New church building with the Catholics?

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Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Our session is looking at the different building possibilities for our church. So far they have had plans drawn up for expansion of our existing building. They are also looking at the possibility of moving to a pre-existing location that would meet our needs. They have examined locations that would fit the criteria, and have come up with one that might work. They only problem is that it is owned by the city, and the city has a contract with a Catholic school to meet there for three years during the week. If we bought this building, we would have to honor the contract. This is a touchy and dangerous situation in my opinion. I am asking if there is anything morally wrong with purchasing this building, while having to honor the contract to the Catholic Church?

Thanks
 

wsw201

Puritan Board Senior
I don't see anything morally wrong with it. Would it make a difference if it were a secular school?
 

VirginiaHuguenot

Puritanboard Librarian
If the Catholic Church is a false church and the contract requires a true church to serve as the landlord for a false church, I'd have a big problem with that clause.
 

Scott

Puritan Board Graduate
Being a landlord does not imply approval of the doctrines believed by tenants, whether secular or religious.

You could approach the Catholic Church and ask if they would have an interest in mutually terminating the lease early. Maybe they would like to move.
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot
What if a church was landlord to an abortion clinic?

Good point. Supporting a false gospel is more damaging than supporting the murder of the flesh.
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Originally posted by Jeff_Bartel
Originally posted by VirginiaHuguenot
What if a church was landlord to an abortion clinic?

Good point. Supporting a false gospel is more damaging than supporting the murder of the flesh.

Today, our church had a long meeting regarding the new building. The topic of the Catholics being in the same building with us didn't even come up. Everyone seems to just care about the functionality of the building itself, and do not seem to see this as a moral issue.

Please pray for our church as we are now pursuing the purchase of the building so we can put more definite numbers on the price, etc. Ultimately, this will come down to a congregational vote, but the session will make a recommendation first.

Mat 10:28 And you should not fear the ones killing the body, but not being able to kill the soul. But rather fear Him being able to destroy both soul and body in Hell.

From my standpoint, an abortion clinic only kills the body, but the Catholic church sends people to hell with their false gospel. I have a good idea that most of our congregation would gasp at the idea of sharing a building with baby-slayer George Tiller, even for two years. The presence of the Antichrist doesn't seem to have as much of an effect.

How can we as good stewards of our treasures allow such blasphemy to go on under our roof for the sake of saving a few dollars?

- Buy a building to share with the Catholics for 2 years: Lots of money.
- Build a new building on the current location: Alot MORE money.
- Defending Christ's Holy name at all costs: Priceless.
 

Texas Aggie

Puritan Board Freshman
God does not dwell in temples made with hands. The congregation could meet in a part-time brothel and it would not matter (other than perception from the world). Look at where we all live, work and play.... we are surrounded by the world. The temple of God is everywhere.

The building itself has no morality... the people comming inside bring in the trash. Your concern is support of the catholic doctrine and public perception. Stop supporting homosexual lifestyle by giving tips to your waiter at a restaurant if you discern he's gay (its the same principle).

By the way, the Catholic Church does not send anyone to hell, nor does man, nor do any of the fallen angles. God takes care of this little matter. The false doctrine is awful, but there are "those who overcome."

Buy the church and honor the contract. After the contract expires, give them the boot. If the building is nice for the price, take the deal. Who knows, there may be some light shed throughout the remainder of the contract (doubtful, but you never know).

We are all the daughters of Catholicism... sometimes I believe we are not far enough removed.
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Originally posted by Texas Aggie
God does not dwell in temples made with hands. The congregation could meet in a part-time brothel and it would not matter (other than perception from the world). Look at where we all live, work and play.... we are surrounded by the world. The temple of God is everywhere.

True. I am not worried abou the perception of the world, just the judgment of God.

Originally posted by Texas Aggie
The building itself has no morality... the people comming inside bring in the trash. Your concern is support of the catholic doctrine and public perception. Stop supporting homosexual lifestyle by giving tips to your waiter at a restaurant if you discern he's gay (its the same principle).

The building has no morality in itself. Agreed. With all due respect, the building decision is different than giving a gay man a tip. Would you allow a gay convention to meet in your church? How about in your home? Why or why not? Because God has given you responsibility over your home, that while you are in ownership of it, you as a head are to some degree responsible for what goes on inside it.

Originally posted by Texas Aggie
By the way, the Catholic Church does not send anyone to hell, nor does man, nor do any of the fallen angles. God takes care of this little matter. The false doctrine is awful, but there are "those who overcome."

O.k. How about the Catholic church makes people children of hell to use a more biblical phrase. Same meaning.

Mat 23:15 Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you travel across sea and land to make a single proselyte, and when he becomes a proselyte, you make him twice as much a child of hell as yourselves.

Originally posted by Texas Aggie
Buy the church and honor the contract. After the contract expires, give them the boot. If the building is nice for the price, take the deal. Who knows, there may be some light shed throughout the remainder of the contract (doubtful, but you never know).
Would you do the deal if it were an abortion clinic?
 

Texas Aggie

Puritan Board Freshman
Abortion is allowed by God for some divine purpose (I have no idea what). I am not saying it is right at all. We have a responsibility of thwarting such behavior or at the very lest keep away from it.

I think the congregation would be a little sick meeting in such a murderous environment... I myself could not bring myself to attend. It would be very disturbing and a rather extreme example.

As far as the judgment of God, He may want someone to purchase the clinic to end the practice. Likewise, He may intend to have you guys purchase the building to end the Catholic school contract.

If your congregation is rich, go build your own building. If the congregation is struggling, take what you can get (what is offered by God). Eventually the mess with the little Catholic school spreading their infectious doctrine will cease to exist under your power and the provision God has made for your church. Now, if you keep the school running and make money off this group then I would be seriously concerned about judgment.

No, I would not allow a gay convention to rent out our church (this implies support and we would be making money from the deal). On the flip side, I would purchase a building that claimed home to a gay organization, then give them the boot once the contract expired (this does not show support).
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
The session has now recommended that our church pursue the Catholic school building.

I have talked to our pastor in private (he seemed to agree with me, but later seems to support the purchase) and also an elder of the church (who thought I wasn't "trusting" the session and their decision). It's not that I don't trust them in matters of Christian liberty, I would joyfully conceed if this were a matter of mere preference. However, my conscience must be bound to the Word of God in this area, and it seems that some session members are unwilling (or at least it seems they do not want to) talk about it at all.

What else should I do? Go before session with my concerns? This is a touchy subject for them...is it worth rustling feathers over?

:candle:

Also, it seems that a good portion of our church is becoming to friendly with the Catholic movement. Our pastor and others having even called the school priest "father" which is a strict violation of scripture.

Please pray for me...this will not be easy. :pray2:
 

tcalbrecht

Puritan Board Junior
We had a situation a few years ago when our congregation was looking to purchase a Jehovah's Witnesses building. There was discussion on the Session about the wisdom of paying money to the JWs for the property. The Session decided to bring the idea before the congregation with the proviso that if anyone objected on moral grounds the deal would be off. Someone did object and we walked away from the deal.
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Originally posted by tcalbrecht
We had a situation a few years ago when our congregation was looking to purchase a Jehovah's Witnesses building. There was discussion on the Session about the wisdom of paying money to the JWs for the property. The Session decided to bring the idea before the congregation with the proviso that if anyone objected on moral grounds the deal would be off. Someone did object and we walked away from the deal.

I wouldn't have a problem if we were purchasing this building from the Catholics, that would make it more of a business transaction. If you object to this morally, it would seem like to be consistent, you would have to make sure that your styrofoam coffee cups were not purchased from a false religion, etc. etc.

The thing that concerns me with this, is that we would be willingly signing a contract with the Catholic school, allowing them to "worship" during the week, promoting their heresy 5 days out of the week, while we praise our God together on Sunday??? We must not hold hands with the Catholic church! Our differences are THAT big!

I am not saying that our session approves of Catholic doctrine, for they have been clear that they do not. That being said, I think this is not only a dangerous position to put our church in (as many in our congregation are becoming more sympathetic to Catholics), but sinful in that we would be allowing this to go on (knowingly and willingly) in our own building! We are to be good stewards of what we are given, and to let the Antichrist into the church building would be one of the worst acts of "stewardship" I can think of.

P.S. Thanks for the reply!

[Edited on 6-10-2005 by Jeff_Bartel]
 

AdamM

Puritan Board Freshman
Jeff, I think you have done well to state your valid objections to the elders. However, now that the decision has been made, I would pray for the grace to humbly submit to the leadership even though they made what you might legitimately think is a wrong decision. I think it would be an example to all of your maturity, because we are called to labor here on earth within the context of churches that are never going to be perfect.
 

Arch2k

Puritan Board Graduate
Originally posted by AdamM
Jeff, I think you have done well to state your valid objections to the elders. However, now that the decision has been made, I would pray for the grace to humbly submit to the leadership even though they made what you might legitimately think is a wrong decision. I think it would be an example to all of your maturity, because we are called to labor here on earth within the context of churches that are never going to be perfect.

Adam,

Agreed. The only problem is that the battle isn't over. This will ultimately come down to a congregational decision. We have ample time to try to exhort and convince before a final decision is made.

Thanks for your advice.

:handshake:
 
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