Help in understanding certain Sprititual gifts

[wmc1982]

I used to go to a Charismatic church where the gift of tongues was believed to still be applicable to today's church (no one used it in church, but at personal devotion). I've been a reformed believer for a while now, but I don't understand the split between churches in believing that gifts such as prophesy and tongues still exist or not.

I used to "speak in tongues" (only in deep prayer by myself when it came out on its own) a few years ago, but I always stop myself when it starts to happen because it seems that Reformed theology (or at least my church) doesn't agree with it. And I am afraid of doing something that goes against God's Spirit (like blasphemy). I haven't done this in about 2 years and it doesn't come up that often. But I feel like I need to know if this is from God or the devil.

I see how so many charismatic and pentecostal churches fall into obsessing over the emotional. But can these gifts be real today and be used responsibly in the church?

Is there a specific yes or no answer given in Biblical text?

 

[KMK]

You will find a variety of answers to your question here on PB, but one thing is for sure, if you are talking about 'tongues' as 'new revelation' then those who hold to the Reformed confessions say they are not from God.

LBC 1:6 The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down or necessarily contained in the Holy Scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelation of the Spirit, or traditions of men...

But if you are talking about some kind of 'tongues' that is an 'inner illumination' of the HS, then you might find some Refomded confession holders who say that it could be of God.

LBC 1:6 ...Nevertheless, we acknowledge the inward illumination of the Spirit of God to be necessary for the saving understanding of such things as are revealed in the Word, and that there are some circumstances concerning the worship of God, and government of the church, common to human actions and societies, which are to be ordered by the light of nature and Christian prudence, according to the general rules of the Word, which are always to be observed.

I hope this is helpful.

BTW, is there any possibility that the 'tongues' you experienced is neither of God or the devil, but just you doing what you were told by your pastor?

 

[wmc1982]

You will find a variety of answers to your question here on PB, but one thing is for sure, if you are talking about 'tongues' as 'new revelation' then those who hold to the Reformed confessions say they are not from God.

LBC 1:6 The whole counsel of God concerning all things necessary for his own glory, man's salvation, faith and life, is either expressly set down or necessarily contained in the Holy Scripture: unto which nothing at any time is to be added, whether by new revelation of the Spirit, or traditions of men...

But if you are talking about some kind of 'tongues' that is an 'inner illumination' of the HS, then you might find some Refomded confession holders who say that it could be of God.

LBC 1:6 ...Nevertheless, we acknowledge the inward illumination of the Spirit of God to be necessary for the saving understanding of such things as are revealed in the Word, and that there are some circumstances concerning the worship of God, and government of the church, common to human actions and societies, which are to be ordered by the light of nature and Christian prudence, according to the general rules of the Word, which are always to be observed.

I hope this is helpful.

BTW, is there any possibility that the 'tongues' you experienced is neither of God or the devil, but just you doing what you were told by your pastor?

Thanks for responding, it was helpful. I never thought anything was new revelation with tongues. In the book of Acts, I remember some "prophets" telling Paul not to go somewhere on his missionary journey, and he ends up going a different direction. Was this considered divine revelation?

It was recorded there in the account of Acts but it would seem that many revelations that led people to different destinations or directions must of occurred in that time that weren't recorded in the Bible. So isn't much of God's Word not in the Bible?


You make a good point, that the 'tongues' could have been from neither, but from my pastor (or other influences I was around such as our youth group going to Brownsville, Florida one year where all that stuff was around).

I'm just don't want to offend God either way and these questions seem hard to find clear and concrete answers for.

 

[Davidius]

I used to be a charismatic as well. One of the biggest realizations I had was that a private spiritual gift (one used to edify oneself when alone) is an oxymoron. The gifts were for the building up of the Church.

 

[wmc1982]

I used to be a charismatic as well. One of the biggest realizations I had was that a private spiritual gift (one used to edify oneself when alone) is an oxymoron. The gifts were for the building up of the Church.

but is the church in no longer need of those spiritual gifts?

It seems that Paul used tongues in private devotion to help develop him to be able to preach. I think our private devotions can often help in strengthening our usefulness in the church.

 

[NaphtaliPress]

Glossolalia happens in other religions, mystics, etc.; they are not known tongues which is what the gift was in the NT.

 

[wmc1982]

I thought Paul spoke in glossolalia

(from my understanding in "Paul: Apostle of the Heart Set Free. by FF Bruce")

 

[NaphtaliPress]

The gift of NT Tongues are in known languages. I believe this was and is the Reformed interpretation (John Lightfoot, etc).

 

[MW]

And I am afraid of doing something that goes against God's Spirit (like blasphemy).

It is this very real possibility which led the apostle Paul to insist that all communication about the Lord Jesus Christ be in language that can be discerned for its content (1 Cor. 12-14). The idea of a person praying to God or teaching others, and saying he knows not what, is counter to the revelation-centred faith which is fundamental to Christianity.

 

[rescuedbyLove]

Is there a specific yes or no answer given in Biblical text?

no.

 

[wmc1982]

Thank you NP and AB with your last two comments. I'm seriously taking a look on both of your posts right now

 

[kalawine]

I used to go to a Charismatic church where the gift of tongues was believed to still be applicable to today's church (no one used it in church, but at personal devotion). I've been a reformed believer for a while now, but I don't understand the split between churches in believing that gifts such as prophesy and tongues still exist or not.

I used to "speak in tongues" (only in deep prayer by myself when it came out on its own) a few years ago, but I always stop myself when it starts to happen because it seems that Reformed theology (or at least my church) doesn't agree with it. And I am afraid of doing something that goes against God's Spirit (like blasphemy). I haven't done this in about 2 years and it doesn't come up that often. But I feel like I need to know if this is from God or the devil.

I was a Charismatic for about ten years. I spoke in my "prayer language" in private every day during those years. There is no doubt that you will soon be getting a lot of good theological answers on this subject from the guys on this board and I can give you some good ones myself. But for now I'd like to throw something at you that is more experiential. Though it is true that Sola Scriptura is what we hold to and it is also true that we cannot always trust our experiences and/or feelings to learn truth, it is also true that the Bible teaches us that we have a God-given conscience.

Romans 9:1a
I speak the truth in Christ—I am not lying, my conscience confirms it in the Holy Spirit—

Romans 14:23b
and everything that does not come from faith is sin.

It was long before I became a Reformed believer that I began to struggle deep in my heart (conscience) with the idea that my "prayer language" was not from God. I think that I knew "instinctively"... (Boy, if you knew me and my complete story you would know how badly I hate using words like "feelings" and "instinct") but I think I knew instictively that I was born again (before I became a Charismatic) and that I did not have a "tongue" from Satan. In my humble opinion the only thing satanic about the "prayer language" is that it is false. (LOL As if that weren't enough!)
Your case may be different than mine was but I believe it is the same. The Lord is graciously leading you out of that naive stage (PLT!) of your faith and into the historical faith of the Reformers.

You will NEVER blaspheme the Holy Spirit by questioning some experience that you have had whether it came from God or not. The Pharasees were blaspheming the Holy Spirit in the only passage of Scripture that I know of that mentions such a blasphemy. The Pharsees and Saducees and teachers of the Law knew that Jesus was a "teacher come from God."

John 3:1&2
1Now there was a man of the Pharisees named Nicodemus, a member of the Jewish ruling council. 2He came to Jesus at night and said, "Rabbi, we know you are a teacher who has come from God. For no one could perform the miraculous signs you are doing if God were not with him."

Despite this knowledge they claimed that he was possessed by the devil.

Mark 3:22-33

22And the teachers of the law who came down from Jerusalem said, "He is possessed by Beelzebub[c]! By the prince of demons he is driving out demons."

23So Jesus called them and spoke to them in parables: "How can Satan drive out Satan? 24If a kingdom is divided against itself, that kingdom cannot stand. 25If a house is divided against itself, that house cannot stand. 26And if Satan opposes himself and is divided, he cannot stand; his end has come. 27In fact, no one can enter a strong man's house and carry off his possessions unless he first ties up the strong man. Then he can rob his house. 28I tell you the truth, all the sins and blasphemies of men will be forgiven them. 29But whoever blasphemes against the Holy Spirit will never be forgiven; he is guilty of an eternal sin."

30He said this because they were saying, "He has an evil spirit."

Questioning whether or not something is from God is not blasphemy. I believe that blasphemy of the Holy Spirit is knowingly calliong the work of the Holy Spirit, the work of Satan. (I'm not even sure that it can still be done since Jesus has left to be with the Father) The more you move into the Reformed faith the more you will question many things that you used to believe. It's fun actually. Relax and enjoy the ride! Take it from an ex-tongue-talking, pew-jumping fanatic.

BTW I may upset some "Reformed Charismatics" by saying this, but when I was a member of a Yahoo group (no longer around) called "ExCharisma" I was trying to turn to Reformed belief and still keep one foot in Charismaina (Sound harsh? I almost typed Sodom). When I first discovered John Piper I wanted the guys at ExCharisma to tell me why we couldn't be Reformed and Charismatic (Piper - though I respect him - leans that way a triffle). One of the wisest things I ever heard from ExCharisma came from moderator Robin Arnaud. Robin said (I'm paraphrasing), "Kevin, Piper hasn't been where we have or seen what we've seen." And you know what? Robin is probably right.

 

[kalawine]

BTW, is there any possibility that the 'tongues' you experienced is neither of God or the devil, but just you doing what you were told by your pastor?

KMK, I agree with everything you said on your post. Also, I forgot to say in my previous post that I believe that my "tongues" were psychosomatic. I was "coerced" by a book I was given.