Question About Tithing...

[extolHIM]

Hey Guys...I have a bit of a complicated question about tithing. My wife and I have been going to an non-demoninational church the last 3 years that is somewhat of a Southern Baptist/AOG mix. We started going there before Christ saved me 2 1/2 years ago, and about a year and a half ago, the Holy Spirit opened my eyes through Scripture to the truths of the doctrines of grace. Anyways...we have been praying for wisdom and searching Scripture for some time now and feel that God is guiding us to leave our current church and find a Reformed Baptist church in our area. So currently, we are trying out 3 or 4 different churches. We are consistent tithers and our plan is to hold off tithing now until we find a church and then "catch up" with whatever church we end up joining. Ok, here's where it gets a little complicated. We have some friends that are going through some serious financial issues. They were planning on adopting and lost thousands of dollars (around $4,000, I believe) when the African country they were adopting from closed it's doors to adoption. We feel that our "brother" is in need and we don't think it's right to just stand if we have a chance to help. However, we are pretty tight ourselves at the moment and helping them out will definitely put an extra strain on us (we know that God can definitely overcome that, of course!). So my question is...is it wrong to use our tithe to help a brother and sister in need while we don't have a permanent church home, or would it only be right to use money above and beyond the tithe to help?

Opinions are great, but if anyone has an Scriptural advice, that is even more welcome. I think Deut. 15:7-11 and I John 3:17-18 speak strongly about helping brothers in need, but would our tithe be considered "the world's goods"?? I don't know if I'm stretching those passages too far by using our tithe in helping our friends.

Thoughts?

 

[Scott1]

What you are coming from, broadly evangelical with pentecostal influence:

Arminian influence + dispensational + no confession
.... + low view of church + low view of sacraments + ordinary case special revelation outside of scritpure

going toward:

Doctrines of grace + covenant theology + confession
+ high view of church + high view of sacraments + sola scriptura

First, seek peaceable dismissal from the current church, respectfully based on your major change of doctrine belief

Research in advance and know what church you are going to (e.g. do on-line reformed baptist church research, seek out references. If you are looking presbyterian reformed look at NAPARC directory).

You should be "tithing" wherever you are right now unless it cannot charitably be termed evangelical.

This is more opinion, some may not agree, and there is no exact biblical way to quantify this.... divert some portion (not most) of your tithe to directly support the Lord's work outside of the church you are accountable to. The majority of the tithe ought go where you are as long as some sort of evangelical church with believers in it.

More than you asked, but hopefully will orient toward principles that bring God Honor and Glory.

 

[Skyler]

Tithing isn't just about giving to the church; it's also about meeting the needs of our fellow believers. That was the reason the people in the early church sold their property and brought the money to the apostles--so they could meet the needs of the other believers. I don't see how you could argue that it's wrong to do so directly instead of through the intermediary of the church administration.

 

[rookie]

I agree with Skyler,

I would also go along with 2 Corinthians 9:7. I made the mistake of not tithing anymore at the church I went to recently because my heart wasn't in it anymore. And I was planning on leaving that church for another one, and gave up the tithing. Because I didn't see them using the money for the work of Christ, but to try to pay their hugely inflated mortgage on the new building, when an old one was completely paid for.

And they just kept spending money on useless things.

It was still people of God, no matter what my perspective was. But at the same time, I have seen my wife and I, on the odd occasion, hand out money to needing Christians directly as well.

Helping a Christian in need is not always just physically helping them, especially when they are in a bind.

 

[extolHIM]

Scott...yes, definitely a huge change is in store for our family. I have met with the pastor (who I've been friends with for 10 years), and he was completely understanding and very gracious and wished us the best. He knew of our belief differences and probably knew it was coming. We parted on very good terms. I found some reformed churches on the 9 marks site and we tried one last week, and have 2 or 3 others we plan on trying. There is one we tried last month that is 25-30 minutes away, but we really liked it a lot and they seem very sound, so despite the distance, we may end up there. I drive that distance to work, so that shouldn't be an excuse if we find a great church.

Anyways...I appreciate the advice so far. So you think we should tithe even to places we visit? I'm thinking I would prefer to at least know a good deal about the church and what they exactly stand for and whether we are going to join there before supporting them and their work for the Kingdom.

Skyler...hmmm...interesting point. Obviously, things were run a bit different back then, but I guess this could be seen as accomplishing the same thing, just skipping using the church as the conduit through which that money is flowing through...at least temporarily, and definitely not permanently.

 

[Skyler]

Thinking about this a bit more.

I believe I spoke hastily. Although I don't retract anything I said in my previous post, I don't think it necessarily represents a balanced picture. I do think that giving to brothers in need "counts" as a tithe, giving to the Lord, but I also don't want to encourage people to take it entirely into their own hands to decide how the money would be best used. The elders (or deacons) of the church are often aware of needs you are not. In general, I think it's a good idea to entrust the money to them and allow them to distribute it as would best benefit the body of Christ.

Kind of like a mutual fund. Almost.

Sort of.

 

[JBaldwin]

I take a more radical view of tithing, and I know there are folks who disagree with me. As I've read through the NT and looked at what Jesus said about money, I believe that under the new covenant

1. Our giving is not limited to 1/10. In fact, 1/10 is the minimu.
2. All that we have belongs to the Lord, and that giving to someone in the body of Christ is no different than giving to a church.
3. If we are in a church where we are comfortable giving, that is where our money should go.
4. Giving is not limited to money. Sometimes there is no money to give, but there is time, other posessions, etc. In some places, people don't have money, but they give in other ways.
5. When there is no church to give, there will probably be somewhere else where we can give, and in this case it is this family in need.

Personally, my husband and I struggled with this when we were in a liberal church for a short time. We withdrew all of our giving and both of us felt led to give to a ministry which purchased Bibles to take to Christians in places like China and Albania. We gave faithfully there until we were in a better church. We physically and spiritually saw God bless this.

 

[Scott1]

We parted on very good terms. I found some reformed churches on the 9 marks site and we tried one last week, and have 2 or 3 others we plan on trying. There is one we tried last month that is 25-30 minutes away, but we really liked it a lot and they seem very sound, so despite the distance, we may end up there.

extolHIM
Anyways...I appreciate the advice so far. So you think we should tithe even to places we visit? I'm thinking I would prefer to at least know a good deal about the church and what they exactly stand for and whether we are going to join there before supporting them and their work for the Kingdom.

In reformed theology, and this reflects biblical principle- one doesn't "leave" a church except by death, transfer or excommunication.

Granted, this is not common thinking, and especially does not reflect "broadly evangelical" teaching because there is implicitly a "low" view of the church, and by derivation, Christ's Body.

So, in an ordinary case at least, one stays at a home church, is committed to it, serves His people there, tithes there until death, transfer or excommunication. Transfer being a matter of substantial prayer, only for substantial reasons and respecting the process, as much as within your power, of the home church.

That would mean not leaving and then hoping to find a "better" church later, but only going to a church with the doctrine that caused you to leave the home church in the first place.

In ordinary cases, at least, shepherds would not just "let you go," but would rather want to transfer you to another branch of Christ's church, under their care and discipline.

So, in the situation you describe, and this may not be the whole story, you didn't really transfer to another church, but you are "floating" which ought not be.

This does not release someone from "tithing", any more than from taking the sacraments, etc. ("Tithe" used advisedly, it's really a principle of first fruits giving as a testimony of God's ownership over everything, and not under the Levitical "tithe" laws- but that was not your post topic, so the term is used as you are using it here).

You can see part of the difficulty-
without a church to which you are accountable, which you are supporting with your tithes, service, and prayers, you feel you can prioritize giving outside of it.

That's not the way it is in the Kingdom of God.

May God help us all to see His Body and He sees it, and value it.

 

[Peairtach]

In tithing we are following the pattern of our patriarchal forbears Abraham and Jacob; we are not under the tithing laws of the Old Covenant period.

Communicant members are voluntarily entering into a commitment with God to tithe as Abraham and Jacob did. Melchisedec and the Lord did not ask Abraham and Jacob to tithe but they volunteered it.

Different people have different ideas about whether the tithe - or all of it - should go to the institutional church or not, and whether it should be before or after tax, etc. You can work these things out for yourself before God using the general principles of the Word. Although tithing is an important principle (e.g. Malachi) maybe the Lord doesn't expect us to get too tied in knots about these things.

But woe to you Pharisees! For you tithe mint and rue and every herb, and neglect justice and the love of God. These you ought to have done, without neglecting the others.(Luke 11:42, ESV)

 

[Jack K]

One of the good things about giving to whatever is your local church, rather than picking and choosing what specific ministries and needy people you like best, is that you are fully giving to God—including giving up control of how your money will be disbursed.

Every situation has its unique circumstances. But I do believe you should factor in the idea that while you are certainly supposed to choose a good church, it may not be your prerogative to think you ought to be able to choose where the offering due to your church gets spent, nor your prerogative to divert it if you're unhappy with your church's direction. I'm not sure that's a hard-and-fast rule, but it's the sort of thinking we generally would do well to avoid.

Now, giving generously beyond that to all sorts of good causes is another matter in which you do have a right to choose.

 

[elnwood]

[BIBLE]Deuteronomy 14:24-27[/BIBLE]

If the law had allowance to spend their tithe on food and drink for the glory of God, then by all means, help your friends in need!

 

[extolHIM]

Greatly appreciate all the advice everyone! Would love to respond individually, but running kinda short on time. The church we were going to did not have "membership", so I'm not sure how a "transfer" of membership would work. I feel like having our pastor's blessing is sufficient and the reason was definitely substantial. We prayed and searched Scripture over the decision for months. We absolutely believe that even though a tithe is usually considered 10%, that that is definitely a minimum, and we should give cheerfully and liberally to the Lord's work through our local church. This we always do and have no plans of not giving back to the Lord from our first fruits as soon as we find a local body to join. We just feel that continuing to give to a church that we don't attend and that doesn't teach sound doctrine, is not the best use of the financial blessings the Lord has given us. So....from what I can tell, it doesn't seem to be prohibited in Scripture to do what we are considering doing and it's something that would only be a one time thing and only to help our a brother and sister in Christ.

 

[Jack K]

Greatly appreciate all the advice everyone! Would love to respond individually, but running kinda short on time. The church we were going to did not have "membership", so I'm not sure how a "transfer" of membership would work. I feel like having our pastor's blessing is sufficient and the reason was definitely substantial. We prayed and searched Scripture over the decision for months. We absolutely believe that even though a tithe is usually considered 10%, that that is definitely a minimum, and we should give cheerfully and liberally to the Lord's work through our local church. This we always do and have no plans of not giving back to the Lord from our first fruits as soon as we find a local body to join. We just feel that continuing to give to a church that we don't attend and that doesn't teach sound doctrine, is not the best use of the financial blessings the Lord has given us. So....from what I can tell, it doesn't seem to be prohibited in Scripture to do what we are considering doing and it's something that would only be a one time thing and only to help our a brother and sister in Christ.

You seem to have thought through a sometwhat unique situation, trying to both apply biblical principles and honor God. You've come up with a reasonable solution. So having considered it carefully, feel free to go with that solution and don't burden yourself further with wondering whether or not it is the very best solution. What you are doing is a good thing that shows your desire to serve God and his church.