Ghosts and haunted houses

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I have personally never undoubtedly experienced anything supernaturally strange in these ways, so the whole topic is practically irrelevant to me. Just like the charismatic movement can take things way too far with hearing from God directly, the tongues, and other things, I think many people over or wrongly spiritualize the topic of ghosts and hauntings. Could some of it be true? I definitely think that it's possible, and I'm okay with not having a systematic theology to justify a position on the topic. I'm pretty open minded when it comes to those things and would lean towards them being real because 1. the Bible seems to have many instances of the spiritual realm interacting with the earthly 2. there are so many stories and instances of these things happening, that I think it would be pretty crazy to dismiss every single testimony as being false.

Some things we just don't have answers for. Remember that show "Beyond Belief"? So many of those stories are really far out, but are said to be true. I don't know what to make of them, but I imagine some of those stories somehow really are true.
 
Ryan&Amber2013 said:
I have personally never undoubtedly experienced anything supernaturally strange in these ways, so the whole topic is practically irrelevant to me. Just like the charismatic movement can take things way too far with hearing from God directly, the tongues, and other things, I think many people over or wrongly spiritualize the topic of ghosts and hauntings. Could some of it be true? I definitely think that it's possible, and I'm okay with not having a systematic theology to justify a position on the topic. I'm pretty open minded when it comes to those things and would lean towards them being real because 1. the Bible seems to have many instances of the spiritual realm interacting with the earthly 2. there are so many stories and instances of these things happening, that I think it would be pretty crazy to dismiss every single testimony as being false.

Some things we just don't have answers for. Remember that show "Beyond Belief"? So many of those stories are really far out, but are said to be true. I don't know what to make of them, but I imagine some of those stories somehow really are true.
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My concern would be when we open ourselves up to satanic influences by getting interested and dabbling around with Ghost shows, Ufo's, Occult stuff etc.
 
Dachaser said:
My friend was scared when he came over to see me, as while did not believe in Demons, thought that he had encountered "dark forces"
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More often than not, I try not to use the term "demon" right away. Even we who are biblically literate tend to import film connotations into the term. Daimonia is a biblical term, but it needs to be fleshed out (no pun intended).
 
I'm starting to wonder if the office next door to me is haunted.

A couple of years ago it was occupied by a lawyer who played in a praise band at a local evangelical church. Then he got into the legalized marijuana gig, gave up his profession of faith and now is an acolyte of the "Force," being an ascending master of the Jedi faith. He also quit practicing law and is now a full-time "bartender" at one of the local pot shops.

So a new lawyer took over the space. After an auspicious start, she found herself facing DUI and drug charges.

The landlord asked me if I wanted to expand into that space. I told him I'm happy with my little drama-free hole in the wall.

As for demons, etc., I purposely do not delve too deeply into the topic, but I have enough first-hand (albeit anecdotal) observations that folks who get into drugs and/or who play with occultic things often find themselves in a real mess--and not just a legal mess.
 
VictorBravo said:
I'm starting to wonder if the office next door to me is haunted.

A couple of years ago it was occupied by a lawyer who played in a praise band at a local evangelical church. Then he got into the legalized marijuana gig, gave up his profession of faith and now is an acolyte of the "Force," being an ascending master of the Jedi faith. He also quit practicing law and is now a full-time "bartender" at one of the local pot shops.

So a new lawyer took over the space. After an auspicious start, she found herself facing DUI and drug charges.

The landlord asked me if I wanted to expand into that space. I told him I'm happy with my little drama-free hole in the wall.

As for demons, etc., I purposely do not delve too deeply into the topic, but I have enough first-hand (albeit anecdotal) observations that folks who get into drugs and/or who play with occultic things often find themselves in a real mess--and not just a legal mess.
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Most lawyers ARE demon-possessed, aren't they?
 
I know it's dangerous to spend all the time talking about demons, so I wondered if I did that. There is one sure-fire way to see. I went to my blog and looked at the tags in the right-hand column. I've spent more time talking about epistemology than anything else. That kind of surprised me, since I haven't dealt with epistemology in about a year. Then it was Trinity.
https://tentsofshem.wordpress.com/
 
BayouHuguenot said:
And that's all you do in these situations. You "say." You never mount an argument or offer defeaters for my exegesis.

Now, I am generally skeptical of what we call "haunted houses," but only because I have a robust angelology and theory of the supernatural.

I think most of the "haunted houses" are bunk. I do think that some areas, though, particularly those associated with satanic ritual abuse, are a different matter.
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What reference is good for angelology in your opinion? I know Turretin mentions something in short. I've never went into that issue in-depth.
 
Aco said:
What reference is good for angelology in your opinion? I know Turretin mentions something in short. I've never went into that issue in-depth.
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How technical do you want to get? The following are fairly popular treatments.

The best short treatment is Michael Heiser's Angels. I know Heiser is controversial in some circles, but that's only because of his view of Nephilim, which isn't in his Angels.

Another great one is Dorn's work.
https://www.amazon.com/Unseen-Realm...&qid=1545747122&sr=8-3&keywords=doug+van+dorn


The Lutheran apologist and theologian JW Montgomery did a great job.
https://tentsofshem.wordpress.com/2018/06/22/review-principalities-and-powers-montgomery/
 
Pergamum said:
I bet nobody pulled that same line on William Gurnell (warning him about spending all his time talking about demons).
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Right. And emphasis-arguments are almost always wrong. A thing is true or false, regardless of how much it is "emphasized." Now, an over-emphasis on something can be quite unhealthy. I've been there, and I can give a few examples:

1) An overemphasis on theonomy can turn you either into a kinist or into an American Vision Cultural Marxist.
2) An overemphasis on Thomism can turn you into a papist.
3) An overemphasis on partial preterism can turn you into a full preterist.
 
Reading through the comments in the thread...I have never experienced anything like that and recall to have rarely heard of people experiencing demons or similar things, only if involved in the occult.
But all that "haunted houses and places" is very much strange to me. It seems to be much more an american thing to me (maybe also british because of their castles etc.).
A great emphasis on exorcisms also seems to be quite romanistic to me, for example in Eastern orthodoxy, where I came from, it's very very rare. I know only that gypsies and Valachs were a lot, now a little bit less, heavily involved in black magic, which led to demonic possessions. I know that from older farmers, where I come from, whose anscestors lived under Ottoman rule and were illiterate and some of the superstitious, that there were widespread beliefs in vampires (the term "vampire" actually originated from that area) and practice of black magic etc.
But know all that seems to have vanquished in most parts.
Is it exclusively tied to occult practices?
 
Aco said:
A great emphasis on exorcisms also seems to be quite romanistic to me, for example in Eastern orthodoxy, where I came from, it's very very rare.
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An exorcism is simply driving the demon out by the power of Jesus' name. Rome makes it more a big deal than anything else.
 
I'd say go no further in your study than the Bible. The local presbytery should be able to handle this. A friend of mine wrote a paper of Voodoo/Hoodoo and most recently Freemasonry but he was given the task by the presbytery.
 
JM said:
I'd say go no further in your study than the Bible. The local presbytery should be able to handle this. A friend of mine wrote a paper of Voodoo/Hoodoo and most recently Freemasonry but he was given the task by the presbytery.
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Yeah, I normally wouldn't recommend people delve too deeply on their own. Once I learned how the US Govt was using programmed multiples and employing the High Priest of Set, I knew we were getting into dark stuff.

Since most of this stuff on the surface level is recycled New Age, a good worldview primer is sufficient.
 
BayouHuguenot said:
An exorcism is simply driving the demon out by the power of Jesus' name. Rome makes it more a big deal than anything else.
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It is still a big deal if even one exorcism is attempted today in any church. The number makes no difference if people believe in such via bad teaching, or supposed eye witness testimony.
 
Somebody should define exorcism.

If I have prayed and read Scripture with a person seeing a spirit (a spirit telling him to hang himself) and he destroys his amulet said to contain a family spirit as a sign of repentance, and prays, and then the man stops seeing a demon and hearing voices telling him to kill himself...

....then what have I done?
 
earl40 said:
It is still a big deal if even one exorcism is attempted today in any church. The number makes no difference if people believe in such via bad teaching, or supposed eye witness testimony.
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Calling on Jesus' name is a big deal. I do it often.
 
Pergamum said:
Somebody should define exorcism.

If I have prayed and read Scripture with a person seeing a spirit (a spirit telling him to hang himself) and he destroys his amulet said to contain a family spirit as a sign of repentance, and prays, and then the man stops seeing a demon and hearing voices telling him to kill himself...

....then what have I done?
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I feel like the posts that push back against some ideas surrounding exorcism don’t get read carefully, and extremes of what is considered “cessationism” get imported into them. At least, there’s very little interaction with or acknowledgement expressed of assertions based on Scripture. All of us, I hope, would say that “what you have done” is pray to a great God, and proclaimed his great truths to a needy person. Then I am sure, like any one of us would have done, you gave thanks to God for a change in that person. But you didn’t see what happened; you can’t know with any certainty what happened. We shouldn’t make pronouncements about what happens in the spiritual realm, and don’t have to. The secret things belong to the Lord. That’s all some of us are trying to say. If the man becomes a believer or is strengthened in his faith, and these troubling events go away, then praise God. He uses our prayers and our words. He is good.

Again, Rev. Winzer on this board always recommended Satan Cast Out by Frederick Leahy. That book will greatly help anyone trying to sort out how to think about the activity of demons, spirits, etc.
 
There are a lot of unseen things that we can still know about. So it doesn' tlogically follow that if something is unseen, we can't know it. I don't even know God's essence, yet I am able to make a number of pronouncements about it: It's simple, for one.
 
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