# Is it foolish to not be ambitious?



## Jonathan95 (Dec 17, 2019)

Being a young man as I am, I sometimes fall easily into the trap of comparing myself to those around me. 25 years of age, no college degree, no big career track to follow, no spouse, etc. The predominate culture, I believe, would tell me to do all that I could to be successful and move out ASAP and get a wife and build a family, make a ton of money and so on and so forth. 

I recently finished reading _The Jewel of Christian Contentment _by Jeremiah Burroughs and I thought it was great. Incredibly convicting. With that said, it's almost as if that now that I'm beginning to get a grasp on how to grow in contentment that the pressure is on. And I feel like, not only the secular culture but even the church would want me to have a little more fire under my footing. 

With this said, I know that it's more of a heart issue and varies by individual person and situation.

Still, as vague as the question might come off, is it foolish to not be ambitious. I don't mean to be lazy. Yes, I get that much. 

I feel like when someone is described as "ambitious' it conjures up images of someone who is constantly on the move through their checklist for life. 

Again, I do no good to compare myself to others. Still, sometimes I am led to feel as if by working on contentment of spirit, I am not being grateful for opportunities the Lord gives to "move forward" through life.

It's difficult to explain. I never want to be slothful and lazy, nor passive in a negative sense. What is a biblical "go-getter"? I would think that being one who continually strives to grow in sanctification and holiness inwardly does make me "ambitious" to a degree. 

I suppose a lot of the time I feel as if I should want to do so much more. But truthfully, I am thankful for what I have and am ok where I am.

Sorry my thoughts are all over the place. I welcome any questions, comments, or concerns.


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## jw (Dec 17, 2019)

I dunno, but splitting infinitives is really bad!


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## Jonathan95 (Dec 17, 2019)

Joshua said:


> I dunno, but splitting infinitives is really bad!


Sorry! I dont know if I am able to edit that now! I can try deleting and remaking this post another time! I feel kind of embarrassed.


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## JTB.SDG (Dec 17, 2019)

Brother, good reflections. Could you clarify just a bit further?


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## jw (Dec 17, 2019)

I was only joking, Friend. Carry on!

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## ZackF (Dec 17, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Being a young man as I am, I sometimes fall easily into the trap of comparing myself to those around me. 25 years of age, no college degree, no big career track to follow, no spouse, etc. The predominate culture, I believe, would tell me to do all that I could to be successful and move out ASAP and get a wife and build a family, make a ton of money and so on and so forth.


Where in this culture are you seeing the above in great numbers? That sounds so 1945. “Alrighty boys, the war is over. Go home, marry your schweethawt, buy a house, fill it, and of course get some fine Detroit iron for the lady to move that growing family around.”

I think you’ll find fashionable opinion these days is different and that you are to avoid marrying, certainly don’t contribute to overpopulation, and to do as little as possible in life except travel as much you can at another’s expense. Play video games to the wee hours. Support various social causes at other’s expense as well. 

The former’s danger is kind of a duty complex and runaway ambition. The second is, well, what you see out in the world.

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## VictorBravo (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Sorry! I dont know if I am able to edit that now! I can try deleting and remaking this post another time! I feel kind of embarrassed.



Josh has his hangups…

I rather like to boldly, ostentatiously even, split those infinitives. "Infinitive" derives from Latin for "indefinite" or "unlimited." They cry out to abruptly be confined.

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## TheInquirer (Dec 18, 2019)

"Ambition" for the Lord and His kingdom, and making the most of the life and talents He has given you, is certainly a good thing and what all Christians should pursue.

There is much danger in listening to the world's definitions of success and achievement. What I would perhaps recommend is sorting your thoughts a bit and seeing which are clearly "the Lord's will" as expressed in Scripture and which are the world's messages infiltrating and causing confusion.

Reactions: Amen 1


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## Pergamum (Dec 18, 2019)

You should have holy ambitions and spiritual goals. It is the nature of man to take dominion over the earth. It is unnatural to have no desire to improve yourself, to achieve, or to develop a skill.

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

JTB.SDG said:


> Brother, good reflections. Could you clarify just a bit further?



Another way to ask the same question on my heart is; when does contentment become laziness? Obviously contentment which is true, biblical and Christlike is never laziness, foolishness, or sin.

I suppose as a Christian we might tend to use a word like "contentment" as a veneer for sloth. And "ambition" to justify our covetousness. What's the balancing act between the two look like?


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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

ZackF said:


> Where in this culture are you seeing the above in great numbers? That sounds so 1945. “Alrighty boys, the war is over. Go home, marry your schweethawt, buy a house, fill it, and of course get some fine Detroit iron for the lady to move that growing family around.”



Haha, good point! I guess it's more my Hispanic culture where family is everything. And this was the general pressure being felt before my conversion being surrounded by these kinds of people with that mindset.


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## TheInquirer (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> I suppose as a Christian we might tend to use a word like "contentment" as a veneer for sloth. And "ambition" to justify our covetousness. What's the balancing act between the two look like?



Good questions. I've wrestled with these same issues recently. One primary factor is your motivation behind your ambition. The glory of God is the purest motivation. Though we can be deceived and blinded by our desires, I think we are often somewhat aware when our hearts are really longing to fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life. 

I am trying to make it a habit often to ask myself if I am glorifying God by what I am doing, or how best can I glorify God with my day. I do a poor job of it, but I think asking that question helps sort out the confusion.

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

TheInquirer said:


> Good questions. I've wrestled with these same issues recently. One primary factor is your motivation behind your ambition. The glory of God is the purest motivation. Though we can be deceived and blinded by our desires, I think we are often somewhat aware when our hearts are really longing to fulfill the lust of the flesh, the lust of the eyes, and the pride of life.
> 
> I am trying to make it a habit often to ask myself if I am glorifying God by what I am doing, or how best can I glorify God with my day. I do a poor job of it, but I think asking that question helps sort out the confusion.



Amen yeah, I agree.
Sometimes when deciding between two options for example, maybe you can glorify God by being remaining as is or glorify God by changing something. Regardless, in that type of circumstance, let each one of us be fully convinced in our own mind.

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## Ben Zartman (Dec 18, 2019)

If you're not being a sluggard--something which Proverbs heartily condemns--then contentment with your lot is a great thing. And where you are now may be the best place for you; but you must consider whether it will be seemly five or ten years from now. It may be OK to live with your parents in your twenties, but how will it be in your forties?
Remember also that it is good for a man to bear the yoke in his youth. Now is the time to develop skills and knowledge that can secure you better employment when/if you do get married and move out. I never went to college, but I spent my life developing skills that now stand me in good stead. I can't imagine how I'd provide for my family if all I knew was how to flip burgers and bag groceries (which were some of my first jobs).
The best thing you can do is excel at whatever you have before you now. "Seest thou a man diligent about his business? He shall stand before kings: he shall not stand before mean men." When I was flipping burgers in high school, I wanted to be the best burger flipper. When I was folding pizza boxes, I wanted to be the fastest folder (did you know there's pizza-box folding championships? How cool is that!). The point is, if you strive to excel where you are, God will bring opportunities your way. Jacob strove to be the best cattle breeder in the east, and God increased him greatly, even in that humble occupation.

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## TylerRay (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Being a young man as I am, I sometimes fall easily into the trap of comparing myself to those around me. 25 years of age, no college degree, no big career track to follow, no spouse, etc. The predominate culture, I believe, would tell me to do all that I could to be successful and move out ASAP and get a wife and build a family, make a ton of money and so on and so forth.
> 
> I recently finished reading _The Jewel of Christian Contentment _by Jeremiah Burroughs and I thought it was great. Incredibly convicting. With that said, it's almost as if that now that I'm beginning to get a grasp on how to grow in contentment that the pressure is on. And I feel like, not only the secular culture but even the church would want me to have a little more fire under my footing.
> 
> ...


None of us know your situation well enough to judge one way or another. I would encourage you to let the law of God be your judge. You have been reflecting on the tenth commandment, your duty to be content with your lot. I encourage you to balance your reflections with the eighth commandment:

Q. 141. _What are the duties required in the eighth commandment?_
A. The duties required in the eighth commandment are, truth, faithfulness, and justice in contracts and commerce between man and man; rendering to every one his due; restitution of goods unlawfully detained from the right owners thereof; giving and lending freely, according to our abilities, and the necessities of others; moderation of our judgments, wills, and affections concerning worldly goods; a provident care and study to get, keep, use, and dispose these things which are necessary and convenient for the sustentation of our nature, and suitable to our condition; *a lawful calling, and diligence in it; *frugality; avoiding unnecessary lawsuits, and suretiship, or other like engagements; *and an endeavor, by all just and lawful means, to procure, preserve, and further the wealth and outward estate of others, as well as our own.*​

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## arapahoepark (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Another way to ask the same question on my heart is; when does contentment become laziness? Obviously contentment which is true, biblical and Christlike is never laziness, foolishness, or sin.
> 
> I suppose as a Christian we might tend to use a word like "contentment" as a veneer for sloth. And "ambition" to justify our covetousness. What's the balancing act between the two look like?


I was actually just about to start a thread on something similar...where do heavenly mindedness and earthly needs and desires intersect?

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## jw (Dec 18, 2019)

VictorBravo said:


> Josh has his hangups…
> 
> I rather like to boldly, ostentatiously even, split those infinitives. "Infinitive" derives from Latin for "indefinite" or "unlimited." They cry out to abruptly be confined.


I can't believe you had the nerve, boldly, to go there.

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## bookslover (Dec 18, 2019)

Joshua said:


> I was only joking, Friend. Carry on!



In Russia, infinitives split you!

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## Username3000 (Dec 18, 2019)

arapahoepark said:


> I was actually just about to start a thread on something similar...where do heavenly mindedness and earthly needs and desires intersect?


Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect (Romans 12:2).

The will of God is perfect; it is never contradictory. Heavenly mindedness is not at odds with lawful earthly needs and desires. 

To say it another way, a man’s duty to care for his family’s earthly needs does not chafe against his duty to be heavenly minded. 

Where do they intersect? At the glory of God. 

Whether you eat, or drink, or work, or purchase a home, or hunt, or study, whatever you do, do all to the glory of God. 

Regarding the OP:

You seem to need older men in your life. Men to guide you, men to show you what it means to be a man. Men to give you an example of how to do earthly things in a God-honouring way. 

Have you brought this question to your elders?

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

Rutherglen1794 said:


> Do not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewal of your mind, that by testing you may discern what is the will of God, what is good and acceptable and perfect (Romans 12:2).
> 
> The will of God is perfect; it is never contradictory. Heavenly mindedness is not at odds with lawful earthly needs and desires.
> 
> ...



Yup. They say they'll be praying for me. Never had a dad or any prominent men in my life at all. Just me and my mom now. And praise God she only recently this past season professed faith in Christ after 5 years of me witnessing to her. But throughout my whole life it's only been us. Which is another reason why I am hesitant about leaving home.


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## Andrew35 (Dec 18, 2019)

My ambition is not to be foolish. That's challenge enough for me at times.

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## Ed Walsh (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Still, as vague as the question might come off, is it foolish to not be ambitious. I don't mean to be lazy. Yes, I get that much.



I own a small business that has lasted 30 years so far. Once upon a time, I interviewed a man from my church for a position as a construction estimator trainee. I liked this brother but never got to really know him until the interview. I asked him what his life goals were. When did work fall in importance? Very humbly, he talked for about five minutes telling me that he didn't want too much out of life--just enough to get by will do nicely. And things like that. I had heard enough. I looked at him and said frankly that there was no place in my business for a person with such goals. That ended the interview.

Ecclesiastes 9:10
Whatsoever thy hand findeth to do, do it with thy might;
for there is no work, nor device, nor knowledge, nor wisdom, in the grave, whither thou goest.​

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

Ed Walsh said:


> Very humbly, he talked for about five minutes telling me that he didn't want too much out of life--just enough to get by will do nicely. And things like that. I had heard enough. I looked at him and said frankly that there was no place in my business for a person with such goals.



So the man was penalized for being too humble? I'm sorry, I don't quite understand. I would get it if he wouldn't have been willing to work too hard but wanted an "easy" life. That speaks to certain heart issues and character flaws. That doesn't appear to have been the case although maybe it was evident from body language or follow-up questions. If you could please explain.


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## TylerRay (Dec 18, 2019)

@Jonathan95, consider these things:

The more wealth you have, the more you can help others.
The more wealth you have, the more you can support the Church.
With greater success will come greater mastery of yourself.
With greater success will come skill and wisdom in managing your affairs.
This skill and wisdom will make you more useful for the Kingdom of Christ, and may even help fit you for church office.
Now consider the contrary:

If you choose to live in relative poverty, you will have little to give to the church or to others.
If you choose to live in relative poverty, you may find yourself occasionally needing the support of others who have been more ambitious. Those funds could go to more noble causes than to support a man without ambition.
If you choose not to seek advancement, you will likely learn very little about managing people, property, and finances. This could keep you out of church office, and make you less useful to the Kingdom than you might have been.
If you choose not to seek advancement, you will have less opportunity to learn discipline and self-mastery.

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## Ed Walsh (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> So the man was penalized for being too humble? I'm sorry, I don't quite understand. I would get it if he wouldn't have been willing to work too hard but wanted an "easy" life. That speaks to certain heart issues and character flaws. That doesn't appear to have been the case although maybe it was evident from body language or follow-up questions. If you could please explain.



I mean, his approach _sounded_ humble, but what he said was not at all true humility. It was just a plain lack of drive. I still remember almost my exact words. "I don't think my company has an opening for someone with your talents." To this day, he works odd jobs and is looking for work more than finding it. He sounded like Uriah Heep. Humility and stupidity can sometimes be cousins. What's to explain. He was a lazy guy.

Ed


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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

TylerRay said:


> @Jonathan95, consider these things:
> 
> The more wealth you have, the more you can help others.
> The more wealth you have, the more you can support the Church.
> ...



These are very good considerations. I am starting to see the bigger picture here. Thank you!

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

Ed Walsh said:


> I mean, his approach _sounded_ humble, but what he said was not at all true humility. It was just a plain lack of drive. I still remember almost my exact words. "I don't think my company has an opening for someone with your talents." To this day, he works odd jobs and is looking for work more than finding it. He sounded like Uriah Heep. Humility and stupidity can sometimes be cousins. What's to explain. He was a lazy guy.
> 
> Ed



I see! Thank you for sharing this.


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## Andrew35 (Dec 18, 2019)

Sometimes laziness can indeed masquerade as humility. This is kind of a judgment call.

While I fully agree with Ed's points, I do want to approach from a slightly different angle: not everyone lives a life setting lofty goals for themselves and their careers. If, however, you take pride in your work, focus on your craft, and set your hand to do it for God's glory, advancement will often take care of itself. People will notice And you'll avoid many of the traps into which the ambitious can fall.

"Do you see a man skillful in his work? He will stand before kings; he will not stand before obscure men." -Proverbs 22:29

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## Username3000 (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Yup. They say they'll be praying for me. Never had a dad or any prominent men in my life at all. Just me and my mom now. And praise God she only recently this past season professed faith in Christ after 5 years of me witnessing to her. But throughout my whole life it's only been us. Which is another reason why I am hesitant about leaving home.


Then your elders should be discipling you.

One thing to consider is that a man should be able to stand on his own two feet spiritually, economically etc., if he ever wishes to be the leader, provider, and protector of a family. Can you do that? Then that is what to work toward.

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## Jonathan95 (Dec 18, 2019)

Rutherglen1794 said:


> Then your elders should be discipling you.
> 
> One thing to consider is that a man should be able to stand on his own two feet spiritually, economically etc., if he ever wishes to be the leader, provider, and protector of a family. Can you do that? Then that is what to work toward.



Thank you for the resources. I am doing what I can. I can assure you of that. I don't actually wish to seek a wife currently in my life but I will take what you have stated under consideration. Thanks again.


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## OPC'n (Dec 18, 2019)

Contentment doesn't mean feeling content in your surroundings whether poor or rich. Even seeking contentment in God's peace and joy is wrong. Contentment means being content in God alone. His joy and peace etc are extra gifts that he sometimes gives to us and sometimes does not. When he does give them to us we relish in his provision and give him praise. When he doesn't give them to us we run to his feet as a child requesting more of him and give him praise and glory. In the end, we find we are only content when our contentment is in him. Are you content because you have no worries and you're comfortable in your situation? Would you be as content if all your needs weren't met? Don't measure your contentment by your feelings or surroundings, instead, measure it by your contentment in God. Then think about God's commands to all of us. One is to work hard to provide for our families and his people. Be content to please and glorify God by following his commands for us whether they be earthly duties or heavenly duties. Being content in how you feel or your circumstances is a faulty foundation that can crumble tomorrow.


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## Username3000 (Dec 18, 2019)

Jonathan95 said:


> Thank you for the resources. I am doing what I can. I can assure you of that. I don't actually wish to seek a wife currently in my life but I will take what you have stated under consideration. Thanks again.


You’re welcome. I hope they are of some help. 

Sorry I couldn’t be more of a help with the contentment aspect.


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## VictorBravo (Dec 18, 2019)

Andrew35 said:


> While I fully agree with Ed's points, I do want to approach from a slightly different angle: not everyone lives a life setting lofty goals for themselves and their careers. If, however, you take pride in your work, focus on your craft, and set your hand to do it for God's glory, advancement will often take care of itself. People will notice And you'll avoid many of the traps into which the ambitious can fall.



Took my words and posted them!

I agree with Ed regarding zeal to work and I've often had Eccl. 9:10 printed out above my desk during times of my own slackery.

But I suspect I would have not fared well with Ed's question--At various stages of my life the answer might have changed, but I had a hard time articulating a life goal. Still do, by the way. But as a young guy I probably would have said something like, "I seek to learn as much as I can, be as productive as I can, and pay the employer more than he pays me--and I want to be paid well." 

I bring up here the importance of productive activity. Not necessarily to get rich, but to do right. Besides, it feels good to be purposeful and pleasantly tired at the end of the day.

I'm self-employed too; I have been most of my life. I'm a great employee as long as my boss lets me do what I want to do. Keeping something you've built up forces you to balance present and future, yet barely gives you time to dwell on either too much. It leads one naturally to number one's days.

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## py3ak (Dec 20, 2019)

Scripture provides a lot of guidance in this area.

The fundamental ambition should be to be pleasing to God (2 Corinthians 5:9).
That means that there should be growth in grace and in knowledge (2 Peter 3:18) -- in other words, you should always be learning from the Bible and taking the next step in being a disciple.
You should work so that you can cover your own costs and also have something to give those in need (Eph. 4:28). Ideally, you can work in something that's intrinsically productive and beneficial, but that's not always possible in this world. But with the fruits of your labor you can do something productive.

If you're growing in grace, learning new information and mastering new skills, and exercising diligence at work, I think that's more important than having a specific plan. Additional responsibility and opportunity will come along, in the usual way of things, for those who are reliable and get better at their jobs.

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