Originally posted by Paul manata
Re: Bahnsen. I'd have to look at it in context. My point, which you showed nicely, is that people have specticles on and are so fired up to see error in others and read what they want into them. It may be that Bahnsen's quote is similar to this kind of stuff:
RPCUS: "That the denial of the distinction of visible and invisible church and the introduction of an historical and eschatological church, opens the door to new and mystical meanings being applied to the Lord's Supper that are sacerdotal in orientation; makes justification an eschatological process instead of a definitive legal act; obscures the reality and necessity of the new birth; and corrupts the Gospel preaching by eliminating the call to repentance and faith within the congregation"
HERETIC #1: "Two reservations have to be made. The first is a question as to the felicity or even propriety of the term 'invisible' to give expression to such considerations. There are liabilities that can be avoided if other terms are employed. The second is more than reservation. The distinction between the church visible and the church invisible is not well-grounded in terms of Scripture, and the abuses to which the distinction has been subjected require correction." [1]
RPCUS: "Any doctrine that denies the Covenant of Works is contrary to the Bible and the Westminster Standards"
HERETIC #2: "The idea that any covenant God makes with man can ever be anything other than a covenant of grace is wrong and deadly wrong" [2]
RPCUS: "Any doctrine of justification that teaches that justification is a process beginning with baptism which is contingent upon continual obedience to the Law of God, which can be lost by apostasy, and which is not completed until Judgment Day is contrary to the Bible and the Westminster Standards"
HERETIC #3: "Perseverance in faith is, in one sense, the condition of justification; that is, the promise of acceptance is made only to a persevering sort of faith; and the proper evidence of its being that sort is actual perseverance "¦"; "For the just shall live by faith. It seems to be because continuance in faith is necessary to continuance in justification, at least in part, that the apostle expresses himself as he does "¦"; "Perseverance is acknowledged by Calvinian divines to be necessary to salvation. Yet it seems to me, that the manner in which it is necessary has not been sufficiently set forth. It is owned to be necessary as a sine qua non: and also, that though it is not that by which we first come to have a title to eternal life, yet it is necessary in order to the actual possession of it, as the way to it "¦; But we are really saved by perseverance; so that salvation has a dependence on perseverance, as that which influences in the affair, so as to render it congruous that we should be saved. Faith (on our part) is the great condition of salvation; it is that by which we are justified and saved. But in this faith, the perseverance that belongs to it is a fundamental ground of the congruity that faith gives to salvation. Perseverance indeed comes into consideration, even in the justification of a sinner, as one thing on which the fitness of acceptance to life depends." [3]
RPCUS: "Any doctrine of justification that defines faith as faithful obedience to God is contrary to the Bible and the Westminster Standards", and "In essence, Mr. Shepherd and his followers hold forth teachings that blur the distinction between justification and sanctification and amount to a salvation by faith plus works."
HERETIC #4: "Here faith and works are identical. Not similar, but identical. The work is faith; faith is work. We believe in Jesus Christ and in His salvation, that's why we do not tremble "¦ Well now you see that faith alone is not alone. Faith is not alone. Faith always has an object. The faith, your act of believing, is pointed definitely to God in Jesus Christ, and by the regeneration of the Holy Spirit, and conversion, it's all one "¦ And that's why we have to be satisfied merely to do what the Scriptures and Confessions say that we ought to do, and that then we are on the way, and I think that Norman Shepherd is certainly in the line of direct descent on faith."[4]
AND
HERETIC #5: "Modern interpreters who don't like what I am suggesting and what Professor Shepherd is suggesting end up saying that to justify in James 2 really means "to demonstrate justification," not to "demonstrate righteousness." That is, they make the word to justify mean "to justify the fact that I'm justified." And the word never means that. That's utterly contrived. It means either "to declare righteous" or "to demonstrate righteous." It does not mean, "to justify that one's justified." Am I making myself clear? I'm suggesting that the reason Paul and James are not contrary to one another is because the only kind of faith that will justify us is working faith, and the only kind of justification ever presented in the Bible after the Fall is a justification by working faith, a faith that receives its merit from God and proceeds to work as a regenerated, new person"[5]
RPCUS: "Any doctrine of baptism that teaches that all who are baptized with water are by that baptism incorporated into Christ and are recipients of all the benefits of Christ's accomplished work is contrary to the Bible and the Westminster Standards", and "Any doctrine of baptism that explains water baptism as the moment in which we are regenerated or as the point of transfer from death to life is contrary to Scripture and the Westminster Standards"
HERETIC #6: "Almighty God, heavenly Father, we give you eternal praise and thanks that you have granted and bestowed upon this child your fellowship, that you have born him again to yourself through holy baptism, that he has been incorporated into your beloved son, and is now your child and heir "¦" [6]
AND
HERETIC #7: "And so we utterly condemn the vanity of those who affirm the sacraments to be nothing else than naked and bare signs. No, we assuredly believe that by baptism we are engrafted into Christ Jesus, to be made partakers of his righteousness, by which our sins are covered and remitted." [7]
AND
HERETIC #8: "Grant that this child now to be baptized, may receive the fullness of thy grace and ever remain in the number of the faithful and elect children through Jesus Christ our Lord "¦" AND "Seeing now, dearly beloved, that that this child is regenerate and grafted into the body of Christ's church, let us give thanks unto God Almighty "¦"[8]
AND
HERETIC #9: "We must realize that at whatever time we are baptized, we are once for all washed and purged for our whole life. Therefore, as often as we fall away, we ought to recall the memory of our baptism and fortify our mind with it, that we may always be sure and confident of the forgiveness of sins." "¦ "It is a thing out of all controversy true, that we put on Christ in baptism, and were baptized on this very ground, that we should be one with Him."[9] AND "But as baptism is a solemn recognition by which God introduces His children in to the possession of life, a true and effectual sealing of the promise, a pledge of sacred union with Christ, it is justly said to be the entrance and reception into the Church."[10]
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Wow - Nine heretics, condemned by their own words, and their own writings. If you are up on current Reformed factions, you have likely placed your picks up and down the list of quotes as belonging to the likes of Pastors Steve Schlissel, Doug Wilson, Steve Wilkins, John Barach, and even Norman Shepherd. If you are a critic of the "New Perspective on Paul", you may think some of these quotes fit somewhere into that mindset (i.e. perhaps we have some N.T. Wright answers out there). You may even be real astute, and believe this is clearly the work of some Roman Catholic scholars (surely hell bound).
Well, NAME THAT TUNE is a difficult game, and if you did, indeed, answer as I suspect above, NAME THAT HERETIC is apparently an even more difficult game. Consider our answer key, directly corresponding to the "number" assigned to the "heretic".
1. John Murray
2. R.J. Rushdoony
3. Jonathan Edwards
4. Cornelius Van Til
5. Gregory L. Bahnsen
6. Martin Bucer
7. John Knox
8. Thomas Cramer
9. John Calvin
