Southern Baptist Convention 2021 Meeting

Taylor

Puritan Board Senior
There has been a good deal of buzz about the 2021 Southern Baptist Convention that took place last week. I know we have quite a few SBC folks on the board. What are your perspectives? The election of Litton to the presidency is troubling to me. Many are rejoicing that the SBC narrowly escaped a "fundamentalist takeover." However, Litton co-preaches with his wife, and up until last week his church taught formal trinitarian heresy. Many in the SBC are saying that turning the convention around at this point is practically impossible. There was a significant effort to elect a conservative this time around, and it failed. With the convention being held in Anaheim next year, a similar effort will be well night impossible.

Is the SBC lost? Is it time for the faithful to leave? What are your thoughts?
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Senior
Here is a helpful take by Tom Ascol (whom, it so happens, I got to hear preach at his church in Cape Coral, FL, a week ago).
 

arapahoepark

Puritan Board Post-Graduate
:popcorn:

I would probably leave if a part of it though for very different reasons that Russell Moore did. Thank God I do not have to make that choice and that my non-denom church is vehemently anti-woke.
Conservatives though have really dug themselves a hole with all the cover ups. I think they lost their credibility. But, I only speak as an outsider. I have to say that if I am right I am appalled at the speed at which people are abandoning the truth for woke.
 

J.L. Allen

Puritan Board Sophomore
There has been a good deal of buzz about the 2021 Southern Baptist Convention that took place last week. I know we have quite a few SBC folks on the board. What are your perspectives? The election of Litton to the presidency is troubling to me. Many are rejoicing that the SBC narrowly escaped a "fundamentalist takeover." However, Litton co-preaches with his wife, and up until last week his church taught formal trinitarian heresy. Many in the SBC are saying that turning the convention around at this point is practically impossible. There was a significant effort to elect a conservative this time around, and it failed. With the convention being held in Anaheim next year, a similar effort will be well night impossible.

Is the SBC lost? Is it time for the faithful to leave? What are your thoughts?
In a serious note, I find the view of narrowly escaping a so-called fundamentalist takeover to be disturbing. I understand there is much to the debate that raged in the late 19th and early 20th century of the Western church, but it really came down to affirming the fundamentals. Have they not read a church history book or taken a look at beyond their noses to see the devolution of the church and the current state of affairs?
 

B.L.

Puritan Board Sophomore
There has been a good deal of buzz about the 2021 Southern Baptist Convention that took place last week. I know we have quite a few SBC folks on the board. What are your perspectives? The election of Litton to the presidency is troubling to me. Many are rejoicing that the SBC narrowly escaped a "fundamentalist takeover." However, Litton co-preaches with his wife, and up until last week his church taught formal trinitarian heresy. Many in the SBC are saying that turning the convention around at this point is practically impossible. There was a significant effort to elect a conservative this time around, and it failed. With the convention being held in Anaheim next year, a similar effort will be well night impossible.

Is the SBC lost? Is it time for the faithful to leave? What are your thoughts?

I'm in the unique situation of being a member of a SBC congregation, but not considering myself Southern Baptist. I appreciate much about my local church, but I'm not a SBC loyalist by any stretch. While the denomination is mostly comprised of political/social conservatives, it is a mixed bag when it comes to doctrinal beliefs. Yes, despite the BF&M.

I don't think the SBC is lost. Sure there is much to be concerned about, but Mike Stone - despite being the victim of an 11th hour smear campaign - only lost to Ed Litton by a rather small margin. I think faithful churches instead might want to reconsider how much they give to the cooperative program. When I think of denominations that are beyond hope I think of the United Methodist Church...the SBC is nowhere close to taking on that much water.

Speaking to my particular situation, my pastor gave a short recap yesterday of the 2021 convention and he had some harsh words for the Conservative Baptist Network and those like Founders who are fighting the good fight against the CRT infiltration. Needless to say it was a quiet car ride home not wanting to express my disappointment and frustration with my kids in the back seat.

At any rate...those are my quick thoughts on the matter.
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Senior
Speaking to my particular situation, my pastor gave a short recap yesterday of the 2021 convention and he had some harsh words for the Conservative Baptist Network and those like Founders who are fighting the good fight against the CRT infiltration. Needless to say it was a quiet car ride home not wanting to express my disappointment and frustration with my kids in the back seat.
Your post is helpful, but I’m having a hard time deciphering the meaning of this paragraph.
 

B.L.

Puritan Board Sophomore
Your post is helpful, but I’m having a hard time deciphering the meaning of this paragraph.

Speaking to my particular situation, my pastor gave a short recap yesterday of the 2021 convention and he had some harsh words for the Conservative Baptist Network and those like Founders who are fighting the good fight against the CRT infiltration. Needless to say it was a quiet car ride home not wanting to express my disappointment and frustration with my kids in the back seat.

Sorry...I wrote that in a hurry. What I meant was in my local church my pastor spoke out against those who are concerned about the trajectory the SBC appears to be on and rather than vent my frustration to my wife on the car ride home I chose to remain silent. My children are too young to understand the issues and don't need to hear me criticize the leadership in the church.

Hopefully this makes better sense.
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Senior
Sorry...I wrote that in a hurry. What I meant was in my local church my pastor spoke out against those who are concerned about the trajectory the SBC appears to be on and rather than vent my frustration to my wife on the car ride home I chose to remain silent. My children are too young to understand the issues and don't need to hear me criticize the leadership in the church.

Hopefully this makes better sense.
Ah, I see. Thank you for clarifying, brother.

Why is your pastor speaking out against those who are concerned about the trajectory of the SBC? That in itself is disturbing. Personally, I think anyone who is not at least concerned about the SBC is at very best naïve.
 

B.L.

Puritan Board Sophomore
Why is your pastor speaking out against those who are concerned about the trajectory of the SBC? That in itself is disturbing. Personally, I think anyone who is not at least concerned about the SBC is at very best naïve.

I found it troubling and was caught off guard by his remarks. He said he's going to give a much fuller account of what transpired at the convention in the near future. I know he has close ties to several in the SBC who have been criticized for being "woke", so I believe he may have been partially motivated to want to defend men he knows and respects from what he considers to be unfair attacks.
 

Ben Zartman

Puritan Board Sophomore
Sorry...I wrote that in a hurry. What I meant was in my local church my pastor spoke out against those who are concerned about the trajectory the SBC appears to be on and rather than vent my frustration to my wife on the car ride home I chose to remain silent. My children are too young to understand the issues and don't need to hear me criticize the leadership in the church.

Hopefully this makes better sense.
Wouldn't this be a good opportunity to show your children that:
1: it is sometimes necessary to disagree with church leaders.
2: there is a right way to do so.
Whenever the elders in our church do something wrong or stupid, or teach some error, I make sure my children know what is right according to Scripture. It's my duty as a father. Hopefully they will learn to search the Scriptures for themselves and be able to discern good from evil.
 

Jonathco

Puritan Board Freshman
I'm not Southern Baptist, but I watch the SBC closely (lately with disappointment).

I had a feeling Litton would win - he was widely supported by the SBC establishment; he leans moderate-liberal; and he tickles the ears of many, by claiming to be complementarian, while also allowing his wife to "co-teach" [cough] preach from the pulpit. With all of that, Litton swept the middle of the SBC, picking up the center, the majority of the left-of-center, and likely some of the right-of-center who feared a "fundamentalist" gaining the presidency. Sadly, I don't see Litton reducing the liberal decline that is plaguing the SBC.

In addition to the CRT/I infiltration, the SEND Network & NAMB are also pushing a heavy "seeker-friendly" church plant initiative that is further deteriorating any semblance of a healthy, reforming church. It saddens me deeply that I have brothers in the Lord who are at-this-time pursuing membership for their churches, in the SBC.

For those of us who are confessional reformed baptists, the SBC has become an association I would not even consider. If my church was SBC, I would encourage it to leave immediately. Sadly, this also makes the options for confessional baptist associations even slimmer, as given their prior failings, I would be concerned with ARBCA as well.
 

B.L.

Puritan Board Sophomore
Wouldn't this be a good opportunity to show your children that:
1: it is sometimes necessary to disagree with church leaders.
2: there is a right way to do so.
Whenever the elders in our church do something wrong or stupid, or teach some error, I make sure my children know what is right according to Scripture. It's my duty as a father. Hopefully they will learn to search the Scriptures for themselves and be able to discern good from evil.

No, I don't think the car ride home was the appropriate timing for a teaching moment.

Before I go criticizing leadership in the church I want to make sure I've first been quick to listen and slow to speak.

The conversation with the kids, if and when needed, will come after I hear the full report my pastor plans on presenting to the congregation.
 

B.L.

Puritan Board Sophomore
With all of that, Litton swept the middle of the SBC, picking up the center, the majority of the left-of-center, and likely some of the right-of-center

Litton won by only 556 votes...that's hardly indicative of him having swept anything. Moreover, when you consider there are 47,000 churches voluntarily associated with the SBC the number of messengers who were present to vote was pretty low overall (though this year's showing was historically high). I don't have time to confirm right now, but I think I recall there were ~15,000 messengers in attendance this year. If the church to messenger ratio was 1:1 there would still be over 30,000 churches in the SBC that didn't even send a messenger and yet when you consider churches are permitted to send as many as 12 messengers each the number of churches that likely didn't participate may have been even greater. I know several SBC congregations in my area that voluntarily associate with the SBC of Virginia, but aren't engaged at the national level at all.

For those of us who are confessional reformed baptists, the SBC has become an association I would not even consider. If my church was SBC, I would encourage it to leave immediately. Sadly, this also makes the options for confessional baptist associations even slimmer, as given their prior failings, I would be concerned with ARBCA as well.

So, is the Village Church of Byron confessionally reformed? I poked around the website and facebook page and didn't see any signs that it is. Is your church voluntarily associated with any other like-minded churches?
 
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Jonathco

Puritan Board Freshman
Random observation. The guy that is always standing behind Greear in the pictures looks like Emperor Palpatine.View attachment 8147
With just a touch of Mr. Burns added in too.

R753b2e39d63ac2297f167a94f5478adf
 

Broadus

Puritan Board Freshman
Our elders are meeting to discuss whether we remain in the SBC. I began as pastor here almost nineteen years ago, and our relationship with the SBC has become increasingly distant as we've moved in a more Reformed way, recently adopting the 1689 Second London Baptist Confession.

The SBC, along with our churches, has been moving in a pragmatic direction for over a century, and the Conservative Resurgence over the inerrancy of the Bible did little, if anything, to move us away from pragmatism, at least from my perspective. The 2021 Convention was almost a complete embarrassment.
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Senior
Our elders are meeting to discuss whether we remain in the SBC. I began as pastor here almost nineteen years ago, and our relationship with the SBC has become increasingly distant as we've moved in a more Reformed way, recently adopting the 1689 Second London Baptist Confession.

The SBC, along with our churches, has been moving in a pragmatic direction for over a century, and the Conservative Resurgence over the inerrancy of the Bible did little, if anything, to move us away from pragmatism, at least from my perspective. The 2021 Convention was almost a complete embarrassment.
Have you folks had any contact or correspondence with Founders Ministries down in Florida? They might be able to give good counsel. I visited Tom Ascol’s church the Sunday before the convention, and he asked for prayers from the pulpit. I’m not sure if their disposition toward the SBC has changed.
 

Broadus

Puritan Board Freshman
Have you folks had any contact or correspondence with Founders Ministries down in Florida? They might be able to give good counsel. I visited Tom Ascol’s church the Sunday before the convention, and he asked for prayers from the pulpit. I’m not sure if their disposition toward the SBC has changed.
Indeed. Founders has been a great resource for us. Tom Ascol and Jared Longshore are obviously unhappy with what all has happened but still want to be engaged with the SBC and try to bring about change. I'm not convinced that real change is doable. The SBC is so large and the elitists are so entrenched in power that it's hard to see lasting change happening. The SBC is a very pragmatic denomination, not a deeply theological one. "Decisionism" is mistaken for evangelism, programs for discipleship, and emotionalism for worship. Often I wonder if we're even talking about the same gospel.
 

Christopher Robin

Puritan Board Freshman
My SBC church gives money "selectively" to particular programs, refusing to fund such things as their publishing house which peddles all sorts of heretical stuff alongside the good stuff. Fortunately our local Association and (to a lesser degree) State Convention are pretty solid.
 

Ben Zartman

Puritan Board Sophomore
For those of you who are in the SBC, what do you see as the benefits of association? Historically, Baptists have not seen a Scriptural mandate to associate (even though our Presbyterian friends do, but I don't wish to debate that here).
It seems that since forming denominations is not biblically required, the liabilities far outweigh any benefits, but maybe there's benefits that I simply don't see.
 

gjensen

Puritan Board Freshman
For those of you who are in the SBC, what do you see as the benefits of association? Historically, Baptists have not seen a Scriptural mandate to associate (even though our Presbyterian friends do, but I don't wish to debate that here).
It seems that since forming denominations is not biblically required, the liabilities far outweigh any benefits, but maybe there's benefits that I simply don't see.


LBC 26.14,15 is helpful.
 

gjensen

Puritan Board Freshman
That churches may apply to one another for aid and counsel is a far cry from forming formal associations; in fact, the LBCF comes out against the formation of denominations.

I would say that the confession affirms associational churchmanship. I am certainly not saying that the SBC is an ideal example of what that should look like.
 
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