Romans922
Puritan Board Professor
This thread would be best answered probably by Rev. PCA Polity himself (Fred Greco) but anyone can answer.
As a side note: I am especially enjoying my two week class on PCA church polity taught my Jack Williamson. Great stuff. He is funny.
I attended a metro Atlanta PCA church a couple weeks ago, and some pretty startling things happened. I was wondering if something could be done (if possible, besides) or if there is nothing that can be done or if nothing can be done because it isn't 'serious' enough. I have heard that the Metro Atlanta Presbytery is a pretty messed up Presbytery influenced greatly by Perimeter ministries.
This is what happened:
It was a new church (about a year old) and they are currently meeting in a business office, pretty big. And I walk in the front doors (with suit and tie on <-- I was the only one), and to the right is a little Cafe area. That was the first thing I saw and I almost puked (how seeker-sensitivish). Then I go into where the service would be, and it was dark (mood lighting). And I notice at once that there are candles set up on the stage, not like a RCC but like an emergent gathering would have (Kirkland's stuff) across the whole stage. It made me cringe. Then the service starts and one of the pastors prayed (they already have about 4 pastors, meeting for a year, almost like a seeker sensitive model of having a pastor for administration, finance, assimilation, etc.). Then they show a video (very emergent type of video) Then three people come up and lead worship and they are closing eyes and lifting hands. Songs I had heard before (contemporary worship - guitar, jimbe, and singer). Then after that, I guess they are starting a fast and pray week (this past week) and it is specifically geared toward listening to God for a call to give to a new church building (state of the art, I might add). This part of the service saw the director of finance (for the new building) talk about the new building (this section of the service was longer than the sermon)!!! Nice looking building (at least it is supposed to be). Then the 'pastor' got up and grabbed a music stand and sat his bible on it, and then grabbed a stool and sat comfortably on it, sticking his legs out as if he was reclining. Oh boy. So the 'sermon' was on 1 Samuel and Samuel's call of God with Eli, etc. (at this time it is appropriate to state that powerpoint is used throughout the service, including sermon). The main point of the sermon was 'listen' tied to the coming week of fast/pray about giving to the new building. So he has a long introduction and talks about how he was a horrible listener to his wife, until this past month. And he says that he is going to teach those gathered how he learned how to listen. He said we need to listen to God's voice, and asks 'how do we hear God's voice?'. So at this point, I think immediately in my head, 'God's Word,' 'Scripture,' etc. He proceeds to say for everyone not to tell his presbytery what he is about to say, which is that we see clearly in Scripture that God's voice has been heard in visions, dreams, prophecies, etc. And says that we can still hear His voice through these means today (non-cessationist view). NEVER MENTIONS THE WORD OF GOD in His sermon, He never preaches the gospel either for that matter (he also makes fun of seminary, but I wont waste time talking about that). He ends his sermon with saying to the people that he is going to show us a passage of Scripture (from Chronicles) and wants us to read it through and pick the verse that speaks to you (this is his practical portion of the 'sermon' (note: he never preached, he didn't even teach for that matter, but had a 'conversation with us' and/or talked)). So I read the passage and picked the whole passage as something that spoke to me (everyone else picked one verse, the passage was about giving). And he said now take that verse and think about it for a minute (wait minute), now he said he wanted everyone to take that home with them and meditate upon it and wait for God to speak to them. Then he said whatever you hear, do it! (Talk about subjectivism!). So then they sang another song and we left.
As a side note: I am especially enjoying my two week class on PCA church polity taught my Jack Williamson. Great stuff. He is funny.
I attended a metro Atlanta PCA church a couple weeks ago, and some pretty startling things happened. I was wondering if something could be done (if possible, besides) or if there is nothing that can be done or if nothing can be done because it isn't 'serious' enough. I have heard that the Metro Atlanta Presbytery is a pretty messed up Presbytery influenced greatly by Perimeter ministries.
This is what happened:
It was a new church (about a year old) and they are currently meeting in a business office, pretty big. And I walk in the front doors (with suit and tie on <-- I was the only one), and to the right is a little Cafe area. That was the first thing I saw and I almost puked (how seeker-sensitivish). Then I go into where the service would be, and it was dark (mood lighting). And I notice at once that there are candles set up on the stage, not like a RCC but like an emergent gathering would have (Kirkland's stuff) across the whole stage. It made me cringe. Then the service starts and one of the pastors prayed (they already have about 4 pastors, meeting for a year, almost like a seeker sensitive model of having a pastor for administration, finance, assimilation, etc.). Then they show a video (very emergent type of video) Then three people come up and lead worship and they are closing eyes and lifting hands. Songs I had heard before (contemporary worship - guitar, jimbe, and singer). Then after that, I guess they are starting a fast and pray week (this past week) and it is specifically geared toward listening to God for a call to give to a new church building (state of the art, I might add). This part of the service saw the director of finance (for the new building) talk about the new building (this section of the service was longer than the sermon)!!! Nice looking building (at least it is supposed to be). Then the 'pastor' got up and grabbed a music stand and sat his bible on it, and then grabbed a stool and sat comfortably on it, sticking his legs out as if he was reclining. Oh boy. So the 'sermon' was on 1 Samuel and Samuel's call of God with Eli, etc. (at this time it is appropriate to state that powerpoint is used throughout the service, including sermon). The main point of the sermon was 'listen' tied to the coming week of fast/pray about giving to the new building. So he has a long introduction and talks about how he was a horrible listener to his wife, until this past month. And he says that he is going to teach those gathered how he learned how to listen. He said we need to listen to God's voice, and asks 'how do we hear God's voice?'. So at this point, I think immediately in my head, 'God's Word,' 'Scripture,' etc. He proceeds to say for everyone not to tell his presbytery what he is about to say, which is that we see clearly in Scripture that God's voice has been heard in visions, dreams, prophecies, etc. And says that we can still hear His voice through these means today (non-cessationist view). NEVER MENTIONS THE WORD OF GOD in His sermon, He never preaches the gospel either for that matter (he also makes fun of seminary, but I wont waste time talking about that). He ends his sermon with saying to the people that he is going to show us a passage of Scripture (from Chronicles) and wants us to read it through and pick the verse that speaks to you (this is his practical portion of the 'sermon' (note: he never preached, he didn't even teach for that matter, but had a 'conversation with us' and/or talked)). So I read the passage and picked the whole passage as something that spoke to me (everyone else picked one verse, the passage was about giving). And he said now take that verse and think about it for a minute (wait minute), now he said he wanted everyone to take that home with them and meditate upon it and wait for God to speak to them. Then he said whatever you hear, do it! (Talk about subjectivism!). So then they sang another song and we left.
No, on second thought, don't answer that question.
That "service" is an atrocity.
