Is Jesus totally empathetic today?

[earl40]

This is sort of in line with a question I have asked in the past "Is Jesus impassible today?"

Now I ask this question knowing full well that Jesus is indeed empathetic in that He now knows what pain feels like and has also experienced pain. So a better way of asking this question is.....

Does Jesus experience pain in His empathy today? Or another way of asking would be...Can Jesus be empathetic without experiencing pain while empathizing? This may sound silly but if I know Our Lord I can not currently imagine Him shedding a tear and suffering in any way today.

 

[Peairtach]

You're asking very deep Qs.

With the finite but extended knowledge that the Lord Jesus now has in His finite, but now glorified and hyper-exalted, human nature, maybe this makes a big difference to the nature of His empathy, compared to what He went through in His humiliation.

His human nature will also now have access to His divine knowledge in a way that it didn't during His humiliation.

Our Lord is beyond pain and sorrow but completely capable of appropriate empathy with His people. In my humble opinion.

 

[earl40]

You're asking very deep Qs.

With the finite but extended knowledge that the Lord Jesus now has in His finite, but now glorified and hyper-exalted, human nature, maybe this makes a big difference to the nature of His empathy, compared to what He went through in His humiliation.

His human nature will also now have access to His divine knowledge in a way that it didn't during His humiliation.

Our Lord is beyond pain and sorrow but completely capable of appropriate empathy with His people. In my humble opinion.

It is indeed deep and maybe we should redefine what empathy must entail, in that no doubt a person (Jesus or glorified men) can have empathy without the feeling of pain. Of course this can only happen in a glorified state, as to the point Jesus is not crying a today over anything that is happening in this fallen world.

 

[py3ak]

Earl, Hebrews 4 answers your question.

Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Does Jesus feel or experience pain? No, he is passed into the heavens.
Does he therefore lack compassion? No, he is touched with the feelings of our infirmities.

Therefore Jesus is both compassionate and free from suffering. If anyone would like to insist on "touched with the feelings of our infirmities" I should think it would suffice to point out that no one takes it to mean that Christ himself feels weak or tempted or overwhelmed, though we often feel all those things: he helps us in these distresses, he is compassionate towards us in them, without being subject to them.
If that is hard to grasp, I suspect it's because we assume there is a necessary connection between having compassion and sharing a feeling (etymologically justified, no doubt, but not genuinely necessary: however "empathy" may tend to give the wrong idea). The easy way to illustrate that is to consider someone who is hysterical, desperate, or even insane; you can have compassion on them and exert yourself to help them without sharing their feelings. Indeed, not sharing their feelings would seem to be essential to actually being of material help in such a case.
It is good that we have a rock higher than ourselves - that there is an inexhaustible joy that is not intermitted by our flailing: otherwise there would be no solid ground upon which ever to emerge from the changing tides of the various aspects of misery.

 

[Reformedfellow]

With the finite but extended knowledge that the Lord Jesus now has in His finite, but now glorified and hyper-exalted, human nature, maybe this makes a big difference to the nature of His empathy, compared to what He went through in His humiliation.

I'm sorry brother, possibly off topic here, but could you explain a little bit about exactly what you mean here? Jesus Christ finite in ANY way at all is not correct. Sorry if I am misunderstanding what you mean.

 

[Stargazer65]

With the finite but extended knowledge that the Lord Jesus now has in His finite, but now glorified and hyper-exalted, human nature, maybe this makes a big difference to the nature of His empathy, compared to what He went through in His humiliation.

I'm sorry brother, possibly off topic here, but could you explain a little bit about exactly what you mean here? Jesus Christ finite in ANY way at all is not correct. Sorry if I am misunderstanding what you mean.

Finite would be correct when speaking of his human nature in the hypostatic union. If it was not finite, then his human nature would not be human.

 

[Peairtach]

Jesus in his humanity is not e.g. omnipresent, omnipotent or omniscient.

These are divine qualities that are "incommunicable" i.e. only God has them or can have them. So the God-Man, Christ, only has them in His divine nature.

 

[Reformedfellow]

Richard,

Jesus in his humanity is not e.g. omnipresent, omnipotent or omniscient.
These are divine qualities that are "incommunicable" i.e. only God has them or can have them. So the God-Man, Christ, only has them in His divine nature.

I think I am gonna need time to think about your argument here before responding. I need time to think about what you are saying here. Jesus, now, in Heaven, at the right hand of God, being infinite AND finite at the same time :S
I can think of many scriptures that indicate our Lord Jesus as not being finite at all. I am quite hesitant to accept your answer (though I maybe do not still understand what you really want to say).

Anyway, it is getting off topic to this thread and is not fair to our brother Earl who started this thread with a separate, and real concern of his.
Forgive us brother Earl.
But perhaps our brother Ruben was most helpful in pointing you to Hebrews 4 for your answer?
I think that was a great response to your question. Jesus, because He HAS experienced our suffering, even to the point of being abandoned, betrayed, mocked, rejected, scorned, tortured, and CRUCIFIED (and ALL without any just cause) He is well able now, even in His divinity way up there heaven (which seems so far away to us) to be our "empathizer", and even more than that, He is our "ALL in ALL".
Or, as our bother Ruben has put it; "Therefore Jesus is both compassionate and free from suffering."

He is indeed interceding for you Earl. (Romans 8:34, Hebrews 7:25, Hebrews 9:24)
What a wonderful Savior we have Earl. He is able, ABLE, to save all that the Father has given Him, save us to the uttermost.

 

[earl40]

Earl, Hebrews 4 answers your question.

Seeing then that we have a great high priest, that is passed into the heavens, Jesus the Son of God, let us hold fast our profession.
For we have not an high priest which cannot be touched with the feeling of our infirmities; but was in all points tempted like as we are, yet without sin.
Let us therefore come boldly unto the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy, and find grace to help in time of need.

Does Jesus feel or experience pain? No, he is passed into the heavens.
Does he therefore lack compassion? No, he is touched with the feelings of our infirmities.

Therefore Jesus is both compassionate and free from suffering. If anyone would like to insist on "touched with the feelings of our infirmities" I should think it would suffice to point out that no one takes it to mean that Christ himself feels weak or tempted or overwhelmed, though we often feel all those things: he helps us in these distresses, he is compassionate towards us in them, without being subject to them.
If that is hard to grasp, I suspect it's because we assume there is a necessary connection between having compassion and sharing a feeling (etymologically justified, no doubt, but not genuinely necessary: however "empathy" may tend to give the wrong idea). The easy way to illustrate that is to consider someone who is hysterical, desperate, or even insane; you can have compassion on them and exert yourself to help them without sharing their feelings. Indeed, not sharing their feelings would seem to be essential to actually being of material help in such a case.
It is good that we have a rock higher than ourselves - that there is an inexhaustible joy that is not intermitted by our flailing: otherwise there would be no solid ground upon which ever to emerge from the changing tides of the various aspects of misery.

Good post, though I suspect if we went around saying "he is compassionate towards us in them, without being subject to them" we would be judged nuts. What I believe would be an interesting study is to look into how the condition of men will be different in the new earth. For instance, I believe we would not be able to say we empathize with someone unless we feel sadness before we die. Now if one is in glory, or dead, one can still be empathetic while experiencing no sadness which is impossible before death. Thus the difficulty in "understanding" this.

 

[py3ak]

Good post, though I suspect if we went around saying "he is compassionate towards us in them, without being subject to them" we would be judged nuts.

Possibly we move in different circles; anyone who wants to say that Christ is subject to suffering is not taking into account that he is the head of the new creation, that he has been exalted to God's right hand, that death has no more dominion over him, that the Lord has gone up with a shout.

 

[earl40]

Good post, though I suspect if we went around saying "he is compassionate towards us in them, without being subject to them" we would be judged nuts.

Possibly we move in different circles; anyone who wants to say that Christ is subject to suffering is not taking into account that he is the head of the new creation, that he has been exalted to God's right hand, that death has no more dominion over him, that the Lord has gone up with a shout.

This board is by far and away the most reformed in ANY circle I have encountered which includes the church we are about to join (PCA). Which is why I use it for my main resource for reference to historic reformed thought. If you guys don't know the "truly reformed" response you know where to get it. I write this with sincere admiration, and am humbled to be a part of such a great resource The Lord has provided.

 

[py3ak]

We're glad to have you here, Earl.