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Why do it differently than Christ did?Intinction is the practice during the Lord's Supper, where in the partaking of the elements, one takes the bread and dips it into the cup filled with wine and then sticks the bread (after dipping) in their mouth consuming it (that is the informal description so you understand all the actions).
Seems like a minor detail to worry about.
Sorry. Just seems like theological nitpicking to worry about whether or not the elements happen to contact each other prior to entering the mouth.Perhaps minor if we don't care about what Christ told us to do, or Paul's view of what Christ told us to do.
Sorry. Just seems like theological nitpicking to worry about whether or not the elements happen to contact each other prior to entering the mouth.Perhaps minor if we don't care about what Christ told us to do, or Paul's view of what Christ told us to do.
Sorry. Just seems like theological nitpicking to worry about whether or not the elements happen to contact each other prior to entering the mouth.
.Presbyterian Church in America
DIRECTORY FOR WORSHIP 58-1
CHAPTER 58
The Administration of the Lord's Supper
58-1. The Communion, or Supper of the Lord, is to be observed
frequently; the stated times to be determined by the Session of each
congregation, as it may judge most for edification.
58-2. The ignorant and scandalous are not to be admitted to the Lord's
Supper.
58-3. It is proper that public notice should be given to the congregation, at
least the Sabbath before the administration of this ordinance, and that, either
then, or on some day of the week, the people be instructed in its nature, and a
due preparation for it, that all may come in a suitable manner to this holy
feast.
58-4. On the day of the observance of the Lord's Supper, when the sermon
is ended, the minister shall show:
a. That this is an ordinance of Christ; by reading the words of
institution, either from one of the Evangelists, or from 1 Corinthians
11, which, as to him may appear expedient, he may
explain and apply;
b. That it is to be observed in remembrance of Christ, to show forth
His death till He come; that it is of inestimable benefit, to
strengthen His people against sin; to support them under
troubles; to encourage and quicken them in duty; to inspire them
with love and zeal; to increase their faith, and holy resolution;
and to beget peace of conscience, and comfortable hopes of
eternal life.
Since, by our Lord's appointment, this Sacrament sets forth the
Communion of Saints, the minister, at the discretion of the Session, before
the observance begins, may either invite all those who profess the true
religion, and are communicants in good standing in any evangelical church,
to participate in the ordinance; or may invite those who have been approved
by the Session, after having given indication of their desire to participate. It
is proper also to give a special invitation to non-communicants to remain
during the service.
58-5. The table, on which the elements are placed, being decently covered,
and furnished with bread and wine, and the communicants orderly and
gravely sitting around it (or in their seats before it), the elders in a convenient
place together, the minister should then set the elements apart by prayer and
thanksgiving.
The bread and wine being thus set apart by prayer and thanksgiving,
the minister is to take the bread, and break it, in the view of the people,
saying:
That the Lord Jesus Christ on the same night in which
He was betrayed took bread; and when He had given thanks, He
broke it, gave it to His disciples, as I, ministering in His name,
give this bread to you, and said, "Take, eat; this is My body
which is for you; do this in remembrance of Me." (Some other
biblical account of the institution of this part of the Supper may be
substituted here.)
Here the bread is to be distributed. After having given the bread, he
shall take the cup, and say:
In the same manner, He also took the cup, and having
given thanks as has been done in His name, He gave it to the
disciples, saving, "This cup is the new covenant in My blood,
which is shed for many for the remission of sins. Drink from it,
all of you."
While the minister is repeating these words, let him give the cup.
58-6. Since believers are to act personally in all their covenanting with the
Lord, it is proper that a part of the time occupied in the distribution of the
elements should be spent by all in silent communion, thanksgiving,
intercession and prayer.
58-7. The minister may, in a few words, put the communicants in mind:
Of the grace of God, in Jesus Christ, held forth in this
sacrament; and of their obligation to be the Lord's; and may
exhort them to walk worthy of the vocation wherewith they are
called; and, as they have professedly received Christ Jesus the
Lord, that they be careful so to walk in him, and to maintain
good works.
It may not be improper for the minister to give a word of exhortation
also to those who have been only spectators, reminding them:
Of their duty, stating their sin and danger, by living in
disobedience to Christ, in neglecting this holy ordinance; and
calling upon them to be earnest in making preparation for
attending upon it at the next time of its celebration.
Then the minister is to pray and give thanks to God,
For His rich mercy, and invaluable goodness, vouchsafed
to them in that Sacred Communion; to implore pardon for the
defects of the whole service; and to pray for the acceptance of
their persons and performances; for the gracious assistance of
the Holy Spirit to enable them, as they have received Christ
Jesus the Lord, so to walk in Him; that they may hold fast that
which they have received, that no man take their crown; that
their conversation may be as becomes the Gospel; that they may
bear about with them, continually, the dying of the Lord Jesus,
that the life also of Jesus may be manifested in their mortal
body; that their light may so shine before men, that others,
seeing their good works, may glorify their Father who is in
heaven.
An offering for the poor or other sacred purpose is appropriate in
connection with this service, and may be made at such time as shall be
ordered by the Session.
Now let a psalm or hymn be sung, and the congregation dismissed,
with the following or some other Gospel benediction:
Now the God of peace, that brought again from the dead
our Lord Jesus, that great Shepherd of the sheep, through the
blood of the everlasting covenant, make you perfect in every
good work to do His will, working in you that which is well
pleasing in His sight, through Jesus Christ; to whom be glory for
ever and ever. Amen.
58-8. As past custom has been found in many parts of the Presbyterian
Church, our congregations are urged to have a service of spiritual preparation
for the Lord’s Supper during the week previous to the celebration of the
Sacrament.
I have heard some of the guys that came in with the J&R cite the practice as being part of the "culture"
Unfortunately, I'm somewhat of a germaphobe. So, on that basis alone, I would not take part in this practice. (Although, I did do it once when visiting a church, because I didn't know what I was about to do.)
It is a very unsanitary practice. I don't know why anyone would agree to something like this.
(I would disagree with it on a biblical basis as well, but others have done a good job already in that regard.)
Wayne,
I am speaking only from the perspective of a member of a presbytery that is made up of a few former RP, BP,and RPC-ES congregations.
My comment was only meant to point out to those in the "Southern Synod" of the PCA that we have in our church those that practiced Intinction prior the joining and receiving and that the practice was not considered by either side to be an issue that required a change of practice. Neither has it been an issue until very recently.
I have done no research as to its prevalence. however I have been told that in some churches did practice it, and that as one retired TE said "we did know that anyone thought it was a big deal".
Not necessarily defending intinction, but why are certain other practices of communion in Reformed churches not also seen as being out of accord with Scripture? For instance, using grape juice instead of wine, using multiple cups instead of one, or using precut little cracker-like bread bites, rather than one large pieces that is broken. I could see where possibly using grape juice could perhaps be defended, but there was a picture of unity given when Christ gave one cup, and broke pieces from one loaf of bread. How is it that these practices are not out of accord and intinction is?
Not necessarily defending intinction, but why are certain other practices of communion in Reformed churches not also seen as being out of accord with Scripture? For instance, using grape juice instead of wine, using multiple cups instead of one, or using precut little cracker-like bread bites, rather than one large pieces that is broken. I could see where possibly using grape juice could perhaps be defended, but there was a picture of unity given when Christ gave one cup, and broke pieces from one loaf of bread. How is it that these practices are not out of accord and intinction is?
I support using wine, drinking from a common cup, and breaking from a common loaf of bread (although of these practices, I think wine is the only thing strictly required). I think Rae was right to bring this up in the minority report, and Andrew, in his article, was only partially right in saying it was a distraction. Yes, it is not the issue at hand, but it seems that Andrew's position would cut against practices that are widespread in the PCA.
Ruben, my purpose in even mentioning it was that I have heard (here and elsewhere) PCA members say "I never heard of it in my church/presbytery, it must have just started".
*Also, in any of these things if Jesus is commanding us to do something, then germs (or the possibility of 'catching' germs) can't stop us from obeying. The question would then be "Do I obey God or man (my own germiphobia which has been heightened in the last 20 years because of other germiphobes which has killed my immune system so I'd rather think upon gross things and what diseases I could contract than the great blessing of obeying the Lord in all things)?"*
* = stepping on/off soapbox
Rev. Andrew Barnes,
Did Mr. Whitlock give any examples of "Intinction" from Reformed Churches during the 16th and 17th century?
"In a study by the Dutch scholar, W.F. Dankbaar, "Communion Practices in the Century of the Reformation" (Communiegebruiken in de eeuw der Reformatie), Dankbaar does “a precise and detailed study of how each congregation and refugee congregation celebrated the Lord's Supper, which indicates that not one of these congregations that he studied practiced intinction.”"
"By the time of the Protestant Reformation, when communion under both kinds was reinstituted, the command to have both bread and wine was a gift to the communicants. The idea that some may have preferred to intinct, having been recently admitted to freely, by faith, feed on Christ, and passed the privilege to drink, seems highly unlikely. They had been withheld the privilege of drinking from the cup of the Lord, but communicants could now freely feed upon Christ completely. Thus the practice of intinction was not generally practiced in the Reformed churches."
Quote Originally Posted by Pilgrim72 View Post
Unfortunately, I'm somewhat of a germaphobe. So, on that basis alone, I would not take part in this practice. (Although, I did do it once when visiting a church, because I didn't know what I was about to do.)
It is a very unsanitary practice. I don't know why anyone would agree to something like this.
(I would disagree with it on a biblical basis as well, but others have done a good job already in that regard.)
So you would disagree with a common cup, too?
Ruben, my purpose in even mentioning it was that I have heard (here and elsewhere) PCA members say "I never heard of it in my church/presbytery, it must have just started".
Of course, Kevin: my point was merely that your evidence on the matter hardly showed that the PCA consciously decided to receive known intinctionists and refused to speak against them.
Right.
Had I wanted to make that point I would have referred to the practice of our church celebrating the Lord's Supper at General Assembly.
Ruben, my purpose in even mentioning it was that I have heard (here and elsewhere) PCA members say "I never heard of it in my church/presbytery, it must have just started".
Of course, Kevin: my point was merely that your evidence on the matter hardly showed that the PCA consciously decided to receive known intinctionists and refused to speak against them.
Right.
Had I wanted to make that point I would have referred to the practice of our church celebrating the Lord's Supper at General Assembly.
Oh yeah. I would definitely not drink from a common cup. I don't even like the common loaf of bread... with everyone grabbing, pinching and manhandling it. I prefer it to be precut by someone unknown and unseen. What I don't know can't hurt me...