Is R.C Sproul Correct???

[AdventTruth]

Scott has it right. We are judicially free from sin because of the alien righteousness of Christ; we are justified extra nos (outside of us). Our guilt, however, remains. We're still guilty people, deserving of judgment, but we're justified in Christ.

This all relates to where the doctrines of justification, imputation, and Christ's representation of us before God meet.

Agreed. Robert Reymond explains some of this very well: "... one occasionally hears justification popularly defined as God 'looking at me just as if I'd never sinned.' This is an example of a (very) partial truth becoming virtually an untruth, since nothing is said in such a definition concerning the ground of justification or the instrumentality through which justification is obtained. Much more accurately, the Shorter Catechismm defines justification as 'an act of God's free grace, wheerein he pardoneth all our sins, and accepteth us as righteous in his sight, only for the righteousness of Christ, imputed to us, and received by faith alone...

... justification refers to God's wholly objective, wholly forensic judgment concerning the sinner's standing before the law, by which forensic judgment God declares that the sinnner is righteous in his sight because of the imputation of his sin to Christ, on which ground he is pardoned, and the imputation of Christ's perfect obedience to him, on which ground he is constituted righteous before God."

In a sense God doesn't ever clear the guilty. We are cleared on account of our standing in Christ or rather on account of the active obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted then not because our sins have been forgotten (deliberately or by accident) or because God has just made them disappear. Rather we are accepted on the basis of Christ's obedience wich is imputed to us who believe.

And here is the rub....you contradicted your self above. You say he never clears the guilty....but then gives the means by which the guilty are cleared....that means Being through Christ! So the guilty are cleared....through Christ.

 

[Scott1]

In a sense God doesn't ever clear the guilty. We are cleared on account of our standing in Christ or rather on account of the active obedience of Jesus Christ. We are accepted then not because our sins have been forgotten (deliberately or by accident) or because God has just made them disappear. Rather we are accepted on the basis of Christ's obedience wich is imputed to us who believe.

Hence, we understand what is meant by saying we are sinners saved by grace.

Not that we are not sinners, we are, but we are saved by Jesus Christ's perfect righteousness imputed to us, according to the plan of election decreed by our Triune God in eternity past.

In that, our God does not "wink at sin," or compromise His standard of perfect obedience. It is the perfection and excellency of our Lord's obedience, on our behalf that satisfies God's justice,
though we are, in ourselves, still sinners.

 

[stephen2]

And here is the rub....you contradicted your self above. You say he never clears the guilty....but then gives the means by which the guilty are cleared....that means Being through Christ! So the guilty are cleared....through Christ.

I think this may be moving beyond the intent of what RC Sproul meant to communicate. He and I and everyone would affirm that God pardons our sins. They are removed from us. In that sense there is nothing wrong with saying the guilty are cleared...

I believe Sproul is trying to highlight the fact that God cannot clear the guilty. Proverbs says as much and Paul explains that the very reason for Christ's death is that God might be just and the justifier of the wicked - and so Paul actually summarizes the gospel as the announcement of the righteousness of God: "Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference." God does not simply justify the wicked. Rather He justifies the righteous, and those who are by faith united to the Lord Jesus are counted righteous by virtue of their union with Him. In that sense HE doesn't clear the guilty. Rather their sins have been paid for and they are righteous by imputation.

 

[earl40]

We are cleared of guilt AS IF we never sinned as much as Jesus was punished AS IF He was a sinner.

 

[OPC'n]

I think everyone is right on how they are coming at this. We are sinners and will always be sinners till we die, and in that manner we are guilty of committing those sins for the day. However, we don't stand guilty before God because Christ paid for each and every sin of His people. Even my pastor didn't like how Sproul worded this and I really don't think he meant it the way it sounds. I think we've by now

 

[AdventTruth]

And here is the rub....you contradicted your self above. You say he never clears the guilty....but then gives the means by which the guilty are cleared....that means Being through Christ! So the guilty are cleared....through Christ.

I think this may be moving beyond the intent of what RC Sproul meant to communicate. He and I and everyone would affirm that God pardons our sins. They are removed from us. In that sense there is nothing wrong with saying the guilty are cleared...

I believe Sproul is trying to highlight the fact that God cannot clear the guilty. Proverbs says as much and Paul explains that the very reason for Christ's death is that God might be just and the justifier of the wicked - and so Paul actually summarizes the gospel as the announcement of the righteousness of God: "Even the righteousness of God which is by faith of Jesus Christ unto all and upon all them that believe: for there is no difference." God does not simply justify the wicked. Rather He justifies the righteous, and those who are by faith united to the Lord Jesus are counted righteous by virtue of their union with Him. In that sense HE doesn't clear the guilty. Rather their sins have been paid for and they are righteous by imputation.

"Hating all sin, God will by no means clear the guilty. In western Pennsylvania many years ago, I was asked to write ordination exams for ministerial candidates. Part of the exam covered the Westminster Confession, a section of which was true-false. Knowing how tricky true-false questions can be, I wanted to try out the exam before administering it to a candidate. I asked the ordained men if they would take the test (without putting their names on their papers). One question was this: "The only way God ever clears the guilty is through the atonement of Jesus Christ." Every single man marked that question true. I reminded them that the confession says that God will by no means (which includes the cross) clear the guilty. He redeems and saves the guilty, but he does not clear them. They are still guilty. It is only because of his grace, his most loving mercy, and his imputation of Christ's righteousness that God justifies us while we are still sinners."

I'm sorry, but reading Dr. Sproul's quote above seems to be saying as redeemed Believers in Christ we are still guilty. Is this not the case?