DVD on Calvinism

[Peccant]

Hi Folks
from Bonnie (but secular) Scotland

I've heard recently about a DVD which has come out across the pond in the good ole US of A.
It's title is "Amazing Grace" The Theology and History of Calvinism."

Has anybody seen it .??
And is it worth getting.??

Have a Bless`ed day Y'all

 

[VirginiaHuguenot]

See this thread.

 

[ANT]

Yes, It's very good .... It's even easy to watch!

I ordered it and have had it for about 6 or 7 months now.

 

[BobVigneault]

It got mixed reviews here Grant. Some were very offended by the images of Christ in violation of the 2nd commandment. Dr. Matt had a problem with this and wrote a review of the dvd contained in this thread here:

http://www.puritanboard.com/forum/viewthread.php?tid=7582#pid111253

Others thought the dvd had merit. It was a good discussion.

 

[Arch2k]

I own the DVD and find it helpful in explaining Calvinism to newbies, but the 2nd commandment violations are completely unnecessary.

 

[Arch2k]

...and dissappointing

 

[SoldierOfTheRock]

The dvd's are great. (There are two discs.)

I did not have any problem with the second commandment while watching it. I normally do not have a big problem with that type of thing, unless of course it is being worshipped or being used to make fun of God or Christ.

It is worth it, it is not a short program, I am thinking over two hours. I especially enjoyed the history and the quotes from fathers in the faith.

All in all, it is good.

 

[heartoflesh]

I have it, and watched it once. I thought it was basically good, but am not sure it would be a good tool for introducing someone to the doctrines of grace. For instance, at one point it spends at least 5 minutes showing pictures of great Reformed leaders of the past....

"Charles Spurgeon"..... "J. Gresham" ..... "Cornelius Van Til", etc, etc,

I found this tedious and unneccessary. If I were a non-adherent I would not be impressed by this.

 

[Pilgrim]

It is quite good but very thorough, to the point of tedium at times, especially for those who are generally familiar with Calvinism's history and theology, etc.

I have to admit that I don't recall seeing pictures of Christ in the film, but that's likely because I was doing other things while watching it and so listened more than watched. However I do recall that most of the narrator's scenes were shot in a sanctuary that looked quite "high church" so perhaps that's where some of the imagery came in. I may have a vague recollection of stained glass windows. I would have to probably watch it again to give a better opinion. But since it's 4 hours +, I don't know when I'd have the opportunity to do so.

Unfortunately, the pictures of Christ/2nd Commandment issue doesn't appear to be on the radar screen for most Calvinists, even many who are in more or less Reformed churches. I don't want to step on any toes here, (and hope that I'm wrong here) but I find very few Baptists that have any concern whatsoever about this issue, or if they do, the ones I know oppose it on other grounds than that it being a violation of the commandment. Of course the same could be said about many in the more broadly evangelical wing of the PCA, EPC, etc.

 

[Peccant]

Thanks one and all for the comments.

I guess there is only one way I can make a judgment on it myself. That is to watch it.

God be with you.

 

[Ivan]

To those who have watched the DVD, is there a pastor on it by the name of Roger Ellsworth?

 

[Pilgrim]

Originally posted by Ivan
To those who have watched the DVD, is there a pastor on it by the name of Roger Ellsworth?

I don't think so. The following leaders are featured:

Dr. R.C. Sproul, Dr. D. James Kennedy, Dr. George Grant, Dr. Stephen Mansfield, Dr. Thomas Ascol, Dr. Thomas Nettles, Dr. Roger Schultz, Pastor Walt Chantry, Dr. Joe Morecraft, Dr. Ken Talbot, Pastor Walter Bowie and Dr. R.C. Sproul, Jr..

http://apologeticsgroup.com/ecommer...d=129&osCsid=41343a5a195ed233e01c0a782fa36e12

[Edited on 4-2-2006 by Pilgrim]

 

[Ivan]

Hmmm...maybe it's a different DVD. I know Roger knows Thomas Ascol and Thomas Nettles. I remember Nettles as a professor at Southwestern Baptist Thelogoical Seminary in Ft. Worth, Texas. He basically had to leave the seminary because of his beliefs.

 

[Pilgrim]

Originally posted by Ivan
Hmmm...maybe it's a different DVD. I know Roger knows Thomas Ascol and Thomas Nettles. I remember Nettles as a professor at Southwestern Baptist Thelogoical Seminary in Ft. Worth, Texas. He basically had to leave the seminary because of his beliefs.

I've seen a DVD on the Doctrines of Grace in Baptist life that features Nettles. Maybe Ellsworth was involved in that one.

 

[Pilgrim]

Here is the DVD I was thinking of "Baptists and the Doctrines of Grace". Looks like it contains two messages by Dr. Nettles.

http://www.founders.org/fpress/nettles_dvd.html

 

[bened]

Originally posted by Ivan
I remember Nettles as a professor at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Ft. Worth, Texas. He basically had to leave the seminary because of his beliefs.

Are you sure about that? He left for Mid-America before I was a student there. You may well be right but just curious as to how you came to that.

SWBTS was a pretty eclectic group of profs. They were good but just an interesting mix. I'll give two examples from my experience. I sat under a theology prof, Jeff Pool (sp) who's now at TCU's Bright Divinity School (i.e. liberal, disciples of Christ), last I checked. Dr. Pool was a kind, intelligent man as I recall. The other was the great Dr. Curtis Vaughan, New Testament prof extrodanaire, who was unashamedly calvinistic. I still recal the conviction in his voice and the grin on his face when he'd "digress" about "the doctrine" in second year greek class. (Seemed as if he had AT Robertson's huge grammar memorized. Millard Ericson, when he was a guest prof, called Dr. Vaughan "the great one" both in and outside of his classes. I've yet to see such a mixture of brilliance, graciousness and humility in one man. Wish all of this board could have known him).

My point in that little digression was that there was a melting pot of perspectives that made altogether for a middle of the road, conservative seminary. Though Dilday has shown himself to be a bitter, vitriolic man since his firing (though deserved) in '95, he seemed an able, if aloof, administrator that retained profs.

That said, it may be that he "encouraged" Bush and Nettles to go elsewhere. Both, especially Nettles, are doing well now at Southeastern and Southern seminaries respectively.

Oh, on topic, I have the dvd and agree that it is good and a bit tedious, but solid, nonetheless. I'll go back through it to look for 2nd Commandment infractions.



[Edited on 4-3-2006 by bened]

 

[Me Died Blue]

In addition to the second commandment violation, I thought a lot of the evangelism section was weak. Other than that, I thought it was definitely a well-made and well-presented study.

 

[Ivan]

Originally posted by bened

Originally posted by Ivan
I remember Nettles as a professor at Southwestern Baptist Theological Seminary in Ft. Worth, Texas. He basically had to leave the seminary because of his beliefs.

Are you sure about that? He left for Mid-America before I was a student there. You may well be right but just curious as to how you came to that.

SWBTS was a pretty eclectic group of profs. They were good but just an interesting mix. I'll give two examples from my experience. I sat under a theology prof, Jeff Pool (sp) who's now at TCU's Bright Divinity School (i.e. liberal, disciples of Christ), last I checked. Dr. Pool was a kind, intelligent man as I recall. The other was the great Dr. Curtis Vaughan, New Testament prof extrodanaire, who was unashamedly calvinistic. I still recal the conviction in his voice and the grin on his face when he'd "digress" about "the doctrine" in second year greek class. (Seemed as if he had AT Robertson's huge grammar memorized. Millard Ericson, when he was a guest prof, called Dr. Vaughan "the great one" both in and outside of his classes. I've yet to see such a mixture of brilliance, graciousness and humility in one man. Wish all of this board could have known him).

My point in that little digression was that there was a melting pot of perspectives that made altogether for a middle of the road, conservative seminary. Though Dilday has shown himself to be a bitter, vitriolic man since his firing (though deserved) in '95, he seemed an able, if aloof, administrator that retained profs.

That said, it may be that he "encouraged" Bush and Nettles to go elsewhere. Both, especially Nettles, are doing well now at Southeastern and Southern seminaries respectively.

Oh, on topic, I have the dvd and agree that it is good and a bit tedious, but solid, nonetheless. I'll go back through it to look for 2nd Commandment infractions.



[Edited on 4-3-2006 by bened]

The rumor at the time was that Nettles was tired of being nagged about his teaching. He was relatively young at the time and didn't have the position and status as did Vaughn.

I didn't have neither as a professor but I did attend a few of their classes just to listen to them, especially Vaughn. I think the bottom line is that Vaughn had the senority and the respect that a much younger Nettles didn't have at the time. I liked both of them very much. I thought the two of them were two of the best professors SWBTS had. Unfortunately, the time of their classes didn't work with my schedule. As with many seminary students I worked full-time and attended seminary full-time.

I did have Bush as a professor and although a very tough grader I gained a lot of insight from his teaching. He was (and I'm sure still is) a good one.

I attended from 1978 through 1981.

 

[bened]

Originally posted by Me Died Blue
In addition to the second commandment violation, I thought a lot of the evangelism section was weak. Other than that, I thought it was definitely a well-made and well-presented study.

How so? What in this section would you change and how would you change it?

Please don't my questions as an affront. I'm merely interested in your perspective so that I can deepen and improve my own. My church and community are full of folk who are cultural Christians but not biblical ones.
Especially prominent in this is the notion that an outward profession = biblical salvation even if there's no life change. And repentace is tantamount to "getting back in church." Hence, I'm looking for biblically-grounded ways to share the message and tear down this idol built upon the altar of easy-believism.

I think your thoughts, Chris, as well as those of others on this board, would greatly help me in this endeavor.

 

[Me Died Blue]

I honestly can't remember much of the specifics on that section, as it was the least memorable section of the three, and also since I only watched the film awhile back.

As I remember, though, in general I thought it resembled too much of the contemporary evangelical attitudes and tendencies to complicate and/or water-down the process of evangelism, as opposed to the plain teaching of the Gospel. Another weakness was that I thought it simply went on too long, as it could have answered the question of what place evangelism has in light of sovereignty in much less time than it did, even with still giving several answers.

But again, I'd have to go back and look again to be more specific. In general it didn't really bother me that much, especially since it was solely Holmberg and The Apologetics Group, rather than any of the more broadly known and representative voices.

 

[Pilgrim]

The evangelism portion was no more than a half hour, and the second disc is only about 45 minutes long in all.

I only saw it once, but I remember thinking the part with the man trying to sell books in the graveyard could have been cut down a little, although I suppose they felt the need to put it in for those who may have still been unconvinced of Total Depravity. The part where the guy starts stealing the scoffer's stuff after he rejects the gospel on typical postmodern relativistic grounds is an attempt to introduce presuppositionalism and expose moral relativism.

The Trinity Foundation apparently played some part in the production of this DVD, as they are given credit/thanks in the closing credits and Gordon Clark is mentioned favorably several times.

[Edited on 4-3-2006 by Pilgrim]