God is love

[Romans922]

In many conversations that I have had for the past few years, when discussing the sovereignty of God, someone always states that God is a loving God or how can God be that way if He is loving? I am sure by now you guys understand what I am talking about. In my thought, people are taught in the beginning of their 'new lives' that God is love. However, they are not taught, at least seemingly, that God is holy. I would say that God is both 100% love and 100% holy. Equal in a sense. But most people are focusing so much on God as being love that they forget about or are ignorant of the fact that God is holy. God being holy determines what God being love means (and vice versa). However they just dont see that.

My question: "How should I reply to someone who is thinking this way, focusing way too much on God is love, (or maybe a better way to put it is that they are focusing way to little on God as holy)?"

If what I am asking is confusing, please say so...I know you guys will!

 

[Average Joey]

I voted both.

 

[Puritan Sailor]

Have them read the OT historical books. Then ask them to explain the death of Ananias and Saphira.

 

[Vytautas]

People believe the last thing they hear and are carried about every wind of doctrine. So when they read I John and read God is love they tend to believe that to the exclusion of what they came to believe previously. This is not a way that is careful in its theology. Let this be an example that all the biblical evidence of what God is should be brought to the table. Now some would hold that holiness and love are mutually exclusive. That is, the antithesis of love is holiness and the opposite of holiness is love.

 

[gwine]

Mal 1:1 The oracle of the word of the LORD to Israel by Malachi.
Mal 1:2 "I have loved you," says the LORD. But you say, "How have you loved us?" "Is not Esau Jacob's brother?" declares the LORD. "Yet I have loved Jacob
Mal 1:3 but Esau I have hated. I have laid waste his hill country and left his heritage to jackals of the desert."

God is too holy to indiscriminately love.

 

[Romans922]

Originally posted by James McGrail

Originally posted by Romans922
In many conversations that I have had for the past few years, when discussing the sovereignty of God, someone always states that God is a loving God or how can God be that way if He is loving? I am sure by now you guys understand what I am talking about. In my thought, people are taught in the beginning of their 'new lives' that God is love. However, they are not taught, at least seemingly, that God is holy. I would say that God is both 100% love and 100% holy. Equal in a sense. But most people are focusing so much on God as being love that they forget about or are ignorant of the fact that God is holy. God being holy determines what God being love means (and vice versa). However they just dont see that.
My question: "How should I reply to someone who is thinking this way, focusing way too much on God is love, (or maybe a better way to put it is that they are focusing way to little on God as holy)?"
If what I am asking is confusing, please say so...I know you guys will!

I voted both. You're right. God is 100% holy and 100% love. He does not 'posses' love or 'contain' love, 1John says He IS love. He is the very definition of the word. Human love is tainted with sin, God's love is holy. Jesus looked upon the rich young ruler and LOVED him. But God has a special love for His elect,
In fact, I do not believe we can properly explain the doctrines of grace without God's love coming into the picture.
Oh well, that's my vote and my 2 cents worth.
Back to the football game.

So you kinda, just did what I was talking about...you focused almost 95% on God being love, and mentioning just once that you agree with Him being holy.

How should we respond to people who focus only on His love?

 

[cultureshock]

God\'s love

At our church this morning, the pastor read Psalm 136. Try a few of these on for size:

"to him who struck down the firstborn of Egypt, for his steadfast love endures forever" (v. 10)

"but overthrew Pharaoh and his host in the Red Sea, for his steadfast love endures forever" (v. 15)

"to him who struck down great kinds, for his steadfast love endures forever; and killed mighty kings, for his steadfast love endures forever" (vv. 17-18)

The 1 John statement that "God is love" cannot rightly be used to claim that God loves all humans in an indiscriminate, blanket fashion. What does it even mean when people say that God is 100% love? It does not have to imply that he loves 100% of humans with a 100% love. I think that even the use of a percentage to describe God's love is itself a faulty analogy. Stick to the Scriptures--they say that he is both love and holy, but that he doesn't love all in the same way. I would simply show people the passages and leave the unhelpful analogies aside.

Brian

[Edited on 12-11-2005 by cultureshock]

 

[Craig]

God's love is holy...and God is altogether holy.

 

[Steve Owen]

Originally posted by gwine

Mal 1:1 The oracle of the word of the LORD to Israel by Malachi.
Mal 1:2 "I have loved you," says the LORD. But you say, "How have you loved us?" "Is not Esau Jacob's brother?" declares the LORD. "Yet I have loved Jacob
Mal 1:3 but Esau I have hated. I have laid waste his hill country and left his heritage to jackals of the desert."

God is too holy to love indiscriminately.

The remarkable thing is not that God should have hated Esau, but that He should have loved Jacob.

Martin

 

[Robin]

Andrew,

I've found the conversation to move a bit further when we define what love IS and is not.

Love is never disconnected from truth, for one thing. Both at the divine and human level. And Divine love portrayed in Holy Scripture is never disconnected from God's mercy (towards the reprobate) and via the cross for the regenerate. Never.

Nowadays, the "definition" of love most folk have in mind, has to do with a sense of fairness towards sinners who "try their best" and of course, God would grade on a curve and allow that to procure heaven. Afterall, people are basically good. All this is seated in the depraved heart of ideas: "good people go to heaven; bad people go to hell" --- which is the worldly wisdom (as Paul puts it.)

Some of Jesus' own words serve well to dispell the misinformation. Was Jesus loving when he said:

John 17:9 (praying to the Father)

I am praying for them. I am not praying for the world but for those whom you have given me, for they are yours.

Mark 14:20-21

He said to them, "It is one of the twelve, one who is dipping bread into the dish with me. For the Son of Man goes as it is written of him, but woe to that man by whom the Son of Man is betrayed! It would have been better for that man if he had not been born."

Space doesn't permit...but do a word search on all of Jesus' "woe" statements (curses) in the Gospels. Why would a "loving" Jesus denounce and curse upstanding religious leaders? Another, cutting question is: what happens to someone cursed by Jesus?


Selah

Robin