# Should Christians Know current tv and movies in the Culture?



## Dachaser (Aug 29, 2017)

Such as the tv show preacher, that recently showed Jesus as committing adultery with Mary, had a child, and one of his descendants was so much of an inbred, that he was shown to pee in the face of the shows hero, who was looking for the messiah.

Should Christians at least know what current tv and movies viewpoints regarding Jesus and Christianity are, in order to address and deal with them in culture?


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## Gforce9 (Aug 29, 2017)

David,
Interesting question. My first thought is that prior knowledge of a show isn't required to call out something as rubbish. Might it be helpful in some way? Maybe in that you can say "Yea, I saw the show and here is where it is in error". I think if you ask someone for which assertions of the show they are inquiring about, you can speak with them regarding those without prior knowledge. As an aside, I wouldn't want to expose myself to such a show as you described...

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## jw (Aug 29, 2017)

No, Christians do not have a moral obligation to "[k]now current tv and movies in the Culture."

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## Stope (Aug 29, 2017)

It would be helpful. We know Paul was somewhat aware of what the local pagan thinkers said (Acts and Titus). Indeed wise as serpents and innocent as doves.


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## ZackF (Aug 29, 2017)

There are thousands every year. I sure hope not.


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## BGF (Aug 29, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> Should Christians at least know what current tv and movies viewpoints regarding Jesus and Christianity are, in order to address and deal with them in culture?


I assume by "culture" you mean the unbelievers in our context. I think we first must deal with our own lack of holiness first. Do I need to see shows that depict sin to know what sin is? No. I knew lust, violence, and blasphemy long before shows like _Game of Thrones_ and _Preacher_. Too many of us entertain ourselves with the same or similar content while we decry the moral decay around us. I expect unbelievers to act like unbelievers. Perhaps we who believe and are joined to our holy Lord Jesus Christ should begin acting like it. This is how we engage unbelievers. By being salt and light, as we are commanded to be.

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## Dachaser (Aug 29, 2017)

BGF said:


> I assume by "culture" you mean the unbelievers in our context. I think we first must deal with our own lack of holiness first. Do I need to see shows that depict sin to know what sin is? No. I knew lust, violence, and blasphemy long before shows like _Game of Thrones_ and _Preacher_. Too many of us entertain ourselves with the same or similar content while we decry the moral decay around us. I expect unbelievers to act like unbelievers. Perhaps we who believe and are joined to our holy Lord Jesus Christ should begin acting like it. This is how we engage unbelievers. By being salt and light, as we are commanded to be.


I think that this would have to be done with discernment, for the reason would have to be in order to know what is being shown and why, but would have to know that one need not anything that violates their convictions, or else temps them to sinning.


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## BGF (Aug 29, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> I think that this would have to be done with discernment, for the reason would have to be in order to know what is being shown and why, but would have to know that one need not anything that violates their convictions, or else temps them to sinning.


I guess, but what can these shows teach me about my neighbor or myself that isn't already present in me? If I want to engage someone through the culture they participate in I don't need to have ever participated. For example, If someone asks me what I think about _Preacher _my response doesn't need to be to run home and binge watch so I can be informed. I can simply say, "I've never seen it. Why don't you tell me about it and why you like it?". That can be the beginning of a very fruitful conversation without ever having to participate in the sinful things of the world. I already do that too much.

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## Dachaser (Aug 29, 2017)

BGF said:


> I guess, but what can these shows teach me about my neighbor or myself that isn't already present in me? If I want to engage someone through the culture they participate in I don't need to have ever participated. For example, If someone asks me what I think about _Preacher _my response doesn't need to be to run home and binge watch so I can be informed. I can simply say, "I've never seen it. Why don't you tell me about it and why you like it?". That can be the beginning of a very fruitful conversation without ever having to participate in the sinful things of the world. I already do that too much.


Good way to get involved into a conversation without having the burden of watching it .


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## timmopussycat (Sep 4, 2017)

Gforce9 said:


> David,
> Interesting question. My first thought is that prior knowledge of a show isn't required to call out something as rubbish. Might it be helpful in some way? Maybe in that you can say "Yea, I saw the show and here is where it is in error". I think if you ask someone for which assertions of the show they are inquiring about, you can speak with them regarding those without prior knowledge. As an aside, I wouldn't want to expose myself to such a show as you described...



I'll take option two. I don't have time to watch TV 24/7. Yet I do think some of us should follow and report the trends in this area, so that the rest of us may be aware of what is being peddled to our neigbous.


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## jwithnell (Sep 4, 2017)

Believers wxpise rhemselves to a lot if garbage to be able to "speak to the culture. A well-rounded newspaper will likely give you sanitized reviews and commentary.

I watched a bit of Handmaidens Tale, but I think the more valuable insights come from interviews with the actors and others who clearly misunderstand what the scriptures teach.


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## Cymro (Sep 4, 2017)

Without holiness no man shall see God. All is vanity and there is nothing new under the sun.

Reactions: Like 3 | Amen 2


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## Parmenas (Sep 4, 2017)

I wish I knew much less of modern culture.

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## JimmyH (Sep 4, 2017)

The OP brought the film 'Zulu' to mind. It was Michael Caine's first starring role, and was released in 1964. Having to do with a British outpost attacked by a vastly superior force of Zulu warriors and how the British defeated them. Jack Hawkins played a Christian missionary and was made to look like an hysterical fool throughout the film. Typical of many portrayals of Christians in film and television going back quite a ways. 
At one time a very famous writer, W. Somerset Maugham, wrote 'Rain' in 1921. It was made into a film a few times variously titled Rain, Sadie Thompson, Miss Sadie Thompson, as well as an opera. A Christian missionary encounters a 'fallen woman' on a remote island who is attempting to repent from her past life. He succumbs to his lusts and ends up cutting his own throat, while she, now disillusioned, mutters, "You men! You filthy, dirty pigs! You're all the same, all of you" returns to her previous lifestyle, and the show is over. 

Nothing new about antichrist writing in books and film. If there is any difference between now and years ago it is only in the increased volume of anti Christian material being disseminated as 'art.'

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## Pergamum (Sep 4, 2017)

No. Every time a pastor tries to be hip or relevant by tying in a movie plot or theme to the gospel, it cheapens the gospel message. 

I remember a very serious pastor who was very indignant about any form of flesh on television during one sermon or any scenes of fornication or kissing.. Well, the next sermon he used an illustration from the movie Braveheart. I even tire of allusions to the Lord of the Rings or the Narnia series.

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## Wayne (Sep 4, 2017)

Turn away mine eyes from beholding vanity; and quicken thou me in thy way.
--Ps. 119:37

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## ZackF (Sep 4, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> Such as the tv show preacher, that recently showed Jesus as committing adultery with Mary, had a child, and one of his descendants was so much of an inbred, that he was shown to pee in the face of the shows hero, who was looking for the messiah.
> 
> Should Christians at least know what current tv and movies viewpoints regarding Jesus and Christianity are, in order to address and deal with them in culture?



I am interested in the things I am interested in whether it is fiction or nonfiction. The potential for needing to "address it" seldom is a reason for me to watch something. My exception has been by trying to parent. I've found myself watching cartoons because I am concerned about my daughter is watching. For example a year ago I stopped letting her watch 'Caillou' because the title character is a whinny brat and concluded the show was a negative influence she could do without. Children don't need help being more whinny.

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## Alan D. Strange (Sep 4, 2017)

As several have noted here, one can be conversant with popular culture (including television and films) without engaging it directly but by reading about it.

When I was in the pastorate in NJ (my first ten years in the ministry), my wife and I decided, particularly as our children were young, not to own a television. I also was involved, on behalf of my presbytery, with a very active on-campus ministry at the local state university. I had need in that work, and my pastoral work, to know about various matters current in popular culture as part of my apologetic engagement with many unbelievers. I learned what sort of newspapers, journals, reviews, and the like to read to stay abreast of such (including the new shows that preview in a season).

I could go on at some length of the use that I made of such, but my point is that if one is in a situation in which one needs to learn about various aspects of popular culture, it can be done without immersing oneself in it (customarily that is done uncritically). It can be done in a way that one knows about it and can bring proper analysis to bear. I could also, for example, listen to a song a time or two, read its lyrics, etc., read about it from intelligent sources, and bring a Christian critique to bear on it without it becoming my diet of musical listening.

I don't by all this mean to indicate that I did not watch things selectively (that I thought most important). I know that Greg Bahnsen watched many films (so did Harvie Conn) and listened to much popular music and brought a keen apologetical mind to bear on it.

As many here have indicated, nothing should be done that induces sin or causes stumbling. Only some who are equipped to deal with certain things should engage them. Even then, though, one need not see or listen to all to which one would wish to bring a proper analysis.

Peace,
Alan

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## Edward (Sep 4, 2017)

ZackF said:


> For example a year ago I stopped letting her watch 'Caillou' because the title character is a whinny brat and concluded the show was a negative influence she could do without.



It sneaks in a lot of Canadian style social propaganda, as well. At least it was better than the Yogi Bear I grew up on. "Stealing is great if you can put it to the Man".


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## Ben Zartman (Sep 5, 2017)

I limit myself to reading Time Magazine to find out what's kind of going on, and listened to NPR until my car radio broke (Providence? Probably). That gives me enough overdose of worldly world view to talk to my neighbors about politics and such. As for raunchy TV shows--funny, but all my acquaintances assume that I don't watch them, and I suspect would be disappointed if I were to begin. It seems that the less I know about the excesses of pop culture, the better my testimony. And the more I know the Bible instead, the better my testimony.
While we don't have a TV, I watch movies with my children, but rarely do I let them watch a new movie by themselves, and often do I pull the plug on something that's heading the wrong direction. There are probably more children's shows and movies banned in our house than are allowed (The Little Mermaid being one of the very first).

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## Dachaser (Sep 5, 2017)

Alan D. Strange said:


> As several have noted here, one can be conversant with popular culture (including television and films) without engaging it directly but by reading about it.
> 
> When I was in the pastorate in NJ (my first ten years in the ministry), my wife and I decided, particularly as our children were young, not to own a television. I also was involved, on behalf of my presbytery, with a very active on-campus ministry at the local state university. I had need in that work, and my pastoral work, to know about various matters current in popular culture as part of my apologetic engagement with many unbelievers. I learned what sort of newspapers, journals, reviews, and the like to read to stay abreast of such (including the new shows that preview in a season).
> 
> ...


Your last paragraph really spoke to me, and still trying to get that balance between being ingnorant of how the culture is currently running, but also not getting too tied into it.


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## Free Christian (Sep 30, 2017)

Sort of reminds me of a book i read, not sure but may have been 50 yrs in the church of Rome? Anyway, the person who was a priest said about becoming one he had to read a long list of sins etc. But then went on to say how he wished he never had as it put things in his mind that otherwise would never have been there. Polluted his mind with things that stained it i guess. Watching shows, Godless rubbish to , ha ha, "enlighten us" is no different in my opinion. Just a modern day version of that RC book of sin really.


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## Held Fast (Sep 30, 2017)

Its been said that federal agents that are trained to work in counterfeiting do not actual handle counterfeits ... instead they devote themselves to knowing the real thing so intimately that they can quickly notice when a bill is not the real thing. I believe the same principle applies to a Pastor's knowledge of contemporary culture. Certainly Paul like every other citizen of Rome was exposed to depravity on the streets of Corinth simply while walking to the market, but we have no indication he sought it out in order to be more relevant to the disciples. He was versant in contemporary philosophy, which is at a level below its outward expressions in memes, media and culture. So if we use Paul as a model, perhaps we ought to recognize depravity when we see it incidentally because our knowledge of truth is deeply instilled; and we ought to understand where the philosophy behind contemporary depravity departs from the Biblical worldview. I had a hard time convincing a young person entering ministry of this, but as an old guy whose ministry population is in their early 20s, the fact that I am not knowledgeable of most contemporary media starts far more meaningful (and frequent) conversations than any I've had that sprung from having watched the same TV show.

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## Dachaser (Oct 2, 2017)

Held Fast said:


> Its been said that federal agents that are trained to work in counterfeiting do not actual handleI was thinking like when the counterfeits ... instead they devote themselves to knowing the real thing so intimately that they can quickly notice when a bill is not the real thing. I believe the same principle applies to a Pastor's knowledge of contemporary culture. Certainly Paul like every other citizen of Rome was exposed to depravity on the streets of Corinth simply while walking to the market, but we have no indication he sought it out in order to be more relevant to the disciples. He was versant in contemporary philosophy, which is at a level below its outward expressions in memes, media and culture. So if we use Paul as a model, perhaps we ought to recognize depravity when we see it incidentally because our knowledge of truth is deeply instilled; and we ought to understand where the philosophy behind contemporary depravity departs from the Biblical worldview. I had a hard time convincing a young person entering ministry of this, but as an old guy whose ministry population is in their early 20s, the fact that I am not knowledgeable of most contemporary media starts far more meaningful (and frequent) conversations than any I've had that sprung from having watched the same TV show.


I was thinking like when that movie that came out with Tom hanks that said that Mary was the holy grail, and that Jesus had a bloodline through her seemed to be really popular, would be good to know what was being said in that film to culture.

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## Held Fast (Oct 2, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> I was thinking like when that movie that came out with Tom hanks that said that Mary was the holy grail, and that Jesus had a bloodline through her seemed to be really popular, would be good to know what was being said in that film to culture.



I can empathize with the desire to know ... but we know all too well that a message sent from the pulpit is not necessarily a message received, so regardless of what the media may be sending, it is more important to know what the audience is receiving. I asked someone who saw that movie what they took away from it; the comments were along the lines of Tom Hanks sure has gained weight, the book was better, and it did not challenge their worldview in any way. I wonder some times if we rush to pick fights with ideas to which no one is paying attention.


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## Dachaser (Oct 4, 2017)

Held Fast said:


> I can empathize with the desire to know ... but we know all too well that a message sent from the pulpit is not necessarily a message received, so regardless of what the media may be sending, it is more important to know what the audience is receiving. I asked someone who saw that movie what they took away from it; the comments were along the lines of Tom Hanks sure has gained weight, the book was better, and it did not challenge their worldview in any way. I wonder some times if we rush to pick fights with ideas to which no one is paying attention.


I was thinking more along the lines of we as Christians just knowing what the culture is saying and why they are saying it that way?


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## Held Fast (Oct 4, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> I was thinking more along the lines of we as Christians just knowing what the culture is saying and why they are saying it that way?



Do you feel we have a biblical obligation to know what the culture is saying and why? 
If so, what purpose does knowing serve?


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## Dachaser (Oct 5, 2017)

Held Fast said:


> Do you feel we have a biblical obligation to know what the culture is saying and why?
> If so, what purpose does knowing serve?


Paul knew the customs and the theologies of His culture, as he applied the scriptures based upon that context.


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## Held Fast (Oct 6, 2017)

Dachaser said:


> Paul knew the customs and the theologies of His culture, as he applied the scriptures based upon that context.



Was Paul's knowledge the fruit of an intentional pursuit to become knowledgeable, or incidental to living in the world? Do we have any indication that he set out to learn the customs and theologies for the purpose of being able to apply scriptures to them? You've given a descriptive citation; do you have a prescriptive one, i.e. one that instructs us to seek out knowledge of worldly culture in order to serve some kingdom purpose?


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