Did Preincarnate Christ Suffer?
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RamistThomist
Puritanboard Clerk
Can the divine nature suffer? The only way "creation" can be suffering is if we take a Neo-Platonic or Gnostic view that creation is a diminution, or even act of violence.
C. Matthew McMahon
Christian Preacher
Correct. God as God cannot suffer at any time. Any mention of “suffering” or any other like anthropopathic ideas conveyed to us are for our apprehension. They are true insofar as God desires us to have a certain conception, but God never changes, or suffers. (God is unchanging. James 1:17; Psalm 33:11, 102:12, 25-27; Num. 23:19; Mal. 3:6; 1 Sam. 15:29; Isa 46:10; Rom. 11:29; Titus 1:2; Heb. 6:18; 2 Tim. 2:13; James 1:17. God is infinitely perfect. Psalm 18:25-26, 92:15; Mark 10:18; Matt 5:48; Deut. 32:4; Job 34:10, 36:23; Gen. 18:25; 2 Chr. 19:7; Rom. 9:14. God described in human terms. Psalm 44:23, Jer. 7:13; Jer. 7:25; Psalm 73:20, 78:65; Psalm 121:4; Isa. 40:28, Isa. 51:9; Psalm 11:4; Heb. 4:13.
God is a simple spiritual essence. Simple, in this way, means without parts. When a man lays down on a bed, his head is at one point and his feet are at another. God does not have parts that extend in one place or another. We understand that God is a single and simple essence. Instead, as a spirit, God is able to be everywhere, infinitely, in the fullness of His being at all times. Thomas Watson explains, “when the sun shines in a room, not the body of the sun is there, but the light, heat and influence of the sun.” In His uniqueness as a Spirit, Charnock says, “We can conceive no other of God, if he were not a pure, entire unmixed Spirit.” Christ said, “God is Spirit,” (John 4:24). God is simple in that He is “void of all composition, division and change.” God is not subject to generality, or specialty. He does not have matter or that which is made of matter. Whatever is in God, is His essence, and all that He is, He is by nature. This teaching guards Christians against God being made up of parts, or having some incompleteness to His nature.
It’s easier to understand that God has no parts, but more difficult to understand that God has no passions. We read in Scripture, “For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains,” (Deut. 32:22). And, "God loveth a cheerful giver," (2 Cor. 9:7). These seem like “responses” to human actions. When men sin against God, He gets angry. When Christians give cheerfully, He becomes happy. But, passions, or affections, that describe God in Scripture, such as love, hatred, anger, jealousy, patience, and the like, either describe God’s actions in human terms, so we understand His relationship to the action more clearly, or they describe Him figuratively. God does not change in His emotions from one moment to the next. Instead, with God there is, "no variableness, neither shadow of turning," (James 1:17). This includes His apparent emotions which even include the possibility of suffering or being "dismayed."
God is a simple spiritual essence. Simple, in this way, means without parts. When a man lays down on a bed, his head is at one point and his feet are at another. God does not have parts that extend in one place or another. We understand that God is a single and simple essence. Instead, as a spirit, God is able to be everywhere, infinitely, in the fullness of His being at all times. Thomas Watson explains, “when the sun shines in a room, not the body of the sun is there, but the light, heat and influence of the sun.” In His uniqueness as a Spirit, Charnock says, “We can conceive no other of God, if he were not a pure, entire unmixed Spirit.” Christ said, “God is Spirit,” (John 4:24). God is simple in that He is “void of all composition, division and change.” God is not subject to generality, or specialty. He does not have matter or that which is made of matter. Whatever is in God, is His essence, and all that He is, He is by nature. This teaching guards Christians against God being made up of parts, or having some incompleteness to His nature.
It’s easier to understand that God has no parts, but more difficult to understand that God has no passions. We read in Scripture, “For a fire is kindled in mine anger, and shall burn unto the lowest hell, and shall consume the earth with her increase, and set on fire the foundations of the mountains,” (Deut. 32:22). And, "God loveth a cheerful giver," (2 Cor. 9:7). These seem like “responses” to human actions. When men sin against God, He gets angry. When Christians give cheerfully, He becomes happy. But, passions, or affections, that describe God in Scripture, such as love, hatred, anger, jealousy, patience, and the like, either describe God’s actions in human terms, so we understand His relationship to the action more clearly, or they describe Him figuratively. God does not change in His emotions from one moment to the next. Instead, with God there is, "no variableness, neither shadow of turning," (James 1:17). This includes His apparent emotions which even include the possibility of suffering or being "dismayed."
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