question about open theism
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Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
I agree with that statement Dan. Prayer does not change the future. That would mean that the future is up for grabs.
Me Died Blue
Puritan Board Post-Graduate
We can see from Scripture that prayer is certainly heard and used by God, but that is no problem for the doctrine of sovereign providence - for if He can ordain the end events that come as a result of prayer, He can certainly ordain the prayer itself as well, as a chosen means for those ends.
Me Died Blue
Puritan Board Post-Graduate
In addition to my comments above about God ordaining prayer as a possible means to ends that He has also ordained, that question reveals a grave and narrow misunderstanding about the nature of prayer, in that it understands supplication to be its full substance. A brief look at many prayers in the Bible, especially the Lord's, will show that petition is but one of many essential parts of prayer, and really is not even the most basic part, which is praising God in thankfulness.
is it safe to say that prayer ushers in God's will? Or is that only one part of the truth about prayer? Do we, at one point, say that the function of prayer/God's complete sovereignty/God's willingness to hear our prayers and respond to them is something we can't fully explain...that it is a mystery?
heartoflesh
Puritan Board Junior
I don't know if I would say that prayer ushers in God's will, if that means that God's will won't/can't be done unless I pray. God's will will be done whether or not I pray, and he may will that I pray. If I pray, it is because God willed it.
Scott Bushey
Puritanboard Commissioner
Dave,
But God does not base the outcomes (His decree's) upon our faithfulness or prayers. We are commanded to pray, hence, we pray.
But God does not base the outcomes (His decree's) upon our faithfulness or prayers. We are commanded to pray, hence, we pray.
I agree with Chris' comments mostly. God commands us to pray not because it can alter His will, or that He doesnt already know what need and desire, but so when He grants us what we need we will be apt to thank and praise Him. If God just gave us the things we need w/o prayer we wouldnt be conscious of His lovingkindess towards us.
Me Died Blue
Puritan Board Post-Graduate
That is how we reconcile the *apparent* changing of God's actions (such as Moses' various prayers for mercy on the Israelites) with His sovereign providence.
no1special18
Puritan Board Freshman
C.S Lewis
I know C.S Lewis did not have the greatest theology, but I think he said it well when he said that...
"Prayer does not change God it changes me."
-C.S Lewis-
I know C.S Lewis did not have the greatest theology, but I think he said it well when he said that...
"Prayer does not change God it changes me."
-C.S Lewis-
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