Wow! Thank you for all your detailed responses. This is one of the biggest areas I'm struggling with and I have about 7+ people (plus all the rest of the Christians I meet in life) I will be teaching this to, so it is really important for me to get this down. Thanks for the book recommendation The Gospel Mystery of Sanctification and link, Jon.
Zach: We should always look back to the Cross of Christ with thanksgiving and gratitude
Thanks for your reply, Zach. Ok, so I read about the gospel and the cross and am grateful but certainly not at all THAT grateful as I should be (Of course, a big part of me can't grasp the depth of what He gave me). If gratitude is part of the correct motivation for living the life, how do I get more gratitude? A pastor told me to watch "The Passion" movie to conjure up more feels of gratefulness but this seems fake or like some sort of legalism to me? Is it? Is it impossible for me to work to produce any gratitude? Is this one of those cases where I must seek a passion for God and to fall in love with God more and while I take my eye off of myself and put it on God, that He will produce that gratitude inside of me?
Zach: the more of the love of Christ we comprehend the further we will be sanctified as we are filled with the fullness of God. … look forward in recognizing that the vigor, power, and comfort of our Spiritual life depends on our sanctification. As we know the love of Christ we will desire a vigorous, powerful, and comfortable spiritual life as part of our glorifying and enjoying of God forever and in knowing that sin threatens to make our worship of God weak we will seek to mortify sin in our flesh in complete reliance upon God's grace.
So are we then to become goal-oriented like “I want a good spiritual life, so I need to be sanctified. So I will obey in order to become more Christ-like.”
Jack K: My own writing is often seen to be in the same camp with Horton and Fitzpatrick, so I'll attempt to explain.
Great! I feel like they are on to some sort of truth that I'm missing and I am eager to know deeply what it is.
unless you have a strong love for the 400-year-old English of the Puritan period, I'm going to recommend that for ease of understanding you get Bruce McRae's modern English version of that book
Thank you! I love the old dead guys but yes, 400 pages would be quite difficult to get through. Thanks for the easier book.
the notion that a true zeal for holiness must be fueled by the assurance that God is on our side and loves us. And they're absolutely right about that. There's little power to love unless you know you are loved. And self-effort is not the path to holiness.
Okay, yes!!!!!! This is exactly what I hear them saying and it sounds true but I don't quite get it. So someone tells me that I need to realize I am loved by God in order to love others. So... how do I realize? I read the gospel and I'm grateful. But not ALL THAT grateful. So I lose patience and yell at my mom. I feel bad, tell God sorry and tell mom sorry. But how does my knowing God loves me REALLY ACTUALLY fuel my love towards my Mom where I can be patient with her and not even have that yucky desire to yell at her? How does this work in the real world? So how can I become fueled in the right way by the Holy Spirit and NOT by self-effort? Because "trying harder to be nice to mom" looks like self-effort. And trying to "hold my patience" looks like a lot of self-effort. But then Owen tells us to mortify the flesh and since sanctification is synergistic, I know part of my sanctification is by.... gasp... self-effort. But then I'm so afraid of performing works of self-effort and thinking they might be "legalistic" (whatever that means).
Jack K: Where Walter Marshall's book will take you beyond what I've read from Horton and Fitzpatrick is in how to nurture this in your daily life. It's not just looking back to the cross and feeling appreciative. It's not even just seeing the beauty of Jesus and the cross more and more fully and feeling more and more appreciative.
Hmmm... thanks for writing this. This is exactly what I'm hearing. I hear this teaching from Horton and Fitzpatrick but I read little about HOW it is APPLIED in daily life. I keep hearing to look back at the cross, see the beauty of Jesus, be gospel-driven... but HOW?
But this is done through daily resting in Christ and trusting the work of the Spirit. Marshall is good at showing the critical difference between self-effort and trusting-in-God effort as we work at our sanctification.
Yes, I will get his book because this is EXACTLY my question. HOW do I do this? Because it seems like I do both but not enough of both to make much of a change. I'm a very slow sanctifier.

But of course, it's not really me, right?

How much is me, how much is Him? Can I accidentally do too much?
I was reading Jerry Bridges' The Pursuit of Holiness and it seemed like mostly just telling me to "make myself obey" and seemed like mostly self-effort but at the same time as I do all the "forced obedience", I give thanks to God for the "power" behind this obedience because I recognize that He is helping me perform these "acts of forced obedience." I just hear "obey obey obey" so much from the Christians around me that I worry somehow we are being legalistically driven because there is so much fear and pressure involved in the obedience. It isn't motivated by "love of God" or "gratitude" so much as "obey because God told you to." Which is correct to some extent, I think... but is there a point where it goes too far?
Jack K: what motivates us, try this one: God does. We would never have the slightest desire to serve him were it not for his amazing love for us—we love because he first loved us. And we could never appreciate this love he has for us without the transforming work of the Spirit in our hearts. So it's God from top to bottom. If you're trying harder to serve him from a distance, in order to impress him or avoid making him grumpy, you're missing out on the power. The power to be loving comes when you draw close to God daily, confident that he welcomes you in Christ and putting all your hope for acceptance on being joined to Jesus, trusting him to use all this to nurture a thankful zeal for godly service.
Yes, God is the one who gives us the desire to move. "Trying harder to serve God in order to impress Him or keep from making Him angry" So does "earning closeness with God" count as trying to buy God? Is this concept that when we sin "we pull away from God" or "God pulls away from us" false? Is it that God never pulls away and even when we "pull away", God is right there not really letting us go? So we can be grateful when we sin that He still has us and we have not lost ANY STANDING with God? (Not talking about salvation, I'm clear on that concept)
JJ said: Personally speaking i find that any teaching or book that takes my eyes of Christ my righteousness and makes me look at myself and my filthy rags ends with me in spiritual depression and despair
Right! Piper always teaches that when I take my eye off of God and put it on myself and my problems, that I will despair. He says the solution is to KEEP your eye on God and don't worry about those other things. But I get thrown off because sanctification is partly my job to work out so I try to be good but I worry I have the WRONG MOTIVATION for being good. Is there another right motivation besides gratitude?
Sarah: He IS our Master and WILL work sanctification within us. My greatest prayer is this: "may I truly love you, Lord, with all my being and truly love your ppl with all my being".......And herein lies sanctification. You becoming less and him becoming more. When you love him and his ppl legalism flies out the door. You might find yourself doing something resembling righteousness, but then notice you are doing it for yourself even though on the outside it looks like you're doing it for him and his ppl. Your heart breaks and you turn to your Master asking for forgiveness, asking for love and humility which emulates how he walked on this earth. Without love all your works do become legalistic. You're doing it out of pride and self dependence. ....And so it is that when your eyes are on Christ and his work and what he's done for you, then your eyes are off self.
I love the prayer example, thanks, Sarah. I love God but I have trouble loving His people because I lack love for God, right? So I try to put my eyes back on Him to see and appreciate who He is (reading Attributes of God and TULIP) and let God work in me a desire to obey but I worry I might be "letting be and let God"? Other Christians tell me to "obey" even when you absolutely don't want to. But they use fear of seperation from God in relationship as the motivation or "God will give you a spanking" for not obeying. I wonder that there might be a positive motivation, like gratitude but then "fear of God" seems logical as a good motivation.
Scott: God's method of sanctification is neither self-reliant activity nor God-reliant passivity, but God-dependent effort.
Scott, what is this blend look like and motivated by? Why do we obey (when we don't feel like it)? Is it because we TRUST God despite how we feel and obey because we KNOW He is right and our feelings are wrong? But then how do we fall back on gospel-drivien-gratitude a Horton and Fitzpatrick encourage? Why do they say to keep going back to the cross for motivation and for the power to act and be?
Randy:Just to be honest. My obedience isn't only gratitude. Most of the time I obey because I don't want to be disciplined and I believe God loves me enough to discipline me. So it isn't always something done out of gratitude. It is a healthy fear and reverence that keeps me sometimes. Sorry, I am just not always grateful. I am not all that sanctified yet I suppose.
haha... thank you for your honesty, Randy. The "Fear of God" motivation. So then are the Christians who tell me that "you will lose communion (not salvation) with God" correct? And even if I obey, God will chastize me to keep me depending on Him and growing. I will always have trials and I am grateful for those.
Jon: I response to your comment, I would prefer to see the relationship between 'by the mercies of God' and 'presenting ourselves' as one of 'assurance as the ground of obedience' rather than one of gratitude. This is something I enjoyed hearing Walter Marshall emphasizing in his book I recommended earlier: The Gospel Mystery of Sanctification. Not being assured of our peace with God before we move to obey him dishonors his grace and seeks to WIN his favor.
I LOOOOVE THIS!!! Thank you Jon. That's part of what I'm getting at. Trying to win God's favor is an incorrect motivation, right? Is it true as Piper says that God is 100% "on our side" because of what Jesus did? And we cannot "earn" even .01% of God's favor by our prayers and deeds? So am I ever "seperated" from God? Please explain this concept a little more, Jon. What should our motivation for obedience be if not gratitude? "Not being assured of our peace with God... BEFORE we obey..." This is SOOOO deep and yet I never hear it in church or from any Christian I know. Only from Piper, Horton and Fitzpatrick.
Jon: At any rate, I am inclined to stay away from gratitude as a motive for obedience because it comes so close (if not all the way) to becoming a method for paying God back. What shall we render to God but to lift our cup salvation and say 'more?'
This is so deep. Exactly. Hmmm... can gratitude be a right motivation at all? I love that we cannot GIVE God ANYTHING. Not even worship, right? But in church all I hear is that we are to worship God FOR GOD but isn't it FOR US? As if God needed anything from us. Or we could add to God in any way?
The problem I see with using gratitude as a motive is that it can create a debtor's ethic in our hearts that undercuts God's glory. It is a dishonor to God to presume to 'pay him back.' I believe a better response that honors him is not one that says, 'you have done this for me; now I DO this FOR you,' but one that says, 'YOU have done this for me; I enjoy you; give me more of you.' There is a subtle difference, but seeing such subtleties exposes the plots of that subtle serpent whose method is to conquer the toe before the foot and leg.
If possible, please explain a little more. So how do I do this in worship? In prayer? Without running into "using God" or is that good? Because we truly ARE dependent upon God. I'm afraid it might lean towards people only wanting God for His benefits and not Him. How can I use this to have patience with my mother? With loving others?
Randy: I think I understand what you are saying but I do believe that duty and response also play a part in this scenario. In fact, if I am not mistaken we are encouraged to obey him as debtors. It doesn't dishonor God to obey him out of debt that He paid a price for us and now we owe him reverence as sons. In fact that is exactly why Paul states the following. It is an adoption thing and we need to recognize this and be grateful to God. In Romans Chapter 1 the beginning of sin is that they became unthankful and then they spiral down into depravity. So Gratitude is very important. it isn't the only reason I can muster up on my wicked heart to obey him though. As I noted above. i am a sinful man who needs much sanctification.
And just when it looks narrowed down... heehee... thanks, Randy.
Jack K: absolutely NOT as something done to pay God back or earn his approval. Their point is that it's NOT repayment, but rather a free and glad obedience that's appropriate for saved people. I can see how one might hear the word and think in terms of repayment, but that's not how those guys use it.
So be grateful and WANT to do good deeds why again? God forgave me so why should I forgive my neighbor? I am glad God forgave me but my tendancy is to not forgive my neighbor. I know, really ugly, I know.

How does this gratitude pass on? Am I just not grateful enough to God to pass it on?