# Prayer meetings and Long prayers



## BG (Aug 13, 2017)

Back in 1999, I was part of a church that had mid week prayer meetings that would sometimes last from one to two hours, it was a blessing to be a part of that group. Since that time I have not been in a church that conducts a mid week prayer meeting. Also, I notice that when ever the pastor prays for a long time five minutes or so people complain. I tend to think that prayer together is an essential part of a healthy church life, and fellowship, you learn a lot about each other when you pray together. 

Am I wrong to be troubled by the lack of prayer in our churches? 

Is the lack of prayer a sign of something? 

Am I off base here, are there good reasons not to have prayer meetings?


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## OPC'n (Aug 13, 2017)

IDK. I personally feel uncomfortable with prayer meetings. IDK how right I am (I'm probably dead wrong in fact), but I think prayer should be kept in corporate worship and in personal solitude. I don't see anything in the Bible about prayer meetings.


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## JTB.SDG (Aug 13, 2017)

I'm really troubled by the lack of prayer. I think it's a sign of unhealthy and weak churches, and an attitude of self-sufficiency. Even AFTER Pentecost the disciples are devoting themselves to prayer, and I don't think it's a coincidence that in connection with that the Lord continued to add to their number day by day.

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## Jack K (Aug 13, 2017)

Yes, the lack of prayer in our churches should trouble us, as should lack of prayer in our personal lives.

There is not just one good model for prayer, though. The hours-long prayer meeting is one model, but there are other signs of a prayer-filled church. My former church had a three-hour weekly prayer meeting (a drop-in event where people felt free to come and go), and the elders prayed together for at least an hour every week. But I thought the best sign of a prayerful culture was the fact that people were always praying together in the hallways and on the lawn and such. If you mentioned a concern in your life, you'd better be ready to pray about it, because someone would probably say, "Let's pray about that right now." I miss that.

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## C. M. Sheffield (Aug 14, 2017)

OPC'n said:


> I don't see anything in the Bible about prayer meetings.



You might skim through the book of Acts.

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## OPC'n (Aug 14, 2017)

C. M. Sheffield said:


> You might skim through the book of Acts.


I have


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Aug 14, 2017)

Some of this might be of help:

Prayers in the Old Testament can be seen throughout the book of Psalms, and in various histories, but public prayer can is found in 1 Kings 8:22; 2 Chron. 14:11; Isa.37:15; Ezra 9:5-6; 2 Chron. 20:5. They were given by Solomon, Asa, Hezekiah, Ezra, and Jehoshaphat. Public prayer also formed an important part of the service of the Jewish synagogue, that moral institution, which, from an early period, certainly from the time of Ezra, constituted the regular _sabbatical_ worship of the Jewish people. The synagogue service was, in substance, the _model_ of the early Christian Church. The titles and functions of the officers, and the form of worship were the same. See Samuel Miller's _Thoughts on Public Prayer._

In the New Testament, Christ taught his disciples to pray a number of times, and the book of Acts furnishes us with a number of accounts of prayer (Acts 6:4, 24; 16:25; 20:36; 21:5.)

Equally, Paul expresses to the church that _they _are to "pray without ceasing." (1 Thess. 5:17). 

And then there is 1 Tim. 2:1-8 which is quite direct, and a command.
"Therefore I exhort first of all that supplications, prayers, intercessions, and giving of thanks be made for all men,
2 for kings and all who are in authority, that we may lead a quiet and peaceable life in all godliness and reverence.
3 For this is good and acceptable in the sight of God our Savior,
4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.
5 For there is one God and one Mediator between God and men, the Man Christ Jesus,
6 who gave Himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time,
7 for which I was appointed a preacher and an apostle-- I am speaking the truth in Christ and not lying-- a teacher of the Gentiles in faith and truth.
8 I desire therefore that the men pray everywhere, lifting up holy hands, without wrath and doubting;"
(1Ti. 2:1-8).

God’s temple is described as _the house of prayer, _(Luke 19:46) there his people met together to seek his face; public prayer is a great ordinance, and when rightly managed, of great efficacy.

Consider also 1 Cor. 11:1-19, which involve head coverings in public during prayer when the "woman prays", and Paul uses prayer as a argument. (Not to get into head covering here).

Thomas Ridgley said those who pray in public during public prayer times, "one is the mouth of the whole assembly," The Works of Thomas Ridgley (Vol. 4).

And I love Zechariah. There is public prayer (Zechariah 8:21). "Come let us go speak daily to pray before the Lord." Christians should think, _I will go also.
_
As for other institutions, public prayer, preaching the word, the Lord's day, singing of God's praises, the exercise of discipline, with what belongs thereunto, they have their foundation in the law and light of nature, being only directed and applied unto the gospel church-state and worship by rules of especial institution ; and they can no more cease than the original obligation of that law can so do. (Owen, J. The Works of John Owen (Vol. 15).

"Public prayer in a congregation, where the body is seen and voice is heard," Heywood, O. The Works of Oliver Heywood (Vol. 3).

There yet remaineth something to be spoken, of the kinds and circumstances of prayer, which is either public or private : and both of them either ordinary or extraordinary. (Acts vi. 4, &c. 1 Tim. ii. 12. Matt. vi. 6. Acts x. 4. Joel ii. 15. Jonah iii. 6.) Public prayer is a prayer made of, and in the congregation, assembled for the service of God. (Ps. lxxxiv. 1, &c.) Ussher, J. A Body of Divinity.

As concerning the public prayer, our Savior promises us, that, “where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them,” (Matt. 18:20). Du Moulin, P. The Love of God.

How can we come to the House of Prayer, and not be moved with the very glory of the place itself so to frame our affections praying, as doth best beseem them whose suits the Almighty doth there sit to hear, and his Angels attend to further? When this was ingrafted in the minds of men, there needed no penal statutes to draw them unto public Prayer. Hooker, R. The Works of Richard Hooker (Vol. 1).

To have public prayer in the church, or to administer the sacraments in a tongue not understood of the people, is a thing plainly repugnant to the word of God and the custom of the primitive church. Neal, D. (n.d.). The History of the Puritans (Vol. 3).

But the word is more commonly used only for an instituted or appointed way or means of worship. So the sacraments are ordinances ; so public prayer, singing of praise, the preaching of the word, and the hearing of the word preached, are divine ordinances. The setting apart of certain officers in the church, the appointed way of discipline, public confession of scandals, admonition, and excommunication, are ordinances. These are called the ordinances of God's house, or of public worship ; and these are intended in the doctrine : it is the profanation of these ordinances that is spoken of in the text : " They came into my sanctuary to profane it ; and lo ! thus have they done in the midst of mine house," saith God. Edwards, J. (n.d.). The Works of Jonathan Edwards (Vol. 4).

The general nature of prayer,' which is, ' an opening or making known of the desires of your hearts.' Desire is the soul of prayer, and there must not only be habitual desires, but they must be actuated. Praying is the pouring out our souls in actual desires after the good things we want, Isa. xxvi. 9. Yet is not the voice altogether excluded, which is necessary in public prayer in the church; and in private, in and with the family; and maybe used in secret, for the stirring up our devotions, and keeping our minds from wandering thoughts, provided it be not done with an intention to be heard and taken notice of by others, which will argue gross hypocrisy. Gouge, T. The Works of Thomas Gouge.

A PUBLIC CALLING UPON GOD, in which we unite our own confession, thanksgiving and prayer with the church ; for God will not only be invoked by every one privately, but also publicly by the whole church, for his own glory and our comfort. It is for this reason that Christ has added a special promise to such prayers as are offered up publicly. " If two of you shall agree on earth as touching any thing that they shall ask, it shall be done for them of my Father which is in heaven. For where two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them." (Matt. IS : 19, 20.) It is not public prayer, but ostentation and hypocrisy, the counterfeit of true piety, that Christ condemns....Prayer is also distinguished into public and private prayer, from the circumstances of person and place. Private prayer is the intercourse which a faithful soul has with God, asking, alone and apart from others, certain blessings for himself, or for others ; or giving thanks for benefits received. This form of prayer is not restricted to any particular words or places, for oftentimes the heart, when burdened and distressed, gives utterance to nothing more than sighs and groans ; and the Apostle commands " that men pray every where, lifting up holy hands." (1 Tim. 2 : 8.) Public prayer is that which, by the use of certain words, is offered up to God by the whole church in the congregation, the minister leading, as it is right and proper that he should in the public gatherings of the church. Language, or the use of the tongue, is necessary for this form of prayer. Ursinus, Z. (n.d.). The Commentary of Ursinus on the Catechism.

All neglect of God's worship and ordinances, in not observing them in their practice. The neglect of these, though men do not professedly reject them, is very offensive, Exod. iv. 24, 25. So in this command is forbidden, 1st, The neglect of prayer, Psal. xiv. 4. How can they read or hear this command without a check, who do not bow a knee to God? This command forbids, (1.) The neglect of public prayer in the congregation; whereof people are guilty when they unnecessarily absent themselves from the public ordinances, or, through laziness or carelessness, the prayers are over ere they come; or unnecessarily go away and leave public prayers ; or do not in their hearts join and go along with the speaker in them. Boston, T. The Whole Works of the Late Reverend Thomas Boston (Vol. 2).

Prayer is a principal part of God s worship, and therefore is frequently put for the whole, Zech. viii. 21, 22. Acts xvi. 23. Hence God s temple of old was called the house of pray er. Public prayer is most necessary for averting judgements, obtaining blessings, and preserving love and unity among Christians ; also it is a solemn owning the God whom we serve in the face of the world, and so highly glorifies God. Willison, J. The Practical Works of John Willison (Vol. 4).

"What we received of the Lord, that we are to deliver," 1 Cor. xi. 23. And there is public prayer and praise, catechising, both in public, and teaching from house to house. These and the like ordinances, for edification and worship, Christ, as King of Zion, has appointed to be dispensed by ministers in his visible kingdom. Erskine, E. The Whole Works of Ebenezer Erskine (Vol. 2).

I could wish that men would be more in public prayer, and that they would not forget private prayer, Richard Sibbes, Volume 7.

Prayer. It is called seeking of God, and is the highway to find him. It has a large promise; Matth. vii. 7, " Ask, and it shall be given you ; seek, and ye shall find ; knock, and it shall be opened unto you ;" and it has been the gate of heaven to many a soul. It is a four-leaved gate, and at every one of the leaves the King has shewn himself to poor sinners. (1.) Public prayer, at which Lydia got her heart opened ; Acts xvi. 13, 14. Boston, T. The Whole Works of the Late Reverend Thomas Boston (Vol. 10).

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## Edward (Aug 14, 2017)

C. M. Sheffield said:


> You might skim through the book of Acts.



Or perhaps Matthew? "And when thou prayest, be not as the hypocrites: for they love to stand and pray in the Synagogues, and in the corners of the streets, because they would be seen of men."


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## OPC'n (Aug 14, 2017)

Rev. Matthew, do you not see in most of those verses the pastor leading the prayers for the people? When I was little we belonged to a very weird church. We had prayer meetings and anyone in the congregation could just start a prayer and pray out loud. I don't see this type of thing in Acts do you?


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## C. Matthew McMahon (Aug 14, 2017)

OPC'n said:


> Rev. Matthew, do you not see in most of those verses the pastor leading the prayers for the people? When I was little we belonged to a very weird church. We had prayer meetings and anyone in the congregation could just start a prayer and pray out loud. I don't see this type of thing in Acts do you?



Many times we tend to err on the side of error because we see abuses rather than what we hope might be ideals. Instead of looking at the possible problems, consider the ideal public prayer meeting as it stands in many of the Scriptures quoted above and as it has been solidified by the church at large for thousands of years. 

It may be that you are looking to find that elusive Scripture that says "Women get to partake of the Lord's Supper." I'm supposing you have a happy inconsistency there. (And I would encourage you to partake.) But not because there is a "line item" that neatly sets it down as we'd idealistically hope, but that by good and necessary inference it is not only allowed, but commanded. 

With prayer, it is far different. It is not only clearly seen, but it is clearly commanded. Sometimes we simply need to step back a bit to see the forest instead of the myopic stance we have on a single tree.
The thing is, its not commanded in a "weird way in a weird church." It is to be done decently and in order. Weird churches tend to ruin Christians. Good things done in bad ways can ruin our perception.

I'll tell you a story - a family we knew many years ago had a case with a young child, a girl. The mom prepared a bath for one child as the child watched. Maybe she was 4 or so. She took her bath went to bed and was excited for her bath the next day. At the proper time she ran upstairs, grabbed all the toilet paper off the roll, plugged up the hole in the tub, and turned on the _hot _water. She had watched her mother, but not as carefully as she ought to. The mother caught her in time, scolded the child and spanked her. Afterwards, the mother was asked, "why did you spank the child?" She replied, "What do you mean? She could have been very badly hurt." "Yes........she could have, but you didn't teach her that yet. She was trying to be helpful. It wasn't time for her to be spanked."

In thinking about how we sometimes deal with practical ideas, if a church has never been taught what it means to "redeem the time" or "to "devote oneself to God in private devotions," or that all the men should "pray everywhere holding up holy hands to God" or, that God's temple is called "the house of prayer," (which is the individuals in the church now), then spanking the church before she's taught is not the way to go. In our day and age its is sometimes hard to impossible to find "ideals," so we must settle for finding "things somewhat normal." On a mere practical level, don't let the _weird church_ ruin something that has been called by countless Christians for ages..sweet communion.

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## Cymro (Aug 15, 2017)

It is and always has been the practice in the Evangelical churches in Wales, and no doubt the in Uk as well, to hold a midweek church prayer meeting. I think Rev McMahon has given an excellent defence of the subject. A common saying amongst us is, that the spiritual health of a church is gauged by the attendance and earnestness of the prayer meeting. In fact such a meeting is called colloquially, "the power house." The presiding officer, whether Minister or Elder, is to be rigorous in not allowing some who would (as in another thread), dampen the meeting with a long prayer or a shopping list. Another practical use is that how else can the gifts of members be recognised and then utilised? And how else can the burdens of the church be dicovered and sympathetically prayed for.
It was through prayer meetings that a number of Revivals in Wales had their origins.


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## Ed Walsh (Aug 15, 2017)

BG said:


> Also, I notice that when ever the pastor prays for a long time five minutes or so people complain. I tend to think that prayer together is an essential part of a healthy church life, and fellowship, you learn a lot about each other when you pray together.



The way things used to be:
*
The Sabbath in Puritan New England*
by Alice Morse Earle

Excerpt from chapter VII - The Length of the Service

Dr. Lord of Norwich always made a prayer which was one hour long; and an early Dutch traveller who visited New England asserted that he had heard there on Fast Day a prayer which was two hours long. These long prayers were universal and most highly esteemed,--a "poor gift in prayer" being a most deplored and even despised clerical short-coming. Had not the Puritans left the Church of England to escape "stinted prayers"? Whitefield prayed openly for Parson Barrett of Hopkinton, who could pray neither freely, nor well, that "God would open this dumb dog's mouth;" and everywhere in the Puritan Church, precatory eloquence as evinced in long prayers was felt to be the greatest glory of the minister, and the highest tribute to God.

In nearly all the churches the assembled people stood during prayer-time (since kneeling and bowing the head savored of Romish idolatry) and in the middle of his petition the minister usually made a long pause in order that any who were infirm or ill might let down their slamming pew-seats and sit down; those who were merely weary stood patiently to the long and painfully deferred end. This custom of standing during prayer-time prevailed in the Congregational churches in New England until quite a recent date, and is not yet obsolete in isolated communities and in solitary cases. I have seen within a few years, in a country church, a feeble, white-haired old deacon rise tremblingly at the preacher's solemn words "Let us unite in prayer," and stand with bowed head throughout the long prayer; thus pathetically clinging to the reverent custom of the olden time, he rendered tender tribute to vanished youth, gave equal tribute to eternal hope and faith, and formed a beautiful emblem of patient readiness for the last solemn summons.


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## Ben Zartman (Aug 15, 2017)

I think what must be guarded against in regards to the mid-week prayer is turning it into a duty, as though Wednesday were a holy day like unto the Sabbath. Our church has mid-week prayer, and it is a great blessing, but we have to be always watchful against those who would say "God requires you to go to mid-week prayer; how can you say you love God if you don't go to prayer meeting?"

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## deathtolife (Aug 15, 2017)

For those who doubt the requirement of a corporate prayer meeting, or the mandate to be at one may I recommend this series to you by Rev. Al Martin which he taught at the Free Reformed Church in Grand Rapids,MI. Either way it will be very helpful. http://www.sermonaudio.com/sermoninfo.asp?sid=11715824110


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## lynnie (Aug 15, 2017)

I agree OP. As we watch the nation go downhill and see all the lost, how desperately we should be interceeding both privately and together. 

One thing I find helpful is for a people at a prayer meeting to pray for one thing at a time. Then others can join in after and add to the prayer. Then after a few prayers you can move to the next subject. For example you pray for the missionaries and foreign countries. Then maybe some prayers for the nation. Then some prayers for needs in the church. Then prayers for children and teens.

Corporate prayer is supposed to be corporate. When I hear somebody go for 20 minutes and cover 15 subjects, I feel like they took their personal devotional life and brought it into the corporate meeting. It isn't really praying as a group together. It is certainly fine for the pastoral prayer at the opening of the Sunday service to cover many things, that is different. But if we are a group, we are talking to God as a group, one by one, and not just doing our individual thing. 

I also think leaders need to remind people to speak up. I have been at so many meetings where I am sure they were praying in a known language, but you can't even hear what they said. Hard to be saying "Amen" in that setting. 

But, even if the meetings are not perfect, we need to pursue them and encourage them.

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## bookslover (Aug 15, 2017)

When it comes to public prayer, someone semi-jokingly said that the "600-second" rule should be followed. One shouldn't pray publicly for more than 600 seconds (10 minutes). It may have been a (semi)joke, but there's wisdom there.

Also, as Joel Beeke has pointed out, one shouldn't teach in one's public prayers: "God doesn't need the instruction."


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## SavedSinner (Aug 15, 2017)

Even 600 secs seems to long. Yes, I think it is disrespectful to God to address others in your prayer instead of addressing only God. Some ministers and elders even do it and when it happens, it throws my heart out of the prayer. Samuel Miller's book on prayer, "Thoughts on Public Prayer" is one the best book I have read on the subject.

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## deathtolife (Aug 16, 2017)

Maurice Roberts says:

_"First, how long should a public prayer be as a general rule? We respectfully suggest that it should be no longer than five or ten minutes, unless the man who is leading in prayer has real ‘liberty’. We hope that this will often be the case, but experience suggests that it is not ordinarily so in our day. If a man in prayer has a manifest freedom of utterance and is led to plead with God in a manner that indicates that the Spirit is being poured on his soul, let him pray till he is finished. In such a case no one will feel the prayer too long. But this is rare. If we do not have this ‘liberty’, we must restrict our prayers as to their length."_


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