Are there any Erastian state churches today?

[NaphtaliPress]

Presuming that a generalized working definition of bare bones Erastianism is that the ultimate appeal of church discipline is to the state, are there any true Erastian churches today? I don't know for instance what the Revolution settlement did for the Anglican church; did that power in that church go solely to the bishops or how did church censures work before the modern era apostasy?

 

[Taylor]

Would Vatican City count? I honestly don’t know.

 

[RamistThomist]

Presuming that a generalized working definition of bare bones Erastianism is that the ultimate appeal of church discipline is to the state, are there any true Erastian churches today? I don't know for instance what the Revolution settlement did for the Anglican church; did that power in that church go solely to the bishops or how did church censures work before the modern era apostasy?

In America or outside America? The Prime Minister usually chooses the first recommended name, and then he or she forwards that to her majesty.

 

[Eyedoc84]

Would Vatican City count? I honestly don’t know.

They would be the opposite, right? In RCC, the Pope is supreme over the state.

 

[Scottish Presbyterian]

Presuming that a generalized working definition of bare bones Erastianism is that the ultimate appeal of church discipline is to the state, are there any true Erastian churches today? I don't know for instance what the Revolution settlement did for the Anglican church; did that power in that church go solely to the bishops or how did church censures work before the modern era apostasy?

I'm pretty sure the Church of England is still Erastian in the sense you describe, at least officially.

 

[Taylor]

They would be the opposite, right? In RCC, the Pope is supreme over the state.

That’s what I’m wondering. Is the pope also a state official? If that’s the case, it still seems Erastian. I don’t see really any practical difference between a head of the state who is also head of the church and a head of the church who is also head of the state.

 

[SeanPatrickCornell]

That’s what I’m wondering. Is the pope also a state official? If that’s the case, it still seems Erastian. I don’t see really any practical difference between a head of the state who is also head of the church and a head of the church who is also head of the state.

I guess the question to ask though is, does Vatican City have any citizens that aren't high officials in the Catholic Church? Seems to me that the Vatican is a unique creature.

 

[MChase]

That’s what I’m wondering. Is the pope also a state official? If that’s the case, it still seems Erastian. I don’t see really any practical difference between a head of the state who is also head of the church and a head of the church who is also head of the state.

There is a difference between a state excommunicating and the church carrying out a death penalty. Both bad, but different nonetheless.

 

[Taylor]

There is a difference between a state excommunicating and the church carrying out a death penalty. Both bad, but different nonetheless.

What if the head of the state and the church are the same person? Does Erastianism require that the state not be clergy?

 

[ZackF]

In any state where the church is undergoing an investiture contest can be thought of as least partially Erastian. The RCC has CCP appointed bishops.

 

[Charles Johnson]

What if the head of the state and the church are the same person? Does Erastianism require that the state not be clergy?

Then it's called Caesaro-papism. Erastianism does indeed require that the state not be the clergy.

 

[Tom Hart]

The Church of Tuvalu, while perhaps not officially Erastian (they don’t even seem to have a website, so their exact beliefs are difficult to ascertain), is the state church in a country where the government exercises some power over religion.

 

[Taylor]

Then it's called Caesaro-papism. Erastianism does indeed require that the state not be the clergy.

Ah, yes. I haven’t heard that term in many years. Thanks for clearing that up for me.