# Sin have dominion over me?



## pm (Dec 1, 2008)

> Psalm 119:133
> Keep steady my steps according to your promise,
> and let no iniquity get dominion over me.





> I Cor 10:13 No temptation has overtaken you that
> is not common to man. God is faithful, and he will
> not let you be tempted beyond your ability, but
> with the temptation he will also provide the way
> of escape, that you may be able to endure it.



Does I Cor 10:13 negate Psalm 119:133?

Along the same line, is it not true, as we sink deeper in sin
God gives us over to a depraved mind? Isn't that the same as sin
getting dominion over me? Or is that not true of the Christian?

What about the Christian who struggles with 
"the sin that so easily beset us" (Heb 12:1) their whole life?
Does not that sin have dominion over me?


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## turmeric (Dec 1, 2008)

My  ; Believers are never "given over" in the same sense as unbelievers; God will not let them fall fatally; though they may fall grievously.


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## Scott1 (Dec 1, 2008)

Both the effects of sin and the effects of grace are profound, some aspects we cannot fathom in our finite minds. We are called to respond in faith.

Basically, when God redeems a sinner- He elects, regenerates, justifies and adopts that person. Man has nothing to do with making these happen, God does them and they are a miracle only God can do.

When God does these miraculous things that only He can do, the dominate power of sin over us is broken. This is why a sinner is now "free" to truly rest in faith in Christ alone for salvation because the sinner's constituent nature has been changed by God. 

The unredeemed person has a bias, a tendancy, a bondage toward sin, which controls his nature. The reformers call this "moral inability." When God changes a sinner, he changes the constituent nature of a human being and gives the sinner "moral ability" to truly rest in faith in Christ's righteousness alone.

That does not mean a redeemed person instantly becomes perfect (remember justification is by the perfect righteousness of Christ, not the person's behavior). He does not. Perfection comes in the state of glory only.

Yet, after God redeems us, a remnant of the "old nature" abides in us. God provides grace to overcome the remnant of the "old nature" which involves a constant battle in our lives. This is called sanctification and as I understand it, is a cooperative work between us and God- man plays a part in this.

This is why it is important in this life for Christians to avail themselves of the "means of grace" God has provided for sanctification-

reading and meditating on His Word,
praying,
singing His praises,
taking the sacraments. 

These strengthen our faith and bring more obedience and more blessing on our life. We need to make these a priority in life, because God commands it. That would be reason enough, but also provides much benefit and blessing on us for obedience.

Over time, the "new nature" becomes more evident. It may be hard to see at a given time but, over time, the changed nature that God alone gave us will show compared to a non-redeemed person.

The Westminster Confession of Faith summarizes this beautifully:



> Chapter XIII
> Of Sanctification
> 
> I. They, who are once effectually called, and regenerated, having a new heart, and a new spirit created in them, are further sanctified, really and personally, through the virtue of Christ's death and resurrection,[1] by His Word and Spirit dwelling in them:[2] the dominion of the whole body of sin is destroyed,[3] and the several lusts thereof are more and more weakened and mortified;[4] and they more and more quickened and strengthened in all saving graces,[5] to the practice of true holiness, without which no man shall see the Lord.[6]
> ...



Scripture proofs



> [1] 1CO 6:11 And such were some of you: but ye are washed, but ye are sanctified, but ye are justified in the name of the Lord Jesus, and by the Spirit of our God. ACT 20:32 And now, brethren, I commend you to God, and to the word of his grace, which is able to build you up, and to give you an inheritance among all them which are sanctified. PHI 3:10 That I may know him, and the power of his resurrection, and the fellowship of his sufferings, being made conformable unto his death; ROM 6:5 For if we have been planted together in the likeness of his death, we shall be also in the likeness of his resurrection: 6 Knowing this, that our old man is crucified with him, that the body of sin might be destroyed, that henceforth we should not serve sin.
> 
> [2] JOH 17:17 Sanctify them through thy truth: thy word is truth. EPH 5:26 That he might sanctify and cleanse it with the washing of water by the word. 2TH 2:13 But we are bound to give thanks alway to God for you, brethren beloved of the Lord, because God hath from the beginning chosen you to salvation through sanctification of the Spirit and belief of the truth.
> 
> ...


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## pm (Dec 1, 2008)

*Has not been my experience*

Scott, thank you for your nice well thought-out response.

But if I may, I would like to pursue this a bit further, you say;



> These (means of grace) strengthen our faith and bring more obedience and more blessing on our life. We need to make these a priority in life, because God commands it. That would be reason enough, but also provides much benefit and blessing on us for obedience.
> 
> Over time, the "new nature" becomes more evident. It may be hard to see at a given time but, over time, the changed nature that God alone gave us will show compared to a non-redeemed person.



I have seen the above to be true in myself and others, but at the same time I have seen the opposite to be true. I know a 30 year Christian who has serious problems with desires of the flesh. The sin which so easily besets me (eating) has been a problem my whole life and continues to be so. I guess what I am saying, is that these things for me do not easily fit in the theory you espouse.

-----Added 12/1/2008 at 08:51:32 EST-----

Joshua,



> No. Scripture never contradicts Scripture. This is a fundamental hermeneutical presupposition.



It is nice to say this, but here we have Psalms 119:133 asking God to not let sin have dominion over us, and I Cor 10:13 saying there is always a way of escape. I see a contradiction here, regardless of the " fundamental hermeneutical presupposition."


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## Scott1 (Dec 1, 2008)

> pmkadow
> 
> I have seen the above to be true in myself and others, but at the same time I have seen the opposite to be true. I know a 30 year Christian who has serious problems with desires of the flesh. The sin which so easily besets me (eating) has been a problem my whole life and continues to be so. I guess what I am saying, is that these things for me do not easily fit in the theory you espouse.



This is the teaching of your Westminster Standards in summarizing the doctrine of Scripture.

It's hard to know observing one case. We have limited knowledge.

You describe a 30 year old who is dealing with serious sin and then that you have been struggling with the same sin most all of your life.

One way to look at this is that Christians (those who God has elected, regenerated, justified and adopted) can yet have serious and radical falls into sin but never
total and final falls.

Why is that?

One reason is that Jesus himself is at the right hand of the Father interceeding daily for the elect. They never can be lost, it's not even possible.

God really does break the dominant power (not all influences) of sin over the believer. You may not believe that, but it is true. That's why we need to continue build our faith up to believe that (e.g. using the "means of grace" God has appointed).

One other possibility is that as one grows (sanctification) one becomes more aware of his sin- more aware of God's grace too, right along with it. That could also be this person's situation.

If a believer persists in sin, he will not be lost, but will be turned over to the chastening of the Lord. Sin still brings pain and misery, blots out the sense of assurance and offends God, even when a believer commits it. Whom God loves, he chastens (cf Hebrews 12:6).

Don't forget this is also a cause for church discipline if it is public and scandalous. God can and will grant repentance but there is involvement of man's will involved here (unlike getting saved in the first place). 

Someone who persists in sin and gets more and more controlled by it over time is either:

1) a disorderly believer whom God will severly chasten
2) not a Christian in the first place

We have imperfect knowledge as created beings knowing what God knows, so we cannot know for absolute certain which it is.


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## VictorBravo (Dec 1, 2008)

pmkadow said:


> It is nice to say this, but here we have Psalms 119:133 asking God to not let sin have dominion over us, and I Cor 10:13 saying there is always a way of escape. I see a contradiction here, regardless of the " fundamental hermeneutical presupposition."



I think the prayer in Psalm 119 is very much like the prayer Jesus taught us:

"And forgive us our debts, as we forgive our debtors." Mat. 6:12.

And the passage in I Corinthians recognizes this truth:

"And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day." John 6:39.

They are not contradictory. We are told to pray without ceasing, and among other things, prayers for deliverance from sin and for forgiveness are always in order, even though we are assured we will not be lost. It is to God's glory.


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