Any Historic Premillennialists on Here?

Status
Not open for further replies.

convicted1

Puritan Board Freshman
Hello again, Willis,

In the eternal state, earth has been cleansed by fire—whether utterly dissolved and recreated, or its surface burned away and remade, commentators vary—and upon this New Earth the city of God, New Jerusalem, has come down (Rev 21:1,2,3). The land promises now are fulfilled not only by the boundaries of old Israel but include the entire earth ("the meek shall inherit the earth"). The Israel of God possesses the world, indeed, the universe.

Zechariah 14:1,2,3,4 was the last thing I let go of from my premil days, that is, interpreting it literally. I now believe it stands for the ravaging of the church during the age, and particularly its being overcome at the very end. Although it is certainly possible the Lord could touch upon the Mount of Olives at the end, though I think Rev 6:14, "And the heaven departed as a scroll when it is rolled together; and every mountain and island were moved out of their places" indicates that upon His return the earth will not remain intact. The two witnesses of Rev 11 were the next-to-last thing I relinquished upon embracing the amil view.

I think Zechariah 14 speaks of a future time and not something that occured during the Christ's earthly ministry. Seems the writing speaks of future events. Seems like John Gill's commentary is spot on. But I, and Gill, could be wrong.
 

Dachaser

Puritan Board Doctor
Jesus sets up the Kingdom here on all the earth when He returns, as all peoples and nations will acknowledge Him as the Lord...

After that era, Bible states thatHe turns all ofthat to His father, so that God is all...

D see this is essentially a more literal view of how to understand prophecy...
 

MW

Puritanboard Amanuensis
I think Zechariah 14 speaks of a future time and not something that occured during the Christ's earthly ministry. Seems the writing speaks of future events. Seems like John Gill's commentary is spot on. But I, and Gill, could be wrong.

Didn't Gill interpret the feast of tabernacles spiritually? That doesn't seem consistent to me.

Believers in Christ keep the feast, v. 16. Believers in Christ are holy to the Lord, and whatever they use in service to the Lord is also holy, v. 20, 21. If this prophecy awaited fulfilment believers could not be called "saints." But believers are repeatedly addressed as "saints" in the New Testament. That is an eschatological realisation of Old Testament apocalyptic visions.

This prophecy is understood to refer to an eschatological judgment necessitated by the Lord coming to save His people from the covenant curse of international invasion. The curse was borne by Christ. Believers in Christ are delivered from the curse. He is the restoration promised in the book of the covenant. Unbelieving Israel suffered the full weight of the curse and have been cut off for ever, just as was foretold by the prophets. The benediction is pronounced on the Israel of God, the children of Abraham according to the promise, identified in Galatians as those who believe in Christ, the promised Seed.
 

Peairtach

Puritan Board Doctor
Zechariah 14 talks about e.g. living waters flowing out to the world. We've very much had that since the beginning of the NT era.

There's been a great earthquake. The end of the OT administration and the beginning of the New.

Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
 

Dachaser

Puritan Board Doctor
The Jews were not revived as a nation though at that time, and the earthquake was saidto be in aliteral/physical fashion...

Think that making it a spiritual one really is reading into the passage our theology!
 

MW

Puritanboard Amanuensis
The Jews were not revived as a nation though at that time, and the earthquake was saidto be in aliteral/physical fashion...

Think that making it a spiritual one really is reading into the passage our theology!

See John 7 for the rivers of living water in relation to the feast of tabernacles as fulfilled in the glorification of Jesus and the the giving of the Spirit.

The giving of the Spirit is the specific sign of the last days, Acts 2. It inaugurates a spiritual economy which sets the people of God free from bondage to those earthly elements which were part of the Old Testament economy. The Old Testament speaks of this new age according to the types with which it was familiar. We read the fulfilment in the light of the Antitype. It is not a matter of reading our theology into the passage, but of reading it with the veil taken away. 2 Corinthians 3.
 

Dachaser

Puritan Board Doctor
And this would be an issue where A Mil and Pre Mils would see things in a different fashion, as we would tend to see those passages being fulfilled in a literal sense when Jesus returns toi earth...
 

Peairtach

Puritan Board Doctor
And this would be an issue where A Mil and Pre Mils would see things in a different fashion, as we would tend to see those passages being fulfilled in a literal sense when Jesus returns toi earth...
You see the "living waters" in v.8 as some kind super plumbing arrangements during the millennial period? That's all that can be meant by taking verse 8 "literally".

Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

Dachaser

Puritan Board Doctor
was speaking more towards Him setting foot on Mount of Olives again, and the earthquake being a real physical one!
 

Peairtach

Puritan Board Doctor
Your literalism is literally selective. Is there going to be a problem with the lighting during the millennium, too? (vv. 6-7)

Sent from my C6903 using Tapatalk
 
Last edited:

MW

Puritanboard Amanuensis
And this would be an issue where A Mil and Pre Mils would see things in a different fashion, as we would tend to see those passages being fulfilled in a literal sense when Jesus returns toi earth...

Jesus hadn't come for the first time. The literal sense should make sense of the passage in its historical context. And it is theologically responsible to take note of the typical and prophetic imagery which Jesus has used to explain the significance of His coming into the world -- a significance for time and eternity.

The passage speaks of the geography of Israel being altered. That is an internal marker that figurative language is being used, as when Jesus speaks of the mountain being cast into the sea.

Other cataclysmic passages of the Old Testament clearly relate to the covenantal alterations which would take place with the coming of Jesus. E.g., Haggai's shaking as explained in Hebrews 12.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top