Wayne Grudem's Systematic Theology

[Reformed Covenanter]

I am currently one-third of the way through Wayne Grudem's Systematic Theology (2007 edition), having never read it before. What are your thoughts on this volume (or any of the earlier editions of the work)?

 

[Matthew1344]

My pastor loves it.

 

[Leslie]

My daughter, in her 40's, not at all theologically inclined, enthusiastically joined a study group going through this in 2 years. Anyone who can write well enough to inspire lay people (especially my daughter) to dig in is excellent in my book.

 

[Matthew1344]

yeah it is written to be easily understood.

 

[Rom]

I remember reading it early on in my understanding of the Doctrines of Grace. It was helpful for a season in my life, though I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at my church currently - there are better resources I would point them to, such as G.I Williamson's Commentary on the Confession, and Vos' Commentary on the Larger Catechism - which are works that I think are easy to read and are both Confessionally grounded.

 

[Jake]

I'm curious to see what is beneficial. When reading a systematic theology, I would prefer to read from a Reformed author. I've only been pointed to parts of Grudem's work by non-Reformed (though often predestinarian in orientation) men, such as the section on the continuation of spiritual gifts. Is there something that Grudem addresses better than others?

 

[Matthew1344]

I remember reading it early on...

me too

there are better resources

Yeah there is

though I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at my church currently

But i would still recommend it to people along with the books that Rom said. Actually the other day I told some of my friends they should pick up calvins institutes along with grudems book.

 

[Rom]

though I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at my church currently

But i would still recommend it to people along with the books that Rom said. Actually the other day I told some of my friends they should pick up calvins institutes along with grudems book.

That's great - but I want to be clear that I wouldn't recommend it, because it would cause confusion where Grudem differs from what our Church believes.

We disagree with Grudem on Polity, Sacraments, and the Ordinary Continuation of Extraordinary Spiritual Gifts (just off the top of my head). I remember the Chapter on Polity being particularly atrocious, and for a Presbyterian to recommend Grudem's book would seem to be an odd thing, considering our denomination's very name is rooted in our polity

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

My daughter, in her 40's, not at all theologically inclined, enthusiastically joined a study group going through this in 2 years. Anyone who can write well enough to inspire lay people (especially my daughter) to dig in is excellent in my book.

yeah it is written to be easily understood.

One thing that has really struck me is that the book is not only well-written, but is also structured very clearly. Thus it compares favourable with Michael Horton's ST; the first 400 pages of Wayne Grudem has been a breeze; the first 400 pages of Michael Horton were so wearisome that I sold the book (only to buy it back a fortnight ago).

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

I wouldn't recommend it to anyone at my church currently

I'm curious to see what is beneficial. When reading a systematic theology, I would prefer to read from a Reformed author.

I would not give it to those who lack discernment. I am reading it partly because I am in need of a mental challenge, and thought I would sharpen my thinking by reading a systematic theology that is generally well respected, but not one that I would entirely agree with.

 

[Matthew1344]

Polity

Just real quick, what is this?

That's great - but I want to be clear that I wouldn't recommend it, because it would cause confusion where Grudem differs from what our Church believes.

good call

I think for the most part our pastors at our church would agree with what he writes in his book. Dont know for sure though.

 

[Rom]

Polity

Just real quick, what is this?

Church Government.

 

[Pilgrim]

I haven't read it through, although I have found it to be quite useful. But I think the points others have been made regarding how well written it is are valid. It also has a devotional quality that many other similar texts lack.

 

[KMK]

I have found it helpful, especially for understanding how the modern calvinistic mind works. It is difficult to interact in the modern world when all you read is the Puritans.

 

[DMcFadden]

Grudem is a Westminster (Phil) grad (he started at Fuller and transferred) who has written the most popular all-around conservative theology in this generation. There are several hundred thousands of the books in print as it is used in countless Bible colleges and seminaries. This is owing to his clarity, avoidance of technical terminology (e.g., he writes of the "clarity" of Scripture rather than its "perspicuity"), and irenic spirit.

Grudem is so good that he is praised by Reformed (Nicole, Poythress, Packer), Arminian (Coppedge), Baptist (Patterson, Breshears, Baptist Standard), Dispensational (Saucy), Charismatic Baptist (Piper), Foursquare (Hayford) and Vineyard (Deere) theologians.

Major differences from most PB brethren: polity (he is Baptist), eschatology (he is historic premill), and cessationism (he accepts on-going "charismatic" gifts).

Nevertheless, he is more accessible than just about any writer out there and sticks to a conservative, inerrantist, non-egalitarian, 5-point platform.

I have and will continue to recommend him enthusiastically (despite my many disagreements with him on specific points) because there is nobody out there (in my opinion) who can be read by the lay-person and college student so easily and profitably. Among the challenges Reformational Christians face in this age can be summarized by weak views of the authority of the Bible and a pervasive egalitarianism that erases biblical distinctions of gender. Grudem is strong on both of those points. And, Ken is spot on: if you want to engage the present culture, you need to be a bit more up-to-date with the controversies and bibliographies than 400-500 years ago.

If R.C. Sproul had written a sys theo, I would probably have preferred it to Grudem. However, there are only a few Sproul's and Grudems out there. As such, it will be a joy to continue being nourished by the rich fruit of his theology, even if it requires picking out the seeds.

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

It also has a devotional quality that many other similar texts lack.

Yes, I have found this a significant advantage to the book.

It is difficult to interact in the modern world when all you read is the Puritans.

So true; I think you have highlighted one of the main problems with neo-Puritanism. By all means read the Puritans, but it is a mistake to simply think that you can regurgitate Puritanism nowadays.

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

Does anyone know if his son, the Revd Elliot Grudem has any plans to publish any major theological writings? Elliot is a Presbyterian minister and a graduate of RTS; a Presbyterian version of his dad's ST would be most welcome!

 

[Matthew1344]

Online Messages 2005 - Christian Essentials Enrichment Class of Scottsdale Bible Church here is a link that has his systematic theology in outline form. and if you keep clicking, then you can get all of them up to 2014.

 

[Rom]

I'm sorry. I have Grudem in multiple formats. But I couldn't in good conscience recommend him to a lay-person finding their legs in a Confessional Presbyterian Church. To have him undermine many of the doctrines of your church seems odd. Now if you want to give him to someone more firmly rooted in the faith, great! My PCA Pastor wouldn't ever recommend him to anyone in the congregation and would always steer folks elsewhere. I think it was wise of him.

I will echo the praise for his writing style and approachability. It is no doubt a fine work.

 

[Deleted member 6112]

I have and will continue to recommend him enthusiastically (despite my many disagreements with him on specific points) because there is nobody out there (in my opinion) who can be read by the lay-person and college student so easily and profitably. Among the challenges Reformational Christians face in this age can be summarized by weak views of the authority of the Bible and a pervasive egalitarianism that erases biblical distinctions of gender. Grudem is strong on both of those points. And, Ken is spot on: if you want to engage the present culture, you need to be a bit more up-to-date with the controversies and bibliographies than 400-500 years ago.

If R.C. Sproul had written a sys theo, I would probably have preferred it to Grudem. However, there are only a few Sproul's and Grudems out there. As such, it will be a joy to continue being nourished by the rich fruit of his theology, even if it requires picking out the seeds.

How does James Montgomery Boice compare?

 

[RamistThomist]

I am currently one-third of the way through Wayne Grudem's Systematic Theology (2007 edition), having never read it before. What are your thoughts on this volume (or any of the earlier editions of the work)?

Warm, scholarly rigorous. Sure, he bucks the trend in a few areas, but I appreciate him for that.

Here is where I contrast him with Horton (whom I;m currently reading and enjoying) beyond obvious differences. Grudem is dealing with broadly evangelical debates (even the semi-arminians he spars with still fall loosely within American evangelicalism). Horton is dealing with the debates that Eastern Orthodoxy, Radical Orthodoxy, and Continental Philosophy generated--and that's valuable in its own right.

I've used Grudem in teaching many Sunday School classes. His organization is probably the clearest of any.

 

[RamistThomist]

I have and will continue to recommend him enthusiastically (despite my many disagreements with him on specific points) because there is nobody out there (in my opinion) who can be read by the lay-person and college student so easily and profitably. Among the challenges Reformational Christians face in this age can be summarized by weak views of the authority of the Bible and a pervasive egalitarianism that erases biblical distinctions of gender. Grudem is strong on both of those points. And, Ken is spot on: if you want to engage the present culture, you need to be a bit more up-to-date with the controversies and bibliographies than 400-500 years ago.

If R.C. Sproul had written a sys theo, I would probably have preferred it to Grudem. However, there are only a few Sproul's and Grudems out there. As such, it will be a joy to continue being nourished by the rich fruit of his theology, even if it requires picking out the seeds.

How does James Montgomery Boice compare?

Grudem gives you A LOT more and deals with more recent controversies.

 

[Matthew1344]

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

I am with brother Rom on this. Better to read Berkhof, than Grudem.

http://books.biblicaltraining.org/Systematic Theology by Louis Berkhof.pdf

 

[Matthew1344]

Never read berkhof. What is best book from him?

 

[bookslover]

I am with brother Rom on this. Better to read Berkhof, than Grudem.

http://books.biblicaltraining.org/Systematic Theology by Louis Berkhof.pdf

Berkhof is a good example of why so many people turn to Grudem. Berkhof is thoroughly orthodox (especially from our Reformed perspective), but he's stunningly boring as a writer. I think the average layman would give up on Berkhof after two or three pages.

Grudem likes women deacons and gives away too much to the charismatic movement - but if you want a clear and well-written presentation of basic Christian doctrine written with style and verve, Grudem is your man. As a Reformed person, you can always supplement him with other writings. (I have the first edition, published in December, 1994.)

His volume is 20 years old this year and, as far as I can tell, it's still a very steady seller.

 

[Ask Mr. Religion]

I fear explanations of things explained.

Why is being boring a detriment other than to exemplify the sad state of affairs of this fallen world, wherein a Dominoe's Pizza mentality exists, such that if we cannot "get it" in thirty minutes or less it is free?

It is the same world that the word "awesome" now means "thank you for your well recited order" at a dining establishment.

Sorry, but give me the "boring" men of old who would drive me to my knees seeking understanding of truths versus those who would appeal to the hoi polloi all the while getting not a few matters wrong.

 

[Matthew1344]

Ha

Sorry, but give me the "boring" men of old who would drive me to my knees seeking understanding of truths versus those who would appeal to the hoi polloi all the while getting not a few matters wrong.

Be nice, we all love those guys

 

[bookslover]

I fear explanations of things explained.

Why is being boring a detriment other than to exemplify the sad state of affairs of this fallen world, wherein a Dominoe's Pizza mentality exists, such that if we cannot "get it" in thirty minutes or less it is free?

It is the same world that the word "awesome" now means "thank you for your well recited order" at a dining establishment.

Sorry, but give me the "boring" men of old who would drive me to my knees seeking understanding of truths versus those who would appeal to the hoi polloi all the while getting not a few matters wrong.

I understand your point but, for most average people (and especially in our age, where you're lucky to get people - even Christian people - to read anything at all), "boring" will equal "not read." Grudem gives you the impression that he's truly interested and excited by theology, and wants you to be interested and excited by it, too. As I wrote, it's easy to supplement him with more Reformed stuff when needed, but I would heartily recommend Grudem to most people.

 

[Reformed Covenanter]

I am with brother Rom on this. Better to read Berkhof, than Grudem.

I have read Louis Berkhof's ST twice, and still consider it to be the best (relatively) modern ST. However, I cannot read him all the time and need to read someone else.

Berkhof is thoroughly orthodox (especially from our Reformed perspective), but he's stunningly boring as a writer.

I think Louis Berkhof's boringness [if that is even a word] has been greatly exaggerated.

Never read berkhof. What is best book from him?

Matt, you might find his Manual of Christian Doctrine a good medium-length discussion of systematic theology. I had to consult it recently (having never read it before) and found it to be very clear and reasonably concise.