

Kids learn foreign languages really fast, so it's a good idea to teach them archaic English from an early age if you want them to understand it. The biggest problem I've seen is when they use that language around other kids (because they think it's English) and get teased.


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## Dearly Bought (Sep 21, 2011)

I saw this thread title and wondered if your local UCC had started up some very specific support groups...


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## Stargazer65 (Sep 21, 2011)

We always use KJV for family devotions. The kids pick it up because they are used to hearing it. One issue is that oftentimes our spoken prayers are colored with archaic language out of habit. That sometimes can spill into corporate prayer, although I don't think it's caused any problems.


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## Pergamum (Sep 21, 2011)

We read and explain from the KJV as well as another version , and then sometimes we transliterate or explain even more basically so that each words is understood.


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Sep 21, 2011)

We use the KJV in family worship and have yet to run into any problems. Other than my oldest saying "My Will" instead of "Thy Will" that is.


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## JM (Sep 21, 2011)

My children were raised on the AV and have their own copies to read from.


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## KMK (Sep 21, 2011)

My children were all raised on KJV and never had a problem.



TimV said:


> Kids learn foreign languages really fast, so it's a good idea to teach them archaic English from an early age



I am not sure what this has to do with this thread since the KJ is neither 'foreign' or 'archaic'. Perhaps you thought the OP was about the Vulgate?


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

Dearly Bought said:


> I saw this thread title and wondered if your local UCC had started up some very specific support groups...


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## TimV (Sep 21, 2011)

Amerse
Caul
Cockle
Concupiscense
Froward

Ken, I could make a list of archaic KJ words 100 long and no person under 20 in your church could define 10 percent of them. This has everything to do with the OP. Just the other day at Men's Bible study one of the men insisted on reading from the KJ and two teenagers didn't understand the passage. They both get good grades in school but haven't been taught archaic English. I stopped the reader and asked the kids if they understood it and they said no, they didn't.

So, if someone wants to use the KJ in family worship, starting from a young age is really helpful, since kids pick up languages fast.


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

TimV said:


> Amerse
> Caul
> Cockle
> Concupiscense
> Froward



Having read through the KJV a couple times in the last couple years, it is worth pointing out that I only remember even seeing the last two, and only the last one with any degree of regularity. The first three probably occur once or twice in some obscure minor prophet. I'm not saying that totally destroys your point. I just want to correct the impression that one is constantly running into those words on a daily basis in the KJV.

Furthermore, as a science major, I feel compelled to point out that your data is not complete until you perform the same experiment on a variety of types of passages using the KJV and, say, the ESV. It may be that sometimes Scripture takes time for the teenagers to understand even in a more modern translation, which does not necessarily imply any lack of intelligence in them.

To contribute my own experience, I was not regularly taken to church until I was 11, but when I was 9 or 10 I took an interest in reading the Bible, and the only thing available was my dad's KJV (he was an unbeliever at the time, but a high school friend had given him one). I think I read Genesis, most of Exodus, and Matthew. I got the main points just fine.


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## TimV (Sep 21, 2011)

What's the last Book in the KJ that you read? Austin?


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

TimV said:


> What's the last Book in the KJ that you read? Austin?



Lamentations. Why? Are you going to do a word search on it and pull a couple words that most people don't know? I acknowledge you can probably find some. However, the book is understandable for the most part even to a child.


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## TimV (Sep 21, 2011)

Lam 1:19 I called for my lovers, but they deceived me: my priests and mine elders gave up the ghost in the city, while they sought their meat to relieve their souls. 
Lam 1:20 Behold, O LORD; for I am in distress: my bowels are troubled; mine heart is turned within me; for I have grievously rebelled: abroad the sword bereaveth, at home there is as death.

Kids must be smarter in Texas than in California.


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

TimV said:


> Amerse
> Caul
> Cockle
> Concupiscense
> Froward



I ran a search on the first three words. "Amerse" did not return any results. "Cockle" returns one result in the middle of Job and the context clues are sufficiently helpful to establish the point. "Caul" is also defined in context as part of an animal's body that is above the liver.

Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for KJV
Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for KJV
Blue Letter Bible - Search Results for KJV

Again, I'm not saying you have no point. I'm just trying to be fair. It is easy to make the KJV look like gibberish by pulling out a string of words people have trouble defining out of context, but the reality is that they are _usually_ not so confusing in context, and they don't occur _that_ often.

---------- Post added at 10:25 AM ---------- Previous post was at 10:21 AM ----------




TimV said:


> Kids must be smarter in Texas than in California.



I guess so.  Actually, I lived in Maryland from 9-11, though I was born in Texas.


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## C. M. Sheffield (Sep 21, 2011)

We have and do employ the KJV in morning and evening prayer as well is in our instructional times. However, the KJV is not the only translation with words that most would consider over the head of the average child (e.g. propitiation, justification, sanctification, et al.) not to mention the many abstract concepts that all children struggle to grasp. But this is what parents are for. Teaching these concepts to children in an accessible way.


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

TimV said:


> Lam 1:19 I called for my lovers, but they deceived me: my priests and mine elders gave up the ghost in the city, while they sought their meat to relieve their souls.
> Lam 1:20 Behold, O LORD; for I am in distress: my bowels are troubled; mine heart is turned within me; for I have grievously rebelled: abroad the sword bereaveth, at home there is as death.



I really hope this is not your best example. I think I can remember how I would have read this as a 10-year-old. First, I would have thought using "mine" instead of "my" was weird, but I still would have known what it meant. I would have thought "ghost" was strange, but it is clear what it means from the context. I would have thought "meat" meant animal meat rather than food in general (which is the way the KJV uses it), but that does not substantially alter the basic meaning of the verse.

2nd verse, I might not have known what "bowels" meant. Or "bereaveth," but what else does a sword do? The central meaning is pretty clear.


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## KMK (Sep 21, 2011)

TimV said:


> Amerse
> Caul
> Cockle
> Concupiscense
> ...



Tim, it was a joke. Hence the  emoticon.

------------------

Please keep the thread on track people. I regret if my joke took the thread in the wrong direction.


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## Fogetaboutit (Sep 21, 2011)

> Amerse
> Caul
> Cockle
> Concupiscense
> Froward





Ezra 9:5
NIV: abasement
KJV: heaviness

Is 24:23
NIV:abashed
KJV:confounded

Ezek 40:18
NIV:abutted
KJV: over against

Is 13:8
NIV:aghast
KJV:amazed

Ezek 40:13
NIV:alcove 
KJV:little chamber

Acts 2:6 
NIV:bewilderment
KJV:confounded

Ps 58:7 
NIV:blunted
KJV:cut in pieces

Job 8:2
NIV:blustering 
KJV:strong

Song 2:12
NIV:cooing
KJV:voice

I Ki 4:22
NIV:cors 
KJV:measures

Gen 40:6
NIV:dejected
KJV:sad

Gen 14:1
NIV:goyim
KJV:nations


They are many more examples but I rest my case


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## earl40 (Sep 21, 2011)

La KJV traduce bien en español?

I always wondered how the KJV only believers answered this.


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## au5t1n (Sep 21, 2011)

earl40 said:


> La KJV traduce bien en español?
> 
> I always wondered how the KJV only believers answered this.



Most of them would support la Reina-Valera Antigua for a Spanish translation, but there aren't any of them here. Perhaps you can start another thread: "Los niños de padres que prefieren la Reina-Valera."


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## py3ak (Sep 21, 2011)

It's "amerce" not "amerse", and it appears in Deuteronomy 22:19.


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## MW (Sep 21, 2011)

On TimV's tangent -- The benefit of reading words in sentences and paragraphs is that it gives one a feel for the meaning of the word even when one doesn't know what it means. And using a dictionary when one doesn't understand what a word means is usually considered basic common sense. The children learn how to use a dictionary in early English classes.

On the original question -- the younger ones are usually fine. They learn the AV as they would any translation: slowly but surely. The problem arises when they grow older and feel they must start worrying what others think of them. At that point, the problem obviously isn't with the Bible, but with the attitude towards God.


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## BertMulder (Sep 21, 2011)

armourbearer said:


> On TimV's tangent -- The benefit of reading words in sentences and paragraphs is that it gives one a feel for the meaning of the word even when one doesn't know what it means. And using a dictionary when one doesn't understand what a word means is usually considered basic common sense. The children learn how to use a dictionary in early English classes.
> 
> On the original question -- the younger ones are usually fine. They learn the AV as they would any translation: slowly but surely. The problem arises when they grow older and feel they must start worrying what others think of them. At that point, the problem obviously isn't with the Bible, but with the attitude towards God.



Knowledge of KJV English is a great help in reading many older theological books...


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## Pilgrim Standard (Sep 21, 2011)

I always read from the 1599 Geneva for Family Devotions, BUT, I ensure that the Children follow along from the KJV. I read it somewhat slowly so that they can follow along. I understand that it is a real chore, but the questions that arise from the children due to this practice are astonishing to me. We get to pause and dig in to meanings all the time. I can tell if the passages are really difficult for them which happens from time to time because they will ask me to slow down. 

I have found that in this practice the children have picked up on meaning very quickly by having a written text to compare to audible text. I mean to say, that they seem to have learned definitions and understandings of many words, phrases and passages by hearing/reading alternative words in their place. It began as an interesting experiment in family devotions that became a practice that the family prefers. 
Our children are 10 and under. 3 of them follow along in their KJVs.


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## Pilgrim (Sep 21, 2011)

BertMulder said:


> armourbearer said:
> 
> 
> > On TimV's tangent -- The benefit of reading words in sentences and paragraphs is that it gives one a feel for the meaning of the word even when one doesn't know what it means. And using a dictionary when one doesn't understand what a word means is usually considered basic common sense. The children learn how to use a dictionary in early English classes.
> ...



Indeed it is. In older works it seems that it was more common to allude to certain passages without directly citing them. Last year I was reading a book that was published in the mid 20th Century. The term "vain jangling" was used, which I eventually discovered was in the KJV. In retrospect that was probably one reason why I started reading the KJV much more. 

I have yet to read Dr. Ryken's book on the AV but I believe one of his points is that familiarity with the AV is very helpful in becoming conversant with a great many works in English literature as well.


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## KMK (Sep 21, 2011)

Pilgrim said:


> I have yet to read Dr. Ryken's book



It is an excellent book that presents the importance of the AV from literary standpoint instead of the more common theological and historical.


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## jandrusk (Sep 22, 2011)

ESV for the family, and 1599 Geneva Bible for me.


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