# Reference Bible Choice



## Osage Bluestem (Oct 19, 2009)

Hi. I have the oppourtunity to get my first really well made bible this year, and I plan to take it. 

I have always wanted a Thompson Chain Reference, hand size, leather, thumb index....etc and had pretty much decided to get one. However, I looked at some Cambridge bibles recently and thought they were pretty nice as well. They feel good in your hand and smell nice as well.

Here is my question, what is the difference between the cambridge center column reference and the thompson chain reference? Which reference system is more useful? If you were going to spend the money for one really good bible to use as your primary which would you go with? Thompson from Kirkbride in black leather or Cambridge center column in calf or goat skin? 

I already have good study bibles, I am looking for a good reference bible not a study bible with biased notes. I want a good reference bible but I want a good quality bible as well for use as my primary reading bible that I take with me, something durable and reliable that I can use in every situation and mark up for years to come.


Thoughts?


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Oct 19, 2009)

I love my Thomson-Chain NKJV. It is an extremely durable bible and it has been a wonderful tool.


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## Osage Bluestem (Oct 19, 2009)

Backwoods Presbyterian said:


> I love my Thomson-Chain NKJV. It is an extremely durable bible and it has been a wonderful tool.



Is it easy to master? I have always wanted one, but it does look a bit confusing. I have looked through my grandfather's old one at his house and the ones at the book stores but I'm still not exactly clear on how to use it properly.

Do you think the reference provided by thompson is more useful than the cambridge center column?


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## Grillsy (Oct 19, 2009)

Have you tried Scofield's reference bi...oh wait.


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## Peairtach (Oct 19, 2009)

A lot of people round the PB are recommending the ESV Study Bible, and I aim to check it out, DV.

I have the Thompson KJV, which I don't use alot, but I should take it off the shelf.

The Thompson Chain Reference Bible Store - TheStudyBible.com

I have the Newberry KJV Interlinear Englishman's Bible which brings out the nuances of the text. I use it quite abit.

Thomas Newberry - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

http://www.newblehome.co.uk/newberry/penfold.html

You can get this and some other Bibles with a wide margin or inter-leaved with blanks that you can scribble your wisdom on.

I have the NIV "Pocket" Study Bible -the notes are very good.

I have the New Open NKJV Bible - good notes.

The Alfred Marshall Interlinear New Testament.

The Archaeology Study Bible, NIV, Zondervan - good for archaeology.

How God has blessed us - some more than others - with the richness and riches of His Word at this point in history especially!

We truly are a blessed people, that know the joyful sound of the Lord's Salvation!


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## David (Oct 19, 2009)

If you were wondering what the two Bibles look like, ChristianBook.com has scanned previews for practically all the ones they stock. I found it extremely handy in finding a King James Version that had section headings, like modern translations do, so it might help you decide which Bible to go for.

Amazon also includes previews, but not for every book or every edition of a book, making it pretty hit and miss.


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## DMcFadden (Oct 19, 2009)

If you want a PREMIER Bible, R.L. Allan makes the best Bible I know of in the English language.

Currently, there is a sale on with certain models.

*1. The Allan King James Longprimer in Black French Morocco. $140.00 $99.00*
An excellent value. Durable French Morocco Leather-which will become more pliable-with all of the craftsmanship of the highland goatskin Bibles. This has become one of our favorite Bibles because of its craftsmanship and affordability. French Morocco has encased Sacred Scripture for centuries and is an extremely durable binding.

Features:
India Paper
Black letter type and Black Binding
Center column references
Ribbon marker
Red under gold page edges
Large, readable type size
Oxford maps
An extremely clear, generously sized typface and superb bindings combine to make the Longprimer edition Allan's premier reference Bible.

(below: the Allan Longprimer on top of an ESV1 Tan)

*2. The Allan English Standard Version in Antique Brown and Black Buffalo Grain Goatskin. $170.00- $110.00*
Antique brown (or black) Buffalo grain goatskin,
semi-yapp style,
gilt page edges,
2 ribbon markers
2007 Updated ESV Text
Classic Reference (80,000)
Concordance (14,500)
Black Letter
9.5 point font
8 1/4 inch x 5 1/2 inch x 1 1/4-Paper weight is at least 24 lb if not 27lb
Smyth Sewn Binding

They are Smyth Sewn (no bad glue jobs for them) and the leather is magnificent!!! If you want a KJV, the Longprimer is supposed to be the best. The ESV doesn't look bad either.

R.L. Allan ESV, KJV and NIV


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## Brian Withnell (Oct 19, 2009)

A good laptop computer with Libronix DLS and the NASB 95 update with about 13 other translations and the original text all installed. Finds every occurrence of nearly any word in the original language in seconds, has cross references with the ability to see them without actually turning to them, or turn to the in less than a second. Turning back is as quick as hitting the page back command, and looking up additional references is quicker than lightening. You can put in your own notes, you can find commentaries (if your reading pushes you down a rabbit hole to study a passage) and come back sooner than you can even get out another book. It is a little too cumbersome in worship (I use a Reformation Study Bible for that) but it works in Bible studies and Sunday School.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Oct 20, 2009)

DD2009 said:


> Backwoods Presbyterian said:
> 
> 
> > I love my Thomson-Chain NKJV. It is an extremely durable bible and it has been a wonderful tool.
> ...


The Thompson system is not that hard to use. At the basic level, you see a "thought prompt" next to a verse, which is a number with a word or phrase. You go to the back of the bible and find that numbered item. There you will find scripture passages quoted with the same "thought prompt". At these referenced verses there will be other "thought prompts" that you can trace similarly.

So the Thompson is similar to having a bible and a mini topical concordance (100,000 links covering over 7,000 topics) combined into one volume. The topical "thought prompts" by the scripture verses were worked out by Thompson and some may disagree with his methods of topical categorization. That said, I have not found them to be egregious to the point claiming the Thompson has an underlying anti-Reformed bias. It does not, in my opinion. This is the distinctive difference between a Thompson and a standard cross-reference Bible. The latter simply lists a few verses with no prompting of what the context of these verses may be. You are left on your own to determine why these cross-references were listed. The Thompson lists thought prompts and then points (using the chain-reference numbering system) you to other verses where these same thoughts are suggested by the verses listed. Many times I have found linkages that the Thompson suggests that were pleasant surprises to me that other, standard cross-reference Bibles, omitted. I have used many Thompson's in the past and still refer to them. You basically have a running mini-exposition of every passage when using a Thompson.

One final piece of advice- only buy a Thompson published by Kirkbride. There are some Thompson's that were published by other houses that are inferior in quality. And if you are lucky, try to find the Centennial KJV goatskin leather edition of the Thompson. I love mine (a gift from my son), along with my NKJV and NASB Thompson versions. 

My only complaint about the Thompson's? No colorization! So I spent weeks colorizing the many maps and graphics using colored pencils in one of my Thompson bibles. I will probably leave it to my son in my will. 

NOTE: At present my favorite study bible is the 1599 Geneva Study Bible. But, unlike so many other bibles, the binding offerings for the 1599 GSB are poor. I handle my _genuine leather_ GSB with care for fear of the binding falling apart. Sigh.

AMR


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## Backwoods Presbyterian (Oct 20, 2009)

DD2009 said:


> Backwoods Presbyterian said:
> 
> 
> > I love my Thomson-Chain NKJV. It is an extremely durable bible and it has been a wonderful tool.
> ...



I have never used a Cambridge center-column so I am not sure. That being said I have not found the Thompson hard to use at all.


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## Osage Bluestem (Oct 20, 2009)

Thanks everyone. I ordered this one today:

Allan 52 Oxford Longprimer Ref Edition (KJV) French Morocco-Black

Oxford Longprimer Ref Edition (KJV) French Morocco-Black [Allan 52; FREE Shipping] - $99.99 : EvangelicalBible.com

It should arrive in 4 to 8 days. I can't wait.


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## JM (Oct 20, 2009)

Looks like a good price...it's Morocco Leather?


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## David (Oct 20, 2009)

DD2009 said:


> Thanks everyone. I ordered this one today:
> 
> Allan 52 Oxford Longprimer Ref Edition (KJV) French Morocco-Black
> 
> ...


That looks very impressive, and $40 off too. Now you've got me interested. Do these Bibles have a lifetime guarantee?


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## Osage Bluestem (Oct 20, 2009)

David said:


> DD2009 said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks everyone. I ordered this one today:
> ...



David,

I found this on the FAQ on the site where I ordered the bible:



> 12. Do Bibles have a lifetime warranty?
> 
> Premium Leather, Genuine Leather and Bonded Leather carry lifetime warranties for "normal" use.



Good question. I should of thought to check on that before I ordered it.


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## DMcFadden (Oct 21, 2009)

R.L. Allan is arguably the finest leather Bible in the world. Some critics are willing to cede equal or nearly equal status to Cambridge's finest Bibles. However, from the theads on the PB over the last couple of years, I cannot remember anyone giving anything other than a rave review. Mark Bertrand is often cited as the authority on leather Bibles.

Bertrand on the ESV by Allans . . .
Bible Design and Binding: R. L. Allan's ESV3 in Buffalo Grain Goatskin (Black and Antique Brown)

Bible Design and Binding: R. L. Allan's ESV1, ESV1T and ESV1 BR in Highland Goatskin

Bertrand on the Longprimer . . .
Bible Design and Binding: R. L. Allan's Oxford Long Primer in Highland Goatskin

I own one Allan's Bible (20BR, a Blackface Oxford Brevier) and it is spectacular!!!

I am also partial to the classic thinlines and have a NKJV signature leather Bible and an ESV leather Bible. Both of these are "butter" in your hands. The MOST flexible Bibles I have ever seen. Of the two, the Crossway is better bound (in my opinion). Amazon.com had the NKJV $129.99 for $79.99; Evangelicalbible.com sells the $149.99 ESV for $94.49.


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## Scott1 (Oct 21, 2009)

You may be interested to know Thompson Chain reference is likely to come out with an ESV edition in the near future.

Also, as others have recommended, get leather (not imitation leather).


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## reformedminister (Oct 21, 2009)

If you use the reference system, the Thompson Chain would have been the better choice. I have a Longprimer, semi-yapp goatskin and it is the nicest Bible I own. I use it as my preaching Bible, and study almost exclusively with my Thompson Chain.


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## JM (Oct 21, 2009)

I have the Classic Concord with Metrical Psalms in Calfskin from TBS. It would be the best Bible for the price, the leather is thick (!!), soft and flexible. This Bible has "bold-figure cross references, self-pronouncing text, page summary heading, Bible word list."


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## DMcFadden (Oct 21, 2009)

I also have the TBS Bible and can vouch for the fact that it is the finest bound Bible I have ever seen under $40.

Windsor Bible with Met. Psalms -Calfskin 
Luxury Calfskin leather Bible with Metrical Psalms. Supplied in presentation box. Quality sewn binding with Bible paper and decorative head & tail bands. Semi-yapp page protection and gilt page edges. Two marker ribbons. 
This NEW Windsor Bible has: Gift Presentation page - The Epistle Dedicatory - The Translators to the Reader -Word List & Bible Reading Scheme. Page size: 190 x 133mm (7½" x 5¼"); Thickness: 25mm (1"). 
Product Code: PS25U
ISBN (Black): 9781862283381
$32
(If you skip the metrical psalms, it is only $30!!!).

Yes, $32 for a Bible that is not imitation or pretend, but genuine leather! It also has a quality sewn binding (no cheap glue jobs). It is certainly no Allan and only comes in KJV. But, if that is what you are looking for and you are price sensitive, the TBS would be a decent choice. Where else are you going to find not only the Dedicatory but the "Translators to the Reader" preface so often dispensed with in today's printings? 

I still stand by my earlier recommendations of the Allan for most translations and the Nelson signature for the NKJV. Allan would have the best bound ESV, but I prefer a classic thinline to carry to church and so opted for the Crossway premium model from the discounter.

A Thompson ESV sounds amazing! Andy, do you know when it will be coming out?

Again, it just depends on what you want. E-sword or The Word will give you many translations and more reference material than you can profitably use . . . on your computer for FREE. But, the OP asked for a well made premium Bible. In that category, the options are far fewer. Even some of the so-called "genuine leather" Bibles on the market are glue jobs with ridiculously stiff covers. Even my "genuine leather" ESV Study Bible is so stiff that I only use it with my wife for morning devotions and leave it by our bed. If you are intending to use the Bible for a long time, Smyth sewn is the only way to go, and good quality leather will be appreciated over time. One of my beefs with the Geneva Bible is the exceedingly poor binding.


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## Jim Peet (Oct 21, 2009)

*My favorite is the ESV study Bible*

My favorite is the ESV study Bible

the online component is very worthwhile


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## JM (Oct 21, 2009)

DMcFadden said:


> I also have the TBS Bible and can vouch for the fact that it is the finest bound Bible I have ever seen under $40. Windsor Bible with Met. Psalms -Calfskin



I bought three of them for my children. Excellent Bibles.


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## DMcFadden (Oct 23, 2009)

I just received an e-mail from the Kirkbride people (publishers of the Thompson chain reference Bible). In response to my question as to whether they have plans for an ESV based Thompson, they said:



> Thank you for your interest in the Thompson Chain Reference Bible. I am sorry but at this time there are no plans to come out with any new translation.



I guess that answers the queston as to whether the Thompson people plan to issue an ESV anytime soon.


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## JM (Oct 23, 2009)

If anyone does buy a Thompson, stay clear of the Thompson published by Nelsons, buy a Kirkbride...for binding alone. my notes


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Oct 23, 2009)

JM said:


> If anyone does buy a Thompson, stay clear of the Thompson published by Nelsons, buy a Kirkbride...for binding alone. my notes


At your site linked above you recommend removing the alphabetical and numerical topical indexes. In other words, removing that which is unique to a Thompson. Odd.

AMR


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## JM (Oct 23, 2009)

Ask Mr. Religion said:


> JM said:
> 
> 
> > If anyone does buy a Thompson, stay clear of the Thompson published by Nelsons, buy a Kirkbride...for binding alone. my notes
> ...



I've lost formatting a couple of times on the old blog and every once in a while on the new, I'll fix that up, thanks.

-----Added 10/23/2009 at 07:52:55 EST-----

I just doubled checked it, it looks fine on on Mozilla.


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## Ask Mr. Religion (Oct 23, 2009)

Doh! You clearly commented that the emboldened items should be kept. I read it just the opposite of what you clearly wrote. Mea culpa!

AMR


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## JM (Oct 23, 2009)

AMR, your post casued me to re-read what I post on my blog and correct the MANY mistakes I had made. Thank you.


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