# What should we think when someone says...



## Tim (Jul 31, 2008)

What should we think when someone says:

"I was reading my Bible when God gave me this verse"

"I was praying and felt God was telling me to..."

"God laid it on my heart"

Is this mysticism or being lead by the Spirit? 

If you ask someone about why they would make these comments, I am not sure that they would be able to communicate what exactly the information was that they received from God. Thus, I have a hard time believing that God actually "spoke to them" in these ways. But I hear this all the time.

At this point, I am thinking that the only way God communicates with us is through the Bible.


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## BobVigneault (Jul 31, 2008)

Those phrases wouldn't trouble me as much as if someone said, "This morning I was shaving and I heard God say, 'Bobby'......."

"I was reading my Bible when God gave me this verse" The Bible is more than a book of literature, more than an historical narrative. The Bible is the LIVING word of God and the Holy Spirit applies scripture to our daily circumstance. Every good gift is from God and the scripture and it's application is from God so I believe this phrase can be justified from the Word.

"I was praying and felt God was telling me to..."
There is a divine unction. Folks are moved by the Spirit but the key is that any unction or inner nudge MUST be consistent with God's revealed will in the Bible, otherwise it is simply mysticism and can lead us into danger. We "HIDE the Word in our hearts" (memory) and in doing so we will not always have a lucid, rational direction but it will be more of a nudge or unction as a result. 

"God laid it on my heart"
The Scripture says it this way - 1 Cor. 10:10


> ....these things God has revealed to us through the Spirit. For the Spirit searches everything, even the depths of God. 11 For who knows a person's thoughts except the spirit of that person, which is in him? So also no one comprehends the thoughts of God except the Spirit of God. 12 Now we have received not the spirit of the world, but the Spirit who is from God, that we might understand the things freely given us by God. 13 And we impart this in words not taught by human wisdom but taught by the Spirit, interpreting spiritual truths to those who are spiritual.
> 
> 14 The natural person does not accept the things of the Spirit of God, for they are folly to him, and he is not able to understand them because they are spiritually discerned. 15 The spiritual person judges all things, but is himself to be judged by no one. 16 “For who has understood the mind of the Lord so as to instruct him?” But we have the mind of Christ.



There is a non verbal Spirit to spirit communication that takes place between God and his children. It allows us to discern spiritual truth. It is more than just facts and formulas, it is that assurance we have that we know that we know.

Bottom line is as you said, God speaks through his Word but he also brings things to mind at the perfect moment through a vital connectedness with Jesus Christ that we call faith.


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## Tim (Jul 31, 2008)

Thanks for your useful post, Bob. I appreciate what you are saying and agree with the qualifiers you have given. I am just trying to get at the question of how we are to view these "inner nudges", or "unction", and if they are Biblical. 

I agree that the Bible is 'living'. And living suggests activity. But what is the nature of this activity? How is it active with us in a way that is different from other 'literature'? 

When we say 'moved by the Spirit', what does this mean? Feel free to use philosophical language. 

And what is this 'non-verbal Spirit to spirit communication'? 

Perhaps what we are getting at is the nature of the work of the Holy Spirit. I am really trying to examine how one might make these claims even though they cannot verbalize how they know these things are true. 

I think we can go further here.


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## BobVigneault (Jul 31, 2008)

> “This divine unction is the one distinguishing feature that separates true gospel preaching from all other methods of presenting truth. It backs and interpenetrates the revealed truth with all the force of God. It illumines the Word and broadens and enrichens [sic] the intellect and empowers it to grasp and apprehend the Word. It qualifies the preacher’s heart, and brings it to that condition of tenderness, of purity, of force and light that are necessary to secure the highest results. This unction gives to the preacher liberty and enlargement of thought and soul—a freedom, fullness, and directness of utterance that can be secured by no other process.”


— E. M. Bounds, Power Through Prayer 




> “The Holy Spirit enables Christians by giving them what is called in the New Testament “unction”; He gives “anointing,” understanding, freedom, and clarity of speech, an authority. Many terms can be used with respect to this God-given ability to preach. One quotation seems to me to sum it all up very well. Probably the first letter that Paul ever wrote was to the church at Thessalonica, and in the first chapter of the first epistle, he reminds the believers of how the Gospel had come to them: “Our gospel came not unto you in word only, but also in power, and in the Holy Ghost, and in much assurance” (1 Thessalonians 1:5). Paul was saying: “I did the speaking, but it was not I. I was used.” As he was speaking, he knew that he was merely the vehicle, the channel, the instrument that the Holy Spirit was using. He was taken up; he was out of himself; he was, as it were, possessed by the Spirit, and he knew that he was preaching with “much assurance.” Everything was against him. Thessalonica was a pagan city, part of Macedonia. The people did not have a Jewish background or the Old Testament Scriptures; they did not know the prophets; they knew nothing. They were living a life of sin and degradation in utter ignorance, and yet when the apostle appeared among them, he was able to speak with assurance. Why? Because it was not his word only, but he spoke “in power, and in the Holy Ghost.” . . .
> 
> The Holy Spirit takes people and helps them to speak in a clear manner . . . That is the way the Holy Spirit works, but there is another—His action upon the listeners. If the Holy Spirit only acted on the preacher, there would be no conversions. The supreme example of the Spirit’s action on the hearers is what happened when Peter was preaching in Jerusalem on the day of Pentecost. In Acts 2 we read that halfway through his sermon, as he was expounding the Scriptures, the people “were pricked in their heart, and said unto Peter and to the rest of the apostles, “Men and brethren, what shall we do?” (v. 37). The Holy Spirit did the pricking. It was not Peter’s sermon, which was a straightforward exposition of Scripture. The power, the convicting power of the Holy Spirit, was there working in the listeners. On that day three thousand were added to the church. The beginning of chapter 4 tells us that in the next day or so another two thousand were added.
> 
> This, then, is the dual action of the Spirit. He takes the preacher, the speaker, whether in a pulpit or in private, and gives this enabling. Then the Holy Spirit acts upon the ones who are listening and deals with their minds and hearts and wills. Both things happen at the same time.”



— David Martyn Lloyd-Jones, Courageous Christianity, 1st U. S. edition, Crossway Books, Wheaton, IL, 2001, p. 190.


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## A5pointer (Jul 31, 2008)

BobVigneault said:


> Those phrases wouldn't trouble me as much as if someone said, "This morning I was shaving and I heard God say, 'Bobby'......."
> 
> "I was reading my Bible when God gave me this verse" The Bible is more than a book of literature, more than an historical narrative. The Bible is the LIVING word of God and the Holy Spirit applies scripture to our daily circumstance. Every good gift is from God and the scripture and it's application is from God so I believe this phrase can be justified from the Word.
> 
> ...




Bob, I see the text you are using as referring to the Spirit's work in regenrating faith not ongoing special revelation. I do not see any texts indicating special guidance.


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## BobVigneault (Jul 31, 2008)

Bruce, that is the thrust of the passage but it certainly doesn't say that the Spirit has one interaction with the believer at regeneration and then He's done with us. Spiritual discernment is an ongoing work of the Spirit and that is also a topic of that passage.

I don't believe in ongoing revelation apart from the Scripture.


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## Tim (Aug 1, 2008)

Thanks, guys. 

This is a hard one for me to get my mind around.

Upon further reflection, may I offer this: with regard to 'special guidance', perhaps it is that with the Spirit's help, we see opportunities for application. If we see a text that condemns a specific sin, we will be able to recognize that we committed that sin, and then repent and ask for forgiveness.

In that situation, I could see how one could say, "God laid it on my heart". A sinner sees God speaking to him through scripture.

But I am not sure that this covers all the situations in which I have heard people use these types of phrases.


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## BobVigneault (Aug 1, 2008)

I say that most of the times I've heard those terms they have indicated an ignorance of how God speaks and moves us. I was trying to come up circumstances in which they may have a biblical meaning.

I don't use that language because it is ambiguous speech at best. It's like saying, "I accepted Jesus into my heart"; it's a common pattern but it really doesn't mean anything and it reflects a very flawed theology.


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## Tim (Aug 1, 2008)

BobVigneault said:


> I don't use that language because it is ambiguous speech at best.



Thanks for this observation, Bob. I agree. We must be clear, especially in this day and age when 'feelings' are the guide.

I may start a thread on 'spiritual sensations' such as conscience, conviction, shame, etc. There may be an interesting discussion on how we know when these things are 'happening' to us. I mean, what actually is it that we attend to when we say, "I was ashamed"?


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## KMK (Aug 1, 2008)

LBC 1:6 The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down or necessarily contained in the Holy Scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelation of the Spirit, or traditions of men. *Nevertheless, we acknowledge the inward illumination of the Spirit of God to be necessary for the saving understanding of such things as are revealed in the Word,* and that there are some circumstances concerning the worship of God, and government of the church, common to human actions and societies, which are to be ordered by the light of nature and Christian prudence, according to the general rules of the Word, which are always to be observed.

I think this 'inward illumination of the Spirit" is what these people are refering to.


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## Augusta (Aug 1, 2008)

I remember a few times people here mentioning "a ha" moments when they finally understood a doctrine or some spiritual truth when they were reading the scriptures. I have experienced this myself many times. I think that these types of understandings of scripture are the Holy Spirit illuminating the scriptures to us. This is the HS chief work in us.

Conversely, I have never had that same type of "a ha now I understand what to do in this or that situation" like I have with the scriptures and understanding them. I don't think we get that kind of direction or illumination about daily decisions etc. I think God wants us not to worry about tomorrow but to rest in him. He is directing our paths and we are to have faith that he will order all things for our good. This is walking by faith not by sight.


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## Grymir (Aug 1, 2008)

Yah, the big no-no is when sobody prays, opens the Bible, and points to a verse. For example -

"Oh Lord of the universe, maker of all things good, what should I do about my financial situation?" This person then opens their trusty KJV and points his finger to a page and what should it read?











Chapter 13!


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