The Journey to Atheism - My Take

[panta dokimazete]

I posted this list on another BB (II) and would like to recruit assistance in refining this:

1. Accept the idea that I can substantially understand or judge the verity of all things.
2. Accept the idea current accumulated evidentiary experience and knowledge are the best true measure of all things.
3. Accept the idea that the atheistic interpretation of natural circumstantial evidence is interpreted correctly.
4. Accept the idea that I am open to the idea I can be dissuaded through doubt.
5. Reject Doctrine
6. Reject Scripture
7. Reject Christ
8. Reject Faith
9. Reject God

Recommendations/additions?

[Edited on 2-8-2005 by jdlongmire]

 

[panta dokimazete]

hm, stunned silence?

[Edited on 2-9-2005 by jdlongmire]

 

[Ben Gliddon]

That seems to be a good evaluation of the things that go on, but I'm not sure if there is a set logical or chronological order to these things. As Van Til put it, every man interprets the universe in terms of his own ultimacy, despite that God is ultimate. The sinner says he can know everything comprehensively in order to interpret it in terms of his own ultimacy, and he thus says that he cannot know anything about God and can keep "discovering" the mysteries of the universe by scientific method. I know from my unbelief, before God made his mercy known on me, and even now in my fleshly impulses, that this is what the sinner does. He makes himself the ultimate determiner of all things. Would there be a being with greater authority in anything, we would not be able to comprehend it. We are haters of God in Adam before conversion and in our flesh after conversion. I know when I most doubt God's faithfulness or any of his attributes, it is because I am deceiving myself and subsequently trusting myself to decide the reality of all things. Of all the things in the list you provided, they are all the specific sins of the man in Adam. "Who is this that darkens counsel by words without knowledge? ...I will question you, and you will make it known to me..." (Job 38), "Who are you, O man, to answer back to God?" (Romans 9), "The fool says in his heart, 'there is no God.'"

 

[panta dokimazete]

Thank you!

I created the original post as a response to a Christian's proclamation that they were now Atheistic.

I probably should have titled it:

The "Christian" Journey to Atheism

and I think the ultimate destination of the list is to tie in Scriptural rebuttals or similar statements, so thank you for starting it...

[Edited on 2-9-2005 by jdlongmire]

 

[Ben Gliddon]

What I mean by "Would there be a being with greater authority in anything, we would not be able to comprehend it" is that the natural man cannot and will not acknowledge it, despite that he knows it in his inner being. As Van Til has also said, man's self consciousness presupposes the God of the Bible. Nothing is intelligible apart from Christ "upholding the universe by the word of his power." (Hebrews 1:3b) The man in Adam "suppresses the truth in unrighteousness, for what can be known about God is plain to [him], because God has shown it to [him]. For His invisible attributes, namely, his eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly perceived, ever since the creation of the world, in the things that have been made." (Romans 1)

[Edited on 2-9-2005 by Ben Gliddon]

 

[Average Joey]

Originally posted by jdlongmire

1. Accept the idea that I can substantially understand or judge the verity of all things.


[Edited on 2-8-2005 by jdlongmire]

I think the first and main reason somebody would not believe in God is because of their own personal sin that they are proud of.Most likely it would be sexual.

 

[panta dokimazete]

VERY good point...

 

[WrittenFromUtopia]

Originally posted by Paul manata
the problem with all of this is that there are no such things as atheists. Everybody believes in God.

 

[a mere housewife]

Question-- I was wondering lately, and this has to do with point number one:
how can a materialist believe he has the ability to judge all things? If he has that ability, then isn't there something for him with which to judge the material, which has to be non-material-- and even more fundamental than the material? If he judges survival to be the ultimate -- I don't know, whatever it is, fact or process: if he judges survival to be the thing by which all else is judged, then isn't there something for him more fundamental than survival, by which he judges survival to be the most fundamental? How can you possibly be a materialist?

I know-- you can't, really. But people manage to think they are, anyway.

 

[Ben Gliddon]

Paul, you're right. "For althought they knew God, they did not honor him as God or give thanks to him, but they became futile in their thinking, and their foolish hearts were darkened. Claiming to be wise, they became fools, and exchanged the glory of the immortal God for images resembling mortal man and birds and animals and reptiles... And since they did not see fit to acknowledge God, God gave them up to a debased mind to do what ought not to be done. They were filled with all manner of unrighteousness..." "The fool says in his heart 'there is no God'"

Heidi, to your question "How can a materialist believe he has the ability to judge all things?" "All have turned aside, together they have become worthless... There is no fear of God before their eyes." There's not an excuse, or even a good reason to hate God "Every mouth [will] be stopped, and the whole world [will] be held accountable to God."

[Edited on 2-11-2005 by Ben Gliddon]