To Sabbatarians: What is the Pastoral response to those who can't keep the Sabbath?

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In my opinion, the sabbath issue will always come down to personal conscience. Conscience is based on wisdom. Wisdom comes from the Lord. All of us know what is a breech on the sabbath (as God has given us that wisdom). I do not burden myself on the Lord's day-I see it as a pleasure and a grace. The sabbath was made for man and not man for the sabbath. I try and keep my thoughts on the Lord, his mercy and grace, read and study his word, rest from the tiring week. If my daughter is playing a game on her phone, I do not 'crack' her for it, but point her to a more profitable time spent. If someone in my household is doing something typical that can be done the other 6 days of the week, I remind them that God has given freedom from such mundane tasks on His day and I do so, graciously and tenderly; with patience.

None of us keep the day as we should. Wandering thoughts would be sinful...not redeeming the time and such. None of us love the Lord with all our hearts, mind, soul and strength. Maybe we should focus more on that than items we should avoid. The day is a day of peace and quiet in the Lord. It is not a burden and shouldn't be.

Lastly, I have not always been in this place. MY church takes the continental view (as Lynnie has mentioned about the PCA). I don't point my fingers at anyone. We are works in progress and the HS is faithful. Lets leave it to Him.
 
Who does that? I love "the Lord his Day," as they used to call it in New England.
I know plenty of folks who make the Sabbath a dreary exercise in strictness. They turn the Sabbath into a distasteful duty instead of a privilege.

I think a better approach is called for; we must call out the privileges of the day, a full day of rest and comfort in the Lord. God has loved us so much that He guards His time with us and puts guards around it so that we can enjoy him.

I remember as a kid my dad FORBIDDING me from doing homework once he got home from work. This was so that we could go walking or play together. Homework was a dreary task, but I felt I had to do it. Some schools are terrrible about homework. My dad freed me from that thought and preserved a definite cut of time for himself (and my grades never really suffered because I learned not to waste my school time but used it well for school work so that I could have home time).

The Sabbath is like this act of love from my Dad. He loves us and so preserves the best cut of time for Himself.
 
It may mean the OP is not Confessional in his views, but it does not make him guilty of sin if his own conscience does not condemn him.
Tyler, I have always heard church discipline referred to as reserved for scandalous sins that lead to excommunication if not repented of. I appreciate you clarifying, but I would use words like correct or exhort if it is a matter of the church's doctrinal position, as opposed to clear unmistakable immorality or slander or crime and so forth.

I don't understand you guys throwing around the word discipline. I have been in two PCA churches myself in my life and I loved the pastors and the people. But I never saw so many exceptions to Confessional Sabbath keeping in my life among elders. There is less where I go now (Baptist Calvinist) than in the PCA. What, are you going to tell me the entire PCA needs to be put under discipline for all the presbyteries that don't agree with Confessional standards? I seriously- I am not exaggerating- did not know a single PCA elder who didn't take an exception on the Sabbath. I am no great Sabbath keeper here according to some of you (I have watched a DVD Sunday night and folded wash when it got to the point of the ox falling into a well with the wash baskets) but even I could not figure out why men even wanted to be PCA elders if they had these exceptions to the sabbath and claimed to be confessional.

Myson the OP is in the PCA. I think you could appeal to him to change his view, or go to the OPC or whatever, but I don't think anybody has the right to use the word discipline in this situation. Not for PCA people.

Anyway, going back to the subject itself, when I read Gaffin's book and he carefully lays out the continental view, and quotes all sorts of Reformed guys, it was pretty impressive and I could not for the life of me figure out how he could debate it. But then he carefully laid out why he thinks the Sabbath is still binding upon us and by the time he was done I thought he won the debate.

But having said that, discipline is for sin and error, it is not for views that are within the realm of orthodoxy. The Continental view is like Arminians who you might want to engage in extended debate with, but it isn't like Joyce Meyer lovers bringing word of faith teachings that are literally a different gospel. Continental views are not a different gospel or a sin, they are just one more thing that Machen's warrior children fight about. I think you have every right at PB to insist on holding to the Confessional Puritan view, but there is nobody who holds to the Continental view who thinks "thou shalt not kill" was abrogated. You can't equate the two in light of our Reformed church history. You can argue and debate and set the rules of the board here, but I think Myson has been too harshly treated by some.

Hey Myson.....the Gaffin book might help you think it all through without condemnation and rebuke. "Calvin and the Sabbath".

My son took a manager job at CVS with the presupposition that he went to church every Sunday. After a month people quit, sometimes he was the only guy to do pharmacy, and before long he worked almost every Sunday for a year, plus a lot of evenings. He had a wife and rent and school loans and bills to pay. We just kept telling him that the Lord could get him another job even in this rotten economy, and it took a year but now he has a Mon-Fri and they are happy to go to church on Sunday and midweek. I will pray the Lord works so you can go to church on Sunday. But don't forget that the other half of that command is to work six days, and it is a godly honorable thing to work hard as you are doing. Look up John Murray on how it is wrong to go to a five day work week instead of six and makes society go downhill if you really want to enjoy Reformed debate, ha. Probably most people here would flunk on that one. But never mind that subject, I don't want to get another infraction, if I am not already there......
Lynnie,

In my denomination, the boundaries of "the realm of orthodoxy"are set by the Westminster Confession. All officers have to subscribe to it in its entirety, without taking exceptions. So, if someone is violating any part of the law of God (as spelled out in the Westminster Standards) in a stiff-necked, unrepentant way, as the gentleman I described is, he will come under discipline. First, he will be rebuked (which has a broader context of counseling and pleading). If he continues in his sin, he will be barred from the Lord's Supper. Finally, if he refuses to repent, he will eventually be excommunicated. This is true for idolators, adulterers, sabbath-breakers, murderers, and anyone else who is boldly unrepentant in his habitual continuance in sin.

Think of it this way: if we had a man who join the congregation, explaining to the elders that he is a medical doctor, and it later came out that he is an abortionist, he would be disciplined. He would object that he is able to do his job in good conscience, convinced that he is only helping women with their medical issues. However, his convictions are dead wrong, and he should be shepherded to repentance.

Similar examples could be given of polygamists or peyote users. They may be able to commit their sins in good conscience, and may be convinced that the Scriptures do not forbid their sins, but they are in serious need of correction.
 
Well Tyler, while I expect to go to my grave disagreeing with you about what the grounds for being barred from the supper or excommunication should be, I have to admit that in a way it is like a breath of fresh air to hear of a group that calls themselves Confessional and actually are. At least that shows integrity. While Continental folks don't see themselves as breaking the Sabbath at all if they are resting from their works a la Hebrews 4, and I don't class that position with murder and so forth, I at least better understand where you are coming from now and thank you for explaining.
 
Well Tyler, while I expect to go to my grave disagreeing with you about what the grounds for being barred from the supper or excommunication should be, I have to admit that in a way it is like a breath of fresh air to hear of a group that calls themselves Confessional and actually are. At least that shows integrity. While Continental folks don't see themselves as breaking the Sabbath at all if they are resting from their works a la Hebrews 4, and I don't class that position with murder and so forth, I at least better understand where you are coming from now and thank you for explaining.
Thank you for your cordiality, Lynnie. I hope our position doesn't come across as severe. We really do have a very sweet group, and the session is no exception. It's their attempt to shepherd an erring sheep, not an exercise in trying to purge the church with a heavy hand.
 
The Lord's Day is not for our relaxation (like for many Saturday is, and for many is all Sunday is), but for taking our rest from our weekday work, chores and recreations in order to devote ourselves to worshipping and focusing our attention upon the Lord.
If (for argument's sake) cleaning the garage is a very relaxing thing to an individual, would there be warrant to do this on the Sabbath?
 
The Lord's Day is not for our relaxation (like for many Saturday is, and for many is all Sunday is), but for taking our rest from our weekday work, chores and recreations in order to devote ourselves to worshipping and focusing our attention upon the Lord.
If we look at the ten commandments, most commandments are not conscience driven. For example: You shall not steal, You shall not murder, etc are all pretty clear-cut. For a person to say "I killed the guy, but it is not bothering my conscience," is never an excuse. Is this the same with the Sabbath?
 
What does his have to do with the OP? This sounds like you need to start a thread to ask some questions.
If we look at the ten commandments, most commandments are not conscience driven. For example: You shall not steal, You shall not murder, etc are all pretty clear-cut. For a person to say "I killed the guy, but it is not bothering my conscience," is never an excuse. Is this the same with the Sabbath?
 
Each situation is different, one more difficult than another. Yet there is nothing too hard for the Lord. My experience was this. I worked in the steel works which had to have continuous shift work otherwise furnaces etc, would collapse. I was a young Christian and had my wife and three children to support. There was no option given, shift work was required, and only the sick and elderly were granted day work. Then my elder brother was converted, and after a while he said, How are you working on the Sunday? That seared my conscience, but how could I manage a reduction of a third in my wages, and the impossibility of getting on to day work which had no Sabbath working?
My wife and I took the matter to the Lord, and we had one of those rare experiences when the word spoke powerfully and personally to us. This verse was given,Prov21:1, “The king’s heart is in the hand of the Lord, as the rivers of water: He turneth it withersoever He will.” This is what we pleaded. Then young I, plucked up courage to approach the Engineer over 800 of us men, who had a dreadful mouth, and I told him bluntly that I had become a Christian and needed the Sabbath Free. He was a bit taken aback but did not comment. A fortnight later I had an official letter telling me to start on day work!
Prayer, prayer, prayer is the answer to your dilemma. Your ways are not His ways and He will answer in the time of your trouble. His way will be a way that you might never have thought of.
 
If (for argument's sake) cleaning the garage is a very relaxing thing to an individual, would there be warrant to do this on the Sabbath?
If your ox fell in the ditch you may in good conscience get him out. Cleaning the garage is something that you could do on another day.
Exodus 31:15 Six days may work be done; but in the seventh is the sabbath of rest, holy to the LORD: whosoever doeth any work in the sabbath day, he shall surely be put to death.
They took Sabbath observance more seriously in those days.
 
Mr R-
I was under the assumption from years ago that participation here assumes agreement with basic Reformed theology and Confessional standards. As Pyack-Ruben once said long ago about something, the PB is not out to reinvent the wheel. There are godly studious Christians who sincerely believe in the Dispensational pre trib rapture, or that we can lose our salvation, or that God does miracles just like the NT today, or that the Sabbath was abrogated/fulfilled by the work of Jesus as described in Hebrews 4.

Maybe I should not have said they don't belong here, but I will say from experience that if they say anything against the standards here they will get an infraction. I've gotten at least a couple myself so I try to be careful (the continuationist position If I recall correctly...and I got a few nasty cracks when I posted Vern Poythress of all people about extraordinary providences). It is your board, your rules, and that's OK. But do godly people who hold to a continental position fit here? You tell me. I was under the impression they do not.
Moderator Note:
Lynnie,

It appears you will not let this go without implying a rigidity is afoot that needs to be repented, or to revisit past moderator actions. I want to remind you of the board's raison d'etre in the words of Semper Fidelis:

https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/what-this-is-a-reformed-board.24779/
https://www.puritanboard.com/threads/what-this-is-a-reformed-board.24779/#post-304429

The board is a decidedly confessional board, with specific confessions. As our rules state:

9. ...The order that the moderators help facilitate is to be aligned with their statements of faith (comprised in the Westminster Confession of Faith, The Canons of Dordt, The Belgic Confession, The Heidelberg Catechism, and Baptist Confession of Faith of 1689)​

Accordingly, the moderation staff just will not be long-suffering when anyone seeks to explicitly smuggle in, or by implication of their post's content, something outside these clear boundaries of what we all agreed to when we joined this site. I want to remind you of the company you are keeping and note that the sincerity of others who are outside these boundaries is not in dispute. That said, not a few sincere beliefs are sincerely wrong and appeals to sincerity are not the means by which we determine what is in and what is out. For those so inclined to push against our confessional boundaries, there are plenty of internet discussion sites that will welcome their participation and views. The PB is not one of them.

As to your concern about Continentalism and the Sabbath day, their view is no less strict than the English confessional view. The Synod of Dort's doctrinal deliverance (items declared binding on all the churches), in its 164th session on May 17, 1619 stated:

1. There is both a ceremonial and moral element in the fourth commandment of the divine law.
2. The ceremonial [element] is the rest of the seventh day after creation, and the strict observance of the same day was especially enjoined upon the Jewish people.
3. The moral [element] is that a certain and definite day be set aside for worship, and for the purpose that as much rest as is necessary for worship and for pious reflection upon it [be provided].
4. The Jewish Sabbath having been abolished, Christians must solemnly keep Sunday [in the original Dutch it is "the day of the Lord,"] holy.
5. This day has always been observed from the time of the apostles in the ancient Catholic Church.
6. This day must be so set aside for worship that on it people may rest from all ordinary labors (excluding those that love and present necessity demand) together with all such recreations that hinder worship.​

- See https://standardbearer.rfpa.org/articles/synod-dordrecht-and-sabbath

Further, Danny Hyde's article on Dordt's regulae in CPJ 12 and earlier in the PRTS journal similarly proves the actual Continental view is not the current modern view that has made it a wax nose to suit whatever some would rather be doing on the Lord's Day.

With this in mind and my previous reset of the conversation, the thread is now re-opened.
 
The Lord's Day is not for our relaxation (like for many Saturday is, and for many is all Sunday is), but for taking our rest from our weekday work, chores and recreations in order to devote ourselves to worshipping and focusing our attention upon the Lord.

This is something I haven't thought too much about...but should. You hear the saying 'rest and relaxation' all of the time. Does anyone even make a distinction between the two terms or is the saying just for emphasis? I am going to relax. I am going to rest. Now I wonder if I don't use the term interchangeably.
 
The two words are related in different ways, rest including relaxing, properly understood.

Rest
- Cease work or movement in order to relax, refresh oneself, or recover strength.

Relax - Make or become less tense or anxious.

In other words, to rest is to ease work or movement in order to make or become less tense or anxious, refresh oneself, or recover strength.

Sanctify the Sabbath by holy resting all the day...(WLC #117). Then meditate upon that holy resting on Monday and the days following.
 
Hey Myson.....the Gaffin book might help you think it all through without condemnation and rebuke. "Calvin and the Sabbath".

Hey thanks lynnie! As someone who hasn't really had the means to think through these things and has been kinda lost on what the "Continental View" was, I'm glad to learn more and more than willing to be corrected in what I've previously been taught (which is that the Sabbath was abrogated in my non-confessional background, but not something I've come to fully agree with since joining the PCA). Thanks for the help! Just bought it on Amazon!
 
I must say that this thread has gone in many different directions, but I want to thank everyone for sharing and giving their insights. It has been tremendously helpful for me, in conjunction with my local congregation, to think through this issue and what God requires of us. I welcome any and all comments (but prefer those that directly address the question I first asked)!
 
Hey thanks lynnie! As someone who hasn't really had the means to think through these things and has been kinda lost on what the "Continental View" was, I'm glad to learn more and more than willing to be corrected in what I've previously been taught (which is that the Sabbath was abrogated in my non-confessional background, but not something I've come to fully agree with since joining the PCA). Thanks for the help! Just bought it on Amazon!
Mr. Trowbridge,

Note the following from post #75 from Patrick on the classic continental view:
As to your concern about Continentalism and the Sabbath day, their view is no less strict than the English confessional view. The Synod of Dort's doctrinal deliverance (items declared binding on all the churches), in its 164th session on May 17, 1619 stated:

1. There is both a ceremonial and moral element in the fourth commandment of the divine law.
2. The ceremonial [element] is the rest of the seventh day after creation, and the strict observance of the same day was especially enjoined upon the Jewish people.
3. The moral [element] is that a certain and definite day be set aside for worship, and for the purpose that as much rest as is necessary for worship and for pious reflection upon it [be provided].
4. The Jewish Sabbath having been abolished, Christians must solemnly keep Sunday [in the original Dutch it is "the day of the Lord,"] holy.
5. This day has always been observed from the time of the apostles in the ancient Catholic Church.
6. This day must be so set aside for worship that on it people may rest from all ordinary labors (excluding those that love and present necessity demand) together with all such recreations that hinder worship.
- See https://standardbearer.rfpa.org/articles/synod-dordrecht-and-sabbath

Further, Danny Hyde's article on Dordt's regulae in CPJ 12 and earlier in the PRTS journal similarly proves the actual Continental view is not the current modern view that has made it a wax nose to suit whatever some would rather be doing on the Lord's Day.
 
This is something I haven't thought too much about...but should. You hear the saying 'rest and relaxation' all of the time. Does anyone even make a distinction between the two terms or is the saying just for emphasis? I am going to relax. I am going to rest. Now I wonder if I don't use the term interchangeably.
It is in this regard that the word often translated as "rest" in, for example, Hebrews 4.1-8 (not verse 9) can be understood with the idea of ceasing, even more than of cessation of physical activity. Remember that the Lord our God needed no "rest" for He had a "residue of the Spirit"--that is, He was not exhausted by His creation-work. It is the idea of ceasing from His creation- labor, and in our own context, ceasing those labors and other recreations, etc. that pertain to the 6-day week in which we are to do "all our work" that are more in mind here.
 
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