Existence of God as Axiomatic

Discussion in 'Apologetical Methods' started by Charles Johnson, Nov 16, 2019.

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  1. BayouHuguenot

    BayouHuguenot Puritanboard Amanuensis

    No.
     
  2. jwright82

    jwright82 Puritan Board Graduate

    Yeah I agree. Whatever we mean by infinite in math is not the same as infinite when apllied to God, qualitative differences. There are different infinities in math.
     
  3. Dachaser

    Dachaser Puritan Board Doctor

    Isn't God infinite in the absolute sense then, as none beyond Him?
     
  4. BayouHuguenot

    BayouHuguenot Puritanboard Amanuensis

    Sure. We were discussing more the idea of an infinite duration. And if you apply that to days, that means we would have had to have an infinite number of days before we get to today, which means we would have never gotten to today.
     
  5. PuritanCovenanter

    PuritanCovenanter Moderator Staff Member

    God being above and outside of creation's infinite time and space is incomprehensible. I think it always will be. I think it is part of the majesty he will always have in Himself alone as we and his creation will always be tied to time and space.
     
  6. Dachaser

    Dachaser Puritan Board Doctor

    He alone self existed outside of time and space proper.
     
  7. jwright82

    jwright82 Puritan Board Graduate

    I prefer to look at as different kinds of infinity. I brought it up because although I believe that the first cause argument is true intuitionially but I am skeptical over simplistic versions because of the work on infinities in math by Cantor show the concept is not so simple. But all the complexity of infinity that we come across on a created level is in sum total a completely different kind of "infinity" than whatever is meant by when we apply it to God.
     
  8. jwright82

    jwright82 Puritan Board Graduate

    Just an example of what I'm talking about infinite duration and different kinds of infinity. Now I completely agree with your point Jacob but I noticed a paradox. The terminator paradox (which I just made up but am pretty sure there's some concept out there) John Conner sends Kyle Reese back in time to save his mother. Kyle Reese becomes John's father only for John to grow up fight the machines (don't be skeptical SIRI 2.0 might be Skynet, I don't trust those things) train Kyle and send him back to be his father. And over and over and over again on into infinity, an infinite loop but the same finite number of days of John Conner being fathered by Kyle only to live let's say 30 years to send Kyle back. That finite 30 years hasn't changed and yet there's an infinite temporal loop. You see complex.
     
  9. Dachaser

    Dachaser Puritan Board Doctor

    Isn't God being self existent Eternal Being define His infinite status?
     
  10. BayouHuguenot

    BayouHuguenot Puritanboard Amanuensis

    Probably, but when we say infinity, do we mean it in terms of body, space, time, all of the above, none of the above?
     
  11. jwright82

    jwright82 Puritan Board Graduate

    A different kind I guess but notice how complex infinity is in human concepts. I'd say his infinity is unique.
     
  12. Dachaser

    Dachaser Puritan Board Doctor

    Beyond and above!
     
  13. BayouHuguenot

    BayouHuguenot Puritanboard Amanuensis

    Beyond, not above. Above is spatial language and connotes that God is a body.
     
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