Falling in love with the ESV

Status
Not open for further replies.
I thought most people liked the KJV for its easily memorized verse!? At least that is my opinion. The language kind of sticks in your head, even if you don't quite understand it as a kid. Although I haven't attempted memorizing any other version.
 
I thought most people liked the KJV for its easily memorized verse!? At least that is my opinion. The language kind of sticks in your head, even if you don't quite understand it as a kid. Although I haven't attempted memorizing any other version.

I guess I would ask what the point would be to memorise something that you don't understand. It is like asking someone, Sprechen Sie Deutsch, yet you don't speak German yourself.
 
:popcorn:I'm really enjoying this thread! I'm just struck by God's grace in blessing us with so many essentially literal translations. The very fact that we can discuss which one of our many Bibles is the best is truly blessing. Especially in light of our many Brothers and Sisters that do not even have access to a bad translation. Praise be to God! :sing:
 
My point wasn't that it was just beneficial to be able to memorize it and that understanding was irrelevant. Rather that the language and style added a dimension that that wasn't purely conceptual. Like a catchy song. You don't have to be conscious of the meaning of the song in order to recite it. I memorized some of the harder Pauline passages before I understood fully what he was saying. It helped to be able to call the verse to mind as I studied what it meant.
 
I love The Message. It's inerrant translation, it's majestic beauty, it's brilliant prose, it's memorizing cadence, it's flawless textual tradition. It makes the more formal translations seem like cheap copies. I hear that The Message even corrects the original Greek and Hebrew. Even John Calvin foretold of a great translation which would enter the English tongue and that it would be called "The Message". I am in tears right now at how precious The Message really is.

Why read the ESV when one can be enveloped by the comforting and awesome force of The Message?
 
ummm ok.
I got an ESV Study Bible for Christmas and it's GREAT!!! I LOVE it!!! glad you like it too.
 
Ahh, but the KJV reads like a Shakespearian play in it's grand style!

I have to be a voice for the KJV here. I'm still hooked on it. I was a total loser when I picked it up and read it cover to cover. And it converted me. And if an idiot liberal like me could understand it...well... When I pick up another version to read it, they read like a Dick and Jane book. (I'm not an idiot liberal anymore, but that's another story)

There's something about the KJV that no other translation has. I even got the Geneva Bible. It's siren song of it's translation and history lured me, but it's not the King Jimmy. So I stuck with my first love. Using the KJV is like wielding Stormbringer. The others, like a wooden katana.

But I recently got the Reformation ESV from Ligonier during their special. It's not bad. I have compaired it to my KJV. The structure seems similar. So, if you are going to leave your first love, you could do worse. Much worse.
 
The KJV still has a warm place in my heart. But I have become something of a translation polygamist. One translation just isn't enough.
 
I probably don't understand what's behind the translation, but the ESV has a few oddly worded passages that seem to sound as if the translators are somehow trying to sound more impressive, or "smarter" or something. For example I was just reading in 1 Samuel, where God calls out to Samuel, and he answers "Here am I." Or in Mary's "magnificat," where she says "the rich he has sent empty away." If they were going for modern English, why the awkward ordering that no modern speaker would ever use? Those kind of hit me between the eyes.

I also use the NASB and NKJV pretty extensively. It's probably due to my age, but I really never spent much time in KJV.
Thus must be what them smart people call "poetic" or "worshipful" or "beautiful" language. They must have had an English professor on the committee. Some people have this notion that God should be approached with awe or "fear" or something. I don't know why, but they seem to think it's wrong for the Bible to sound like a TV commercial. :lol:
 
I started out with the KJV in my teen years, then switched to the NIV for a few years. About a year after I became Reformed, I switched to the NKJV and kept that for about 10 years. In seminary I switched to the ESV, largely because of it's style. But I also compared it and the NKJV in my language studies in seminary and just found the ESV to be more consistent. It really does a good job trying to translate word for word in a way that isn't forced or awkard but more natural. It's certainly not perfect, as shown by some passages noted above. But overall I have enjoyed it. :2cents:
 
I probably don't understand what's behind the translation, but the ESV has a few oddly worded passages that seem to sound as if the translators are somehow trying to sound more impressive, or "smarter" or something. For example I was just reading in 1 Samuel, where God calls out to Samuel, and he answers "Here am I." Or in Mary's "magnificat," where she says "the rich he has sent empty away." If they were going for modern English, why the awkward ordering that no modern speaker would ever use? Those kind of hit me between the eyes.

I also use the NASB and NKJV pretty extensively. It's probably due to my age, but I really never spent much time in KJV.
Thus must be what them smart people call "poetic" or "worshipful" or "beautiful" language. They must have had an English professor on the committee. Some people have this notion that God should be approached with awe or "fear" or something. I don't know why, but they seem to think it's wrong for the Bible to sound like a TV commercial. :lol:

Strong arguments can be made on both sides. Many English buffs I know would not side with the ESV on a lot of its renderings...the argument partially comes down to what makes "good english" and is "worshipful language" really what we think it is?

Not coming from a KJV background, I found the NKJV and NASB a much smoother read than the ESV. Although the ESV has been my main translation since I came into the faith. Since then I have also used the HCSB, NIV, etc.
 
I probably don't understand what's behind the translation, but the ESV has a few oddly worded passages that seem to sound as if the translators are somehow trying to sound more impressive, or "smarter" or something. For example I was just reading in 1 Samuel, where God calls out to Samuel, and he answers "Here am I." Or in Mary's "magnificat," where she says "the rich he has sent empty away." If they were going for modern English, why the awkward ordering that no modern speaker would ever use? Those kind of hit me between the eyes.

I also use the NASB and NKJV pretty extensively. It's probably due to my age, but I really never spent much time in KJV.
Thus must be what them smart people call "poetic" or "worshipful" or "beautiful" language. They must have had an English professor on the committee. Some people have this notion that God should be approached with awe or "fear" or something. I don't know why, but they seem to think it's wrong for the Bible to sound like a TV commercial. :lol:

Apparently Yoda helped in some of the translation.
 
I don't understand having an attachment to a translation, especially to the KJV.

On a related note, I have even less understanding for attempting to PRAY in KJV English. Why is there a need to say "and Thy glory, and glorify Thee" as opposed to "and Your glory, and glorify You."???? A few people I know do it, and I'm almost certain they use the pronouns incorrectly.
 
Okay I confess!
Hello! My name is Martin, I also have been using the ESV
:(
Please do not think less of me
:lol:
 
:applause:

That's the first step Martin. The truth shall set you free. Now you will, as I did, begin to see the grass is greener on the other side. That is, the ESV side!
 
Thanks it just feels better getting it of your chest.
Now I do not have to carry it around in a brown paper-bag.
And only read it in badly lit backrooms to churches.
Now I can be proud of my new love, since I am no longer alone.
Thanks for your strength and showing me the way
:lol::lol::lol:
 
I love The Message. It's inerrant translation, it's majestic beauty, it's brilliant prose, it's memorizing cadence, it's flawless textual tradition. It makes the more formal translations seem like cheap copies. I hear that The Message even corrects the original Greek and Hebrew. Even John Calvin foretold of a great translation which would enter the English tongue and that it would be called "The Message". I am in tears right now at how precious The Message really is.

Why read the ESV when one can be enveloped by the comforting and awesome force of The Message?

:lol::lol::lol: Wait....you were joking right? :think:
 
Thanks it just feels better getting it of your chest.
Now I do not have to carry it around in a brown paper-bag.
And only read it in badly lit backrooms to churches.
Now I can be proud of my new love, since I am no longer alone.
Thanks for your strength and showing me the way
:lol::lol::lol:

You are most welcome.

Embrace the dark side young Skywalker!

-----Added 1/2/2009 at 12:49:53 EST-----

I love The Message. It's inerrant translation, it's majestic beauty, it's brilliant prose, it's memorizing cadence, it's flawless textual tradition. It makes the more formal translations seem like cheap copies. I hear that The Message even corrects the original Greek and Hebrew. Even John Calvin foretold of a great translation which would enter the English tongue and that it would be called "The Message". I am in tears right now at how precious The Message really is.

Why read the ESV when one can be enveloped by the comforting and awesome force of The Message?

:lol::lol::lol: Wait....you were joking right? :think:

I hope so!?!:think:
 
OK, I'm a curmudgeon and a spoiled sport, but everytime an ESV thread comes up, if I have the energy, I have to point out Hebrews 11:31.

ESV: By faith Rahab the prostitute did not perish with those who were disobedient, because she had given a friendly welcome to the spies.


AV: By faith the harlot Rahab perished not with them that believed not, when she had received the spies with peace.

The word is εἰρήνης (irenes)--peace, not "friendly." It doesn't matter which Greek text you use, it's the same.

Every other translation uses some variation of "received with peace." Why oh why did the ESV decide to put a Mae West spin on the passage, especially because it purports to be a formal equivalent?

Nit-picky, yes, but I just bugs me to see someone's (dare I say joking or playful?) fingerprints on the text.


I personally prefer the word "peace, but I can see a little bit why they may have chosen "friendly welcome."

I think the bigger question is were those that perished people who "believed not," or people who were "disobedient?"

Maybe
in both word changes peace/friendly and believed not/disobedient the meanings are the same.
 
I'm anxiously awaiting the "l33t sp33k" translation.

(If you think I'm kidding about that translation existing, I'm not. I am kidding about waiting for it though.)
 
What does "Reading Level 8" mean? 8th grade level?

The KJV has a reading level of twelve, because of the difficulty of the English used. I ran across this note from a website called, sundayschoolresources.com, and the they state regarding the NASB, KJV, NRSV, and the NKJV:

The difficult reading level of these Bible translations prevents us from recommending these translations for children. While some may consider the NKJV to be written at a Medium Reading Level, we think it is too difficult for children to read...

Forgive me, but that is hogwash! :lol:

I was memorizing the NKJV at age 7 (in AWANA, but we won't go there).

I do agree that the KJV is difficult to memorize, but children did memorize it at one time.

The KJV may be hard for children to understand, but it is probably easier to memorize. And as has been pointed out AWANA uses the NKJV. I think that Michael Marlowe makes a good point here:

The concept of propitiation is made more difficult to teach because there is not a word for it in the NIV. And aside from such inconveniences to theological exposition, the idiomatic style seemed to make the sacred text less impressive and less memorable than most conservatives would prefer. As Professor Wallace said, "It is so readable that it has no memorable expressions, nothing that lingers in the mind. This is a serious problem for the NIV that is not always acknowledged."
 
I love The Message. It's inerrant translation, it's majestic beauty, it's brilliant prose, it's memorizing cadence, it's flawless textual tradition. It makes the more formal translations seem like cheap copies. I hear that The Message even corrects the original Greek and Hebrew. Even John Calvin foretold of a great translation which would enter the English tongue and that it would be called "The Message". I am in tears right now at how precious The Message really is.

Why read the ESV when one can be enveloped by the comforting and awesome force of The Message?

:lol::lol::lol: Wait....you were joking right? :think:

Yeah, I don't know what brought it on :p I've read so many of these "I love the ESV" "I love the NKJV" "I want the KJV to have my children" type threads (I might have even written one way back some time, though I'm not sure) I thought I would rebel and write one about The Message.

I'm not against dynamic translations but I think The Message fails even by its own standards of a paraphrase. Because the English is so "today" (early 90s) it is already becoming out of date even more than the KJV is! (well, maybe not that much, but you get my point).

Anyway, it was just meant as humour and not against anyone or anything. :)
 
Because the English is so "today" (early 90s) it is already becoming out of date even more than the KJV is! (well, maybe not that much, but you get my point).
Exactly. I wonder how long will it take for any translation in "today's" English to become out of date and fall into disuse, especially if another "more today" translation is out? My favorite NIV, for example - will it last for another ten or twenty years?
Perhaps that is the true reason why many still prefer to memorize from the old good KJV: nobody wants to re-memorize his favorite passages after a while...
 
As long as one remains reformed, God willing, he will most likely see the ESV for years to come. The great influence it has had in such a short span of time is unparalleled as far as I know. I think it's to ingrained in reformed culture to die quickly like other translations. That's my prediction anyhow, and it wasn't even a 'word from the Lord'!
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top