Selling Indulgences Again
- Thread starter gcdugas
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Polanus1561
Puritan Board Senior
dsanch1120
Puritan Board Sophomore
There’s gotta be a better way to start a reformation in the church..
gcdugas
Puritan Board Freshman
Martin Luther labored under immense guilt and put himself through incredible pains and straits seeking to assuage his abiding guilt. Bunyan's Pilgrim similarly was ever conscious of his "burden of sin" and obsessed with getting rid of it. John says: "he that believeth not the Son shall not see life; but the wrath of God abideth on him." But today that burden is obscured, denied and falsely salved with numbing philosophies, deceitful lies, countenanced atheism, pagan religions and imposter "Christianity". There is no fear of God in our land. Homos parade their sin as Sodom, the courts are filled with false witnesses, and for everyone that feels even a twinge of guilt for a short second, there are ten smooth talking hucksters preaching greasy grace and easy-believeism on every corner and on every other channel of the TV and radio. No one goes to hell and God is everyone's buddy. Anyone that dares to preach God's holy and righteous standard is immediately denounced as a legalist, overly harsh, an enemy of grace, mean spirited etc. No wonder that the churches are filled with false converts. Through the Law comes the knowledge of sin. And we seldom hear the Law proclaimed anywhere these days.
'Twas grace that taught my heart to fear, and grace my fears relieved. Well I ask, where is the grace that teaches our hearts to fear? Where is it proclaimed today? This is why I provocatively titled this thread as I did. We DO need to get back to the place where the market value for indulgences are considerable though they are forever illegitimate. Today, I'm sad to say, the market price for an indulgence is ZERO because the fear of God is ZERO.
'Twas grace that taught my heart to fear, and grace my fears relieved. Well I ask, where is the grace that teaches our hearts to fear? Where is it proclaimed today? This is why I provocatively titled this thread as I did. We DO need to get back to the place where the market value for indulgences are considerable though they are forever illegitimate. Today, I'm sad to say, the market price for an indulgence is ZERO because the fear of God is ZERO.
psycheives
Puritan Board Freshman
This is actually quite a good point and I like your point and your quote: "No one goes to hell and God is everyone's buddy."
When I show others the Westminster Larger Catechism breakdown of the 10 commandments, they are stunned. I am stunned! Not only the negative aspect of the law but the positive! How greatly we fall short! Especially 9th commandment for those of us who like to argue about theological accuracy and easily slide into bashing Christian brothers. A return to studying the deeper meaning of the 10 commandments would certainly do a lot of good for Christians (and society but that's a pretty lost cause as more lawlessness is embraced every passing year).
Really, who hasn't sinned many times every day they are on social media with a list like this when discussing your least liked Christian teacher:
Q. 143. Which is the ninth commandment?
A. The ninth commandment is, Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.839
A. The ninth commandment is, Thou shalt not bear false witness against thy neighbor.839
Q. 144. What are the duties required in the ninth commandment?
A. The duties required in the ninth commandment are, the preserving and promoting of truth between man and man,840 and the good name of our neighbour, as well as our own;841 appearing and standing for the truth;842 and from the heart,843 sincerely,844 freely,845 clearly,846 and fully,847 speaking the truth, and only the truth, in matters of judgment and justice,848 and in all other things whatsoever;849 a charitable esteem of our neighbours;850 loving, desiring, and rejoicing in their good name;851 sorrowing for,852 and covering of their infirmities;853 freely acknowledging of their gifts and graces,854 defending their innocency;855 a ready receiving of a good report,856 and unwillingness to admit of an evil report,857 concerning them; discouraging tale-bearers,858 flatterers,859 and slanderers;860 love and care of our own good name, and defending it when need requireth;861 keeping of lawful promises;86 2 studying and practicing of whatsoever things are true, honest, lovely, and of good report.863
A. The duties required in the ninth commandment are, the preserving and promoting of truth between man and man,840 and the good name of our neighbour, as well as our own;841 appearing and standing for the truth;842 and from the heart,843 sincerely,844 freely,845 clearly,846 and fully,847 speaking the truth, and only the truth, in matters of judgment and justice,848 and in all other things whatsoever;849 a charitable esteem of our neighbours;850 loving, desiring, and rejoicing in their good name;851 sorrowing for,852 and covering of their infirmities;853 freely acknowledging of their gifts and graces,854 defending their innocency;855 a ready receiving of a good report,856 and unwillingness to admit of an evil report,857 concerning them; discouraging tale-bearers,858 flatterers,859 and slanderers;860 love and care of our own good name, and defending it when need requireth;861 keeping of lawful promises;86 2 studying and practicing of whatsoever things are true, honest, lovely, and of good report.863
Q. 145. What are the sins forbidden in the ninth commandment?
A. The sins forbidden in the ninth commandment are, all prejudicing the truth, and the good name of our neighbours, as well as our own,864 especially in public judicature;865 giving false evidence,866 suborning false witnesses,867 wittingly appearing and pleading for an evil cause, outfacing and overbearing the truth;868 passing unjust sentence,869 calling evil good, and good evil; rewarding the wicked according to the work of the righteous, and the righteous according to the work of the wicked;870 forgery,871 concealing the truth, undue silence in a just cause,872 and holding our peace when iniquity calleth for either a reproof from ourselves,873 or complaint to others;874 speaking the truth unseasonably,875 or maliciously to a wrong end,876 or perverting it to a wrong meaning,877 or in doubtful and equivocal expressions, to the prejudice of truth or justice;878 speaking untruth,879 lying,880 slandering,881 backbiting,882 detracting,[882a] tale bearing,883 whispering,884 scoffing,885 reviling,886 rash,887 harsh,888 and partial censuring;889 misconstructing intentions, words, and actions;890 flattering,891 vain-glorious boasting;892 thinking or speaking too highly or too meanly of ourselves or others;893 denying the gifts and graces of God;894 aggravating smaller faults;895 hiding, excusing, or extenuating of sins, when called to a free confession;896 unnecessary discovering of infirmities;897 raising false rumors,898 receiving and countenancing evil reports,899 and stopping our ears against just defense;900 evil suspicion;901 envying or grieving at the deserved credit of any,902 endeavoring or desiring to impair it,903 rejoicing in their disgrace and infamy;904 scornful contempt,905 fond admiration;906 breach of lawful promises;907 neglecting such things as are of good report,908 and practicing, or not avoiding ourselves, or not hindering what we can in others, such things as procure an ill name.909
A. The sins forbidden in the ninth commandment are, all prejudicing the truth, and the good name of our neighbours, as well as our own,864 especially in public judicature;865 giving false evidence,866 suborning false witnesses,867 wittingly appearing and pleading for an evil cause, outfacing and overbearing the truth;868 passing unjust sentence,869 calling evil good, and good evil; rewarding the wicked according to the work of the righteous, and the righteous according to the work of the wicked;870 forgery,871 concealing the truth, undue silence in a just cause,872 and holding our peace when iniquity calleth for either a reproof from ourselves,873 or complaint to others;874 speaking the truth unseasonably,875 or maliciously to a wrong end,876 or perverting it to a wrong meaning,877 or in doubtful and equivocal expressions, to the prejudice of truth or justice;878 speaking untruth,879 lying,880 slandering,881 backbiting,882 detracting,[882a] tale bearing,883 whispering,884 scoffing,885 reviling,886 rash,887 harsh,888 and partial censuring;889 misconstructing intentions, words, and actions;890 flattering,891 vain-glorious boasting;892 thinking or speaking too highly or too meanly of ourselves or others;893 denying the gifts and graces of God;894 aggravating smaller faults;895 hiding, excusing, or extenuating of sins, when called to a free confession;896 unnecessary discovering of infirmities;897 raising false rumors,898 receiving and countenancing evil reports,899 and stopping our ears against just defense;900 evil suspicion;901 envying or grieving at the deserved credit of any,902 endeavoring or desiring to impair it,903 rejoicing in their disgrace and infamy;904 scornful contempt,905 fond admiration;906 breach of lawful promises;907 neglecting such things as are of good report,908 and practicing, or not avoiding ourselves, or not hindering what we can in others, such things as procure an ill name.909
MyCrows
Puritan Board Sophomore
"What a day! Take hell. Take heaven. Take sin. Take salvation. Children’s games. Most of what we think and do are diversions from a real hell to which all out of Christ are moving steadily and moving relentlessly. No doubt, horror books and movies are popular with many because they are fictional substitutes for their discarded real hell. In comparison with the real hell, Stephen King’s most frightening tales are amusing. Christ tells us most about hell. and He is the one we use to assure ourselves that there is no hell. The true Jesus warns us that if we do not repent we will surely perish, but He is made to say that God is our heavenly Father whether we repent or not, whether we are true Christians or not."
Excerpt from an article by John H. Gerstner
Excerpt from an article by John H. Gerstner
TheInquirer
Puritan Board Junior
Absolutely agree with you on a lack of fear of God. It may be the biggest problem in our society (can’t think of one to go higher on the list at the moment). Need more hellfire preaching and evangelism - most Christians I know are too afraid to talk about hell. What good is a message of salvation if people don’t know what they are saved from?
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