The New Cambridge Paragraph Bible?

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Regi Addictissimus

Completely sold out to the King
Good afternoon. Let me start off by pleading for this to not become a translation debate. I am simply looking to spend more time with the King James and trying to find the right one to do it with.
Can anyone comment on the NCPB that has spent significant time with it? David Norton seems to have put a lot of effort into this rendering of the KJ. I will probably purchase it for Logos first and then buy it in print later.
I found the following article about the NCPB interesting.

"you want to know what the KJV translators really intended, you need the New Cambridge Paragraph Bible. Editor David Norton, like F.H.A. Scrivener before him, dedicated years of his scholarly life to blowing away “thousands of specks of dust from the received text.” He looked at the personal diaries of KJV translators. He learned Hebrew. He went to Oxford’s Bodleian library and studied the surviving notes from the translators’ work—particularly their scrawls on unbound copies of the Bishop’s Bible, which they were instructed to revise. Norton performed his task with excessive care: to call him “detail-oriented” would be like calling Paul “an influential theologian” or calling Spurgeon “good with words.”

https://blog.logos.com/2017/06/youve-probably-never-seen-real-king-james-version/

https://www.logos.com/product/24557/the-new-cambridge-paragraph-bible-with-the-apocrypha-rev-ed

I have also been drooling over the Schuyler Canterbury KJV for some time.
 
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JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
I have a large format, and the smaller 'personal size' copy of the work. It was Mark Bertrand's Bible Design Blog article that first got me interested in the paragraph format, and the two editions (large/small). I've read David Norton's History of the KJV Bible, and it is very informative with plenty of info on the KJV in general, and the NCPB in particular. This Wikipedia article on the NCPB distills it down and will give the rhyme and reason for the revision. Of the two editions the larger 2005 is preferable, if you're reading at home. It is a workout to take along. The personal size is okay, but the print is small, and as noted in the blog, the ghosting is noticeable.
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Post-Graduate
I was not aware of this project until now, and I am now very interested. I just read Norton’s preface, and it seems like a great project. I just bought it in Logos.
 

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
I was not aware of this project until now, and I am now very interested. I just read Norton’s preface, and it seems like a great project. I just bought it in Logos.
I'm sure you'll like Norton's revision. I'm curious, I was very disturbed when I found that my print editions have a typo in Galatians 3:13b, though I've gotten over it. The text reads, "Cursed is every one that hangeth on tree." Omitting the 'a' before 'tree.' The digital version would be corrected I expect ?
 

Regi Addictissimus

Completely sold out to the King
I was not aware of this project until now, and I am now very interested. I just read Norton’s preface, and it seems like a great project. I just bought it in Logos.
Let me know what you think. I have been eying it for a while. The samples I have read have been enjoyable.
 
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Regi Addictissimus

Completely sold out to the King
I have a large format, and the smaller 'personal size' copy of the work. It was Mark Bertrand's Bible Design Blog article that first got me interested in the paragraph format, and the two editions (large/small). I've read David Norton's History of the KJV Bible, and it is very informative with plenty of info on the KJV in general, and the NCPB in particular. This Wikipedia article on the NCPB distills it down and will give the rhyme and reason for the revision. Of the two editions the larger 2005 is preferable, if you're reading at home. It is a workout to take along. The personal size is okay, but the print is small, and as noted in the blog, the ghosting is noticeable.

Thanks for the information. What are your impressions on the work itself? Do you find it enjoyable to read?
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Post-Graduate
I'm curious, I was very disturbed when I found that my print editions have a typo in Galatians 3:13b, though I've gotten over it. The text reads, "Cursed is every one that hangeth on tree." Omitting the 'a' before 'tree.' The digital version would be corrected I expect ?

That’s what the Logos edition has, as well. That’s strange.
 

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
That’s what the Logos edition has, as well. That’s strange.
LOL, I couldn't wait so I went to Logos, saw that the NCPB was only $9.99, and went for it. Sure enough, the typo is there. So, I don't know how they digitally format their copy, but apparently they went straight from the existing printed text.
I'm sending an email to Logos to make them aware of the mistake. Perhaps it is not that difficult to update, and correct, the typo.
 

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
Thanks for the information. What are your impressions on the work itself? Do you find it enjoyable to read?
I do find it enjoyable to read. It took awhile for me to become accustomed to the paragraph format, as opposed to the familiar double column layout, but once I did the text seemed to flow more easily.

On the other hand, for bringing to church, or a Bible study I prefer a traditional layout with larger verse numbers. The verse numbers in the large 2005 edition, and in the 'personal size' edition, are minuscule, and it if you're leafing through to find a passage the pastor announces in beginning his sermon, or in a Bible study, it can be difficult to find the verse in a timely manner.
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Post-Graduate

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
Mine has the Gal's verse, correct:

13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:

The Cambridge Paragraph Bible: Of the Authorized English Version (Cambridge: Cambridge University Press, 1873), Ga 3:13.

Scrivener, Ambrose edition
LOL ! That edition can be had on Logos for the same $9.99.

David Norton, the editor of the NCPB, writes that, while Scrivener was a true scholar, he used his own judgment to 'perfect' the text where he thought it needed correction, or improvement, without the necessity of proof from previous manuscripts. I take that policy to be tantamount to that of the modern day textual critics, Westcot & Hort, Metzger, Aland. Making assumptions without the textual proofs, as I understand it.

Here is a very good interview with NCPB editor David Norton, who, it turns out, is a direct descendent of the great Welsh preacher Daniel Rowland !
 

Cohawkin

Puritan Board Freshman
I can comment on the physical aspects of the smaller hardback edition.
The paper is delicate, sensitive to moisture, so it is not suitable for pen marking, but pencil works well. It does show a fair amount of ghosting, but it seems that about 90% of the text are line matched to the adjacent pages, and in those instances ghosting is not distracting. I find the 9 point font to be clearer to me than a comparable esv paragraph bible, and when I am relaxed I can get immersed in reading. There is also a good amount of leading in between lines to help your eyes follow along. I suffer with astigmatism in both eyes, and like to read without my glasses. This is one of the few bibles I have found to be comfortable and has become my primary bible.

Also, the translator's notes found in the inner margin are helpful and I have surprisingly seen some variant translations offered that are now found in modern bibles.
 

Regi Addictissimus

Completely sold out to the King
David Norton, who, it turns out, is a direct descendent of the great Welsh preacher Daniel Rowland !

That is fascinating! Thanks for sharing. I also look forward to the interview.
 
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Taylor

Puritan Board Post-Graduate
I believe Logos has a feature to report typos.

Well, it’s technically not a typo for Logos. If that’s what is published in print, then that is what Logos has to publish, as well. They
can’t be selling a different product than Cambridge while calling it the same thing. The only thing to do would be to report it to Cambridge, let them fix it, and then wait for Logos to update accordingly.
 

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
Well, it’s technically not a typo for Logos. If that’s what is published in print, then that is what Logos has to publish, as well. They
can’t be selling a different product than Cambridge while calling it the same thing. The only thing to do would be to report it to Cambridge, let them fix it, and then wait for Logos to update accordingly.
I sent Logos an email this morning. Got an automated reply that they would be in touch within a few days. You make a very pertinent point. It seems, from what I've read, and Cambridge's track record with the NCPB, that it is unlikely that they will reprint it anytime soon. I'll send Cambridge an email as well though.
 

JimmyH

Puritan Board Senior
I received a reply to my email from Logos. They gave instructions on how to report a typo via right clicking after highlighting. I couldn't do that because my app is on an android, so I called them. A young lady was very helpful, and she reported it.
I asked if they would change it, and add the 'a', and she said she couldn't be sure. They might contact Cambridge to make them aware of it, and ask permission. Anyway ... if it changes in my app, and I notice it, I'll know it got done. :)
 

Taylor

Puritan Board Post-Graduate
Have you spent anytime with it yet? If so, what are your thoughts?

Not really. To be quite honest, I am not familiar enough with the particularities of the KJV and its vocabulary to notice when a word here or there has been changed by the editor. I do like the use of quotation marks, though. However, I am not sure what I think about the disuse of italics for added words. Apparently, the editor, Norton, wrote an article somewhere arguing that they are not as helpful as is often believed.

My opinion of the work is, for now, based solely upon the words of the editor himself in the preface.
 
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