Musculus on John 4:24 (Latin; my spelling right?)

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NaphtaliPress

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George Gillespie cites Musculus on John 4:24 in his EPC; not a direct quotation but it looked interesting so I ran it down (the commentary is online; see here). What is the rule on updating Latin spelling? u to v, i to j? Anyone see any misspellings? Anyone question this is the right spot out of Muscuslus (looks to me to be correct but I don't know much Latin)

Gillespie writes: "Musculus reprehends bishops for departing from the apostolical and most ancient simplicity, and for adding ceremonies unto ceremonies in a worldly splendor and spectability, whereas the worship of God ought to be pure and simple.1

1.Musculus on John 4:24. Hanc simplicitatem in ecclesia Christi non tulerunt episcopi, sed cerimonias cerimonijs ita addiderunt, & mundano splendore ornarunt acspectabiles reddiderunt, ut, sicuti hodiernus dies declarat, & Gentes & Judaeos externi cultus superstitione Christiani uicerimus [Vide August. Episto. 119], quod malum tum potissimum inualuit, quando abiecto uerbo die mundana sapientia administrari coepit religio Christi. Quotus hodie quisque est, qui spiritali cultu contentus, non affectet externas aliquas cerimonias, quibus deum colat? [FONT=&quot]Commentariorvm In Evangelistam Ioannem Heptas prima (Basel: [Johann Herwagen,] 1545) 129. [/FONT]
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DTK

Puritan Board Junior
Chris,

Not an answer to your question, but I take it you found the Augustine reference that Musculus cites?

DTK
 

MW

Puritanboard Amanuensis
Chris,

The Musculus excerpt makes the specific points which Gillespie cites.

For standardisation, it is legitimate to replace "j" with "i," and "u" with "v" when it is not functioning as a vowel. E.g., "cerimonijs" to "cerimoniis," and "inualuit" to "invaluit."
 

DTK

Puritan Board Junior
Chris,

The numbering of Augustine's epistles, as employed by Musculus, must be different from the numbering in Migne PL 33. Epistola CXIX (119) in the Augustine corpus of Migne is actually a letter written by one named Consentius to Augustine. If I am correct in speculating that Consentius is the same person to whom Augustine writes in Epistle 205, then he was a monk living in the year 420 among the sect of Priscilianists, who were numerous in Spain. Constentius was probably living, however, at one of the monasteries at Lerins or St. Victor, some monasteries on islands off the south coast of France.

At any rate, he is soliciting Augustine's advice/counsel regarding images of God, thus I don't think Epistola CXIX in Migne's numbering is the correct reference. I think you have some chart handy that cross-references three different numberings of Augustine epistles. If you do, you can let me know here, or email me with another clue as to the numbering if you still desire to have me run it down.

DTK
 

NaphtaliPress

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David,
I was right that I thought I'd seen 119 before. Letter 119 is 55 in Migne. Epistola LV. Ad Inquistiones Januarii. It would help to have the Musculus translated I guess but I think it may be to the same place (Letter 55, chapter xix). There is no indication Musuculus is directly quoting; so far I've not matched any words.
 

DTK

Puritan Board Junior
David,
I was right that I thought I'd seen 119 before. Letter 119 is 55 in Migne. Epistola LV. Ad Inquistiones Januarii. It would help to have the Musculus translated I guess but I think it may be to the same place (Letter 55, chapter xix). There is no indication Musuculus is directly quoting; so far I've not matched any words.

Thanks Chris. I don't think it's really Epistola LV that Musculus has in mind either. I suppose it's either Letter 75.13-14 to Jerome (which can be read in the Schaff or Eerdmans edition), where Augustine seeks to prove to him that Jewish ceremonies are hurtful rather than harmless; or Musculus might have the Letter below in mind...

Augustine (354-430): Let us, then, look at the whole setting of that sentence (i.e., Titus 1:15), and we may thus grasp the Apostle’s meaning, as far as we can, by examining his intention. He was afraid that those to whom he wrote those words were being led astray by the shadows of things and by the fair name of knowledge, that they were being turned away from the light of truth which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. He perceived that they should be put on guard against the preoccupation with vain and useless observances under the name of wisdom and knowledge, against the superstition of the Gentiles, especially of those who were called philosophers, and against Judaizing tendencies, for these shadows of things to come were to be rolled away since Christ their light had now come. Therefore, when he reminded them and wrote to them: ‘How great care he had for them, and for those who were at Laodicea, and whosoever had not seen his face in the flesh, that their hearts might be comforted, being joined in charity, unto all the riches of fullness of understanding unto the knowledge of the mystery of God, which is Christ, in whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge, I say this,’ he said, ‘that no man may deceive you by plausible speech’ (Col. 2:1-4). Because they were attracted by love of truth. Therefore he pointed out in Christ what they held most dear, namely, the treasure of wisdom and knowledge, for it was under the name and by the promise of this that they could have been led into error. Fathers of the Church, Vol. 20, Saint Augustine, Letters 131-164, Letter 149 (Washington D.C.: The Catholic University of America Press, 1953), pp. 257-258.
Latin text: Totam ergo ipsius sententiae circumstantiam videamus: ita enim Apostoli intentione perspecta, sensum ejus, quantum valemus, fortasse tenebimus. Quibus enim ista scribit, metuebat eos seduci umbris rerum, dulci nomine scientiae, et averti a luce veritatis quae est in Christo Jesu Domino nostro. Hanc autem sub nomine sapientiae vel scientiae curam vanarum superfluarumve observationum, et de superstitione gentilitatis, maximeque ab eis qui Philosophi sunt nuncupati, et a Judaismo, cavendam esse cernebat, ubi erant umbrae futurorum removendae, quoniam lumen earum jam Christus advenerat. Cum ergo commemorasset et commendasset quantum certamen pro eis haberet, et pro his qui Laodiceae fuerant, et quicumque non viderant faciem ejus in carne, ut cordibus consolarentur copulati in charitate, et in omnibus divitiis plenitudinis intellectus, ad cognoscendum mysterium Dei, quod est Christus, in quo sunt omnes thesauri sapientiae et scientiae absconditi; Hoc dico, inquit, ut nemo vos circumveniat in veri simili sermone: quia veritatis amore ducebantur, veri similitudinem illis timuit, ne deciperentur. Et ideo commendavit in Christo quod dulcissimum habebant thesaurum, scilicet sapientiae et scientiae, cujus nomine et promissione induci poterant in errorem. Epistola CXLIX, Caput II, §24, PL 33:640.

Or it might even be another letter, but this is what I uncovered thus far; and I don't know if, given the fact that Musculus seems to be referencing rather than citing, it would be profitable to you for me to pursue it further.

Blessings,
DTK
 

NaphtaliPress

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Difficult to know. I had thought about the Jerome as well before I recalled the alias numbering. Musculus may have the reference wrong, but this gets me to the point of doing critical analysis of the text of Musculus which was only referenced by Gillespie in summation rather than quoting (Gillespie does not note the Augustine in his summation). It would make one complicated footnote! I may simply cite the Musculus, note the alias number, and leave it at that. Thanks for the above but I think given the complexities of a secondary or even tertiary notation, we'll call the hunt off.
I will say,and continue to say, it is amazing what is available online.
David,
I was right that I thought I'd seen 119 before. Letter 119 is 55 in Migne. Epistola LV. Ad Inquistiones Januarii. It would help to have the Musculus translated I guess but I think it may be to the same place (Letter 55, chapter xix). There is no indication Musuculus is directly quoting; so far I've not matched any words.

Thanks Chris. I don't think it's really Epistola LV that Musculus has in mind either. I suppose it's either Letter 75.13-14 to Jerome (which can be read in the Schaff or Eerdmans edition), where Augustine seeks to prove to him that Jewish ceremonies are hurtful rather than harmless; or Musculus might have the Letter below in mind...

Augustine (354-430): Let us, then, look at the whole setting of that sentence (i.e., Titus 1:15), and we may thus grasp the Apostle’s meaning, as far as we can, by examining his intention. He was afraid that those to whom he wrote those words were being led astray by the shadows of things and by the fair name of knowledge, that they were being turned away from the light of truth which is in Christ Jesus our Lord. He perceived that they should be put on guard against the preoccupation with vain and useless observances under the name of wisdom and knowledge, against the superstition of the Gentiles, especially of those who were called philosophers, and against Judaizing tendencies, for these shadows of things to come were to be rolled away since Christ their light had now come. Therefore, when he reminded them and wrote to them: ‘How great care he had for them, and for those who were at Laodicea, and whosoever had not seen his face in the flesh, that their hearts might be comforted, being joined in charity, unto all the riches of fullness of understanding unto the knowledge of the mystery of God, which is Christ, in whom are hid all the treasures of wisdom and knowledge, I say this,’ he said, ‘that no man may deceive you by plausible speech’ (Col. 2:1-4). Because they were attracted by love of truth. Therefore he pointed out in Christ what they held most dear, namely, the treasure of wisdom and knowledge, for it was under the name and by the promise of this that they could have been led into error. Fathers of the Church, Vol. 20, Saint Augustine, Letters 131-164, Letter 149 (Washington D.C.: The Catholic University of America Press, 1953), pp. 257-258.
Latin text: Totam ergo ipsius sententiae circumstantiam videamus: ita enim Apostoli intentione perspecta, sensum ejus, quantum valemus, fortasse tenebimus. Quibus enim ista scribit, metuebat eos seduci umbris rerum, dulci nomine scientiae, et averti a luce veritatis quae est in Christo Jesu Domino nostro. Hanc autem sub nomine sapientiae vel scientiae curam vanarum superfluarumve observationum, et de superstitione gentilitatis, maximeque ab eis qui Philosophi sunt nuncupati, et a Judaismo, cavendam esse cernebat, ubi erant umbrae futurorum removendae, quoniam lumen earum jam Christus advenerat. Cum ergo commemorasset et commendasset quantum certamen pro eis haberet, et pro his qui Laodiceae fuerant, et quicumque non viderant faciem ejus in carne, ut cordibus consolarentur copulati in charitate, et in omnibus divitiis plenitudinis intellectus, ad cognoscendum mysterium Dei, quod est Christus, in quo sunt omnes thesauri sapientiae et scientiae absconditi; Hoc dico, inquit, ut nemo vos circumveniat in veri simili sermone: quia veritatis amore ducebantur, veri similitudinem illis timuit, ne deciperentur. Et ideo commendavit in Christo quod dulcissimum habebant thesaurum, scilicet sapientiae et scientiae, cujus nomine et promissione induci poterant in errorem. Epistola CXLIX, Caput II, §24, PL 33:640.

Or it might even be another letter, but this is what I uncovered thus far; and I don't know if, given the fact that Musculus seems to be referencing rather than citing, it would be profitable to you for me to pursue it further.

Blessings,
DTK
 
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