FPCR distinctives

[NaphtaliPress]

For those who may be interested, as I noted in the audio notice I just posted, our pastor is beginning a series with the May 7 PM sermon on our church's distinctives which normally strike visitor's as "surprising." The sermon today was introductory, but the subsequent entries will cover, albeit briefly, why we are EP, a cappella, use the AV, why the woman wear headcoverings during the service, etc.
http://www.fpcr.org/fpdb/OOW/2006/05072006.htm

 

[PuritanCovenanter]

Man, that is a lot to cover in one sermon Chris.

 

[NaphtaliPress]

Randy,
Not one; several in a series. Not sure he can do each in 30 minutes though, so some may be in more parts. We'll see.

 

[Pilgrim]

Listened to the evening message last night. I think Dr. Bacon is wise in preaching this series explaining FPCR's distinctives.

Although the OPC I attend does not mandate headcoverings, EP, KJV, etc., we do worship similar to what is advocated in Meuther and Hart's With Reverence and Awe and that alone is definitely an oddity in this area that is dominated by Romanists, Pentecostals (mostly Oneness) and revivalism (the latter being the case in the few relatively sound evangelical churches). This includes the Psalms being sung more frequently than apparently was done in the past. Not having a "praise band" is seen as hopelessly outdated and a blind adherence to traditionalism by many evangelicals, and not having an "altar call" is the first sign of hyper-Calvinism to others. Keeping the Sabbath of course is seen as legalism by most evangelicals today, apparently even among a good many Presbyterian ones. And I've found the issue of pictures of "Christ" does not generate so much as a second thought even for many who would identify as "Calvinists."


[Edited on 5-9-2006 by Pilgrim]

[Edited on 5-9-2006 by Pilgrim]

 

[NaphtaliPress]

Yes; hopefully the series will be useful. Also, I truly hope that the 2007 installment of The Confessional Presbyterian will contain Dr. Bacon's long promised article dealing with the pictures of Christ issue.

Originally posted by Pilgrim
Listened to the evening message last night. I think Dr. Bacon is wise in preaching this series explaining FPCR's distinctives.

Although the OPC I attend does not mandate headcoverings, EP, KJV, etc., we do worship similar to what is advocated in Meuther and Hart's With Reverence and Awe and that alone is definitely an oddity in this area that is dominated by Romanists, Pentecostals (mostly Oneness) and revivalism (the latter being the case in the few relatively sound evangelical churches). This includes the Psalms being sung more frequently than apparently was done in the past. Not having a "praise band" is seen as hopelessly outdated and a blind adherence to traditionalism by many evangelicals, and not having an "altar call" is the first sign of hyper-Calvinism to others. Keeping the Sabbath of course is seen as legalism by most evangelicals today, apparently even among a good many Presbyterian ones. And I've found the issue of pictures of "Christ" does not generate so much as a second thought even for many who would identify as "Calvinists."


[Edited on 5-9-2006 by Pilgrim]

[Edited on 5-9-2006 by Pilgrim]

 

[Casey]

Originally posted by NaphtaliPress
albeit briefly, why we are EP, a cappella, use the AV, why the woman wear headcoverings during the service, etc.

. . . and . . .

Originally posted by NaphtaliPress
Yes; hopefully the series will be useful. Also, I truly hope that the 2007 installment of The Confessional Presbyterian will contain Dr. Bacon's long promised article dealing with the pictures of Christ issue.

Does this mean the CP may include articles pro-EP, a cappella, use of the AV, and why women ought to wear headcoverings?


What we believe about the Second Commandment (concerning images of Christ) is confessional . . yes . .

 

[NaphtaliPress]

Oh, I don't know, I was not saying that. CPJ wasn't started to be a playground for FPCR distinctives. Just the images issue is all I indicated CPJ may be addressing in future. However, CPJ is dependent on author submissions so if something really really great on those topics dropped in the editor's submission basket, then maybe (but they'd have to be very well done to be worthwhile; I mean there is a lot of ok material on the Net so I'm not sure I want to spend space just on an "ok" presentation). EP and a cappella singing are brought up in the 2006 issue (which I should be sending out today to the book maker) since they come up in the RPW literature survey by Dr. Smith. This is unavoidable since the subject is part of the literature. Frank is a cappella EP (as is the editor), and does some interacting on that issue, though we also give some full citations of the opposing position without much critique, if I recall correctly. However if the issue were to be addressed head on in some fashion, I would want the best presentation from both sides that is possible and thorough and fair dealing on the strengths and weaknesses of the arguments from both sides. But I'm not really ready to line something like that up, and the way the discussions of the issues have gone here and elsewhere do not make me optimistic that it is even possible to get something that merits CPJ space. Again, it may happen that something drops into the editor's basket but it would have to be very well done, and very irenic, to make me want to broach the issue directly any time soon.

Originally posted by StaunchPresbyterian

Originally posted by NaphtaliPress
albeit briefly, why we are EP, a cappella, use the AV, why the woman wear headcoverings during the service, etc.

. . . and . . .

Originally posted by NaphtaliPress
Yes; hopefully the series will be useful. Also, I truly hope that the 2007 installment of The Confessional Presbyterian will contain Dr. Bacon's long promised article dealing with the pictures of Christ issue.

Does this mean the CP may include articles pro-EP, a cappella, use of the AV, and why women ought to wear headcoverings?


What we believe about the Second Commandment (concerning images of Christ) is confessional . . yes . .

 

[Casey]

Oh, I don't know, I was not saying that. CPJ wasn't started to be a playground for FPCR distinctives.

I'm happy to hear that this is the way you're handling these issues. (BTW, I'm also happy the Journal critiqued Gore's book.)

I pray the Lord would use the CPJ to turn his churches back to the wisdom of the Confession & Catechisms . . and I agree that the Second Commandment is one area that reformation is needed.

 

[NaphtaliPress]

Thanks Casey. I'm not sure Dean Gore was so happy about it; we did send a complimentary copy of the journal and an invite to respond via the author, but as neither the author or I have received any correspondence back, it is hard to know his impressions of the criticisms.

As for the purpose of CPJ, I should have as well quoted from the first issue:

In a day when it appears that Presbyterians are drifting further and further from the doctrines of the Westminster Confession of Faith and Catechisms, we hope The Confessional Presbyterian journal will provide a forum for inter-denominational discussion among conservative Presbyterians, wishing to defend closer adherence to these old standards of biblical Christianity. To facilitate such an environment we have assembled a fine board of contributing editors from several denominations (see page 184). Our goal, as hopefully reflected in this first issue, is to publish a range of theological, practical and historical material, supportive of the Westminster Standards, while allowing for courteous discussion where disagreements may exist. Our hope is to publish one volume annually.

Originally posted by StaunchPresbyterian

Oh, I don't know, I was not saying that. CPJ wasn't started to be a playground for FPCR distinctives.

I'm happy to hear that this is the way you're handling these issues. (BTW, I'm also happy the Journal critiqued Gore's book.)

I pray the Lord would use the CPJ to turn his churches back to the wisdom of the Confession & Catechisms . . and I agree that the Second Commandment is one area that reformation is needed.