Latin: How helpful have you found it?

[erickinho1bra]

To my Latin proficient brethren, I have some questions:

1. At what age did you begin to learn Latin?
2. When did you become proficient?
3. How many doors has it opened up to you when it comes to reading literature from church history?
4. How helpful have you found it to be, generally, in your spiritual life?
5. Finally, what do you think is the best approach to learn Latin for a family man?

 

[Pictet]

To my Latin proficient brethren, I have some questions:

1. At what age did you begin to learn Latin?
2. When did you become proficient?
3. How many doors has it opened up to you when it comes to reading literature from church history?
4. How helpful have you found it to be, generally, in your spiritual life?
5. Finally, what do you think is the best approach to learn Latin for a family man?

I'm not (yet) that proficient, so not the ideal person to answer; but no-one else has weighed in yet, so...

1. 36 (ish)
2. Next year (ish). Or more accurately, I can read easy bits and pieces. Or struggle through harder books with a dictionary. But I haven't been working hard at it at all. I can read Caesar and easier medieval Latin without help.
3. At my level, it's been invaluable in academic study (checking other people's references, and finding that are wrong, and chasing down a few for myself); for reading interesting books not available in English it's still hard going though occasionally doable. Scholastic literature is definitely easier, so hopefully it won't be long till I can read Turretin, Mastricht and so on relatively smoothly. But I'd need a higher level to fit in commentary study to my sermon prep or read through many hefty books.
4. It's been more spiritually helpful than you'd think given what I've just said. Any book is better and more moving in it's original language. Augustine, for instance, is stunning in the original, even if often hard.
5. Approach: there are two main textbook alternatives, as I see it: Lingua Latina per se Illustrata, which gets you reading fast but possibly imprecisely; and Keller & Russell 'Learn to Read Latin' which gives a more thorough grammatical basis while still having plenty reading; it's pricier and it would take time to work though, but it's good. Personally I'd do both. You also need a way of learning lots of vocab (I like Anki -research shows it's the most efficient way). And you need lots and lots of reading and listening practice from as early on as possible (the Legentibus app is incredible). Aim for a chapter a week of a textbook, do a bit of reading/listening daily, and practice vocab daily, and you'll get there. I've had long breaks from any study and still an making progress.

 

[DanSSwing]

Does anyone know if the Latin in Rosetta Stone software is useful for learning ancient/medieval Latin? Or does it waste your time with words like “car” and “bicycle” using the same template it uses for teaching modern languages?

 

[davejonescue]

I will post this on here, because this looks more relevant to its usage.

All of these can be done online without relocating:

Free or Low-Cost options: Price - Free to $16 a Month.
Latinum $8-$16 a month. - An Audio course for learning Latin. Its main course is Adler's Latin which uses the Ollendorff's method. But it offers others. Lots of vocab, and goal is to be able to read & speak Latin fluently.
Latin Tutorial $5-$10 a month - A very well done online offering.
Homeschool Connections 4 Year HS Latin Free - Catholic - 4 Years of HS Latin via Online Prerecorded Video - uses Wheelock (Over 100hrs of video)
Latin I Latin II Latin III St. Agnes - Free - Catholic - Audio - Attempts to, in a Year of Study, give one a good foundation using Collins "Primer of Ecclesiastical Latin" to start to read ecclesiastical literature written in Latin.
Latin by the Natural Method - Book I Book II Book III TG Free - Textbooks, appears to be based on majority Catholic Latin Church texts. Highly regarded on Latin forums for low-cost training.

More expensive options: Price $250-$1200 per course (from least expensive to most expensive)
LatinPerDiem - $250-$300 per course - Taught by Dr. Noe
Oxford Latinitas - $300-$500 per course
The Ancient Language Institute - $750-$800 per course
Veterum Sapientia Institute - $1100-$1500 per 3 credit course - Catholic, but accepts non-disruptive Protestants - Leads to Vatican Accreditation in Latin, the only offered in the US.

Latin Tutors - $30-$70 an hour (and there are probably quite a few sites like this.) Would be good at getting face to face time with Latin experts.

And I am sure there are more.

Also, as far as Latin Readers go, to start practicing reading. If one has a 12-13inch tablet. There are tons of Latin Readers on Archive.org for free, ranging in all types of degrees of difficulty, from elementary on up. Youtube also has several channels where they have created mock TV shows and News Reports in Latin, so one can get a feel for the language.

This is why I was mentioning that we live in an age where it is not hard or expensive at all to learn Latin. I have the stuff needed for several of these courses, I just havent found the time. But that doesnt mean it is impossible for the one with the discipline to do so. Looking online, most say that you will need to invest at least 1,000-2,000 hrs of study to start to feel comfortable reading without looking in a dictionary every other word. For most people, at an hour a day, that is close to 4-6 years of consistent study.

 

[Pictet]

Does anyone know if the Latin in Rosetta Stone software is useful for learning ancient/medieval Latin? Or does it waste your time with words like “car” and “bicycle” using the same template it uses for teaching modern languages?

No, it's definitely not useful.

There is no program or app currently available for Latin that either teaches efficiently or gets you as far as a regular textbook. You are much, much better getting almost any old textbook and working through it.

There are good apps for some tasks, as I mentioned, but nothing that actually teaches the language well.

 

[Ploutos]

No, it's definitely not useful.

There is no program or app currently available for Latin that either teaches efficiently or gets you as far as a regular textbook. You are much, much better getting almost any old textbook and working through it.

There are good apps for some tasks, as I mentioned, but nothing that actually teaches the language well.

Now that's interesting. Can you elaborate why it falls short? It would seem like Latin would be an easy target here.

 

[Pictet]

Now that's interesting. Can you elaborate why it falls short? It would seem like Latin would be an easy target here.

It does seem so, on some level.

But frankly coming from a broader language-learning background Rosetta Stone just isn't a well respected way of learning any language. It's designed (like Duolingo) to make things easy and fun. It's grammar-lite, yet doesn't actually offer enough exposure to large amounts of text to help you internalise the things without more explicit grammar instruction. It's designed to draw you in, not to teach you.

It's not going to do you actual harm, but there's no language for which it is an efficient means of learning. You waste a lot of hours. The only real attraction is that it feels easier than picking up a textbook. And it's still really quite expensive!

There are apps that do aspects of language learning very well - Kwiziq is brilliant for grammar, for instance - but they tend not to be available for minority languages like Latin. Duolingo is not really better than Rosetta Stone, and the Latin course is far, far too short to be really useful, but since it's free doing a few minutes of that a day till you finish the course is still preferable.

Going through a textbook may feel harder, but any decent one - and there are many, even plenty of free ones, but they work. Certainly a bit of advice helps get the most out of them, but they get you somewhere.

 

[Ploutos]

That's helpful; so it's not just that Rosetta Stone is terrible at Latin, it's that Rosetta Stone is just terrible all around.

 

[Pictet]

That's helpful; so it's not just that Rosetta Stone is terrible at Latin, it's that Rosetta Stone is just terrible all around.

Yes, exactly. It's a triumph of marketing, but not of actual learning.
There's clearly huge potential for really powerful language learning software, but nothing really delivers on the whole package yet.

 

[Solparvus]

Programs like DuoLingo or Rosetta Stone, if used, need to be seen as just one tool in your language learning toolbox. Neither one by itself is going to take you to fluency, whatever the marketing says.

Good things said already in this thread. Also, just get into the language. Start reading. I would start by reading the Bible in Latin, whether the Vulgate or other Latin translation. You should know the Bible pretty well already, and so that will help in deciphering the Latin. Do your best to find things you can understand, but also don't be afraid to read things somewhat above your head. You just need to do all you can to get Latin into your system, and that takes a lot of time.

 

[a.k.pritchard]

To my Latin proficient brethren, I have some questions:

1. At what age did you begin to learn Latin?
2. When did you become proficient?
3. How many doors has it opened up to you when it comes to reading literature from church history?
4. How helpful have you found it to be, generally, in your spiritual life?
5. Finally, what do you think is the best approach to learn Latin for a family man?

1. Began to learn Latin at 12 years old in grammar school.
2. As far from proficient as it is possible to be, lol.
3. Greek and Hebrew at university helped me much more.
4. I usually stick to the five solae and that about does me.
5. I'd imagine recruiting a friend who has studied classics at university. Would be invaluable.