# A couple verses



## Dennis1963 (Oct 7, 2007)

I have a few Arminian friends (shocking I know, lol) who use some verses to try to disprove the Reformed doctrine of predestination, also one reformed 5 point Calvinist who agrees that these scriptures are strong arguments for Arminianism. Here are the verses: 

*1 Timothy 2:4 who desires all men to be saved and to come to the knowledge of the truth.*
I think in it's context, prayer is the subject. v.2 we are to pray for all, those in authority ect... This is good and acceptable to God our Saviour. So in a sense does it mean to pray for all, we don't know who the elect are only God does? Our job is to pray and water? So...V.4 "desires all men to be saved" People in authority? or in a broader sense not just Jewish, but all different nationalities? I would think If God desired "all men" literally, to be saved, then all men would be saved, no one would face hell. 


* 1 John 2:2 and He Himself is the propitiation for our sins; and not for ours only, but also for those of the whole world.* I think this one simply means, not for ours only (Jews) but for the whole world (Gentiles). Jesus tore down the dividing wall between the Jews and Gentiles on the cross and made both into one, therefore there is no difference now. 


* 1 Timothy 4:10 For it is for this we labor and strive, because we have fixed our hope on the living God, who is the Savior of all men, especially of believers. * This one I find a little more difficult. Would this mean the preserving of all mens natural and temporal being in general? Especially of the everlasting and spiritual being of the elect? Anotherwords, God, who has all life in Himself, the bestower and preserver of all life, Who is the Deliverer of "all men" and...."the spiritual and eternal Saviour of believers"? So we diligently move foreword cheerfully, bearing many tribulations along the way for God's glory and advance His kingdom by gaining souls?

I think I am on the right track? Any insight and help would be most appreciated. Thanks in advance.


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