# Origins of the "meet and greet" during worship services?



## Broadus (Sep 12, 2013)

How long has the "meet and greet, wander around the sanctuary while doing so" been around? For many churches, it seems almost an element of worship. For other churches which have it, it is conducted perhaps after the announcements but before the call to worship.

The latter is what has happened in our church. When I came a little over a decade ago, the "meet and greet" was during the early part of the worship service. I later managed to move it before the call to worship, but it was still disruptive for worship. We have finally deleted it from the service altogether. Our people are a very friendly lot, and lots of meeting and greeting takes place before and after the service. Even from a purely pragmatic standpoint, the "meet and greet" during the service was unnecessary for welcoming others.

I realize that supporters of the "meet and greet" will point to biblical injunctions to greet one another and so forth. However, it seems to me that would be the normal way that believers greet one another whenever they see each other. It has nothing to do with corporate worship.

But I'm curious as to how long this greeting time during the service has been around? My guess is that it is a fairly recent innovation, perhaps within the past 30 or 40 years, but I really do not know for sure. Any ideas? Any documentation?

Thanks.


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## Rich Koster (Sep 12, 2013)

We have a half hour set apart between SS & Worship for meet & greet; coffee & sometimes snacks included. We don't do it during the service.


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## Jack K (Sep 12, 2013)

It's more necessary in larger churches and those that attract a lot of visitors, many of whom might otherwise slip in and out without meeting anyone or won't feel comfortable sticking around for coffee unless they're personally invited by someone who's greeted them. Regulars usually hang around a bit before and after services, so a programmed greeting time isn't as important for catching up with them.

My church attracts a lot of visitors and is large enough that these can go unnoticed if we aren't deliberate. We typically have announcements before the service starts, followed by a few minutes of greeting. It makes it easier to "catch" visitors who might otherwise not get a warm welcome. Although there isn't much concern in my church for making a distinction between what happens before and after the call to worship, there is a desire not to interrupt the service proper with announcements or with the greeting time version of "fruit basket upset."


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## Broadus (Sep 12, 2013)

Thanks, Rich and Jack, for your perspective, but what I am really seeking to understand is where the "meet and greet" started historically. Am I right that it is a relatively new (as within the past few decades) innovation?


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## Somerset (Sep 12, 2013)

I think it is fairly new over here. I'm happy to be met at the door and for people around me to say "hello". But I really do not like the running around shaking hands with everyone - but I do accept that my objections may be more to do with my Englishness than my theology.


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## Kevin (Sep 12, 2013)

I have never heard it called "meet and greet" but many reformed churches practice the "passing of the peace". The turning and shaking hands while saying "peace be with you" to which the person replies "and also with you".

I can see how in informal churches it could degenerate into simple saying howdy to each other.

more info here Passing the Peace | Reformed Worship


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## Broadus (Sep 12, 2013)

Somerset said:


> I think it is fairly new over here. I'm happy to be met at the door and for people around me to say "hello". But I really do not like the running around shaking hands with everyone - but I do accept that my objections may be more to do with my Englishness than my theology.



It is not an uncommon practice in the U.S., at least according to my observation, for churches to have a time when people go around greeting one another. I think the purported purpose is to make visitors feel welcome.



Kevin said:


> I have never heard it called "meet and greet" but many reformed churches practice the "passing of the peace". The turning and shaking hands while saying "peace be with you" to which the person replies "and also with you".
> 
> I can see how in informal churches it could degenerate into simple saying howdy to each other.
> 
> more info here Passing the Peace | Reformed Worship



This is typically a peaceful "howdy."


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## yeutter (Sep 12, 2013)

In liturgical churches this is an innovation that came in with the Romish Vatican II. Liberal Episcopalians and Lutherans dutifully copied this innovation. 
The historical justification for this was that in the early days of the Church their was a break between what is sometimes called the Mass of the Catechumens and the Eucharistic Service proper. At a point in the service; [I think just before the Nicene Creed] the Deacon will proclaim "The doors, the doors." At that time the sub-Deacons would walk from the alter towards the doors and all the Catechumens and those under suspension from the Lords table would go before them. The sub-Deacons would greet them saying "The Peace of God be with you." Thus the Catechumens and those under suspension were excluded from the mysteries of the Mass.
Vatican II brought back the greeting, "The Peace of God be with you" but not the context in which it was originally used.
Why this has spread to liberal protestantism, and from there to evangelical churches has been a mystery to me.


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## Broadus (Sep 12, 2013)

yeutter said:


> In liturgical churches this is an innovation that came in with the Romish Vatican I. Liberal Episcopalians and Lutherans dutifully copied this innovation.
> The historical justification for this was that in the early days of the Church their was a break between what is sometimes called the Mass of the Catechumens and the Eucharistic Service proper. At a point in the service; [I think just before the Nicene Creed] the Deacon will proclaim "The doors, the doors." At that time the sub-Deacons would walk from the alter towards the doors and all the Catechumens and those under suspension from the Lords table would go before them. The sub-Deacons would greet them saying "The Peace of God be with you." Thus the Catechumens and those under suspension were excluded from the mysteries of the Mass.
> Vatican I brought back the greeting, "The Peace of God be with you" but not the context in which it was originally used.
> Why this has spread to liberal protestantism, and from there to evangelical churches has been a mystery to me.



Thanks, Thomas. Are you referring to Kevin's "passing the peace" post or the widely accepted practice in evangelical churches of simply greeting each other, especially visitors, welcoming them to the church?


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## yeutter (Sep 12, 2013)

Sorry, I failed to make myself clear. I was referring to the "passing of the Peace."


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## Kevin (Sep 12, 2013)

Yeutter, the exclusion of the catachumins is an ancient practice that is only maintained by the Orthodox churches. Your post seems to imply that the "passing of the peace" was dropped when. The practice of exclusion declined in the west. 
Do you have any citations for this? Everything I have read or heard in class was that the blessing of peace was said by one communicant to an other as the elements of the supper were 
Passed hand-to-hand. The separation of the blessing from the supper seems in this case to be a natural evolution of out changing practice if the supper. 

I find nothing shocking or "romish" in church members wishing each other a blessing. And I am interested in the history of the idea that to do so is a innovation of Vatican 1.


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## jambo (Sep 12, 2013)

Somerset said:


> I think it is fairly new over here. I'm happy to be met at the door and for people around me to say "hello". But I really do not like the running around shaking hands with everyone - but I do accept that my objections may be more to do with my Englishness than my theology.



Maybe it's a British thing but I always hate when they do it in church. I enjoy meeting folk before or after but hate being compelled to do it by a visiting speaker or when attending a different church if on holiday.


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## JimmyH (Sep 12, 2013)

In the Baptist churches I've attended 'give everyone a handshake or a hug' was practiced. Very friendly to parishioners and newcomers. In the OPC church I am attending now it is not that way at all. It is not unfriendly per se but attending the past two months I have only been welcomed by two members out of 30 or so. Another interesting observation ... to me .... is that Baptists say Amen with a 'long' A. Presbyterians say 'ah men.'


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## yeutter (Sep 12, 2013)

Kevin, thank you for catching my error. It was Vatican II, not Vatican I, that brought in the passing of the Peace, in conjunction with the new vernacular Mass which superseded the Tridentine Mass.


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## yeutter (Sep 13, 2013)

Kevin said:


> Yeutter, the exclusion of the catachumins is an ancient practice that is only maintained by the Orthodox churches. Your post seems to imply that the "passing of the peace" was dropped when. The practice of exclusion declined in the west.
> Do you have any citations for this? Everything I have read or heard in class was that the blessing of peace was said by one communicant to an other as the elements of the supper were
> Passed hand-to-hand. The separation of the blessing from the supper seems in this case to be a natural evolution of out changing practice if the supper.
> 
> I find nothing shocking or "romish" in church members wishing each other a blessing. And I am interested in the history of the idea that to do so is a innovation of Vatican 1.


Thanks for noting my error. I should have said Vatican II not Vatican I. Vatican II was primarily concerned with liturgical innovation, and introduced the use of the Mass in the vernacular.
You suggest the exclusion of the catechumens is exclusively a practice of the Eastern Church. That may be true. I learned much of my Church history especially the Church Fathers from a Russian Orthodox Arch-Priest. If I remember rightly, Bishop Marcel Lefebvre said the source of "the passing of the Peace" was separated from its original context by Vatican II when it replaced the Tridentine Liturgy with the vernacular liturgy. One example of the ancient liturgical predecessors to "the passing of the peace" may be found in the Liturgy of St. Mark [Ante-Nicene Fathers Volume VII page 554. Eerdmans edition] In this liturgy the Deacon says "Salute one another" shortly after the dismissal of the catechumens.


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## CharlieJ (Sep 13, 2013)

In Sermon 227, Augustine refers to congregants practicing the "kiss of peace" as a liturgical element in church. I think the kiss of peace has been a standard element of liturgical practice since ancient times, at least between the clergy. It seems to have been sporadically practiced by the laity.


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## Leslie (Sep 13, 2013)

Not having a lot of social skills, I find meet and greet exceedingly uncomfortable. I'd make substantial compromises, were I living in the States, to attend a church that did not have this. A person who is shy or has other interpersonal problems should have the option of bowing out instead of enduring the torture. Similarly, those who have arthritis which might not be visible, but renders a handshake exceedingly painful.


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## JimmyH (Sep 13, 2013)

Leslie said:


> Not having a lot of social skills, I find meet and greet exceedingly uncomfortable. I'd make substantial compromises, were I living in the States, to attend a church that did not have this. A person who is shy or has other interpersonal problems should have the option of bowing out instead of enduring the torture. Similarly, those who have arthritis which might not be visible, but renders a handshake exceedingly painful.



I know the feeling Mary I too tend to be shy. On the other hand, 1John tells us that loving our brethren is evidence of our new nature. Meeting and greeting gives us an opportunity to demonstrate that we do. Looking outside myself at others who may be as shy as I am, my offering a hello and a handshake may be the only personal interaction that person has with a fellow Christian. I can do all things through Christ which strengtheneth me. In my humble opinion.


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## Broadus (Sep 13, 2013)

Leslie said:


> Not having a lot of social skills, I find meet and greet exceedingly uncomfortable. I'd make substantial compromises, were I living in the States, to attend a church that did not have this. A person who is shy or has other interpersonal problems should have the option of bowing out instead of enduring the torture. Similarly, those who have arthritis which might not be visible, but renders a handshake exceedingly painful.



Thanks, Leslie. That's an additional perspective I had not considered. I remember being in church services where the congregation was instructed to interact with others--holding hands (sorry--I'm not a "hand-holder" other than my wife's) or telling the person behind me and being told "I love you"). I am put off by such congregational manipulation. Regardless the intentions, I don't see how it contributes to corporate worship. Perhaps it contributes to the worship of the corporate. 



JimmyH said:


> Leslie said:
> 
> 
> > Not having a lot of social skills, I find meet and greet exceedingly uncomfortable. I'd make substantial compromises, were I living in the States, to attend a church that did not have this. A person who is shy or has other interpersonal problems should have the option of bowing out instead of enduring the torture. Similarly, those who have arthritis which might not be visible, but renders a handshake exceedingly painful.
> ...



With respect, I somewhat disagree, Jimmy. While I think I understand the gist of what you're saying, that we are to love fellow believers, that doesn't work out the same for everyone. The shy person may not say much while carrying a meal to a sick sister. Be that as it may, I think Leslie's point is well taken. Some folk feel manipulated into doing what they are uncomfortable doing. They love no less than others--they simply express it differently and perhaps even more significantly by what they do.

Nevertheless, back to my original post, I suspect that this "meet and greet" time during the worship service came about as a pragmatic attempt to get people to interact with one another and is a relatively recent innovation. However well-intentioned, I fear that it distracts from the act of corporate worship. I don't find any scriptural support for it _during_ the time set aside for corporate worship. Greet fellow believers before corporate worship and bid them farewell afterwards, but all actions and thoughts should be pointed toward God during corporate worship.

If anyone has any additional historical insight where this greeting in Protestant churches arose, I would appreciate it.


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