# Replacing Israel



## Notthemama1984 (Jan 5, 2011)

How do you defend the charge "Cov Theologians have a replacement theology"?

I think I hear the charge just about every week here at DTS.


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## CharlieJ (Jan 5, 2011)

Galatians 3:16 in context.


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## Kim G (Jan 5, 2011)

I am new to covenant theology (2 years) but would answer the charge this way:

I think the problem with calling it "replacement theology" is a misunderstanding of the Israel of the Old Testament. True Israel has ALWAYS been God's believing people of all times. As the NT says, not all Israel was Israel, and unbelievers were false Jews. We are God's believing people, therefore we are part of true Israel. Although the Gentiles were wild branches, we have been grafted into the tree of Israel.

I'm sure someone else can give you a much better answer, but I too get sick of hearing about "replacement theology."


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## Poimen (Jan 5, 2011)

Actually dispensationalists have a replacement theology insofar as the Gentiles, in God's plan, replace (albeit temporarily) the Jews until the rapture. So what dispensationalists must mean is that we as covenant theologians get rid of the special relationship that God has with the Jews. In this way of thinking, covenant theologians would have a 'good riddance' theology (tongue firmly planted in cheek). Of course this is simplistic since many covenant theologians have held that in the future God would rescue the Jews in a marvelous act of conversion (as per their understanding of Romans 11). 

Furthermore the real issue/conviction for covenant theologians is that we hold to a fulfillment theology. Abraham was to be a blessing for all the nations (Genesis 18:18 cf. Galatians 3:14). For us, we see that as being fulfilled in Christ as the Gentiles receive the promise by faith (as father Abraham did). Christ fulfills the covenant promises, that is brings them to fruition (Matthew 5:17 cf. 2 Corinthians 1:20). 

In short, the seed has bloomed, the child has become a man for now the church has grown up to be what God always intended (Galatians 4:1ff.).


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## JM (Jan 5, 2011)

Scroll down a little, right side you'll find a bunch of rebuttals...enjoy. 

Riddleblog - The Latest Post


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## Notthemama1984 (Jan 5, 2011)

How would you defend against the charge........


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## JM (Jan 5, 2011)

As posted above...Gal. 3


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## greenbaggins (Jan 5, 2011)

Rev. Kok has an excellent answer. To say the same thing in a different way, Jesus is the new way of being true Israel. He relives Israel's story (see Matthew, where just about everything Jesus says and does is a re-doing of Israel's past, only with obedience this time instead of disobedience). Thus, Jesus is obedient Israel. Those with faith in Jesus are part of true Israel. So, no replacement at all. Look at the remnant theology of the OT. This is another clue. The faithful remnant of true Israel gets smaller and smaller until, in the NT, there is only one faithful Israelite: Jesus. Then, in Jesus, those with true faith are the true Israel as being the true remnant. Charlie is correct as well: Galatians 3 is the death-knell of dispensationalism. Those who are of faith are the true children of Abraham. Galatians 6:16 is helpful, as well, where Paul calls the church "the Israel of God."


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## Scott1 (Jan 5, 2011)

Great question.

_A Case for Amillennialism_ by Kim Riddlebarger is must reading. The Westminster Confession, implicitly makes the case for covenant theology (because that is what it is), against the dispensational framework, and explains why it is not "replacement."

One starting point is,

Covenant theology is not replacement of Israel, it is expansion of it, in accordance with God's plan from the very beginning.

Then, go back to God's covenant with Abraham, which interpreted in light of the New Testament more explicitly, shows that God intended _spiritual_ descendants from Abraham- a people from every tribe, nation, kindred and tongue.

That was always God's plan- beginning with national Israel, but not ending there, to reclaim a holy and peculiar people, Jew and Gentile, for His own Glory. He chose and planned to do this from the whole of His creatures, not a narrow political kingdom, but a people out of all the peoples He had created.

So there is not any "replacement," only expansion, in accordance with God's plan from the very beginning.

---------- Post added at 06:44 PM ---------- Previous post was at 06:35 PM ----------

There are many, many points you can then explore with the person who is assuming a dispensational framework.

Ask them to define "Israel", and they will give you a sophisticated sounding answer, "sons and daughters of Jacob." They will repeat what they have been told, "Israel is an earthly people with earthly promises, the church is a spiritual people with spiritual promises.

Emphasize if there are two separate plans of redemption (one for Jews, one for Gentiles), we must know who we are speaking of- after all, eternity depends on it.

Who is a Jew under their system- who qualifies by their dispensational definition?

Does 3/4 Jew and 1/4 Gentile qualify? People claiming to be Jewish who are 1/8? The Samaritans (1/2 and 1/2)- and they were despised 2,000 years ago for not being Israel in Jesus' day- yet many who have much less blood than that, who are unbelievers, even atheists qualify under their definition.

Don't let them duck that question!

And if "Israel" only gets (earthly) promises, why are they denied the far better spiritual promises- was it God's intention to make them second class citizens?

Drill that nonsense, and you will see this system logically and biblically crumble.

Then, ask them why they use a hermeneutic that is less logical than that of covenant theology to get to their framework:

Dispensationalism- views the New Testament in light of the Old
Covenant Theology- views the Old Testament in light of the New

Why do they interpret backwards?

Why do they pull the spiritual truths revealed in the New Testament back into the "types and shadows" of the Old?


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## Peairtach (Jan 5, 2011)

The Church, Jews and Gentiles and their children, is the New Covenant Israel of God. 

Ethnic Jews who currently are outside of the Church/the Israel of God, are free to rejoin this club by faith in Christ any time.

Romans 9-11 still indicates that the most of the Jews that have been cut out of the Abrahamic Olive Tree of the CoG, are still in some special providence being dealt with by God's, should be "beloved" to Christians because of the patriarchs, although being enemies because of their opposition to the Gospel, and will be re-ingrafted as a nation. 

"Israel" is a much broader concept than under the Old Covenant period. You don't have to become a Jew or ethnic Israelite now in order to be part of Israel or its Commonwealth. Israel is an international nation that is in the process of absorbing all nations and cultures, and whose true covenant members are those that accept Christ as the King of Israel.

The Land of Israel has also expanded in the New Covenant period and is measured from the River (Euphrates) to the ends of the Earth, rather than from the river Euphrates to the Great Sea. ( E.g.Genesis 15:18, Deut 11:24, Ps 72:8, Dan 2:35, Matt 5:5, Rev 11:15) 



> Therefore remember that at one time you Gentiles in the flesh, called "the uncircumcision" by what is called the circumcision, which is made in the flesh by hands-- remember that you were at that time separated from Christ, alienated from the commonwealth of Israel and strangers to the covenants of promise, having no hope and without God in the world. But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far off have been brought near by the blood of Christ. For he himself is our peace, who has made us both one and has broken down in his flesh the dividing wall of hostility by abolishing the law of commandments expressed in ordinances, that he might create in himself one new man in place of the two, so making peace,
> and might reconcile us both to God in one body through the cross, thereby killing the hostility. And he came and preached peace to you who were far off and peace to those who were near. For through him we both have access in one Spirit to the Father. So then you are no longer strangers and aliens, but you are fellow citizens with the saints and members of the household of God, (Ephesians 2:11-19, ESV)



Before Christ came if you wanted full fellowship with God and His people, it wasn't enough to be a Gentile God-fearer like Cornelius, you had to become a Jew by circumcision of you and your sons, and latterly by baptism of the whole family. This was symbolised by the "mid-wall of partition" in the Temple which kept Gentile god-fearers further away from the Holy Place and Holest of All, than Jews. Certain laws also characterised this division, e.g. the food laws.

Now all true Israelites are those who from the heart accept Jesus as King of Israel, and their children are included in the Covenant administration. They do not have to become Jews/ethnic Israelites in order to be part of Israel, but can keep their national and cultural identity along with their spiritual one.


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## caoclan (Jan 5, 2011)

I like this from Heidelblog: Covenant Theology is Not Replacement Theology « Heidelblog


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## TimV (Jan 5, 2011)

Kim you're the man! Well, not exactly  but that was simple and sweet.


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## Edward (Jan 5, 2011)

I'd respond with 'Why would you bear such false witness against Christian brothers?" 

It's a slur. I'd call them on it.

One of the professors, perchance?


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## Notthemama1984 (Jan 5, 2011)

Edward said:


> One of the professors, perchance?



A few.


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## Bald_Brother (Jan 17, 2011)

Chaplainintraining said:


> How do you defend _against _the charge "Cov Theologians have a replacement theology"?



Make them read this.


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