Indwelling of the Holy Spirit in believers...

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turmeric

Megerator
I was looking at Philip Way's chart about CT & NCT and noticed that CT holds that Old Testament believers were indwelt by the Holy Spirit in the same manner as we are.
Question; So just what DID happen at Pentecost? I looked over every instance I could find of the Holy Spirit descending on believers in the Book of Acts recently (trying to see if there's Biblical warrant for a 2nd experience) and it's pretty clear that whatever this was, it was a New Testament thing, not that the Spirit was absent in the OT, of course.

If it's exactly the same, and Pentecost wasn't the beginning of the Church, then what was it the beginning of?:scholar:
 
Hi Meg,

Petacost was the reversal of the Tower of Babel, so to speak.

Think about it.... but there's much more to it...

The saints indwelt in the OT were far and few between. The "age of the Spirit" or era of Salvation had not yet come. The Mediator of the New Covenant would inaugurate that.

In Acts 2, the Holy Spirit is given to Christ's church as the sign of Christ's present power and glory. Signs and wonders may have marked the beginning of this new age of salvation, but they do not necessarily characterize it. Rather the work of the Holy Spirit in this age is that sinful men and women may at this very moment call upon the name of the Lord and be saved. (Which didn't occur in the OT.) This is proof of the grace and mercy of God that manifests itself through the work of the Holy Spirit in the church. The age of salvation is present because of the present work of God's Holy Spirit, as poured out by the Lord Jesus Christ. In the OT, the Tower of Babel was when man attempted to unify against God and make a name for himself. At Pentacost, God finally unifies sinful people to establish His Name in world.

Carefully read this sermon link to get more detail:


http://www.christreformed.org/resources/sermons_lectures/00000006.shtml?main


I hope this helps clarify....there's a lot to it...but it's exciting to learn about what God is doing in history via the Spirit!!!

Robin :book2:

PS. The direct answer to your question: the Holy Spirit was the Inaugurator of the "age of Salvation" in the world - the "down payment" of the fulfillment of the Promise to Abraham (Gen. 15).

[Edited on 2-9-2005 by Robin]
 
It's been my understanding that in the OT the Spirit fell on folks for specific purposes. Samson is a great example. Samson knew he had the Spirit as evidenced by his strength but there comes a point in his callousness where he didn't know the Spirit had left him.

From pentacost on, the Spirit descends upon and never leaves the believer. The Spirit's purpose after pentacost is to build His church and as a result, even the gates of hell cannot prevail against it.

[Edited on 9-2-2005 by maxdetail]
 
Is there any official explanation in any of the creeds regarding the similitude/differences of the Spirit, OT and NT?
 
hmmm...i assume then that there is a difference between regeneration and the indwelling of the spirit? What is the time difference for this then?
 
The same Spirit worked in the lives of believers, in much the same way under the OT administration as the NT. But as mentioned above, the real difference lay in the "perfusion" of the Spirit. He was the same life-giving Spirit; it was the same invincible, dynamic, divine power at work. But it was the difference (as I think RC Sproul may once have put it) of a tap dripping, versus a firehose valve opened fully.

But it wasn't merely a matter of total numbers of people affected (though clearly, the OT saw fewer overall than in the NT era). Also the typical individual believer in the OT era did not experience the Holy Spirit's grace and power to the same degree as does the typical NT believer. This was the essence of Peter's declaration of the fulfillment of Joel's prophecy at Pentecost, "your sons and daughters shall prophesy, your young men..., your old men..., my bondslaves, men and women...." The measure of the Spirit in the OT was less--by divine design.

There were priviledged few--like Moses, Aaron, Miriam, Samson, Samuel, David, Daniel, and other judges, prophets, priests, and kings--who experienced the Spirit's power in an enhanced manner, either temporarily or permanently, for the performance of their duty, or simply because God so favored them (as he has the sovereign prerogative to do). The NT inauguration saw this blessing extended in an unprecedented manner.

So, is there any room for "special" movement of the Spirit? Or are we all identically blessed? Or is there no difference in the flood over all the earth? This is no more true than supposing that the ocean is flat as glass from pole to pole and east to west. The ocean depths vary greatly, as does the Spirit's depth within men. The ocean's power is regularly evident upon the shores, as is the Spirit where his Word and its ministers operate. The Spirit surges like the tempestuous sea, in one place or another, but purposefully and not aimlessly, although oftentimes with a chaotic and irregular effect (see Jonathan Edwards wise words on revival). And that flood has yet to come to many places. It has not yet risen "to cover the tops of the highest mountains" (Gen 7:19).

And so we pray, "that the earth will be full of the knowledge of the glory of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea" (Hab. 2:14).
 
The Reformed, in keeping with their emphasis on continuity, have typically equated Spirit Baptism (a short title for "baptism in/with the Spirit") with Regeneration. Pentecostals, in keeping with their emphasis on Acts as normative for today, have typically equated Spirit Baptism with a Second Blessing that may or may not occur in the life of a believer and that manifests itself with signs and miracles. I believe both are entirely wrong. The Dutch Calvinist theologian Abraham Kuyper has an excellent grasp on Pneumatology as it relates to the OT and NT:

http://www.ccel.org/k/kuyper/holy_spirit/htm/v.vii.ii.htm
 
Call me dumb, or maybe I'm just really tired but I need to clarify things.

1. The Holy Spirit preceeds faith and repentence

So the Holy Spirit had to of been indwelling OT believers if they were to have faith. Right?

2. What do I tell those who claim that the Holy Spirit didn't dwell in man until pentacaust?
 
Originally posted by ABondSlaveofChristJesus
Call me dumb, or maybe I'm just really tired but I need to clarify things.

1. The Holy Spirit preceeds faith and repentence

So the Holy Spirit had to of been indwelling OT believers if they were to have faith. Right?

2. What do I tell those who claim that the Holy Spirit didn't dwell in man until pentacaust?

Are regeneration and indwelling by the spirit the same thing?

As i understand it, it is regeneration that is needed for faith and repentence?
 
Hey Guys,

First - if anyone wants to, do a word-search in the OT (on the computer Bible link) for Holy Spirit and/or Spirit. You'll see all the references. But read large portions of Text to get it.

Here is one of the most direct and breathtaking descriptions of how God saves His people via the Spirit.

Ezekiel 37 The Valley of Dry Bones

The hand of the LORD was upon me, and he brought me out in the Spirit of the Lord and set me down in the middle of the valley; it was full of bones. And he led me around among them, and behold, there were very many on the surface of the valley, and behold, they were very dry. And he said to me, "Son of man, can these bones live?" And I answered, "O Lord GOD, you know." Then he said to me, "Prophesy over these bones, and say to them, O dry bones, hear the word of the Lord. Thus says the Lord GOD to these bones: Behold, I will cause breath to enter you, and you shall live. And I will lay sinews upon you, and will cause flesh to come upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and you shall live, and you shall know that I am the LORD."

So I prophesied as I was commanded. And as I prophesied, there was a sound, and behold, a rattling, and the bones came together, bone to its bone. And I looked, and behold, there were sinews on them, and flesh had come upon them, and skin had covered them. But there was no breath in them. Then he said to me, "Prophesy to the breath; prophesy, son of man, and say to the breath, Thus says the Lord GOD: Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe on these slain, that they may live." So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived and stood on their feet, an exceedingly great army.

Then he said to me, "Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel. Behold, they say, 'Our bones are dried up, and our hope is lost; we are clean cut off.' Therefore prophesy, and say to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: Behold, I will open your graves and raise you from your graves, O my people. And I will bring you into the land of Israel. And you shall know that I am the LORD, when I open your graves, and raise you from your graves, O my people. And I will put my Spirit within you, and you shall live, and I will place you in your own land. Then you shall know that I am the LORD; I have spoken, and I will do it declares the LORD." I Will Be Their God, They Shall Be My People

The word of the LORD came to me: "Son of man, take a stick and write on it, 'For Judah, and the people of Israel associated with him'; then take another stick and write on it, 'For Joseph (the stick of Ephraim) and all the house of Israel associated with him.' And join them one to another into one stick, that they may become one in your hand. And when your people say to you, 'Will you not tell us what you mean by these?' say to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: Behold, I am about to take the stick of Joseph (that is in the hand of Ephraim) and the tribes of Israel associated with him. And I will join with it the stick of Judah, and make them one stick, that they may be one in my hand. When the sticks on which you write are in your hand before their eyes, then say to them, Thus says the Lord GOD: Behold, I will take the people of Israel from the nations among which they have gone, and will gather them from all around, and bring them to their own land. And I will make them one nation in the land, on the mountains of Israel. And one king shall be king over them all, and they shall be no longer two nations, and no longer divided into two kingdoms. They shall not defile themselves anymore with their idols and their detestable things, or with any of their transgressions. But I will save them from all the backslidings in which they have sinned, and will cleanse them; and they shall be my people, andI will be their God.

"My servant David (Christ) shall be king over them, and they shall all have one shepherd. They shall walk in my rules and be careful to obey my statutes. They shall dwell in the land that I gave to my servant Jacob, where your fathers lived. They and their children and their children's children shall dwell there forever, and David my servant shall be their prince forever. I will make a covenant of peace with them. It shall be an everlasting covenant with them. And I will set them in their land and multiply them, and will set my sanctuary in their midst forevermore. My dwelling place shall be with them, and I will be their God, and they shall be my people. Then the nations will know that I am the LORD who sanctifies Israel, when my sanctuary is in their midst forevermore."

Take special note of all the "I will" statements; forever/more & everlasting statements; the reference to "one" people/nation.

There is a continued theme throughout the entire Bible of God saying "I will be their God and they shall be my people."

Also note - the bones are dry and scattered - the bodies are dead and beyond hope. It is the Gospel (the Word prophesied) that resurrects the bodies. So as Ezekiel speaks the Word of the Lord (the Gospel) - the breath of the Spirit comes upon the bodies...:detective:

Robin

[Edited on 2-14-2005 by Robin]
 
Originally posted by ABondSlaveofChristJesus
Call me dumb, or maybe I'm just really tired but I need to clarify things.

1. The Holy Spirit preceeds faith and repentence

So the Holy Spirit had to of been indwelling OT believers if they were to have faith. Right?

2. What do I tell those who claim that the Holy Spirit didn't dwell in man until pentacaust?
Your logical approach is essentially correct. God's Spirit is the agent of change, of spiritual (new) life, regardless of which time frame you are referring to. Now those who have a defective view of salvation and the operation of God in it, and the necessity of Divine initiative from first to last, are probably not going to appreciate the Spirit's irresistible and essential work.

As for your second question, For what it's worth I would point out the nature of the Spirit's work as Jesus described it. He "blows where he wills," said Christ, speaking years before Pentecost to Nicodemus. Jesus castigates Nicodemus for being ignorant of the Holy Spirit's operation. "You are the Teacher of Israel, and you don't get it?" If your conversationalist now objects, saying that Pentecost is describing something other than salvation, you can then ask, "So what exactly are we arguing about? Clarify your revised statement of belief for me, please."
 
Originally posted by doulosChristou
The Reformed, in keeping with their emphasis on continuity, have typically equated Spirit Baptism (a short title for "baptism in/with the Spirit") with Regeneration. Pentecostals, in keeping with their emphasis on Acts as normative for today, have typically equated Spirit Baptism with a Second Blessing that may or may not occur in the life of a believer and that manifests itself with signs and miracles. I believe both are entirely wrong. The Dutch Calvinist theologian Abraham Kuyper has an excellent grasp on Pneumatology as it relates to the OT and NT:

http://www.ccel.org/k/kuyper/holy_spirit/htm/v.vii.ii.htm


:amen:

Kuyper speaks of a preparatory grace which I find in scripture. He is a good read.
 
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