Does assurance rest on looking inward to sanctification or outward to imputation

[MW]

In the context of Nicholas' quote, do you think you're talking about the same kind of "looking in"?

I believe we are referring to the same introspection.

The statement by Bishop Beveridge is phenomenally biblical. The conclusion of Nicholas doesn't follow. Sinners undoubtedly have no righteousness of their own which can bear the scrutiny of the perfect law of God. It is certainly the case that the imputation of the righteousness of Christ is the only hope of sinners to find acceptance in the sight of God. But it is equally true that the righteousness of Christ is imputed to those that believe, and those only believe who have been regenerated by the Spirit of God. Where there are no marks of regeneration there is no reason to conclude that faith is genuine, and therefore no basis for claiming a saving interest in the finished work of Christ.

It's lamentable to see modern Christians suffering from psychological fracture. They try to produce religious experiences which bypass the heart with the result that they never feel true joy and peace in believing. Biblical doctrine needs to be presented in accord with the biblical view of man. The Bible does not speak of certain facts with which we must brainwash ourselves into the persuasion that all is well with us. The Bible speaks to the heart as the centre of man's religious and moral life, and by a complex balance of instruction, promise, and warning, it converts the soul through the gracious influence of the Spirit of truth.

Justification without regeneration would be a legal fiction -- which is a blatant contradiction to the epistemic claim of Scripture that the *truth* sets men free. Blessings!

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Well said. I believe I said the same thing. Would you take any issue with my presentation of the same?

 

[Amazing Grace]

In light of the above, looking in, can only bring sorrow the vast majority of the time.

Colossians 1:27 teaches otherwise. The effect of looking in depends entirely on what is being examined.

27 To them God chose to make known how great among the Gentiles are the riches of the glory of this mystery, which is Christ in you, the hope of glory.

I am feebily attempting to figure out how this verse has anything to do with the "EXCELLENT BIBLICAL'' post by Bishop Beveridge and also what it has to do with assurance.

So I stand by the quote as reflecting the true character of a believer in Christ. And also notice how I said 'vast majority' not 100% of the time.

 

[Amazing Grace]

In the context of Nicholas' quote, do you think you're talking about the same kind of "looking in"?

I believe we are referring to the same introspection.

The statement by Bishop Beveridge is phenomenally biblical. The conclusion of Nicholas doesn't follow. Sinners undoubtedly have no righteousness of their own which can bear the scrutiny of the perfect law of God. It is certainly the case that the imputation of the righteousness of Christ is the only hope of sinners to find acceptance in the sight of God. But it is equally true that the righteousness of Christ is imputed to those that believe, and those only believe who have been regenerated by the Spirit of God. Where there are no marks of regeneration there is no reason to conclude that faith is genuine, and therefore no basis for claiming a saving interest in the finished work of Christ.

It's lamentable to see modern Christians suffering from psychological fracture. They try to produce religious experiences which bypass the heart with the result that they never feel true joy and peace in believing. Biblical doctrine needs to be presented in accord with the biblical view of man. The Bible does not speak of certain facts with which we must brainwash ourselves into the persuasion that all is well with us. The Bible speaks to the heart as the centre of man's religious and moral life, and by a complex balance of instruction, promise, and warning, it converts the soul through the gracious influence of the Spirit of truth.

Justification without regeneration would be a legal fiction -- which is a blatant contradiction to the epistemic claim of Scripture that the *truth* sets men free. Blessings!

Well since there is a great chance that I am not clear, and only spoke a few words, my conclusion does follow. I also concur that there is a noticeable change in character, yet we must always becareful not to co mingle justification with sanctification. I assumed the threrad was asking if ones assurance of Jutification, rests on looking inward to ones own sanctification. The works and deeds one has done. And that is how my answer is deemed. Assurance is an essence of saving faith. Period. when it is all boiled down. Hebrews 10: 22let us draw near with a sincere heart in (AO)full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled clean from an evil conscience and our bodies washed with pure water.

23Let us hold fast the confession of our hope without wavering, for He who promised is faithful;

“These things have I written unto you that believe on the name of the Son of God; that ye may know that you have eternal life” (I John 5:13).


“My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me: and I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand. My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father’s hand” (John 10:27-29)


For salvation; assurance of eternal life is always based upon the finished work of Jesus Christ on our behalf. So when I see 'looking in' I automatically, and perhaps wrongly assume that looking at our self worth and deeds as a barometer of our standing with God. Therefore blending sanctification with Justification. Not only can I not look to my faith, for it is so weak at times that there is no assurance there, how can I look to my sanctification when I sin continuously, perhaps not manifested in a such a grave way, yet sin none the less. I must only have hope in the faithfulness for assurance in Christ alone, by His mercy and free grace. “Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ, and thou shalt be saved;” Even if I cannot see any evidence of faith at times, I can be certainly assured of salvation because of the promises of God's Word, that He sees it. Just as the hebrews put the blood on the outside of the door post and could not see it themselves, the Lord saw it and the angel of death passed over it.

Also, Beveridges statement should not be carried and understood that a true believer must always be gloomy and long faced and a hater of himself. For the grace of God brings a new creation. One will love what they once hated and hate what they once loved. Yet it will be more noticeable to others than ourselves.

Spurgeon says it well:

I have one more class of objectors to answer and I am finished. There is a certain breed of Calvinist, whom I do not envy, who are always jeering and sneering as much as ever they can at the full assurance of faith. I have seen their long faces; I have heard their whining periods, and read their dismal sentences, in which they say something to the effect - "Groan in the Lord always, and again I say, groan! He that mourneth and weepeth, he that doubted and feareth, he that distrusteth and dishonoureth his God, shall be saved." That seems to be the sum and substance of their very ungospel-like gospel. But why is it they do this? I speak now honestly and fearlessly. It is because there is a pride within them - a conceit which is fed on rottenness, and sucks marrow and fatness out of putrid carcasses. And what, say you, is the object of their pride? Why, the pride of being able to boast of a deep experience - the pride of being a blacker, grosser, and more detestable sinner than other people. "Whose glory is in their shame," may well apply to them. A more dangerous, because a more deceitful pride than this is not to be found. It has all the elements of self-righteousness in it."

From "Full Assurance" by C. H. Spurgeon, Metropolitan Tabernacle Pulpit, 1861, p. 292.

This is what morbid introspection/examination brings. And a lamentable practice in certain puritan circles.

 

[moral necessity]

Where there are no marks of regeneration there is no reason to conclude that faith is genuine, and therefore no basis for claiming a saving interest in the finished work of Christ.

Without seeming like I disagree with you, Matthew, for I highly respect your opinions in the posts you write and often agree with them, I would like to say that, faith, in itself, is a mark of regeneration, as it is a fruit of regeneration. And, regeneration will lead to additional fruit as well. I'm sure you'd agree with that.

Luther said something to the effect of, "they who have faith will be sanctified, but you may never see it." The visible fruits of sanctification are what Luther is referring to. The inward cleansing from our sin, and renewing of our faculties, which is the core of sanctification, may take quite a long time to become visible fruits that the general person may view. The example that James gives with regard to Abraham is with a fruit that occurred 15 years later. During that time, Abraham was a liar and one who distrusted in the sovereignty of God. Also, our perception of what ought to be there during sanctification often leads us to get "tunnel vision" so to say, to where we look for certain things, and, when they aren't there, we make the wrong evaluation.

When I examine myself, and look inward for the Christ within me, I don't discredit the presence of faith abiding there, that miraculous faith that is only God-given, that has caused me to abandon all other hopes and all other righteousnesses for the righteousness of Christ being my substitute. When I abandon that as my foundation for assurance, and begin founding it upon the other fruits of sanctification, which may or may not be able to always be perceived, for they are often inward workings that have not yet led to clear, observable, mature fruit, I find myself more prone to the downward spirals of spiritual assaults upon my conscience. Being the perfectionist that I am, and one who examines to the nth degree with this kind of looking, I need a rock of assurance, and not the shifting sand, underneath of my conscience. And, the rock is the promise of God, that, coming to him, he won't cast me out, and that he who began a good work will complete it.

Let me know what you think, as I grant that I see through a glass darkly also.

 

[MW]

Well said. I believe I said the same thing. Would you take any issue with my presentation of the same?

Not at all. I appreciated your emphasis on "honesty." But it is often the case that discussions of practical subjects tend to take for granted the theological framework which undergirds them; so I tried to help by clarifying the theological framework, and also added what I feel should be a major concern in pastoral practice today -- addressing of the heart as a remedy for the fractured psyche of post-postmodern man. Blessings!

 

[Semper Fidelis]

Nicholas,

It wasn't the quote that caused a problem but this commentary upon it.

In light of the above, looking in, can only bring sorrow the vast majority of the time.

If we look in and see Christ in us then looking in should not bring sorrow "...the vast majority of the time...." There is absolutely nothing "morbidly introspective" about the Spirit testifying with our spirit that we are sons of God.

I think it is apparently obvious to the casual observer that the WCF decries any assurance on the basis of our works and highlights the truth that we are unprofitable servants and always resting upon the cross of Christ.

We must, however, reconcile with the Scriptures that tell us to ensure that we are truly laying hold of Christ and the fruits of regeneration that proceed from it. James truly is an Epistle of Straw if introspection only leads to morbid obsession.

 

[MW]

Without seeming like I disagree with you, Matthew, for I highly respect your opinions in the posts you write and often agree with them, I would like to say that, faith, in itself, is a mark of regeneration, as it is a fruit of regeneration. And, regeneration will lead to additional fruit as well. I'm sure you'd agree with that.

There is just one point which is worthy of consideration. I would be wary of speaking about additional fruit as something which comes later. The God-given faith by which we receive and rest upon Christ and His righteousness is also the means whereby the heart is purified. Hence justification and sanctification are inseparable. While it is true that the graces of the Spirit develop in us over time, it is also a fact that the seed of those graces are planted in us when we are regenerated. So 2 Peter 1:3, "According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue." On that basis, as the passage proceeds, we are exhorted to add to our faith and to make our calling and election sure. Blessings!

 

[moral necessity]

Excellent point! Seeds are present at regeneration, which then sprout/develop/mature into fruit, and then into ripe fruit. The time factor varies with different people, as well as the degree, according to the sovereign plan of the Gardener. Thanks for sharpening! Blessings as well!

 

[Iconoclast]

Thoughts?

In 2Pet1 I heard a pastor open up this section of scripture in a message entitled "Get Assurance". The main point of the sermon was along the lines of all these scriptural marks of assurance should be in the believer, and growing as we mature. They will produce fruit in the life as God works in us to will and to do of His good pleasure.
The things mentioned here by Peter [ in vs.5-7 ]come in one on top of another ,like different parts of a choir each being added in to make a smooth sound. These graces manifest in the life lead to an assurance of faith.
Self examination looking for these traits can be helpful.

2 Peter 1
1Simon Peter, a servant and an apostle of Jesus Christ, to them that have obtained like precious faith with us through the righteousness of God and our Saviour Jesus Christ:

2Grace and peace be multiplied unto you through the knowledge of God, and of Jesus our Lord,

3According as his divine power hath given unto us all things that pertain unto life and godliness, through the knowledge of him that hath called us to glory and virtue:

4Whereby are given unto us exceeding great and precious promises: that by these ye might be partakers of the divine nature, having escaped the corruption that is in the world through lust.

5And beside this, giving all diligence, add to your faith virtue; and to virtue knowledge;

6And to knowledge temperance; and to temperance patience; and to patience godliness;

7And to godliness brotherly kindness; and to brotherly kindness charity.

8For if these things be in you, and abound, they make you that ye shall neither be barren nor unfruitful in the knowledge of our Lord Jesus Christ.

9But he that lacketh these things is blind, and cannot see afar off, and hath forgotten that he was purged from his old sins.

10Wherefore the rather, brethren, give diligence to make your calling and election sure: for if ye do these things, ye shall never fall:

 

[Amazing Grace]

Nicholas,

It wasn't the quote that caused a problem but this commentary upon it.

In light of the above, looking in, can only bring sorrow the vast majority of the time.

If we look in and see Christ in us then looking in should not bring sorrow "...the vast majority of the time...." There is absolutely nothing "morbidly introspective" about the Spirit testifying with our spirit that we are sons of God.

I think it is apparently obvious to the casual observer that the WCF decries any assurance on the basis of our works and highlights the truth that we are unprofitable servants and always resting upon the cross of Christ.

We must, however, reconcile with the Scriptures that tell us to ensure that we are truly laying hold of Christ and the fruits of regeneration that proceed from it. James truly is an Epistle of Straw if introspection only leads to morbid obsession.

Brother Rich: I agree that looking in or out to Christ is the ONLY remedy for sorow. And this is where Joy resides, not in anything I do. Only by the grace of God is the relief of sorrow found, nothing else.