National Super-Sabbath Breaking Sunday?

[VictorBravo]

As I said, I used to be a deacon in the Seventh Day Baptist church. A great bunch of people who are dear to my heart.

The SDBs settled the town I used to live in. I looked into the history and found out that there was once another SDB church on the other side of town and I couldn't understand why the folks didn't meet in the middle. There was only two miles between the churches.

It turned out that there was a great split 100 years ago. The church on the west side it turned out were a bunch of libertines. They were the flagrant wretches who came to the conclusion that one could play croquet on the Sabbath. So Milton, Wisconsin was split into the croquet players and the abstainers.

Now you have forced me to make a confession, Bob. My wife and I sometimes have played croquet in the backyard on a Lord's Day evening. But we were very sure not to take pleasure in it, I'll tell you that!

Actually, we did. Call it a donkey in the ditch or what have you, but whacking the little balls in the fresh air-- after worship, reading, home psalm singing, nursing aching bones from the previous week's labors--enjoying each other's company in the quiet of an early evening often renews the mind and refreshes the body.

And the fact that she wins more often than I do does its work on my pride too.

 

[Augusta]

**Steps into Andrew's shoes for a moment**

Thomas Watson
The Ten Commandments

Thomas Watson
The Ten Commandments
File 11
(... continued from file 10)

2.4 The Fourth Commandment


'Remember the Sabbath-day to keep it holy. Six days shalt thou
labour, and do all thy work: but the seventh day is the Sabbath of
the Lord thy God; in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy
son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maid-servant, nor thy
cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates. For in six days
the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is,
and rested the seventh day; wherefore the Lord blessed the
Sabbath-day and hallowed it. Exod 20: 8 - 11.

This commandment was engraven in stone by God's own finger, and
it will be our comfort to have it engraven in our hearts.
The Sabbath-day is set apart for God's solemn worship; it is
his own enclosure, and must not be alienated to common uses. As a
preface to this commandment, he has put a memento to it, 'Remember
to keep the Sabbath day holy.' This word, 'remember,' shows that we
are apt to forget Sabbath holiness; therefore we need a memorandum
to put us in mind of sanctifying the day. I. There is in these words a solemn command. 'Remember the
Sabbath-day to keep it holy.'
[1] The matter of it. The sanctifying the Sabbath, which
Sabbath sanctification consists in two things, in resting from our
own works, and in a conscientious discharge of our religious duty.
[2] The persons to whom the command of sanctifying the Sabbath
is given. Either superiors, and they are, more private, as parents
and masters; or more public, as magistrates; or inferiors, as
natives, children, and servants, 'Thy son, and thy daughter, thy
man-servant, and thy maidservant;' or foreigners, 'thy stranger that
is within thy gates.'
II. The arguments to obey this commandment of keeping holy the
Sabbath are,
[1] From the rationality of it. 'Six days shalt thou labour and
do all thy work;' as if God had said, I am not a hard master, I do
not grudge thee time to look after thy calling, and to get an
estate. I have given thee six days, to do all thy work in, and have
taken but one day for myself. I might have reserved six days for
myself, and allowed thee but one; but I have given thee six days for
the works of thy calling, and have taken but one day for my own
service. It is just and rational, therefore, that thou shouldest set
this day in a special manner apart for my worship.
[2] The second argument for sanctifying the Sabbath, is taken
from the justice of it. 'The seventh day is the Sabbath of the Lord
thy God;' as if God had said, The Sabbath-day is my due, I challenge
a special right in it, and no other has any claim to it. He who robs
me of this day, and puts it to common uses, is a sacrilegious
person, he steals from the crown of heaven, and I will in nowise
hold him guiltless.
[3] The third argument for sanctifying the Sabbath, is taken
from God's own observance of it. He 'rested the seventh day;' as if
the Lord should say, Will you not follow me as a pattern? Having
finished all my works of creation, I rested the seventh day; so
having done all your secular work on the six days, you should now
cease from the labour of your calling, and dedicate the seventh day
to me, as a day of holy rest.
[4] The fourth argument for Sabbath-sanctification, is taken ab
utili, from the benefit which redounds from a religious observation
of the Sabbath. 'The Lord blessed the seventh day and hallowed it.'
God not only appointed the seventh day, but he blessed it. It is not
only a day of honour to God, but a day of blessing to us; it is not
only a day wherein we give God worship, but a day wherein he gives
us grace. On this day a blessing drops down from heaven. God himself
is not benefited by it, we cannot add one cubit to his essential
glory; but we ourselves are benefited. This day, religiously
observed, entails a blessing upon our souls, our estate, and our
posterity. Not keeping it, brings a curse. Jer 17: 27. God curses a
man's blessings. Mal 2: 2. The bread which he eats is poisoned with
a curse; so the conscientious observation of the Sabbath, brings all
manner of blessings with it. These are the arguments to induce
Sabbath-sanctification.

 

[BobVigneault]

Put a sharp pebble in your shoe while playing Vic. That will take most of the pleasure out of it. Keep score on the back of your most recent Form 1040, that will kill any residual pleasure. Whack away brother and have a lousy time!

 

[py3ak]

If the magistrate would uphold God's law, it would be illegal to work (?) by playing professional sports on the first day of the week.

 

[BobVigneault]

These kinds of debates remind me of one of my favorite old jokes but I have to be oh so delicate in telling it.

Did you hear about the old timey Baptist missionaries who wouldn't have (a mutually gratifying connubial relationship) while standing up?

They were afraid the natives would think they were dancing!


{Moderator warning: I don't see how this is edifying. Does this really make my point? If I pull this kind of off color stunt again I will suspend myself.} Mod off.

 

[OPC'n]

These kinds of debates remind me of one of my favorite old jokes but I have to be oh so delicate in telling it.

Did you hear about the old timey Baptist missionaries who wouldn't have (a mutually gratifying connubial relationship) while standing up?

They were afraid the natives would think they were dancing!


{Moderator warning: I don't see how this is edifying. Does this really make my point? If I pull this kind of off color stunt again I will suspend myself.} Mod off.

I don't think "dancing" on Sunday is allowed. I read somewhere that Jonathan Edward's congregation was upset when his wife had a child on Sunday because they felt it meant they were "dancing" on Sundays.

 

[Augusta]

More from Thomas Watson's The Ten Commandments:

Close the Sabbath evening with repetition, reading, singing
Psalms, and prayer. Ask that God would bless the word you have
heard. Could we but thus spend a Sabbath, we might be 'in the Spirit
on the Lord's-day,' our souls would be nourished and comforted; and
the Sabbaths we now keep, would be earnests of the everlasting
Sabbaths which we shall celebrate in heaven.
Use one. See here the Christian's duty, 'to keep the
Sabbath-day holy.'
(1) The whole Sabbath is to be dedicated to God. It is not
said, Keep a part of the Sabbath holy, but the whole day must be
religiously observed. If God has given us six days, and taken but
one to himself, shall we grudge him any part of that day? It were
sacrilege. The Jews kept a whole day to the Lord; and we are not to
abridge or curtail the Sabbath, as Augustine says, more than the
Jews did. The very heathen, by the light of nature, set apart a
whole day in honour of false gods; and Scaevola, a high-priest of
theirs, affirms that the wilful transgression of that day could have
no expiation or pardon. If any one robs any part of the Christian
Sabbath for servile work or recreation, Scaevola, the high priest of
the heathenish gods, shall rise up in judgment to condemn him. Let
those who say, that to keep a whole Sabbath is too Judaical, show
where God has made any abatement of the time of worship; where he
has said, you shall keep but a part of the Sabbath; and if they
cannot show that, it robs God of his due. That a whole day be
designed and set apart for his special worship, is a perpetual
statute, while the church remains upon the earth, as Peter Martyr
says. Of this opinion also were Theodore, Augustine, Irenaeus, and
the chief of the fathers.
(2) As the whole Sabbath is to be dedicated to God, so it must
be kept holy. You have seen the manner of sanctifying the Lord's-day
by reading, meditation, prayer, hearing the word, and by singing of
psalms to make melody to the Lord. Now, besides what I have said
upon keeping this day holy, let me make a short comment or
paraphrase on that Scripture. 'If thou turn away thy foot from the
Sabbath, from doing thy pleasure on my holy day; and call the
Sabbath a delight, the holy of the Lord, honourable: and shalt
honour him, not doing thine own ways, nor finding thine own
pleasure, nor speaking thine own words.' Isa 58: 13. Here is a
description of rightly sanctifying a Sabbath.
'If thou turn away thy foot from the Sabbath.' This may be
understood either literally or spiritually. Literally, that is, if
thou withdrawest thy foot from taking long walks or journeys on the
Sabbath-day. So the Jewish doctors expound it. Or, spiritually, if
thou turn away thy affections (the feet of thy soul) from inclining
to any worldly business.
'From doing thy pleasure on my holy day.' That is, thou must
not do that which may please the carnal part, as in sports and
pastimes. This is to do the devil's work on God's day.
'And call the Sabbath a delight.' Call it a delight, that is,
esteem it so. Though the Sabbath be not a day for carnal pleasure,
yet holy pleasure is not forbidden. The soul must take pleasure in
the duties of a Sabbath. The saints of old counted the Sabbath a
delight: the Jews called the Sabbath dies lucis, a day of light. The
Lord's day, on which the Sun of Righteousness shines, is both a day
of light and delight. This is the day of sweet intercourse between
God and the soul. On this day a Christian makes his sallies out to
heaven; his soul is lifted above the earth; and can this be without
delight? The higher the bird flies, the sweeter it sings. On the
Sabbath the soul fixes its love on God; and where love is, there is
delight. On this day the believer's heart is melted, quickened, and
enlarged in holy duties; and how can all this be, and not a secret
delight go along with it? On a Sabbath a gracious soul can say, 'I
sat down under his shadow with great delight, and his fruit was
sweet to my taste.' Cant 2: 3. How can a spiritual heart choose but
call the Sabbath a delight? Is it not delightful to a queen to be
putting on her wedding robes in which she shall meet the king her
bridegroom? When we are about Sabbath exercises, we are dressing
ourselves, and putting on our wedding robes in which we are to meet
our heavenly bridegroom the Lord Jesus; and is not this delightful?
On the Sabbath God makes a feast of fat things; he feasts the ear
with his word, and the heart with his grace. Well then may we call
the Sabbath a delight. To find this holy delight, is to 'be in the
Spirit on the Lord's-day.'
'The holy of the Lord, honourable.' In the Hebrew, it is
glorious. To call the Sabbath honourable, is not to be understood so
much of an outward honour given to it, by wearing richer apparel, or
having better diet on this day, as the Jewish doctors corruptly
gloss. This is the chief honour that some give to this day; but by
calling the Sabbath honourable, is meant that honour of the heart
which we give to the day, reverencing it, and esteeming it as the
queen of days. We are to count the Sabbath honourable, because God
has honoured it. All the persons in the Trinity have honoured it.
God the Father blessed it, God the Son rose upon it, God the Holy
Ghost descended on it. Acts 2: 1: This day is to be honoured by all
good Christians, and had in high veneration. It is a day of renown,
on which a golden sceptre of mercy is held forth. The Christian
Sabbath is the very crepusculum and dawning of the heavenly Sabbath.
It is honourable, because on this day 'God comes down to us and
visits us.' To have the King of heaven present in a special manner
in our assemblies, makes the Sabbath-day honourable. Besides, the
work done on this day makes it honourable. The six days are filled
up with servile work, which makes them lose much of their glory; but
on this day sacred work is done. The soul is employed wholly about
the worship of God; it is praying, hearing, meditating; it is doing
angels' work, praising, and blessing God. Again, the day is
honourable by virtue of a divine institution. Silver is of itself
valuable; but when the royal stamp is put upon it, it is honourable;
so God has put a sacred stamp upon this day, the stamp of divine
authority, and the stamp of divine benediction. This makes it
honourable; and this is sanctifying the Sabbath, to call it a
delight, and honourable.
'Not doing thine own ways.' That is, thou shalt not defile the
day by doing any servile work.
'Nor finding thine own pleasure.' That is, not gratifying the
fleshly part by walks, visits, or pastimes.
'Nor speaking thine own Words.' That is, words heterogeneous
and unsuitable for a Sabbath; vain, impertinent words; discourses of
worldly affairs.
Use two. If the Sabbath-day is to be kept holy, they are
reproved who, instead of sanctifying the Sabbath, profane it. They
take the time which should be dedicated wholly to God, and spend it
in the service of the devil and their lusts. The Lord has set apart
this day for his own worship, and they make it common. He has set a
hedge about this commandment, saying, 'Remember;' and they break
this hedge; but he who breaks this hedge, a serpent shall bite him.
Eccl 10: 8. The Sabbath day in England lies bleeding; and oh! that
our parliament would pour some balm into the wounds which it has
received! How is this day profaned, by sitting idle at home, by
selling meat, by vain discourse, by sinful visits, by walking in the
fields, and by sports! The people of Israel might not gather manna
on the Sabbath, and may we use sports and dancings on this day?
Truly it should be matter of grief to us to see so much
Sabbath-profanation. When one of Darius's eunuchs saw Alexander
setting his feet on a rich table of Darius's, he wept. Alexander
asked him why he wept? He said it was to see the table which his
master so highly esteemed now made a footstool. So may we weep to
see the Sabbath-day, which God highly esteems, and has honoured and
blessed, made a footstool, and trampled upon by the feet of sinners.
To profane the Sabbath is a great sin; it is a wilful contempt of
God; it is not only casting his law behind our back, but trampling
it under foot. He says, 'Keep the Sabbath holy;' but men pollute it.
This is to despise God, to hang out the flag of defiance, to throw
down the gauntlet, and challenge God himself. Now, how can God
endure to be thus saucily confronted by proud dust? Surely he will
not suffer this high impudence to go unpunished. God's curse will
come upon the Sabbath-breaker; and it will blast where it comes. The
law of the land lets Sabbath-breakers alone, but God will not. No
sooner did Christ curse the fig-tree, but it withered. God will take
the matter into his own hand; he will see after the punishing of
Sabbath violation. And how does he punish it?
(1) With spiritual plagues. He gives up Sabbath profaners to
hardness of heart, and a scared conscience. Spiritual judgements are
sorest. 'So I gave them up unto their own hearts' lust.' Psa 81: 12.
A sear in the conscience is a brand-mark of reprobation.
(2) God punishes this sin by giving men up to commit other
sins. To revenge the breaking of his Sabbath, he suffers them to
break open houses, and so come to be punished by the magistrate. How
many such confessions have we heard from thieves going to be
executed! They never regarded the Sabbath, and God suffered them to
commit those sins for which they are to die.
(3) God punishes Sabbath-breaking by sudden visible judgements
on men for this sin. He punishes them in their estates and in their
persons. While a certain man was carrying corn into his barn on the
Lord's-day, both house and corn were consumed with fire from heaven.
In Wiltshire there was a dancing match appointed upon the
Lord's-day; and while one of the company was dancing, he suddenly
fell down dead. The 'Theatre of God's Judgements' relates of one,
who used every Lord's-day to hunt in sermon-time, who had a child by
his wife with a head like a dog, and it cried like a hound. His sin
was monstrous, and it was punished with a monstrous birth. The Lord
threatened the Jews, that if they would not hallow the Sabbath-day,
he would kindle a fire in their gates. Jer 17: 27. The dreadful fire
which broke out in London began on the Sabbath-day; as if God would
tell us from heaven he was then punishing us for our Sabbath
profanation. Nor does he punish it only in this life with death, but
hereafter with damnation. Let such as break God's Sabbath see if
they can break those chains of darkness in which they and the devils
shall be held.
Use three. It exhorts us to Sabbath holiness.
Make conscience of keeping this day holy. The other
commandments have an affirmative in them only, or a negative; this
fourth commandment has both an affirmative in it and a negative.
'Thou shalt keep the Sabbath day holy,' and, 'thou shalt not do any
manner of work in it,' shows how carefully God would have us observe
this day. Not only must you keep this day yourselves, but have a
care that all under your charge keep it; 'Thou, and thy son, and thy
daughter, and thy man-servant, and thy maidservant;' that is, thou
who art a superior, a parent or a master, thou must have a care that
not only thou thyself, but those who are under thy trust and
tuition, sanctify the day. Those masters of families are to blame
who are careful that their servants serve them, but have no care
that they serve God; who care not though their servants should serve
the devil, so long as their bodies do them service. That which Paul
says to Timothy, Serva depositum, 'That good thing, which was
committed unto thee, keep,' is of large meaning. 1 Tim 1: 11. Not
only have a care of thy own soul, but have a care of the souls thou
art entrusted with. See that they who are under thy charge sanctify
the Sabbath. God's law provided, that if a man met with an ox or an
ass going astray, he should bring him back again; much more, when
thou sees the soul of thy child or servant going astray from God,
and breaking his Sabbath, thou shouldest bring him back again to a
religious observation of this day.
That I may press you to Sabbath-sanctification, consider what
great blessings God has promised to the strict observers of this
day. Isa 58: 14. (1) A promise of joy. 'Then shalt thou delight
thyself in the Lord.' Delighting in God is both a duty and a reward.
In this text it is a reward, 'Then shalt thou delight thyself in the
Lord;' as if God had said, If thou keep the Sabbath conscientiously,
I will give thee that which will fill thee with delight; if thou
keep the Sabbath willingly, I will make thee keep it joyfully. I
will give thee those enlargements in duty, and that inward comfort,
which shall abundantly satisfy thee; thy soul shall overflow with
such a stream of joy, that thou shalt say, 'Lord, in keeping thy
Sabbath there is great reward. (2) Of honour. And 'I will cause thee
to ride upon the high places of the earth.' That is, I will advance
thee to honour, ascendere faciam; so Munster interprets it. Some, by
the high places of the earth, understand Judea; so Grotius. I will
bring thee into the land of Judea, which is situated higher than the
other countries adjacent. (3) Of earth and heaven. 'And I will feed
thee with the heritage of Jacob;' that is, I will feed thee with all
the delicious things of Canaan, and afterwards I will translate thee
to heaven, whereof Canaan was but a type. Another promise is,
'Blessed is the man that does this, that keepeth the Sabbath from
polluting it.' Isa 56: 2. 'Blessed is the man;' in the Hebrew it is,
'blessednesses.' To him that keeps the Sabbath holy, here is
blessedness upon blessedness belonging to him; he shall be blessed
with the upper and nether springs; he shall be blessed in his name,
estate, soul, progeny. Who would not keep the Sabbath from polluting
it that shall have so many blessings entailed upon him and his
posterity after him? Again, a conscientious keeping of the Sabbath
seasons the heart for God's service all the week after. Christian
the more holy thou art on a Sabbath, the more holy thou wilt be on
the week following.

 

[py3ak]

These kinds of debates remind me of one of my favorite old jokes but I have to be oh so delicate in telling it.

Did you hear about the old timey Baptist missionaries who wouldn't have (a mutually gratifying connubial relationship) while standing up?

They were afraid the natives would think they were dancing!


{Moderator warning: I don't see how this is edifying. Does this really make my point? If I pull this kind of off color stunt again I will suspend myself.} Mod off.

I don't think "dancing" on Sunday is allowed. I read somewhere that Jonathan Edward's congregation was upset when his wife had a child on Sunday because they felt it meant they were "dancing" on Sundays.

I would be very surprised if anyone in Edwards' congregation was stupid enough to imagine that children were born on the same day of the week as they were conceived, without fail.

 

[ReformedWretch]

God bless you Bob!

 

[Wannabee]

That's scandalous Bob. It also reminds me of why you always invite two of us fishing...



I'll be at an elders' meeting for the Super Bowl. He has a big screen TV and great surround sound. I think most of the church will be there...

 

[OPC'n]

These kinds of debates remind me of one of my favorite old jokes but I have to be oh so delicate in telling it.

Did you hear about the old timey Baptist missionaries who wouldn't have (a mutually gratifying connubial relationship) while standing up?

They were afraid the natives would think they were dancing!


{Moderator warning: I don't see how this is edifying. Does this really make my point? If I pull this kind of off color stunt again I will suspend myself.} Mod off.

I don't think "dancing" on Sunday is allowed. I read somewhere that Jonathan Edward's congregation was upset when his wife had a child on Sunday because they felt it meant they were "dancing" on Sundays.

I would be very surprised if anyone in Edwards' congregation was stupid enough to imagine that children were born on the same day of the week as they were conceived, without fail.

It's true. I did "read" it. I'll try to find it among my audio I have of him.

 

[lynnie]

I guess I'll throw Tim Keller into the mix just for fun

*************
METROPOLITAN NEW YORK PRESBYTERY

Resolution on the Sabbath

Adopted at the March 13, 1999, stated meeting.

Resolution on the Sabbath
That the Metropolitan New York Presbytery adopt the following statements on the issue of the Sabbath:

1. We recognize that, by our subscription to our subordinate standards, the Presbyterian Church in America has embraced a particular view of the Sabbath. We further recognize, however, that this view of the Sabbath has not been embraced by the whole church throughout history, and that it has not been embraced by many in our own Reformed tradition (for example, in the teachings of John Calvin or the Heidelberg Catechism).

2. In light of this diversity within the Presbyterian and Reformed system of doctrine, we believe that it is incumbent upon us to allow men to serve as teaching elders while embracing views of the Sabbath that, while differing from our subordinate standards, still fall within the broader Reformed tradition.

3. As always, we believe that such views, as exceptions to our confessional standards, should be openly and honestly declared to the Presbytery, which has the right and responsibility to guard the church from any view that is inimical to our system of doctrine.

4. Specifically, members of the Presbytery should be able to affirm the following:

a. That the fourth commandment has not been abrogated but is still binding upon believers today.

b. That the fourth commandment obligates believers to order their lives so that time is weekly devoted to corporate worship with the people of God.

c. That the fourth commandment obligates believers to order their lives so that one day in seven is devoted for proper work and necessary rest.

d. That the fourth commandment obligates believers to order their lives so that rest is given to employees, servants, and others, and so that time is available for works of mercy and outreach.

e. No society can be well-ordered that ignores these principles.

5. Since the time of the apostolic church, the first day of the week has been recognized as the Lord’s Day, the day of Christian worship. While worship on other days of the week is certainly appropriate, we believe that the principal time of Christian worship is the Lord’s Day.

6. In light of the historical controversies, we believe that it would be unwise of the Presbytery to attempt to construct an exhaustive list of activities that we would approve or disapprove for the Sabbath. These matters should be left to the consciences of Christians under the ongoing ministry of the Word and the oversight of Christ’s church.

 

[Glenn Ferrell]

I guess I'll throw Tim Keller into the mix just for fun

*************
METROPOLITAN NEW YORK PRESBYTERY

Resolution on the Sabbath

Adopted at the March 13, 1999, stated meeting.

Resolution on the Sabbath
That the Metropolitan New York Presbytery adopt the following statements on the issue of the Sabbath:

1. We recognize that, by our subscription to our subordinate standards, the Presbyterian Church in America has embraced a particular view of the Sabbath. We further recognize, however, that this view of the Sabbath has not been embraced by the whole church throughout history, and that it has not been embraced by many in our own Reformed tradition (for example, in the teachings of John Calvin or the Heidelberg Catechism).

2. In light of this diversity within the Presbyterian and Reformed system of doctrine, we believe that it is incumbent upon us to allow men to serve as teaching elders while embracing views of the Sabbath that, while differing from our subordinate standards, still fall within the broader Reformed tradition.

3. As always, we believe that such views, as exceptions to our confessional standards, should be openly and honestly declared to the Presbytery, which has the right and responsibility to guard the church from any view that is inimical to our system of doctrine.

....

Taking an exception to the confessional standards is not license for an officer of the church to teach or practice contrary to the standards of his church. He may privately hold views to the contrary; but must not teach or act contrary to them.

An argument that taking an exception permits one to ignore the implications of a constitutional standard for teaching and practice is exactly what some PCUSA officers and courts are currently claiming regarding the ordination of unrepentant sodomites.

 

[Scott1]

Westminster Confession of Faith
Chapter XXI
(emphasis added)

VIII. This Sabbath is to be kept holy unto the Lord when men, after a due preparing of their hearts, and ordering of their common affairs beforehand, do not only observe an holy rest all the day from their own works, words, and thoughts about their worldly employments and recreations,[38] but also are taken up the whole time in the public and private exercises of His worship, and in the duties of necessity and mercy.[39]

The fourth commandment is a difficult one to keep because it also applies to discussion and thinking about sports entertainment as well as playing in it. We need faith from God and his grace to even try to do this. There is blessing in obedience.

I have regarded the sabbath as ending at sundown which has meant I am free to go and participate after sundown. Arriving later to the party, it has been a shock to have a sabbath focus and suddenly go into one of a sports and entertainment focus, a party atmosphere, but I have felt free to do it, without violation of conscience.

The Super Bowl party venue has also provided for some good discussion about the sabbath (i.e. "Why were you not here earlier"?) with both Christians and non-believers (which discussion also helps mitigate my ignorance of the previous NFL season).

 

[Glenn Ferrell]

I disagree with the broad brush that's being used to paint a standard for what is acceptable Sabbath keeping.

We can't even agree on what is good and acceptable worship on the Lord's Day. Some are offended by the instruments, some by the Trinity Hymnal, and let's not even mention the alternate song book.

.....

There is also the questions that true believers answer differently.

1. Is Jesus our Sabbath rest or is it a day of the week?
2. Is the Sabbath still the seventh day as ordained at creation?
3. Is there sufficient evidence for a change in the day from scripture?
4. Is Sunday the new sabbath?
6. Is the Lord's Day always the same as the Day of the Lord in scripture.
7. Is the Sabbath one day out of the week, or the 1st or the 7th?
8. What things are acceptable on the sabbath?
9. Can a believer watch tv?
10. Can a believer watch tv programming that was recorded on the Sabbath?

There is no way we can come to a place where we can point the finger at another believer and accuse them of spiritual adultery because they keep the Sabbath differently.

The problem is, we think we are comprehenders when it comes to spiritual truth but we are all merely aprehenders. God has revealed some things with great clarity and others he has left us to struggle with, have strong opinions and love one another.

This implies a lack of clear consensus among today’s Reformed believers shrinks what we may confess, teach, preach and say with certainty. Thus, we end up with a contracted standard based upon majority opinion or ignorance rather than the historical and confessional understanding of God’s Word.

Pastorally, I agree the Fourth Commandment is less clearly understood in the minds of sincere and faithful Reformed believers today than the sixth, seventh or eighth commandments. Such is due to the neglect of officers to expound the whole “system of doctrine taught in the Holy Scriptures.” Therefore, the former should be clearly taught before applying formal ecclesiastical discipline to those breaking the Sabbath in ignorance. However, that ignorance is no argument for a minimalist confession.

The questions proposed in the post quoted above may all be adequately answered by reference to the confessional standards affirmed in the ordination vows of the poster, as I notice he is an officer within the OPC.

Furthermore, it is unbecoming an officer who has sworn to “sincerely receive and adopt the Confession of Faith and Catechisms of this Church, as containing the system of doctrine taught in the Holy Scriptures,” to publicly deny another officer may unreservedly confess, declare and teach the “standard for what is acceptable Sabbath keeping” contained in those very confessional standards. A confession is for confessing; and such confession is not limited to the consensus or understanding of the Reformed community of believers in general, the membership of a denomination, or the personal opinions of some of its officers. The written words of the Standards are just that, “standards,” to be believed, confessed and taught, without apology.

So, I make no apology for calling action contrary to the Confession I confess “sin.” Presumptuous sin? For most, no. Sin of ignorance? For many. But, it would be greater sin against knowledge if an officer, especially a teaching elder, did not unambiguously rebuke “by teaching plainly the first principles of the Oracles of God,” calling sin what he has previously confessed as sin at his ordination or installation.

 

[NaphtaliPress]

-----Added 1/29/2009 at 02:30:19 EST-----

I'm thinking it depends upon whether you've got the Puritan or Continental view on the Sabbath.

The “Continental view” is repeatedly used as an argument for Sabbath indifference.

Can anyone demonstrate a consensus of the Continental Reformed prior to 1900 approving the playing or watching organized sports on the Lord’s Day?

Calvin in the Hands of the Philistines: Or Did Calvin Bowl on the Sabbath? | Naphtali Press

 

[Quickened]

I just get my info on this from R.C. Sproul. He watches football on Sundays...he's a "Continental viewer."

I couldnt help but cringe at this post. I dont mean to come across as rude but you should turn to the Word of God as opposed to getting info from fallible man.

 

[OPC'n]

I just get my info on this from R.C. Sproul. He watches football on Sundays...he's a "Continental viewer."

I couldnt help but cringe at this post. I dont mean to come across as rude but you should turn to the Word of God as opposed to getting info from fallible man.

Oh, you don't want to go there!

 

[beej6]

(snip)

There is also the questions that true believers answer differently.

1. Is Jesus our Sabbath rest or is it a day of the week?
2. Is the Sabbath still the seventh day as ordained at creation?
3. Is there sufficient evidence for a change in the day from scripture?
4. Is Sunday the new sabbath?
6. Is the Lord's Day always the same as the Day of the Lord in scripture.
7. Is the Sabbath one day out of the week, or the 1st or the 7th?
8. What things are acceptable on the sabbath?
9. Can a believer watch tv?
10. Can a believer watch tv programming that was recorded on the Sabbath?

There is no way we can come to a place where we can point the finger at another believer and accuse them of spiritual adultery because they keep the Sabbath differently.

(snip)

Answers:
Both. No. Yes. Yes. Don't know. One day out of the week, the 1st day.
Works of necessity and mercy for certain; others are dependent on one's conscience before the Lord. Yes. Yes.

The fact that we answer these questions differently doesn't mean all answers are acceptable. With regards to the Law of God, there must be better and worse answers, or why bother with them at all?

I would certainly not accuse anyone I didn't know of sin, but it's certainly fair game to have this discussion (again!).

As for the original post, this Sunday will be like other Sundays - worship, rest, more worship, more rest. I typically record football games and watch them later.

 

[py3ak]

Before basing any conclusions on differences between the Continental and Puritan views of the Sabbath, it's worth while to at least read this thread.

It's true. I did "read" it. I'll try to find it among my audio I have of him.

I hope the audio gives some substantive documentation. The great abundance of Mr. Edwards' children should have settled any doubt in people's minds.

 

[he beholds]

Maybe I'm getting off topic, but what all is included with the Puritan view of "recreation"? I gather watching football on TV would be out of the question, but what about throwing a football with my son out in the yard?

Sinner.

*joking*

I think throwing a football is great because you have to spend time and fellowship with each other and not beside each other.

But that cannot make something permissible, can it? As long as you are doing it with another and not beside them, then it is allowable recreation?

I would be very surprised if anyone in Edwards' congregation was stupid enough to imagine that children were born on the same day of the week as they were conceived, without fail.

Well, they were stupid enough to fire him for making a personal belief in Christ a prerequisite for communion.

 

[VictorBravo]

I feel a bit convicted about my flippant (though true) posts on this subject. I forget sometimes that a lot of new people may not get my understatements.

So, I think I should clarify that I hold to Confessional keeping of the Lord's Day, and seek to be diligent in it.

That being said, I am very much against list-making. I view the 4th commandment as a positive command. One day in seven we really should try to understand what it means to Love God with all our hearts, souls, and minds. It is not a day to look for cracks in the sidewalk to avoid.

To quote Walt Chantry in Call the Sabbath a Delight:

In Hebrews 5:14 we are told that ‘solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.’ It may seem comfortable to have a list to tick off without thought. However, the truth is that such practice atrophies the mind and hearts.

p. 105

BTW, I highly recommend the book.

The idea is that in observing the Sabbath, we have one goal in mind: to honor God. We can do that through corporate worship, fellowship, reading, singing, etc. The important thing is that the day is set aside.

Chantry, in the chapter called "Difficult Cases of Conscience" points out that different people will have a different conscience of how their activities should be ordered. The office worker who sits all day for his work and then seeks to reads scripture on a Lord's Day afternoon may find himself falling asleep and unable to grasp the text. Why shouldn't he get up and go for a walk or even a run, to get his mind clear? He can return to his observance of the Lord's Day with greater joy and clarity.

Contrast that with the fitness fanatic who runs vigorously every day of the week. He would gain spiritual benefit by resting from that activity, because it is his common everyday task.

The point is, we like to make rules, but in so doing we can miss the teaching. Call the Sabbath a delight, rejoice in what God has done for you and his church, meditate on his glory and his majesty and on his Word.

So I think we are to order our lives so that we truly (not merely pay lip service to) our task. Sometimes that means doing something that another devoted follower of Christ might not want to do. (Like buying takeout for your exhausted wife, or going for a walk, so forth). It's an ongoing process, and with the right frame and attitude, we grew in faith while seeking to be obedient.

 

[raekwon]

I'll be catching the remainder of the game with my wife and daughter after worship on Sunday evening.

Coincidentally, I'm going to be teaching on rest and the Sabbath in my home group on Tuesday. (Our church is likely moving our worship service from Sunday evening to Sunday morning, and if that happens, I'm going to propose that we move our home group meetings from Tuesday to Sunday evening. I'll be teaching toward that end.)

 

[reformed trucker]

I feel a bit convicted about my flippant (though true) posts on this subject. I forget sometimes that a lot of new people may not get my understatements.

So, I think I should clarify that I hold to Confessional keeping of the Lord's Day, and seek to be diligent in it.

That being said, I am very much against list-making. I view the 4th commandment as a positive command. One day in seven we really should try to understand what it means to Love God with all our hearts, souls, and minds. It is not a day to look for cracks in the sidewalk to avoid.

To quote Walt Chantry in Call the Sabbath a Delight:

In Hebrews 5:14 we are told that ‘solid food is for the mature, who by constant use have trained themselves to distinguish good from evil.’ It may seem comfortable to have a list to tick off without thought. However, the truth is that such practice atrophies the mind and hearts.

p. 105

BTW, I highly recommend the book.

The idea is that in observing the Sabbath, we have one goal in mind: to honor God. We can do that through corporate worship, fellowship, reading, singing, etc. The important thing is that the day is set aside.

Chantry, in the chapter called "Difficult Cases of Conscience" points out that different people will have a different conscience of how their activities should be ordered. The office worker who sits all day for his work and then seeks to reads scripture on a Lord's Day afternoon may find himself falling asleep and unable to grasp the text. Why shouldn't he get up and go for a walk or even a run, to get his mind clear? He can return to his observance of the Lord's Day with greater joy and clarity.

Contrast that with the fitness fanatic who runs vigorously every day of the week. He would gain spiritual benefit by resting from that activity, because it is his common everyday task.

The point is, we like to make rules, but in so doing we can miss the teaching. Call the Sabbath a delight, rejoice in what God has done for you and his church, meditate on his glory and his majesty and on his Word.

So I think we are to order our lives so that we truly (not merely pay lip service to) our task. Sometimes that means doing something that another devoted follower of Christ might not want to do. (Like buying takeout for your exhausted wife, or going for a walk, so forth). It's an ongoing process, and with the right frame and attitude, we grew in faith while seeking to be obedient.

Off-topic:
Hey Vic, I'm blessed to be able to fellowship with Walt on Sundays!

Re:OP

Years ago I was really into football, but the harder I chase after God, the less
I care about it. I think the only games I watched this year were the three that I went to (season ticket holder), and I enjoyed the time with family more than the game. Can't get excited about watching it on tv when I can spend that time studying scripture or reading a good book from my library
(wife says when I'm not working that's all I do...READ!).
Don't know if I'll waste my time with the "Big Game"...6 hour commercial with
a little football interjected!

 

[kvanlaan]

First, I think it must be noted that while football is enjoyable to some and not to others, croquet is a most conspicuous manifestation of Satan and general evil in the world and thus should not be played at any time, and most certainly not on the Sabbath.

That being said, I think a lot comes down to where your focus lies. Do you, on a certain Sabbath in January, find yourself dreaming of pigskin during an engaging sermon on Deuteronomy 14:21? That's bad. What is your focus on the Sabbath?

 

[Quickened]

Off-topic:
Hey Vic, I'm blessed to be able to fellowship with Walt on Sundays!

Thats crazy!!! I too attend the same church! Egads!

 

[jaybird0827]

How will you respond to the imminent national celebration of professional Sabbath breaking for fun and profit?

A most-appropriately titled thread. Thank you!

 

[Tim]

To consider the title of the thread, If I were back in North America...

I would be doing my best to spend time in public and private worship, to focus on the Lord, to consider what I heard of God's Word preached, to spend time in fellowship with brothers and sisters - speaking of the Lord, His glory, and His works. May God have mercy on me if I were ever to put football (or any other sport/recreation) ahead of Him on His day.

NOTE: I very much enjoy sports. Sport science is my profession!

Important question: if you spend time with fellow Christians but never mention the Lord, is it still fellowship?

 

[he beholds]

To consider the title of the thread, If I were back in North America...

I would be doing my best to spend time in public and private worship, to focus on the Lord, to consider what I heard of God's Word preached, to spend time in fellowship with brothers and sisters - speaking of the Lord, His glory, and His works. May God have mercy on me if I were ever to put football (or any other sport/recreation) ahead of Him on His day.

NOTE: I very much enjoy sports. Sport science is my profession!

Important question: if you spend time with fellow Christians but never mention the Lord, is it still fellowship?

This is true of every single day! But that is a good the reminder, though

 

[TimV]

It's such a hard question because the practicalities are so difficult.

I'm also a 10 Commandment guy instead of a 10 Suggestion guy, and it burns me when Sunday is treated like any other day. But if after I go to church, and have spent time with friends I watch a nature show, listen to the radio or enjoy some of my hobbies, it's hard to see how that is different than sitting with friends to watch (in my case since I hate football) some funny adds?

Anyway, I'm glad the subject was posted, if for no other reason that there WILL be Christians interrupting their normal church services to one extent or another on that day, and hopefully some consciences will be pricked.