Definition of heresy.

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Southern Presbyterian

Puritan Board Doctor
Is the following a sufficient/thorough definition of heresy?

We are in heresy when we pick and choose what to believe in Scripture rather than receiving it all as the word of God. Instead of being received, the faith is chosen selectively by the heretic.

I'll credit the quote to it's author later, as I do not want to bias the discussion based on his identity.;)
 
I would think it would be more like denying the essential doctrines of the Christian faith.
 
I would think it would be more like denying the essential doctrines of the Christian faith.

:ditto:

Stick to the creeds to define heresy. Perhaps it would be helpful to refer to false views (confessionally false) as "errors" rather then "heresy"?

What I mean is a man who denies (say) the "holy catholic church" or "one baptism for the remission of sins" is a "heretic". But the next man who differs from the WCF on church government or mode and subject of baptism is "in error".

Now I happen to belive that those who are in "error" vis the WCF are also "heretics", but that can only be my opinion until such time as an ecumenical council recieves the WCF as the "holy faith of our fathers, unless which a man believe he may not be saved."

:2cents:
 
I agree that this is an over-simplification. Yet I was hoping to spark some discussion on the subject (but no one seems to be engaged by the topic) and perhaps, just maybe, come up with a definition of heresy that most PB folk could agree to. We do see the term used from time to time here 'bouts.

Any other comments or discussion before I reveal the source of the quote?

Anyone want to guess who I'm quoting? :)
 
Slippery little word, "heresy," isn't it?

In RC circles, they distinguish heresy from schism (disunity through lack of love) and apostasy (abandonment of Christianity). In the RC sense of the term, "heresy" comes in two principle flavors: "formal" (adherence to false doctrine by a baptized Roman Catholic) and "material" (false doctrine held in ignorance by a non-Roman).

For those of us Protestants, we often throw the word around about as loosely as we do political/ideological labels. A "liberal," for instance, is just about anybody to the left of me. Religiously, "I am a conservative evangelical," YOU are a fundamentalist. In this sense, a heretic is anybody who disagrees with me over a point of doctrine. The problem comes when, as a result of seeing through a "glass darkly," we begin to disagree on eschatological schema, patterns of polity, candidates for baptism, the RPW, ow whatever. On this board, I believe I have heard Arminians, name-it-and-claim-it preachers, credobaptists, and premil folks labeled "heretics" at one time or another. Some think theonomy is a heresy. Most of you all have no problems calling dispensationalism heresy, etc.

It would seem to me that one might distinguish between beliefs that consign one to hell and notions that are to one degree or another untrue, but not a "salvation issue." In our Protestant tradition, heresy has often been used in a more technical sense of a two-fold move: denying a "crucial" (???) Christian truth + embracing an unbiblical error. But herein lies the rub. Who is to distinguish between a central/crucial doctrine and an "unimportant" one? Might it even be heretical to call ANY doctrine of God "unimportant"?

Another distinction seems necessary. My observation is that conservative Protestants often suffer from degree envy. So we send our best and brightest off to Harvard, Claremont, Chicago, the GTU, etc. for their terminal degrees. They return with their piety and heart for the Lord intact, but often infected with a mindset that destroys the faith from within. Having known and grown close to mentors who are unashamedly liberal, they suffer from bouts of cognitive dissonance. Unable to condemn the pernicious doctrines of their mentors without seeming to slam their academic father-figures, they waffle. However, the next generation of students, tuaght by the wafflers, begins to move further away from the truth. When they go off to university for their PhD's they return with little heart for the Lord and a decidedly liberal methodology and mindset.

One of my colleagues in seminary was the best of the best (Wheaton summa; top grades at Fuller). But, after returning from graduate school tried to explain to an NT Intro class (where one of my interns was present) that Jesus did not know that he was God during his earthly ministry!!! My intern, in his best California valley boy slang, raised his hand to ask: "Didn't Peter kindof tip him off at Caserea Philippi?"

My point being that sometimes a teacher may be unassailably displaying evident piety and devotion, even giving lip service to all of the right doctrines, yet teach in such a way as to infect students with heresy. My concern is that we make the word narrow enough not to throw everyone but me and thee off the boat and yet broad enough to include the professedly orthodox person who leads people astray.
 
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Who are you quoting? I tried to google the quote but came up empty. It sounds like something that i have heard or read before.
 
The quote comes form Rushdoony's commentary on Romans & Galatians.

BTW, I agree with Dennis in that "heresy" does seem to be a "slippery term".

Is there a standardized definition of heresy? If so, who decided it?
 
The quote comes form Rushdoony's commentary on Romans & Galatians.

BTW, I agree with Dennis in that "heresy" does seem to be a "slippery term".

Is there a standardized definition of heresy? If so, who decided it?



It's not a definition but . . .

Heresy corrupts unity and purity of faith


INSTITUTES OF THE CHRISTIAN RELIGION
TRANSLATED BY
HENRY BEVERIDGE

CHAPTER 2
COMPARISON BETWEEN THE FALSE CHURCH AND THE TRUE

SECTION 5


5. The objection of personal succession, and the charge of heresy and
schism, refuted both from Scripture and Augustine.




As to their charge of heresy and schism, because we preach a different
doctrine, and submit not to their laws, and meet apart from them for
Prayer, Baptism, the administration of the Supper, and other sacred rites,
it is indeed a very serious accusation, but one which needs not a long and
labored defense. The name of heretics and schismatics is applied to those
who, by dissenting from the Church, destroy its communion. This
communion is held together by two chains — viz. consent in sound
doctrine and brotherly charity. Hence the distinction which Augustine
makes between heretics and schismatics is, that the former corrupt the
purity of the faith by false dogmas, whereas the latter sometimes, even
while holding the same faith, break the bond of union (August. Lib.
Quaest. in Evang. Matthew.). But the thing to be observed is, that this
union of charity so depends on unity of faith, as to have in it its beginning,
its end, in fine, its only rule. Let us therefore remember, that whenever
ecclesiastical unity is commended to us, the thing required is, that while
our minds consent in Christ, our wills also be united together by mutual
good-will in Christ. Accordingly Paul, when he exhorts us to it, takes for
his fundamental principle that there is “one God, one faith, one baptism”
(Ephesians 4:5). Nay, when he tells us to be “of one accord, of one mind,”
he immediately adds, “Let this mind be in you which was also in Christ
Jesus” (Philippians 2:2, 5); intimating, that where the word of the Lord is
not, it is not a union of believers, but a faction of the ungodly.



.
 
Could heresy be defined as a belief where if one were to believe it, then he could not be a Christian?
 
What Heresy Is.

James Durham, Concerning Scandal (Naphtali Press, 1990). Part Four (Concerning Scandalous Divisions), Chapter One (How Heresy, Schism AND Division Differ), page 225.
WHAT HERESY IS.
And, first, Heresy, is some error in doctrine, and that especially in
fundamental doctrine, followed with pertinacy, and endeavor to propagate
the same.
 
I believe heresy is tied to the usage in church documents that declare heretics by saying "if they deny what is taught here, let them be anathema." Anathema means accursed, or damned, and comes from Galatians 1:9, "If anyone is preaching a gospel contrary to what you received, he is to be accursed!"

A heresy, is something that is contrary to the gospel itself thus is damnable.
 
The origin of the word in the NT is instructive. Hairesis denotes . . .
1. a choice
2. a chosen opinion (used only negatively in the NT of views caused by false teachings)
3. a sect or party (holding certain opinions)

2 Tim 3:16 pictures the role of the Scriptures as establishing the "line" ("teaching" - didaskalian), showing where we have deviated from the line ("reproof" - elegmon), directing us in the proper change in course to return to the line ("correction" - epanorthoosin), and how to continue our conduct on the line ("training in righteousness" - paideian teen dikaiosunee). The "geometry" of obedience leads us to follow the line of God's leading in His word. Our "choice" seems responsive to His gracious provision of truth to follow in and error to avoid.

Heresy would seem to involve a very different kind of "choosing," one that exalts the autonomous will of man. "Choosing" to separate from the life-giving truth of God in favor of one's own determinations, differentiations, and decisions, sometimes even forming a schismatic party would characterize heresy.
 
The origin of the word in the NT is instructive. Hairesis denotes . . .
1. a choice
2. a chosen opinion (used only negatively in the NT of views caused by false teachings)
3. a sect or party (holding certain opinions)

2 Tim 3:16 pictures the role of the Scriptures as establishing the "line" ("teaching" - didaskalian), showing where we have deviated from the line ("reproof" - elegmon), directing us in the proper change in course to return to the line ("correction" - epanorthoosin), and how to continue our conduct on the line ("training in righteousness" - paideian teen dikaiosunee). The "geometry" of obedience leads us to follow the line of God's leading in His word. Our "choice" seems responsive to His gracious provision of truth to follow in and error to avoid.

Heresy would seem to involve a very different kind of "choosing," one that exalts the autonomous will of man. "Choosing" to separate from the life-giving truth of God in favor of one's own determinations, differentiations, and decisions, sometimes even forming a schismatic party would characterize heresy.

I am going to save that one!

I think 'heresy' must involve 'schism'.

1 Cor 11:18,19 "For first of all, when ye come together in the church, I hear that there be divisions among you; and I partly believe it. For there must be also heresies among you, that they which are approved may be made manifest among you.

There are plenty of people out there (probably myself) who believe some error but do not choose to cause division. That is error, not heresy.

This would agree with Durham's quote above.
 
Ken,

In lecture 39 of Dr. Curt Daniel's History of Calvinism series, he speaks of the problem of offering humanity an inadequate diagnosis of our depravity and inability. He analogizes to a physician who offers (for a fee) to "doctor" your Xray to make it look less dire rather than operating to remove the cancer. Daniel says that such a doctor should be "run out of" the ranks of physicians. Then, he adds: "In my opinion, Arminians should be run out of the ranks of theologians too." Does that have any relevance for our discussion of "heresy"???

:rofl::rofl::rofl:
 
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So far we have the following marks of heresy (I may have missed a couple, so correct me where necessary).

1. Clear Biblical error (leading to the fires of Hell) is involved.
2. That error is taught to others.
3. It leads to schism in the Church.

What did I miss?
 
So far we have the following marks of heresy (I may have missed a couple, so correct me where necessary).

1. Clear Biblical error (leading to the fires of Hell) is involved.
2. That error is taught to others.
3. It leads to schism in the Church.

What did I miss?

Who advocates #3? Schism has been a blessing at times...

Divisions and separations are most objectionable in religion. They weaken the cause of true Christianity...But before we blame people for them, we must be careful that we lay the blame where it is deserved. False doctrine and heresy are even worse than schism. If people separate themselves from teaching that is positively false and unscriptural, they ought to be praised rather than reproved. In such cases separation is a virtue and not a sin.

WHo said the above? was it Dabney? I find it very true
 
Ken,

In lecture 39 of Dr. Curt Daniel's History of Calvinism series, he speaks of the problem of offering humanity an inadequate diagnosis of our depravity and inability. He analogizes to a physician who offers (for a fee) to "doctor" your xray to make it looke less dire rather than operating to remove the cancer. Daniel says that such a doctor should be "run out of" the ranks of physicians. Then, he adds: "In my opinion, Arminians should be run out of the ranks of theologians too." Does that have any relevance for our discussion of "heresy"???

:rofl::rofl::rofl:

Great analogy! I am going to use that one. (I will give Dr. Daniel credit)
 
Schism would be a bad dividing of the Church - Trouble for troubles sake.

Separation would be a good action of the Church - We must remain a chaste bride.
 
I just came across this definition of heresy while reading this evening:

"Heresies... gross and dangerous errors voluntarily held (Titus 3:11), and factiously maintained by some person or persons within the visible church, Acts 20:30, in opposition to some chief or substantial truths grounded upon and drawn from the holy Scripture...."

--James Fergusson, in his An Exposition of the Epistles of Paul to the Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, Thessalonians.

I think this is much better than the first definition I cited. What say ye?
 
I just came across this definition of heresy while reading this evening:

"Heresies... gross and dangerous errors voluntarily held (Titus 3:11), and factiously maintained by some person or persons within the visible church, Acts 20:30, in opposition to some chief or substantial truths grounded upon and drawn from the holy Scripture...."

--James Fergusson, in his An Exposition of the Epistles of Paul to the Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, Colossians, Thessalonians.

I think this is much better than the first definition I cited. What say ye?

I like the words 'factiously maintained'!
 
The classic understanding of heresy has been:

Heresy is an error which puts one's salvation in jeopardy.

Hence, Christians can be in error, but not be heretics. Thus, denial of the Trinity, the Chalcedonian formula of Christ, etc. etc. are heresies. Arminianism is not.
 
The classic understanding of heresy has been:

Heresy is an error which puts one's salvation in jeopardy.

Hence, Christians can be in error, but not be heretics. Thus, denial of the Trinity, the Chalcedonian formula of Christ, etc. etc. are heresies. Arminianism is not.


So the belief in, and teaching of, the free will of man deciding to accept God's gift that He has offered and made possible by Christ's death on the the cross to the entire world and is just standing by waiting for men to choose Him is not heresy?

Can you explain why not?

Sounds like a different gospel to me.

I can accept that Suzy Q in the pew believes that and is saved in spite of it; but one who believes and teaches such things, how can they be anything but a heretic?
 
So far we have the following marks of heresy (I may have missed a couple, so correct me where necessary).

1. Clear Biblical error (leading to the fires of Hell) is involved.
2. That error is taught to others.
3. It leads to schism in the Church.

What did I miss?

Who advocates #3?

Am I on your ignore list or do you not bother to read all of the posts?

No KMK, you are not. I mised it. So now I must disagree that schism is always heretical. I agree with the quote i provided.
 
might as well be Catholic,since no one's a heretic

The classic understanding of heresy has been:

Heresy is an error which puts one's salvation in jeopardy.

Hence, Christians can be in error, but not be heretics. Thus, denial of the Trinity, the Chalcedonian formula of Christ, etc. etc. are heresies. Arminianism is not.


So the belief in, and teaching of, the free will of man deciding to accept God's gift that He has offered and made possible by Christ's death on the the cross to the entire world and is just standing by waiting for men to choose Him is not heresy?

Can you explain why not?

Sounds like a different gospel to me.

I can accept that Suzy Q in the pew believes that and is saved in spite of it; but one who believes and teaches such things, how can they be anything but a heretic?


Hey y'all. I'm seriously asking, not just being a smart mouth.

Anybody?

Am I being too strict in my understanding of what heresy is? Is there as much leeway in beliefs as it seems, based on my observations of the PB for the last 4 years and my foray into the PCA?

It seems like "everybody" is cutting everyone else so much slack in the "biggies", that's it's hard to comprehend why all the "little stuff" has divided the church to this extent.
If
So the belief in, and teaching of, the free will of man deciding to accept God's gift that He has offered and made possible by Christ's death on the the cross to the entire world and is just standing by waiting for men to choose Him is not heresy?
isn't that big of a deal; then is anything? If all that is an acceptable level of error; then why bother with separation. We should all go back to PCUSA, shoot, might as well go for the gold and go all the way back to the Catholic church and purify it. As near as I can tell, their baptisms are acceptable by the cream of the crop of reformed/presbyterians as represented on the Puritan Board. The arguements for RC baptisms might as well be arguements for why the RC isn't really all that bad, just in error.

I really do need a good funciional definition of heresy because I am used to having everything spelled out that I am supposed to believe. Turned out that it was all wrong and I'm unlearning all the old stuff and learning new. This new way of living doesn't involve being force-fed my "beliefs". I had to start from scratch. I'm not looking for the legalism I left behind, but just a good way to figure out the boundaries of Scripture. I've spent 4 years off and on here, done a lot of reading, and bugged pastors with questions about their sermons and what I've been reading. The only one who hasn't been able to turn off the questions and discussions during this time is my husband:chained:, although he does fall asleep on me:coffee:

My observation, for whatever it's worth:2cents:, is that whatever one believes can be backed up by scripture and the confessions in some way. If we took everyone here on the PB and tried to match up those who held all the same beliefs; there wouldn't be any matches, except maybe husbands and wives. That's ok, but can I get one thing that everyone agrees on? Just one. A good functional definition for heresy. Who gets to decide what is heresy? How can you really say
Heresy is an error which puts one's salvation in jeopardy.
?
God is in charge of salvation, so can it ever really be in jeopardy?

I think that if I knew what heresy was then I'd be a lot less likely to float that direction. Trust me, I get some odd ideas at times. I know how to spot Baptist nutcases, but I wouldn't recognize a Presbyterian that was going off the deep end if I was in the boat with him or on shore watching.
 
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