I Need Assistance with Presup!!!

Status
Not open for further replies.

Confessor

Puritan Board Senior
What do you currently see natural revelation as saying/revealing?

CT
I know from Romans 1 that it reveals the Christian God, but I don't know how to show anything that it reveals. That's why I'm asking you.
So what you are saying is that when you look around at the created order, you cannot make out anything concerning the existence of God, his power and people's obligations?

My question was not what you think you should be able to see, but what you actually see now. It is something similar to a person asking for math help concerning calculus. The next question what math do you currently know. Once we are clear what level of math one is comfortable, then one can work out a plan to get you to the level that you need to be.

CT
I see that all sin is naturally punished. E.g. if someone drinks too much, he can die from alcohol poisoning. He can't do some good deeds to counter-act the effects.
 

ChristianTrader

Puritan Board Graduate
Why does natural revelation naturally point to a belief in salvation by grace? Why, from just viewing nature, is it unnatural (no pun intended) to believe that a works-based salvation can suffice?
Okay, now I am confused as to why my above argument is not sufficient? Are you asking why natural revelation does not reveal God to be partly just/partly unjust?

Again what do you think natural revelation is saying. If I know what you think it is saying, then I can at least know your starting point and then we could proceed from there.

CT
I don't know how to demonstrate that natural revelation shows the infinite justice of the Creator, and why that justice must account for every sin (thus showing that all men are guilty of condemnation). So, two things that I would love for you to demonstrate, for my sake:

1. That natural revelation shows that the Creator must have justice as an attribute.
Well belief in creation ex-nihilo theism gets you the infinite God part (eternal, independent, self-existent, not dependent on or limited by anything besides himself etc.)

If it is not an attribute of God then from where does man receive the concept?

2. That the justice is one that disallows all sins -- In other words,, there must be no sin at all, not just less sin than good.

I believe that natural revelation is clear and that all men know this, but how can it be formulated in an argument or demonstration?
Well I think 2 is entailed by 1. By being infinite in justice, God would perfectly make sure that every wrong doing is met with its proper consequence. To do less would contradict the belief of infinite justice.

And every sin against an infinite God would be more than any finite being could make up for committing.

CT
 

Confessor

Puritan Board Senior
And every sin against an infinite God would be more than any finite being could make up for committing.
...which establishes the necessity of punishment after death (for those not covered by Christ), and salvation by grace. Thank you for your help.

Haha, I was re-reading your older posts, and now they all make sense. :D
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top