he beholds
Puritan Board Doctor
Has anyone read this? I just finished it and it is one of the best books I've ever read.
I would love to discuss it if anyone here has read it!
I would love to discuss it if anyone here has read it!
Till We Have Faces, by C.S. Lewis
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Timothy William
Puritan Board Junior
I've tried to read it; I got maybe a third of the way through.
Montanablue
Puritan Board Doctor
I love this book.
C.S. Lewis really understands women...
C.S. Lewis really understands women...
I've read it a couple of times, and we requested it from the library again the other day, but it hasn't arrived yet. It's pretty great - I don't think the observation is quite as keen as in That Hideous Strength, and I think Perelandra scaled some greater heights, but I know of no retelling of a story that is as good. It shows what can be done in the way of expansion with myths and fairy tales - if you have a golden ear and magic fingers.
he beholds
Puritan Board Doctor
The Space Trilogy is next on my summer reading list! We really want to name our coming son Ransom, and my husband says after reading that, I'll be even more sure.
That is one of my husband's all time favorite series of books. I actually have never completely read anything by C.S. Lewis and I expected a Narnia-type read. Narnia was very good (I have listened to a dramatic reading of most of the books) but not incredible. Till We Have Faces was unbelievably delicious. I cannot believe someone can write as well as C.S. Lewis did in that book. It was hardly like reading at all. I'm glad to hear that the trilogy is equal or better in-depth.
Jon Peters
Puritan Board Sophomore
I'd never heard of the book until last night when my wife got home from her book club and said that it was her new book. And then I see this thread today! Weird.
he beholds
Puritan Board Doctor
Is it a Christian book Club? I'm thinking about using it on one of my next turns, but I'm the only Christian in my club. I don't think you have to be a Christian to enjoy it, but I was wondering about her club.
If you have time, you should read it, too. I'm sure she'll have lots to talk about when she's done. My husband could hardly wait until I read it after him.
awretchsavedbygrace
Puritan Board Sophomore
He should of wrote a book about women then.
Montanablue
Puritan Board Doctor
?
What I meant (perhaps I wasn't clear) was that in this particular book, I thought that Lewis really picked out many of the workings of the female mind. I found myself sympathizing immensely with Orual. Many of her thoughts were things that I've found creeping through my brain - and I know that other women with whom I've discussed the book have felt the same way.
he beholds
Puritan Board Doctor
Hahaha! I could not sympathize with her in the least--perhaps it was because of the thoughts that I've shared with her!
Montanablue
Puritan Board Doctor
Okay, well, when I said "sympathize" I didn't mean that I liked her. I could just see, all too well, where she was coming from!
awretchsavedbygrace
Puritan Board Sophomore
No, you were clear. Im just saying, a book about women would of been helpful to me.
Jon Peters
Puritan Board Sophomore
It's a group of all Christian women but most of the books they've read are secular.
I will take your advice and read it. I am in a book club as well so maybe I will recommend it.
Timothy William
Puritan Board Junior
Oddly enough, I've read elsewhere the criticism that Lewis didn't understand women especially well, that he was single for much of his life, and worked in a very male environment, and that his female characters were often not well developed.
Montanablue
Puritan Board Doctor
Really? Interesting. I can't speak for the rest of his writings, but in this book, I think he's spot on.
There is probably no limit to the number of partial or skewed or insane criticisms that have been directed against authors. Take this one as an example: we have some bona fide women who feel that he understands their inner workings well. If some other woman thinks otherwise it could be, 1. that her inner workings are a little different, 2. that she is not very aware of her inner workings, 3. that she doesn't recognize the inner workings he describes because they aren't flattering. None of those would invalidate Lewis' perception.
However, grounding it on his supposed lack of acquaintance with women is absurd. To be sure, his mother died when he was young, the schools he went to did not have women, and he was definitely middle-aged before marriage; but after WWI he took up residence with Mrs. Moore ("D" of the journals, whom in time he came to call his mother) and her daughter Maureen in fulfilment of a promise to his slain comrade Paddy Moore. During WWII they also had some schoolgirls in to live with them who had been evacuated from London. Mrs. Moore was quite a handful, and so was Maureen, plus at least one of their hired female helps was a little mentally unbalanced: Lewis had the ability to observe firsthand, and actively to participate in helping, women when they were not at their best.
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Grillsy
Puritan Board Junior
I am not sure why Lewis is given so much slack on the PB. Considering certain things about his personal life that he was unapologetic about or considering certain theological views.
Fine author, I just think that we could be a little more cautious about our open endorsements.
Fine author, I just think that we could be a little more cautious about our open endorsements.
Grillsy said:
If by "personal life" you are referring to the alleged inappropriate relationship with Mrs. Moore, I have done research on the subject and, to my mind, I have found no evidence that the relationship was anything but appropriate. To say otherwise is to read a Freudian interpretation into what was, in essence, a filial relationship rather than a sexual one.
As for theology, I tend to be forgiving of Lewis largely because theology was not his area of expertise (as he himself admitted). He was more of an expert on Christianity and culture, Christian behavior, and literature. Besides, he's a calvinist now, isn't he?
On topic, Till We Have Faces is, in my opinion, one of Lewis's greatest works, only outranked by That Hideous Strength and The Great Divorce. It's also his only work of fiction published after Joy Gresham's death, making its points about the nature of love and possession (themes througout Lewis's writings) that much more personal.
darn it, "Till we have faces" is one of the few things of Lewis's that I haven't read, so when I saw this thread I thought I might discover a bit about it, -but I can't really tell much from the comments at all! I'll just have to get a copy.
I agree with Grillsy though, that where Lewis is concerned discernment is called for. He's almost always a great read, but still and all he had some pretty un-Biblical ideas
I agree with Grillsy though, that where Lewis is concerned discernment is called for. He's almost always a great read, but still and all he had some pretty un-Biblical ideas
Yes, I think that goes without saying. But it's nice sometimes to find an author you feel you can relax your guard with a bit. Lewis seems to have such credit for bieng a great Christian warrior (which he was) that I think people sometimes do just that, especially maybe if they're sincere believers who just don't happen to be much into critical thinking, or whatever you want to call it. They may think "the great Narnia writer, this MUST be good stuff!" and swallow his stories about purgatory and so forth because they're so well written and gripping. I've known it happen.
The problem is in "relaxing your guard"; that's not what Paul said to do. Of course people ought to exercise realistic self-assessment about how what they read influences them, and avoid harmful influences; but people are also perfectly capable of twisting what they read in support of a previously held agenda, so the fact that someone "got there from here" so to speak, doesn't necessarily mean that "there leads to here".
he beholds
Puritan Board Doctor
I actually openly endorse any number or literary talents, and most of them are, sadly for their sake, not Christians. I think this book was wonderful. I could not have personally written it, because my conscience squirms at even pretending for literature's sake that any other god was God; for instance, I could not have written Narnia, b/c Aslan is not the real Christ. I would have felt conflict at that.
However, I can and do appreciate authors who could use the idea of God or the idea of Christ, and in a fictitious manner, give an allegory. I actually might prefer in a work of fiction a representation that says, "I am Christ," not be used--since our knowledge of Christ is limited to what's revealed in the Bible. Lewis sought out true themes of God, by using a fictitious account of a fictitious god, and I think that was a good way to explore true themes. I would have been much more uncomfortable reading this book had Lewis named Ungit "Yahweh" and Ungit's son, "Christ." For I would consider that to be adding to the Bible (a la Anne Rice).
I probably sound defensive, and I don't mean to♥. I just don't personally have a problem with reading even unChristian authors, so it's hard to feel bad endorsing a work written by a Christian.
Oh, I totally agree--which is why I'm much more guarded when reading Calvin than when I read Lewis. Since I have more in common with Calvin, I'm more likely to fall into Calvin's errors than Lewis's.
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