# Wlc # 139



## 21st Century Calvinist (Oct 27, 2010)

So I was reading WLC #139 today and I have a couple of questions that I know someone on the PB can answer. I have posted the text below as copied/pasted from here (with proof references deleted.) Westminster Larger Catechism
What are the stews referred to here? I am thinking that they are not the warm and comforting casseroles that are such a treat on a chilly fall or winter evening. 
Also the dancings, plays, etc. mentioned (highlighted in red) is that a blanket ban on such things or does the modifier lascivious also refer to the dancings, plays, etc?
Q. 139. What are the sins forbidden in the seventh commandment?

A. The sins forbidden in the seventh commandment, besides the neglect of the duties required, are, adultery, fornication, rape, incest, sodomy, and all unnatural lusts; all unclean imaginations, thoughts, purposes, and affections; all corrupt or filthy communications, or listening thereunto; wanton looks, impudent or light behaviour, immodest apparel;prohibiting of lawful, and dispensing with unlawful marriages; allowing, *tolerating, keeping of stews,* and resorting to them;entangling vows of single life, undue delay of marriage, having more wives or husbands than one at the same time; unjust divorce, or desertion; idleness, gluttony, drunkenness, unchaste company; lascivious songs, books, pictures, dancings, stage plays; and all other provocations to, or acts of uncleanness, either in ourselves or others.


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## NaphtaliPress (Oct 27, 2010)

Stews=brothels.


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## Wayne (Oct 27, 2010)

_Stews_ = brothels 
[etymological aside: did the term arise as a pun, from the "broth" portion of the word _brothel_; broth > stew ? Or is that reaching?]

Then with "books, pictures, dancings, stage plays" the implication is primarily insofar as those things have lascivious content. Books and pictures have a wider context and the point here obviously is not to rule out all books or pictures, just those which lend themselves to the subject at hand--violations of the seventh commandment. Dancings and stage plays are a bit more up for discussion in the context of the Puritan era. And not just within the Puritan era, but there is a long tradition of Christians speaking out against stage plays, for one as they have historically been a wellspring of a great deal of sinfulness. Even into the early 20th century, while we still had the vestiges of a wider Christian culture, the acting profession was looked down upon.

Some of Chris Coldwell's earlier work, _The Naphtali Press Anthology_ included reprints of a few sermons and discourses where various pastors spoke against the evils of the stage. The CTS Library has a full set of that Anthology, as does the PCA Historical Center, if you want a closer look at any of that material.


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## 21st Century Calvinist (Oct 27, 2010)

Gentlemen, Thank you both for your helpful responses. Would never have worked out stews on my own. 
I never realized that the reason some Christians objected/object to dancing and plays was based on the seventh commandment. Makes perfect sense now.
Wayne, I am so going to come see you someday soon.


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## Andres (Oct 28, 2010)

Wayne said:


> Dancings and stage plays are a bit more up for discussion in the context of the Puritan era. And not just within the Puritan era, but there is a long tradition of Christians speaking out against stage plays, for one as they have historically been a wellspring of a great deal of sinfulness. Even into the early 20th century, while we still had the vestiges of a wider Christian culture, the acting profession was looked down upon.



Was acting not also understood by some to contain an element of deception, in that actors were portraying something they were not?


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## Peairtach (Oct 31, 2010)

Of more ingeniousness than the word "stew" is that the divines classed idleness, gluttony and drunkenness under the Seventh Commandment:


> The sins forbidden in the seventh commandment, besides the neglect of the duties required, are...idleness, gluttony, drunkenness



We know from Scripture that unjustified idleness, and gluttony and drunkenness are sinful, but are they really summarily comprehended under "Thou shalt not commit adultery"?


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## Contra_Mundum (Oct 31, 2010)

Richard,
The answer, typical for such issues, is in the prooftexts offered. The associations were first made (according to the 17th cent. interpretation of these texts) by the Scriptural prophets themselves.

Ezekiel 16:49. Behold, this was the iniquity of thy sister Sodom, pride, *fulness of bread*, and abundance of *idleness* was in her and in her daughters, neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and needy. [This passage is notorious for its description of Jerusalem (presumably "sister Gomorrah") and her "sister Sodom" (clearly identified as Samaria) as most irrepressible whores]

Proverbs 23:30-33. They that *tarry long at the wine*; they that go to seek mixed wine. Look not thou upon the wine when it is red, when it giveth his colour in the cup, when it moveth itself aright. At the last it biteth like a serpent, and stingeth like an adder. *Thine eyes shall behold strange women*, and thine heart shall utter perverse things.

The probable connection between these sins and the 7C has to do with such sins becoming occasions for additional fleshly indulgence. It does not mean that such sins cannot be classified under one or more other commandments as well.


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## 21st Century Calvinist (Oct 31, 2010)

I can easily see how idleness leads to breaking the seventh commandment- look at David and Bathsheeba. I can also see how drunkenness leads to the same. I work with non Christians! But like Richard I don't see the ready connection with gluttony. Is it a case of "a way to a man's heart is through his stomach?"


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## toddpedlar (Oct 31, 2010)

21st Century Calvinist said:


> I can easily see how idleness leads to breaking the seventh commandment- look at David and Bathsheeba. I can also see how drunkenness leads to the same. I work with non Christians! But like Richard I don't see the ready connection with gluttony. Is it a case of "a way to a man's heart is through his stomach?"


 
Donnie -

I think the connection between drunkenness, gluttony and adultery is through the fact that all 3 sins reflect a lawful and good activity whose proper bounds have been transgressed. All are also connected to "physical appetites" which have gone nuts - seeking alcohol, which is good in proper measure, in excessive quantities such that you are degraded; seeking food, which is good in proper measure, in excessive quantities such that you are degraded; seeking sexual activity, which is good in proper measure and within proper boundaries, in excessive quantity, such that you are degraded. Seems all very similar to me, and the puritans did at times write on these subjects in this way.


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## 21st Century Calvinist (Oct 31, 2010)

Thanks, Todd. "I found that post helpful." I guess I was just looking for a straight line between gluttony and adultery, like I see with drunkenness and idleness. But yes, I see the connection through physical appetites gone awry.


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## Peairtach (Oct 31, 2010)

Fair enough. They are all various lusts of the flesh. 

They could be classed under other Commandments also, but maybe the Seventh is the most appropriate.


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