Jack K
Puritan Board Doctor
The standard two young guys in white shirts and ties. They showed up at our door. It made me recall this thread about whether or not we should show any hospitality to such people. So what did I do? Here's a summary blow by blow:
By the time my wife called me to speak with them, she'd already given them each a glass of cool water. They looked hot and tired. I sat on our back porch with them and got to know them a bit. Where they were from. What fun they'd been able to enjoy in our area, etc.
I figure young Mormons tend to be trapped in a works righteousness system, so when they asked me about spiritual matters I talked about how I used to feel pressure to prove myself to God and the church, but have learned the freedom and power that comes from grace. After I talked a bit about grace, one of them mentioned that indeed "by grace are ye saved, through faith."
So I had him get out his Bible and look at that passage (interestingly, he didn't know where to find that verse he'd quoted). I talked about the context of Ephesians 2. I showed them how Paul says we're saved by grace, not works, but then in the next verse says we're saved to do good works. I talked about how our hearts are inclined to get this backwards—to try to do good works to impress God—when the reality is that having experienced the love of Jesus he impresses us, so that we erupt in good works out of gratitude rather than pressure. I asked if they too felt pressure sometimes.
They wouldn't admit that. Instead they countered with James 2:17: "Faith apart from works is dead." I spoke for a bit about the need not to confuse Paul's use of the word "faith" (πίστις), which almost always refers to saving faith, with James who uses it somewhat differently. Maybe I was showing off. But that really is, I think, the only good way to answer that confusion.
We went back to Ephesians and I tried to speak the gospel from chapters 1 and 2. We looked at how believers were once objects of wrath, but now can enjoy the freedom of being sons of God due to redemption and forgiveness through Christ's blood. I could have done better here.
At some point I told them plainly that I thought their mission was dangerous, both to my neighbors and to their own souls. But I said it nicely. By this time, I had legitimate concern for them.
They were ready to go, so I asked if I could pray for them from chapter 3. They agreed. So I prayed that they would know how high and deep and wide and long is the love of Christ and that Christ would dwell in their hearts by faith. I prayed the same for myself—that I too would know Christ's love more fully. One of them had mentioned that he'd recently begun studying the Bible, so I prayed that God would speak to him through it and that he'd come to see Jesus more clearly.
So that was it. They left. I think I maybe overwhelmed them more than I really spoke to them out of concern for their souls. I'd gotten caught up in making sure I was debating them well, forgetting that it's really pretty easy to win a debate with a young Mormon if you keep it to the Bible. For all their training, they're woefully unprepared to handle the Bible.
I probably argued biblically too much and spoke/listened to them as persons too little. I was overly pleased with myself for being able to start with a verse they picked and present the gospel from that point (ala Philip with the Ethiopian), and I'm sure my smugness showed through. Not good. Being comfortable with my own failings would have been a far more powerful witness to a couple of guys caught up in performance-based religion.
Still, I hope a seed of the gospel got planted. In my experience, many young Mormons have never really heard it. The encounter reminded me to "always be prepared to give an account of the hope that is within you." I could be better prepared.
Thoughts?...
By the time my wife called me to speak with them, she'd already given them each a glass of cool water. They looked hot and tired. I sat on our back porch with them and got to know them a bit. Where they were from. What fun they'd been able to enjoy in our area, etc.
I figure young Mormons tend to be trapped in a works righteousness system, so when they asked me about spiritual matters I talked about how I used to feel pressure to prove myself to God and the church, but have learned the freedom and power that comes from grace. After I talked a bit about grace, one of them mentioned that indeed "by grace are ye saved, through faith."
So I had him get out his Bible and look at that passage (interestingly, he didn't know where to find that verse he'd quoted). I talked about the context of Ephesians 2. I showed them how Paul says we're saved by grace, not works, but then in the next verse says we're saved to do good works. I talked about how our hearts are inclined to get this backwards—to try to do good works to impress God—when the reality is that having experienced the love of Jesus he impresses us, so that we erupt in good works out of gratitude rather than pressure. I asked if they too felt pressure sometimes.
They wouldn't admit that. Instead they countered with James 2:17: "Faith apart from works is dead." I spoke for a bit about the need not to confuse Paul's use of the word "faith" (πίστις), which almost always refers to saving faith, with James who uses it somewhat differently. Maybe I was showing off. But that really is, I think, the only good way to answer that confusion.
We went back to Ephesians and I tried to speak the gospel from chapters 1 and 2. We looked at how believers were once objects of wrath, but now can enjoy the freedom of being sons of God due to redemption and forgiveness through Christ's blood. I could have done better here.
At some point I told them plainly that I thought their mission was dangerous, both to my neighbors and to their own souls. But I said it nicely. By this time, I had legitimate concern for them.
They were ready to go, so I asked if I could pray for them from chapter 3. They agreed. So I prayed that they would know how high and deep and wide and long is the love of Christ and that Christ would dwell in their hearts by faith. I prayed the same for myself—that I too would know Christ's love more fully. One of them had mentioned that he'd recently begun studying the Bible, so I prayed that God would speak to him through it and that he'd come to see Jesus more clearly.
So that was it. They left. I think I maybe overwhelmed them more than I really spoke to them out of concern for their souls. I'd gotten caught up in making sure I was debating them well, forgetting that it's really pretty easy to win a debate with a young Mormon if you keep it to the Bible. For all their training, they're woefully unprepared to handle the Bible.
I probably argued biblically too much and spoke/listened to them as persons too little. I was overly pleased with myself for being able to start with a verse they picked and present the gospel from that point (ala Philip with the Ethiopian), and I'm sure my smugness showed through. Not good. Being comfortable with my own failings would have been a far more powerful witness to a couple of guys caught up in performance-based religion.
Still, I hope a seed of the gospel got planted. In my experience, many young Mormons have never really heard it. The encounter reminded me to "always be prepared to give an account of the hope that is within you." I could be better prepared.
Thoughts?...
