ReformedWretch
Puritan Board Doctor
I would still argue that it is a cult, evil, blasphemous, and to be avoided.
Freemasonry - Fraternity or Cult
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Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
Adam,
When we Christians speak of cults, we are referring to those groups that are abberant teachers of Christianity.
There are many groups or things that are evil, blasphmeous and should be avoided. For instance, Disney.
[Edited on 12-10-2005 by Scott Bushey]
When we Christians speak of cults, we are referring to those groups that are abberant teachers of Christianity.
There are many groups or things that are evil, blasphmeous and should be avoided. For instance, Disney.
[Edited on 12-10-2005 by Scott Bushey]
ReformedWretch
Puritan Board Doctor
But Scott, you don't believe (even after just reading those things in this thread, that the Masons are abberant teachers of Christianity?
Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
Yes. However, much like AA/NA, they are not a church, nor do they claim to be. In that way, they are not a cult in the clinical sense.
Possibly splittin hairs here.......
ReformedWretch
Puritan Board Doctor
Agreed then.
But....if you had a pastor who was a Mason and took his family on a Disney World vacation, which would you be more concerned about?
Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
I would'nt ever have a pastor who was a Mason (unless of course it had to do with cement).
Disney cannot be avoided unfortunately..........I am as well guilty.
A cult is more expansive thatn simply an apostate church:
Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
So then Disney is a cult.
LawrenceU
Puritan Board Doctor
Whilst Free Masonry / Speculative Masonry may not fit the posted definition of a cult it is rooted in paganism, perpetuates a works righteousness, promotes egalitarianism among 'dieties', and spreads a damning view of God. I come from a long line of Masons. The majority were Scottish rite with a few York rite thrown in. Several of my older relatives have demitted from the lodge. Many have been 32nd degree Masons. Some have even been working on 'mystic' degrees. Each of them, thankfully, had their eyes opened by the Holy Spirit and they saw the error of their ways.
No Christian has any business being associated with the Lodge.
Later on I'll post how I really feel about it.
No Christian has any business being associated with the Lodge.
Later on I'll post how I really feel about it.
Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
[thread hijack]
http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/living/religion/13324125.htm
[back to your regularly scheduled program]
http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/living/religion/13324125.htm
[back to your regularly scheduled program]
Larry Hughes
Puritan Board Sophomore
Trever,
I did the same thing (1997 just after conversion), requesting removal, and explained why. Then I stopped receiving letters. I was a 3rd degree, MM of the blue lodge. My grandparents were 32 degree Scottish Rites Order (as opposed to Knights Templar, more popular in England). My dad never belonged as he had been concerned about them when he was in the Marine Corps. They were listed as a flagged group for security clearances.
To restate: But what would you call a group that though denies the label "œreligious" for "œfraternity" and yet teaches men who are leaders of their homes that the way to heaven is to do good deeds and earn it?
The base interview requirements vary from locale to locale but generally in the south and specifically in KY there are 3 litmus tests before you can even show up.
1. Do you believe in one God? One suffices. Though some Lodge regions have moved to say that poly-theism is essentially mono-theism in another form & hence accept poly-theistic candidates.
2. Are you or have you belonged to the communist party or a fraternity so affiliated. This stems from #1.
3. Do you drink, work at or affiliate with any employment (e.g. a bar, distillery, etc..) that has or serves alcoholic beverages. No joke. This has a lot of history behind.
The process: Once a candidate approaches the lodge for membership (one most not be approached but approach by "œtheir own free-will", a Mason should never approach you, but in reality this does happen) he goes through questions for candidacy and if accepted then three symbolic rituals including symbolic blood oaths at the end (very bloody in symbolism). The first two degree are really just 'going through the motions´ to reach the third ceremony. The third IS and involves a symbolic acted out "raising from the dead of the candidate" to that of Master Mason by symbolically linking/playing the candidate(s) out as Hiram Abiff (the Masonic savior, to which the raised MM is now like). Once raised as a Master Mason one is a true blue lodge Free or Speculative mason. The "upper degrees" then can be pursued along two track up to the 32nd level. Again the degrees 4 through 31 are mere going through the motions to arrive at 32. Depending upon the track one goes through Scottish Rites or York Rites. Scottish is most popular in America today. The double headed eagle emblem on the back of cars indicates the Scottish 32 degree. Then if one goes one step further one can become a Shriner.
Masonry is nothing but in gnosticism. Again from the KY Monitor: The monitor is steeped in religion taught by the Lodge this is but one tiny excerpt. To put it quite blunt in regards to the Lodges assertion that it is not a religion - THEY LIE PERIOD! That is a fact obvious enough for a blind man to see.
"œPage XIV & XV, "All antiquity solved the enigma of the existence of evil by supposing the existence of a Principle of Evil, of demons, fallen angels, an Ahriman, a Typhon, a Siva, a Loki, or a Satan, that, first falling themselves, and plunged into misery and darkness, tempted man to his fall and brought sin into the world. All believed in a future life, to be attained by purification and trials; in a state or successive states of reward and punishment; and in a Mediator or Redeemer, by whom the Evil Principle was to be overcome and the Supreme Deity reconciled to His creatures. The belief was general that He was to be born of a virgin and suffer a painful death. The Hindus called him Krishna; the Chinese, Kioun-tse; the Persians, Sosiosch; the Chaldeans, Dhouvanai; the Egyptians, Horus; Plato, Love; the Scandinavians, Balder; the Christians, Jesus; MASONS, HIRAM. It is interesting that the "small hill west of Mount Moriah" has been identifieed as Golgotha, or Mount Calvary. Krishna, the Hindoo Redeemer, was cradled and educated among shepherds. A tyrant, at the time of his birth, ordered all the male children to be slain. He performed miracles, say his legends, even raising the dead. He washed the feet of the Brahmins. It was on a cruciform tree that Krishna was said to have expired, pierced with arrows. He descended into Hell, rose again, ascended to Heaven, charged his diciples to teach his doctrines, and gave them the gift of miracles.
This belief of primitive man in the fall of mankind form the Kingdom of Light and restoration to bliss through a Redeemer is also inseparably connected with the belief in original creation through the spoken Word of the Supreme Deity. God spoke the Word and the Word created the world and the creatures therein. Only by this all-powerful, omnipotent Word could *** be raised from Death to immortality! This legend of the Master Mason's Word is rooted among the very oldest beliefs of mankind. The pastor of your church will tell you that, viewed historically and critically, the Fourth Gospel of St. John is an entirely different kind of document from those of St. John is an entirely differnt kind of document from those of the first three Gospels. The first three are called the Synoptical Gospels, because of theri many agreements in subject, order, and language, but the fourth Gospel is recognized as clearly a thesis, or sermon, written mainly to prove the writer's view of a contested question. At the time there was in existence a large sect known as the Gnostics, that is, "those who know", whose doctrines and teachings endeavored to explain creation bv some system of "emanations" from the Supreme Deity, particularly concerning this wonder-working Word, spoken "in the beginning", and of the final triumph of the Redeemer, with whom the Word seems to have been identified, over the powers of evil. It is sometimes called the "Logos" dotrine-the Greek word "logos" meaning "word." St. John essayed to prove that Jesus was this Word of the Gnostics in the flesh. He commences his essay, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." Of course the Word was lost at the death of the Christians's Redeemer, Jesus, as at the death of Hiram. Etc...."
--END QUOTE
A pastor, deacon, elder OR Christian cannot remain in the lodge once taught. Pastors, deacons, elders should not even be such with Masonic affiliation.
Larry
I did the same thing (1997 just after conversion), requesting removal, and explained why. Then I stopped receiving letters. I was a 3rd degree, MM of the blue lodge. My grandparents were 32 degree Scottish Rites Order (as opposed to Knights Templar, more popular in England). My dad never belonged as he had been concerned about them when he was in the Marine Corps. They were listed as a flagged group for security clearances.
To restate: But what would you call a group that though denies the label "œreligious" for "œfraternity" and yet teaches men who are leaders of their homes that the way to heaven is to do good deeds and earn it?
The base interview requirements vary from locale to locale but generally in the south and specifically in KY there are 3 litmus tests before you can even show up.
1. Do you believe in one God? One suffices. Though some Lodge regions have moved to say that poly-theism is essentially mono-theism in another form & hence accept poly-theistic candidates.
2. Are you or have you belonged to the communist party or a fraternity so affiliated. This stems from #1.
3. Do you drink, work at or affiliate with any employment (e.g. a bar, distillery, etc..) that has or serves alcoholic beverages. No joke. This has a lot of history behind.
The process: Once a candidate approaches the lodge for membership (one most not be approached but approach by "œtheir own free-will", a Mason should never approach you, but in reality this does happen) he goes through questions for candidacy and if accepted then three symbolic rituals including symbolic blood oaths at the end (very bloody in symbolism). The first two degree are really just 'going through the motions´ to reach the third ceremony. The third IS and involves a symbolic acted out "raising from the dead of the candidate" to that of Master Mason by symbolically linking/playing the candidate(s) out as Hiram Abiff (the Masonic savior, to which the raised MM is now like). Once raised as a Master Mason one is a true blue lodge Free or Speculative mason. The "upper degrees" then can be pursued along two track up to the 32nd level. Again the degrees 4 through 31 are mere going through the motions to arrive at 32. Depending upon the track one goes through Scottish Rites or York Rites. Scottish is most popular in America today. The double headed eagle emblem on the back of cars indicates the Scottish 32 degree. Then if one goes one step further one can become a Shriner.
Masonry is nothing but in gnosticism. Again from the KY Monitor: The monitor is steeped in religion taught by the Lodge this is but one tiny excerpt. To put it quite blunt in regards to the Lodges assertion that it is not a religion - THEY LIE PERIOD! That is a fact obvious enough for a blind man to see.
"œPage XIV & XV, "All antiquity solved the enigma of the existence of evil by supposing the existence of a Principle of Evil, of demons, fallen angels, an Ahriman, a Typhon, a Siva, a Loki, or a Satan, that, first falling themselves, and plunged into misery and darkness, tempted man to his fall and brought sin into the world. All believed in a future life, to be attained by purification and trials; in a state or successive states of reward and punishment; and in a Mediator or Redeemer, by whom the Evil Principle was to be overcome and the Supreme Deity reconciled to His creatures. The belief was general that He was to be born of a virgin and suffer a painful death. The Hindus called him Krishna; the Chinese, Kioun-tse; the Persians, Sosiosch; the Chaldeans, Dhouvanai; the Egyptians, Horus; Plato, Love; the Scandinavians, Balder; the Christians, Jesus; MASONS, HIRAM. It is interesting that the "small hill west of Mount Moriah" has been identifieed as Golgotha, or Mount Calvary. Krishna, the Hindoo Redeemer, was cradled and educated among shepherds. A tyrant, at the time of his birth, ordered all the male children to be slain. He performed miracles, say his legends, even raising the dead. He washed the feet of the Brahmins. It was on a cruciform tree that Krishna was said to have expired, pierced with arrows. He descended into Hell, rose again, ascended to Heaven, charged his diciples to teach his doctrines, and gave them the gift of miracles.
This belief of primitive man in the fall of mankind form the Kingdom of Light and restoration to bliss through a Redeemer is also inseparably connected with the belief in original creation through the spoken Word of the Supreme Deity. God spoke the Word and the Word created the world and the creatures therein. Only by this all-powerful, omnipotent Word could *** be raised from Death to immortality! This legend of the Master Mason's Word is rooted among the very oldest beliefs of mankind. The pastor of your church will tell you that, viewed historically and critically, the Fourth Gospel of St. John is an entirely different kind of document from those of St. John is an entirely differnt kind of document from those of the first three Gospels. The first three are called the Synoptical Gospels, because of theri many agreements in subject, order, and language, but the fourth Gospel is recognized as clearly a thesis, or sermon, written mainly to prove the writer's view of a contested question. At the time there was in existence a large sect known as the Gnostics, that is, "those who know", whose doctrines and teachings endeavored to explain creation bv some system of "emanations" from the Supreme Deity, particularly concerning this wonder-working Word, spoken "in the beginning", and of the final triumph of the Redeemer, with whom the Word seems to have been identified, over the powers of evil. It is sometimes called the "Logos" dotrine-the Greek word "logos" meaning "word." St. John essayed to prove that Jesus was this Word of the Gnostics in the flesh. He commences his essay, "In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God." Of course the Word was lost at the death of the Christians's Redeemer, Jesus, as at the death of Hiram. Etc...."
--END QUOTE
A pastor, deacon, elder OR Christian cannot remain in the lodge once taught. Pastors, deacons, elders should not even be such with Masonic affiliation.
Larry
There are a few ministries that deal with freemasonry.
Unfortunately most are Fundies who find the Antichrist behind every tree (or in Epcot Center..i.e. the Disney boycott). Their stuff is....to borrow a modern term..."whack".
A good ministry, however, is Ephesian 5:11,Inc,found at: http://www.ephesians5-11.org/othermin.htm
I have read that fully 10-15% of all Southern Baptist deacons belong to the Masonic Lodge.
Unfortunately most are Fundies who find the Antichrist behind every tree (or in Epcot Center..i.e. the Disney boycott). Their stuff is....to borrow a modern term..."whack".
A good ministry, however, is Ephesian 5:11,Inc,found at: http://www.ephesians5-11.org/othermin.htm
I have read that fully 10-15% of all Southern Baptist deacons belong to the Masonic Lodge.
Pilgrim
Puritanboard Commissioner
There have been many SBC pastors over the years who have been masons, and not a few pastors there and elsewhere who have been 32nd degree, etc.
I have read that not a few PCA RE's belong or did belong to it too, although I would think this is less prevalent now than in the 70's and 80's. I think there was a report on this in the 1980's and debate at a GA but I don't know exactly what the outcome was. Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't know that the PCA went much further than the SBC in officially doing anything about freemasonry. (of course with the SBC's ecclesiology, they cannot "force" their congregations to do anything on the national level). My guess is that it is probably up to the Presbytery whether to bar masons from office.
[Edited on 12-12-2005 by Pilgrim]
Pilgrim
Puritanboard Commissioner
Kaalvenist
Puritan Board Sophomore
"Christians should walk in the light. Their beliefs, purposes, manner of life, and their rules of action and conduct should be based on the Word of God and should not be concealed. Oathbound societies usually involve an improper requirement of secrecy, aims which are immoral, intimate fellowship with unbelievers or participation in unbiblical worship. Membership in such organizations is inconsistent with a Christian profession, however good their announced purposes may be."--The Testimony of the Reformed Presbyterian Church of North America, 25.19.
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