Tight jeans

[sis]

With the second-hand stores, Wal-Mart, etc, many options are available if people desire to dress nicely for worship, yet do not have much of a budget for clothing.

Does it matter anymore?

My pet peeve is blue jeans and knit clothing that show the entire, totally entire figure.

The problem is, if a church is upholding God's Word, it will attract godly people, but will they visit more than once if the general attire is the same as those attending a ball game?

 

[Tim]

I am right with you on this one, Anne (I checked your profile to see your name - welcome to the Puritan Board). It seems that people don't care anymore about dressing properly. I am sometimes the only one in the congregation with a tie (pastors included).

A few things that I think should be done:

1. A shirt and tie for the men (cheap to acquire), a jacket if you can afford it;
2. Men should never wear sandals;
3. Women should be careful about the length of their skirt/dress;
4. No cleavage;
5. Women should be careful about the tightness (or looseness) of their clothing as well as clothing that is "semi-see-through";
6. Children should be held to the same standard as adults (within reason for the youngest, of course)

This is not legalism; it is about respect and honor for the Lord's House and the importance of the meeting. I have noticed over the years that one litmus test is how the teenage girls of the congregation dress. That will tell you a lot about the importance the church places on modesty and respectful clothing (or, to be fair, the struggle the church has where people have not been brought up to show honor in their manner of dress).



Interestingly, people used to dress nicely at ball games! Look closely at the bottom of the picture (circa 1908) - the men are dressed better than is now commonly seen in many churches!

 

[Abd_Yesua_alMasih]

Doesn't it sort of depend on culture? I am not advocating being lazy in dress but here even in business meetings is a tie rarely worn. To then wear a suit and tie to church would be really over dressing. I could see however that in some parts of the world wearing a suit and tie would be completely respectable.

On the earlier note though, I did leave a number of churches back in 2004 when I found I was faced with more temptation when attending church than I ever was out in the secular world during the week.

 

[ReformedWretch]

Sis, welcome! Please see my signature for requirement for your signature

 

[raekwon]

I am right with you on this one, Anne (I checked your profile to see your name - welcome to the Puritan Board). It seems that people don't care anymore about dressing properly. I am sometimes the only one in the congregation with a tie (pastors included).

A few things that I think should be done:

1. A shirt and tie for the men (cheap to acquire), a jacket if you can afford it;
2. Men should never wear sandals;
3. Women should be careful about the length of their skirt/dress;
4. No cleavage;
5. Women should be careful about the tightness (or looseness) of their clothing as well as clothing that is "semi-see-through";
6. Children should be held to the same standard as adults (within reason for the youngest, of course)

This is not legalism; it is about respect and honor for the Lord's House and the importance of the meeting. I have noticed over the years that one litmus test is how the teenage girls of the congregation dress. That will tell you a lot about the importance the church places on modesty and respectful clothing (or, to be fair, the struggle the church has where people have not been brought up to show honor in their manner of dress).

Numbers 3-5 generally seem to be about modesty in dress, which is important (and applies equally to men as it does to women), but 1 and 2 are pretty arbitrary and dependent on the culture of the church. I have a hard time buying that there's something inherently more "respectful" or "honorable" about a tie and jacket, and binding someone's conscience to specific items of dress is wrong.

 

[kvanlaan]

Just last night we went to our favorite second-hand store and got my eldest son Judah a suit. Not a polyester leisure suit, but a wool-blend suit by Cambridge. And it was $33, with white dress shirt included.

Funny thing is, the same son was saying yesterday (as we are looking for a new home church) that while he likes the service at the church I grew up in (CRC) and the music is more lively (sometimes even Hillsongs ) and things are easier for him to understand; the church we've been attending in the evenings as a possible one (FRC), while difficult to understand and not as lively (EP with the "Thees and Thous" preserved) and somewhat long in the tooth to him (sermons are about an hour and can be rather complex theologically), he would rather go there.

Why? The modesty practised in the FRC and the reverence of worship is, to him, so much more appropriate than the behaviour of the kids at the CRC (he's been to youth group a few times and says he doesn't need to go back). Add to that the general disrespect for parental authority and the tart-ish habits of dress, and he is rather confused by some aspects of Western Christianity.

Sorry, perhaps a little but this all happened here in the last 24 hours, it's on the tip of my tongue.

 

[Rangerus]

While our early morning service here in Austin is primarily coat and tie, the general dress around the church is "business" casual. (slacks and pullovers, although not shorts and sandals). And the same for women.

Austin prides itself in being a "laid-back" town where it is rare to see anyone in a coat and tie anywhere. The city motto is "Keep Austin weird" (I don't agree with this)

I did once, about 20 years ago, attend a church (Baptist) in Waco where many of the young women wore very revealing attire that to say the least was a distraction.

 

[shackleton]

The thing I do not like is when girls where form fitting pants that basically show everything. This is rather distracting and makes it hard to concentrate on the service, (maybe it is just me), I get enough of that all week it would be nice to not be tempted at chruch as well as in the world.

 

[Tripel]

The immodesty of women and girls in church (of all places) is a soapbox issue for me. It used to be that girls and boys grew up wanting to be like their parents. Boys wearing their daddy's old (and far too big) dress shoes and girls wearing mama's pearls. I'm not sure it has changed too much for men, but these days it is more likely that the women are the ones trying to dress like the girls.

There's an out-of-town church I visit whenever I am in that area, and it saddens me to see how the women and girls dress. Mothers and daughters wearing the same styles and sporting the same cleavage. The only difference is that the mothers' tanned skin is looking leathery while the teens' tanned skin has a few years before it is fully damaged.

I'm sorry honey, but you don't look 20 years old. You look every bit of 45, yet desperate to have your youth back.

 

[PastorSBC]

1. A shirt and tie for the men (cheap to acquire), a jacket if you can afford it;

So what specifically about a tie and jacket make a man more honoring to the Lord?

 

[Notthemama1984]

One can dress nicely without a tie.

 

[CDM]

When promoting ones preference of dress, one should consider the poor in this country. Contrary to modern American sentiment, the poor do exist.

 

[Tripel]

So what specifically about a tie and jacket make a man more honoring to the Lord?

You're right. It's not about the specific items of clothing. But I think the point of Tim's post is to say that we should make an extra effort regarding our dress when we go to worship. For some people, that's going to be a tie or a suit. For others, it means their leather shoes.

My church is on the formal end of the spectrum. Mostly suits among the men. I like it that way, but on the other hand I think it causes some people to be uncomfortable. I'm thinking specifically about a family that has attended our church off and on. They don't have much money, and definitely not the kind of money to get their many kids suits and ties. They wear jeans and casual shirts, sometimes sandals, but I get the feeling that they ARE dressing up. Their shirts are always tucked in, and they wear belts. Unfortunately they stick out, but I think it's great they are making as much effort as everyone else. I wouldn't want my church to be any less formal, but I do hope that our members see those with less as being no different.

 

[raekwon]

I've said this in another thread about how we dress for church (amazing how some of these same issues are re-hashed OVER and OVER in certain circles) . . . our clothes need to be clean, the need to fit, they need to be culturally appropriate, and they need to be modest.

(And immodesty is not just a problem with women and girls.)

 

[Tripel]

And immodesty is not just a problem with women and girls.

I'm not disagreeing, but I'm curious what kind of issues you have come across. I can't think of examples in my circles of men being immodest with their dress.

 

[LawrenceU]

If you are a man just make sure you wear pants.
[ame=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ta9LSx8-9Vc]YouTube - Jesus wore pants, not a dress!!! Baptist preaching Bible[/ame]

 

[OPC'n]

Modesty is key. With that said, I believe the rest is cultural. Here in America we have money to buy very nice clothes even if it is at Goodwill, which was donated by a rich person. The point is, one now has a very nice piece of clothing no matter how you got it. Because we do have much money here in America, it has become our culture for everyone to wear nice clothing. In third world countries where most of the persecuted church abides, they do not concentrate on such luxury. They know that it's their heart toward God which matters. It should be the same for us. Wearing nice clothing doesn't make one holy (I don't believe anyone is saying that it does). Paul actually addresses this,

1 Tim 2:8-10 8 "I desire then that in every place the men should pray, lifting holy hands without anger or quarreling; 9likewise also that women should adorn themselves in respectable apparel, with modesty and self-control, not with braided hair and gold or pearls or costly attire, 10 but with what is proper for women who profess godliness—with good works."

Paul teaches here that women are to adorn themselves with good works, which is shown via respectable apparel, modesty, and self-control. During his time, braiding hair was evidently immodest because the woman's hair was her glory or covering during worship. Obviously this is cultural since I've never met anyone who doesn't braid their children's hair. He also speaks to over dressing or dressing with costly clothing. He doesn't say, "Dress up because that honors Christ." Instead he says to be modest or balanced or in actuality not to dress in such a way which draws attention to oneself, which could be in costly attire or in a way that it is obvious you're lazy (not clean, hair not combed etc) that people star at you. Dressing sexually is just plain inappropriate as it makes brothers in Christ stumble and it shows your heart. However, jeans do not always fit into the sexual category. Mine don't except for the ones I've outgrow (yeah, I need a good diet) I find dresses do more often than pants or jeans. BTW, I do dress nicely most of the time by wearing soft wool-like pants during winter and cotton for summer with a nice shirt/blouse. Sometimes I do wear jeans with a nice blouse and heels. Modesty is key though.

 

[MrMerlin777]

One can dress nicely without a tie.

My understanding is that there are even some denominations that would have a problem with someone wearing a tie.

A pastor friend of my was a guest preacher at a church some time ago (not sure why he was there, maybe funeral etc). The church was to some degree Mennonite and was slightly offended by his tie. He removed it before speaking. I'm not sure what the reasoning is behind this groups dislike of ties but there ya go, just an incident that occured.

 

[LadyFlynt]

Modesty is key...but believing a tie and jacket is somehow more God-honouring is equivalent to saying a capedress is more God-honouring. One can dress nicely without a tie or jacket. And as for $33 on a suit for a boy, though a good deal, is still too much for some families that could better us that to make ends meet or spend that extra keeping their growing boys in supply of pants and shoes that fit. There are poor in this country...are you going to dare tell them how they should dress for worship or presume upon their intentions?

 

[bookslover]

If you are a man just make sure you wear pants.
YouTube - Jesus wore pants, not a dress!!! Baptist preaching Bible

That guy's a trip - a bad one. He's been led astray by the obsolete language of the KJV. Apparently, the Jimmy uses "britches" in several places and this guy automatically equates it with what we mean by britches. I'd bet he has 0 knowledge of Hebrew, or he would have looked up the Hebrew behind the obsolete English. Or, failing that, he could at least have found out what the KJV translators meant by "britches" in their own day.

The idea that Jesus wore pants, in the modern sense of pants, is, of course, absurd.

 

[raekwon]

And immodesty is not just a problem with women and girls.

I'm not disagreeing, but I'm curious what kind of issues you have come across. I can't think of examples in my circles of men being immodest with their dress.

Well, we need to understand that "modesty" in dress is more than just "not showing too much skin" (though it certainly does include that). Some of the most immodest "church-wear" I've ever seen also keeps the wearer completely covered (think of the insanely ostentatious hats some women wear and the flashy suits and shoes some men wear in African-American churches).

"Modesty" is a reservedness, an understatedness in the way one dresses, and that also means not dressing in such a way that flaunts wealth or draws too much attention in any way. That's not to say that there's something inherently wrong with dressing in accord with current fashion and/or one's own tastes, but there are modest and immodest ways to do so.

 

[bookslover]

I'm constantly amazed at the way some women will buy some article of clothing just because it's the current fashion and not because it actually looks good on them, enhancing their features. The same is true with makeup. The current fad, I guess, is eye makeup so dark and so heavily applied that it makes the woman look like she has two dark holes in her face where her eyes used to be.

 

[Honor]

If you are a man just make sure you wear pants.
YouTube - Jesus wore pants, not a dress!!! Baptist preaching Bible

that's the guy!!!!!!! I saw a youtube video of him preaching... He hates reformed theology. He's actually the first person I have ever seen that called Reformed Theology a cult.
Sorry my bad that was totally

 

[OPC'n]

Some men can be immodest when their jeans hang low. This isn't done in my church, but I've been to churches where some did this. Tight shirts and jeans is another example for men. Men need to keep their shirts button up. etc

 

[ReformedWretch]

Every time I see this thread title an old Conway Twitty song starts going through my head.

 

[LawrenceU]

Modesty is key...but believing a tie and jacket is somehow more God-honouring is equivalent to saying a capedress is more God-honouring. One can dress nicely without a tie or jacket. And as for $33 on a suit for a boy, though a good deal, is still too much for some families that could better us that to make ends meet or spend that extra keeping their growing boys in supply of pants and shoes that fit. There are poor in this country...are you going to dare tell them how they should dress for worship or presume upon their intentions?

Amen! This idea that a suit and tie are somehow God honoring is ridiculous. And, by the way, I like suits and ties. Real ones not the ill fitting junk they pawn off at ridiculous prices today. When I wear a suit it has a pocket square in the breast pocket, my trousers are held up by braces, often there is a waist coat under it if it is single breasted, and I always wear a proper hat. That is how a suit should be worn.

But, to the point. Show me one place in Scripture that says we are to 'wear our best' to a worship service. I don't even see it implied. Modesty has nothing to do with the 'level' of clothing that one wears. It flows from the heart and results in an appropriate dress that does not call lustful attention to the forefront of the mind of the viewer. I know people who can be very 'modestly dressed' (no shape hugging or revealing too much skin) and yet because of their wicked heart are never modestly dressed. Their very demeanor is immodest.

We have, I believe, created a bar that is actually an affront to God. What would someone say to those men in the church where I was a member in my youth that wore their overalls to church? And, no they were not always their best pair. Sometimes they even came with remnants from the barn yard still on their boots. Some of them had suits and sometimes they wore them some times not. Was one day more acceptable to God than another?

 

[larryjf]

Do we have the authority to regulate how people dress at church outside of what the Bible calls us to?

The Scripture is clear that we ought to dress modestly, but i think we go too far when we try to exact a more disciplined dress code.

 

[Whitefield]

I once overheard some farmers observing that if the preacher was better dressed than they were, then maybe they were paying the preacher too much.

 

[steven-nemes]

If you are a man just make sure you wear pants.
YouTube - Jesus wore pants, not a dress!!! Baptist preaching Bible

That guy sounds totally awesome.

 

[LadyFlynt]

Not only that, but in my neck of the woods, ties are seen as IMMODEST. Thus we have churches here the forbid the wearing of them or the typical suit jacket (with lapels). Another issue...you thought suitcoats were expensive, not try having them turned into a sack jacket!