John MacArthur and John Piper

Discussion in 'Preaching' started by Bladestunner316, Aug 29, 2004.

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  1. Bladestunner316

    Bladestunner316 Puritan Board Doctor

    From people who have read and studied their works what would you suggest would be top priority to read from these men?

    blade
     
  2. Me Died Blue

    Me Died Blue Puritan Board Post-Graduate

    I haven't read much MacArthur, but the two books of his that I have read were good: [i:0a06bd2a38]Why One Way?[/i:0a06bd2a38] and [i:0a06bd2a38]The Murder of Jesus[/i:0a06bd2a38]. I've also heard a lot of good things about his [i:0a06bd2a38]Hard to Believe.[/i:0a06bd2a38]

    Piper, I've read much more by. The only two works of his I've found to be very helpful were [i:0a06bd2a38]The Passion of Jesus Christ[/i:0a06bd2a38] (which speaks of the [i:0a06bd2a38]true[/i:0a06bd2a38] meaning and significance of Christ's journey to the Cross amidst the pop-Christianity being aroused by the movie) and [i:0a06bd2a38]Counted Righteous In Christ[/i:0a06bd2a38] (which clarifies and solidifies the historic Reformed, Christian theology on this very central, important doctrine, which itself is even being challenged in our day by so-called Reformed men). Another work of his that I found helpful was [i:0a06bd2a38]The Legacy of Sovereign Joy[/i:0a06bd2a38], but that was only because I was basically clueless with regard to Reformed church history when I read it. It's an extremely introductory-level theological and historical biography of Augustine, Luther and Calvin. Piper's [i:0a06bd2a38]Desiring God[/i:0a06bd2a38] is not very helpful or deep - if you want a better statement of his "Christian Hedonism" in a much shorter book, read [i:0a06bd2a38]The Dangerous Duty of Delight[/i:0a06bd2a38].
     
  3. LawrenceU

    LawrenceU Puritan Board Doctor

    Piper's [u:0b5f7c7857]The Pleasures of God[/u:0b5f7c7857] does a very good job of laying down a foundational understanding of the character and nature of God and its import in theology.
     
  4. fredtgreco

    fredtgreco Vanilla Westminsterian Staff Member

    Piper's [i:be1d604779]Counted Righteous in Christ [/i:be1d604779]is a must read in todays theological millieu.
     
  5. Scot

    Scot Puritan Board Sophomore

    I'm the opposite of Chris. I've read more MacArthur than Piper, though I haven't read all that much of either one. I'm reading Hard To Believe by MacArthur right now (when I get time) and I think it's awesome.

    I've read The Passion Of Jesus Christ by Piper and it is very good. In fact, that's one of the books that we're giving away at the church fair booth this year (along with many others).
     
  6. Puritan Sailor

    Puritan Sailor Puritan Board Doctor

    Piper's "The Supremacy of God in Preaching" and MacArther's "Ashamed of the Gospel" I have found both enlightening.
     
  7. LauridsenL

    LauridsenL Puritan Board Freshman

    I second the recommendation of Piper's Pleasures of God.

    But I even more highly recommend his book, Justification of God: An Exegetical and Theological Study of Romans 9:1-23. It certainly is one of the best (and many believe it is "the" best) exposition of Romans 9 ever written. But it's much more than a commentary on Romans 9. Piper not only annihilates all objections to God's sovereignty over election, he does so in a way that compels and inspires a deeper worship of our awesome God. Piper himself often describes how God used the process of writing the book to influence him. For example,

    "The Fall of 1979

    Then, about ten years later, came the fall of 1979. I was on sabbatical from teaching at Bethel College. My one aim on this leave was to study Romans 9 and write a book on it that would settle, in my own mind, the meaning of these verses. After six years of teaching and finding many students in every class ready to discount my interpretation of this chapter for one reason or another, I decided I had to give eight months to it. The upshot of that sabbatical was the book, The Justification of God. I tried to answer every important exegetical objection to God"(tm)s absolute sovereignty in Romans 9.

    But the result of that sabbatical was utterly unexpected""at least by me. My aim was to analyze God"(tm)s words so closely and construe them so carefully that I could write a book that would be compelling and stand the test of time. What I did not expect was that six months into this analysis of Romans 9 God himself would speak to me so powerfully that I resigned my job at Bethel and made myself available to the Minnesota Baptist Conference if there were a church who would have me as a pastor.

    In essence it happened like this: I was 34 years old. I had two children and a third on the way. As I studied Romans 9 day after day, I began to see a God so majestic and so free and so absolutely sovereign that my analysis merged into worship and the Lord said, in effect, "I will not simply be analyzed, I will be adored. I will not simply be pondered, I will be proclaimed. My sovereignty is not simply to be scrutinized, it is to be heralded. It is not grist for the mill of controversy, it is gospel for sinners who know that their only hope is the sovereign triumph of God"(tm)s grace over their rebellious will." This is when Bethlehem contacted me near the end of 1979. And I do not hesitate to say that because of Romans 9 I left teaching and became a pastor. The God of Romans 9 has been the Rock-solid foundation of all I have said and all I have done in the last 22 years..."

    It's not a quick, "popular-style" read, but it's certainly the best book he's written. You simply cannot fully assess or understand Piper without reading it.
     
  8. Bladestunner316

    Bladestunner316 Puritan Board Doctor

    sounds like i got more reading to do:)

    blade
     
  9. govols

    govols Puritan Board Junior

    For MacArthur, I have thoroughly enjoyed:

    The Gospel According to Jesus
    The Gospel According to the Apostles
    Charismatic Chaos
    Ashamed of the Gospel
    Hard to Believe
    Battle for the Beginning
    Murder of Jesus

    As for Piper:
    The Passion of Jesus Christ
    Counted Righteous in Christ
    Desiring God

    Sproul has some great ones as well. James White.

    I am currently reading "By His Grace and for His Glory," by Thomas J. Nettles.

    Unfortunately I have to reread books to totally remember things. My wife can look at it and remember. :banghead:

    I'm still hoping that in year 10 of our marriage, 2005, that she will begin to rub off on me that part.
     
  10. SoldierOfTheRock

    SoldierOfTheRock Puritan Board Freshman

    Hard To Believe

    I have not read MacArthur's "Hard to Believe" But I do have the audio book. It is great.

    I hve listenend to it atleast 5 times, and everyone I have listen to it really enjoys it. Well, most, some are on the opposite side of God's Sovereignty. They tend to disagree with him, because he takes away the false christianity and worthlessness found so often today in the church.

    All in all, if you can find the audio book somwhere, pick it up and listen to it. It really is that great.
     
  11. luvroftheWord

    luvroftheWord Puritan Board Sophomore

    MacArthur's little book [u:0caee2a6cf]Found: God's Will[/u:0caee2a6cf] is quite good and helps to destroy the popular notion that God has an individual will for everybody's lives that they must find and obey. His [u:0caee2a6cf]The Gospel According to....[/u:0caee2a6cf] books are good as well.

    In the case of Piper, I find him more helpful than MacArthur and I have enjoyed all of the following books by him:

    Desiring God
    The Pleasures of God
    Let the Nations Be Glad: The Supremacy of God in Missions
    The Supremacy of God in Preaching
    Counted Righteous in Christ
    Beyond the Bounds
    Recovering Biblical Manhood and Womanhood
    The Passion of Jesus Christ
    A Hunger for God
     
  12. LauridsenL

    LauridsenL Puritan Board Freshman

    LOTR --

    Read [u:1b261d0427]The Justification of God[/u:1b261d0427]. It will take a bit longer than Piper's other books, but you'll love it.

    Lee
     
  13. Bladestunner316

    Bladestunner316 Puritan Board Doctor

    Which book did piper write that people had quarals over concerning justification?

    blade
     
  14. JWJ

    JWJ Puritan Board Freshman

    [quote:7739fce611="Bladestunner316"]Which book did piper write that people had quarals over concerning justification?

    blade[/quote:7739fce611]

    Future Grace
     
  15. govols

    govols Puritan Board Junior

    I kind of liked that book. I read it along side James White's book on Justification.
     
  16. luvroftheWord

    luvroftheWord Puritan Board Sophomore

    [quote:aa4a4404a0="LauridsenL"]LOTR --

    Read [u:aa4a4404a0]The Justification of God[/u:aa4a4404a0]. It will take a bit longer than Piper's other books, but you'll love it.

    Lee[/quote:aa4a4404a0]

    Ugh! I forgot about that one! That was the first Piper book I ever had. It dispelled all doubt in my mind about Romans 9.

    By the way, my handle is luvroftheWord (LOTW), not Lord of the Rings (LOTR). :lol:
     
  17. JWJ

    JWJ Puritan Board Freshman

    [quote:b336f4dc28="JWJ"][quote:b336f4dc28="Bladestunner316"]Which book did piper write that people had quarals over concerning justification?

    blade[/quote:b336f4dc28]

    Future Grace[/quote:b336f4dc28]

    For clarification... I am taking your question to be what book did Piper write that caused quarals because of his "apparent" Fuller views of justification... that would be Future Grace.

    Jim
     
  18. Bladestunner316

    Bladestunner316 Puritan Board Doctor

    sorry if I wasnt cleaer:)

    blade
     
  19. LauridsenL

    LauridsenL Puritan Board Freshman

    [quote:64ac4d2083]By the way, my handle is luvroftheWord (LOTW), not Lord of the Rings (LOTR). [/quote:64ac4d2083]

    Yeah, sorry about that!
     
  20. BaptistReformer

    BaptistReformer Inactive User

    Apparently I am behind... the last post here was Sept 1, 2004. I am new to the board and just found this discussion.

    I have read MacArthur extensively. In fact I just returned two weeks ago from the Shephards Conference at Grace Church. EXCELLENT!

    ANyway... the current MacArthur work that is extremely helpful in navigating the current Entreprenuership and Man Centered ministry model is FOOL'S GOLD. Great little book! And i would concur with what many others have said HARD TO BELIEVE and THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO Jesus are key works to cut throught the mamby pamby man-centered evangelistic approach so popular to day.

    Hope that helps!
     
  21. BaptistReformer

    BaptistReformer Inactive User

    Apparently I am behind... the last post here was Sept 1, 2004. I am new to the board and just found this discussion.

    I have read MacArthur extensively. In fact I just returned two weeks ago from the Shephards Conference at Grace Church. EXCELLENT!

    ANyway... the current MacArthur work that is extremely helpful in navigating the current Entreprenuership and Man Centered ministry model is FOOL'S GOLD. Great little book! And i would concur with what many others have said HARD TO BELIEVE and THE GOSPEL ACCORDING TO Jesus are key works to cut throught the mamby pamby man-centered evangelistic approach so popular to day.

    Hope that helps!
     
  22. Bladestunner316

    Bladestunner316 Puritan Board Doctor

    :up::up:
     
  23. SolaScriptura

    SolaScriptura Puritan Board Doctor

    I just found this thread, too...

    For Piper, I really like:

    Let the Nations Be Glad
    The Pleasures of God
    Desiring God
    Future Grace

    For MacArthur, my favorite book of his is: The Gospel According to Jesus
     
  24. BlackCalvinist

    BlackCalvinist Puritan Board Senior

    I'm waiting on my copy of Fool's Gold to arrive :)
     
  25. turmeric

    turmeric Megerator

    Faith Works rocks!
     
  26. Redeemed

    Redeemed Puritan Board Freshman

    Gospel According to Jesus made a profound impact on my thinking

    Everything MacArthur writes is powerful
     
  27. govols

    govols Puritan Board Junior

    Josh,

    I agree that those two books are MacArthur's best but the Avatar makes me want to say, "Hey Mo, Hey Larry !" Oh wise guy, huh? Yuck, yuck, yuck, yuck.

    :D
     
  28. Julia

    Julia Inactive User

    We have found McArthur helpful. Recently watched/listened to Does The Truth Matter Anymore on DVD, and its been most encouraging. We live in Hungary, and dont speak the language yet, so fellowship is limited!:)
     
  29. bond-servant

    bond-servant Puritan Board Sophomore

    'Desiring God' by John Piper is awesome. So is "Brothers , we are not professionals" After reading this thread though, I want to read 'The Justification of God'!

    'Hard to believe' by McArthur is good. So is its predecessor "The Gospel according to Jesus':book2:
     
  30. clevipearce

    clevipearce Puritan Board Freshman

    I don't believe 'Don't Waste Your Life' has been mentioned. Although a little less tones down, it packs a powerful message. I recommend this book to less theologically versed persons. I'm probably going to start a small group on my campus next semester with this book.
     
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