Tolerance for Error in Evangelicalism: Arminianism and Dispensationalism

[White Robe]

 

[arapahoepark]

...though there is a bit too much "Salvation Onlyism" among them for my liking.

Meaning what exactly? No ecclesiology?

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

Meaning what exactly? No ecclesiology?

Among other things, yes.

I would have thought that the descriptor Salvation Onlyism was fairly self-explanatory.

 

[Schoolman]

In practice, Dispensationalism used to refer to eschatology. But when a leading brand of Dispensationalists moved their eschatology toward Historical Premillennialism, they also moved their theology to NCT. That happened about a decade ago. For years the theological move was mostly in stealth, but lately they have become strident in attacks on the law and covenants and have removed the Old Testament from Christians in effect. It seems some still call themselves Calvinist because they recognize Dort, but some are increasingly attacking Reformed theology because it is structured by the covenants and because it upholds God’s law. This is all new to me, but I see it in a church where I grew up and it is spreading through that church’s seminary rapidly. For them, Dispensationalism has become a codeword for NCT and antinomianism. I recently was surprised when a “Calvinist” Dispensationalist there denounced Calvin angrily because he taught the covenants.

 

[Pilgrim]

Additionally, I hear little out of the Reformed world about Dispensationalism besides a few books here and there (Poythress, Gentry, etc.). Perhaps many feel there are more important battles to fight or that those battles have already been fought. However, real people at the ground level are being affected negatively.

There are reams of material by Reformed men (and Calvinistic men) combating dispensationalism. Perhaps you are simply unfamiliar with some of it. Some of it is older. But Riddlebarger, Waldron, DeMar, and Storms are some off the top of my head that have been published in the last 20 years. Mathison wrote a little book as well. Not many major Dispensational works that have been published in that span either. Most of the popular preachers who teach dispensationalism are in their 70s or 80s. (I suppose that Adrian Rogers and J. Vernon McGee still "teach" it too!)

At least when it comes to publishing, dispensationalism is so unfashionable these days that most dispensational works are either self-published or published by very small publishers. Apparently even Moody has little interest. (They seem to have sort of gone "missional" and now "woke.") Perhaps the one exception is if MacArthur is the author. But some at Master's Seminary, such as Michael Vlach, have had to go with smaller publishers that are largely unknown.

If you have very many people under 40 or even under 50 in your church who are ardent dispensationalists, I'd be surprised unless maybe they came out of independent fundamentalism or something similar. Even among Southern Baptists it is waning. True, that is moreso the case in the pulpit than in the pews, but I've found that many in the pews are open to other understandings or at least won't regard anything but dispensationalism as liberalism as might have been the case 25-30 years ago. Usually the pews will follow the pulpit eventually.

 

[Taylor]

(I suppose that Adrian Rogers and J. Vernon McGee still "teach" it too!)

 

[Pilgrim]

Those are broadcasts that are carried on hundreds of stations. They "still" teach it because McGee died in 1988 and Rogers died in 2005. If the Lord tarries, MacArthur will be teaching long after he has gone as well. The teaching will not disappear. But even some charismatics are moving away from pre-trib.

 

[Taylor]

Those are broadcasts that are carried on hundreds of stations. They "still" teach it because McGee died in 1988 and Rogers died in 2005. If the Lord tarries, MacArthur will be teaching long after he has gone as well. The teaching will not disappear. But even some charismatics are moving away from pre-trib.

Ah, I understand. I don't know why I didn't catch the quotes.

 

[deuteronomist]

I've really grown frustrated, other than the mess going on right now in the visible church. since the latter half of last year, I started really noticing that Arminians are much more likely to be inconsistent in their thinking. I read a paper which surveyed reformed and non-reformed Baptists in Appalachia and the author found that reformed Baptists were much more likely to value hard work and be less sympathetic to government intervention than free will or other varieties of Baptist. It's very noticeable even without direct data points though.

 

[Jerusalem Blade]

This is why the integrity of our local church is so significant. We do not have control over the doings of other churches. If we are part of a denomination that is going off from the top down, that can be a problem, despite our being in a "local church".

I am taking my time – researching, prayerfully – seeking a sound church, even if that means re-locating to another state (moving to Cyprus to help in a church I planted may be out of the picture for us).

 

[Ed Walsh]

I would love to correct those in error, but experience shows that the majority are not willing to listen.

Greetings this Lord's Day morn,

This was God's experience too in the years prior to the Babylonian Captivity.
And people wonder why I am so sure that God is in the progress of judging our nation--perhaps the whole world
(For the few that may be interested, do a search of the PB for the word 'judgment' by user Ed Walsh)

It is the visible Church that God always comes for first.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Jeremiah 5:1–31 (ESV)

Jerusalem Refused to Repent
5 Run to and fro through the streets of Jerusalem,
look and take note!
Search her squares to see
if you can find a man,
one who does justice
and seeks truth,
that I may pardon her.
2 Though they say, “As the LORD lives,”
yet they swear falsely.
3 O LORD, do not your eyes look for truth?
You have struck them down,
but they felt no anguish;
you have consumed them,
but they refused to take correction.
They have made their faces harder than rock;
they have refused to repent.

4 Then I said, “These are only the poor;
they have no sense;
for they do not know the way of the LORD,
the justice of their God.
5 I will go to the great
and will speak to them,
for they know the way of the LORD,
the justice of their God.”
But they all alike had broken the yoke;
they had burst the bonds.

6 Therefore a lion from the forest shall strike them down;
a wolf from the desert shall devastate them.
A leopard is watching their cities;
everyone who goes out of them shall be torn in pieces,
because their transgressions are many,
their apostasies are great.

7 “How can I pardon you?
Your children have forsaken me
and have sworn by those who are no gods.
When I fed them to the full,
they committed adultery
and trooped to the houses of whores.
8 They were well-fed, lusty stallions,
each neighing for his neighbor’s wife.
9 Shall I not punish them for these things?
declares the LORD;
and shall I not avenge myself
on a nation such as this?

10 “Go up through her vine rows and destroy,
but make not a full end;
strip away her branches,
for they are not the LORD’s.
11 For the house of Israel and the house of Judah
have been utterly treacherous to me,
declares the LORD.
12 They have spoken falsely of the LORD
and have said, ‘He will do nothing;
no disaster will come upon us,
nor shall we see sword or famine.
13 The prophets will become wind;
the word is not in them.
Thus shall it be done to them!’ ”

The LORD Proclaims Judgment
14 Therefore thus says the LORD, the God of hosts:
“Because you have spoken this word,
behold, I am making my words in your mouth a fire,
and this people wood, and the fire shall consume them.
15 Behold, I am bringing against you
a nation from afar, O house of Israel,
declares the LORD.
It is an enduring nation;
it is an ancient nation,
a nation whose language you do not know,
nor can you understand what they say.
16 Their quiver is like an open tomb;
they are all mighty warriors.
17 They shall eat up your harvest and your food;
they shall eat up your sons and your daughters;
they shall eat up your flocks and your herds;
they shall eat up your vines and your fig trees;
your fortified cities in which you trust
they shall beat down with the sword.”

18 “But even in those days, declares the LORD, I will not make a full end of you. 19 And when your people say, ‘Why has the LORD our God done all these things to us?’ you shall say to them, ‘As you have forsaken me and served foreign gods in your land, so you shall serve foreigners in a land that is not yours.’ ”

20 Declare this in the house of Jacob;
proclaim it in Judah:
21 “Hear this, O foolish and senseless people,
who have eyes, but see not,
who have ears, but hear not.
22 Do you not fear me? declares the LORD.
Do you not tremble before me?
I placed the sand as the boundary for the sea,
a perpetual barrier that it cannot pass;
though the waves toss, they cannot prevail;
though they roar, they cannot pass over it.
23 But this people has a stubborn and rebellious heart;
they have turned aside and gone away.
24 They do not say in their hearts,
‘Let us fear the LORD our God,
who gives the rain in its season,
the autumn rain and the spring rain,
and keeps for us
the weeks appointed for the harvest.’
25 Your iniquities have turned these away,
and your sins have kept good from you.
26 For wicked men are found among my people;
they lurk like fowlers lying in wait.
They set a trap;
they catch men.
27 Like a cage full of birds,
their houses are full of deceit;
therefore they have become great and rich;
28 they have grown fat and sleek.
They know no bounds in deeds of evil;
they judge not with justice
the cause of the fatherless, to make it prosper,
and they do not defend the rights of the needy.
29 Shall I not punish them for these things?
declares the LORD,
and shall I not avenge myself
on a nation such as this?”

30 An appalling and horrible thing
has happened in the land:
31 the prophets prophesy falsely,
and the priests rule at their direction;
my people love to have it so,
but what will you do when the end comes?