earl40
Puritan Board Professor
Below is a bold response to a RC who believes against the cardinal doctrine of faith alone...any editing tips would be appreciated greatly.
BIBLE SAYS FAITH AND WORKS NEEDED FOR SALVATION
Sal Ciresi
During the Protestant Reformation in the early 1500s, a familiar term regarding salvation was "sola fide," Latin for "by faith alone." The reformers, at that time, accused the Catholic Church of departing from the "simple purity of the Gospel" of Jesus Christ. They stated it was faith alone, without works of any kind that brought a believer to eternal life. This is partially true because the reformers believed “eternal life” is a work of The Holy Spirit and He, The Holy Spirit, gives “eternal life” by the grace of preaching Jesus to the unregenerate, or spiritually dead, and that work “bringing life” is done by the Holy Spirit alone. Now when this happens faith is given and that faith is the instrument, or tool, used to connect people to Christ. Now the RC church, like many Protestants today, gets the order of regeneration and faith backwards. Read John 3:3, in context, for this is the direct teaching of Jesus…John 3:3 “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.” So regeneration or “eternal life” precedes anyone having faith. Now to clear up another misconception in how you are using the word “salvation”. It has many different meanings and one must use precise words to explain the biblical teaching of JUSTIFICATION which is the issue.
They defined this faith as "the confidence of man, associated with the certainty of salvation, because the merciful Father will forgive sins because of Christ's sake." How anybody can disagree with this beyond me, in that to assert salvation from beginning to end is not anything other than for "Christ sake" is a clear repudiation of The Gospel. Isaiah 53:11 "Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see and be satisfied;
by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities."
This view of salvation is a crucial issue because it strikes at the very heart of the Gospel message eternal life. Allow me to quibble a tad on how the issue is JUSTIFICATION before God and not “salvation” because all Protestants should believe that the ultimate OUTWORKING of salvation is when we are resurrected in the future.
Roman Catholicism teaches that we are not saved by faith alone. Now this IS THE ISSUE
The Church has taught this since 30 A.D. as part of the Divine Revelation. I will let you try to document this statement that is patiently false and I know you have no document that teaches such dated from 30 A.D.
The truth of the Catholic Church's teaching can be demonstrated from Sacred Scripture alone. Catholic yes just not Roman catholic.
All who claim the title "Christian" will be able to agree on the following two truths: salvation is by grace alone (Ephesian2:8) and salvation is through Christ alone (Acts 4:12). These biblical facts will be our foundation as we explain the teaching of the Catholic Church. I will agree and take the title of “Christian”
If we take a concordance and look up every occurrence of the word "faith," we come up with an undeniable fact the only time the phrase "faith alone" is used in the entire Bible is when it is condemned (James 2:24). The epistle of James only mentions it in the negative sense. If one reads James, in context, he is speaking of how men are justified before MEN. Also no Protestant will disagree that goods works will ALWAYS follow those who are justified before God and thus can say with James that a faith without works is not a real faith in God or a DEAD faith.
The Bible tells us we must have faith in order to be saved (Hebrews 11:6). Hebrews 11 is speaking of those who have faith and have been justified already. Read Romans 4 in context and see that any type of work, be it grace produced good works or not, will not justify anybody “before God”….”4 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
Yet is faith nothing more than believing and trusting? Searching the Scriptures, we see faith also involves assent to God's truth (1 Thessalonians 2:13), obedience to Him (Romans 1:5, 16:26), and it must be working in love (Galatians 5:6). These points appeared to be missed by the reformers, yet they are just as crucial as believing and trusting. (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) should be heeded by all it's certainly an attention grabber. No reformer would disagree with that one needs to exercise one’s faith. The reformers stated clearly that this “exercise” or “working in love” has NOTHING to do with how one is justified before God. By asserting a person must work to achieve a right standing or to be justified before God is nothing but a works based salvation which is CLEARLY spelled out as being another Gospel. Let us look at one reference cited above, in context, and see if it makes the point that any work merit eternal life……..note the below the role of FAITH.”5 It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.2 Behold I, Paul, say to you that if you receive circumcision, Christ will be of no benefit to you.3 And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law. 4 You have been severed from Christ, you who [are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.” Now some may say faith is a work but as Ephesians says in context “8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and [that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;” Here we see faith is not a work but a possession given by God’s grace alone and it says specifically one is SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH” and this faith is “9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.”, which BTW includes faith “WORKING in love.” Faith is not a work, it is indeed "believing and trusting in Christ alone" as the reformers said.
J.C. Ryle: says:…”Moreover, the Scriptures nowhere teach us that faith sanctifies us in the same sense and in the same manner that faith justifies us! Justifying faith is a grace that “worketh not,” but simply trusts, rests, and leans on Christ (Rom. 4:5). Sanctifying faith is a grace of which the very life is action: it “worketh by love,” and, like a mainspring, moves the whole inward man (Gal. 5:6).”(Holiness, xviii).
Paul speaks of faith as a life-long process; EXERCISING faith is indeed a lifelong process
never as a one-time experience (Philippians 2:12). Here we have scripture that people are called to strive after SANCTIFICATION which is a life log process and Philippians is not speaking justification.
"He never assumes he has nothing to worry about. If he did, his words in (1 Corinthians 9:24-27) would be nonsensical. He reiterates the same point again in his second letter to Corinth (2 Corinthians 13:5). He takes nothing for granted, yet all would agree if anyone was "born again" it certainly was Paul. Our Lord and Savior spoke of the same thing by "remaining in Him" (John 15:1-11). All of these passages are written for believers, who posses eternal life, to gain ASSURANCE AND NOT SALVATION which you know few RC have because of the thinking that they have to indeed merit to enter heaven.
Paul tells us our faith is living and can go through many stages. It never stays permanently fixed after a single conversion experience no matter how genuine or sincere. Our faith can be shipwrecked (1 Timothy 1:19) Indeed one can if they do not heed was was written a few lines above "15 Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief:" This happens when you do not heed The Object of faith, Jesus. departed from (1 Timothy 4:1), disowned (1 Timothy 5:8) wandered from (1 Timothy 6:10), and missed (1 Timothy 6:21). Christians do not have a "waiver" that exempts them from these verses. Men ought to try to harmonize what Jesus said to what you think these verses say for scripture cannot be set against itself. "27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:28 and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand.29 My Father, who hath given them unto me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand." Here you would see that men who have "eternal life" which includes all who have real faith are not able to be snatched out of His hand. This goes in direct opposition of the RC teaching of what and how long "eternal life" or regeneration is. No doubt a RC must think one can be born again and again and again through the sacrament of penance for mortal sin which kills.
Do our works mean anything? According to Jesus they do (Matthew 25:31-46). The people rewarded and punished are done so by their actions. And our thoughts (Matthew 15:18-20) and words (James 3:6-12) are accountable as well. These verses are just as much part of the Bible as Romans 10:8-13 and John 3:3-5. All good Protestants believe that there are rewards but Justification is by THE WORK of Jesus ALONE, as is the reprobation of the unbeliever unto hell is based on the work of ADAM. Believe in the second Adam, Jesus, for the salvation of you soul.
Some will object by appealing to Romans 4:3 and stating Abraham was "declared righteous" before circumcision. Thus he was only saved by "believing" faith (Genesis 15:6), not by faith "working in love" (Galatians 5:6). Isn't this what Paul means when he says none will be justified by "works of law" (Romans 3:28)? No, this is not what he means. He's condemning the Old Covenant sacrifices and rituals which couldn't justify and pointing to better things now in Christ Jesus in the New Covenant (Hebrews 7-10). A close examination of Abraham's life revealed a man of God who did something. In Genesis 12-14 he makes two geographical moves, builds an altar and calls on the Lord, divides land with Lot to end quarrels, pays tithes, and refuses goods from the King of Sodom to rely instead on God's providence. He did all these works as an old man. It was certainly a struggle. After all these actions of faith, then he's "declared righteous" (Genesis 15:6). Did these works play a role in his justification? According to the Bible, yes. With all you just wrote you separates the OT saints from the NT saints, for ALL men OT and NT are saved by faith, read Romans 5 which is talking about us and all men who ever lived.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness.
The Catholic Church has never taught we "earn" our salvation. It is an inheritance (Galatians 5:21), freely given to anyone who becomes a child of God (1 John 3:1), so long as they remain that way (John 15:1-11). You can't earn it but you can lose the free gift given from the Father (James 1:17). So God grants "eternal life" and faith but tales it all back? Also you are not being truthful in saying the RC church foes not say you can earn heaven. You believe The Treasury of Merit is available to those who are in purgatory and that merit can be purchased with indulgences which are a propitiation of sins committed. There is no thing more revolting to any true Christian than to think it is not Christ ALONE who the sins of His children were laid as being The Meritorious One.
The reformer's position cannot be reconciled with the Bible. That is why the Catholic Church has taught otherwise for over 1,960 years. The Catholic Church has and always will be around...just don't think the Roman Catholic church is a true church. The RC rein officially ended with Trent and its contradiction of Galatians.
Where does our assistance come from to reach our heavenly destination? Philippians 4:13 says it all, "I can do all things in Him who strengthens me."
Assistance? I rather have A Savior.
(Sal Ciresi has lectured on apologetics in the diocese of Arlington, VA and has resided in Northern Virginia since his discharge from the Marine Corps in 1991.) Feel free with sharing this with Sal.
BIBLE SAYS FAITH AND WORKS NEEDED FOR SALVATION
Sal Ciresi
During the Protestant Reformation in the early 1500s, a familiar term regarding salvation was "sola fide," Latin for "by faith alone." The reformers, at that time, accused the Catholic Church of departing from the "simple purity of the Gospel" of Jesus Christ. They stated it was faith alone, without works of any kind that brought a believer to eternal life. This is partially true because the reformers believed “eternal life” is a work of The Holy Spirit and He, The Holy Spirit, gives “eternal life” by the grace of preaching Jesus to the unregenerate, or spiritually dead, and that work “bringing life” is done by the Holy Spirit alone. Now when this happens faith is given and that faith is the instrument, or tool, used to connect people to Christ. Now the RC church, like many Protestants today, gets the order of regeneration and faith backwards. Read John 3:3, in context, for this is the direct teaching of Jesus…John 3:3 “Truly, truly, I say to you, unless one is born again he cannot see the kingdom of God.” So regeneration or “eternal life” precedes anyone having faith. Now to clear up another misconception in how you are using the word “salvation”. It has many different meanings and one must use precise words to explain the biblical teaching of JUSTIFICATION which is the issue.
They defined this faith as "the confidence of man, associated with the certainty of salvation, because the merciful Father will forgive sins because of Christ's sake." How anybody can disagree with this beyond me, in that to assert salvation from beginning to end is not anything other than for "Christ sake" is a clear repudiation of The Gospel. Isaiah 53:11 "Out of the anguish of his soul he shall see and be satisfied;
by his knowledge shall the righteous one, my servant, make many to be accounted righteous, and he shall bear their iniquities."
This view of salvation is a crucial issue because it strikes at the very heart of the Gospel message eternal life. Allow me to quibble a tad on how the issue is JUSTIFICATION before God and not “salvation” because all Protestants should believe that the ultimate OUTWORKING of salvation is when we are resurrected in the future.
Roman Catholicism teaches that we are not saved by faith alone. Now this IS THE ISSUE
The Church has taught this since 30 A.D. as part of the Divine Revelation. I will let you try to document this statement that is patiently false and I know you have no document that teaches such dated from 30 A.D.
The truth of the Catholic Church's teaching can be demonstrated from Sacred Scripture alone. Catholic yes just not Roman catholic.
All who claim the title "Christian" will be able to agree on the following two truths: salvation is by grace alone (Ephesian2:8) and salvation is through Christ alone (Acts 4:12). These biblical facts will be our foundation as we explain the teaching of the Catholic Church. I will agree and take the title of “Christian”
If we take a concordance and look up every occurrence of the word "faith," we come up with an undeniable fact the only time the phrase "faith alone" is used in the entire Bible is when it is condemned (James 2:24). The epistle of James only mentions it in the negative sense. If one reads James, in context, he is speaking of how men are justified before MEN. Also no Protestant will disagree that goods works will ALWAYS follow those who are justified before God and thus can say with James that a faith without works is not a real faith in God or a DEAD faith.
The Bible tells us we must have faith in order to be saved (Hebrews 11:6). Hebrews 11 is speaking of those who have faith and have been justified already. Read Romans 4 in context and see that any type of work, be it grace produced good works or not, will not justify anybody “before God”….”4 What then shall we say that Abraham, our forefather according to the flesh, has found? 2 For if Abraham was justified by works, he has something to boast about, but not before God.
Yet is faith nothing more than believing and trusting? Searching the Scriptures, we see faith also involves assent to God's truth (1 Thessalonians 2:13), obedience to Him (Romans 1:5, 16:26), and it must be working in love (Galatians 5:6). These points appeared to be missed by the reformers, yet they are just as crucial as believing and trusting. (1 Corinthians 13:1-3) should be heeded by all it's certainly an attention grabber. No reformer would disagree with that one needs to exercise one’s faith. The reformers stated clearly that this “exercise” or “working in love” has NOTHING to do with how one is justified before God. By asserting a person must work to achieve a right standing or to be justified before God is nothing but a works based salvation which is CLEARLY spelled out as being another Gospel. Let us look at one reference cited above, in context, and see if it makes the point that any work merit eternal life……..note the below the role of FAITH.”5 It was for freedom that Christ set us free; therefore keep standing firm and do not be subject again to a yoke of slavery.2 Behold I, Paul, say to you that if you receive circumcision, Christ will be of no benefit to you.3 And I testify again to every man who receives circumcision, that he is under obligation to keep the whole Law. 4 You have been severed from Christ, you who [are seeking to be justified by law; you have fallen from grace. 5 For we through the Spirit, by faith, are waiting for the hope of righteousness.6 For in Christ Jesus neither circumcision nor uncircumcision means anything, but faith working through love.” Now some may say faith is a work but as Ephesians says in context “8 For by grace you have been saved through faith; and [that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God;” Here we see faith is not a work but a possession given by God’s grace alone and it says specifically one is SAVED BY GRACE THROUGH FAITH” and this faith is “9 not as a result of works, so that no one may boast.”, which BTW includes faith “WORKING in love.” Faith is not a work, it is indeed "believing and trusting in Christ alone" as the reformers said.
J.C. Ryle: says:…”Moreover, the Scriptures nowhere teach us that faith sanctifies us in the same sense and in the same manner that faith justifies us! Justifying faith is a grace that “worketh not,” but simply trusts, rests, and leans on Christ (Rom. 4:5). Sanctifying faith is a grace of which the very life is action: it “worketh by love,” and, like a mainspring, moves the whole inward man (Gal. 5:6).”(Holiness, xviii).
Paul speaks of faith as a life-long process; EXERCISING faith is indeed a lifelong process
never as a one-time experience (Philippians 2:12). Here we have scripture that people are called to strive after SANCTIFICATION which is a life log process and Philippians is not speaking justification.
"He never assumes he has nothing to worry about. If he did, his words in (1 Corinthians 9:24-27) would be nonsensical. He reiterates the same point again in his second letter to Corinth (2 Corinthians 13:5). He takes nothing for granted, yet all would agree if anyone was "born again" it certainly was Paul. Our Lord and Savior spoke of the same thing by "remaining in Him" (John 15:1-11). All of these passages are written for believers, who posses eternal life, to gain ASSURANCE AND NOT SALVATION which you know few RC have because of the thinking that they have to indeed merit to enter heaven.
Paul tells us our faith is living and can go through many stages. It never stays permanently fixed after a single conversion experience no matter how genuine or sincere. Our faith can be shipwrecked (1 Timothy 1:19) Indeed one can if they do not heed was was written a few lines above "15 Faithful is the saying, and worthy of all acceptation, that Christ Jesus came into the world to save sinners; of whom I am chief:" This happens when you do not heed The Object of faith, Jesus. departed from (1 Timothy 4:1), disowned (1 Timothy 5:8) wandered from (1 Timothy 6:10), and missed (1 Timothy 6:21). Christians do not have a "waiver" that exempts them from these verses. Men ought to try to harmonize what Jesus said to what you think these verses say for scripture cannot be set against itself. "27 My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:28 and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, and no one shall snatch them out of my hand.29 My Father, who hath given them unto me, is greater than all; and no one is able to snatch them out of the Father's hand." Here you would see that men who have "eternal life" which includes all who have real faith are not able to be snatched out of His hand. This goes in direct opposition of the RC teaching of what and how long "eternal life" or regeneration is. No doubt a RC must think one can be born again and again and again through the sacrament of penance for mortal sin which kills.
Do our works mean anything? According to Jesus they do (Matthew 25:31-46). The people rewarded and punished are done so by their actions. And our thoughts (Matthew 15:18-20) and words (James 3:6-12) are accountable as well. These verses are just as much part of the Bible as Romans 10:8-13 and John 3:3-5. All good Protestants believe that there are rewards but Justification is by THE WORK of Jesus ALONE, as is the reprobation of the unbeliever unto hell is based on the work of ADAM. Believe in the second Adam, Jesus, for the salvation of you soul.
Some will object by appealing to Romans 4:3 and stating Abraham was "declared righteous" before circumcision. Thus he was only saved by "believing" faith (Genesis 15:6), not by faith "working in love" (Galatians 5:6). Isn't this what Paul means when he says none will be justified by "works of law" (Romans 3:28)? No, this is not what he means. He's condemning the Old Covenant sacrifices and rituals which couldn't justify and pointing to better things now in Christ Jesus in the New Covenant (Hebrews 7-10). A close examination of Abraham's life revealed a man of God who did something. In Genesis 12-14 he makes two geographical moves, builds an altar and calls on the Lord, divides land with Lot to end quarrels, pays tithes, and refuses goods from the King of Sodom to rely instead on God's providence. He did all these works as an old man. It was certainly a struggle. After all these actions of faith, then he's "declared righteous" (Genesis 15:6). Did these works play a role in his justification? According to the Bible, yes. With all you just wrote you separates the OT saints from the NT saints, for ALL men OT and NT are saved by faith, read Romans 5 which is talking about us and all men who ever lived.
5 But to him that worketh not, but believeth on him that justifieth the ungodly, his faith is reckoned for righteousness.
The Catholic Church has never taught we "earn" our salvation. It is an inheritance (Galatians 5:21), freely given to anyone who becomes a child of God (1 John 3:1), so long as they remain that way (John 15:1-11). You can't earn it but you can lose the free gift given from the Father (James 1:17). So God grants "eternal life" and faith but tales it all back? Also you are not being truthful in saying the RC church foes not say you can earn heaven. You believe The Treasury of Merit is available to those who are in purgatory and that merit can be purchased with indulgences which are a propitiation of sins committed. There is no thing more revolting to any true Christian than to think it is not Christ ALONE who the sins of His children were laid as being The Meritorious One.
The reformer's position cannot be reconciled with the Bible. That is why the Catholic Church has taught otherwise for over 1,960 years. The Catholic Church has and always will be around...just don't think the Roman Catholic church is a true church. The RC rein officially ended with Trent and its contradiction of Galatians.
Where does our assistance come from to reach our heavenly destination? Philippians 4:13 says it all, "I can do all things in Him who strengthens me."
Assistance? I rather have A Savior.
(Sal Ciresi has lectured on apologetics in the diocese of Arlington, VA and has resided in Northern Virginia since his discharge from the Marine Corps in 1991.) Feel free with sharing this with Sal.
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